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Speaker 1: Picture this. You've dedicated your life to performing, You've spent

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Speaker 1: countless thousands of hours in dance classes, sessions with vocal coaches,

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Speaker 1: doing scriptwork, and finally, finally you win Australian theatre's most

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Speaker 1: prestigious award. What do you do next, Well, if you're

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Speaker 1: Elise McCann, you do what's totally illogical and start a

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Speaker 1: tech company. Elise is one of Australia's top performers. She's

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Speaker 1: a singer, a dancer, an actor and a producer and

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Speaker 1: now she's also the co founder of wellness app hey Lemonade,

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Speaker 1: which delivers three minute pep talks from famous Australian voices,

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Speaker 1: which she started with fellow entertainer Lucy Durak. So how

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Speaker 1: does she hold together more jobs than you can count

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Speaker 1: on one hand? Well, I can tell you right now

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Speaker 1: that Alice thinks a lot about how she works, and

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Speaker 1: after having researched her ways of working prior to our chat,

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Speaker 1: I went into this interview thinking I was about to

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Speaker 1: meet my kindred spirit of productivity nerdiness. My name is

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Speaker 1: doctor amanthe Immer. I'm an organizational psychologist and the founder

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Speaker 1: of Behavioral Science Consultancy Inventium and this is how I

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Speaker 1: work a show about how to help you do your

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Speaker 1: best work. Now, the obvious question I had for a

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Speaker 1: lease to start with is how does an award winning

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Speaker 1: musical theater star end up starting a tech company.

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Speaker 2: It was a product of naivety.

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Speaker 3: I think Lucy Jreck and I had obviously been friends

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Speaker 3: for many years. We actually met in a dance class

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Speaker 3: back when I was seventeen or something like that. Lucy

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Speaker 3: was in the cast of Mum and Bea. I was

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Speaker 3: studying at NAIDA and I was watching her on stage

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Speaker 3: night and I just remember thinking she was amazing. And

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Speaker 3: we met in this dance class and we became friends,

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Speaker 3: and we've stayed friends over the years. And you know,

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Speaker 3: we'd often go for walks because I love a walk

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Speaker 3: any time I can kind of multitask, including exercise and

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Speaker 3: talking to someone. And during COVID, we both obviously had

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Speaker 3: been the arts had been hit hugely, and Loose and

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Speaker 3: I particularly were going through some tough times. Loose had

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Speaker 3: been playing Princess Fiona in Shrek the Musical, and I

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Speaker 3: was living in New York and I was working with

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Speaker 3: Sarah Jessica Parker's production company and just it was having

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Speaker 3: a great time over there, and then COVID happened and

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Speaker 3: we came back and everything disappeared. And both of us

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Speaker 3: we're really resilient, optimistic people, but I think that we

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Speaker 3: had that thing where you started to think, Wow, I

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Speaker 3: don't know what the next chapter will look like. When

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Speaker 3: you can't envision what's going to happen next, there is

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Speaker 3: a different sense of kind of you know, stress or

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Speaker 3: a little bit of doubt that comes in. And so

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Speaker 3: we both actually did some meditation apps. There was this

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Speaker 3: amazing Deepak Chopra meditation program that was going around and

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Speaker 3: we both had ended up doing it, and both of

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Speaker 3: us had a similar experience where we felt like we

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Speaker 3: weren't doing it right. Loose was always you know, like

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Speaker 3: changing Teddy her son's nappy whilst trying to do the

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Speaker 3: listen to the meditation because she just never had time

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Speaker 3: on her own, and she's like, ah, I can't do

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Speaker 3: this with my eyes closed. I can't stick for twenty minutes.

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Speaker 3: And I was the same. I was always like, my

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Speaker 3: brain is constantly thinking ahead, you know, I produced as

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Speaker 3: well as act, and my brain's always thinking of the

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Speaker 3: next spot fire. And I was finding it really hard

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Speaker 3: to turn my brain off, and I was like, am

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Speaker 3: I doing this right? Like I don't know if I'm

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Speaker 3: doing this right? And often, yeah, sometimes we didn't like

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Speaker 3: the voice of the person.

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Speaker 2: And so there were a whole bunch of things.

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Speaker 3: And we went for a walk and we're having a

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Speaker 3: chat and Loose was like, this is what I need,

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Speaker 3: a chat with a friend and I was like, yes.

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Speaker 2: We should make that.

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Speaker 3: And we just naively were like, great, let's let's let's

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Speaker 3: see if there's an if anything like that is out there.

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Speaker 3: And so we looked all, you know, across the app

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Speaker 3: stores and we couldn't find anything. And we thought, oh,

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Speaker 3: we'll just make it. And so because neither of us

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Speaker 3: had ever done anything like this, we just thought it'll

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Speaker 3: be fine. And I think that's actually what made it happen.

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Speaker 2: Two things.

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Speaker 3: One not having any concept really of what was involved.

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Speaker 3: And both of us are very asque culture people. We're

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Speaker 3: very like yes and you say yes before you say no,

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Speaker 3: and you figure out how to do it, rather than

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Speaker 3: you know, stopping something before you figure out how.

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Speaker 1: To do it.

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Speaker 3: And so we just said about trying and that and

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Speaker 3: also I think the fact that yeah, yeah, we just

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Speaker 3: didn't know how hard it would be.

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Speaker 1: I remember going on a walk with one of your

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Speaker 1: other co founders, the other Lucy Lucy Cochrane, Yes, and

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Speaker 1: she was telling me, Yeah, she was telling me how

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Speaker 1: you got a meeting with Alan Joyce, which blew my mind.

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Speaker 1: Can you tell me how like we get in the room,

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Speaker 1: how two performers who've just started this tech company but

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Speaker 1: it hasn't yet launched, getting meeting with Alan Joyce to

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Speaker 1: do work at Quantas.

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Speaker 2: Yes, Yes, it's ridiculous and phenomenal. We've been very lucky

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Speaker 2: we have.

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Speaker 3: We've had we're able to be in the room with

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Speaker 3: Alan Joyce and Rob Marcalino, who was the head of

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Speaker 3: people in HR at Quantas. We've also done the same

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Speaker 3: with We did the same with Craig Drummond at Medibank,

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Speaker 3: and with Jean Pratt and the team USY. We've been

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Speaker 3: so lucky to get into amazing rooms. And part of that, honestly, one,

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Speaker 3: we have some amazing business mentors and investors that you know,

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Speaker 3: people in that world and believe in us in the product.

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Speaker 3: But two, because Louisa and I have worked in the

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Speaker 3: entertainment industry, Lucy Jurak and I've worked in the entertainment

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Speaker 3: industry for so long. We know really interesting different groups

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Speaker 3: of people from when they come to see the show.

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Speaker 3: And I think there is like, and I don't want

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Speaker 3: to say it too loud in case the magic wears off,

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Speaker 3: but I think there's like some little bit of luck

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Speaker 3: magic that we have where someone has seen you on

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Speaker 3: Stay and they think, oh wow, that's kind of a

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Speaker 3: bit cool, and so they want to meet you, and

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Speaker 3: so they let you come into the room. And I

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Speaker 3: think often we'll you know, we get in the room

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Speaker 3: where it happens for Hamilton reference if anyone loves a musical.

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Speaker 1: And decided thank you, thank you too.

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Speaker 3: And so you know, we've been we've been very dedicated

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Speaker 3: to make sure that if we get in the room,

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Speaker 3: we're really prepared, because you don't want to squander that opportunity,

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Speaker 3: because as you said, it's like it's so rare. But thankfully,

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Speaker 3: you know, these wonderful people who've been intrigued by us

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Speaker 3: and then have been able to kind of hear about

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Speaker 3: our product and have liked it, and so now we're

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Speaker 3: getting to yeah, develop branches of it for them.

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Speaker 1: How did you prepare for the meeting with Alan.

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Speaker 3: We basically wrote a script and we we then we

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Speaker 3: then allocated out the script, and then we used what

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Speaker 3: we use for our when we learn scripts for TV

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Speaker 3: shows or for acting, and we use this thing called

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Speaker 3: line learner. So we both together recorded the script into

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Speaker 3: line learner and then you can mute the other person.

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Speaker 3: Because Lucy has been living in Melbourne and I live

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Speaker 3: in Sydney most of the time, so we're not always

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Speaker 3: in the same city, and so we just like rehearse

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Speaker 3: with the other person in our ear but using line learner,

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Speaker 3: just so that we kind of had our script and

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Speaker 3: our pitch down, and we put together a whole presentation.

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Speaker 2: And decks and slides.

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Speaker 3: And I love graphics and I love color anything that

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Speaker 3: kind of helps my brain catalog things, and so we

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Speaker 3: made up a huge deck and a huge slide, and

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Speaker 3: we did some mock pitches. We did some mock pittures

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Speaker 3: with Lucy Cochran and with one of our investors, and.

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Speaker 2: Then we just kind of gave it a go and

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Speaker 2: it went really well. Go figure, I'd love that.

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Speaker 1: You wrote a script and you learned the script. How like,

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Speaker 1: where do you even start to with the script writing

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Speaker 1: process for a business? Meeting.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I know, it sounds so silly.

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Speaker 3: We basically wanted to have had every We wanted to

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Speaker 3: know everything that we wanted to say and find a

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Speaker 3: way to say it as condensedly as possible. And so

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Speaker 3: we thought, let's write that out and then just refine it,

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Speaker 3: refine it, refine it, refine it, and make sure it

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Speaker 3: was under ten minutes, because we did know how much

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Speaker 3: time we'd have with him, and so we thought, okay,

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Speaker 3: if we can make this under ten minutes, then we

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Speaker 3: also have time to field questions, to just banter back

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Speaker 3: and forth. But worst case, if they're just going to

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Speaker 3: come in and sit and give us nothing, we know

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Speaker 3: that we can get in and get out. And so

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Speaker 3: so that's what we did. Yeah, we kind of wrote

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Speaker 3: everything that we'd ever want to say, which is what

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Speaker 3: I used to do with essays as a teenager because

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Speaker 3: I'm such a nerd, And then I'd write everything I

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Speaker 3: wanted and then you'd just you know, whittle it back

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Speaker 3: to the bare bones. And in doing so, because Louse

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Speaker 3: and I obviously like learned scripts all the time. Our

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Speaker 3: brains are quite good at learning scripts. And so then

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Speaker 3: when someone asks you a question, if it kind of

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Speaker 3: ties into a section of the script that you were

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Speaker 3: going to talk about. You can kind of respond that

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Speaker 3: way but still make it really natural. And I think

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Speaker 3: that that helped us because I don't know if they

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Speaker 3: know that we made a script. If you're listening, Alan,

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Speaker 3: there was no script, this didn't happen. But yeah, so

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Speaker 3: I don't know if I don't think they realized that

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Speaker 3: we were, you know, essentially giving them a script, but

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Speaker 3: we did.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, what's your process for learning?

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Speaker 3: As for me, it's repetition, but actually you know what, No,

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Speaker 3: it's it's a compilation of repetition, so just saying it

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Speaker 3: a few times, but it's actually connecting it with normally

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Speaker 3: if you're doing in it as an actor, connecting it

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Speaker 3: with like an intention of the character, and thinking about

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Speaker 3: it as listening to what the other person was saying.

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Speaker 3: So we always try and if someone asks a question,

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Speaker 3: think of it as what would I say? How would

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Speaker 3: I respond to that question? And really think as you

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Speaker 3: would as a human because we respond to questions all

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Speaker 3: the time, so why would we not do it the

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Speaker 3: same way when you're doing a script. So in terms

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Speaker 3: of this, we we tried to like have each other

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Speaker 3: kind of jumping just towards the end of someone's thoughts.

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Speaker 3: So it felt like it continued on and we had

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Speaker 3: little moments where we'd always script it, even for some

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Speaker 3: forward loose to jump in. Like that was your section

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Speaker 3: where we talk about the difference between meditation and motivation applications,

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Speaker 3: and we talked about how the meditation field is crowded

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Speaker 3: and there are you know, a number of apps on

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Speaker 3: the market and they're wonderful what they do, but it

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Speaker 3: requires consistent practice and sometimes many people are even triggered

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Speaker 3: by motivational you know, the words meditation or motivation, and

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Speaker 3: like Lucy would jump in and go and sometimes people

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Speaker 3: are triggered by the words motivation or meditation.

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Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, so we just.

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Speaker 3: Kind of like it was so it sounds so silly

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Speaker 3: now I'm saying about loud, but it really worked, and

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Speaker 3: it meant that it came across. It meant that we

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Speaker 3: knew that we we knew what we wanted to say,

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Speaker 3: We knew that we had the language, and that we

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Speaker 3: could just relax and we could just deliver it if

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Speaker 3: that was all we were going to get the opportunity

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Speaker 3: to do. But otherwise, yeah, like I said, riff off

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Speaker 3: it and so but we did we programmed in little

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Speaker 3: moments to like jump in on each other, which is

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Speaker 3: also I think useful because then you're not just trying

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Speaker 3: to remember large blocks, like it becomes a conversation.

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Speaker 2: And that makes it way easier.

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Speaker 1: In terms of your career as an entertainer. And you

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Speaker 1: know where I've seen you on stages is Miss Honey

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Speaker 1: and Matilda, and you were amazing and you won a

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Speaker 1: lot of awards for that role, such as the Helpman Award,

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Speaker 1: which is like that's like the Oscars of Australian Theater,

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Speaker 1: I guess exactly for people that don't know that those awards,

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Speaker 1: like what happens after you win all those awards? Do

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Speaker 1: you still have to audition for things?

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Speaker 3: That's a great question, and you know what, sometimes you do. Yes,

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Speaker 3: definitely I still audition for things all the time. But

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Speaker 3: you do sometimes have people just offer you things, and

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Speaker 3: that's amazing, Like that's kind of where you go, this

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Speaker 3: is the dream.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.

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Speaker 3: You know, look, I actually quite like auditioning because I

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Speaker 3: like getting to play a part that for me, I

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Speaker 3: try and go in and think this is my part

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Speaker 3: for these seven minutes, like this is me, this is

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Speaker 3: my version, and hope you like it, basically, but it

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Speaker 3: can often be the only time you ever really get

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Speaker 3: to sing certain material or do a scene, you know,

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Speaker 3: because unless you're the one person chosen for the role,

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Speaker 3: you're not necessarily ever gonna sing that song or.

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Speaker 2: Do that scene. So I don't mind auditioning.

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Speaker 1: When you do have to audition, How do you prepare

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Speaker 1: for an audition?

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Speaker 3: Honestly, it depends on the part, and it depends on

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Speaker 3: the medium. So if you're auditioning for a musical, then

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Speaker 3: you have to prepare three disciplines really, So if the

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Speaker 3: show is a dance show, you might need to tap dance,

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Speaker 3: or it might be more of a hip hop kind

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Speaker 3: of show, or it might be a bit more of

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Speaker 3: a classic Broadway show. So most of the time you

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Speaker 3: want to make sure you're go into a dance class

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Speaker 3: to kind of at least brush up if you haven't

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Speaker 3: been a really diligent person who's always going to dance class,

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Speaker 3: which is what we should all be. But if you're

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Speaker 3: not that person me, then you go to a dance

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Speaker 3: class to try and brush up on that area. And

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Speaker 3: then obviously you have to prepare your script and song.

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Speaker 3: And often if you are going for a role, they

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Speaker 3: often just give you material, so you kind of straight

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Speaker 3: away go into learning the song from the show. But

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Speaker 3: if you're maybe going in for ensemble or they don't

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Speaker 3: really know where to put you, they will often ask

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Speaker 3: you to prepare your own song. So then you'll find

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Speaker 3: in a song that sits in the right style of

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Speaker 3: the show that's not from the show. You know, you

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Speaker 3: try and find something by a similar composer or by

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Speaker 3: that composer from something else, and you have to learn

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Speaker 3: that you prepare it as like thirty two bar because

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Speaker 3: they never want to have too much of it. And

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Speaker 3: then the same thing with your script. And I always

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Speaker 3: try and I always try and learn the lines without

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Speaker 3: trying to put any acting into it, just so like

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Speaker 3: they're words, because otherwise if I find that if I'm

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Speaker 3: learning them with a thought in my head of how

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Speaker 3: I'm supposed to say it, then I can only say

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Speaker 3: it that way, Whereas if I just learn them as words,

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Speaker 3: then when someone gives me something, if I ask someone

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Speaker 3: to read with me, if they give me something different,

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Speaker 3: I can respond differently. Because they're just words, They're not

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Speaker 3: predetermined how they're delivered. So I try and do that,

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Speaker 3: and I always try and have a friendly read with

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Speaker 3: me live before the audition because or else the first

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Speaker 3: time you actually do it with someone else is on

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Speaker 3: the day and then it can throw you. So yes,

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Speaker 3: there's lots of things for that and that. If you're

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Speaker 3: auditioning for a TV or film, then same thing. It's

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Speaker 3: often just a script, but it's a different kind of

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Speaker 3: medium because it's not as physical, so they're not going

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Speaker 3: to see as much of your face or your body,

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Speaker 3: and you have to you know, the cameras off are

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Speaker 3: much closer, so you have to kind of really contain

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Speaker 3: the acting. The thoughts are all the same, but you

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Speaker 3: just have to remember that it's as if I was

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Speaker 3: talking to someone just across from me, rather than projecting

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Speaker 3: to two thousand people. So you know, they're different skill sets,

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Speaker 3: but yeah, there's different kind of things that you can

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Speaker 3: do for each of them.

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Speaker 1: What about rejection, because I imagine you know, as someone

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Speaker 1: in this industry, you would have had lots of rejection,

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Speaker 1: so much like, how have your strategies for dealing with

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Speaker 1: that and managing that changed over the years.

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Speaker 3: When I first started, I used to take it quite

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Speaker 3: personally because I was young and I was still developing

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Speaker 3: my thick skin, I think, and if I'm really honest,

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Speaker 3: when I was little, younger, I was chubby, and I

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Speaker 3: didn't feel very beautiful, and I always felt like I

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Speaker 3: wasn't pretty enough, or I was too fat, or you know,

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Speaker 3: that was kind of the narrative i'd tell myself. And

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Speaker 3: so there was a little of judgment on myself and

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Speaker 3: a little bit of shame, like if I didn't get

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Speaker 3: something or if I didn't go well, and over time

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Speaker 3: I had to thankfully, part of that meant that then

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Speaker 3: I was I looked a little bit older than my

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Speaker 3: age when I first started out, and so that meant

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Speaker 3: that then I actually got a foot in the door

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Speaker 3: because I could cover roles that we're a bit older

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Speaker 3: and a bit younger. And I think that's actually what

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Speaker 3: helped me get into the industry. So now I can

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Speaker 3: reflect on that, I'm quite grateful, but at the time

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Speaker 3: I didn't really understand it that way. But over the years,

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Speaker 3: just because it happens so often, if you get one

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Speaker 3: out of every ten things you go for, you are

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Speaker 3: smashing it like it's it's hard, and often you don't

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Speaker 3: get something and it's nothing to do with you. It's

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Speaker 3: about the balance, it's about the mix. It's that there's

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Speaker 3: actually no male opposite that's also auditioned that's in the

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Speaker 3: right age bracket, or that is you know, they're much

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Speaker 3: taller than you, or it could be anything. You know,

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Speaker 3: they've cast another role and there was only one option,

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Speaker 3: and that person's blonde, So we need a brunette. Like

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Speaker 3: it can be anything, and so it's so not about you,

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Speaker 3: and it's not until you do it enough and enough that.

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Speaker 2: You kind of realize that.

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Speaker 3: And I think for me, I had to just kind

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Speaker 3: of keep telling myself if I am not okay with

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Speaker 3: the rejection, that I just shouldn't do it, and that's okay,

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Speaker 3: Like you.

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Speaker 2: Don't have to do this job.

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Speaker 3: It's a choice, and if you want to do the

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Speaker 3: job you have to. You have to get okay with

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Speaker 3: someone saying no, and remember it's not about you, and focus.

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Speaker 3: For me, I just focus on what is meant to

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Speaker 3: be will be.

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Speaker 1: I want to know, with this kind of change in

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Speaker 1: how you make decisions around deliberately doing things that excite

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Speaker 1: you and make you happy, what does that look like

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Speaker 1: now on a day to day basis when you're evaluating

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Speaker 1: how to live your life.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, oh, I need to do it a

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Speaker 3: little bit. I need to come back to it a

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Speaker 3: little bit, to be honest, because recently I had have

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Speaker 3: said yes to many things and I was feeling a

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Speaker 3: little bit stretched, and I was like, ooh, I'm at

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Speaker 3: capacity and that I think that can happen for a

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Speaker 3: lot of people. And I think that happens for a

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Speaker 3: lot of people in the business world and a lot

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Speaker 3: of people in the enertainment world, because in the entertainment world,

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Speaker 3: we're ultimately always freelancers. You know, you work for a show,

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Speaker 3: whether it's a TV show or a musical or a play,

364
00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:11,720
Speaker 3: for a finite period of time, and so you're constantly

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Speaker 3: moving from employer to employer, and so you don't ever

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Speaker 3: have that sense of normalcy or stability of this is

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Speaker 3: what every day looks like. And so because of that,

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Speaker 3: you tend to say yes because you're like, I don't

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Speaker 3: know what's going to come after this, so I should

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Speaker 3: say yes to what's happening now. And for me, I

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Speaker 3: started making finding and creating ways to make my own work.

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Speaker 3: So I, you know, started writing and I produce and

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Speaker 3: we've you know, created this company, and that has been

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Speaker 3: so powerful because that's given me another skill set and

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Speaker 3: something that I have agency in and have control over.

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Speaker 3: And so I don't feel like I have to say

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Speaker 3: yes to something in the entertainment world or anything. Actually,

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Speaker 3: like I don't have to take a producing job if

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Speaker 3: I don't want to do it, because I would actually

380
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Speaker 3: rather make space to perform in that. Or I don't

381
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Speaker 3: have to say yes to auditioning for that ad that's

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Speaker 3: three thousand dollars and going to take me days and

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Speaker 3: days of work to go in for it, and it's

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Speaker 3: not worth my time because you know what, actually I

385
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Speaker 3: can put my time and energy into this other thing

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Speaker 3: that I love. So having a variety of things I

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Speaker 3: think is really has been really important for me and

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Speaker 3: so useful. And I often like, if I ever get

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Speaker 3: to talk to other actors or young actors, I'm often saying,

390
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Speaker 3: find something else that gives you joy, because sometimes you'll

391
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Speaker 3: burn out because as an actor, you give so much energy,

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Speaker 3: and so you do sometimes deplete yourself of that energy.

393
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Speaker 3: So you need something else that can kind of refill

394
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Speaker 3: your tank. And you know, one of my girlfriends, she'd

395
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Speaker 3: created a company called Sojournal, and she basically designs itineraries

396
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Speaker 3: for people. So because she loves travel, she knows all

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Speaker 3: about different places in the world, and that's what she

398
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Speaker 3: does when she's just like wanting to do something fun.

399
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Speaker 3: And I have another friend that like learned to be

400
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Speaker 3: a vegan chef because that makes her feel fun. And

401
00:18:56,680 --> 00:19:00,600
Speaker 3: so they're not jobs that they necessarily go and try

402
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Speaker 3: and fulfill in a you know, every day, full time sense.

403
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Speaker 2: But it's something else.

404
00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:09,199
Speaker 3: That makes you feel like you have power, that you

405
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Speaker 3: have agency, and that therefore you know and that makes

406
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Speaker 3: you feel good. So then you don't rely on having

407
00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:19,680
Speaker 3: to have someone else approve or validate you to work,

408
00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:21,600
Speaker 3: which is what happens as an actor because you can't

409
00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:25,040
Speaker 3: choose which jobs you get. Someone else decides. They decide

410
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:28,040
Speaker 3: if you get to audition, they decide if you get

411
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Speaker 3: the part, They decide when that job is so because

412
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Speaker 3: you have no autonomy. There For me, it was really

413
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Speaker 3: about creating something else that meant I had autonomy, and

414
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Speaker 3: then it is now it is about saying, what is

415
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Speaker 3: what excites me and what can I validly fit in

416
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Speaker 3: in terms of time and is this time that is worth?

417
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Speaker 3: Is this time that I'm going to carve out for

418
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Speaker 3: this worth that does it sustain me somehow? So recently

419
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Speaker 3: I was asked to work on a development of a

420
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Speaker 3: new TV show and I really really wanted to do that,

421
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Speaker 3: and so even though I was completely full, I was like,

422
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Speaker 3: I'm going to make time, and so I had to

423
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Speaker 3: pull out as something else so I could do that.

424
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Speaker 3: And then same thing, I was asked to do a

425
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:14,080
Speaker 3: development of a new musical, and same thing, I was like, Oh,

426
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Speaker 3: I really want to do that because all you know,

427
00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:17,680
Speaker 3: as an actor, you just want to create a role.

428
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Speaker 3: So I was like, great, I want to do that.

429
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Speaker 3: So I need to change these hours, which means I'm

430
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Speaker 3: going to work on this time on the weekend. And

431
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Speaker 3: that's a valid sacrifice to make because that's important to me.

432
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Speaker 3: But then someone else will ask you to do something

433
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Speaker 3: and I'm like, you know what, that doesn't feel like

434
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Speaker 3: it excites me, so that I'm not going to make space.

435
00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:37,119
Speaker 1: For sounds like there's so many things that you're juggling.

436
00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:38,520
Speaker 1: And I know that you're a big fan of to

437
00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:41,719
Speaker 1: do lists and maybe you've got quite the system. Can

438
00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:44,280
Speaker 1: you talk me through your system for to do lists?

439
00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:44,760
Speaker 2: Yes?

440
00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:48,800
Speaker 3: So I have, like I love a list because there's

441
00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:51,040
Speaker 3: so many different things going on, my brain needs to

442
00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:53,399
Speaker 3: be aware of all these different projects. So I have

443
00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:56,280
Speaker 3: like a master flow chart, and basically it's this big

444
00:20:56,440 --> 00:20:59,480
Speaker 3: chart that has each of the different projects, and within

445
00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:02,280
Speaker 3: each one of them, I have all of the elements

446
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:04,040
Speaker 3: that I need to do, and it might be broken

447
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:06,320
Speaker 3: down in terms of things I need to action, things

448
00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:08,800
Speaker 3: that need to be chased up, things that are and

449
00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:11,439
Speaker 3: I also then in terms of hay Lemon aid, I

450
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,000
Speaker 3: break them down into sections. So this is creative, this

451
00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:18,040
Speaker 3: is legal, this is content, this is marketing. So it's

452
00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,560
Speaker 3: just really clear and easy for me to straight up

453
00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:22,679
Speaker 3: go ooh, there's a lot of things happening in content

454
00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:23,200
Speaker 3: right now.

455
00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:24,879
Speaker 2: I need to put some more time in that.

456
00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:27,720
Speaker 3: Oh that thing that's easy to delegate, great, and it

457
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:30,200
Speaker 3: just kind of gives me an overall view. And if

458
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:33,080
Speaker 3: I can also then tell that there's a whole bunch

459
00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:35,120
Speaker 3: of things on my performance schedule. I need to rehearse

460
00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:37,199
Speaker 3: for Barbra streisand I need to do that audition, I

461
00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,479
Speaker 3: need to put down that tape, I need to you know,

462
00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:42,520
Speaker 3: start preparing learning that script. So you can see there's

463
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:44,600
Speaker 3: a whole bunch of things. And because I can see

464
00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:49,359
Speaker 3: it all. I can see how much, I guess you

465
00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:51,600
Speaker 3: know where the weight is going and maybe where I

466
00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:53,720
Speaker 3: need to carve out more space for one thing and

467
00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:56,000
Speaker 3: less for something else. And I've also use color a

468
00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:59,920
Speaker 3: lot because my brain loves color, and it does it

469
00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:00,440
Speaker 3: kind of.

470
00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 2: Like helps me see somehow.

471
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:02,480
Speaker 1: It helps.

472
00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:04,639
Speaker 3: I have a bit of a photographic memory when color

473
00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:07,800
Speaker 3: is involved. So if something you know, I can kind

474
00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:09,919
Speaker 3: of see the color and then somehow see all the

475
00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:13,080
Speaker 3: things underneath. It sounds silly, but it works.

476
00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:16,240
Speaker 1: It doesn't sound silly at all. Tell me about how

477
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,680
Speaker 1: you manage your diary and how you chunk things, because

478
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:22,120
Speaker 1: again I know you think quite deeply about this.

479
00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:25,480
Speaker 3: I yes, I schedule. I schedule within an inch of

480
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:26,120
Speaker 3: its life.

481
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,320
Speaker 2: So it started. I actually started when I was at.

482
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:32,119
Speaker 3: High school because I was a super nerd. So anyone

483
00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:35,840
Speaker 3: out there that's a nerd, I see, and I would.

484
00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:38,200
Speaker 3: I knew that I had, you know, multiple subjects of exams,

485
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,200
Speaker 3: and I had them all back to back. For some reason,

486
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,200
Speaker 3: mine had all been scheduled back to back. So when

487
00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:44,200
Speaker 3: I schedule now, I do the same thing I did then,

488
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:46,399
Speaker 3: which is I'm like okay, so I say I get

489
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:48,280
Speaker 3: up at six or six thirty, I'll try and either

490
00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:50,320
Speaker 3: go for a walk or do some yoga and do

491
00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,760
Speaker 3: life admin because there's something about having the life admin

492
00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:56,359
Speaker 3: feel at least clear in my brain. It's like having

493
00:22:56,359 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 3: a clear desk. It makes me feel like I can

494
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:00,880
Speaker 3: conquer what's next. And then I schedule. Okay, so from

495
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 3: nine to eleven, I'm going to do hay lemonade. Then

496
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:05,200
Speaker 3: from eleven thirty till this time, I'm going to work

497
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:07,640
Speaker 3: on this project. At three o'clock, I will always try.

498
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:10,359
Speaker 3: Between three and four, I try and sing or try

499
00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:12,560
Speaker 3: and do you know, script work or whatever it might be.

500
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:14,879
Speaker 3: Then I'll do another bit of hay lemonade, and then

501
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:16,879
Speaker 3: I try and do social work, like something social in

502
00:23:16,920 --> 00:23:20,639
Speaker 3: the evening so that I feel connected. And I know

503
00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 3: it sounds like overly scheduled, but it's the only way

504
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:27,879
Speaker 3: I can a get through everything and b for me

505
00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:31,159
Speaker 3: because there's so many projects, I don't have to have

506
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,159
Speaker 3: any one thing finished, or it's unlikely I'll ever have

507
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 3: any one thing finished. So if I've done a bit

508
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:40,080
Speaker 3: of something of each thing that day, then at least

509
00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:42,560
Speaker 3: I feel like I'm maintaining and that kind of gives

510
00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,800
Speaker 3: me a great sense of satisfaction, but also means that

511
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:47,560
Speaker 3: I'm making progress, Whereas if I try to do all

512
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,400
Speaker 3: of one thing, finish that, then move on to the next,

513
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:52,719
Speaker 3: it's just never going to happen. And then you're trying

514
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:56,280
Speaker 3: to particularly with performing, you're rushing it. So I have

515
00:23:56,359 --> 00:24:00,000
Speaker 3: these big concerts coming up. I'm doing these barbarsteris and cons.

516
00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:03,479
Speaker 3: It's across the country. It's me Caroline O'Connor, Katie Noonan

517
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,520
Speaker 3: and Ryan Gonzalez, and we sing the score of Barbra

518
00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:10,239
Speaker 3: Streisand and it's amazing. But her music is epic, and

519
00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:12,600
Speaker 3: so you have to sing it in. So if I wait,

520
00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 3: I can easily just move that off the list because

521
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:16,840
Speaker 3: it doesn't feel like it's right now or it's urgent.

522
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,359
Speaker 3: But if I do that, then my voice isn't gonna

523
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:20,919
Speaker 3: have sung it in when it comes around to it,

524
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,320
Speaker 3: and doing it a week before three days before isn't

525
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 3: enough time. So it's better for me to go, I'm

526
00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 3: going to do an hour, one hour, or I'm gonna

527
00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:30,480
Speaker 3: do just half an hour or And this is what

528
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:30,639
Speaker 3: I do.

529
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,640
Speaker 2: When I'm learning a new show. I will schedule.

530
00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 3: I'll go, Okay, I'm gonna do these two songs today,

531
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 3: tomorrow's a break. I do those two songs the next day,

532
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:40,040
Speaker 3: then a break, than those two songs the next day,

533
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 3: then have a break. Then the next day I will

534
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,560
Speaker 3: do all six of those songs, then start again the

535
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:47,560
Speaker 3: next week, and then I kind of work backwards, and

536
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,480
Speaker 3: I just always alter the order slightly, but make sure

537
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,920
Speaker 3: that you're building on something, because I feel like small

538
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,480
Speaker 3: bite sized chunks is achievable, whereas if it's just all

539
00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:58,240
Speaker 3: one big thing too much.

540
00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 1: I love the I'm wondering what happens.

541
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:06,600
Speaker 2: When things go awright. Well, I think when things go awry.

542
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,000
Speaker 1: Or when your motivation goes awry.

543
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:09,480
Speaker 2: It happens all the time.

544
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 3: To be honest, almost daily things go awry, and so

545
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:14,720
Speaker 3: I almost daily don't stick to the schedule, and I

546
00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:17,240
Speaker 3: have to be okay with that. But something about having

547
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,680
Speaker 3: a schedule means that then you also can the days

548
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:21,879
Speaker 3: it doesn't go awry, means that if I have to

549
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 3: skip singing today or I have to skip working on

550
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 3: that project today, I can because I did some yesterday

551
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:30,240
Speaker 3: and I know I've got it scheduled for some tomorrow.

552
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,480
Speaker 3: So it's it's about like for me, it's about having

553
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,280
Speaker 3: that sense of order that then can be have some

554
00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:41,199
Speaker 3: flexibility around it. And sometimes I definitely lose motivation, and

555
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,000
Speaker 3: that's when I also know that I am tired and

556
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:47,440
Speaker 3: probably a bit burnt out, and so then I will

557
00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:49,919
Speaker 3: also try and just like clear things off the plate

558
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,600
Speaker 3: and like delegate if I can, and or just be

559
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 3: okay that some days you just need to sit on

560
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:57,119
Speaker 3: your couch and watch YouTube clips of dogs. You know,

561
00:25:57,400 --> 00:25:59,199
Speaker 3: that's what I have to do some days. And if

562
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:01,200
Speaker 3: that's what I do, that's okay, and I go cool.

563
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:05,280
Speaker 3: I'll start again tomorrow. I think one of my superpowers

564
00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 3: and my downsides is that I get every things really quickly,

565
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:13,080
Speaker 3: and I think it's something I had to build up

566
00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 3: because of acting. But it's like I make a decision quickly,

567
00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:20,640
Speaker 3: and if it's wrong, that feels so bad. I hate it,

568
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:22,760
Speaker 3: but at least I know and then I can like

569
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:25,200
Speaker 3: try something else. And it's the same with this. It's

570
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 3: like if I don't get something, it sucks, but then

571
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:29,960
Speaker 3: I can try again tomorrow, or at least you know

572
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,640
Speaker 3: where you stand. I rather know than like a oh

573
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:36,879
Speaker 3: maybe in any capacity. And that's how I feel about

574
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:39,080
Speaker 3: the schedule and about all of those elements like if

575
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:42,720
Speaker 3: I can't do it today, oh that sucks, but that's cool.

576
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:45,760
Speaker 3: I'll just start it again tomorrow. Just have to accept

577
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:47,119
Speaker 3: the given circumstances.

578
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: We will be back with at least soon talking about

579
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:57,360
Speaker 1: her slightly unusual system for capturing ideas and thoughts when

580
00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:00,640
Speaker 1: she is on the go. If you'll look for more

581
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: tips to improve the way that you work, I write

582
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 1: a short fortnightly newsletter that contains three cool things that

583
00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:11,000
Speaker 1: I've discovered that helped me work better, ranging from software

584
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:14,440
Speaker 1: and gadgets that I'm loving through the interesting research findings.

585
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:17,439
Speaker 1: You can sign up for that at Howiwork dot co.

586
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:21,720
Speaker 1: That's how I work dot co. I know you've got

587
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:24,159
Speaker 1: a system for when you think of something on the

588
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: go and you need to remember it, tell me what

589
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:26,800
Speaker 1: you do.

590
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:30,560
Speaker 3: So I write myself text messages so I have a

591
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 3: running text to myself. It's equals MC squared because my

592
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 3: name is Elise and mccatn which is mcc and I

593
00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:39,960
Speaker 3: actually had been It was because when I was in

594
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:42,960
Speaker 3: New York, I remember walking past his coffee place and

595
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,359
Speaker 3: they had a picture of Albert Einstein and e and

596
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 3: then m with you know the two like sign and

597
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 3: I was like, Ohm, sorry see and then the two

598
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 3: and I was like, oh god, that's my initials. And

599
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:56,440
Speaker 3: I was like, oh my gosh, that's like energy. That's

600
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,680
Speaker 3: like abb Einstein's whoa and my mind blew and I was.

601
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 2: Like, there says me, I feel seen. And it was

602
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 2: just like this like weird moment.

603
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,679
Speaker 3: And also I have a massive Mariahkarry obsession, so of

604
00:28:07,720 --> 00:28:10,439
Speaker 3: course we all know the emancipation of MIMI is E

605
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:14,800
Speaker 3: equals MC squared, So I basically label myself equals MC squared.

606
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 3: And it always gives me a giggle because then if

607
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:18,760
Speaker 3: I have to write something to myself, I can find

608
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,280
Speaker 3: it really easily. And it also just means everything is

609
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 3: in one spot and I can come back to it

610
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:27,840
Speaker 3: really quickly. But it something about laughing, I think just

611
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 3: it releases indoorphins, It releases tension, it releases stress, so

612
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 3: when my brain is on overdrive at least. Also, yeah,

613
00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:35,880
Speaker 3: having like a fun name for my own text message

614
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:37,679
Speaker 3: love letter to myself is useful.

615
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 1: Do you, like, do you do anything with those messages, like,

616
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:45,720
Speaker 1: for example, do you have a system where you will

617
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:49,440
Speaker 1: go back over all the messages that you will send

618
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:53,840
Speaker 1: to equals MC squad during the day and then do

619
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 1: something with them. Or is it more just a repository

620
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 1: of things.

621
00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 3: It's more a repository of things, to be honest. But

622
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 3: to be honest, something about writing them down means that

623
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 3: my brain doesn't need to remember them anymore. And then

624
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 3: I often I do come back to them at the

625
00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 3: end of the day, but I often find that most

626
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:10,800
Speaker 3: of them have been actioned by that stage, and when

627
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:12,040
Speaker 3: they haven't, added them to the flow.

628
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 1: Shut.

629
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 3: But of course, but but it kind of it isn't

630
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 3: most of the time for me, just about the brain

631
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 3: not wasting energy on trying to remember something.

632
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:25,680
Speaker 2: I am very lucky.

633
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 3: That I happen to be able to work quite quickly,

634
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,360
Speaker 3: and I am a great multitasker. I'm good at getting

635
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:32,200
Speaker 3: shit done. I don't know if I'm allowed to swear sorry,

636
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 3: you can. Christ I stopped myself earlier, I couldn't this time.

637
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 3: I'm really good at getting shit done. And and so

638
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:44,320
Speaker 3: if I but I get I holt, I get stopped

639
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 3: or you know, I get stuck in that if I

640
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 3: feel like I'm trying to hold onto too many things.

641
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 3: So it's mostly just about getting them out and I

642
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:54,360
Speaker 3: think that that's you know, that works with stress, with

643
00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 3: all kinds of things. Just getting it out means that

644
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:58,960
Speaker 3: you can come back to that later if you want to.

645
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 3: I think I think it works with anger. I think

646
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:03,800
Speaker 3: it works with actually all of our emotions too, Like

647
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,360
Speaker 3: if you are really angry at someone or really hurt

648
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,440
Speaker 3: by something, I often will write that down, write down

649
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 3: exactly what I want to say to that person, because

650
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:13,160
Speaker 3: then I don't have to hold it. Then I can

651
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:15,600
Speaker 3: actually let it go. And if I want to tell them,

652
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 3: I've got it there so I don't have to hold

653
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,400
Speaker 3: onto it to remember to tell them it's there. So

654
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:23,000
Speaker 3: it just I do that with everything, just like write

655
00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:26,080
Speaker 3: it down some way so then you can let it go.

656
00:30:26,440 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 1: I know you're a big fan of emails in draft.

657
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:29,960
Speaker 2: I am.

658
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:30,959
Speaker 1: Tell me about that.

659
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 3: Okay, so most people think I'm nuts about this, but

660
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 3: I if I have something that I want to if

661
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 3: I need to action, or an email I need to

662
00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 3: send to someone, or information I need to convey to someone,

663
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 3: I will start it in an email. And then if

664
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 3: I you know, if I just have a thought like oh,

665
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:48,720
Speaker 3: that's right. Actually, you know what, let's make sure that

666
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 3: we tell everyone that we're going to have this year subscription,

667
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 3: and let's tell them on the first of January. I'll

668
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:54,440
Speaker 3: go and write that in an email and you know,

669
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 3: write the name of the person this is going to

670
00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:57,560
Speaker 3: go to. But I'll pop it in an email and

671
00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 3: leave it in my drafts. And I do that with

672
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:03,000
Speaker 3: everything because so I actually have I just checked this morning,

673
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 3: I have twenty six drafts in my email, which is

674
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:08,800
Speaker 3: actually not too bad, I thought, but draft emails, I

675
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 3: should say. But the reason I do that is because

676
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 3: or else I'm going to write that down somewhere else

677
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 3: to remember it and then have to come back and

678
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:17,720
Speaker 3: at some point translate that into an email. Whereas if I,

679
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:20,080
Speaker 3: you know, if I'm working through a problem or I'm

680
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 3: you know, thinking about something we need to action down

681
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 3: the track, if I have it in an email draft already,

682
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:26,000
Speaker 3: then half the work is done.

683
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:26,960
Speaker 2: You just you get.

684
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 3: And also it's another reminder every time you go back

685
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 3: to your drafts or something else happens, you're like, oh, yes,

686
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,920
Speaker 3: of course that have I actioned that yet, And you

687
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:36,600
Speaker 3: can just add to it and it's all same thing

688
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:38,360
Speaker 3: in the one place. And it's kind of like having

689
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 3: little you know, flow tabs for each individual thing, but

690
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 3: it saves me the time of you know, going back

691
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:43,920
Speaker 3: in and doing it later.

692
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 2: And I know that lots of people.

693
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:48,600
Speaker 3: Say, carve at time to do one thing and you

694
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:50,880
Speaker 3: know that's what's going to make you most productive. But

695
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:53,880
Speaker 3: for me, I'm I'm yeah, the opposite. I'm the opposite

696
00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 3: in all of the things.

697
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:55,360
Speaker 2: I think.

698
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 1: Now.

699
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 2: I know that one of your friends.

700
00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:02,640
Speaker 1: Gave you advice that is I think commonly given that

701
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,240
Speaker 1: you're the average of the five people that you spend

702
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 1: the most time with, and I know that's something you've

703
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:12,400
Speaker 1: thought about. Can you tell me what, like, what changes

704
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,200
Speaker 1: have you made to your life after doubling down on

705
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:15,800
Speaker 1: that advice.

706
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's so funny because, yeah, my friend said that

707
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 3: to me years ago, years and years ago, like probably

708
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 3: a decade ago, and I had remembered thinking, oh, wow,

709
00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:27,200
Speaker 3: that's really cool. Yeah that's cool, and thinking about the

710
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 3: people that I probably spent the most time with and

711
00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:31,800
Speaker 3: feeling like, oh, they're awesome people.

712
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:32,280
Speaker 2: I love that.

713
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 3: And it wasn't until I would say, probably three or

714
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:40,360
Speaker 3: four years ago, probably three years ago, probably no, probably

715
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 3: four years ago, and then really enhanced with COVID, so

716
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:47,000
Speaker 3: almost three years ago that I was reminded of that

717
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 3: that saying by this same friend and realized, oh, I

718
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:53,560
Speaker 3: needed to take action on this. And that was because

719
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 3: I realized that I had as a people pleaser and

720
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,680
Speaker 3: I am out person I would, you know, I would

721
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 3: say that that's something. You know, I get energy from others,

722
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:09,760
Speaker 3: and so an extrovert, I guess you'd say, I would

723
00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:12,680
Speaker 3: often give my time to lots of people. I would

724
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:15,160
Speaker 3: try and do catch ups with lots of people because

725
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 3: you make a lot of friends in our industry, because

726
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:19,920
Speaker 3: you meet a lot of individual people and you get

727
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:21,960
Speaker 3: on really well. And I would try and catch up

728
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 3: with all of those people. Everyone's like, let's catch up.

729
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:25,560
Speaker 3: You're like yeah, yeah, yeah, and you make all this time.

730
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 3: But I realized that actually a lot of those catch

731
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 3: ups are actually work colleagues. They're not necessarily friends, and

732
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,560
Speaker 3: that's okay. And I realized that I actually needed to

733
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:41,320
Speaker 3: be more deliberate about when I give that time, because

734
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,760
Speaker 3: you talk for an hour about the biz or things,

735
00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 3: but actually you've not had really meaningful, engaged conversations and

736
00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 3: or not necessarily with someone that is refilling or reinvesting

737
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,239
Speaker 3: in me. And I realized I need to it's up

738
00:33:57,280 --> 00:33:59,480
Speaker 3: to me to stop putting my energy out there to

739
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 3: everyone else and just giving that to everyone else if

740
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:04,880
Speaker 3: it's not also being replenished. And so I really deliberately

741
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 3: were like, I don't have to be friends with everyone.

742
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:09,440
Speaker 3: I can be friendly, but I don't have to be

743
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:12,600
Speaker 3: best friends with everyone. That's okay, and so I'm going

744
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:15,640
Speaker 3: to focus on the people that inspire me and invest

745
00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:20,239
Speaker 3: in me and motivate me, because that is you know,

746
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:23,319
Speaker 3: then that's kind of refeeling, and that's cyclical. We kind

747
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,560
Speaker 3: of then support each other. And so I really deliberately

748
00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:30,719
Speaker 3: did that, and I think COVID was helpful because we

749
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 3: all were stuck at home and so we couldn't do

750
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:35,359
Speaker 3: all those catch ups and you know, someone's like, oh,

751
00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 3: let's have a phone call, let's have a zoom, and

752
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:39,799
Speaker 3: then you realize, actually that person never reaches out, and

753
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 3: you're like, oh, that's okay. Well, then we're probably not

754
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,680
Speaker 3: as important to each other. And that doesn't mean we

755
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:49,920
Speaker 3: can't be friendly, but we don't need each other in

756
00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:51,920
Speaker 3: the same way. And so just being able to let

757
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:54,200
Speaker 3: go of that and then focus on the people that

758
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:57,520
Speaker 3: are important and that really give back has been really

759
00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:02,880
Speaker 3: useful and friends and family. Community is really important to me.

760
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:06,800
Speaker 3: They are central to my life, feeling connected and feeling

761
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:08,799
Speaker 3: like there are people that I can share it with.

762
00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:12,560
Speaker 3: And I think because a point did come actually when

763
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,880
Speaker 3: I won The Helpman with Matilda and I'd won the

764
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:18,200
Speaker 3: Sydney Theater Award and I was playing this role that

765
00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:21,240
Speaker 3: I loved, and I was like, Wow, this is everything

766
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 3: I ever thought that I wanted. I've literally gotten all

767
00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 3: the things I've wanted and I have no one to

768
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:28,520
Speaker 3: share it with. And it was because I was so

769
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:32,359
Speaker 3: busy with work and with all of these you know,

770
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:36,520
Speaker 3: people that were friendly, but I hadn't I didn't have

771
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:40,080
Speaker 3: a partner at the time, and I, you know, wasn't

772
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 3: making time for my family. And I was like, wow,

773
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:46,279
Speaker 3: I really don't have that sense of anchoring community to

774
00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:48,120
Speaker 3: share this with. And I was like, and it means

775
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:51,040
Speaker 3: nothing when that happens. So yeah, I made a concerted

776
00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:54,959
Speaker 3: effort to start investing in those people that were going

777
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:56,239
Speaker 3: to give back to me.

778
00:35:57,400 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 1: How did you do that? I feel like that's easier said,

779
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:04,840
Speaker 1: that's done, And I can certainly relate to what you're saying.

780
00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:07,640
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm an only child and so for me,

781
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,120
Speaker 1: friends the family that I choose absolutely, and so I

782
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 1: take my friendships really really seriously. And I think over

783
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 1: the last few years, I've been very reflective when I

784
00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:24,720
Speaker 1: catch up with someone. Am I getting energized and energy

785
00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:27,319
Speaker 1: from this person, or am I leaving feeling a bit

786
00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:29,600
Speaker 1: deflated and like I gave so much of myself but

787
00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:32,400
Speaker 1: I'm not really kind of getting it back. I'm curious

788
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:34,600
Speaker 1: as to what that process is like for you.

789
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like, that's a great question. And part of it

790
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:41,320
Speaker 3: was a mindset, but in actual tangible form, it was

791
00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,320
Speaker 3: having to stop myself from doing a lot of reaching

792
00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:51,520
Speaker 3: out because I would often move into a state of, oh,

793
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:54,320
Speaker 3: I need to make sure that person knows that I

794
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 3: like them or I value them, or that person had

795
00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:58,319
Speaker 3: said we should catch up, so I want it. I'm

796
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,320
Speaker 3: going to reach out to them. And I deliberately stopped

797
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:04,799
Speaker 3: myself from reaching out to anyone for a month. And

798
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:06,920
Speaker 3: I know that sounds so silly. I mean, I did

799
00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:10,600
Speaker 3: my partner and my family obviously, but otherwise I was like,

800
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,279
Speaker 3: I'm not going to reach out and initiate a catch

801
00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:16,400
Speaker 3: up and I'm going to see who reaches out to me.

802
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:17,359
Speaker 2: And it was.

803
00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:21,760
Speaker 3: Sobering to be honest, because that I think and obviously

804
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:23,440
Speaker 3: lots of people have lots of things going on in

805
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:27,279
Speaker 3: their lives and it's not definitive and it's not indicative

806
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:30,799
Speaker 3: of all ways of how important someone is. But it

807
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:33,960
Speaker 3: was about making space for people to come to me

808
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:38,239
Speaker 3: rather than always coming towards others. And that was kind

809
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:40,239
Speaker 3: of what set me off. And then once I was

810
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:42,279
Speaker 3: able to go, Wow, that person's reached out and that

811
00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:44,239
Speaker 3: person has been hey, I'm just going to check in,

812
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 3: or that person or I feel like I'm missing that person.

813
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:49,840
Speaker 3: I haven't heard from them, but I really feel like

814
00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 3: I missed them. That was the what made me go, Okay,

815
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:54,279
Speaker 3: I need to reach out to them because that is

816
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 3: giving me something. And so it was, Yeah, it's mostly

817
00:37:57,080 --> 00:37:58,240
Speaker 3: about it was making space.

818
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:01,520
Speaker 1: I love that idea of a thirty day.

819
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:03,520
Speaker 3: We do it all the time, and that's the thing

820
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 3: it was, because you know I do I did a

821
00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 3: thirty day meditation challenge, we do a thirty day detox,

822
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 3: we do a thirty you know what I mean, like

823
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:13,200
Speaker 3: thirty days of November, like whatever it might be. It's like, yeah,

824
00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:16,400
Speaker 3: just see what happens. I know, because people say it

825
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:19,279
Speaker 3: all the time. With acting, they say like, don't if

826
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,200
Speaker 3: you go forward too much, if you yell, if you press,

827
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:25,200
Speaker 3: people pull away. But if you kind of lean in,

828
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:27,560
Speaker 3: you know, or if you speak quieter, if you make

829
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,080
Speaker 3: more space around you. If you're talking all the time,

830
00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 3: this is my fault. Then no one has space to talk.

831
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 3: But if you leave space, someone else can talk. And

832
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:36,440
Speaker 3: it's the same with this.

833
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:38,560
Speaker 2: It's like create space and see who can come in

834
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:39,200
Speaker 2: to your life.

835
00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 1: Love that. I love that at least for people wanting

836
00:38:42,200 --> 00:38:45,360
Speaker 1: to connect with you. What is the best way to

837
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:45,799
Speaker 1: do that.

838
00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:49,839
Speaker 3: I am terrible on Twitter and LinkedIn. I have them,

839
00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 3: but I don't use them a lot. I'm trying to

840
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:54,800
Speaker 3: use LinkedIn more. So welcome me to that field, guys,

841
00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:58,520
Speaker 3: because I it's not the field you normally use as

842
00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:00,680
Speaker 3: an actor, So welcome me there because I'm trying.

843
00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 2: But I mostly use.

844
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:06,560
Speaker 3: Instagram and probably Instagram the most, to be honest. So

845
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:08,799
Speaker 3: you can reach out of any of my socials or

846
00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:10,879
Speaker 3: I've got a website you can reach out through.

847
00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:13,839
Speaker 2: Hay Lemonade. I would yeah, love to connect great.

848
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:17,160
Speaker 1: I'll put all those handles in the show notes.

849
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 2: Elie. Thank you just been.

850
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,960
Speaker 1: Such a joy. As I finished, has that time gone?

851
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:25,360
Speaker 1: It has because we're going to get kicked out of

852
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:28,640
Speaker 1: the studio. But as I said to you when I

853
00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 1: met you, when I was like reading over and doing

854
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:34,319
Speaker 1: research for the interview, I'm like, I think this is

855
00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:37,960
Speaker 1: my kindred spirit that I'm about to meet. Oh my god,

856
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:38,480
Speaker 1: I feel it.

857
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 2: I feel it. I'm such a fan. So this has

858
00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:44,600
Speaker 2: been such a joy and privilege.

859
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 1: Thank you, Mutual Joy, Thank you. One of my favorite

860
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:51,600
Speaker 1: takeouts from this interview was the fact that har and

861
00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 1: Lucy literally scripted out their meeting with Alan Joyce. I

862
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:00,480
Speaker 1: just think that's so cool, and it's made me really

863
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:05,719
Speaker 1: rethink how I approach sales meetings. I feel like, having had,

864
00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:09,480
Speaker 1: oh gosh, a couple of decades worth of experience selling

865
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:13,960
Speaker 1: things and doing business development, I sometimes find myself getting

866
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:17,760
Speaker 1: lazy and not doing the preparation that I ideally should

867
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 1: be doing. So hearing Elise talk about all the work

868
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 1: that went into their pitch with Alan Joyce has kind

869
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:31,080
Speaker 1: of reinvigorated me to go, Hmm, how can I be

870
00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:35,160
Speaker 1: more disciplined to make sure I really maximize the time

871
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:38,319
Speaker 1: that I get to spend in front of people who

872
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:41,360
Speaker 1: might want to be buying the products and services that

873
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:45,439
Speaker 1: I'm offering. Thank you for sharing part of your day

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00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:48,239
Speaker 1: with me by listening to How I Work. If you're

875
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:51,000
Speaker 1: keen for more tips on how to work better, connect

876
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:54,920
Speaker 1: with me via LinkedIn or Instagram. I'm very easy to find.

877
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 1: Just search for Amantha Imba. How I Work was recorded

878
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:04,120
Speaker 1: on the traditional land of the WARRANGERI people part of

879
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:07,520
Speaker 1: the cool And Nation. I am so grateful for being

880
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:10,440
Speaker 1: able to work and live on this beautiful land and

881
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:13,360
Speaker 1: I want to pay my respects to elder's past, present

882
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:17,600
Speaker 1: and emerging. How I Work is produced by Inventium with

883
00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:19,719
Speaker 1: production support from Dead Set Studios.

884
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:21,640
Speaker 2: The producer for this episode was

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00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:24,440
Speaker 1: Liam Riordon, and thank you to Martin Nimba who did

886
00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:26,840
Speaker 1: the audio mix and makes everything sound better than it

887
00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:28,080
Speaker 1: would have otherwise.