WEBVTT - The French trial making global headlines

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<v Speaker 1>Justa heads up, we'll be discussing sexual abuse and distressing

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<v Speaker 1>themes on the podcast today. The episode might not be

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<v Speaker 1>for everyone, so if you're not filling up to it,

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<v Speaker 1>feel free to skip and come back again tomorrow. Good morning,

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<v Speaker 1>and welcome to the Daily OS. It's Monday, the sixteenth

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<v Speaker 1>of September. I'm Emma, I'm Chloe. A court case out

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<v Speaker 1>of France has captured the attention of the world these

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<v Speaker 1>last couple of weeks. It's an incredibly disturbing story about

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<v Speaker 1>a seventy one year old woman, her ex husband, and

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<v Speaker 1>fifty other men. For the next three months, Gaselle Pelico

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<v Speaker 1>will sit in a courtroom in Avignon, France, as those

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<v Speaker 1>fifty one men, all but one who are strangers to her,

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<v Speaker 1>face rape charges for alleged crimes against her that she

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<v Speaker 1>has no memory of.

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<v Speaker 2>You've probably seen the headlines, but there's a lot that's

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<v Speaker 2>come out about this case, and there's a lot to come,

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<v Speaker 2>so we want to help you understand the context this

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<v Speaker 2>story today in the Deep Dive. But first, m what's

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<v Speaker 2>making headlines.

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<v Speaker 1>Lord Mayor of Sydney, Clover Moore has secured her sixth

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<v Speaker 1>term in office after New South Wales held its local

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<v Speaker 1>council elections over the weekend. Moore first assumed the role

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<v Speaker 1>of Lord Mayor for the City of Sydney in two

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<v Speaker 1>thousand and four. She said she was really delighted about

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<v Speaker 1>the outcome of the election and that it was quote

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<v Speaker 1>a pretty tough campaign and some awful things were said,

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<v Speaker 1>but I'm so encouraged and happy about the city community

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<v Speaker 1>endorsing me.

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<v Speaker 2>A report into the robojet scheme has found twelve current

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<v Speaker 2>and former public servants and former agency heads breached their

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<v Speaker 2>code of conduct on ninety seven occasions. Robodet was a

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<v Speaker 2>government debt collection system used from twenty fifteen to twenty nineteen.

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<v Speaker 2>An illegal automation error resulted in over one point seven

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<v Speaker 2>billion dollars of unlawful debt notices. The Australian Public Service Commissioner,

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<v Speaker 2>who released the findings on Friday, said the scheme was

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<v Speaker 2>a failure of government and apologize for the public services

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<v Speaker 2>role in it.

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<v Speaker 1>A fifty cent public transport fair trial underway in Queensland

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<v Speaker 1>at the moment, will be extended permanently after both major

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<v Speaker 1>parties in the state committed to continuing the cheaper transport

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<v Speaker 1>fares if they win October's election. Queensland Premier Stephen Miles

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<v Speaker 1>said Labour would lock in the fifty cent fairs quote

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<v Speaker 1>forever if they're successful at next month's election. Opposition later

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<v Speaker 1>David Crucifully also announced over the weekend that the LNP

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<v Speaker 1>will extend the current fifty cent fare if there's a

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<v Speaker 1>change of government.

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<v Speaker 2>And today's good news, the US Food and Drug Administration

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<v Speaker 2>the FDA has approved the first over the counter hearing

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<v Speaker 2>a device. The device is compatible with the newest Apple

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<v Speaker 2>Airport's pro which were released last week in the US.

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<v Speaker 2>Acting director for the FDA's Center for Devices and Radiological Health,

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<v Speaker 2>Michelle Tava, so the device is quote another step that

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<v Speaker 2>advances the availability, accessibility, and acceptability of hearing support for adults.

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<v Speaker 1>Gizelle Pelico is the woman at the center of a

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<v Speaker 1>rape trial in France at the moment, she says she

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<v Speaker 1>was raped while unconscious over a period of ten years. Now.

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<v Speaker 1>Her ex husband has admitted to orchestrating the assaults, but

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<v Speaker 1>the global interest in this story has exploded in recent weeks,

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<v Speaker 1>and it's one that we might not actually have ever

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<v Speaker 1>known about or even discussed on this podcast if it

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<v Speaker 1>weren't for Gazelle herself after she explicitly requested the proceedings

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<v Speaker 1>be made public in the hopes of helping other women

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<v Speaker 1>in the future. Chloe, this is an incredibly disturbing case

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<v Speaker 1>and one that you've covered for us on the Daily Os.

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<v Speaker 1>The details are really distressing, as we mentioned at the

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<v Speaker 1>top of the podcast, but central to this story are

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<v Speaker 1>the wishes from Gazelle the alleged victim, to open up

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<v Speaker 1>a conversation about abuse. So let's take it back a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit. Where this case come from. Where does this

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<v Speaker 1>story start?

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<v Speaker 2>So m At the center of this case is Gazelle

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<v Speaker 2>Pellico and Dominique Pellico. They're both seventy one years old.

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<v Speaker 2>They're now separated, but the pair got married when they

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<v Speaker 2>were both twenty one. They have three children and seven grandchildren,

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<v Speaker 2>and they lived together in a small village called Mazan

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<v Speaker 2>in the south of France, and speaking to the court,

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<v Speaker 2>it was Gazelle's understanding that they were a strong couple.

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<v Speaker 2>It was in Mazan that Dominique was initially investigated by

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<v Speaker 2>police when in November twenty twenty, he was caught filming

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<v Speaker 2>up women's skirts at a local supermarket. Police searched Dominique's

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<v Speaker 2>computer and said that they found a folder labeled abuses

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<v Speaker 2>containing over twenty thousand images of an unconscious woman being

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<v Speaker 2>raped by several different men.

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<v Speaker 1>And that woman was Gazelle.

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<v Speaker 2>Correct.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, So French police were actually investigating Dominique for a

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<v Speaker 1>completely different offense when they discovered all this evidence of

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<v Speaker 1>far more serious crimes. Started as this upskirting case and

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<v Speaker 1>has clearly evolved into something far more sinister.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, they inadvertently stumbled upon this footage when they were

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<v Speaker 2>investigating Dominique of separate offenses. And Gizelle said that the

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<v Speaker 2>search of Dominique's computer and those early police investigations is

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<v Speaker 2>what saved her life. She had no memory of the

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<v Speaker 2>rapes and did not recognize any of the men in

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<v Speaker 2>the images that were shown to her by police, and

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<v Speaker 2>that's because her then husband had admitted to drugging her.

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<v Speaker 2>Dominique has pleaded guilty to all the charges against him,

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<v Speaker 2>which includes aggravated rape, drugging, and violating the privacy of

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<v Speaker 2>his wife.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so that brings us to the court case that's

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<v Speaker 1>currently playing out. Gizelle was being frequently sedated. She is

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<v Speaker 1>the woman in the images uncovered by police being assaulted

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<v Speaker 1>by several men, but she didn't know about the assaults.

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<v Speaker 1>How has she described her memory of that time?

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<v Speaker 2>This part is pretty distressing. During her testimony, Gazelle recounted

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<v Speaker 2>experiencing total blackouts beginning in twenty eleven. By twenty thirteen,

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<v Speaker 2>she became increasingly worried that she was developing Alzheimer's disease

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<v Speaker 2>due to chronic memory lapses, weight loss, and hair loss.

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<v Speaker 2>She said, I didn't understand why I had these moments

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<v Speaker 2>like this.

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<v Speaker 3>Wow.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it's unimaginable to consider that she's going through

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<v Speaker 1>this kind of personal turmoil of a health crisis and

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<v Speaker 1>feeling unwell and having no idea that that was just

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<v Speaker 1>the tip of this horrifying iceberg. What we have learned

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<v Speaker 1>over the course of this case is that the extent

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<v Speaker 1>of abuse against Gizelle was extreme and it was calculated,

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<v Speaker 1>and Dominique, her ex husband, has admitted to that. Can

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<v Speaker 1>you take us through a bit more about the revelations

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<v Speaker 1>from him.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this was just the beginning of a lot more

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<v Speaker 2>to come. Dominic did give more details about the abuse

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<v Speaker 2>and so it is very disturbing if you're not in

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<v Speaker 2>the right space to hear it, please just skip ahead.

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<v Speaker 2>Dominique admitted to putting sleeping pills into his wife's evening

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<v Speaker 2>meals to sedate her before raping her and arranging for

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<v Speaker 2>others to rape her from twenty eleven to twenty twenty.

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<v Speaker 2>He told police that while Gazelle was unconscious, he invited

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<v Speaker 2>a number of men to their home to film them

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<v Speaker 2>raping her.

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<v Speaker 1>We've heard that there were several men involved. There are

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<v Speaker 1>dozens of men in this court case who are facing charges.

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<v Speaker 1>What do we know about them? How did they end

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<v Speaker 1>up in Dominique and Gazelle's home? How were they engaged?

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<v Speaker 2>Dominique met most of these men via what is a

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<v Speaker 2>now banned online chat for him called Coco and this

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<v Speaker 2>has been very much on the radar of police for

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<v Speaker 2>quite some time. It's been used in the past to

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<v Speaker 2>coordinate sex crimes and other serious offenses across Europe.

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<v Speaker 1>In terms of the men, is there a specific profile?

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<v Speaker 1>Do we know how old they were?

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<v Speaker 2>After reviewing the footage from Dominique's computer, police made a

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<v Speaker 2>list of eighty three suspects and they've identified and charged fifty.

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<v Speaker 2>The men who allegedly assaulted Gazelle were aged between twenty

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<v Speaker 2>six and seventy.

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<v Speaker 1>Four before we get to what lies ahead for those

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<v Speaker 1>fifty men who have been charged. Dominique, the ex husband

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<v Speaker 1>of the victim, has pleaded guilty to all the charges

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<v Speaker 1>against him. Now, just to recap, that includes aggravated rape, drugging,

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<v Speaker 1>violating the privacy of his wife. There are some other

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<v Speaker 1>violations as well against him.

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<v Speaker 2>What are those so m On top of those charges

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<v Speaker 2>you mentioned, he's also accused of violating the privacy of

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<v Speaker 2>his daughter and two daughters in law after illicit photos

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<v Speaker 2>of them were also found on his devices. For all

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<v Speaker 2>of these crimes, Dominique faces a maximum sentence of twenty

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<v Speaker 2>years in prison. His lawyer described his actions as quote

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<v Speaker 2>a form of addiction, and told reporters that Dominique is

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<v Speaker 2>ashamed of what he did. It is unforgivable.

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<v Speaker 1>When we shared this story on our feed that you

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<v Speaker 1>wrote for us, Chloe, lots of people in the comments

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<v Speaker 1>were really surprised that twenty years is the maximum sentencing

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<v Speaker 1>that he's facing. A lot of outrage people said that

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<v Speaker 1>they didn't feel like it was a severe enough sentence

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<v Speaker 1>for these crimes. Obviously, sentencing is still to come, and

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<v Speaker 1>these are the limitations of the French law. But there

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<v Speaker 1>are fifty other men involved in this case too, so

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<v Speaker 1>what about them.

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<v Speaker 2>So most of the other fifty defendants have been charged

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<v Speaker 2>with aggravated rape and they could also face up to

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<v Speaker 2>twenty years if they're convicted. Many have pleaded not guilty,

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<v Speaker 2>with some saying that they thought they were participating in

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<v Speaker 2>a consensual role playing scenario between the couple where Gazelle

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<v Speaker 2>just pretended to be asleep. Gazelle has disputed those claims,

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<v Speaker 2>saying they knew exactly what they were doing and what

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<v Speaker 2>shape I was in. These videos are scenes of horror

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<v Speaker 2>for me. Similarly, Dominique said everyone knew Gazelle was drugged

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<v Speaker 2>and unconscious, adding that quote every individual had free will

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<v Speaker 2>and could have left the premier.

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<v Speaker 1>So a big part of this story, Chloe, is to

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<v Speaker 1>do with how much of it is in the public domain.

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<v Speaker 1>In many court cases, you know, we often really struggle

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<v Speaker 1>to report on them. Details can be quite limited. Courtrooms

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<v Speaker 1>can be closed, and that's for many reasons, to protect

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<v Speaker 1>identities or because of legal orders. How is it with

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<v Speaker 1>this particular case, a really unique situation, that we have

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<v Speaker 1>so much detailed information.

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<v Speaker 2>You're right, so under French law, complainants have the right

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<v Speaker 2>to remain entirely private during a trial, so we might

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<v Speaker 2>see pseudonyms like John Doe or Jane Doe, and that's

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<v Speaker 2>how we will never know who is behind these cases.

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<v Speaker 2>But instead Gazelle Pelico has insisted on complete total publicity,

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<v Speaker 2>and that's quote from her.

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<v Speaker 1>Has she said why she wants her name published and

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<v Speaker 1>these allegations aired.

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<v Speaker 2>She said to reporters, so when other women wake up

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<v Speaker 2>with no memory, they might remember the testimony of miss

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<v Speaker 2>Now this has been met with widespread support from people

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<v Speaker 2>in France women across the world who have commended Gizelle

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<v Speaker 2>for her bravery. That is not an easy thing to do,

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<v Speaker 2>to put your name to something that is as horrific

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<v Speaker 2>as what we heard in that.

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<v Speaker 1>Trial if we zoom out a little bit, and I

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<v Speaker 1>think this kind of ties in to the outrage about

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<v Speaker 1>maybe current French legislation, that it doesn't go far enough,

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<v Speaker 1>that it's not harsh enough, and what that tells us

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<v Speaker 1>about the country's relationship with women's rights. There's actually another

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<v Speaker 1>quite high profile case in the spotlight in France now,

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<v Speaker 1>specifically about sexual abuse and women's rights. What do we

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<v Speaker 1>know about that story?

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<v Speaker 2>There have been growing calls to change the country's attitudes

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<v Speaker 2>towards sexual violence, notably led by high profile French actor

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<v Speaker 2>Judith god Resh. In February, god Resh, who's fifty one,

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<v Speaker 2>publicly accused of director she worked with at the age

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<v Speaker 2>of fourteen of sexually assaulting her on a film set.

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<v Speaker 2>And there was an opinion piece I read from The

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<v Speaker 2>Washington that was written by a French journalist. Her name

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<v Speaker 2>is Rakaia Dalio. What she was arguing in the piece

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<v Speaker 2>was that France has been slower to embrace the principles

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<v Speaker 2>that we saw in the Me Too movement at the

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<v Speaker 2>end of twenty seventeen. She suggested that the support we've

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<v Speaker 2>seen with god Resch and now what we've seen with

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<v Speaker 2>Pelico quote signaled that perhaps the larger culture here is

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<v Speaker 2>finally ready to push back.

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<v Speaker 1>In practical terms for women in France, what does that

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<v Speaker 1>actually look like, what do they want to change? Specifically?

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<v Speaker 2>It's opened up a conversation about what the French government

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<v Speaker 2>defines as rape. Advocates are pushing French lawmakers to explicitly

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<v Speaker 2>include the concept of consent in the legal definition of rape.

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<v Speaker 2>In March, President Emmanuel Macron expressed his support for this change,

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<v Speaker 2>which could mark a significant step forward in addressing sexual

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<v Speaker 2>violence in the country.

0:12:52.040 --> 0:12:56.360
<v Speaker 1>But it's obviously been a tumultuous year in French politics,

0:12:56.440 --> 0:13:01.240
<v Speaker 1>an election, a change of prime minister, a limp, lots

0:13:01.280 --> 0:13:03.320
<v Speaker 1>going on, and I'm sure a lot of women were

0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:08.080
<v Speaker 1>hopeful after those comments in March from President Macron. And

0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:12.720
<v Speaker 1>maybe now that the Pelico case is dominating global headlines

0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:16.400
<v Speaker 1>that will kind of spur on lawmakers to get this

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<v Speaker 1>done sooner.

0:13:17.679 --> 0:13:19.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, give it the momentum it needs.

0:13:19.679 --> 0:13:22.559
<v Speaker 1>Back to this trial, What is ahead? What are the

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<v Speaker 1>next steps?

0:13:23.600 --> 0:13:26.040
<v Speaker 2>The trial will continue and for the next three months

0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:28.920
<v Speaker 2>until December twenty and I'm sure we can expect the

0:13:28.920 --> 0:13:32.720
<v Speaker 2>conversation around this case and women's rights activism in France

0:13:32.800 --> 0:13:33.560
<v Speaker 2>to evolve.

0:13:34.080 --> 0:13:37.240
<v Speaker 1>Chloe, thank you so much for taking us through that today,

0:13:37.400 --> 0:13:42.120
<v Speaker 1>a really distressing but important case. We will pop some

0:13:42.480 --> 0:13:45.480
<v Speaker 1>links in the show notes to support groups. If this

0:13:45.559 --> 0:13:49.360
<v Speaker 1>episode has raised anything for you. Thank you so much

0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:52.280
<v Speaker 1>for listening to today's episode of The Daily Os. We

0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:55.360
<v Speaker 1>will be back with another episode tomorrow. Until then, have

0:13:55.480 --> 0:13:56.160
<v Speaker 1>a great day.

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<v Speaker 3>My name is Lily Maddin and I'm a proud Arunda

0:14:01.520 --> 0:14:06.319
<v Speaker 3>Bujelung Calkatin woman. From Gadighl country. The Daily oz acknowledges

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<v Speaker 3>that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the

0:14:08.600 --> 0:14:12.200
<v Speaker 3>Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and torrest

0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:15.080
<v Speaker 3>Rate island and nations. We pay our respects to the

0:14:15.080 --> 0:14:17.880
<v Speaker 3>first peoples of these countries, both past and present.