Speaker 1: It's in the news today, but it was actually on
Speaker 1: TV Reload the podcast last week thatyline. Welcome back Eyes
Speaker 1: to TV Reload. As you may know, my name is
Speaker 1: Benjamin Norris and this is your podcast to get all
Speaker 1: the inside goss on the popular TV shows that you
Speaker 1: might be watching from around the world. Underniably, our TV
Speaker 1: sets are a major part of our home entertainment, and
Speaker 1: yet very little is known about how our favorite shows
Speaker 1: get made. So each episode I've been finding the guests
Speaker 1: that want to dive just that little bit deeper into
Speaker 1: the shows that they're currently making, so that you can
Speaker 1: hear all their exclusive stories and gain access to the
Speaker 1: biggest names in Australian television. I want to thank you
Speaker 1: for downloading or subscribing to this podcast however you found me.
Speaker 1: I really do love hearing your feedback, so make sure
Speaker 1: you leave a review or a comment on your chosen
Speaker 1: podcast platform. On today's podcast, I have Courtney Act who
Speaker 1: has just had their mask revealed on the Mass Singer.
Speaker 1: If you missed any of Courtney's performances as Cowgirl, you
Speaker 1: can go back and check them out on tenplay. I
Speaker 1: loved the full circle moment of Courtney singing what About Me,
Speaker 1: which became a huge hit for Shannonol the year that
Speaker 1: they both starred on Australian Idol. That one definitely was
Speaker 1: one of my favorites. Shane Jenik, better known for his
Speaker 1: stage name Courtney Act, is an Australian drag queen's singer
Speaker 1: and television personality. Courtney first came to prominence competing on
Speaker 1: the very first season of Australian Idol in two thousand
Speaker 1: and three. After that show, she went on to sign
Speaker 1: at BMG Australia which is now known as Sony Music,
Speaker 1: and released that iconic single rub Me Wrong, which made
Speaker 1: a decent splash on the ARIA charts. There is obviously
Speaker 1: so much to Courtney's story, from RuPaul's drag race to
Speaker 1: winning Big Brother UK, those dance moves, on Dancing with
Speaker 1: the Stars, the LGBTI advocacy in this country and around
Speaker 1: the world. There's just so much to unpack, and somehow
Speaker 1: Courtney touches on everything effortlessly without ever really sounding like
Speaker 1: that they're big noting themselves. I personally am a huge
Speaker 1: fan and a friend and this chat was everything I
Speaker 1: would expect from Shane and also so much more. I
Speaker 1: will ask if there were big discussions behind the scenes
Speaker 1: regarding the reveal and if there was much consideration into
Speaker 1: revealing Courtney or Shane. We will discuss that play school
Speaker 1: debarcle and how dressing up as a cow is somehow
Speaker 1: more acceptable than a man dressing as a woman. You
Speaker 1: will find out which of the three judges had met
Speaker 1: Courtney before and if politics is something that Shane would
Speaker 1: ever truly be interested in. Plus, we will get plenty
Speaker 1: of exclusives from behind the scenes of The Mass Singer,
Speaker 1: which returns for its season finale on Monday night on
Speaker 1: Network ten. And if you've fallen just that little bit behind,
Speaker 1: you can catch up on ten. Play anyway, guys, let's
Speaker 1: bring Shane slash Courtney act into the podcast, and I
Speaker 1: really do hope you enjoy this very insightful episode of
Speaker 1: TV reload.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: Then I just wanted to say that I was in
Speaker 1: the process of doing my hair and as soon as
Speaker 1: Peter said, can you do nine thirty, I've just come
Speaker 1: in enter the room, so I hadn't finished my face,
Speaker 1: and I look like I've been electrocuted.
Speaker 2: I think that's all in your head. You look. I
Speaker 2: even went I even went like this to check.
Speaker 1: Just to make sure. Yeah, and I hadn't even framed
Speaker 1: the camera, so I'm a lot closer than I normally
Speaker 1: would be. But anyway, how are you.
Speaker 2: I'm good, I'm very good. Actually, I don't know what
Speaker 2: hour is it there?
Speaker 1: Nine n I'm thirty in the morning.
Speaker 2: I got up at four thirty. I'm in Hong Kong.
Speaker 1: What are you doing in Hong Kong? Can you tell
Speaker 1: us or is it a secret project?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm on Celebrity sas Hong Kong. No, I am
Speaker 2: performing at the Gay Games opening gala concert on Sunday.
Speaker 2: I don't have to explain what the Gay Games are
Speaker 2: to you.
Speaker 1: I assume no you don't. It's fine. I completely understand,
Speaker 1: and I should have actually known that's why you were there.
Speaker 1: But you know, for the people playing at home, the.
Speaker 2: Gay Games is an opportunity for queer people to heal
Speaker 2: their high school pe wounds with sports. Obviously the women
Speaker 2: did a much better job than the queer men. But yeah,
Speaker 2: it's like I literally have only just realized, like I'm
Speaker 2: not even I don't think I'm even you know what
Speaker 2: it was? It was when Marti Gras was in the
Speaker 2: Sydney cricket ground Zoe Koombsmar and I was standing there
Speaker 2: in like a rehearsal, the King rehearsal hosting the Mardi Gras.
Speaker 2: But and she turned to me and she she we
Speaker 2: were looking at all the seats and she was like,
Speaker 2: all of this is for sport, and it dawned on me. So, like,
Speaker 2: sixty thousand people fill that stadium several times a week
Speaker 2: to watch sport, and I had never crossed my mind
Speaker 2: how popular sport is that like most of the country
Speaker 2: loves watching sport regularly. And I don't know, I know
Speaker 2: I sound dumb for saying that, but it just sort
Speaker 2: of dawned on me. And I think because historically queer
Speaker 2: people are so like, oh, sport, I should probably say
Speaker 2: like gay men are like, huh sport, because obviously the
Speaker 2: Matilda's a bunch of wonderful women and a lot of
Speaker 2: them queer and out and other female sporting arenas. But yeah,
Speaker 2: I think that that those high school traumas of sport
Speaker 2: really stay with us, and so the Gay Games is
Speaker 2: a great opportunity to like go like, hey, there's actually
Speaker 2: something really fun about playing sport. I'm not playing sport,
Speaker 2: I'm performing but I did notice that marjong is sport
Speaker 2: in the Hong Kong Ga Games, which is about the
Speaker 2: only sport that I think I would be capable of
Speaker 2: not injuring myself. I would come last still, but at
Speaker 2: least I wouldn't break a limb.
Speaker 1: Do you know what I always think of when I
Speaker 1: think of LGBT I in sport. And I don't know
Speaker 1: whether or not you remember this. We're the same age,
Speaker 1: so you may. But do you remember Gina Riley and
Speaker 1: Jane Turner on Big Girls Blouse doing the hotel check
Speaker 1: in at the Olympic Gates Sport?
Speaker 2: Hello, we would like a room please? Okay? So that's
Speaker 2: one bedroom with two beds? No?
Speaker 3: No, just one bed okay, one bed in a trundle.
Speaker 2: No, oh okay.
Speaker 1: I always wonder, you know, I always wondered because so
Speaker 1: much of your humor is so accessible to me. I
Speaker 1: always have wondered whether you've watched all of those same shows,
Speaker 1: like being born in Australia and watching Big Girls Blouse,
Speaker 1: Fast Forward, the comedy company that's in my DNA, and
Speaker 1: I don't know, did you grow up on all that?
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and that's one of the most refreshing things about
Speaker 2: coming home to Australia. Is that like all of that,
Speaker 2: whether you whether you say if you go with that
Speaker 2: Mari from Marjong, I will go you with the night
Speaker 2: like any even when I said mar Jong before, I'm
Speaker 2: sure that a little part of your DNA thought about that.
Speaker 2: And so there's just all of this like added texture
Speaker 2: when you're talking to people in this stream, particularly like
Speaker 2: you know of our Vintine because you just even that
Speaker 2: was probably a bit our of vind Like it's not specific,
Speaker 2: but it's just like that comedy sensibility that we got
Speaker 2: from Maker and Gina and Jane and the whole.
Speaker 1: I can't you know, do it. It's so funny as well,
Speaker 1: like you're in our DNA now as well. And I
Speaker 1: didn't quickly do the research on this, but I feel
Speaker 1: like you've pet on television for nearly two decades. Am
Speaker 1: I right by.
Speaker 2: Saying man Idol was twenty years ago?
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just crazy. And I can't work at if
Speaker 1: Courtney Act is in my DNA or I just or
Speaker 1: it was too easy. But as soon as you performed
Speaker 1: as cowgirl, like I just was like, that's that's Courtney Act.
Speaker 1: That's that's shame, Like I it just and then every
Speaker 1: performance that you did was amazing. But I could actually
Speaker 1: see Courtney Act singing do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like through the through the.
Speaker 2: Cow and did that make it? Because in the comment
Speaker 2: section there's like, because I don't know how many types
Speaker 2: of people are out, but there's the type of person
Speaker 2: who's like, that's Courtney Act and like like somehow like
Speaker 2: the game's over. But then there's like, like you said,
Speaker 2: you're like, oh, that's obviously Courtney And then you watched
Speaker 2: me performing as Cowgirl each episode, doing the numbers and
Speaker 2: I guess like almost transposing what you know of me
Speaker 2: through the cow and I feel like then you feel
Speaker 2: like you're in on it and you're enjoying it.
Speaker 1: You're a super fan and that's the joy of it.
Speaker 1: For those people out there that thought you were all
Speaker 1: those other people, fair play to them, and that's probably
Speaker 1: what they truly thought. But for me, I could see
Speaker 1: like even some of the movements being like Disgraceland back
Speaker 1: in Melbourne and performances.
Speaker 3: Well, you know what was funny is like I have
Speaker 3: got some like.
Speaker 2: Super fan Instagram accounts and there was this strange unspoken
Speaker 2: acceptance like the Courtney Act Archives and Courtney Files, like
Speaker 2: with my name in the title, and none of them
Speaker 2: were like, we know it's Courtney Act. They just were like, oh,
Speaker 2: we love Cowgirl. Isn't this a great performance by Cowgirl?
Speaker 2: And they all kind of went along with the charade
Speaker 2: of it all, which was really adorable to see that
Speaker 2: that's how they chose and like, you know, they would
Speaker 2: message and be like, obviously you can't say anything, but
Speaker 2: we think he's doing really good job on the mast Singer.
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm not even going to write to
Speaker 1: you on Instagram or Twitter or any of those messages.
Speaker 1: I'm just going to enjoy the minutia of you being
Speaker 1: on this show because I'd sort of thought about it
Speaker 1: for so long, thinking you'd be such a great contestant
Speaker 1: on this show that while I was getting it, I
Speaker 1: just was like, I'm just going to enjoy my slice
Speaker 1: of cake instead of eating it too, do you know
Speaker 1: what I mean?
Speaker 2: Yeah, you just go along with the charade of it
Speaker 2: all and have fun. And that's what the masting is.
Speaker 2: If you had to explain the Mastinger to someone, imagine
Speaker 2: that boardroom meeting must have happened. I mean, I'm in
Speaker 2: Hong Kong, right.
Speaker 1: Now, which is where it originated from.
Speaker 2: It must have been in Asia somewhere. It definitely feels
Speaker 2: like that. And I can't imagine in like a Western
Speaker 2: boardroom a person coming in to pitch the mask singer
Speaker 2: without a precedent, because they just be like, what the
Speaker 2: PU talking about? Get out of this room. But they
Speaker 2: when you can show people what the mask singer is,
Speaker 2: it's a definite show them, don't tell them kind of show.
Speaker 2: And they sit down and they watch it, and you're
Speaker 2: not even suspending disbelief. I don't know what you're doing.
Speaker 2: You're just enjoying. You're just letting go and you're just
Speaker 2: having fun, and you're just watching this very silly show.
Speaker 1: I love the idea of you being on this show though,
Speaker 1: because I think of you as being able to wear
Speaker 1: masks and blur gender diversity, and the idea of you
Speaker 1: being cowgirl even though the girl is there. I felt
Speaker 1: like these shows where you can put on a mask
Speaker 1: and just sing without being judged by how you look,
Speaker 1: just it's fascinating to me. I think this something in
Speaker 1: that I probably haven't articulated it properly, but you know
Speaker 1: where I'm going.
Speaker 2: I know what you mean. And it's that thing of like,
Speaker 2: it's that thing of people putting aside your identity and
Speaker 2: their preconceptions maybe about queer people, about a drag performer
Speaker 2: and being entertained by them in some form, like you're
Speaker 2: inside this giant anthropomorphic anthropomorphic and take it and promorphic suit,
Speaker 2: a humanized animal, and they're just being entertained and enjoying
Speaker 2: the whole thing. And then you take your head off
Speaker 2: and they're like, oh my god, it's a drag queen.
Speaker 2: What did we think about this person before we knew?
Speaker 2: Does that does that shift our opinions or ideas about
Speaker 2: what we think about queer people or and especially like
Speaker 2: when the idea of you know, like cowgirl reading a
Speaker 2: storybook to kids, people probably wouldn't think twice about. It's
Speaker 2: like Disneyland, it's a character costume. It's like we're so
Speaker 2: familiar with like people dressed up as giant cows or
Speaker 2: ducks or mice entertaining children. But the idea of the
Speaker 2: person inside that suit, who we know nothing about, you know,
Speaker 2: who those people are inside those suits. But the idea
Speaker 2: of like me dressed up as Courtney, dressed up in
Speaker 2: drag reading a storybook to kids, is this, like you,
Speaker 2: sort of strangely shocking proposition in the world right now?
Speaker 2: I will qualify that by saying strangely shocking proposition for
Speaker 2: about five people who are all, you know, gunning to
Speaker 2: get political points for their extreme right views by inciting
Speaker 2: fear in people where no fear needs to exist. But
Speaker 2: yet So it was kind of fun doing Cowgirl and
Speaker 2: being on tele being in this big, crazy costume and
Speaker 2: entertaining people without them no identity.
Speaker 1: I feel like, without you knowing this, you are able
Speaker 1: to explain things like that to straight people or to
Speaker 1: people who may have fear of queer in a really
Speaker 1: simple way that's so digestible that I feel like you've
Speaker 1: opened and unlocked a lot of doors because just simply
Speaker 1: saying what happened on play school and all of those
Speaker 1: common you know, because it's just you, a man addressed
Speaker 1: as a woman is frightening to them. But as soon
Speaker 1: as you explain to them, but I can be dressed
Speaker 1: as a cow and you don't have a problem. And
Speaker 1: your children an't going to grow up thinking that they're
Speaker 1: going to be cows, you know what I mean? Yeah,
Speaker 1: And all of a sudden, this language, this conversation is
Speaker 1: so accessible to people it's disarming.
Speaker 2: It's just that there's like this level of critical thinking
Speaker 2: that we seem to have lost across the discourse in general,
Speaker 2: which I think is one of the problems, you know,
Speaker 2: like the referendum recently right therese these We're not used
Speaker 2: to people in the in the politics, in politics and
Speaker 2: the media being willfully dishonest. We're used to them being
Speaker 2: a little bit dishonest. We're used to politicians flying a
Speaker 2: little bit, and we used to the media sort of
Speaker 2: giving a spin. But we've entered this sort of Trumpian
Speaker 2: era of politics and media now where people are being
Speaker 2: told things by the same institutions and people they've trusted
Speaker 2: for so long, but now that actually there's been a
Speaker 2: ship where that information is no longer trustworthy. But they
Speaker 2: don't know that because they're not invested. They're just trying
Speaker 2: to get through life and get their Starbucks order right.
Speaker 2: They're not really out there on the front line trying
Speaker 2: to understand the nuancewers of the conversation about gender or
Speaker 2: queer identity, about First nation's identity. They're just taking the
Speaker 2: information as it's given to them because they're busy and
Speaker 2: They're making decision based on what they hear, and there's
Speaker 2: not really that ability to just pause for a second,
Speaker 2: step back and think does this make sense? Because usually
Speaker 2: when you do that, you're like, hang on, this doesn't
Speaker 2: make sense. You know, the theomonga and then the negative
Speaker 2: hype surrounding stuff. And I've been thinking in the wake
Speaker 2: of the referendum, like, why won't this keep happening to
Speaker 2: us in other areas of politics as we go forward,
Speaker 2: and how can we stop it from happening? And I
Speaker 2: think a lot of it is about educating people in
Speaker 2: like it's critical thinking, right. But then I've been researching
Speaker 2: this project about masculinity. I've been listening to all these
Speaker 2: men's podcasts, which I do not recommend. It's a horrible
Speaker 2: and weird world out there on all these podcasts, and
Speaker 2: all of these guys like the Andrew Taps of the world.
Speaker 2: Actually it was Andrew Tate. He was like, you know,
Speaker 2: I've done the critical I can't do his accent. I've
Speaker 2: done the critical thinking. And I'm like, that is not
Speaker 2: critical thinking. You've done the opposite of critical thinking. You've
Speaker 2: done confirmation bias. You've found these things that agree with
Speaker 2: your worldview, and now you're telling yourself that you've done
Speaker 2: critical thinking. And I think that's a problem with the
Speaker 2: simple ideas like confirmation bias. Looking for things in your
Speaker 2: experience that agree with what you already believe to be
Speaker 2: true to validate what you think or is not critical thinking.
Speaker 2: And so yeah, the thing about like Disneyland characters, like
Speaker 2: someone dressed as a dinosaur as a cow or a horse,
Speaker 2: like it should be much more weird to think about
Speaker 2: somebody dressed up as another species than it is to
Speaker 2: just be dressed up of someone of the same species,
Speaker 2: of the different gender, or expressing their gender differently.
Speaker 1: So you've been making us think about all of this
Speaker 1: for so long, Like I will never forget watching you
Speaker 1: perform in Idle, for those first few episodes where you
Speaker 1: can came in a Shane and came in as Courtney.
Speaker 1: Do you know what I thought was really impactful and
Speaker 1: really a turning point in your career was Ian Dixon
Speaker 1: being on television at a time that authorized you in
Speaker 1: a way by supporting you so publicly, allowed you to
Speaker 1: go further with that story and allowed Australia to unpack
Speaker 1: more about it. I mean, I kind of feel like
Speaker 1: you've been doing this for so long, and it's interesting
Speaker 1: we talk about politics because I kind of feel like
Speaker 1: we're going to be I'm going to be talking to
Speaker 1: you in twenty years time and you're going to be
Speaker 1: in politics, do you know what I mean? You know,
Speaker 1: because because it's part of who you are, and the
Speaker 1: accessibility to explain things to the Australian and global audiences
Speaker 1: is so digestible. I feel like it's almost silly that
Speaker 1: if you didn't go into politics at some point.
Speaker 2: It's that funny thing where I think, you know obviously
Speaker 2: that well I don't know. I mean, Dame Edner went
Speaker 2: out in glamorous, I guess to an extent, I do
Speaker 2: wonder like at what point my age will catch up
Speaker 2: with Courtney's glamour or how Courtney will have and then
Speaker 2: lots of people talk about politics, and I think like
Speaker 2: I have a lot more opportunity to do a lot
Speaker 2: more good right now just doing what I'm doing, rather
Speaker 2: than getting sucked into a broken system. But I am
Speaker 2: fascinated with politics, and I am fascinated with, you know,
Speaker 2: how society and the media and everything interacts together, and
Speaker 2: just trying in my own small way to you know, contribute.
Speaker 1: Make an impact, kick the time, yeah.
Speaker 2: Make it yeah. Like well, I can't quite remember why
Speaker 2: or where that began, but it's interesting that you mentioned
Speaker 2: Dicko because I think in a weird way, he's in
Speaker 2: a weird way, in quite a wonderful way. He was
Speaker 2: an ally before we really had that term, and that's
Speaker 2: I think an example of allieship that people might be
Speaker 2: able to like have contact with.
Speaker 3: Where it goes me, I'm in drag might have been
Speaker 3: a bit challenging for.
Speaker 2: Like straight male Australians to understand, but I think Dicko,
Speaker 2: being a brit had grown up with a different understanding
Speaker 2: of drag, like pantomime.
Speaker 1: Well, he grew up in the music business around a
Speaker 1: little queer people, and so there was a lot of
Speaker 1: there was a lot of queer people in English music,
Speaker 1: not you know, obviously there you know, was a lot
Speaker 1: of queer music happening, but behind the scenes there's a
Speaker 1: lot of queer people that Dicko was growing up with.
Speaker 1: And so when you hear all of that that his
Speaker 1: mates growing up in his industry early on was all
Speaker 1: of that, he kind of that sort of marries into
Speaker 1: what you're saying to me. You know, yeah, he did,
Speaker 1: and he ordained you in a weird way. It was beauty.
Speaker 1: It was amazing television, you know, and you've done so
Speaker 1: much since then, but it's just so it's such a
Speaker 1: turning point, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it was cool because queer people
Speaker 2: can be as visible as they want, but kind of
Speaker 2: in a weird way, queer people need straight society in
Speaker 2: order for them to gain acceptance, and that's sort of
Speaker 2: the pride parades and all of that is about attracting
Speaker 2: attention and bringing people on board. But it's it's the
Speaker 2: straight people. It's obviously the queer people who are on
Speaker 2: the front line sort of changing their minds, who are
Speaker 2: in the rooms we're having conversations, So it's you know,
Speaker 2: changing police and who are visible that doing it. But
Speaker 2: it's like the straight people coming around to accepting that
Speaker 2: that sort of brings about the actual change. And I
Speaker 2: think Dicko was an ally in that way where he said, oh,
Speaker 2: it's okay, I'm a straight bloke. I'm entertained by Courtney.
Speaker 2: I'm happy your work with Courtney. My sexuality, my masculinity
Speaker 2: isn't threatened by doing so. And you can too, and
Speaker 2: I think that is sort of role modeling a positive
Speaker 2: behavior for other people, and I always appreciate him for that.
Speaker 1: I always think of it myself as a queer person.
Speaker 1: I was like, is he doing that on television? Is
Speaker 1: he ordaining someone on television? And I felt sired, do
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Like I felt maybe it's
Speaker 1: possible to be on television where prior to that, you know,
Speaker 1: I was hiding away almost like sport, when people being picked,
Speaker 1: I'm like, don't pick me because I don't want the
Speaker 1: light on me, don't you know, don't include me because
Speaker 1: I can't and I don't belong there. And then that
Speaker 1: was a real big change, because I don't necessarily know
Speaker 1: if we've ever had anyone who was so willing to
Speaker 1: be themselves on television as much as you have been
Speaker 1: through a Big Brother through all of these shows. However, actually,
Speaker 1: just a quick point, someone messaged on one of the
Speaker 1: forums last night, you one Big Brother. You came second
Speaker 1: on Dancing with the Stars, You've now you came third
Speaker 1: on RuPaul's Drag Race, and you've now come fourth on
Speaker 1: The Mask Singer. It was a really interesting fact. I
Speaker 1: was like, is it.
Speaker 2: Called a duck. No, what are you good? That's fourth
Speaker 2: and I don't know.
Speaker 1: Yes, let's not go cricket references.
Speaker 2: Well, I will just look, I'm not being defensive, but
Speaker 2: I will say I didn't come third on drag Race,
Speaker 2: and I didn't come second on drag Race. A Door
Speaker 2: and I were technically top three, but that's a technicality.
Speaker 2: I'm not sensitive.
Speaker 1: Technically, then you came like twelfth on idle. So you've
Speaker 1: got a few other little, you know, dots to punch
Speaker 1: in your dance card.
Speaker 2: I don't want to fill in. I don't want to
Speaker 2: fill in five through twelve.
Speaker 1: It's never gonna happen, my friend, It's never gonna happen.
Speaker 1: What was was there a discussion with the producers when
Speaker 1: they asked you to do this show about whether when
Speaker 1: the mask would come off, you'd be Shane or Courtney.
Speaker 1: That really fascinated me because even last night, with the
Speaker 1: rest of Australia knowing it was you under there waiting
Speaker 1: for you to take your cowhead off, I was questioning
Speaker 1: what you would have chosen to do and what that
Speaker 1: conversation must have been like.
Speaker 2: Well, for me, it's all part of the theater of it.
Speaker 2: I wanted it to be as ridiculous as possible, and
Speaker 2: like pulling off my cowhead and being Shane underneath, like
Speaker 2: as a performer as a showman, that doesn't make as
Speaker 2: much sense as taking off that head and having the
Speaker 2: biggest hair ever fall out of it, like Charlie's Angel
Speaker 2: taking off a helmet. And Karen Green, the executive producer, afterwards,
Speaker 2: she was like, Oh, I knew you're gonna be in drag,
Speaker 2: but I just thought you'd have like a little, like
Speaker 2: small like wig on And I was like, I was
Speaker 2: not wanting a pussy catwig underneath that cowhead. I was
Speaker 2: gonna have the biggest, most ridiculous hair possible, Like that's
Speaker 2: that's what this show is. This show is like bigger
Speaker 2: and more ridiculous and just silly, and so I wanted
Speaker 2: to bring that. And it's really hot and sweaty inside
Speaker 2: that costume, like like unbelievably hot and sweaty. So I did.
Speaker 2: I just saw a photo because I was like, how
Speaker 2: did I do my makeup? I just did my eyes
Speaker 2: and I put like my primer on and I just
Speaker 2: did my eyes because they don't sweat as much and
Speaker 2: because then you bang your head inside the kettle and
Speaker 2: you scrape off makeup, and so it was easier just
Speaker 2: to like my foundation on after I had sung my
Speaker 2: number to getting ready for the reveal, to go and
Speaker 2: put the rest of the foundation on in case I
Speaker 2: got eliminated, and then take the head off. And I
Speaker 2: remember like banging something my nose on my chin, and
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, no, am I gonna pull this
Speaker 2: head off and have like a nose smudged off or
Speaker 2: but it.
Speaker 1: All looked perfect, No, not like per usual with you.
Speaker 1: It was perfection. I mean apart from walking into the
Speaker 1: Big Brother House and your dress flying off. I mean yeah,
Speaker 1: which is still like.
Speaker 2: Twenty two years of Well. I didn't do all the
Speaker 2: Mighty Graar parties in drag, but like all of my
Speaker 2: younger mighty graar parties I would do in drag. So
Speaker 2: I do the parade, go to the party. I'd been
Speaker 2: the irch I and the Horden from midnight until eight
Speaker 2: am in full drag, sweating dancing, and that prepared me
Speaker 2: for a career in television of like long shoot days,
Speaker 2: hot lights. My body doesn't sweat, my face doesn't sweat
Speaker 2: when I'm in drag, and I don't think that's natural.
Speaker 2: I think that's years of I think that's nurture, not nature,
Speaker 2: of years of Mardi Gras parties and being in drag
Speaker 2: my skin just being like, you know what will is
Speaker 2: just not sweat. It'll make it easier for everyone.
Speaker 1: You like the Minogues. Do you remember the minogues came
Speaker 1: out and said minogues don't sweat, they sweat litter or.
Speaker 2: Whatever they either. I remember being in Fiji with my
Speaker 2: then boyfriend and we climbed this like mountain and we
Speaker 2: got to the top and I looked at him and
Speaker 2: he was like drenched, and he looked at me and
Speaker 2: he was like, why aren't you sweating?
Speaker 3: And it was this moment where I was like why,
Speaker 3: Like you look like you've been.
Speaker 2: Doused in water, and yeah, I don't know what it is,
Speaker 2: but I'm grateful.
Speaker 1: Probably imagine if you were a really bad sweater, you
Speaker 1: probably would have had the career that you've had.
Speaker 2: No, that's what's Trevor Ashley back.
Speaker 1: You bitch. The question I also saw on the on
Speaker 1: the boards, which was you know, like on the social boards,
Speaker 1: was this and I feel like if they don't ask it,
Speaker 1: it would be remiss of me. But did you know
Speaker 1: over twenty years, I feel like you would have met
Speaker 1: and interacted with all four of those judges, had you
Speaker 1: had a personal relationship or at least met and spent
Speaker 1: some time with all four of them.
Speaker 2: Only three. I hadn't met Mel before, but Chrissy and
Speaker 2: I had met several times and I had done her show.
Speaker 2: Would I lie to you just fairly recently before that, Husey,
Speaker 2: I've been on Husey We have a Problem. I've been
Speaker 2: on Hughesy's you know. I talked to Husy on the
Speaker 2: Radio Bunch and been on Hughsey we have a Problem.
Speaker 2: Abby and I were stablemates at Over with our podcasts
Speaker 2: when we were there, and I've done photoshops and things together.
Speaker 2: Mel I hadn't ever met before, but yeah, that was
Speaker 2: that thing where I was like, you know what next
Speaker 2: year's LOGI for best Acting should go to the guessing
Speaker 2: panel of the last singer.
Speaker 1: Should have I don't know if that convincing. I mean,
Speaker 1: thank god one kept guessing you just to allow the
Speaker 1: audience to know that she isn't drunk. But the rest
Speaker 1: of them, I was like, you know when they kept
Speaker 1: saying Trevor Ashley and maybe This is a part of
Speaker 1: being an LGBTI person, you know. I just I can
Speaker 1: tell the difference between those two singing voices, so like
Speaker 1: I just was screaming saying that no, no, no, You're
Speaker 1: just so different.
Speaker 2: Like Trevor Ashley and I am not indistinguishable to the
Speaker 2: naked ear.
Speaker 1: It's just just like so mind boggling to me. Anyway,
Speaker 1: this has been a much longer chat, but you have
Speaker 1: definitely unpacked a lot, which I'm very happy with. And honestly,
Speaker 1: I feel like if I was in the flesh with you,
Speaker 1: I'd talked to you for like twenty four hours, so
Speaker 1: you just like it. I'm not bear in Hong Kong.
Speaker 1: But before you go, the last question, I ask everyone
Speaker 1: who joins the podcast, what is something from behind the scenes,
Speaker 1: something that people wouldn't have seen, maybe kind of like
Speaker 1: a bit of a funny anecdote about what it's like
Speaker 1: to take part in this show.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a very pokin dagger behind the scenes.
Speaker 2: Like it's not like you're all hanging out in the
Speaker 2: green room with your masks off, hanging out with Toy
Speaker 2: Jackson and Sandra Sully and whoever, Like you have no
Speaker 2: idea as a contestant who the other people are until
Speaker 2: you watch it on television, you don't hear them, you
Speaker 2: don't see them, you don't that's eagles swinging around my
Speaker 2: hotel room like like giant birds of prey, like gliding
Speaker 2: outside the window.
Speaker 1: I capture them and make an outfit out of them.
Speaker 2: But anyway, no, yeah, so you don't get to see anyone,
Speaker 2: you don't get to know who they are.
Speaker 3: It's all very like it's quite an isolating experience.
Speaker 2: It kind of has throwbacks to COVID where you're like
Speaker 2: locked in a room by yourself getting into drag. But
Speaker 2: it's a lot of fun when you're out there and
Speaker 2: sort of learning how to make the costume have its
Speaker 2: own personality was probably the most fun part, which after
Speaker 2: the first episode, I was very grumpy because I wasn't
Speaker 2: getting to be caught in the act and doing the
Speaker 2: thing that I loved. And once I got over that
Speaker 2: and I realized I could get to be the cowgirl
Speaker 2: and be that, like really lean into that physical comedy
Speaker 2: with very large gestures and limited dexterity, it was a
Speaker 2: lot of fun.
Speaker 1: I just picture because I know that you're such a
Speaker 1: perfectionist with what you do. I just pictured there being
Speaker 1: a mirror in your dressing room and you being able
Speaker 1: to choreograph parts to see what worked as the cowgirl.
Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean? Like because all of
Speaker 1: your movements, it was so funny, and how can you
Speaker 1: be funny underneath that much latex? You know what I mean?
Speaker 2: I put my camera on and i'd practice. I would
Speaker 2: be like, where are my eyes? My eyes are up
Speaker 2: here like and then I thought that my ears were
Speaker 2: like here for a long time, but they were my horns.
Speaker 2: And then I worked out like listen as they whisper,
Speaker 2: and just working out because you're not you can't see,
Speaker 2: so you're just like poking around the dark, working out
Speaker 2: like choreographing, like how where your hand goes, or seeing
Speaker 2: what it looked like when you got on the ground
Speaker 2: and pounded the floor, and working out all of those
Speaker 2: things each week, trying to add a new gesture.
Speaker 1: I just thought of Rachel Griffis. I don't know if
Speaker 1: you ever saw this moment, but when she won her
Speaker 1: Golden Globe, she did this thing where she was like
Speaker 1: she won it for six feet under quite a while
Speaker 1: ago she won, you just sort of pulled on an
Speaker 1: ear like just as in like being quite silly. And
Speaker 1: I noticed you did that at one point when the
Speaker 1: judges were interacting with you, kind of like maybe it
Speaker 1: was not the carrier, maybe it was the thing, but
Speaker 1: it gave that same vibes of just, you know, ridiculous,
Speaker 1: very like, hey, that's a.
Speaker 2: That's a very nuanced to comparison. But I definitely remember
Speaker 2: like scratching my ears like I because I was I
Speaker 2: was like, I wonder if people are getting like, how
Speaker 2: dumb this is, like that I'm scratching my ear? Okay,
Speaker 2: good god, those teams did not go unnoticed.
Speaker 1: I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. Can I just say thank you
Speaker 1: so much for your generosity with your time and talking
Speaker 1: to me this morning. I think it's fantastic and good
Speaker 1: luck with the games over there in Hong Kong. I
Speaker 1: think thank you. Could we have anyone better to represent Australia.
Speaker 2: Ohang, I'm looking forward to it. Lovely to see you again.
Speaker 1: Yeah, lovely to see you. Take care, I'll chat to
Speaker 1: you so