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Speaker 1: Now let's get straight into it, because it is the

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Speaker 1: second time this week with the opposition leader, following the

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Speaker 1: Daily by election obviously earlier in the week, which we

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Speaker 1: spoke to Lea Fanochio about. But joining us on the

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Speaker 1: line right now is the opposition leader, Lea Fanochi Airo.

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Speaker 2: Good morning, Good morning Katie, and to your listeners.

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Speaker 1: Now today Leah, I am obviously keen to focus on

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Speaker 1: this situation with nt Health. Yesterday we learned that doctors

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Speaker 1: and senior health executives discussed shutting the emergency department at

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Speaker 1: one of our Greater Darwin's two hospitals during those crisis

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Speaker 1: talks over staff shortages. Now, the possibility of closing the

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Speaker 1: Palmerston Regional Hospital emergency department was among those options being discussed.

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Speaker 1: That's according to several independent sources familiar with the meeting

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Speaker 1: who's spoken to Matt Cunningham from Sky News. Now, Leah,

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Speaker 1: this is pretty worrying staff. The Health Minister yesterday confirmed

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Speaker 1: that there are issues with staffing. Are you concerned here

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Speaker 1: that we don't have enough staff to actually manage the

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Speaker 1: emergency department at the Palmerston Hospital.

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Speaker 2: Well, what's really concerning, Katie is that this year, we've

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Speaker 2: had three Code yellows at Royal Darwin Hospital and of

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Speaker 2: course two of those have been just in the last

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Speaker 2: few weeks, and of course they're not being explained to

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Speaker 2: Territorians about why we've gone into code yellow and the

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Speaker 2: government haven't put forward their plan as to how we

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Speaker 2: stop going into Code yellow. Now if our main tertiary

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Speaker 2: hospital is in crisis point, you know, in times when

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Speaker 2: we don't have people in hospital suffering from COVID, then

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Speaker 2: we're really concerned that if COVID was to come to

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Speaker 2: the territory, we just wouldn't be able to support the

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Speaker 2: need required if that extra demand was placed on the system.

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Speaker 2: So huge concerns because of course many elective surgeries have

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Speaker 2: been canceled and that means Territorians will continue to suffer

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Speaker 2: under their injuries or whatever it is that they need

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Speaker 2: to procedures they need to get done because they've of

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Speaker 2: course been put on the back burner.

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Speaker 1: You know, I guess you know that we're seeing it

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Speaker 1: right across the board when it comes to staffing and

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Speaker 1: trying to manage this COVID situation. We've spoken about it

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Speaker 1: before with the police as well, but when you're talking

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Speaker 1: about it with the health system. We know that obviously

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Speaker 1: we're trying to staff the Royal Darwin Hospital, we're trying

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Speaker 1: to staff the Palmerston Hospital, and then indeed we need.

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Speaker 3: To have staff out there at Howard Springs.

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Speaker 1: I mean, is it actually maybe a sensible thing for

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Speaker 1: us to look at scaling back that Palmeston Regional Hospital's

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Speaker 1: emergency wart.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think the government need to explain why that

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Speaker 2: would improve health services. Of course, Parmesan Regional Hospital provides

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Speaker 2: a service to you know, thirty five thousand people in

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Speaker 2: the Palmerston area and up with the seventy thousand people

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Speaker 2: you know south of Parmesan throughout the Darwin rural area,

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Speaker 2: so it has an enormous catchment that it provides services for.

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Speaker 2: And if the government are secretly planning to shut down

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Speaker 2: the Palmeston Emergency department or scale it right back, then

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Speaker 2: they need to be explaining to people in those communities

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Speaker 2: why that's important. I think what's a great concern to us, Katie,

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Speaker 2: and we've been saying this right from the start, is

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Speaker 2: when the government put its hand up and said that

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Speaker 2: they would take over management of the Howards Brings Quarantine

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Speaker 2: facility from OSMA. That was going to require four hundred

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Speaker 2: staff to man that facility, which was the role that

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Speaker 2: oz Matt was previously doing. Now we questioned right back

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Speaker 2: at that time, as did the AMA, where are the

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Speaker 2: government going to get those four hundred staff from? And

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Speaker 2: I think the government don't want to admit that the

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Speaker 2: Howard Springs Quarantine facility takeover has drawn resources from our

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Speaker 2: health system and the government just simply can't cope lea.

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Speaker 1: I know today the Northern Territory News has confirmed that

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Speaker 1: Ward two B, which is usually used as a surgical ward,

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Speaker 1: was used to accommodate mental health patients stuck in the

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Speaker 1: emergency department because there were not enough beads to house

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Speaker 1: them in the dedicated mental health facilities.

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Speaker 3: I mean, is it a situation where we.

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Speaker 1: Just need to accept that hospitals are going to ebb

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Speaker 1: and flow and that there will be times when they're

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Speaker 1: really busy and this type of things always going to happen.

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Speaker 2: Look, I don't think so, okay. I mean, obviously there's

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Speaker 2: different pressure points on our health system, and clearly our

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Speaker 2: health professionals do a wonderful job, But three times in

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Speaker 2: one year we're not even at the end of the year,

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Speaker 2: yet Katie, it's been twice in the last few weeks,

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Speaker 2: and of course the government just pretending like this is

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Speaker 2: not happening, there's nothing to see here, but it is

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Speaker 2: really critically important. You don't have a code yellow at

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Speaker 2: a hospital for no reason. And ultimately one hundreds, if

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Speaker 2: not thousands of Territorians are having different surgeries canceled and delayed.

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Speaker 2: I know of one lady who's had hers canceled three

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Speaker 2: times because of this. That has a profound impact on

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Speaker 2: people's health. And of course the AMA I think made

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Speaker 2: the comment in the paper the other week saying, you know,

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Speaker 2: this means that other illnesses are not being picked up,

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Speaker 2: like cancers and other types of things aren't able to

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Speaker 2: be treated or progressed. So it does have a really

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Speaker 2: profound impact and we need to be understanding what the

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Speaker 2: plan is to stop this from happening, because of course,

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Speaker 2: you know, we've been really fortunate with COVID. You know,

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Speaker 2: we haven't had that pressure on our health system because

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Speaker 2: of COVID. But if that was to happen, what does

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Speaker 2: that look like. What contingency planning does the government have

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Speaker 2: to support all the normal health services you have to

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Speaker 2: provide past the COVID response.

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Speaker 3: So, Leah, what do you think the government needs to

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Speaker 3: be doing here?

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Speaker 2: I think they need to be really transparent and honest

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Speaker 2: with people about what is causing the code yellows in

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Speaker 2: the first place. We've had three code yellows this year

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Speaker 2: and no real explanation as to why. Now, if it's

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Speaker 2: because mental health is putting a profound impact on the hospital,

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Speaker 2: then they need to come out and say that, and

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Speaker 2: they need to outline their plan to better support people

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Speaker 2: who need a different service other than an emergency department bed.

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Speaker 2: If they're going to be winding back Parmesan Regional Hospital,

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Speaker 2: then they need to be honest about the fact that

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Speaker 2: they bid off more than they could chew with the

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Speaker 2: Howard Springs cou Do you.

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Speaker 1: Reckon that would be received in the community. Obviously you

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Speaker 1: are a local member out there in Palmiston. Surely it

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Speaker 1: would be political suicide to scale back the Palmeston Hospital

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Speaker 1: at this point.

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Speaker 2: Oh, I think it's a terrible idea, and people in

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Speaker 2: Palmeston fought for twenty years, I think Katie to get

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Speaker 2: that hospital. So it's hard for to have such a

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Speaker 2: wonderful service as the parmasan hospital of course, the ED

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Speaker 2: do an amazing job. People are able to take their

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Speaker 2: sick kids if they've got different injuries. I know people

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Speaker 2: out you know, when I was out in Dundee over

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Speaker 2: the last couple of weeks, Katie, people out there don't

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Speaker 2: have a health service, so they have to come into

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Speaker 2: Parmeerston Hospital. It provides a tremendous support to Royal Darwin

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Speaker 2: for nearly one hundred thousand people who live out in

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Speaker 2: this region. So it's going to have a profound impact.

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Speaker 2: And I think the government need to look at itself

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Speaker 2: and think, okay, can we still handle taking on how

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Speaker 2: it springs? Do we need to give that back to

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Speaker 2: the federal government and pull our stuff out and repurpose

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Speaker 2: them back into the departments so we can continue to

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Speaker 2: run our hospital effectively and efficiently. Or they need to

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Speaker 2: be able to come clean about what their plans are.

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Speaker 2: But the Health Minister pretending that these are operational issues

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Speaker 2: and she's got nothing to do with it, is not

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Speaker 2: really passing the pub test.

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Speaker 3: Katie, lea, let's move along.

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Speaker 1: And I know that yesterday the Shadow Minister of the

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Speaker 1: Territory Families, Joshua Burgoyne, well he reckons that the Minister

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Speaker 1: for Territory Families needs to take urgent action to address

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Speaker 1: what he says the spiral and crime rates on railway

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Speaker 1: terraces in Alice Springs, so in the city there, which

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Speaker 1: have doubled since the youth hub was opened last November.

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Speaker 3: What's the situation here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Look, this is the really important line of questioning

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Speaker 2: that Josh Burgoyne was able to reveal. So he's obviously

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Speaker 2: getting a lot of feedback from people in Alice Springs,

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Speaker 2: particularly those who live in the city around crime being

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Speaker 2: worse since the Gunna government opened its youth hub. And

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Speaker 2: what we've seen from the data we've been able to

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Speaker 2: capture is between the first of November twenty nineteen and

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Speaker 2: eighteen July twenty twenty there were eighty six incidents in

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Speaker 2: the CBD, but for that same period for the following year,

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Speaker 2: since the youth hub has been opened, there's been one

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Speaker 2: hundred and sixty three incidents. And so the colp have

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Speaker 2: been saying for a long time that that youth hub

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Speaker 2: is in the wrong location. Josh Bergwyn has been fighting

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Speaker 2: very hard hard to see a community model in the

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Speaker 2: town camp so that there are activities for kids much

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Speaker 2: closer to where they live, and the whole point of

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Speaker 2: the youth facility was to get kids out of the city,

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Speaker 2: not encourage them to be coming in, Katie. So I

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Speaker 2: think it's been a failure when you look at the statistics,

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Speaker 2: and so we know, under pressure, the government have now

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Speaker 2: allocated five hundred thousand dollars for those town camp community models,

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Speaker 2: but it still hasn't happened yet, and we just can't

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Speaker 2: understand what the hold up is and why it's taking

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Speaker 2: so long to simply devolve what they've got in the

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Speaker 2: city and move it out into the town camp.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so that's what you think needs to be happening

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Speaker 1: that realistically, it needs to move out of the city.

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Speaker 1: It needs to be happening in those town camps because

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Speaker 1: it's creating too much crime.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, it's drawing. It's attracting kids into the city.

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Speaker 2: Kids want to go to the youth hub, which is great,

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Speaker 2: but it also means they're getting themselves into strife in

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Speaker 2: the meantime, and it's bringing a lot more people into

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Speaker 2: the city. I've seen it for myself, Katie, when I've

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Speaker 2: walked the street with Josh number of times, and so

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Speaker 2: the location is just completely wrong. We've had a doubling

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Speaker 2: of those incidents, and the whole point of the Youth

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Speaker 2: Hub was to reduce incidents in the CBNE, not double them.

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Speaker 1: So do you think the program though that the Youth

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Speaker 1: hubbies delivering are they effective?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, look, it's great. I've been there and seen it

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Speaker 2: with my own eyes. It certainly provides lots of activities

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Speaker 2: for kids to do. It's just means it's drawing very

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Speaker 2: large volumes of them into the city and then of

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Speaker 2: course they don't have to stay at that facility, so

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Speaker 2: they get back out onto the stream and catch up

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Speaker 2: with other people and you know, run a mark and

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Speaker 2: it's just not safe. You can't have sixty, sometimes one

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Speaker 2: hundred young people. I mean, one girl I spoke to

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Speaker 2: was eleven roaming around the city in the middle of

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Speaker 2: the night. You know, we're talking about midnight. I was

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Speaker 2: out till two o'clock in the morning one time. It's

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Speaker 2: not okay. And so we need to make sure that

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Speaker 2: any services we're delivering are having the desired impact. So

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Speaker 2: it's sort of you know, we talk about measuring KPIs

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Speaker 2: a lot, Katie. If the KPI was to reduce crime,

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Speaker 2: this has been a failure, So we need to change

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Speaker 2: the model and change it fast. Leah.

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Speaker 1: On that topic, I know that the opposition well have

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Speaker 1: sought to have a number of questions answered when it

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Speaker 1: comes to victims of crime. What exactly did you ask

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Speaker 1: of the government through that official channel of obviously going

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Speaker 1: through those written questions to the government.

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Speaker 2: Yes, So we've been very disappointed and alarmed and received

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Speaker 2: a lot of feedback from people about the fact that

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Speaker 2: the government settled thirty five million dollars to pay out

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Speaker 2: youth offenders over that time period, and it just reinforced

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Speaker 2: to people how offender focus this government is not victim focused.

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Speaker 2: So we believe that any use getting a compo payout

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Speaker 2: for their time in prison should have to pay the

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Speaker 2: restitution to their victims first. And so when we ask

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Speaker 2: questions about that, we found out that since twenty nineteen,

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Speaker 2: there have only been sixteen young people ordered to pay restitution,

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Speaker 2: which is an incredibly all since with since twenty nineteen.

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Speaker 1: Wow, so since twenty nineteen, there's only been sixteen young

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Speaker 1: people who've been forced to actually pay back any money

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Speaker 1: for the damage that they've caused.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well it's even worse. They've been ordered to pay

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Speaker 2: it back, Katie, but only and it only totaled eleven

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars, which of course, you know, barely covers the

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Speaker 2: window pay in these days and some of the break

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Speaker 2: in do we see. So since twenty nineteen, only sixteen

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Speaker 2: had orders totally eleven thousand dollars, Only four of them

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Speaker 2: have paid, and the four of them that paid it

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Speaker 2: totaled six hundred and fourteen dollars and eighty five cents.

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Speaker 1: So so six hundred and eighty four dollars has been

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Speaker 1: paid back to those victims of crime, and through the

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Speaker 1: sixteen ordered that had been was supposed to pay back

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Speaker 1: eleven thousand dollars.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's exactly right. So out of all the crimes

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Speaker 2: committed by you since two thousand and nine, only sixteen

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Speaker 2: of them were required to pay, only four ended up paying,

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Speaker 2: and the four that did end up paying only paid

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Speaker 2: a collective six hundred and fourteen dollars and eighty five

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Speaker 2: cents to their victim. So this is a huge, huge issue, Katie.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's actually a kick in the guts for people,

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Speaker 1: Like it's not just an issue, it's a kick in

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Speaker 1: the guts you're talking about. You know, we know that

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Speaker 1: thirty five million dollars was obviously paid for those don

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Speaker 1: Dale detainees. You know what you make of that is

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Speaker 1: anyone's opinion. They can make up their own minds about

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Speaker 1: whether they think that's good or terrible. But then when

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Speaker 1: you actually look at the restitution that's been paid back

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Speaker 1: to territorians have actually gone through and been the victims

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Speaker 1: of some of these crimes, that's unbelievable.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it is. It's hideous, and it just reinforces again

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Speaker 2: that this government is just solely focused on offenders and

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Speaker 2: not on victims. I mean, how when you know, if

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Speaker 2: we're in government, Katie, enforcing court orders to pay restitution

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Speaker 2: to your victims has to be an extremely high priority.

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Speaker 2: Not only does it send a message to the offender

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Speaker 2: that you're not going to get away with these crimes,

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Speaker 2: but it's important financial support to the victims who have

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Speaker 2: suffered and had to pay out of their own pockets

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Speaker 2: to deal with whatever trauma has been inflicted on them.

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Speaker 2: And so these miniscule amounts of money just show what

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Speaker 2: a fascty entire system is. I think people when they

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Speaker 2: hear about this, Katie, are just going to shake their

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Speaker 2: heads in shame. Lea.

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Speaker 1: Look, we are going to have to get ready to

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Speaker 1: wrap up. But do you know has anything been done

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Speaker 1: to try to get this money?

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Speaker 3: You know, I recovered, I.

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Speaker 2: Wouldn't have thought. So I think this money, when it's

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Speaker 2: not paid, it just goes into the fine's recovery unit,

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Speaker 2: which we know has millions and millions of dollars sitting

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Speaker 2: in it that the government don't go and chase down

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Speaker 2: and recuperate. And this just becomes another debt that they're

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Speaker 2: going to government to add to the bottom line and

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Speaker 2: walk away from. So I think it just reinforces our

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Speaker 2: calls that if any of these youths who get that

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Speaker 2: thirty five million dollars, they need to pay their restitution.

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Speaker 1: Lea, Do we know what kind of crimes we're talking

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Speaker 1: about here where they you know, where obviously they had

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Speaker 1: been ordered to pay that money back.

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Speaker 2: No, So it's just we asked about all youths who

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Speaker 2: had gone through both the Supreme Court and the Use

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Speaker 2: Justice Court whether or not they had been paid restitution.

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Speaker 2: So any person under the age of eighteen who'd gone

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Speaker 2: through any court system, how many restitution orders had been

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Speaker 2: made And it was only sixteen for every youth who

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Speaker 2: went through any court, and of course only four have paid,

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Speaker 2: and that's a measly six hundred and fourteen dollars and

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Speaker 2: eighty five cents.

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Speaker 1: Katie well Lea, I reckon that some of our listeners

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Speaker 1: are going to be quite irate upon hearing that we

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Speaker 1: are going to have to leave it there.

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Speaker 3: Thank you very much for your time this morning.

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Speaker 2: No lovely to speak to you all.

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Speaker 3: Take care, Thank you,