1 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:07,800 Speaker 1: So there's three ways that we can respond to our kids' 2 00:00:07,840 --> 00:00:11,600 Speaker 1: challenging behavior. Whether it's kids at phones, kid's gaming, whether 3 00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:16,040 Speaker 1: the kids are absconding, running away, breaking rules, just having 4 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:19,599 Speaker 1: big bad attitudes. Three ways we can respond to the 5 00:00:19,880 --> 00:00:24,079 Speaker 1: challenging behavior and have the discipline conversation. Today, on the 6 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 1: Happy Families Podcast, we examine those three ways and give 7 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:28,840 Speaker 1: you some clear direction on what to do when things 8 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 1: are getting rough at home with the kids. Good they 9 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:34,199 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Happy Families Podcast. It's where you get 10 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:37,360 Speaker 1: real parenting solutions every day. This is Australia's most downloaded 11 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:40,479 Speaker 1: parenting podcast. We Adjusted and Kylie Couson and Kylie, this 12 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:42,040 Speaker 1: is a hard one for us because we've never had 13 00:00:42,040 --> 00:00:47,639 Speaker 1: any children who have ever really needed to have discipline right, 14 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: have us guide them so that they can make better decisions. 15 00:00:52,159 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 2: No experience in the area at all. 16 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 1: Our six daughters have always been perfect and have given 17 00:00:57,040 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 1: us not a moment of grief or worry. I can't 18 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: even say it. Oh my goodness me. Do we just 19 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:08,959 Speaker 1: give in? Do we play hardball? What's the right way 20 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:12,400 Speaker 1: to do this? Kylie? We're going to examine the three 21 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 1: most common I mean, there are more options than what 22 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about. But we're going to examine 23 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:20,760 Speaker 1: the three most common options that parents step into when 24 00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 1: the kids are being really challenging. Let's start with option 25 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 1: number one. We give in. We just throw our hands 26 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:27,400 Speaker 1: up in the air and say it's all too hard. 27 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,080 Speaker 1: You obviously know better than me. You seem to be 28 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:31,679 Speaker 1: able to see things much more clearly than I do. 29 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:34,080 Speaker 1: I've got no idea because I'm old and ancient. Whatever 30 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:35,280 Speaker 1: you decide for yourself. 31 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 2: And the challenge with this approach is just the fact 32 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 2: that we're actually choosing short term peace, yes, avoiding through 33 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:51,480 Speaker 2: long term chaos and challenge. What inevitably happens too often 34 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 2: when we take this approach, and it's not the approach 35 00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 2: we want, but we're taking the easy road in the moment, 36 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:00,240 Speaker 2: is we actually create a news for ourselves. Late on, 37 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:05,560 Speaker 2: the struggles get bigger and more challenging, and when the 38 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:10,240 Speaker 2: boundaries shift and our kids recognize that there's more rigal room, 39 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:13,240 Speaker 2: they keep pushing against those boundaries. Often. 40 00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:17,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, I love the Josh Ship. He's an American youth speaker, 41 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:20,440 Speaker 1: and he gives great talks, really smart guy, and he 42 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 1: uses that metaphor of when you're on the roller coaster, 43 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 1: and I don't know what you call it, the harness. 44 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 1: The harness comes down on your knees or against your chest, 45 00:02:28,760 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 1: and it pushes really hard and it's restrictive. And our 46 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:35,359 Speaker 1: initial our reaction is I want to push back against this. Yeah, 47 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:37,520 Speaker 1: but he says, we're not pushing back against it because 48 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:41,120 Speaker 1: we don't want it there. We're pushing back against it because, well, 49 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:43,560 Speaker 1: it might be a bit uncomfortable, but we need it 50 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:46,240 Speaker 1: to stay there and stay firm in spite of us 51 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: pushing against it, because it's going to save our lives. 52 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: He argues that our teenagers are a bit the same. 53 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 1: They're pushing and they're saying they don't want it there, 54 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:54,799 Speaker 1: but they really do. They want to make sure that 55 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:55,680 Speaker 1: it's going to stay firm. 56 00:02:57,200 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 2: And I guess the challenge for so many parents is 57 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:03,399 Speaker 2: we have this desire to have this friction free relationship 58 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 2: with our children. 59 00:03:04,200 --> 00:03:04,760 Speaker 1: It doesn't exist. 60 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:07,920 Speaker 2: We want to be friends with them. We want to 61 00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 2: have that kind of reciprocal to and fro with our kids, 62 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:16,640 Speaker 2: and we think that the way we achieve that is 63 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,359 Speaker 2: by allowing them to do the things that they want. 64 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 1: To do, which we call permissiveness. Let's be honest. I mean, 65 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 1: we could charitably call it pick your battles, but often 66 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,280 Speaker 1: when we adopt this approach, we don't pick any battles 67 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: at all. We just will fight that another day. 68 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:33,040 Speaker 2: I remember having a conversation with one of our kids' 69 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 2: school teachers at one point and I said, well, last 70 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 2: week we were on good terms. This week we are 71 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:39,600 Speaker 2: the worst people in the world. 72 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: She hates us. 73 00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 2: And he half jokingly but quite seriously, just said, if 74 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 2: your children, at some point in their lives don't hate you, 75 00:03:48,880 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 2: then you're not doing your job right. Our job is 76 00:03:51,440 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 2: actually to provide stability, structure, and boundaries for our kids. 77 00:03:56,360 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 2: And being kids, they will often see that as you 78 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:05,960 Speaker 2: being unkind, uncaring, unfeeling, and as a result we become 79 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 2: the enemy and the relationship. But it's actually what they need. 80 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 1: I often say to parents, boundaries matter. It's not what 81 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 1: the boundary is, it's how you implement it that makes 82 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:18,960 Speaker 1: the biggest difference. Permissiveness is about not implementing the boundaries. 83 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:22,120 Speaker 1: This is the given option option number one. I see 84 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 1: it a lot. Why because, like you said, Kylie, we 85 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:26,719 Speaker 1: just we want to choose peace. We just want everyone 86 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:29,280 Speaker 1: to just leave us alone where we're exhausted. We've got 87 00:04:29,320 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 1: too much going on, and now the kids have got 88 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,440 Speaker 1: all this energy for this thing that we just don't 89 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:36,039 Speaker 1: have the same level of energy and enthusiasm for what 90 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:37,680 Speaker 1: they want to fight about, and so we give in. 91 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:43,200 Speaker 1: Not helpful, not productive, not effective, not good for our kids' 92 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:44,040 Speaker 1: long term outcomes. 93 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 2: You tapped into something really important there. It seems that 94 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 2: when our kids need those boundaries the most is at 95 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:54,279 Speaker 2: the point in our day or in our lives where 96 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 2: we don't have the capacity. And often that's when we 97 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 2: become most permissive because it's just like, just get out 98 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 2: of my hair, yes, go do it whatever, and we 99 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:06,960 Speaker 2: don't have the time or the head space or the 100 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 2: thought processing to actually navigate that space with clarity. 101 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 1: Great thing about problems, they last. So if you don't 102 00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 1: have the capacity to do with the problem today, the 103 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:22,880 Speaker 1: problem will still exist tomorrow, like it'll hang around until 104 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: you deal with the problem. And that's kind of putting 105 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:29,480 Speaker 1: a positive spit on problems. But I like it because 106 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 1: it means that as a parent, we often think that 107 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 1: we have to fix everything now, and we don't. We 108 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:34,360 Speaker 1: can kick it down the road, we can deal with 109 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:36,360 Speaker 1: it later. It's not a problem to do with it later. 110 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 1: In fact, it's quite good to do with it later. 111 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:40,159 Speaker 1: I'm a big fan of that, all right. Our second 112 00:05:40,279 --> 00:05:44,719 Speaker 1: most common strategy for dealing with kids being belligerent and 113 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:47,919 Speaker 1: annoying and incessantly asking for more, Rather than going with 114 00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:51,800 Speaker 1: giving in, we go with the hell no. That's strategy 115 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 1: number two. Strategy number one given hard core. 116 00:05:55,560 --> 00:06:00,560 Speaker 2: Just souoritarian approach is my way or the highway. 117 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:03,240 Speaker 1: My feedback on this is that I actually would have 118 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:05,360 Speaker 1: struggled with this, and I'll tell you why. I meet 119 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 1: so many people who say, yeah, but it works worked 120 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 1: on me. My parents only ever had to do that 121 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:14,160 Speaker 1: thing once. They punish me. They punished me hard, they 122 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 1: punished me quickly. They linked it directly to what I'd done. 123 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:19,480 Speaker 1: Never did it again. And when you hear that, it's like, 124 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:22,160 Speaker 1: it doesn't mean it's good, it doesn't mean it's right. 125 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 1: But I mean, sometimes it can be really effective. Not 126 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:26,359 Speaker 1: endorsing it, I'm just highlighting this is the logic that 127 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 1: a lot of people will have, and this is why 128 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:29,720 Speaker 1: they go with the hell no, authoritarian style. 129 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:32,680 Speaker 2: So the challenge I have with this approach is that 130 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 2: while it might work in the moment. What it essentially 131 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:42,160 Speaker 2: does is it takes away our children's ability to self regulate. 132 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:46,360 Speaker 2: We've actually taken the choice away from them. And there 133 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 2: are certain experiences, challenges, situations that we actually need to 134 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:57,919 Speaker 2: step in and have a hard no like that is 135 00:06:58,040 --> 00:06:58,480 Speaker 2: our job. 136 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:00,679 Speaker 1: We are the prefrontal cortex of the Fanly the kids 137 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: don't always think things through well. 138 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:05,599 Speaker 2: But there are plenty of times where this approach is 139 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,160 Speaker 2: used and it's not needful if we're able to give 140 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:12,520 Speaker 2: our children the opportunity to start thinking, because you can 141 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 2: police them while you're with them, but once you're not there, 142 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 2: they're not going to go with a hell no. 143 00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:18,480 Speaker 1: Yeah. 144 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:18,760 Speaker 2: Yeah. 145 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 1: The question is how do you get to discipline without damage? 146 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 2: Right? 147 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 1: So the missive structure, the giving in, that creates one 148 00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:28,840 Speaker 1: form of damage. The hell no authoritarian my way of 149 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: the highway that creates a different kind of damage. 150 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 2: And depending on the personality of your child. You have 151 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 2: a submissive child, then they just accept it and they 152 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 2: kind of carry on with life. 153 00:07:37,320 --> 00:07:37,480 Speaker 1: Right. 154 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 2: But if you have an opposition or child I do. 155 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 1: I've watched this happen. 156 00:07:41,360 --> 00:07:45,720 Speaker 2: This ruptures relationships in really significant ways. 157 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, sometimes lifelong ruptures like massive blow ups. After the break, 158 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about our third idea instead of 159 00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 1: giving in, instead of handing out a hell no. And 160 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 1: let's be honest, sometimes both of those can work, and 161 00:07:56,880 --> 00:07:59,320 Speaker 1: sometimes we need both of those the one that's most 162 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:09,880 Speaker 1: effective right after the break. Okay, so we're dealing with 163 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 1: the question of do we give in, do we just 164 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,120 Speaker 1: acquiesced we let the kids have whatever they want? Do 165 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 1: we push back hard and say I'm the parent, You'll 166 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:18,040 Speaker 1: do things my way because I know better than you. 167 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 1: I've climbed forty three rungs on the ladder of life. 168 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: You've only climbed nine, and so therefore I can see 169 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 1: things that you can't see. Or is there a better way? 170 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 1: Hell no, give in or work with them. That's our 171 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 1: third alternative today, And surprise, this is the one that 172 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,680 Speaker 1: we're going to advocate for, the one that we encourage, 173 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:43,080 Speaker 1: the one that we endorse. Why because it's a little 174 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: bit harder, but it works way better. 175 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 2: Well, I was just going to say you saying that 176 00:08:47,800 --> 00:08:51,200 Speaker 2: I'm thinking about every time poor parent out there has 177 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 2: just gone you mean, more work. 178 00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 1: But here's the thing, fast as slow and slow as 179 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: fast when you go with the giving in approach or 180 00:08:58,400 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 1: the hell no approach, you have to just keep on 181 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:04,040 Speaker 1: dealing with we visited, so with a give in, it 182 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:09,319 Speaker 1: just becomes an incessant annoyance, and your kids become increasingly 183 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 1: likely to push boundaries because they're looking for where the 184 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 1: boundary is, and so you're constantly being tested if you 185 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:16,320 Speaker 1: go with the hell no, the kids are constantly pushing 186 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 1: against it. But I want some freedom. I want some 187 00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 1: choice in my life. When we do a working with approach, 188 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:24,640 Speaker 1: it might be slower at the start, but it gets 189 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 1: faster down the track. Fast is slow, slow is fast. 190 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: And for those who have not heard this yet, although 191 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: we talk about it in the pot a lot, the 192 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:35,800 Speaker 1: best way to work with your kids is to explore, 193 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:37,599 Speaker 1: explain in power. I call it the three eas of 194 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:41,760 Speaker 1: effective discipline. Kids want a gaming console, Kids want a 195 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 1: new phone. Kids want to be able to stay out late. 196 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: Kids want to be able to do it, doesn't matter 197 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:46,520 Speaker 1: what it is. 198 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:49,599 Speaker 2: Go to a friend's party, they want to have a sleepover. 199 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, three ease, let me explore what's actually going on 200 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 1: for you. Let me explain what I'm worried about or 201 00:09:54,040 --> 00:09:56,760 Speaker 1: what I'm concerned about. Let's see if we can empower you. 202 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:58,439 Speaker 1: Let's come up with a solution together we can both 203 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:00,640 Speaker 1: feel good about. So we recently had this going on 204 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:02,320 Speaker 1: with our year twelve daughter. She wanted to go to 205 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:04,319 Speaker 1: a camp site and hang out with all of a 206 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:08,199 Speaker 1: friends camping across a long weekend, and we said we 207 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:12,040 Speaker 1: really wanted to say hell no, but part of us 208 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:14,280 Speaker 1: were like, why, she's nearly an adult, and there was 209 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 1: that sort of maybe we should just give in. But 210 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:19,560 Speaker 1: instead we sat down and we explored, explained, and powder 211 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 1: we worked with her and we said, all right, tell 212 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 1: us more about it. What are the dates, who's going, 213 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 1: how many couple are going to be there? Will there 214 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 1: be alcohol? Tell us about access to emergency services, like 215 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:30,679 Speaker 1: what if something goes wrong, You're nearly two hours away 216 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 1: from us. Turns out she's going to be two hours 217 00:10:33,160 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 1: away from us at a place that's only accessible by 218 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 1: four will drive, has no mobile fun coverage, and there's 219 00:10:38,559 --> 00:10:40,960 Speaker 1: a bunch of kids who are going to be taking alcohol. 220 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 1: Plus there's a handful of couples, only ten kids in total, 221 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:45,880 Speaker 1: and the whole thing. We just looked at it and said, 222 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:48,800 Speaker 1: there's a couple of really big red flags for us, 223 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:51,600 Speaker 1: But overarchingly the fact that we can't contact you and 224 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 1: you need a full drive to get in and out, 225 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:54,680 Speaker 1: which means that you're at the mercy of other people 226 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: who may be drinking alcohol. For us, it's just to 227 00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: we don't feel good about this at all situation. What 228 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 1: can we come up with that helps you to feel 229 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: good about it, but also satisfies our concerns for your welfare. 230 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:10,080 Speaker 1: After all, you're under eighteen, you're not an adult, and 231 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:12,120 Speaker 1: we are responsible for keeping you safe. 232 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 2: The conversation went over a couple of days because we 233 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:20,120 Speaker 2: had to revisit this a number of times. She really 234 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:22,439 Speaker 2: wanted to be able to spend time with her friends, 235 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:25,839 Speaker 2: and there's been some changes to the social structure in 236 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 2: her friendship groups. 237 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:28,800 Speaker 1: Yes, this was important. 238 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:33,240 Speaker 2: This is her trying to, I guess, insert herself. And 239 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:37,000 Speaker 2: we continue to talk about it, and I think that 240 00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:38,760 Speaker 2: deep down she knew it was going to be a no, 241 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,400 Speaker 2: but she really wanted to continue having the conversation, just 242 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:45,160 Speaker 2: with that little glimmer of hope that maybe we might, 243 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 2: maybe we might acquiesce. As we continue talking, I actually 244 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 2: said to her, I'm really struggling to make a decision 245 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 2: on this, I said, because I recognize you're nearly eighteen, 246 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:56,720 Speaker 2: you get you know, in a few months time, you 247 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 2: actually get to make the decision around this, I said, 248 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:02,120 Speaker 2: but you're not quite there yet, and so right now 249 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 2: I feel really uncomfortable about X, Y and Z. I said, 250 00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 2: what would you do if you were in our position 251 00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 2: and this was your daughter? And she looked at me 252 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:14,199 Speaker 2: and she said, I actually don't know, and I said, yeah, 253 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:16,840 Speaker 2: that's where I'm sitting. I said, so, based on the 254 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:19,480 Speaker 2: fact that these are my concerns and I'm just feeling 255 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:22,040 Speaker 2: a little bit unsettled by it, I think I have 256 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 2: to say. 257 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: No, Yeah, it's not a hell yes, we don't feel 258 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:26,000 Speaker 1: safe enough about it, But it's not a. 259 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 2: Hell no either. It's just a I can't feel peaceful 260 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:32,559 Speaker 2: about this. I said, what would it look like. Do 261 00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 2: you think if maybe you just went and hung out 262 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:36,320 Speaker 2: with them for the day. Do you think you could 263 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:38,160 Speaker 2: do that and still feel like you're part of it 264 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:41,200 Speaker 2: and not missing out? And she said, yeah, I probably 265 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:43,800 Speaker 2: could do that. Well. As a result, that was actually 266 00:12:43,840 --> 00:12:47,200 Speaker 2: the decision we made. But over the next few days, 267 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,240 Speaker 2: as more and more information came to her, she realized 268 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:52,800 Speaker 2: that it actually wasn't going to work, and she didn't 269 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:57,400 Speaker 2: want to do it, And what I have been actually 270 00:12:57,440 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 2: really surprised about. This was something that she really pushed 271 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:05,640 Speaker 2: hard for. But because we chose to stand strong together, 272 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:07,959 Speaker 2: we were unified in this decision, and I think that 273 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:09,880 Speaker 2: that's really important. 274 00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 1: And we worked with her on it, like we gave 275 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:13,079 Speaker 1: her a voice and a sense that this was something 276 00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:15,719 Speaker 1: we're wrestling with. We're not just dismissing it out of hand. 277 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:16,920 Speaker 1: We're really wrestling with this. 278 00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 2: She has actually come around so beautifully in the acknowledgment 279 00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 2: that she thinks we made the right decision. Yeah, and 280 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:28,920 Speaker 2: she's at peace with it. There's no feeling of I'm 281 00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:30,319 Speaker 2: missing out or But. 282 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:32,480 Speaker 1: The critical thing here is you might listen to that 283 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 1: story and go, oh, my goodness, how nice is that 284 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 1: for you? Obviously perfect outcome, But you're much more likely 285 00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:40,400 Speaker 1: to get that perfect outcome when you don't go with 286 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 1: a hell no, and you don't go with that I'm 287 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 1: just going to give it and let you do it 288 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:44,800 Speaker 1: when you actually say, well, we've got a problem to solve. 289 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 1: I mean, the best discipline it's not about hurting your kids. 290 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:52,040 Speaker 1: The best discipline isn't about I don't know, punishing them 291 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:54,920 Speaker 1: or coming with consequences, Nor is it being las a 292 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:57,280 Speaker 1: fair and letting them do whatever. The best discipline is 293 00:13:57,320 --> 00:13:59,520 Speaker 1: saying there's a problem to solve, how can we solve 294 00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:02,079 Speaker 1: in a way it works for everybody? And if we 295 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:03,960 Speaker 1: can't solve it in a way that works for everybody, 296 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 1: sometimes as a parent you do actually step in and say, well, 297 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 1: I have to use my judgment. My job is to 298 00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 1: keep you safe. Therefore, the decision is this. But we 299 00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:12,320 Speaker 1: can revisit again soon and see what else we can 300 00:14:12,360 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 1: come up with to make this work. If you've got 301 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:15,640 Speaker 1: any more ideas, let's play. 302 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 2: And I think that's key, just the acknowledgment that if 303 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 2: you can't come up with a decision on day one, 304 00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 2: it's okay to take problems and to reassess tomorrow or 305 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 2: the next day or even next week. 306 00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:30,360 Speaker 1: Great thing about problems, they just hang around. 307 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 2: All right. 308 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 1: We need to wrap it up there. Thanks so much 309 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 1: for listening. More information and more resources available in my 310 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:37,320 Speaker 1: Brilliant Book The Parenting. Can I say that about my 311 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:40,600 Speaker 1: own book? Or is that a little bit too self congratulatory? 312 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 1: Is isn't it? 313 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:41,800 Speaker 2: I don't think so? 314 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: You don't, okay? My brilliant book The parenting. Revolution has 315 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 1: got all the stuff about how to have those conversations 316 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:49,360 Speaker 1: and what those three e's look like. Pairing and Revolution 317 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:51,760 Speaker 1: available wherever you get good books. Our time is done. 318 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 1: Thanks so much to Justin rule On from Bridge Media 319 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: for being a wonderful producer making a Happy Families podcast 320 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 1: to sound so good. Have a great day.