1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:04,920 Speaker 1: This episode is sponsored by an Espresso professional and coincidentally, 2 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:09,280 Speaker 1: today is also International Coffee Day. Okay, on with today's show. 3 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: When you're sipping your coffee in the morning, what are 4 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:18,239 Speaker 1: you thinking about? Are you aware of the acidity or 5 00:00:18,280 --> 00:00:22,720 Speaker 1: bitterness or how the aroma is making you feel? Are 6 00:00:22,720 --> 00:00:25,079 Speaker 1: you waiting for the caffeine to kick in and help 7 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 1: ease you into your day? And what about on your 8 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:33,200 Speaker 1: second cup or your fourth, or if you're Jean Marc Dregoli, 9 00:00:33,479 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 1: maybe even your tenth cup. Jean Mark is an Espresso's 10 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 1: general manager of the Oceania region and he loves his coffee. 11 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:46,159 Speaker 1: As well as being a coffee lover, Jean Mark speaks 12 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 1: about five languages fluently and he's moved around the world 13 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:54,480 Speaker 1: for work several times in his career. So what are 14 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:57,960 Speaker 1: Geen Mark's secrets to learning a new language in just 15 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 1: a few months and what if the best lessons he 16 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,320 Speaker 1: has learned in how to settle into a brand new 17 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 1: country for work? And is coffee something that we can 18 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:17,240 Speaker 1: use to be more productive? My name is doctor Amantha Imba. 19 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: I'm an organizational psychologist and the founder of behavioral science 20 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:24,560 Speaker 1: consultancy Inventium, and this is how I work a show 21 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 1: about how to help you do your best work. So 22 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:32,760 Speaker 1: let's head to Jean Marc to learn what actually makes 23 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:34,479 Speaker 1: a good cup of coffee. 24 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 2: First of all, obviously the taste and the taste is 25 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:42,080 Speaker 2: very personal, so I think you need to find the 26 00:01:42,160 --> 00:01:46,040 Speaker 2: right blend and the right I would say recipe that 27 00:01:46,520 --> 00:01:50,120 Speaker 2: works for you. But for me, coffee goes well well 28 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 2: beyond to the tastes. Obviously, it's connecting to what I 29 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:57,680 Speaker 2: do every day and to my business. So the impact 30 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 2: we have on people, the way we do the business 31 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 2: as clearly an impact on how I enjoyed my cup 32 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 2: of coffee. I feel very happy when I know that, 33 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 2: you know, in my espresso or in my longer cup. 34 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 2: You know, we had a fantastic relationship maybe twenty twenty 35 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:21,119 Speaker 2: five thousand kilometer away from here, somewhere in Brazil and Colombia, 36 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 2: sometimes with some of the farmers that I met personally 37 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 2: as well. So I think it enables also some remote 38 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 2: human connections. 39 00:02:30,800 --> 00:02:35,160 Speaker 1: Now, talk me through your daily coffee routine, what you're 40 00:02:35,200 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 1: drinking and when you're drinking. 41 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:40,919 Speaker 2: I have a lot of coffee every day. The first 42 00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:45,799 Speaker 2: coffee is early in the morning, after we come back 43 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:49,400 Speaker 2: from walking the dogs with my wife, and generally that 44 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 2: first cup of coffee is really the one that helps 45 00:02:52,919 --> 00:02:56,880 Speaker 2: me waking up a little bit. Not not physically, but 46 00:02:57,120 --> 00:02:59,959 Speaker 2: I think my brain starts really to function after that one. 47 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:04,440 Speaker 2: And it's generally a cup with milk. We like cappuccinos 48 00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 2: a lot, so we start the day with a cappuccino together. 49 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:12,240 Speaker 2: Then throughout the day I probably have between I would 50 00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:18,600 Speaker 2: say seven to ten cups of coffee, sometimes short, sometime longer, 51 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:21,440 Speaker 2: sometimes with a drop of milk, but generally throughout the 52 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 2: day it's black coffee, no sugar. Typically after lunch I 53 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:29,920 Speaker 2: would go with a short, intense express so and there 54 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:33,760 Speaker 2: are moments where I need that larger cup, maybe a 55 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 2: little bit lighter in tastes, and those moments where I reflect, 56 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 2: where I'm thinking about something, where I relax a bit. 57 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 1: And seven to ten cups of coffee a day, how 58 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:46,560 Speaker 1: are you getting to sleep at night? 59 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:51,040 Speaker 2: You know? The last one is probably around ten in 60 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 2: the evening. So I enjoy coffee, and I enjoy tea 61 00:03:56,120 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 2: a lot as well, and I drink tea at night, 62 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 2: but the coffee is really some saying that calms me. 63 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 2: It's my relaxing moment. It's my me time. So I 64 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 2: know that there is there is a certain amount of caffeines. 65 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 2: But actually, if if you look at the details, and 66 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:19,919 Speaker 2: because caffeine is water soluble, so the extraction and the 67 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:23,360 Speaker 2: way you prepare your coffee will have a very important 68 00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:26,320 Speaker 2: influence on the amount of caffeine you have in your cup. 69 00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 2: So caffeine is not connected to intensity. So the shorter 70 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:35,000 Speaker 2: the extraction, the less the coffee is in contact with water, 71 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 2: the less caffeine in the cup. So you may have 72 00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:43,960 Speaker 2: a bald, intense espresso with very little caffeine, and you 73 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 2: may have a very long, watery cup of coffee with 74 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 2: very little taste but a lot of caffeine. So choose 75 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:54,039 Speaker 2: the right coffee for the right moment, and you can 76 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:57,359 Speaker 2: probably adapt a little bit your intake of caffeine. 77 00:04:58,040 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 1: I think that's really interesting because that's not necessarily intuitive. 78 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: You would think that a more intense coffee flavor has 79 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 1: more caffeine, but it doesn't. So like, how can we 80 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:12,440 Speaker 1: estimate how much caffeine is in a cup of coffee 81 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:13,080 Speaker 1: that we're drinking. 82 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:21,919 Speaker 2: Probably between fifty two hundred milligrams of caffeine in I 83 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 2: would say a normal cup of coffee. Then if you 84 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:30,080 Speaker 2: go into very long cups, then I would say probably 85 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 2: a bit more than that. And then there are some 86 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:36,360 Speaker 2: varieties of coffee. You know, you have Arabica, you have Robusta, 87 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 2: and within those varieties you may have some varieties that 88 00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:44,280 Speaker 2: have a little bit more caffeine than others. So I'll 89 00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 2: give you an example one of our coffee, which is 90 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 2: a very intense coffee in tastes as well, but it's 91 00:05:50,920 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 2: also a coffee that has a little bit more caffeine 92 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 2: than the others, called Kazar. That coffee has around one 93 00:05:56,720 --> 00:06:02,320 Speaker 2: hundred and twenty milligrams of caffeine, and generally the robust 94 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:05,920 Speaker 2: which is the lower quality coffee, as generally a bit 95 00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:09,280 Speaker 2: more cafeine than the Arabicas. So you have to look 96 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 2: at all those parameters, you know, the origin of the coffee, 97 00:06:12,120 --> 00:06:14,600 Speaker 2: the variety, and then the extraction, and then with that 98 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 2: you can estimate the caffeine. 99 00:06:16,960 --> 00:06:20,520 Speaker 1: Now, your final cup of coffee is very late at night, 100 00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:23,920 Speaker 1: and I've heard that people are different in how they 101 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 1: metabolize coffee, So can you tell me a bit about that, Like, 102 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:30,760 Speaker 1: how do people know whether it's okay to have a 103 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:32,640 Speaker 1: coffee at ten o'clock at night, or whether they should 104 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 1: have their last coffee at ten o'clock in the morning. 105 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:38,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, my wife cannot drink a cup of 106 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:41,920 Speaker 2: coffee after three four and she says that, you know, 107 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:44,600 Speaker 2: she feels that her body reacts and then she has 108 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:48,599 Speaker 2: difficulties to fall asleep. I can have one at ten 109 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:52,240 Speaker 2: in the evening and I sleep like a baby again. 110 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 2: It goes. I think it's very personal, but I associate 111 00:06:56,520 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 2: really the coffee moment to a relax moment for me. 112 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 2: So when I'm at the office, the coffee moment is 113 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 2: connecting with colleagues. I'll go to our kitchen and it's 114 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 2: a great opportunity to engage with some staff who have 115 00:07:13,120 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 2: a quick chat. So it's really a connecting moment. When 116 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 2: I'm on my own, coffee is more the moment where 117 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 2: I reflect, where I sink, where I pose myself in 118 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:28,960 Speaker 2: that last cup of coffee. I generally have it while 119 00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 2: reading or watching something just before going to bed, and 120 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 2: it's a little bit my closing, closing of the day, 121 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 2: and it's my relaxing, relaxing moment. So up to now 122 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 2: I haven't seen any effect on my sleeping. Maybe this 123 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:47,119 Speaker 2: will evolve with time. 124 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 1: And how about decaf coffee, because I'm a one caffeinated 125 00:07:53,080 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 1: cup of coffee person a day, but then I would 126 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 1: have a couple of decaf coffees as well. How do 127 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:02,360 Speaker 1: I know how much caffeine is in dcat coffee? 128 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 2: That's a good question, and maybe before I answer, I'll 129 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:10,960 Speaker 2: ask you another question. Do you feel a different taste 130 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 2: on that decaf coffee? 131 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 1: I don't think I do. I don't think so. But 132 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 1: I feel like my palette is not as sophisticated as yours, 133 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:26,120 Speaker 1: Like I can kind of tell what a good coffee tastes, 134 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 1: like good and invented covers, and I am a Melburnie 135 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 1: and so I should know, But I don't think I 136 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:32,960 Speaker 1: can tell the difference. 137 00:08:33,760 --> 00:08:38,320 Speaker 2: I think I think probably no one can tell the difference. 138 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 2: We did some test with some very sophisticated palettes like 139 00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 2: Michelin Star Chefs, and we did some trials and we 140 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 2: make them test what we call an alter ego, you know, 141 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:55,959 Speaker 2: so it's one of our blends and then the same 142 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:59,839 Speaker 2: blends and the same taste profile but without caffeine, and 143 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:02,560 Speaker 2: they were not able to make to make the difference. 144 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:08,480 Speaker 2: So there are several ways to remove cafeine from the coffee. 145 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:12,160 Speaker 2: There is, I would say, a more industrial way to 146 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 2: do it where you use chemical insolvents, and there is 147 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:21,559 Speaker 2: a very natural way of doing it, which is using water. 148 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:26,200 Speaker 2: In some countries they refer that to the Swiss water method. 149 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 2: I think it's a it's a very natural process where 150 00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 2: basically the green coffee before the roasting, goes through a 151 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:40,200 Speaker 2: process where you wash that coffee with water at a 152 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 2: certain temperature under a certain pressure, and that releases the 153 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:49,960 Speaker 2: cafe in. The caffeine goes into the water, and then 154 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:54,480 Speaker 2: you can evaporate that water and recover the cafeine separately, 155 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 2: and your green coffee will be almost without cafine. It's 156 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:03,559 Speaker 2: not one hundred per cent without caffeine, but I think 157 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:06,360 Speaker 2: it's fair to say that it's probably a couple of 158 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: milligrams of caffeine in that cup, So I would say 159 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:14,120 Speaker 2: two to five milligrams of caffeine versus a normal cup 160 00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:17,280 Speaker 2: that is probably closer to one hundred milligrams of cafee. 161 00:10:17,360 --> 00:10:21,840 Speaker 2: So you're close to ninety five percent caffeine free in 162 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 2: the caffeine ated coffee. And the good thing of that 163 00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:28,720 Speaker 2: is if caffeine has an effect on your metabolism. You 164 00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 2: can still enjoy the very good taste of coffee sometimes intensity, 165 00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:37,920 Speaker 2: all the aromatic profile without having the caffeine, So caffeine 166 00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:40,040 Speaker 2: has nothing to do with taste. 167 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 1: Now I want to switch gears and talk about a 168 00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:46,439 Speaker 1: typical working day for you, because one of the challenges 169 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:49,719 Speaker 1: of your role is that you are based in Australia 170 00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: in Sydney, but head office is over in Europe, and 171 00:10:55,200 --> 00:11:01,319 Speaker 1: I Espresso is a global organization. There are probably demands 172 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 1: on your time at all hours of the day and night. 173 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 1: What does the typical day look like for you? 174 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 2: Well, it's a long day and I think you really 175 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:17,560 Speaker 2: summarized it very very well. Being based out of Australia 176 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:22,040 Speaker 2: and working for a Swiss multinational, it's sometimes a bit 177 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:26,679 Speaker 2: of a challenge from a timing perspective, though our colleagues 178 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,400 Speaker 2: in Europe are quite conscious and they are trying to 179 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:34,040 Speaker 2: respect as much as possible the time difference. Sometimes it's 180 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:38,880 Speaker 2: inevitable my day starts generally, I would say, when we 181 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:41,880 Speaker 2: are not in lockdown, it would start at around six 182 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:46,040 Speaker 2: o'clock in the morning. I would go out with my 183 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:49,679 Speaker 2: wife and we would walk for probably half an hour 184 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:54,000 Speaker 2: forty minutes with our dogs, which finally arrived to Australia 185 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:58,760 Speaker 2: after twenty two months journey from Brazil. But that's a 186 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 2: different story. We're very happy to have our dogs with 187 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:05,839 Speaker 2: us and our routine is back to normal. So once 188 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 2: the walk is finished, we start the day preparing, you know, 189 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 2: breakfast and the food for the kids. It's really a 190 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 2: kind of a family family time up to around that 191 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:21,360 Speaker 2: would say seven o'clock for me, seven fifteen and then 192 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:24,000 Speaker 2: I've got my first cup of coffee and that's where 193 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 2: I kick off the day. I move from the family 194 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:31,040 Speaker 2: time to the business time in my brain and start 195 00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 2: thinking about the day, start planning my day, reading the emails, 196 00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 2: and obviously I have a little bit of time also 197 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 2: for me during that morning beginning of the morning, sorry, 198 00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 2: where I do what I call the news screening, So 199 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 2: I'll go through news in Australia, news in Europe. It's 200 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,200 Speaker 2: important for me to maintain a certain connection with Europe, 201 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:59,680 Speaker 2: with my I would say my home home country because 202 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:03,400 Speaker 2: well eighteen years ago, and when you have an expat life, 203 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:06,319 Speaker 2: those little things are helping you, you know, to maintain 204 00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:11,959 Speaker 2: that connection with with your origin, with yourself. So this 205 00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:16,479 Speaker 2: last from seven to I would say eight thirty maximum 206 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:20,000 Speaker 2: nine o'clock, and then at nine o'clock my day really 207 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 2: starts with team meetings, a lot of conferencing throughout the 208 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:31,160 Speaker 2: day where we discuss our operation, we prepare the months, 209 00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 2: the next months, the activities, we discuss, people, et cetera. 210 00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:39,160 Speaker 2: Throughout a long journey would be for me up to 211 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 2: probably six seven in the evening. Then I would stop 212 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 2: spend time with the family again. And then after the 213 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 2: family time, I may have still one hour or two 214 00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 2: either conferencing with Europe or engaging with my colleagues or 215 00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:00,480 Speaker 2: my boss and Zerland. 216 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:04,280 Speaker 1: How do you avoid burning out with such long hours? 217 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 2: That's difficult. I've been used my whole life to work 218 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:13,160 Speaker 2: quite a lot, quite long hours. I think my experience 219 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 2: in countries abroad, in Latin America, you know, the sense 220 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:23,120 Speaker 2: of working and time is very different from one country 221 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:27,040 Speaker 2: to another. I learned it here in Australia. The work 222 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 2: life balance is really important and the long hours is 223 00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 2: not something that is that natural. When you work in 224 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:38,960 Speaker 2: Latin America as an example, and I worked many years 225 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:43,359 Speaker 2: in Mexico and in Brazil as well, the long hours 226 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:47,360 Speaker 2: sounds normal. Sometimes It's not as efficient as the shorter 227 00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 2: hour ear but it's something that you get used to. 228 00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:54,320 Speaker 2: So I have a lot of breaks throughout the day, 229 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 2: moments where I disconnect. Maybe I would go for a 230 00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 2: short walk, and you know those seven to ten coffee days, 231 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 2: those are seven to ten times maybe five maybe ten 232 00:15:09,320 --> 00:15:14,760 Speaker 2: minutes where I can disconnect a bit. So that's how 233 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 2: I'm working. I'm trying to reduce that time. I'm getting 234 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:22,240 Speaker 2: better at it, trying to avoid working during the weekend. 235 00:15:22,280 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 2: I'm getting better at it. And I used one of 236 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:27,920 Speaker 2: your advices in one of the conferences that you did, 237 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:30,480 Speaker 2: where you were saying, you know, try to plan those 238 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 2: shorter meetings. I'm doing that, and now in my planning, 239 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 2: a thirty minutes meeting is generally twenty five minutes meeting, 240 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 2: so I have always five to ten minutes in between 241 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:44,840 Speaker 2: meetings to brace a little bit and to have a break. 242 00:15:45,400 --> 00:15:48,920 Speaker 1: Excellent, good to hear you taking my advice. Now shut back. 243 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:50,640 Speaker 1: How many languages do you speak? 244 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 2: Quite a few? Quite a few. So originally I'm I'm Italian, 245 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:03,600 Speaker 2: but was born in Switzerland. My parents immigrated from Italy 246 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:06,640 Speaker 2: after the Second World War, and I was born in 247 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:10,040 Speaker 2: Switzerland so I started to speak Italian at home, and 248 00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 2: I was speaking French outside of the home and that school. 249 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 2: And then I was lucky to live in Switzerland, where 250 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 2: the multi cultural aspect and plury language is something that 251 00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:27,160 Speaker 2: is key. You know, in Switzerland we have four official languages, 252 00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:31,400 Speaker 2: so you always juggle with at least another language. So 253 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:34,440 Speaker 2: I started to learn German at school. I studied it 254 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 2: for many years, and then I went one year to 255 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 2: live on the Swiss German part of the country. But 256 00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:47,200 Speaker 2: nowadays German is the language I speak the least. So 257 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 2: I would say I'm fluent in French, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, 258 00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:54,480 Speaker 2: and I like to say that I'm fluent in English 259 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:58,760 Speaker 2: as well. Those sometimes my accent and my vocabulary may 260 00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 2: be a bit limited, and then I have a decent 261 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:04,920 Speaker 2: level of German. So I always say that I speak 262 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 2: five and a half languages, including a little bit of Germany. 263 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 1: Well that's four and a half more than me. That 264 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:15,959 Speaker 1: is amazing. What are some of the strategies that you 265 00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:18,400 Speaker 1: have found to be most effective when trying to learn 266 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:20,040 Speaker 1: a new language. 267 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 2: So when I was a kid, I was lucky to 268 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 2: speak Italian and French, So I think my brain developed 269 00:17:29,080 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 2: a little bit of agility. But I have to say 270 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:34,919 Speaker 2: that learning German and English when I was at school 271 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 2: was very, very difficult for me, and I was I 272 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,119 Speaker 2: was a good student, but I was not a good 273 00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:47,359 Speaker 2: language student. What really made a change is when we 274 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:51,760 Speaker 2: decided to have an international experience and we learned it 275 00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 2: the hard way. We were sent end of two thousand 276 00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:59,240 Speaker 2: and three, my wife and myself to Mexico, and we 277 00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:02,600 Speaker 2: did speak a word of Spanish, and we learn the 278 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 2: hard way the importance of the language to really connect 279 00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:11,520 Speaker 2: with the local context, with people, with the culture. The 280 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:14,879 Speaker 2: first six months have been extremely hard for us, but 281 00:18:15,040 --> 00:18:19,000 Speaker 2: we were quite disciplined. So we add every day a 282 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:22,919 Speaker 2: Spanish class in the morning, and then we define the 283 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:25,719 Speaker 2: rule with the people that were close to us and 284 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 2: with our colleagues, which we ask them to basically correct 285 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:34,240 Speaker 2: ourselves every single time we would make a mistake. And 286 00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 2: then with time your brain starts to adapt. Just you 287 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 2: learned it. You learned it at the beginning the hard way, 288 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:44,479 Speaker 2: but then it becomes very natural. And because we've been 289 00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:46,920 Speaker 2: living in so many countries, the first thing we do 290 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,440 Speaker 2: is really learning the language as best as we can, 291 00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:54,359 Speaker 2: so you're able to communicate, to engage with people, to interact, 292 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 2: and to discover the country with different eyes. 293 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:02,200 Speaker 1: That sounds like a very very interesting process. Are there 294 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:06,920 Speaker 1: any other tricks or tips that you have found that 295 00:19:07,240 --> 00:19:09,840 Speaker 1: are really helpful when learning a new language. 296 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:13,800 Speaker 2: Yep, there are, at least for me, there are two things. 297 00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 2: One is listening to the radio when you commute and 298 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:23,800 Speaker 2: listening to the news to radio channel and really family 299 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:28,639 Speaker 2: familiarize you're here with the way people speak, the pronunciation. 300 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 2: At the beginning, it's very hard, you don't understand anything, 301 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:37,960 Speaker 2: and with the times it becomes really natural. And the 302 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 2: second tip for me when you are in the country, 303 00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:43,960 Speaker 2: but also when you live left the country and you 304 00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:48,320 Speaker 2: want to maintain your language level, this is really reading 305 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:53,679 Speaker 2: in other languages. So I force myself to read a 306 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:57,159 Speaker 2: couple of books per year in different languages. So I 307 00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:01,439 Speaker 2: generally don't read much anymore in French because French is 308 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:05,560 Speaker 2: really natural for me, and I try to read at 309 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:10,680 Speaker 2: least one book in Italian, in Spanish, in Portuguese, in English. 310 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 2: So it's really maintaining that brain gymnastic, that flexibility in 311 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:20,160 Speaker 2: your brain to be able to switch from one language 312 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:23,919 Speaker 2: to another. And this really comes with the time, with 313 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:27,200 Speaker 2: a lot of exercise. And you know, in my day 314 00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:29,640 Speaker 2: generally I speak I speak at least two or three 315 00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 2: language in the same day, being with our head office, 316 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:36,000 Speaker 2: being at home, being with my kids. You know, my 317 00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 2: kids language, their mother tongue. I would say, it's not French, 318 00:20:42,760 --> 00:20:47,440 Speaker 2: it's English because they were educated in English. But then 319 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:51,120 Speaker 2: we switch to French and then we may make a joke, 320 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 2: you know, in Spanish or in Portuguese. So it's really 321 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:57,920 Speaker 2: it's really strange. If you would see at our table 322 00:20:57,960 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 2: at home, you would say, those people are really weird. 323 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 1: Wow, it's weird, but yet incredibly impressive. Now, if you 324 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:09,640 Speaker 1: wanted to learn a new language, but you weren't living 325 00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:12,879 Speaker 1: in a city or a country that spoke that language, Like, 326 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:16,479 Speaker 1: let's just say I set you the challenge of learning 327 00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 1: how to speak Japanese over the next six months, but 328 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:21,800 Speaker 1: you have to stay in Sydney. What would you do? 329 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:27,280 Speaker 2: Wow? Wow? Wow wow. So I think the starting point 330 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:31,000 Speaker 2: and what has been really helpful for us is having this, 331 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:35,800 Speaker 2: you know, professional support at the beginning. So I think 332 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:38,879 Speaker 2: you need to start with a teacher just to get 333 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 2: to get the base, to get the basics, to try 334 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:45,640 Speaker 2: to understand how things works in that language, a little 335 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:48,720 Speaker 2: bit of vocabulary, but also a little bit of grammar, 336 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:51,560 Speaker 2: which is a bit boring, but it's very very important. 337 00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:56,479 Speaker 2: So I would definitely start with finding a Japanese teacher 338 00:21:56,800 --> 00:21:59,080 Speaker 2: or a Japanese person in Sydney to help me at 339 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:03,639 Speaker 2: the beginning, and then I think that's where the listening, 340 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:09,200 Speaker 2: the watching, the immersion in that world becomes becomes essential. 341 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 2: If you could find a passion or an interest that 342 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,639 Speaker 2: would connect you to that language, I think it would 343 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:23,199 Speaker 2: help a lot. So typically I am in love with food, 344 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:30,919 Speaker 2: with gastronomy, with cooking, with cooking shows, etc. So if 345 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 2: you like sushi, if you like Japanese gastronomy, then I 346 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:38,120 Speaker 2: think this will help you to connect with the Japanese language. 347 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:43,639 Speaker 2: So you could start maybe watching some shows in Japanese 348 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:47,080 Speaker 2: and you put the subtitle in the language that you like, 349 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:51,920 Speaker 2: so you family you start familiarizing you're here with the language, 350 00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:55,720 Speaker 2: but you can still read under the translation, and once 351 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:59,040 Speaker 2: your level increases a bit, then you put the subtitle 352 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:03,200 Speaker 2: in the same language that you're listening to, So Japanese 353 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:06,800 Speaker 2: language Japanese subtitle. But I have to say that it's 354 00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:10,960 Speaker 2: probably a very difficult exercise to do if you're not 355 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:14,440 Speaker 2: in the country. And the other thing is probably it 356 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:18,359 Speaker 2: would be very difficult for me as well, because Japanese 357 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:22,680 Speaker 2: is not a Latin route. So you know, French, Italian, Spanish, 358 00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:26,920 Speaker 2: and Portuguese they share something in common, which is their origins. 359 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:31,639 Speaker 2: So it's probably much easier to learn Spanish, Portuguese and 360 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:36,920 Speaker 2: Italian with time, then switching from Italian to Japanese. 361 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,959 Speaker 1: Now, tell me about the career advice that you receive 362 00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:44,280 Speaker 1: before leaving Switzerland for the first time. 363 00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:47,760 Speaker 2: I'll put you back in context. It was two thousand 364 00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:53,920 Speaker 2: and three. It was my first assignment abroad, leaving the family, 365 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:58,760 Speaker 2: just freshly married, and the senior executive at that time 366 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 2: that was in charge of the geographical region was going 367 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 2: to so it was one of the general manager of 368 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,280 Speaker 2: Nesley at global level. His name is Carlos Reprezas, a 369 00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:14,040 Speaker 2: Mexican gentleman international career and he told me Mark, you 370 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:18,719 Speaker 2: are going to my home country Mexico, and I'm living 371 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:22,120 Speaker 2: in your home country, Switzerland, so we're switching country. I've 372 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:27,240 Speaker 2: been traveling around the world, working in many countries, and 373 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,359 Speaker 2: I'd like to share one thing with you, and that 374 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:35,600 Speaker 2: can help you, and that advice was basically, when you 375 00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 2: go into my home country, you will find a lot 376 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:43,280 Speaker 2: of differences with Switzerland. Try to focus on the good 377 00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:47,639 Speaker 2: things you will find in Mexico and try to forget 378 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:51,960 Speaker 2: or put on side everything that you like and loved 379 00:24:52,040 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 2: in your home country and try to really enjoy that 380 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:58,880 Speaker 2: country at its best, because if you start focusing your 381 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:02,480 Speaker 2: mind on all the good thing that you will be missing, 382 00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:08,760 Speaker 2: your experience will be very difficult at the beginning in Mexico, 383 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 2: and that advice has been really good for us because 384 00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 2: moving from i would say, a first world country like 385 00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:20,200 Speaker 2: Switzerland to maybe a developing country like Mexico, it's a 386 00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:23,840 Speaker 2: it's a big challenge, but we loved it, and we 387 00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:28,879 Speaker 2: really took that advice one hundred percent and we started 388 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,960 Speaker 2: to enjoy what Mexico has to offer, the best of Mexico, 389 00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:35,800 Speaker 2: which is the culture, which is the food, which is 390 00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 2: the language, which is the travel, which is the diversity. 391 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,800 Speaker 2: And since then, that's the advice that we as a 392 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:48,160 Speaker 2: family use each time we move and we really try 393 00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:51,679 Speaker 2: to take the best of the country we're going to 394 00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:56,040 Speaker 2: and leave a little bit behind us the best thing 395 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:57,200 Speaker 2: of the previous country. 396 00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:00,760 Speaker 1: I love that advice. And you have worked all over 397 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 1: the world. What is like. Tell me more about your 398 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:07,800 Speaker 1: approach to starting a new position in a brand new 399 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:09,240 Speaker 1: country and workplace. 400 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:15,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, so I mentioned to you maybe earlier. You know, 401 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 2: you're getting out of your comfort zone, and I learned 402 00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:23,400 Speaker 2: to enjoy that quite a lot. So the first thing 403 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:26,119 Speaker 2: I would I would do when I arrived in a 404 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:29,879 Speaker 2: new country is try to read a little bit about, 405 00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:33,399 Speaker 2: you know, the culture of the country, the history of 406 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:37,040 Speaker 2: the country, the geography of the country, the people. I 407 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:41,760 Speaker 2: would do probably an immersion on the first first week, 408 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:47,000 Speaker 2: you know, experiencing the food of the country, trying to 409 00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:51,359 Speaker 2: travel a little bit to see the diversity, trying to 410 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:57,120 Speaker 2: I'm putting myself, you know, quickly in what's what's the context, 411 00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:00,760 Speaker 2: and what's the mood there. Then the first the first 412 00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:04,960 Speaker 2: two weeks, first months of starting the new work in 413 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:09,000 Speaker 2: the country, there's a lot of listening, listening to people, 414 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:16,520 Speaker 2: you know, listening how the business works, understanding who they are, 415 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 2: a lot of one to one with the people, to 416 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 2: understand the context, what is really different to what I 417 00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:25,800 Speaker 2: was used to. I think you get a lot of 418 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:27,919 Speaker 2: insight with observation. 419 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:33,000 Speaker 1: What have you learned about Australia and Australians through observation. 420 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:37,800 Speaker 2: So I learned that, first of all, the coffee is 421 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:42,320 Speaker 2: something that is extremely important in Australia. Before coming to Australia, 422 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 2: would never have said that. You know, there's such a 423 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 2: strong coffee culture in the country. And I dare to 424 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:53,120 Speaker 2: say more than coffee culture, I think there's a cafe culture. 425 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,400 Speaker 2: And what shocks me a bit sometimes is to see 426 00:27:56,400 --> 00:28:00,400 Speaker 2: people walking in the morning from their home, walking and 427 00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:04,840 Speaker 2: going to their neighborhood cafe and then walking back with 428 00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 2: their cup of coffee to their home. This is something 429 00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:11,320 Speaker 2: that is not that natural for me. We are we're 430 00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:14,439 Speaker 2: getting used to it, obviously, but that's something that is 431 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 2: very that is very different. And then I would say 432 00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:24,199 Speaker 2: in that coffee culture, the high quality of the coffee 433 00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:28,960 Speaker 2: beverages in in in Australia, the taste profiles that are 434 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,639 Speaker 2: a bit a bit different that what I'm used to. 435 00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 2: The amount of milk in the cup is really key. Also, 436 00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:41,600 Speaker 2: you know, you you can find some of the best 437 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:44,360 Speaker 2: coffees in the world here in this in this country, 438 00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:49,320 Speaker 2: which sometimes in other country it's it's it's difficult. And 439 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 2: at the same time people are still drinking soluble coffee 440 00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:55,480 Speaker 2: at home as well, So you you got a little 441 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 2: bit the post world, you know, and. 442 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:01,640 Speaker 1: What about the work culture here? So what like what 443 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:05,320 Speaker 1: have you noticed that is unique about the Australian way 444 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,960 Speaker 1: of work compared to other countries you've worked within. 445 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 2: Probably there is a relation to hierarchy that is very 446 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:18,920 Speaker 2: different to some of the countries I worked in. So 447 00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 2: definitely in Australia you can be very close to people 448 00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 2: and you can have very direct, unfiltered conversation with anyone 449 00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:35,920 Speaker 2: and that's absolutely normal, which in other countries it may 450 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:39,600 Speaker 2: be it may be more difficult even if you as 451 00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 2: a leader of a major organization you want to do it. 452 00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:47,520 Speaker 2: There is always a little bit of distance between between 453 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:50,680 Speaker 2: people in hierarchy. So I really I really enjoyed that 454 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:56,440 Speaker 2: aspect of Australia. Then I think the work life balance 455 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:59,640 Speaker 2: and making sure that you know you are as efficient 456 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:03,560 Speaker 2: as par gossiple throughout the day because work is only 457 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 2: one part of your life and there is another part 458 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:10,440 Speaker 2: of your life. And finding that balance I think it's 459 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:13,720 Speaker 2: it's really great, and it's it's going a little bit 460 00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 2: out of my comfort zone, but I'm trying to learn faster. 461 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:21,400 Speaker 2: So there's some very very interesting, interesting aspect with the 462 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 2: working culture here. 463 00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:27,200 Speaker 1: That's fascinating now for people that want to learn more 464 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:31,440 Speaker 1: about espresso, whether that is consuming it within their home 465 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:35,320 Speaker 1: or at their office, and particularly for those when lockdown, 466 00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,360 Speaker 1: when they get back to their office. What's the best 467 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 1: way for people to do that? 468 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 2: Oh, I think I think you need to maybe understand 469 00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,680 Speaker 2: a little bit of our history. You know, it's it's 470 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 2: an innovation and pioneering really history. We created something that 471 00:30:54,080 --> 00:31:00,160 Speaker 2: didn't exist, and we created because we wanted to be 472 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:04,920 Speaker 2: able to give the barista coffee experience at home in 473 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,120 Speaker 2: a very simple way, so that you could enjoy a 474 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 2: very consistent cup of coffee at home without having to 475 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:19,480 Speaker 2: invest in major equipment and without having to really master 476 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:23,600 Speaker 2: all the variable of the coffee extraction. That's the origin 477 00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:30,040 Speaker 2: a lot of innovation, a very sustainable business as well, 478 00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:35,440 Speaker 2: because since day one, we've been sourcing extremely high coffee quality, 479 00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:38,600 Speaker 2: and we realize that if you want to have that 480 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:42,760 Speaker 2: supply of very high quality coffee, you need to put 481 00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 2: in place a system where you are very close to 482 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:48,240 Speaker 2: the producers, and you need to make sure that you 483 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:51,600 Speaker 2: work hand in hand with the producer so that they 484 00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:55,000 Speaker 2: have a good living, so that you continue to have 485 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 2: a good business as well. And then the third aspect 486 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:02,200 Speaker 2: is we are a direct consumer business, so we like 487 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:06,240 Speaker 2: that interaction with our consumer. We don't sell our product 488 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,800 Speaker 2: in supermarket. There's a good reason for that because this 489 00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:13,400 Speaker 2: is we believe the direct to consumer allows us freely 490 00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:18,440 Speaker 2: to understand what the consumer wants and to advise them 491 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:22,840 Speaker 2: and offer them the best experience. So I would say, 492 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:26,480 Speaker 2: if you want to leave an espresso experience, just go 493 00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:31,160 Speaker 2: into one of our store when possible, and you know, 494 00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:35,400 Speaker 2: just enter and ask one of our coffee specialists. You know, 495 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:40,520 Speaker 2: seventy percent of our staff are consumer facing, and you 496 00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:43,480 Speaker 2: just ask them to guide you through what an espresso 497 00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:47,800 Speaker 2: can offer, and with very few questions, we can identify 498 00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,040 Speaker 2: your needs, what you like, the way you like to 499 00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:54,120 Speaker 2: drink coffee, and then we can guide you in the 500 00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:58,760 Speaker 2: world of an espresso and discovering what I call and 501 00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:00,840 Speaker 2: what we call the perfect of coffee. 502 00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 1: Amazing. That sounds great, well, Jean Mark, thank you so 503 00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:07,960 Speaker 1: much for your time. I've thoroughly enjoyed learning more about 504 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:10,000 Speaker 1: coffee and languages and all sorts of things. 505 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:12,960 Speaker 2: So thank you, thank you, Thank you very much. Amanta 506 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 2: was lovely to talk to you today. Thank you. 507 00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,240 Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed my chat with Jean Mark and 508 00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 1: maybe you're feeling inspired to start learning a new language. Perhaps. 509 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: How I Work is produced by Inventium with production support 510 00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:31,560 Speaker 1: from Dead Set Studios. The producer for this episode was 511 00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 1: Jenna Koda, and thank you to Martin Nimba who does 512 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:37,440 Speaker 1: the audio mix and makes everything sound better than it 513 00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:40,120 Speaker 1: would have otherwise. See you next time.