1 00:00:00,520 --> 00:00:03,640 Speaker 1: Already and this is this is the daily This is 2 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:15,200 Speaker 1: the daily os oh Now it makes sense. Good morning 3 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 1: and welcome to the Daily Ohs. It's Wednesday, the fifth 4 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:18,280 Speaker 1: of February. 5 00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:19,800 Speaker 2: I'm Harry, I'm Emma. 6 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:23,440 Speaker 1: From stacking shelves to tapping away at the till. Shops 7 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: in Australia are run by workers whose future pay and 8 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: conditions hang in the ballots. The National Workplace Tribunal is 9 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 1: hearing a case that could see the minimum gap between 10 00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 1: ships cut from twelve to ten hours and scrap rest 11 00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:41,920 Speaker 1: breaks for higher paid retail managers. Some of Australia's biggest 12 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:47,639 Speaker 1: companies are supporting the move, including Woolle's, Coals, Kmart and Mecha. Meanwhile, 13 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:51,479 Speaker 1: ex Laviza staff assuing their old employer over allegations they 14 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:55,800 Speaker 1: were underpaid and were regularly and illegally deprived of rest breaks. 15 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:58,040 Speaker 1: Today we'll take a look at some of the big 16 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:02,360 Speaker 1: legal battles set to redefine Australia's retail scene. 17 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:08,760 Speaker 2: Harry, we're talking about some pretty big name brands, a 18 00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 2: lot of movement in the space of workers rights and 19 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:15,479 Speaker 2: retail today. I know you and I've spoken about working 20 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:19,319 Speaker 2: in retail before, and what a formative experience it can 21 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 2: be for young Aussies, young people especially. 22 00:01:23,240 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: Let me guess you were at them all at one 23 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:25,720 Speaker 1: point in your life. 24 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:30,000 Speaker 2: I actually went down the Hospow route. I consider myself 25 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:33,880 Speaker 2: a retail a reformed retail girlie, because I worked in 26 00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 2: like a juice bar in a Westfield. Okay, so I 27 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 2: was meeting people on their retail adventures. 28 00:01:39,360 --> 00:01:41,880 Speaker 1: It's just that, Emma, you could sell me anything. I 29 00:01:41,920 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 1: think that you've just got the retail knack in you. 30 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Harry. If this goes belly up, 31 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 2: I might be dropping my resume into a few shops. 32 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 2: But in all seriousness, we are talking about some very 33 00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 2: real cases and examples of change in the industry. I 34 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 2: want to get into this really interesting case that you 35 00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:03,320 Speaker 2: came across because I know that you have been buried 36 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 2: in the details. You are the expert now on this 37 00:02:06,240 --> 00:02:09,440 Speaker 2: fair work one. Can you explain what's going on with 38 00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:10,000 Speaker 2: this story? 39 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 1: So this particular story actually stretches back to February last year, 40 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:17,960 Speaker 1: although it has emerged in the headlines in more recent weeks, 41 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:21,120 Speaker 1: and I'll get to why that is. But basically, the 42 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:25,239 Speaker 1: Australian Retail Association made an application to the Fair Work 43 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:29,080 Speaker 1: Commission to make some changes to retail awards. That was 44 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 1: a massive word salad. So I'm going to break that 45 00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:34,560 Speaker 1: down a little bit. Yeah, I can see is. 46 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:36,359 Speaker 2: The Australian Retail Association. 47 00:02:36,639 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 1: First of all, very good questions. So the Retail Association 48 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: is a professional body representing some of the big companies 49 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:48,240 Speaker 1: and retailers around the country. So it does range from 50 00:02:48,400 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 1: some of the big businesses that we know about to 51 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:55,880 Speaker 1: smaller businesses, and the bosses of those businesses that might 52 00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: employ just five or six people can join up to 53 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:03,480 Speaker 1: this association. But it's not an association for retail workers. 54 00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:06,679 Speaker 1: I'll just sort of make that point as a point 55 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 1: of clarity. So when I talk about retail awards, which 56 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 1: is the next thing I mentioned in my word salad, there, 57 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:18,360 Speaker 1: an award is the formal set of conditions and pay 58 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: arrangements for retail staff or staff in a particular industry. 59 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 1: So if you work in hospitality, as you did, Emma, 60 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 1: you would be very familiar you are covered under a 61 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: certain industry awards. So when I worked at Macis back 62 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 1: in the day is my very first job, I was 63 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,600 Speaker 1: covered by the Fast Food Award and I remember on 64 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 1: my pay slip, I would have the very specific award 65 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: title and details, and I could go and check that 66 00:03:42,240 --> 00:03:45,040 Speaker 1: at any time to see what I was in title 67 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 1: to as an employee. So basically, what the Retail Association 68 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: has done is they've gone to the Fair Work Commission, 69 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 1: which the last piece of my salad is the Workplace Tribunal, 70 00:03:56,720 --> 00:03:58,640 Speaker 1: so it's sort of the one stop shop for a 71 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:01,920 Speaker 1: lot of workplace disputes around the country. But they also 72 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:06,040 Speaker 1: set the conditions of awards, so these specific industry awards, 73 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 1: and if you want to make changes to the award, 74 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:10,720 Speaker 1: you have to go to the Fairwork Commission. And that's 75 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 1: what the Retail Association has done, and it's put forward 76 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:15,240 Speaker 1: a number of proposals. 77 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:20,039 Speaker 2: Okay, so the Retail Association is a group representing a 78 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 2: bunch of companies, brands, retailers. They've gone to the Fairwork Commission, 79 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:29,040 Speaker 2: that's the employment and industrial regulator putting forward these changes. 80 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:33,440 Speaker 2: So what is the Retail Association pushing to change? 81 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:37,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, so there were initially seventeen proposed changes that the 82 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: Retail Association was calling for. They range from some very 83 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: technical sort of wording in the retail awards. So as 84 00:04:44,960 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 1: it stands, you can agree to certain things with your 85 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:50,680 Speaker 1: employer in writing. Now, there are notes in the Retail 86 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:53,280 Speaker 1: award that says that in writing can also mean an 87 00:04:53,320 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: email or a text message. So what the Retail Association 88 00:04:57,480 --> 00:04:59,839 Speaker 1: wants to do is just sort of scrap those notes 89 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:03,120 Speaker 1: and say that this could include digital records as well 90 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:05,640 Speaker 1: as written records. Very technical thing. 91 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:08,360 Speaker 2: Just modernizing, making it a bit clearer. 92 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:11,039 Speaker 1: Absolutely, Okay, so they seem to be a little bit 93 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:14,160 Speaker 1: less controversial, But then when we get into some of 94 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:16,839 Speaker 1: the other award changes that it's looking into, it gets 95 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:20,320 Speaker 1: a little bit more murky. So one of the changes 96 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:22,840 Speaker 1: they want to make to the award is cutting the 97 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 1: minimum gap between shifts from twelve to ten hours. Anyone 98 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:30,400 Speaker 1: who works in hospitality could tell you that that's the 99 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:34,240 Speaker 1: rule in restaurants in bars around the country. For fast food, 100 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:37,600 Speaker 1: there's actually no minimum set time between your shifts. 101 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 2: So when you say like a minimum gap, you mean, 102 00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:44,760 Speaker 2: for example, your shift finishes at nine pm, that there 103 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:47,840 Speaker 2: are awards to protect workers from being rostered on any 104 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 2: earlier than nine am the next day. 105 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 1: That's right, and for all retail staff. If these award 106 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,400 Speaker 1: changes go through, that means that they could be rusted 107 00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 1: on for seven am next day instead. The association said 108 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 1: it would bring it in line with other industries, that 109 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:07,279 Speaker 1: it's pretty standard this change. And it's also looking at 110 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 1: what's called salary absorption. You can forget that word for 111 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 1: now because that's the technical meaning, but I'll go into 112 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 1: what that actually looks like. So this is a situation 113 00:06:18,080 --> 00:06:22,000 Speaker 1: involving higher paid retail staff. So we think of like 114 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 1: managers or supervisors of a store or a two ic 115 00:06:25,520 --> 00:06:29,440 Speaker 1: at a fashion retailer, for instance. So for these workers, 116 00:06:29,680 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: they would lose their rights to overtime and penalty rates, 117 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 1: so think like weekends or public holidays, and they wouldn't 118 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 1: get allowances for things like their work clothes or a 119 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,640 Speaker 1: meal break or something like that. And they also would 120 00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:47,840 Speaker 1: lose their entitlement to those short rest breaks that we 121 00:06:48,040 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 1: come to know as like a smoke oh back in 122 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 1: the day. So some workers might want to go out 123 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:55,119 Speaker 1: and get a drink of water or have some tea. 124 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: Depends what you want to do in those little ten 125 00:06:57,920 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 1: minute timeframes. 126 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,159 Speaker 2: So under the retailer will there are different entitlements for 127 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:04,280 Speaker 2: breaks depending on how long your shift is. You might 128 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 2: have a longer lunch break, but you might also have 129 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 2: a shorter ten or fifteen break to just go and 130 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:10,440 Speaker 2: chill out. 131 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:12,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, if you're well on your phone, that's right. So 132 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,960 Speaker 1: if you're working between say three and five hours, you're 133 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:18,320 Speaker 1: typically entitled to about a ten minute break. That's pretty standard. 134 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 1: What the Retail Association wants to do for the higher 135 00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 1: level managers is sort of scrap that, right, But in exchange, 136 00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:29,240 Speaker 1: these workers would actually get paid more. So the increase 137 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 1: would be at least twenty five percent above the current 138 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: national minimum standard for this level of employee, and at 139 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 1: the moment that's about fifty four thousand dollars a year, 140 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,400 Speaker 1: and that would go up to sixty seven thousand dollars 141 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:43,880 Speaker 1: a year. Gay. 142 00:07:44,040 --> 00:07:47,680 Speaker 2: So under these proposed changes, people that work in retail 143 00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:52,240 Speaker 2: management positions would forego some of those rights that you mentioned, 144 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 2: like certain breaks, penalty rates, over time, et cetera. But 145 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 2: in exchange, they would get a twenty five percent pay 146 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:01,280 Speaker 2: increase that could see salary is go from about fifty 147 00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 2: four thousand dollars a year to I think you mentioned 148 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 2: sixty seven thousand dollars a year. 149 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: That's right, and it wouldn't be an enforced change e though. 150 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 1: It's just important to note that that there would actually 151 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 1: have to be agreement between the employee and the employee 152 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 1: if this was to take effect. Okay, So, as I mentioned, 153 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 1: it could be a written record, could be a digital 154 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 1: record of just signing away that waiver of entitlements to 155 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 1: extra pay. 156 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 2: Okay. So what strikes me about these reforms is it 157 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:33,160 Speaker 2: does feel a little bit unusual to see a conversation 158 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 2: like this happen between like a body representing the businesses 159 00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:41,640 Speaker 2: looking to change the options available to retail workers, rather 160 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 2: than a blanket rule that sort of flips their circumstances 161 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:49,080 Speaker 2: and either forces them in or out of something. So 162 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:53,320 Speaker 2: why is this happening now? Has the Retail Association said 163 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:56,000 Speaker 2: why they want to make these changes and why they've 164 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 2: gone to fair Work to sort of hammer that out? 165 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:01,760 Speaker 1: Yes, So, in its very rich application back in February, 166 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 1: the Retail Association said that as it stands, the award 167 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,120 Speaker 1: is really complicated and anyone that's had a look at 168 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 1: the document might agree with them. So they wanted to 169 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: introduce some of these changes as a way of promoting 170 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 1: a bit more flexibility, making things a little bit simpler. 171 00:09:18,120 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 1: And they also wanted to make these changes to make 172 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 1: it easier to clarify some work conditions between employee and employer. 173 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 1: So that's kind of at the heart of why they 174 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:32,720 Speaker 1: are pushing for these changes. And as I mentioned, it 175 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 1: has been dragging on for a little while now, but 176 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:38,079 Speaker 1: the reason I came across it is because recently there 177 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: have been some of these really big employers in Australia 178 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 1: who have supported this move. So when you think about 179 00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:48,320 Speaker 1: retail workers instantly, you would probably think about a big 180 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:53,199 Speaker 1: business like Coals or kmart or Barbecues Galore maybe, and 181 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:56,720 Speaker 1: these are all companies that are now backing in this 182 00:09:56,800 --> 00:09:59,920 Speaker 1: move in the Fairwork Commission. They've joined the Australian Retailers 183 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 1: Associations bid to have these provisions put in place, and 184 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 1: that's all seventeen of the initial proposals put forward by 185 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:13,560 Speaker 1: the Retails Association. So I mentioned very technical changes right 186 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:18,280 Speaker 1: through to that higher end salary earner getting more pay 187 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:21,360 Speaker 1: in exchange for changes to what they are entitled to. 188 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 2: Right. I'm really interested in hearing how workers are responding 189 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 2: to this because I guess hearing this idea of the 190 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:31,439 Speaker 2: twenty five percent pay increase for more senior retail workers, 191 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 2: that does sound like a significant pay increase, especially, you 192 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:38,679 Speaker 2: know when we talk about ongoing pay negotiations across more 193 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:42,560 Speaker 2: public service work. There's been high profile conversations about that lately, 194 00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 2: and often they're arguing over five to ten to fifteen percent, 195 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 2: So twenty five percent sounds significant. But on the other side, 196 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:52,800 Speaker 2: when you think about penalty rates, often penalty rates can 197 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:56,160 Speaker 2: be a twenty five to fifty percent loading, depending on 198 00:10:56,240 --> 00:11:00,760 Speaker 2: the circumstances. So how do workers feel about a shift 199 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:03,199 Speaker 2: in their rights? What's the response been. 200 00:11:03,720 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 1: I guess the argument has been framed in that way 201 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:09,280 Speaker 1: that you do sort of give up certain rights in 202 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:12,600 Speaker 1: order to get a pay increase. And yeah, I've been 203 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 1: really interested in this question as well because it is 204 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 1: a really interesting sort of dilemma that you could be 205 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:21,679 Speaker 1: put into, because I'm sure everybody would agree that it 206 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: sounds nice to get a pay increase, but it comes 207 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: with conditions. So the unions which represent workers have come 208 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 1: out really stridently against these proposed changes. The peak union body, 209 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:37,760 Speaker 1: the Australian Council of Trade Unions, said that the changes 210 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 1: would affect one million retail workers in varying capacities. So 211 00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 1: that's from changing the minimum gap between the shifts to 212 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:51,480 Speaker 1: the higher paid managers and supervisors. The ACTU have accused 213 00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:54,240 Speaker 1: some of these big companies that have announced their support 214 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:57,679 Speaker 1: for the changes of trying to cut pay and conditions 215 00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:01,959 Speaker 1: in what they say is the guy of workplace flexibility. 216 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 1: That's in their words. 217 00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:06,200 Speaker 2: Okay, so they're suggesting that the Retail Association might be 218 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 2: trying to look like they're creating more options and evening 219 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,400 Speaker 2: out the playing field for workers. But the union is 220 00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 2: arguing that that's a bit of a disguise. 221 00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 1: This smoke screen is what they say. That's kind of 222 00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 1: their wording. I think it's just important to note that 223 00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 1: the Retailers Association has disputed a lot of the union's claims, 224 00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:28,720 Speaker 1: especially that this would lead to lower wages and poorer conditions. 225 00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 1: They point to some other industry awards that have similar 226 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:35,640 Speaker 1: arrangements in place and say that that has been broadly successful. 227 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:40,319 Speaker 1: But whenever we talk about workplace relations or workplace disputes, 228 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,200 Speaker 1: I feel like it gets political pretty quickly, and the 229 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:46,800 Speaker 1: unions have already linked to this case to the upcoming 230 00:12:46,800 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 1: federal election, which needs to be held by the seventeenth 231 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:54,360 Speaker 1: of May. For anyone that needs reminding, the ACTU assistant 232 00:12:54,400 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 1: Secretary Joseph Mitchell said Australians deserve to know which side 233 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 1: their politicians are on. Are they on the side of 234 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: big business profitiers seeking to cut people's wages or on 235 00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 1: the side of cost of living relief measures that have 236 00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:12,520 Speaker 1: got wages moving again, that's in Joseph Mitchell's words. I've 237 00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:14,599 Speaker 1: tried to get this answer for him because I was 238 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: really curious what our politicians are thinking about this matter. 239 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 1: So the Employment Minister Murray Watt told TDA that he 240 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:24,000 Speaker 1: does have some concerns about the case at the moment, 241 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:27,479 Speaker 1: especially if it's going to mean some changes to worker entitlements. 242 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:30,480 Speaker 1: He also said he had a question for the coalition 243 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:33,520 Speaker 1: he pivoted to asking whether if they won the election, 244 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:37,840 Speaker 1: would they protect big businesses cutting workers' wages during a 245 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 1: cost of living squeeze. So I heard back from Murray 246 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:45,520 Speaker 1: Watt's counterpart, who is the Shadow Employment Minister, Michaylia Cash, 247 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 1: who dismissed his remarks, saying that it's just a baseless 248 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:53,320 Speaker 1: scare campaign in her words, driven by the government and 249 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:54,160 Speaker 1: the unions. 250 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 2: Okay, so some pretty strong words from both the government 251 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 2: and the opposition and the Business Association. The Retailers Association, 252 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:10,079 Speaker 2: So when are we expecting an outcome? It doesn't sound 253 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,920 Speaker 2: like there are many people on the same page in 254 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:16,359 Speaker 2: this debate. It is ongoing in the Fair Work Commission. 255 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 2: Is there a resolve in sight? 256 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:22,160 Speaker 1: Well, there will be a case hearing over ten days 257 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 1: starting on the seventeenth of March, and I'll definitely be 258 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 1: keeping a close eye on it. But while I'm at it, 259 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: I just wanted to mention there's another case that's really 260 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 1: grabbed my attention in recent days, and that involves former 261 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:38,800 Speaker 1: staff at the jewelry company Levisa. 262 00:14:38,080 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 2: As a woman of a certain age who may or 263 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 2: may not have purchased a lot of jewelry from Levisa 264 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 2: after school, or may have been adorned in her year 265 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:51,360 Speaker 2: ten formal jewelry by Levisa. I was very interested in 266 00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:54,400 Speaker 2: this story because along with this fair work story, that's 267 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 2: some pretty high profile businesses caught up in a kind 268 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 2: of retail conversation at the moment about worker entitlements. 269 00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, you go to many malls in or shopping 270 00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:06,640 Speaker 1: centers in Australia, you'll probably stumble across all a visa. 271 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:08,720 Speaker 2: So it's yeah, absolutely. 272 00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:10,080 Speaker 1: Something that I feel like affects a lot of people 273 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 1: in the country. 274 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 2: So what's happening with these former staff. 275 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:17,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, so these Lavisa workers or former employees have taken 276 00:15:17,640 --> 00:15:20,640 Speaker 1: the company to the Federal Court over allegations that they 277 00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 1: were underpaid and exploited. So this is a class action 278 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 1: involving more than three hundred people who had worked at 279 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 1: Laviza places like Canberra and Melbourne. And these were employees 280 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:36,920 Speaker 1: who had worked there between twenty eighteen and twenty twenty four. 281 00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:40,400 Speaker 1: So the court documents spell out some of the allegations 282 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 1: against Laviza. So these workers are accusing the company of 283 00:15:43,720 --> 00:15:47,280 Speaker 1: failing to pay them minimum wages, telling staff not to 284 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 1: take meal or toilet brakes, and not paying overtime. There 285 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: are also some really fascinating stories which I must add 286 00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 1: up all allegations of this stage. But this involves a 287 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 1: manager going to another store to close up because the 288 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 1: staff that had been there at the time weren't fully 289 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 1: trained or experienced enough to close up a store, so 290 00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 1: just knowing the end of day procedures and practices, and 291 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 1: this worker claims that they had to go back to 292 00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: their original store after doing that and perform a similar task. 293 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 1: What is being alleged is that when traveling between these stores. 294 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 1: You're normally entitled to a travel allowance, so that's just 295 00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 1: to pay for fuel that you've used to help out 296 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 1: the company. These personal alledg is that Levisa never paid 297 00:16:32,560 --> 00:16:34,680 Speaker 1: them for traveling between the stores. 298 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:37,520 Speaker 2: So the claim is that they were someone with enough 299 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:41,400 Speaker 2: experience to close up the shop that understaffing issues meant 300 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:44,040 Speaker 2: that there weren't those senior people in other stores, and 301 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:47,840 Speaker 2: they've had to kind of go between different shops allegedly 302 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:51,640 Speaker 2: to be that senior person, but haven't been adequately compensated 303 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 2: for their. 304 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:55,200 Speaker 1: Travel time exactly right, And those kind of stories is 305 00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 1: what's being heard at the moment in the federal court 306 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:00,880 Speaker 1: and tested against evidence. Of course, one of these other 307 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,240 Speaker 1: stories that really stood out to me was that as 308 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:06,080 Speaker 1: a Lavisa employee, you have to wear sometimes up to 309 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:10,200 Speaker 1: five pieces of jewelry. It's all part of the merchandising 310 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:12,920 Speaker 1: and branding of the company. So what some of these 311 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 1: workers are alleging is that there was a common plastic 312 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:19,159 Speaker 1: bag of jewelry for the staff to wear when they 313 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:22,640 Speaker 1: were working, and when they would wear some of this jewelry, 314 00:17:22,680 --> 00:17:26,560 Speaker 1: it would turn their skin grain. So I'm sure anyone 315 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:29,840 Speaker 1: who has had jewelry that has gotten a bit old 316 00:17:29,960 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 1: or something can probably relate to this experience. And so 317 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:35,359 Speaker 1: what some of the stuff would do was then buy 318 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:39,000 Speaker 1: their own Levisa jewelry and under the rules and under 319 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:42,439 Speaker 1: the conditions of working there, they were expected to be 320 00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:46,400 Speaker 1: compensated for that jewelry. But they alleged that Levisa never 321 00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:49,359 Speaker 1: reimburse them for the cost of the jewelry, interesting, which 322 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 1: they under the rules as well, also had to wear 323 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:55,600 Speaker 1: if they were going to be serving customers and helping 324 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 1: people out around the store, they needed to be wearing. 325 00:17:57,760 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 1: This story, so sort of stuck in a bind there. 326 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,679 Speaker 2: I'm always really interested in how different brands kind of 327 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 2: set the rules for things like uniform and presentation, because 328 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 2: when we're talking about retail, particularly fashion retail, you know, 329 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:16,640 Speaker 2: it's almost like the employees are physical visual merchandising products themselves. 330 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:18,640 Speaker 2: You know, you walk into a shop, you see someone 331 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:20,960 Speaker 2: wearing something looks great, you want to know that you 332 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:24,919 Speaker 2: can get it too. So it is fascinating to learn allegedly, 333 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 2: you know, the claims of how the machine kind of 334 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 2: works from the inside. 335 00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 1: Absolutely, and it is important to note that Lavisa has 336 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 1: acknowledged the lawsuit and said, it'll defend itself against the claims. 337 00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:39,840 Speaker 1: So Emma, I'm going to be toggling between the Fair 338 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:43,119 Speaker 1: Work Commission, the Federal Court and Federal Parliament over the 339 00:18:43,119 --> 00:18:45,480 Speaker 1: next few months, so you'll know where to find me 340 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:46,399 Speaker 1: if you're looking for me. 341 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Harry. It sounds like you're going 342 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 2: to have a great time. 343 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:53,080 Speaker 1: Ah, I sure will. All these things that keep the 344 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:54,240 Speaker 1: country going, isn't it. 345 00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:57,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, the important stories that Matta. Thank you so much 346 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:00,560 Speaker 2: for breaking that down for us, Harry. Some real big 347 00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:04,680 Speaker 2: and complicated cases there, but all of you know, national 348 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:08,520 Speaker 2: scale and ongoing, and we will keep you updated. As 349 00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 2: Harry mentioned, thank you so much for listening to today's 350 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:15,400 Speaker 2: episode of The Daily os. If you learn something, feel 351 00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:17,679 Speaker 2: free to share it with a friend. Don't forget to 352 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:20,760 Speaker 2: subscribe or follow wherever you listen to the podcast or 353 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:24,520 Speaker 2: if you're watching us over on YouTube. Hello. We will 354 00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:27,119 Speaker 2: be back later on today with the evening headlines, but 355 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:29,040 Speaker 2: until then, have a fabulous day. 356 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 1: My name is Lily Madden and I'm a proud Arunda 357 00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:39,840 Speaker 1: bunge lung Kalkotin woman from Gadigl Country. The Daily oz 358 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: acknowledges that this podcast is recorded on the lands of 359 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 1: the Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and 360 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 1: Torres Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to 361 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 1: the first peoples of these countries, both past and present.