Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to the Sitdown. I'm Viv Christy from
Speaker 1: Australian Tennis magazine and great to be joined by Matt
Speaker 1: Trolope of oz open dot Com.
Speaker 2: Hey Matt, Hi, Viv, how are you doing.
Speaker 1: I'm great, Thank you Great to be joining you again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's always good. Another episode of the sit Down
Speaker 2: this week and we got the chance to chat to
Speaker 2: one of the game's most esteemed coaches. Tell us what's
Speaker 2: in store for listeners today.
Speaker 1: We were lucky enough to talk to Wim Faset, who,
Speaker 1: as you say, is a superstar of the coaching world.
Speaker 1: He's coached the likes of Kim Kleister's, Victoria Azarenka, Simona
Speaker 1: Hallop and Angelie Kerber and we caught up with Whim.
Speaker 1: He talked about his current role, of course as coach
Speaker 1: to Naomi Osaka, as well as other aspects of the game.
Speaker 1: So let's hear what he has to say. Wim, thanks
Speaker 1: for joining us on the sit Down. It's great to
Speaker 1: have you here. I know it's very early on your
Speaker 1: side of the world. We thought we'd start with talking
Speaker 1: about your relationship with Naomi Osaka this year and what
Speaker 1: you make of her comeback season so far.
Speaker 3: Well, super happy. I was super happy to join Know
Speaker 3: Me again in October. It's it's a really fun project
Speaker 3: where the first part was already really great. We work
Speaker 3: together from from nineteen until the end of or the
Speaker 3: summer of twenty twenty two, so we had we had
Speaker 3: good success, but still I felt there was a lot
Speaker 3: more to achieve. Definitely, if you if we just look
Speaker 3: at her, I think the potential to be a lot
Speaker 3: better than she's ever been. I felt that that was
Speaker 3: very clear. And to have this this check a second chance, yeah,
Speaker 3: it made me really happy. But obviously see it was
Speaker 3: a start from zero again after giving birth and actually
Speaker 3: just starting a few months later, and that was definitely
Speaker 3: very very challenging. And yeah, her first match was was
Speaker 3: only six months after giving birth. That that was like
Speaker 3: super early. But yeah, we we felt we all felt
Speaker 3: she was she was ready to make a comeback. She
Speaker 3: was already in a in a very good physical state,
Speaker 3: and she was just very impatient to get to get
Speaker 3: going again. And we are now a few months a
Speaker 3: few months later, I think as a team we see
Speaker 3: we're actually very happy with the progress with her development.
Speaker 3: We see a big improvements like week by week physically,
Speaker 3: also on the court, I think she's she's really doing
Speaker 3: better and better, like day by day. Obviously we haven't
Speaker 3: had like the big success we were we were hoping for,
Speaker 3: but we all believe that that is just a matter
Speaker 3: of time. So we're we're just going to keep working
Speaker 3: as we have been doing and we really feel that, yeah,
Speaker 3: we're going to have a big success this year.
Speaker 1: What's been the highlight of your first four months back
Speaker 1: on tour together.
Speaker 3: I think I mean, first of all, the best match
Speaker 3: she played was the Switolina match in Miami. I think
Speaker 3: there kind of everything came back together. That was definitely
Speaker 3: also the way we wanted to play, and yeah, it
Speaker 3: was really fun to watch her play, Like you know,
Speaker 3: we saw already in practice how good she can play,
Speaker 3: but they're kind of everything came together. So really pleased
Speaker 3: with that. But just the journey itself is like is
Speaker 3: like a highlight. So just to know where she started
Speaker 3: in October and like where she is now, the way
Speaker 3: she looks, I mean, she's physically stronger than she wasn't
Speaker 3: in twenty two, even in twenty one, I think when
Speaker 3: she won she won the Australian Open, So I think
Speaker 3: the journey itself is for me the highlight.
Speaker 1: As you mentioned earlier, you did work with Naomi several
Speaker 1: years ago. What have you noticed is different this time around?
Speaker 3: She is now, first of all, a super professional player
Speaker 3: who is taking care of like every detail. I really
Speaker 3: feel that she has the mindset now that this is
Speaker 3: her chance to make the best out of herself and
Speaker 3: to show the people are true potential and also for
Speaker 3: her to find her true potential how good She wants
Speaker 3: to know how good she possibly can be, and she's
Speaker 3: willing to work super hard for that. And yeah, it's
Speaker 3: it's a player who right now who's really very curious
Speaker 3: about like lots of things how she can improve in
Speaker 3: different ways and kind of exploring a lot of things
Speaker 3: she's doing, Let's say current nutrition changed a lot, She's
Speaker 3: doing a lot of yoga and different movement kind of training,
Speaker 3: and yeah, just through different ways of training, exploring where
Speaker 3: she can improve.
Speaker 2: It's really interesting to hear talk about this whim because
Speaker 2: I think one thing we also saw that was a
Speaker 2: little different from Naomi was the fact she entered the
Speaker 2: two fifty level tournament in Ruan in France, which is
Speaker 2: a level of tournament. She doesn't tend to play that often.
Speaker 2: We both work with Todd Woodbridge and chatted to him
Speaker 2: about this, and he thought that this was a really
Speaker 2: good thing that she did, that was incredibly important to
Speaker 2: her career. And I wonder what the thinking was for
Speaker 2: Naomi to enter a tournament like that, because of course
Speaker 2: she can get wild cards anywhere, like she could have
Speaker 2: played the still Card tournament the same week. So we're
Speaker 2: just wondering what was going on there in terms of
Speaker 2: that scheduling change for her.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, first of all, when she came back and
Speaker 3: in October when she started training again, one of her
Speaker 3: clear goals in this next chapter in careers to do
Speaker 3: better on the clay and on grass, and obviously for that,
Speaker 3: we need to spend as much time as possible on
Speaker 3: on on that surface, on those surfaces. And you know,
Speaker 3: she also made the decision that she wanted to play
Speaker 3: the Villagering Cup. She wanted to play, she wants to
Speaker 3: play the Olympics, so really busy schedule, and we, yeah,
Speaker 3: we still decided to play a tournament the week after
Speaker 3: after the Villagini Cup did what she played in Japan,
Speaker 3: and then, yeah, we thought it was a good idea
Speaker 3: too to go to Roan where you she might have
Speaker 3: maybe a little bit more chance to play more matches
Speaker 3: that unfortunately didn't work out. But you know, like just
Speaker 3: looking back, I think it was it was not easy
Speaker 3: just going to Japan for the bill the Chinking Cup,
Speaker 3: playing on hard, going to Ruan, have like a day
Speaker 3: of preparation back on bag on clay, and it was
Speaker 3: just it was just a difficult transition. But you know, like, yeah,
Speaker 3: she was very clear that she wanted to play a
Speaker 3: tournament on clay before we go to Madrid, and she
Speaker 3: wants to spend as much as time as possible on
Speaker 3: the clay, and we thought it was a good choice
Speaker 3: and I think it wasn't the bad It wasn't a
Speaker 3: bad choice, but at the end, with all the traveling,
Speaker 3: it was a little bit more difficult than we thought.
Speaker 2: And Mantini Trevison, she's obviously very very good on clay,
Speaker 2: it's a tough draw. More generally, how are you and
Speaker 2: how is Naomi feeling about her game on clay and
Speaker 2: what do you think that she does well on this surface?
Speaker 3: You know, it's it's a surface where she definitely can
Speaker 3: play well, but she needs to spend time and she
Speaker 3: needs to play matches. It's it's it's not the surface
Speaker 3: where she's automatically feeling super confident like she's on the heart. Therefore,
Speaker 3: I mean, she just hasn't played enough on that surface
Speaker 3: the last three four years and also hasn't had the
Speaker 3: success on that surface to be very confident. But at
Speaker 3: the end, she she also grew up on the green
Speaker 3: clay in Florida where she played a lot of hours.
Speaker 3: So she's she's not she's not uncomfortable in her movement
Speaker 3: and right now we see that she's she's playing a
Speaker 3: high level on practice on where we play points. It's
Speaker 3: it was a little bit more difficult, but I think
Speaker 3: you know, she's a she's a super athlete, and that
Speaker 3: that helps her on the clay. She has she has
Speaker 3: the power two yeah too, to still be playing very
Speaker 3: aggressive tennis on the clay and to to accelerate when
Speaker 3: the ball has has no pace. She's she's always been
Speaker 3: kind of a patient player. I mean, she's an aggressive player,
Speaker 3: always has been a player that has been building more
Speaker 3: of the rallies just instead of just going for the
Speaker 3: winner on the first shot. So she has a good
Speaker 3: kick surf on the second serf. So I think there's
Speaker 3: a lot of parts in her game that we fit
Speaker 3: really well on the clay. But it's it's definitely, yeah,
Speaker 3: a work in progress for the next for the next weeks,
Speaker 3: but also for the next years, you know, like her
Speaker 3: comeback is planned for the next seven eight years. So
Speaker 3: the more we can spend time on the clay, the
Speaker 3: more we can learn and hopefully also have the success
Speaker 3: that will only help her, like for the Olympic Games
Speaker 3: this year, but also like for the next year. So
Speaker 3: we're we see it as a big as a big
Speaker 3: learning or I also feel that her game will just
Speaker 3: develop more bye bye by playing on the clay. I
Speaker 3: think her game will will develop in a way that
Speaker 3: it will also help her on the hard courts better.
Speaker 3: So I'm very excited about this part of the season.
Speaker 3: And for sure, it's going to be very challenging because
Speaker 3: you're going to play players like Travis Son who's just
Speaker 3: like really good on clay, and they're just so comfortable
Speaker 3: and they know exactly what to play on which ball.
Speaker 3: But you know, it's we like challenges and we know,
Speaker 3: like we know her potential. I've seen her play good
Speaker 3: tennis on clay and I'm confident she'll be fine.
Speaker 2: Just listening to you talk about her, it sounds like
Speaker 2: that you're very excited with where she can go and
Speaker 2: what more she can achieve. That you feel like there's
Speaker 2: more to do. But I was wondering, where do you
Speaker 2: take a player who's already won four Grand Slam titles,
Speaker 2: has already been world number one, She's been the highest
Speaker 2: paid female athlete in the world. She's kind of already
Speaker 2: scaled the heights. What do you think is next for her?
Speaker 3: Where can she go next? For her, it's just become
Speaker 3: a better player and become a better athlete. I mean
Speaker 3: it sounds, yeah, it sounds maybe weird that I say that,
Speaker 3: but yeah, she has won her four Grand slams and
Speaker 3: she played amazing tennis. But like coaching her, I feel
Speaker 3: there's there's a lot more to do, and there's a
Speaker 3: lot just looking at her. You know, of course, they're
Speaker 3: they're really good players out there, like IgA and like Sablanca,
Speaker 3: Rebecquina Coco, like, I mean, there are a lot of
Speaker 3: good players out there, But just we look at her
Speaker 3: data and we want to, let's say, have much better
Speaker 3: data of her than we had in twenty two and
Speaker 3: twenty one. That's our goal to see like how good
Speaker 3: can she possibly be? And then I do feel that
Speaker 3: if she if she keeps making steps forward, that that's
Speaker 3: the result is going to be that she's going to
Speaker 3: win more Grand Slam or that's I mean, that's at
Speaker 3: least the goal, and that's where we as a team
Speaker 3: really believe in. But the most importan and it's just
Speaker 3: focus on her and yeah, showing her true potential.
Speaker 1: We recently caught up with Brad Gilbert and he told
Speaker 1: us that whether a coach is working with a player
Speaker 1: on the ATP Tour or the WTA Tour, the coach
Speaker 1: the focus is on simply helping that player get better,
Speaker 1: but others say there's a different approach to working with
Speaker 1: players on different tours.
Speaker 3: What's your view, Well, I don't have the real ATP
Speaker 3: experience doing my since I came on the tour in
Speaker 3: two thousand and nine, I have been only coaching at WIT.
Speaker 3: I do feel like I agree more with Brad where
Speaker 3: I feel like tennis is tennis and as a coach,
Speaker 3: what do you do? You try to develop your player
Speaker 3: and you know, like women and men, they're both playing tennis.
Speaker 3: You know, like and technically it's kind of the same sport.
Speaker 3: And then of course you try to analyze your opponents
Speaker 3: and find the right strategy, so that's that's also kind
Speaker 3: of the same. So I I don't think there's a
Speaker 3: there's a really big difference, you know. I think just yeah,
Speaker 3: coaching women, you know that it's it's let's say sometimes
Speaker 3: it could be a little bit more emotional, and it's
Speaker 3: it's it's how to it's it's also very important how
Speaker 3: to prepare the player before before the matches, Like I
Speaker 3: always felt that in my fifteen years on the tour.
Speaker 3: That's like putting them or bring them to the court
Speaker 3: with the right expectations, like what challenge is to expect
Speaker 3: and just to be ready for everything. So they're they're
Speaker 3: kind of let's say emotionally like very stable and and yeah,
Speaker 3: just just to to be ready for for all the
Speaker 3: challenges that day. I think that's just maybe a little
Speaker 3: bit more important than women's doone. As I would say, we.
Speaker 1: Both came to know you in two thousand and nine
Speaker 1: on the WTA tour when you were a coach to
Speaker 1: KYM classes. She was making her comeback as a mother.
Speaker 1: Are there specific requirements in coaching a player who is
Speaker 1: also a.
Speaker 3: Mom, I mean the coaching, the coaching is coaching. You know,
Speaker 3: you tried to make your player a champion, that's a
Speaker 3: ultimate goal, but obviously have you need understanding that that
Speaker 3: it's probably a little bit different than coaching a twenty
Speaker 3: year old like just traveling by herself. Right, So I
Speaker 3: do feel now with Naomi, not much has changed. She
Speaker 3: always had a good structure in her training and also
Speaker 3: at the tournaments where we start early in the morning,
Speaker 3: around eight or nine the latest, and then we just
Speaker 3: do all the work together until around two or three,
Speaker 3: and that's kind of how we've done it in the
Speaker 3: past and kind of how we do it now, and
Speaker 3: then she has she has the rest of the day
Speaker 3: for her daughter, and you know, it's it's it's obviously
Speaker 3: very important that the player has that's like, that's a
Speaker 3: good structure. But with home it was that guy in
Speaker 3: the past, and kind of with with Kim, we we
Speaker 3: did it more or less the same training early in
Speaker 3: the morning and the afternoon more off for the for
Speaker 3: the family.
Speaker 2: So hearing how you talk about coaching and preparing players,
Speaker 2: one thing that you have a lot of experience doing
Speaker 2: is coaching against Serena Williams. I just finished reading Ben
Speaker 2: Rothenberg's book about Naomi Osaka, and there was a part
Speaker 2: in it where he spoke to you about your success
Speaker 2: coaching players to victories against her. I think he've worked
Speaker 2: with six different players who have beaten Serena, which I
Speaker 2: think actually might be a record for a coach. So
Speaker 2: I wondered if you were maybe able to share with
Speaker 2: us now that she's retired, what is the secret to
Speaker 2: beating Serena?
Speaker 3: You know, that's honestly, it's a great that are super
Speaker 3: proud of that. You know, Serena, I mean obviously the
Speaker 3: best player all time, the best female player all time,
Speaker 3: so much respect for her. But yeah, I mean first
Speaker 3: step was always making the player believe that there is
Speaker 3: a chance to win. I think Serena definitely won a
Speaker 3: lot of matches before the match started and making I
Speaker 3: think making the player aware of like what was going
Speaker 3: to happen even before the match would start. You know, say,
Speaker 3: she likes to be a little bit late before the
Speaker 3: start of the match, so she she she likes to
Speaker 3: make you wait. There are a couple of other like
Speaker 3: things she would she would do before the match to
Speaker 3: really show her presence, and you know, I think just
Speaker 3: going on the court and like being there for the
Speaker 3: for the toss and seeing seeing readA on the other
Speaker 3: side is not easy to to stay calm like. So
Speaker 3: it's it's it's super important. That was the first step
Speaker 3: to be really like okay, knowing understanding what's going to happen,
Speaker 3: and then be fully prepared for that. And then yeah, tactically,
Speaker 3: of course, I've beaten Serena with I think, yeah, six
Speaker 3: different players, so all these players had kind of different
Speaker 3: different weapons are and different strengths and weaknesses, so it's
Speaker 3: always a little bit the yeah, a little bit personal.
Speaker 3: But there were I mean, if I if I would
Speaker 3: say like three things. It was obviously that she was
Speaker 3: struggling a bit with with a low slide where she
Speaker 3: has to move in the court and really getting under
Speaker 3: the ball. That was like the match lost to let's
Speaker 3: say Vinci. That was that was very clear that she
Speaker 3: that she was struggling with that balls at her body
Speaker 3: like from the return and also from a defense position.
Speaker 3: If you would let's say play the defense cross that
Speaker 3: would be a lot more comfortable than if you were
Speaker 3: able to play it like long at her at her
Speaker 3: body that she has to like get more distance to
Speaker 3: the ball, and I do feel in tight situations just
Speaker 3: the fall and was letting her down just a little
Speaker 3: bit more than then the back end. Like those I
Speaker 3: think those three were, yeah, were very important. And just mentally,
Speaker 3: she was winning so many matches so easy that like
Speaker 3: if you would just stay mentally like believing that there
Speaker 3: was always kind of a window where she was like
Speaker 3: going down a bit bitter level and that was I
Speaker 3: felt that was always the moment that, yeah, that you
Speaker 3: needed to be ready for. And because she wont so
Speaker 3: many that's just easily. She was also not too comfortable
Speaker 3: when it would go to a five all or a
Speaker 3: six all level because it was like she was not
Speaker 3: experiencing that a lot. So yeah, I mean I would
Speaker 3: say a lot of like all these things a little
Speaker 3: bit together. But I think on the other hand, most
Speaker 3: important you had to hope that she wasn't having like
Speaker 3: her very very best day because at her best, like
Speaker 3: you could have the best tactics doing those but I
Speaker 3: don't know, ten years she was she was unbeatable, like
Speaker 3: that's that's clear. She was far better than than all
Speaker 3: the rest of the game. Whim.
Speaker 1: You've had an amazing coaching career where you've coached multiple
Speaker 1: players to Grand Slam titles or finals. Do you have
Speaker 1: a sort of look back on tennis history and think
Speaker 1: I would have loved to have coached that particular player.
Speaker 3: When I when I started my career in two dozen nine,
Speaker 3: my dream is actually to coach or I thought the
Speaker 3: highest possible I could achieve was to coach Maria Sharpova.
Speaker 3: I think, yeah, she was, Yeah, she was such an
Speaker 3: interesting player. She was also like an unbelievable good player.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I felt like I would have been super
Speaker 3: excited to coach her and to make her, like, yeah,
Speaker 3: tried to make her a better player, and like especially
Speaker 3: the last yeah five six years of her career. I
Speaker 3: think that would have been like super interesting project for myself,
Speaker 3: and I think I could have been a val valuable
Speaker 3: coach for her. But yeah, that's you know, she had
Speaker 3: other great she had really great coaches during her career,
Speaker 3: and she always had like the best people around her.
Speaker 3: And but yeah, like that was definitely a player that
Speaker 3: I would have loved to coach.
Speaker 1: Here, Yeah, as tennis fans, I think we would have
Speaker 1: loved to have seen that too. So on a personal level,
Speaker 1: how do you balance your family life with your life
Speaker 1: as a traveling coach.
Speaker 3: I think I have a very understanding family. I think
Speaker 3: that that's the first one. But my children kind of
Speaker 3: grew up like they were born in the time that
Speaker 3: I was doing this, so so I think my oldest son,
Speaker 3: who's now eight, it was like two or three years
Speaker 3: ago where he actually asked me the question, like, hey,
Speaker 3: my friend says his dad is home every night, so
Speaker 3: he kind of thought that, like when dad goes to work,
Speaker 3: it's normal that he's gone for like three or four
Speaker 3: weeks and then he's home maybe a week or two.
Speaker 3: So for them, it's kind of normal. They haven't experienced
Speaker 3: anything else, and I think that's that's helping us. I
Speaker 3: think some some coaches decide to stay home when when
Speaker 3: the kids are very very young, and I think that
Speaker 3: makes it a little bit more different a girl. Then
Speaker 3: let's say suddenly the kids are three and four years
Speaker 3: old and then suddenly the father starts traveling like four
Speaker 3: or five weeks in a row. I think that's like
Speaker 3: a big shock for the family. So we yeah, like
Speaker 3: we we we we have done it since since the
Speaker 3: kids are born we're luckily my wife is at home,
Speaker 3: so she she can take care of the kids and
Speaker 3: bring them to school, pick them up, bring them to
Speaker 3: the hobbies, bringing to the tennis, the football. So the kids,
Speaker 3: let's say, they're they're having they're having a wonderful time
Speaker 3: even when I'm when I'm when I'm gone, when I'm traveling,
Speaker 3: And every year we tried to do at least one
Speaker 3: trip together, and like recently we did the Indian Wells
Speaker 3: Miami trip, which they have done already a few times,
Speaker 3: and they're they're super happy to be there and have
Speaker 3: some have some sunshine after the cold winter in Belgium.
Speaker 3: The most important spend spend time together and do lots
Speaker 3: of fun activity together.
Speaker 2: It's been really clear from talking to you today just
Speaker 2: how passionate you are about coaching. That's really come through
Speaker 2: in this chat. And I just wondered that, since you've
Speaker 2: done this for fifteen years and started back in two
Speaker 2: thousand and nine, what is it that you must love
Speaker 2: about coaching and walk tim motivated to continue? Like do
Speaker 2: you think it might be something you could still be
Speaker 2: doing in another fifteen years from now?
Speaker 3: Yeah? And when I started, it was obviously not clear
Speaker 3: like how my career would go, and also if I
Speaker 3: would get a lot of chances to coach like good
Speaker 3: players on the tour. So I don't think I imagined
Speaker 3: in two thousand and nine that I was going to
Speaker 3: be here in twenty twenty four and coaching someone like
Speaker 3: Naomi Osaka, and I never dreamed about that. But I think,
Speaker 3: like you said, everything starts with passion. And since the
Speaker 3: first time I picked up a tennis recket, tennis has
Speaker 3: always been, yeah, my biggest passion. I still loved to
Speaker 3: play every time, Like now me thinks it's very funny,
Speaker 3: but every time I get like she's still warming up
Speaker 3: and I get like five minutes to hit the ball,
Speaker 3: and I'm I'm like the happiest person in the world.
Speaker 3: And no, I think also like just my personality, I
Speaker 3: love to I love to I love to give, And
Speaker 3: I think the coaching role is like the the perfect
Speaker 3: role for me. Where I am I'm in the background,
Speaker 3: like trying to to help as much as possible and
Speaker 3: with my with my knowledge, but also with my passion
Speaker 3: and give the give the energy to the player and
Speaker 3: let her feel the passion as well. And yeah, just
Speaker 3: also with with the ambition I have to, yeah, to
Speaker 3: win Grand Slams and to to make the player the
Speaker 3: number one in the world if possible. But yeah, that's
Speaker 3: I think that's the whole package. Yeah, fits me really well.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Wim. It's been great to talk
Speaker 1: to you, and good luck for the weeks and the
Speaker 1: months ahead.
Speaker 3: Thank you very much, both of you.
Speaker 1: So, Matt's some absolute nuggets there from Whim, and I
Speaker 1: loved hearing in particular that the player he would have
Speaker 1: loved to have coached was Maria Sharapova.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought that was really interesting, and yeah, it
Speaker 2: was just absolutely fascinating to know because we'd spoken about
Speaker 2: his success coaching players against Serena, but on the flip side,
Speaker 2: Sharapova notoriously struggled against Serena and I think lost their
Speaker 2: last nineteen matches in a row. So, you know, would
Speaker 2: if Wim had have been working with Maria, would he
Speaker 2: have helped her make a dent in that head to
Speaker 2: head I don't know, and that's something we'll never know,
Speaker 2: but fascinating to contemplate.
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, And what we do know is we'll be
Speaker 1: back next week with another episode of the sit Down,
Speaker 1: and in the meantime, you can listen to John and
Speaker 1: the team on the AO Show weekly this Thursday, and.
Speaker 2: For details on how to contact us, you'll find them
Speaker 2: in the show notes. And in the meantime, please subscribe,
Speaker 2: rate and review Good to see if you next week.
Speaker 1: Look forward to it, Matt oh mm hmm.