1 00:00:02,450 --> 00:00:05,150 Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to The Sit Down. I'm Viv Christie 2 00:00:05,170 --> 00:00:08,090 Speaker 1: from Australian Tennis Magazine and great to be joined by 3 00:00:08,170 --> 00:00:10,230 Speaker 1: Matt Trelope of AusOpen.com. 4 00:00:10,510 --> 00:00:10,990 Speaker 2: Hey Matt. 5 00:00:11,090 --> 00:00:12,049 Speaker 3: Hey Viv, how are you doing? 6 00:00:12,369 --> 00:00:13,290 Speaker 2: I'm great, thank you. 7 00:00:13,460 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: Great to be joining you again. 8 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's always good. Another episode of The Sit Down 9 00:00:17,060 --> 00:00:19,810 Speaker 3: this week and we got the chance... to chat to 10 00:00:19,890 --> 00:00:22,910 Speaker 3: one of the game's most esteemed coaches. Tell us what's 11 00:00:22,970 --> 00:00:24,230 Speaker 3: in store for listeners today. 12 00:00:24,390 --> 00:00:27,340 Speaker 1: We were lucky enough to talk to Wim Fassett, who, 13 00:00:27,770 --> 00:00:30,340 Speaker 1: as you say, is a superstar of the coaching world. 14 00:00:30,380 --> 00:00:34,240 Speaker 1: He's coached the likes of Kim Clijsters, Victoria Azarenka, Simona 15 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:38,379 Speaker 1: Halep and Angelique Kerber. And we caught up with Wim. 16 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:40,879 Speaker 1: He talked about his current role, of course, as coach 17 00:00:40,940 --> 00:00:44,470 Speaker 1: to Naomi Osaka, as well as other aspects of the game. 18 00:00:44,729 --> 00:00:46,330 Speaker 1: So let's hear what he has to say. 19 00:00:46,350 --> 00:00:46,870 Speaker 2: Hello, hello. 20 00:00:50,100 --> 00:00:52,790 Speaker 1: Wim, thanks for joining us on The Sit-Down. It's great 21 00:00:52,830 --> 00:00:54,710 Speaker 1: to have you here. I know it's very early on 22 00:00:54,730 --> 00:00:57,450 Speaker 1: your side of the world. We thought we'd start with 23 00:00:57,490 --> 00:01:00,450 Speaker 1: talking about your relationship with Naomi Osaka this year and 24 00:01:00,490 --> 00:01:03,010 Speaker 1: what you make of her comeback season so far. 25 00:01:03,550 --> 00:01:06,789 Speaker 2: Well, I'm super happy. I was super happy to join 26 00:01:06,810 --> 00:01:12,540 Speaker 2: Naomi again in October. It's a really fun project where 27 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:16,190 Speaker 2: the first part is Um, was already really great when 28 00:01:16,209 --> 00:01:19,250 Speaker 2: we worked together from, from 19 until the end of, um, 29 00:01:19,890 --> 00:01:25,740 Speaker 2: or the summer of, um, 20, um, 22. So we had, uh, 30 00:01:25,810 --> 00:01:28,060 Speaker 2: we had good success, but still I felt there was 31 00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 2: a lot more to achieve. Uh, definitely if you, if 32 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:35,060 Speaker 2: we just look at her, I think, um, the, um, 33 00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:37,800 Speaker 2: the potential to be a lot better than she's ever been. 34 00:01:37,900 --> 00:01:40,390 Speaker 2: I felt that was, that was very clear. And to 35 00:01:40,410 --> 00:01:47,420 Speaker 2: have this second chance, yeah, made me really happy. But obviously, 36 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:51,180 Speaker 2: it was a start from zero again after giving birth 37 00:01:52,180 --> 00:01:56,680 Speaker 2: and actually just starting a few months later. That was 38 00:01:56,720 --> 00:02:02,290 Speaker 2: definitely very, very challenging. And yeah, her first match was... 39 00:02:03,090 --> 00:02:05,930 Speaker 2: was only six months after giving birth. So that was 40 00:02:05,970 --> 00:02:10,010 Speaker 2: like super early. But, um, yeah, we, we felt, um, 41 00:02:10,070 --> 00:02:12,110 Speaker 2: we all felt she was, she was ready to make 42 00:02:12,150 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 2: a comeback. She was already in a, in a very 43 00:02:14,470 --> 00:02:19,400 Speaker 2: good physical state. And she was just very, um, impatient 44 00:02:19,500 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 2: to get, to get going again. And, um, we are 45 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:26,350 Speaker 2: now a few months, a few months later, I think, um, 46 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:30,990 Speaker 2: As a team, we're actually very happy with the progress, 47 00:02:31,650 --> 00:02:37,170 Speaker 2: with her development. We see big improvements week by week, physically. 48 00:02:38,669 --> 00:02:41,590 Speaker 2: Also on the court, I think she's really doing better 49 00:02:42,030 --> 00:02:47,169 Speaker 2: and better day by day. Obviously, we haven't had the 50 00:02:47,250 --> 00:02:53,690 Speaker 2: big success we were hoping for. But we all believe 51 00:02:53,730 --> 00:02:56,850 Speaker 2: that that is just a matter of time. So we're 52 00:02:57,130 --> 00:02:59,390 Speaker 2: just going to keep working as we have been doing. 53 00:02:59,610 --> 00:03:03,530 Speaker 2: And we really feel that, yeah, we're going to have 54 00:03:03,550 --> 00:03:05,290 Speaker 2: a big success this year. 55 00:03:05,830 --> 00:03:08,130 Speaker 1: What's been the highlight of your first four months back 56 00:03:08,169 --> 00:03:08,870 Speaker 1: on tour together? 57 00:03:11,910 --> 00:03:14,150 Speaker 2: I think, I mean, first of all, the best match 58 00:03:14,169 --> 00:03:17,860 Speaker 2: she played was the Svitolina match in Miami. I think 59 00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:23,740 Speaker 2: there kind of everything came back together. That was definitely 60 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:26,940 Speaker 2: also the way we wanted to play, and yeah, it 61 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:31,919 Speaker 2: was really fun to watch her play. We saw already 62 00:03:31,960 --> 00:03:34,500 Speaker 2: in practice how good she can play, but there kind 63 00:03:34,540 --> 00:03:38,190 Speaker 2: of everything came together, so really pleased with that. But 64 00:03:38,630 --> 00:03:42,410 Speaker 2: just the journey itself is like a highlight, just to 65 00:03:42,450 --> 00:03:46,840 Speaker 2: know where she started in October and, like, where she 66 00:03:46,910 --> 00:03:51,160 Speaker 2: is now, the way she looks. I mean, she's physically 67 00:03:51,180 --> 00:03:55,300 Speaker 2: stronger than she was in 22, even in 21, I think, 68 00:03:55,360 --> 00:04:00,000 Speaker 2: when she won the Australian Open. So I think the 69 00:04:00,060 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 2: journey itself is for me the highlight. 70 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 1: As you mentioned earlier, you did work with Naomi several 71 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:08,650 Speaker 1: years ago. What have you noticed is different this time around? 72 00:04:09,370 --> 00:04:13,450 Speaker 2: She is now, first of all, a super professional player 73 00:04:14,590 --> 00:04:20,520 Speaker 2: who is... taking care of every detail. I really feel 74 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:26,000 Speaker 2: that she has the mindset now that this is her 75 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,409 Speaker 2: chance to make the best out of herself and to 76 00:04:29,490 --> 00:04:34,630 Speaker 2: show the people her true potential and also for her 77 00:04:34,750 --> 00:04:38,170 Speaker 2: to find her true potential. She wants to know how 78 00:04:38,350 --> 00:04:42,590 Speaker 2: good she possibly can be and she's willing to work 79 00:04:42,710 --> 00:04:51,360 Speaker 2: super hard for that. Yeah, it's a player right now 80 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:58,460 Speaker 2: who's really very curious about lots of things, how she 81 00:04:58,500 --> 00:05:01,750 Speaker 2: can improve in different ways and kind of exploring a 82 00:05:01,790 --> 00:05:06,589 Speaker 2: lot of things. She's doing, let's say, her nutrition changed 83 00:05:06,650 --> 00:05:11,210 Speaker 2: a lot. She's doing a lot of yoga and different 84 00:05:11,350 --> 00:05:17,770 Speaker 2: movement kind of training. And yeah, just... through different ways 85 00:05:17,830 --> 00:05:22,010 Speaker 2: of training, exploring like where, where she can improve. 86 00:05:22,620 --> 00:05:24,600 Speaker 3: It's really interesting to hear you talk about this whim, 87 00:05:24,740 --> 00:05:26,500 Speaker 3: because I think one thing we also saw that was 88 00:05:26,540 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 3: a little different from Naomi was the fact she entered 89 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 3: the 250 level tournament in Rouen in France, which is 90 00:05:31,980 --> 00:05:34,870 Speaker 3: a level of tournament she doesn't tend to play that often. Um, 91 00:05:34,990 --> 00:05:37,130 Speaker 3: we both work with Todd Woodbridge and chatted to him 92 00:05:37,190 --> 00:05:39,330 Speaker 3: about this. And he thought that this was a really 93 00:05:39,850 --> 00:05:42,030 Speaker 3: good thing that she did that was incredibly important to 94 00:05:42,089 --> 00:05:45,089 Speaker 3: her career. Um, And I wonder what the thinking was 95 00:05:45,150 --> 00:05:47,870 Speaker 3: for Naomi to enter a tournament like that, because, of course, 96 00:05:47,890 --> 00:05:50,109 Speaker 3: she can get wild cards anywhere. Like, she could have 97 00:05:50,130 --> 00:05:52,860 Speaker 3: played the Stuttgart tournament the same week. So we're just 98 00:05:52,900 --> 00:05:54,979 Speaker 3: wondering what was going on there in terms of that 99 00:05:55,020 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 3: scheduling change for her. 100 00:05:56,520 --> 00:06:00,420 Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, first of all, when she came back in 101 00:06:00,620 --> 00:06:03,779 Speaker 2: October and she started training again, one of her clear 102 00:06:03,820 --> 00:06:07,110 Speaker 2: goals in this next chapter in her career is to 103 00:06:07,150 --> 00:06:10,190 Speaker 2: do better on the clay and on grass. And obviously 104 00:06:10,230 --> 00:06:12,350 Speaker 2: for that, we need to spend as much time as 105 00:06:12,390 --> 00:06:17,099 Speaker 2: possible on on on that surface on those surfaces and 106 00:06:17,140 --> 00:06:20,750 Speaker 2: you know um she also made the decision that um 107 00:06:20,950 --> 00:06:22,810 Speaker 2: she wanted to play the village king cup she wanted 108 00:06:22,850 --> 00:06:25,870 Speaker 2: to play she wants to play the olympics so really 109 00:06:25,910 --> 00:06:31,600 Speaker 2: busy schedule and um we um yeah we still decided 110 00:06:31,750 --> 00:06:34,620 Speaker 2: to play a tournament the week after after the village 111 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:38,820 Speaker 2: king cup did what she played in japan and then 112 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:41,700 Speaker 2: um yeah we thought it was a good idea to 113 00:06:41,900 --> 00:06:45,650 Speaker 2: um to go to all, um, where you, where she 114 00:06:45,730 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 2: might have maybe a little bit more chance to play 115 00:06:48,210 --> 00:06:53,920 Speaker 2: more matches. Um, that unfortunately didn't work out, but you know, like, um, 116 00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:57,719 Speaker 2: just looking back, I think it was, it was not 117 00:06:57,779 --> 00:07:00,860 Speaker 2: easy just going to Japan for the village in King cup, 118 00:07:01,140 --> 00:07:05,130 Speaker 2: playing on hard, going to have like a day of 119 00:07:05,150 --> 00:07:08,330 Speaker 2: preparation back on and back on clay. And it was just, 120 00:07:08,710 --> 00:07:11,650 Speaker 2: it was just, um, a difficult transition, but you know, like, 121 00:07:12,420 --> 00:07:15,170 Speaker 2: And yeah, she was very clear that she wanted to 122 00:07:15,210 --> 00:07:18,250 Speaker 2: play a tournament on clay before we go to Madrid. 123 00:07:18,910 --> 00:07:21,429 Speaker 2: And she wants to spend as much time as possible 124 00:07:21,490 --> 00:07:23,750 Speaker 2: on the clay. And we thought it was a good choice. 125 00:07:23,830 --> 00:07:26,750 Speaker 2: And I think it wasn't a bad choice. But at 126 00:07:27,310 --> 00:07:29,920 Speaker 2: the end, with all the traveling, it was a little 127 00:07:29,940 --> 00:07:31,260 Speaker 2: bit more difficult than we thought. 128 00:07:31,940 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 3: And Martina Trevisan, she's obviously very, very good on clay. 129 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:37,680 Speaker 3: It's a tough draw. More generally, how are you and 130 00:07:37,720 --> 00:07:40,720 Speaker 3: how is Naomi feeling about her game on clay? And 131 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:42,500 Speaker 3: what do you think that she does well on this surface? 132 00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:46,820 Speaker 2: You know, it's a surface where she definitely can play well, 133 00:07:47,660 --> 00:07:49,660 Speaker 2: but she needs to spend time and she needs to 134 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:56,660 Speaker 2: play matches. It's not the surface where she's automatically feeling 135 00:07:56,760 --> 00:08:00,030 Speaker 2: super confident, like she's on the hard. Therefore, I mean, 136 00:08:00,250 --> 00:08:05,350 Speaker 2: she just hasn't played enough on that surface the last three, 137 00:08:05,470 --> 00:08:10,460 Speaker 2: four years and also hasn't had the success yet. on 138 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:14,280 Speaker 2: that surface to be very confident. But, um, at the end, she, 139 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 2: she also grew up on the green clay in Florida 140 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 2: where she played a lot of, uh, hours. So she's, 141 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:24,850 Speaker 2: she's not, she's not uncomfortable in her movement. And, uh, 142 00:08:25,550 --> 00:08:28,550 Speaker 2: right now we see that she's, she's playing a high 143 00:08:28,590 --> 00:08:32,650 Speaker 2: level on, on practice. Um, on when we play points, it's, 144 00:08:33,630 --> 00:08:36,429 Speaker 2: it was a little bit more difficult, but I think, um, 145 00:08:36,710 --> 00:08:38,990 Speaker 2: you know, she's a, she's a super athlete and that, 146 00:08:39,130 --> 00:08:42,430 Speaker 2: that helps her on the clay. She has the power 147 00:08:43,090 --> 00:08:49,290 Speaker 2: to still be playing very aggressive tennis on the clay 148 00:08:49,460 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 2: and to accelerate when the ball has no pace. She's 149 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:59,179 Speaker 2: always been kind of a patient player. I mean, she's 150 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:01,570 Speaker 2: an aggressive player, but always has been a player that 151 00:09:01,610 --> 00:09:04,950 Speaker 2: has been building more rallies, just instead of just going 152 00:09:05,309 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 2: for the winner on the first shot. She has a 153 00:09:09,380 --> 00:09:11,420 Speaker 2: good kick serve on the second serve, so I think 154 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:14,890 Speaker 2: there's a lot of parts in her game that fit 155 00:09:14,929 --> 00:09:20,670 Speaker 2: really well on the clay. But it's definitely a work 156 00:09:20,790 --> 00:09:24,829 Speaker 2: in progress for the next weeks, but also for the 157 00:09:24,890 --> 00:09:31,500 Speaker 2: next years. Her comeback is planned for the next seven, 158 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:35,560 Speaker 2: eight years. So the more we can spend time on 159 00:09:35,580 --> 00:09:38,990 Speaker 2: the clay, the more we can learn and hopefully also 160 00:09:39,030 --> 00:09:42,090 Speaker 2: have the success that will only help her like for 161 00:09:42,110 --> 00:09:44,429 Speaker 2: the olympic games this year but also like for for 162 00:09:44,470 --> 00:09:47,860 Speaker 2: the next year so we're um we see it as 163 00:09:47,900 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 2: a big as a big learning part i also feel 164 00:09:52,300 --> 00:09:58,689 Speaker 2: that um her game will just develop more by playing 165 00:09:58,730 --> 00:10:02,990 Speaker 2: on the clay. I think her game will develop in 166 00:10:03,030 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 2: a way that it will also help her on the 167 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:11,040 Speaker 2: hard court better. So I'm very excited about this part 168 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:14,119 Speaker 2: of the season and for sure it's going to be 169 00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:18,050 Speaker 2: very challenging. because you're going to play players like Trevisan, 170 00:10:18,070 --> 00:10:20,740 Speaker 2: who's just like really good on clay and they're just 171 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:23,760 Speaker 2: so comfortable and they know exactly what to play on 172 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:27,720 Speaker 2: which ball. But, you know, we like challenges and we 173 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:32,460 Speaker 2: know her potential. I've seen her play good tennis on 174 00:10:32,500 --> 00:10:35,470 Speaker 2: clay and I'm confident she'll be fine. 175 00:10:36,230 --> 00:10:38,390 Speaker 3: Just listening to you talk about her, it sounds like 176 00:10:38,410 --> 00:10:40,530 Speaker 3: that you're very excited with where she can go and 177 00:10:40,790 --> 00:10:42,850 Speaker 3: what more she can achieve, that you feel like there's 178 00:10:42,890 --> 00:10:43,469 Speaker 3: more to do. 179 00:10:43,490 --> 00:10:43,570 Speaker 2: Yeah. 180 00:10:44,670 --> 00:10:46,330 Speaker 3: But I was wondering, where do you take a player 181 00:10:46,350 --> 00:10:49,270 Speaker 3: who's already won four Grand Slam titles, who's already been 182 00:10:49,950 --> 00:10:52,510 Speaker 3: world number one? She's been the highest paid female athlete 183 00:10:52,530 --> 00:10:54,689 Speaker 3: in the world. She's kind of already scaled the heights. 184 00:10:54,770 --> 00:10:56,670 Speaker 3: What do you think is next for her? Where can 185 00:10:56,690 --> 00:10:57,170 Speaker 3: she go? 186 00:10:57,770 --> 00:11:01,810 Speaker 2: Next for her is just become a better player and 187 00:11:01,850 --> 00:11:05,190 Speaker 2: become a better athlete. I mean, it sounds, yeah, it 188 00:11:05,210 --> 00:11:07,690 Speaker 2: sounds maybe weird that I say that. But yeah, she 189 00:11:07,730 --> 00:11:10,609 Speaker 2: has won her four Grand Slams and she played amazing tennis. 190 00:11:10,650 --> 00:11:15,210 Speaker 2: But like coaching her, I feel there's a lot more um, 191 00:11:15,350 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 2: to do. And there's a lot, um, just looking at her, 192 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,340 Speaker 2: you know, of course, um, they're, they're really good players 193 00:11:21,420 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 2: out there, like, like IGA and like Sabalenka, Rebecca Kina, Coco, like, 194 00:11:25,940 --> 00:11:27,319 Speaker 2: I mean, there, there are a lot of good players 195 00:11:27,380 --> 00:11:31,720 Speaker 2: out there, but just, um, we, we look at, at 196 00:11:31,780 --> 00:11:34,750 Speaker 2: her data and we want to, let's say have much 197 00:11:34,790 --> 00:11:37,870 Speaker 2: better data, uh, of her than we had in 22 198 00:11:37,870 --> 00:11:41,070 Speaker 2: and 21. That's, that's our goal to see like, how 199 00:11:41,150 --> 00:11:44,920 Speaker 2: good can she possibly be? And then I do feel 200 00:11:44,980 --> 00:11:49,200 Speaker 2: that if she keeps making steps forward, that the result 201 00:11:49,220 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 2: is going to be that she's going to win more 202 00:11:51,540 --> 00:11:55,270 Speaker 2: Grand Slam. I mean, that's at least the goal and 203 00:11:55,410 --> 00:11:59,250 Speaker 2: that's where we as a team really believe in. But 204 00:11:59,290 --> 00:12:04,200 Speaker 2: the most important is just focus on her and showing 205 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:05,260 Speaker 2: her true potential. 206 00:12:06,309 --> 00:12:09,770 Speaker 1: We recently caught up with Brad Gilbert and he told 207 00:12:09,850 --> 00:12:11,849 Speaker 1: us that whether a coach is working with a player 208 00:12:11,970 --> 00:12:16,170 Speaker 1: on the ATP tour or the WTA tour, the focus 209 00:12:16,230 --> 00:12:19,670 Speaker 1: is on simply helping that player get better. But others 210 00:12:20,090 --> 00:12:22,960 Speaker 1: say there's a different approach to working with players on 211 00:12:23,030 --> 00:12:24,770 Speaker 1: different tours. What's your view? 212 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:31,800 Speaker 2: Well, I don't have the real ATP experience since I 213 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:35,610 Speaker 2: came on the tour in 2017. nine i have been 214 00:12:35,670 --> 00:12:40,559 Speaker 2: only coaching at wta um i i i do feel 215 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:43,740 Speaker 2: like i agree more with with brad where i feel 216 00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:48,260 Speaker 2: like tennis is tennis and um as a coach what 217 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:50,500 Speaker 2: what do you do you try to develop your player 218 00:12:51,120 --> 00:12:54,080 Speaker 2: and you know like women and men they're both playing 219 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:57,099 Speaker 2: tennis you know like in the and technically it's kind 220 00:12:57,120 --> 00:13:00,600 Speaker 2: of the same sport um And then, of course, you 221 00:13:00,620 --> 00:13:03,559 Speaker 2: try to analyze your opponents and find the right strategy. 222 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:11,090 Speaker 2: So that's also kind of the same. So I don't 223 00:13:11,130 --> 00:13:19,030 Speaker 2: think there's a really big difference. You know, I think just, yeah, 224 00:13:19,110 --> 00:13:24,240 Speaker 2: coaching women, you know, that it's, let's say, sometimes it 225 00:13:24,290 --> 00:13:30,970 Speaker 2: could be a little bit more emotional. And it's... It's 226 00:13:30,990 --> 00:13:35,790 Speaker 2: also very important how to prepare the player before the matches. 227 00:13:36,090 --> 00:13:40,620 Speaker 2: I always felt that in my 15 years on the tour, 228 00:13:40,650 --> 00:13:44,060 Speaker 2: that putting them or bringing them to the court with 229 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:48,080 Speaker 2: the right expectations, what challenges to expect and just to 230 00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:51,500 Speaker 2: be ready for everything. So they're kind of, let's say, 231 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:59,340 Speaker 2: emotionally very stable and... Yeah, just to be ready for 232 00:13:59,660 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 2: all the challenges that day, I think that's just maybe 233 00:14:02,940 --> 00:14:05,099 Speaker 2: a little bit more important than women's tennis, I would say. 234 00:14:05,620 --> 00:14:08,950 Speaker 1: We both came to know you in 2009 on the 235 00:14:09,140 --> 00:14:11,470 Speaker 1: WTA Tour when you were a coach to Kim Clijsters. 236 00:14:11,750 --> 00:14:15,050 Speaker 1: She was making her comeback as a mother. Are there 237 00:14:15,110 --> 00:14:18,450 Speaker 1: specific requirements in coaching a player who is also a mom? 238 00:14:18,830 --> 00:14:22,390 Speaker 2: I mean, the coaching... The coaching is coaching. You try 239 00:14:22,430 --> 00:14:26,890 Speaker 2: to make your player a champion. That's the ultimate goal. 240 00:14:27,570 --> 00:14:32,410 Speaker 2: But obviously, you need understanding that it's probably a little 241 00:14:32,430 --> 00:14:38,910 Speaker 2: bit different than coaching a 20-year-old just traveling by herself. 242 00:14:39,070 --> 00:14:44,460 Speaker 2: I do feel now with Naomi, not much has changed. 243 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:47,979 Speaker 2: She always had a good structure in her training and 244 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 2: also at the tournaments where where we start early in 245 00:14:50,580 --> 00:14:54,820 Speaker 2: the morning, around 8 or 9 the latest, and then 246 00:14:54,860 --> 00:14:58,350 Speaker 2: we just do all the work together until around 2 247 00:14:58,350 --> 00:15:01,630 Speaker 2: or 3. And that's kind of how we've done it 248 00:15:01,690 --> 00:15:03,630 Speaker 2: in the past and kind of how we do it now. 249 00:15:03,730 --> 00:15:06,450 Speaker 2: And then she has the rest of the day for 250 00:15:06,510 --> 00:15:12,740 Speaker 2: her daughter. And, you know, it's always very important that 251 00:15:12,780 --> 00:15:17,080 Speaker 2: the player has that good structure. But with Naomi, it 252 00:15:17,100 --> 00:15:18,940 Speaker 2: was like that in the past and kind of with... 253 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 2: With Kim, we did it more or less the same, 254 00:15:23,140 --> 00:15:25,570 Speaker 2: training early in the morning and the afternoon, more off 255 00:15:25,710 --> 00:15:27,970 Speaker 2: for the family. 256 00:15:28,660 --> 00:15:31,890 Speaker 3: So hearing how you talk about coaching and preparing players, 257 00:15:32,550 --> 00:15:34,230 Speaker 3: one thing that you have a lot of experience doing 258 00:15:34,310 --> 00:15:37,710 Speaker 3: is coaching against Serena Williams. I just finished reading Ben 259 00:15:37,730 --> 00:15:40,510 Speaker 3: Rothenberg's book about Naomi Osaka, and there was a part 260 00:15:40,550 --> 00:15:42,530 Speaker 3: in it where he spoke to you about your success 261 00:15:42,610 --> 00:15:45,630 Speaker 3: coaching players to victories against her. I think you've worked 262 00:15:45,650 --> 00:15:48,230 Speaker 3: with six different players who have beaten Serena, which is 263 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:50,600 Speaker 3: I think actually might be a record for a coach. 264 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:53,400 Speaker 3: So I wondered if you were maybe able to share 265 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,340 Speaker 3: with us, now that she's retired, what is the secret 266 00:15:56,380 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 3: to beating Serena? 267 00:15:57,220 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 2: You know, that's honestly, it's a great stat. I'm super 268 00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 2: proud of that. You know, Serena, I mean, obviously the 269 00:16:05,580 --> 00:16:08,240 Speaker 2: best player all time, the best female player all time. 270 00:16:09,380 --> 00:16:16,330 Speaker 2: So much respect for her. But, yeah, I mean, first 271 00:16:16,370 --> 00:16:20,700 Speaker 2: step was always... make the player believe that there is 272 00:16:20,740 --> 00:16:25,960 Speaker 2: a chance to win i think serena definitely won a 273 00:16:25,980 --> 00:16:30,460 Speaker 2: lot of matches before the match started and making i 274 00:16:31,030 --> 00:16:35,450 Speaker 2: think making the player aware of like what was going 275 00:16:35,490 --> 00:16:38,390 Speaker 2: to happen even before the match would start you know 276 00:16:39,290 --> 00:16:42,290 Speaker 2: say she likes to be a little bit late before 277 00:16:42,310 --> 00:16:44,410 Speaker 2: the start of the match. So she, she, she likes 278 00:16:44,430 --> 00:16:47,710 Speaker 2: to make you wait. Um, there are a couple of 279 00:16:47,790 --> 00:16:50,510 Speaker 2: other like things she would, she would do before the 280 00:16:50,550 --> 00:16:54,350 Speaker 2: match to really show her presence. And I know, I 281 00:16:54,390 --> 00:16:57,910 Speaker 2: think just going on the court and like being there 282 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:00,400 Speaker 2: for the, for the toss and seeing, seeing Sarita on 283 00:17:00,420 --> 00:17:04,130 Speaker 2: the other side is, is, is not easy to, um, um, 284 00:17:04,510 --> 00:17:08,770 Speaker 2: to stay calm. Like, um, so it's, it's, it's super important. 285 00:17:08,790 --> 00:17:12,330 Speaker 2: That was the first step to be really like, okay. Knowing, 286 00:17:12,410 --> 00:17:14,710 Speaker 2: understanding what's going to happen and then be fully prepared 287 00:17:14,750 --> 00:17:20,290 Speaker 2: for that. And then, um, yeah, tactically, of course I've, uh, yeah, 288 00:17:20,570 --> 00:17:23,910 Speaker 2: beaten Serena with, uh, I think, yeah, six different players. 289 00:17:23,950 --> 00:17:27,230 Speaker 2: So all these players had kind of different, different weapons 290 00:17:27,730 --> 00:17:32,050 Speaker 2: and different strengths or weaknesses. So it's always a little bit, the, yeah, 291 00:17:32,190 --> 00:17:39,609 Speaker 2: a little bit, um, personal but there were um i 292 00:17:39,650 --> 00:17:43,359 Speaker 2: mean if i if i would say like three things 293 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:46,660 Speaker 2: um it was obviously that she was struggling but with 294 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:48,640 Speaker 2: the with a low slice where she has to move 295 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:51,580 Speaker 2: in the court and really getting under the ball um 296 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:54,199 Speaker 2: that was like the match she lost to let's say 297 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:56,649 Speaker 2: vinci that was that was very clear that she that 298 00:17:56,670 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 2: she was struggling with that um balls at her body 299 00:18:01,340 --> 00:18:04,260 Speaker 2: like from from the return and uh also from a 300 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:08,169 Speaker 2: defense position if you would let's say play the defense 301 00:18:08,230 --> 00:18:10,290 Speaker 2: cross that would be a lot more comfortable than if 302 00:18:10,369 --> 00:18:12,689 Speaker 2: you were able to to play it like long at 303 00:18:12,710 --> 00:18:15,050 Speaker 2: her at her body that she has to like get 304 00:18:15,109 --> 00:18:18,430 Speaker 2: more distance to the ball and i do feel um 305 00:18:19,290 --> 00:18:23,109 Speaker 2: in in tight situations just the forehand was letting her 306 00:18:23,130 --> 00:18:25,110 Speaker 2: down just a little bit more than than the backhand 307 00:18:25,150 --> 00:18:29,970 Speaker 2: like those i think those three were were um yeah, 308 00:18:30,230 --> 00:18:34,680 Speaker 2: were very important and just mentally she was winning so 309 00:18:34,740 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 2: many matches so easy that, um, like if you would 310 00:18:39,980 --> 00:18:46,790 Speaker 2: just stay mentally like believing, um, that there was always 311 00:18:46,850 --> 00:18:49,990 Speaker 2: kind of a window where she was like going down 312 00:18:50,010 --> 00:18:52,110 Speaker 2: a little bit, bitter level. And that was, I felt 313 00:18:52,130 --> 00:18:55,230 Speaker 2: that was always the moment that, yeah, that you need 314 00:18:55,250 --> 00:18:59,629 Speaker 2: to be ready for. And, um, because she won so 315 00:18:59,670 --> 00:19:03,670 Speaker 2: many matches easily. Um, she was also not too comfortable 316 00:19:03,850 --> 00:19:05,870 Speaker 2: when it would go to a five or a six 317 00:19:05,990 --> 00:19:07,810 Speaker 2: all that, but because it was like, she was not 318 00:19:07,869 --> 00:19:11,639 Speaker 2: experiencing that a lot. So, yeah, I mean, uh, I, 319 00:19:11,869 --> 00:19:14,150 Speaker 2: I would say a lot of like all these things 320 00:19:14,170 --> 00:19:18,379 Speaker 2: a little bit together, but I think on the other hand, um, 321 00:19:19,020 --> 00:19:21,879 Speaker 2: most important, you had to hope that she wasn't having 322 00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:26,580 Speaker 2: like her, her very, very best day because at her best, um, 323 00:19:27,900 --> 00:19:32,570 Speaker 2: You could have the best tactics. During those 10 years, 324 00:19:33,130 --> 00:19:38,090 Speaker 2: she was unbeatable. That's clear. She was far better than 325 00:19:39,369 --> 00:19:40,409 Speaker 2: all the rest of the game. 326 00:19:40,410 --> 00:19:44,570 Speaker 1: Wim, you've had an amazing coaching career where you've coached 327 00:19:44,570 --> 00:19:48,230 Speaker 1: multiple players to Grand Slam titles or finals. Do you 328 00:19:48,230 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 1: ever sort of look back on tennis history and think, 329 00:19:50,940 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 1: I would have loved to have coached that particular player? 330 00:19:57,290 --> 00:20:02,649 Speaker 2: When I started my career in 2009, my dream was 331 00:20:02,710 --> 00:20:06,170 Speaker 2: actually to coach, or I thought the highest possible I 332 00:20:06,210 --> 00:20:10,930 Speaker 2: could achieve was to coach Maria Sharapova. um i think 333 00:20:10,990 --> 00:20:15,500 Speaker 2: yeah she was yeah she was such an interesting player 334 00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:20,060 Speaker 2: she was also like an unbelievable good player but yeah 335 00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,200 Speaker 2: i i felt like i would have been yeah super 336 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:26,050 Speaker 2: excited to coach her and to make her like um 337 00:20:26,460 --> 00:20:29,210 Speaker 2: yeah try to make her a better player and like 338 00:20:29,369 --> 00:20:33,470 Speaker 2: uh um especially the last yeah five six years of 339 00:20:33,510 --> 00:20:35,430 Speaker 2: her career i think that would have been like super 340 00:20:35,910 --> 00:20:39,870 Speaker 2: interesting project for myself and uh I think I could 341 00:20:39,890 --> 00:20:46,169 Speaker 2: have been a valuable coach for her. She had really 342 00:20:46,250 --> 00:20:49,310 Speaker 2: great coaches during her career and she always had the 343 00:20:49,330 --> 00:20:53,770 Speaker 2: best people around her. But yeah, that was definitely a 344 00:20:53,790 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 2: player that I would have loved to coach. 345 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, as tennis fans, I think we would have loved 346 00:20:58,540 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 1: to have seen that too. So on a personal level, 347 00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: how do you balance your family life with your life 348 00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:04,820 Speaker 1: as a traveling coach? 349 00:21:05,500 --> 00:21:09,020 Speaker 2: I think I have a very understanding family. I think 350 00:21:09,580 --> 00:21:15,540 Speaker 2: that's the first one. But my children kind of grew up, 351 00:21:15,820 --> 00:21:18,110 Speaker 2: like they were born in the time that I was 352 00:21:18,170 --> 00:21:21,830 Speaker 2: doing this. So I think my oldest son, who is 353 00:21:21,869 --> 00:21:24,830 Speaker 2: now eight, it was like two or three years ago 354 00:21:25,030 --> 00:21:28,070 Speaker 2: where he actually asked me the question, like, hey, my 355 00:21:28,150 --> 00:21:33,700 Speaker 2: friend says his dad is home every night. So he 356 00:21:34,060 --> 00:21:37,680 Speaker 2: kind of thought that, like, When dad goes to work, 357 00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:40,260 Speaker 2: it's normal that he's gone for like three, four weeks 358 00:21:40,340 --> 00:21:42,840 Speaker 2: and then he's home maybe a week or two. So 359 00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 2: for them, it's kind of normal. They haven't experienced anything else. 360 00:21:47,300 --> 00:21:52,530 Speaker 2: And I think that's helping us. I think some coaches 361 00:21:52,590 --> 00:21:56,690 Speaker 2: decide to stay home when the kids are very, very young. 362 00:21:57,850 --> 00:21:59,770 Speaker 2: And I think that makes it a little bit more 363 00:21:59,830 --> 00:22:02,710 Speaker 2: difficult than normal. let's say suddenly the kids are three 364 00:22:02,730 --> 00:22:05,520 Speaker 2: and four years old and then suddenly the father starts 365 00:22:05,980 --> 00:22:08,080 Speaker 2: traveling like four or five weeks in a row. I 366 00:22:08,100 --> 00:22:11,980 Speaker 2: think that's like a big shock for the family. So we, yeah, 367 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:16,880 Speaker 2: like we, um, we, we, uh, we have done it since, 368 00:22:16,940 --> 00:22:20,420 Speaker 2: since the kids are born. Um, we're lucky my wife 369 00:22:20,500 --> 00:22:23,480 Speaker 2: is at home so she, she can take care of 370 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,650 Speaker 2: the kids and, bring them to school, pick them up, 371 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,159 Speaker 2: bring them to the hobbies, bring them to the tennis, 372 00:22:29,180 --> 00:22:34,899 Speaker 2: the football. So the kids, let's say, they're having a 373 00:22:34,940 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 2: wonderful time even when I'm gone, when I'm traveling. And 374 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:43,650 Speaker 2: every year we try to do at least one trip together. 375 00:22:43,890 --> 00:22:47,350 Speaker 2: And recently we did the Indian Wells Miami trip, which 376 00:22:47,650 --> 00:22:50,410 Speaker 2: they have done already a few times. And they're super 377 00:22:50,450 --> 00:22:54,140 Speaker 2: happy to be there and have some sunshine there. after 378 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:57,780 Speaker 2: the cold winter in Belgium, but most important, spend time 379 00:22:57,820 --> 00:23:00,540 Speaker 2: together and do lots of fun activities together. 380 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:03,459 Speaker 3: Wim, it's been really clear from talking to you today 381 00:23:03,540 --> 00:23:06,340 Speaker 3: just how passionate you are about coaching. That's really come 382 00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:08,820 Speaker 3: through in this chat. And I just wondered that since 383 00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 3: you've done this for 15 years and started back in 2009, 384 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:14,369 Speaker 3: what is it that you most love about coaching and 385 00:23:14,380 --> 00:23:17,469 Speaker 3: what keeps you motivated to continue? Like, do you think 386 00:23:17,510 --> 00:23:19,070 Speaker 3: it might be something you could still be doing in 387 00:23:19,130 --> 00:23:20,350 Speaker 3: another 15 years from now? 388 00:23:20,869 --> 00:23:24,990 Speaker 2: Yeah, and... when I started, it was obviously not clear, um, 389 00:23:25,910 --> 00:23:28,409 Speaker 2: like how my career would go. And also if I 390 00:23:28,450 --> 00:23:31,230 Speaker 2: would get a lot of chances to coach like good 391 00:23:31,270 --> 00:23:35,320 Speaker 2: players on the tour. So, um, I don't think I 392 00:23:35,380 --> 00:23:39,230 Speaker 2: imagined in 2009 that I was going to be here 393 00:23:39,380 --> 00:23:44,240 Speaker 2: in 2024 and coaching someone like Naomi Osaka. And like, 394 00:23:44,700 --> 00:23:48,300 Speaker 2: I never dreamed about that, but I think, uh, like 395 00:23:48,340 --> 00:23:52,369 Speaker 2: you said, everything starts with passion and, um, since the 396 00:23:52,410 --> 00:23:55,290 Speaker 2: first time I picked up a tennis racket, like tennis 397 00:23:55,310 --> 00:23:59,409 Speaker 2: has always been, uh, yeah, my biggest passion. Uh, I 398 00:23:59,450 --> 00:24:02,139 Speaker 2: still love to play every time. Like Naomi thinks is 399 00:24:02,180 --> 00:24:04,800 Speaker 2: very funny, but every time I get like, she's still 400 00:24:04,820 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 2: warming up and I get like five minutes to hit 401 00:24:06,619 --> 00:24:08,780 Speaker 2: the ball. I'm, I'm, I'm like the happiest person in 402 00:24:08,820 --> 00:24:12,880 Speaker 2: the world. And, um, no, I think also like just 403 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:16,070 Speaker 2: my personality, I love to, I love to, I love 404 00:24:16,090 --> 00:24:18,750 Speaker 2: to give. And I think the coaching role is like the, the, 405 00:24:19,490 --> 00:24:24,460 Speaker 2: the perfect role for me where I'm, I'm in the background, 406 00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:27,200 Speaker 2: like trying to, to help as much as possible. And 407 00:24:27,780 --> 00:24:30,540 Speaker 2: with my, with my knowledge, but also with my passion 408 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:32,800 Speaker 2: and give the, give the energy to the player and 409 00:24:34,460 --> 00:24:38,970 Speaker 2: let her feel the passion as well. And, and, um, yeah, just, um, 410 00:24:40,410 --> 00:24:44,449 Speaker 2: also with, with the ambition I have to, yeah, to 411 00:24:44,470 --> 00:24:47,189 Speaker 2: win grand slams and to, to make the player, the, the, 412 00:24:48,460 --> 00:24:51,240 Speaker 2: number one in the world if possible. But yeah, I 413 00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 2: think that the whole package fits me really well. 414 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:56,550 Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Wim. It's been great to talk 415 00:24:56,590 --> 00:24:58,669 Speaker 1: to you and good luck for the weeks and the 416 00:24:58,710 --> 00:24:59,350 Speaker 1: months ahead. 417 00:24:59,910 --> 00:25:01,090 Speaker 2: Thank you very much, both of you. 418 00:25:04,730 --> 00:25:08,010 Speaker 1: So Matt, some absolute nuggets there from Wim. And I 419 00:25:08,070 --> 00:25:10,780 Speaker 1: loved hearing in particular that the player he would have 420 00:25:10,820 --> 00:25:13,100 Speaker 1: loved to have coached was Maria Sharapova. 421 00:25:13,609 --> 00:25:17,090 Speaker 3: Yeah, I thought that was really interesting. And, yeah, it 422 00:25:17,109 --> 00:25:20,530 Speaker 3: was just absolutely fascinating to know because we'd spoken about 423 00:25:20,609 --> 00:25:24,109 Speaker 3: his success coaching players against Serena, but on the flip side, 424 00:25:24,250 --> 00:25:27,610 Speaker 3: Sharapova notoriously struggled against Serena and I think lost their 425 00:25:27,630 --> 00:25:31,510 Speaker 3: last 19 matches in a row. So, you know, if 426 00:25:31,630 --> 00:25:33,820 Speaker 3: Wim had been working with Maria, would he have helped 427 00:25:33,859 --> 00:25:36,420 Speaker 3: her make a dent in that head-to-head? I don't know, 428 00:25:36,700 --> 00:25:39,680 Speaker 3: and that's something we'll never know. But fascinating to contemplate. 429 00:25:39,980 --> 00:25:40,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely. 430 00:25:40,380 --> 00:25:40,960 Speaker 3: Absolutely. 431 00:25:41,609 --> 00:25:43,950 Speaker 1: And what we do know is we'll be back next 432 00:25:44,030 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 1: week with another episode of The Sit Down. And in 433 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:49,639 Speaker 1: the meantime, you can listen to John and the team 434 00:25:49,780 --> 00:25:52,020 Speaker 1: on the AO Show Weekly this Thursday. 435 00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 3: And for details on how to contact us, you'll find 436 00:25:54,619 --> 00:25:57,380 Speaker 3: them in the show notes. And in the meantime, please subscribe, 437 00:25:57,540 --> 00:26:00,040 Speaker 3: rate and review. Good to see you, Viv. See you 438 00:26:00,060 --> 00:26:00,440 Speaker 3: next week. 439 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:01,620 Speaker 1: Look forward to it, Matt.