1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:02,760 Speaker 1: Good morning everybody. Welcome to the Daily OZ. My name 2 00:00:02,840 --> 00:00:05,720 Speaker 1: is Sam Kazlowski. I am joined by Zara Seidler. I 3 00:00:05,760 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 1: hope for all of you in states that had long weekends. 4 00:00:08,720 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 1: You had a wonderful long weekend, and I hope for 5 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:12,920 Speaker 1: the rest of you that your start to the week 6 00:00:13,080 --> 00:00:16,079 Speaker 1: wasn't too bad. Let's quickly whip around the country and 7 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:18,880 Speaker 1: look at some COVID numbers. In Victoria yesterday there were 8 00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:21,840 Speaker 1: one thousand, three hundred and seventy seven new cases of 9 00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:25,080 Speaker 1: COVID nineteen. New South Wales recorded six hundred and twenty 10 00:00:25,079 --> 00:00:27,560 Speaker 1: three new cases and in the Act there were twenty 11 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: eight cases. Zara, the last time we spoke we had 12 00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:34,240 Speaker 1: a different New South Wales premier. A lot has happened 13 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:35,680 Speaker 1: since then. What's the latest. 14 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 2: After we chatted on Friday morning, we did see New 15 00:00:39,479 --> 00:00:42,599 Speaker 2: South Wales Premier gladys Bury Jiclian resign both from her 16 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 2: role as premier and then from Parliament, which will catalyze 17 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:48,639 Speaker 2: a by election. But it won't be the only by 18 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:51,199 Speaker 2: election because since then, even though it has been a 19 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:54,120 Speaker 2: matter of days, we have seen some further resignations. So 20 00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:58,040 Speaker 2: Andrew Constance, who is the current Transport Minister has also 21 00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 2: announced he's resigning from parliament, and yesterday we woke up 22 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:03,240 Speaker 2: to the news that New South Wales Deputy Premier and 23 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:06,840 Speaker 2: State National's Leader John Barillaro was also quitting. So that 24 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 2: is three by elections in a matter of days. They're 25 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:12,959 Speaker 2: likely all be held at the same time. Now if 26 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:15,440 Speaker 2: we turn our attention to today, the New South Wales 27 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:17,840 Speaker 2: Liberal Party is intending to hold a party or in 28 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:21,319 Speaker 2: ballot to vote for a new Premier of New South Wales. So, 29 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 2: as we've explained before, because Gladys Barogiclian was the leader 30 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:28,680 Speaker 2: of the party, her party will now vote for her replacement. 31 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 2: It is all but likely that Dominique Perete, who was 32 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 2: the Treasurer, will win, but Rob Stokes has announced he'll 33 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:35,480 Speaker 2: still contest the. 34 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:39,319 Speaker 1: Ballot down In Victoria, and the Deputy Premier of the state, 35 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:43,559 Speaker 1: James Molino, announced yesterday that a mobile vaccination van initiative 36 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:46,679 Speaker 1: designed to boost vaccine numbers in the state's indigenous communities, 37 00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:49,720 Speaker 1: will be rolled out across the state. They're particularly worried 38 00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:52,600 Speaker 1: about the Northern Victorian town of Shepperton, that has the 39 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: largest Indigenous population in the state and is currently in 40 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 1: a lockdown because of a COVID outbreak. 41 00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 2: Eleven point nine million five financial records have been leaked, 42 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:06,040 Speaker 2: exposing tax avoidance from current and former world leaders, billionaires 43 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:10,200 Speaker 2: and celebrities. The Pandora papers are the largest document leak 44 00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:13,119 Speaker 2: in history and if you want to know more about this, 45 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 2: we have covered it at length in Today's newsletter. 46 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 1: And in today's Good News. The Rob and Malani Walton Foundation, 47 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:23,920 Speaker 1: which is a conservation nonprofit organization based out of the US, 48 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:27,240 Speaker 1: has pledged one hundred million US dollars to the preservation 49 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:31,040 Speaker 1: of African parks. It's estimated the donation will help preserve 50 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 1: over thirty million hectares of land in Africa. It has 51 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:43,280 Speaker 1: been a massive week of New South Wales politics, especially 52 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:45,680 Speaker 1: for the Liberal Party. As we record this morning, we 53 00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:48,400 Speaker 1: are sitting on three resignations, as we said at the 54 00:02:48,400 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: top of this podcast, with the rumors that there are 55 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 1: some more to come. However, we haven't heard much from 56 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 1: the other side of politics from the New South Wales 57 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: Labor Party and that's why I had a chat with 58 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:02,440 Speaker 1: the opposition leader Chrismans about his views on a federal 59 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:05,160 Speaker 1: eyekak and how he monitors his corruption within the Labor 60 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:08,680 Speaker 1: Party and what he sees as his key role in opposition. 61 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:12,359 Speaker 1: Here's that discussion. We have the New South Wales opposition 62 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 1: leader here with us today, Chris Mins. Chris, thank you 63 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 1: so much for your time. Our audience tends to think 64 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,359 Speaker 1: that all politicians are the same. What would you say 65 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,640 Speaker 1: are the three key policies that separates your Labor Party 66 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 1: from the New South Wales Liberal Party. 67 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I mean I think the New South Wales 68 00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:32,079 Speaker 3: Labor Party at its best is about jobs and working people, 69 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:35,240 Speaker 3: making sure that people, particularly those that live perhaps in 70 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 3: Western Sydney or the regions, can get a good job 71 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:39,800 Speaker 3: and that job will make sure that you can buy 72 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 3: a house, or get ahead or travel overseas. And if 73 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 3: we really had a mission statement, if what with our 74 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:47,400 Speaker 3: primary objective, it would be that making sure that there's 75 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 3: good jobs give you enough income to get yourself ahead 76 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 3: and your family ahead. And I think other political parties, 77 00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 3: maybe the Liberal parties more focused on business, the Greens 78 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 3: the environment, but that would be Labour's core hole in 79 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 3: one if you like. 80 00:04:01,800 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 1: And so can you point to a policy that kind 81 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 1: of encapsulates that platform. 82 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:08,080 Speaker 3: The thing that we've been focusing on really closely over 83 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:11,800 Speaker 3: the last few weeks has been in tolls. Government's obsessed 84 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 3: with toll roads. With Sydney's the most told city on 85 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:17,680 Speaker 3: the face of the earth, and we've now privatized it. 86 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:21,480 Speaker 3: So it's a multi billion dollar private monopoly toll road 87 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 3: in the most told city on earth. Now we would 88 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:26,720 Speaker 3: love more money, particularly in Western Sydney, be put into 89 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:30,160 Speaker 3: public transport. So is that people, even if you live 90 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 3: a long way from the city CBD, whether there's a 91 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 3: ponderance of jobs, you can get there in a cheap, easy, 92 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,880 Speaker 3: efficient green way and just too many toll roads in Sydney. 93 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 1: So you've got another eighteen months or so until the 94 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:45,520 Speaker 1: next election if I'm twenty twenty three, if that's right, 95 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:49,359 Speaker 1: and that's quite a while to be an opposition. What 96 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 1: is being an opposition for the next year or so 97 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:52,400 Speaker 1: mean to you? 98 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:55,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a hard one because the opposition traditionally sees 99 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 3: on the news trying to poke holes in the government's 100 00:04:58,080 --> 00:05:01,719 Speaker 3: agenda and point out out glaring stakes and generally trying 101 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 3: to make fun of people, almost like a troll, an 102 00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:06,920 Speaker 3: Internet troll or something. But I think in terms of 103 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 3: COVID pandemic and the stakes, particularly in New South Wales 104 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:13,920 Speaker 3: have really changed and we've tried to turn that upside 105 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:17,719 Speaker 3: down and be constructive, not just effectively, I guess, hanging 106 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 3: shit on the government, but say this is where we 107 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 3: think the states should go, here's some alternatives, and here's 108 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 3: a different perspective on things. So we've tried to say 109 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:29,160 Speaker 3: that the opposition just shouldn't oppose everything at touches, we 110 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:30,400 Speaker 3: should come up with an alternative. 111 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 1: It's been quite a week in New South Wales politics. 112 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 1: We certainly can't remember a more intense week of New 113 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 1: South Wales politics. To be honest with you, have you 114 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 1: spoken to Gladdus paragically and since her resignation on Friday, 115 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:42,919 Speaker 1: I haven't. 116 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 3: No, I haven't spoken to her. I haven't had contact 117 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:49,440 Speaker 3: with her. But I think political differences aside. And I've 118 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 3: been really resolute about not commenting on the particular inquiry 119 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 3: that's taking place for two reasons. Firstly, it's got a 120 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,840 Speaker 3: job to do. The icac's got a job to do it. Also, 121 00:05:58,880 --> 00:06:00,280 Speaker 3: I don't think it's fair to the press we are 122 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 3: to have the opposition sort of squawking from the sidelines 123 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 3: when there's an independent inquiry taking place. But I have said, look, personally, 124 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 3: I wish you the best. That the last fifteen weeks 125 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:14,400 Speaker 3: would have been terrible for anyone absolute inquiry, just the 126 00:06:14,440 --> 00:06:18,000 Speaker 3: COVID management. It's been extremely difficult, and you've got to 127 00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:20,400 Speaker 3: give a credit for turning up every day and answering 128 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 3: questions and trying to navigate us through this difficult period. 129 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 1: And assuming that Dominique Perrote is the next premiere of 130 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 1: New South Wales, are you looking forward to a working 131 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: relationship with him? Have you had much to do with 132 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:33,800 Speaker 1: him in the professional capacity in the past. 133 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:35,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, I have. I mean it's one of the peculiarities 134 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 3: of Westminster politics that you see each other all the time, 135 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:41,280 Speaker 3: you work in the same building, and it's a little 136 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:44,039 Speaker 3: bit like your nemesis. I don't running into your nemesis 137 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:46,719 Speaker 3: every day, but he's not that I know him really well, 138 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:49,159 Speaker 3: and we've spent a fair abount of time together. But 139 00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:50,600 Speaker 3: he's got a job to do and so do why 140 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:54,039 Speaker 3: And while I'm not really interested in the politics of 141 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 3: slinging mud at Dominic Perrote, I think myself and our 142 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 3: team we're going to have better to drive the state forward, 143 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 3: create jobs and think about the future. And I'm looking 144 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 3: forward to that I guess that context and that's a 145 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 3: healthy democracy. 146 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:12,640 Speaker 1: Before IKAK started to investigate Premier bierogically and they spent 147 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:16,000 Speaker 1: a long time investigating the New South Wales Labor Party. 148 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:18,560 Speaker 1: What are some of the steps that you take to 149 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 1: ensure that integrity is being held up in your party 150 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:23,160 Speaker 1: as a key value. 151 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:25,480 Speaker 3: Well, the first one is that there is an independent 152 00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:30,000 Speaker 3: Commission against corruption. It's external from political interference, it sits 153 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:33,200 Speaker 3: outside New South Wales Parliament. It just reports to Parliament 154 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 3: and obviously there's former judges that sit on her end. 155 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 3: The Premier was very unhappy that she resigned this week, 156 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 3: but she did. She decided that the inquiry was important 157 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 3: and that was a principle that she felt that she 158 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:46,480 Speaker 3: should live up to. I think New South Wales Labor 159 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:49,480 Speaker 3: has to do the same thing, even if the circumstances 160 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:52,240 Speaker 3: mean that the party has to change or it's uncovering 161 00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 3: uncomfortable truths. It's important in New South Wales, so standing 162 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:58,880 Speaker 3: by that absolutely. The second part is we have to 163 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 3: acknowledge that changes have to be made to the New 164 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:04,239 Speaker 3: South Wales Labor if we're going to win government, and 165 00:08:04,280 --> 00:08:07,240 Speaker 3: beyond that, if we were able to form a minority 166 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:09,559 Speaker 3: or a majority government. We have to regain the trust 167 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 3: of the people of this state. People work way too 168 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 3: for their tax dollars to be spent in inappropriate or 169 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:18,760 Speaker 3: improper ways. And I think that's the big issue here 170 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:21,760 Speaker 3: that we don't want to be a democracy or a 171 00:08:21,800 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 3: government that treat or we're so flippant with people's money 172 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 3: because people were too hard to end it over to 173 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:28,440 Speaker 3: have it used in the various ways. 174 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:30,480 Speaker 1: And so taking that to a federal context where we 175 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 1: equally should think that people's dollars are too precious to waste. 176 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 1: Do you think there should be a FEDERALAP. 177 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 2: I do, Yeah, I do. 178 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:41,840 Speaker 3: There are corruption bodies I think in Queensland, New South Wales, 179 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 3: South Australia, Victoria. They all have different models, whether they 180 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 3: meet in camera or they have public hearings and the 181 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 3: circumstances of how New South Wales was first and it 182 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 3: was modeled on the Hong Kong Independent Commission against Corruption. 183 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:57,600 Speaker 3: The others have taken the New South Wales model and 184 00:08:57,679 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 3: changed it around. I think you could have a variation 185 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 3: of it in Canberra that would protect taxpayer dollars, make 186 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 3: sure the integrity of the process is above approach and 187 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 3: we've seen it firsthand inside of Labor. Labor had to change. 188 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:16,320 Speaker 3: It was obviously many people are still concerned about former 189 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:20,360 Speaker 3: characters from the previous Labor government. But that notwithstanding, that's 190 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:23,439 Speaker 3: not an excuse not to have an independent corruption inquiry 191 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:27,560 Speaker 3: that's almost a permanent royal commission in place, because it 192 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:31,079 Speaker 3: dissuades bad behavior before it even begins. If you've got 193 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:34,760 Speaker 3: people that don't go into politics with the right intentions morals, 194 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:38,839 Speaker 3: I guess they're less inclined to act in illegal or 195 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 3: improper ways because they know someone's watching all they could 196 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 3: be watching. 197 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 1: Do you think that Dykak made the right decision to 198 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,520 Speaker 1: announce their movements last week. 199 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:50,559 Speaker 3: It's really difficult for me to comment on that, mainly 200 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 3: because I just don't know the circumstances of their inquiry. 201 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:57,120 Speaker 3: I don't know to what extent it impacts on the 202 00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:59,760 Speaker 3: operations of the government and key people in the government, 203 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,800 Speaker 3: and so I've been pretty resolute over the last seventy 204 00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 3: two hours in saying sorry, folks, I don't know what's 205 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 3: going on, and I'm not prepared to comment. 206 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:10,840 Speaker 1: Chris, I've just got one more question. I think something 207 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 1: I've noticed from our audience over the last couple of days, 208 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:18,280 Speaker 1: is a real disconnect between young people thinking, well, how 209 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 1: can politicians find themselves in these types of situations? How 210 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: can they get to a position where they're having to 211 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:30,440 Speaker 1: fend off corruption and fend off difficult circumstances that could 212 00:10:30,440 --> 00:10:34,079 Speaker 1: come back to bite them. In your experience of being 213 00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:37,800 Speaker 1: in politics, would you say that corruption is something that 214 00:10:37,840 --> 00:10:40,920 Speaker 1: politicians have to fend off all the time or it's 215 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:45,040 Speaker 1: not part of the standard operating procedure in Australia. 216 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:50,160 Speaker 3: I would genuinely say that the major vas vast majority 217 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:53,840 Speaker 3: of people on me, even those who've got ideologies or 218 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:56,960 Speaker 3: points of view that are completely diametrically opposite to mine, 219 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 3: going to politics for the right reasons speaking. You don't 220 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:03,040 Speaker 3: go into politics to make a lot of money or 221 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:06,079 Speaker 3: to get rich. It's not a banana a public situation 222 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:08,200 Speaker 3: where you can get in there and rob the coffers 223 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:10,480 Speaker 3: and set up a Swiss Bank account and make billions 224 00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:13,199 Speaker 3: of dollars. It just doesn't work that way. So whether 225 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,600 Speaker 3: some people get corrupted as a result of being in 226 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:19,280 Speaker 3: too long, or making poor decisions or having poor associations, 227 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:21,680 Speaker 3: I just don't know. I haven't I think that is 228 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 3: probably a bit of an eternal problem in politics, going 229 00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:27,559 Speaker 3: back to the Greek So these things are cyclical and 230 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 3: they come back again and again. But I would hate 231 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:33,839 Speaker 3: for people to lose faith in the political process. And 232 00:11:34,080 --> 00:11:36,680 Speaker 3: I'm just as idealistic as I was when I got 233 00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 3: involved in politics. And even people I don't agree with 234 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:42,559 Speaker 3: are involved because they want to make the state better, 235 00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 3: or they want to make the country better, or they 236 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:48,320 Speaker 3: believe in climate change or they want change. They see 237 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:50,360 Speaker 3: what the situation is at the moment and they want 238 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:53,160 Speaker 3: to make it better. So don't lose heart. And if 239 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:56,520 Speaker 3: you're in any way inclined, get involved. Join Labor, Join 240 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,200 Speaker 3: the Libs, join the Greens, join the nat whatever, maybe 241 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:01,440 Speaker 3: not the Nats, but in any other political party, and 242 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 3: have a go because we need you. 243 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:05,560 Speaker 1: Chris Mens, thanks so much for your time. Have a 244 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:06,320 Speaker 1: fantastic week. 245 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:08,160 Speaker 3: Thanks Sam, all the best.