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Speaker 1: Good morning and welcome to the Daily OS. It is Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: the fifth of July. I hope everybody in New South

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Speaker 1: Wales is keeping safe this morning. It's what we're going

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Speaker 1: to talk about on the podcast today because the floods

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Speaker 1: have left us with a lot of questions about climate,

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Speaker 1: about La Nigna, and we're going to try and work

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Speaker 1: through some of them today. Billy, what is the latest

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Speaker 1: from the flood zones.

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Speaker 2: Well, as you said, we're going to dive a bit

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Speaker 2: deeper into this later on, but first, the weather system

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Speaker 2: said to have caused the flooding across New South Wales

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Speaker 2: has shown signs it will ease today. It comes after

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Speaker 2: severe rain beginning on Friday has inundated communities in New

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Speaker 2: South Wales, which includes some low lying areas of Sydney

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Speaker 2: and regional areas. In a press conference yesterday, New South

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Speaker 2: Wales Emergency Services Minister Steph Cook so that they have

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Speaker 2: begun the recovery process for communities where it is safe

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Speaker 2: and appropriate to do so.

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Speaker 1: Meanwhile, Australians lost more than two billion dollars to scams

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Speaker 1: in twenty twenty one, according to a report published by

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Speaker 1: the a Triple C. It found Australians recorded seven hundred

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Speaker 1: and one million dollars in combined losses to investment scams,

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Speaker 1: two hundred and twenty seven million in payment redirections, and

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Speaker 1: one hundred and forty two million in romance scams. After

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Speaker 1: the release of this report, the ariple C Deputy chair

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Speaker 1: called scammers the most opportunistic of all criminals.

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Speaker 2: Nineteen people have been killed while twelve have been injured

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Speaker 2: after a passenger bus in Pakistan fell into a gorge.

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Speaker 2: The bus, which was traveling from the country's capital Islamabad,

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Speaker 2: was said to have slipped after the driver lost control

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Speaker 2: of the vehicle amid heavy rain, with the vehicle falling

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Speaker 2: about sixty one meters. The death toll is expected to rise.

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Speaker 1: And your Tuesday good news. The Wallabies will wear their

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Speaker 1: first nation's jersey when they play England on Saturday night

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Speaker 1: and just a reminder that we beat England on last

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Speaker 1: Saturday night. The jersey has been designed by Camillroy and

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Speaker 1: gamalaay Man Dennis Golding, and the side will also sing

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Speaker 1: the Australian national anthem in the Ugumbar first nation's language,

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Speaker 1: alongside the US Gumbat Youth Choir. All right, let's talk flooding.

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Speaker 1: We're again going to address the fact that there has

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Speaker 1: been a natural disaster here in Australia. This time it's

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Speaker 1: the floods happening across New South Wales as we speak.

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Speaker 1: And it's these floods that have ordered the evacuations of

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Speaker 1: over thirty thousand people and triggered over one thousand requests

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Speaker 1: for assistance. Billy, before we get into a chat about

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Speaker 1: the big picture here, can you tell us a little

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Speaker 1: bit more about the context of these floods.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I think that it's important to note that

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Speaker 2: this is the third major flooding event that New South

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Speaker 2: Wales has seen in just the past five months. So

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Speaker 2: I think that language of seeing a flood once in

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Speaker 2: every one hundred years has well and truly gone out

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Speaker 2: the window this time. So I'm sure that you remember

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Speaker 2: the floods that happened in New South Wales and also

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Speaker 2: in southern Queensland in March and April earlier this year.

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Speaker 2: Those floods left over twenty people debt, and they have

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Speaker 2: during the peak of the Lenina weather event, which causes

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Speaker 2: higher the normal levels of rainfall to eastern Australia. I'm

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Speaker 2: sure anyone who lived through that doesn't need me to

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Speaker 2: explain what Linina is. But now these floods are happening

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Speaker 2: across Greater Sydney and it's impacting a large area, so

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Speaker 2: really from Bateman's Bay on the south coast to Newcastle,

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Speaker 2: which is north of Sydney.

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Speaker 1: And he brought up those keywords there, the big weather phenomenon.

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Speaker 1: We've reported about it a number of times on this

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Speaker 1: podcast and on our page. Is that the reason why

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Speaker 1: New South Wales is experiencing flooding once again.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think that this is the question that people

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Speaker 2: are asking because you might remember that the Bureau of

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Speaker 2: Meteorology said Lininna was over last month. So to understand

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Speaker 2: more about whether these floods have been impacted by Lininna,

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Speaker 2: the Daily Odds spoke to doctor Agus Santaso, who is

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Speaker 2: from the University of New South Wales's Climate Change Research

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Speaker 2: Center and so yes, he said that the effects of

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Speaker 2: Linina have increased the risk of flooding that we're seeing

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Speaker 2: right now to a certain extent. And he said that

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Speaker 2: the weather event that Linina caused meant that down levels

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Speaker 2: were high and that the ground surfaces had a high

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Speaker 2: moisture content. All of which have contributed to this intense

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Speaker 2: rain that we're seeing now. So essentially it means that

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Speaker 2: when there are these intense periods of rain like we've

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Speaker 2: seen over the past couple of days, there is a

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Speaker 2: greater risk of flooding. And he also said something else

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Speaker 2: that I thought was interesting, which was that the tropical

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Speaker 2: Pacific is still showing a Linina like cooling and that

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Speaker 2: it is still classified as a Linina event by other

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Speaker 2: forecasting agencies who have a lower threshold than the Bureau

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Speaker 2: of Meteorology to define a Linina event.

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Speaker 1: Interesting. So, just because Australia has decided that Linina might

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Speaker 1: have passed, it doesn't necessarily mean that's what's happening. So

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Speaker 1: I guess we can allocate a bit of responsibility to Lininna,

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Speaker 1: whether the Bureau of Meteorology thinks it's over or not. Now,

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Speaker 1: let's talk about climate change. Every post we put up

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Speaker 1: about flood has comments underneath it that says climate change

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Speaker 1: is real. How much of an impact has climate change

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Speaker 1: had on the flooding.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think that that's the other really big question here.

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Speaker 2: So doctor Santaso said that increased intensity of extreme rain

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Speaker 2: is consistent with climate change. Because there is more moisture

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Speaker 2: in the atmosphere in a warming planet. So when it

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Speaker 2: does rain, it rains with greater intensity, meaning that it's

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Speaker 2: stronger and more forceful, and it can cause more devastating

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Speaker 2: events like we're seeing at the moment. And this was

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Speaker 2: also touched on by Jane Golding. She's from the Bureau

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Speaker 2: of Meteorology, and in a press conference yesterday she talked

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Speaker 2: about the extra moisture in the atmosphere at the moment.

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Speaker 3: Some locations have received upwards of one hundred and fifty

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Speaker 3: millimeters and that's indicative of how much moisture is in

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Speaker 3: the atmosphere and what some locations will say again today.

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Speaker 2: So in that clip, Golding was discussing the high rain

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Speaker 2: levels that happened yesterday, but also went on to say

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Speaker 2: that they expect the weather system that's been generating flooding

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Speaker 2: to ease today.

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Speaker 1: And so the big question I'm thinking about is that

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Speaker 1: climate change is not going away, and global warming is

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Speaker 1: not a problem we're going to solve in the next year.

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Speaker 1: Does that mean that we're going to see more serious

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Speaker 1: floods in a couple of months time. Is it somewhat inevitable?

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Speaker 2: Well, I think it's important to note that, you know,

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Speaker 2: none of us have a crystal ball, but yes, doctor

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Speaker 2: Santaso said that we should be alert to the possibility

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Speaker 2: of more flooding in the coming months, So he definitely

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Speaker 2: didn't say that it was inevitable, but he said that

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Speaker 2: we should be alert to the possibility. And that's partly

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Speaker 2: because there is about a fifty to sixty percent chance

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Speaker 2: that Le Nina will return later this year, and if

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Speaker 2: that does happen, we could potentially see a repeat of

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Speaker 2: these extreme events. But as I said, it's really only

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Speaker 2: a coin flip, you know, a fifty percent chance as

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Speaker 2: to whether that will actually happen. But there's another weather

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Speaker 2: event forming that could bring higher amounts of rainfall to Australia,

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Speaker 2: which was good, which was poring out to me via

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Speaker 2: doctor Santaso, and I'd never heard of it before. It's

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Speaker 2: called a negative Indian Ocean dipole or negative IOD, which

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Speaker 2: cools sea surface temperatures and changes wind directions. But most

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Speaker 2: crucially for this discussion, it brings rain to parts of

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Speaker 2: Australia that are already vulnerable to flooding. So doctor Santaso said,

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Speaker 2: this negative iod is forecasted to intensify in spring, which

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Speaker 2: combined with a stronger force of rain caused by climate

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Speaker 2: change and the potential for another Linina weather event, doesn't

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Speaker 2: paint the best picture. But like I said, Sam, we

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Speaker 2: don't hold a crystal ball. It's definitely not inevitable, but

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Speaker 2: there are certainly a lot of different factors that are

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Speaker 2: at play here and could cause a lot of damage.

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Speaker 1: Ultimately. The images that really drive it home for me

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Speaker 1: are some of those aerial shots where you just see

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Speaker 1: you indefinite damage from floods that lasts as far as

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Speaker 1: the eye can see. We're sending all of our strength

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Speaker 1: to those in flood zones at the moment. Make sure

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Speaker 1: that you're reaching out to the SEES on one, three, two,

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Speaker 1: five hundred for emergency help in floods and storms and

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Speaker 1: triple zero for life threatening emergencies for the rest of

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Speaker 1: the country. I hope you're all doing well too and

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Speaker 1: appreciating the lack of rain. That's all we've got time

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Speaker 1: for on today's edition of the Daily OS. We hope

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Speaker 1: you'll join us tomorrow. Until then, have a great day.