1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:03,320 Speaker 1: Good morning and welcome to the Daily OS. It's Wednesday, 2 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:06,359 Speaker 1: the twenty third of March, and later on this episode 3 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:09,520 Speaker 1: Tom will be chatting to me about the fuel excise. 4 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:12,280 Speaker 1: It's got to do with how much we're paying for 5 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: fuel and if there's anything we can do to change it. 6 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:17,759 Speaker 1: Before we get there, though, Tom Crowley take us through 7 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 1: the news of the day. 8 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:22,520 Speaker 2: Sure things are starting with Independent New South Wales MP 9 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:25,840 Speaker 2: Gareth Ward, who has been charged over the alleged historical 10 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 2: sexual assault of a teenage boy in twenty thirteen and 11 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 2: a man in twenty fifteen. Ward was formerly a Liberal 12 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:36,200 Speaker 2: Party front bencher and the Minister for Families. He stepped 13 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 2: down from the role last year and left the Liberal 14 00:00:38,360 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 2: Party after confirming he was the subject of a criminal inquiry. 15 00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:43,400 Speaker 2: Ward maintains his innocence. 16 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:47,320 Speaker 1: A Russian court has banned Instagram and Facebook from operating 17 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:51,320 Speaker 1: in the country for engaging in quote extremist activities. The 18 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 1: ban immediately blocks Meta from conducting business in Russia and 19 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 1: disallows the opening of new branches. Meta owned messaging platform 20 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 1: WhatsApp will not, however, be affected by the court's decision. 21 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:06,080 Speaker 2: A passenger plane carrying one hundred and thirty two passengers 22 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,480 Speaker 2: has crashed in southern China. State media have reported there 23 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:13,039 Speaker 2: are no survivors from the crash. The China Eastern Airlines 24 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 2: flight was flying domestically from Kunming to Guangzho when the 25 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:18,320 Speaker 2: aircraft experienced a sudden descent. 26 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:21,680 Speaker 1: It's a pretty heavy day of news, so to round 27 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:23,920 Speaker 1: out the day with some good news, the Back to 28 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: Back Theater in Geelong, which has an ensemble of actors 29 00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 1: with disabilities, has won the International Ibsen Award. The award 30 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,560 Speaker 1: is given to an individual or an organization who's brought 31 00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 1: new artistic dimensions to the world of drama or theater. 32 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 2: Now. 33 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 1: The award has a prize of three hundred and eighty 34 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: four thousand, making it one of the world's richest theater prizes. Okay, Tom, 35 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:53,120 Speaker 1: So for today's deep dive, I wanted to draw on 36 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 1: something that we've spoken to you about a couple of times, 37 00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 1: and that is the cost of living. Anyone that drives 38 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 1: a car knows it right now. It is extremely expensive 39 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: to fill up petrol, but not many people will be 40 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:08,760 Speaker 1: across what the government can actually do about that. And 41 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:11,480 Speaker 1: to be honest, it's something that I learned fairly recently. 42 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 1: So Tom Can you start at the beginning and tell 43 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:17,320 Speaker 1: us what is available to governments in terms of bringing 44 00:02:17,360 --> 00:02:18,520 Speaker 1: down the cost of petrol. 45 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 2: I certainly can, Zarah. I'm looking forward to chatting about 46 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:24,640 Speaker 2: this final ways. Enjoy talking about economics, as you know. 47 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:27,639 Speaker 2: I guess just a quick refresher first. So it was 48 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:29,320 Speaker 2: about a week or so that I was here talking 49 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 2: to Sam about the cost of living, and we were 50 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:35,040 Speaker 2: talking really about these kind of big picture global currents 51 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 2: that are driving up our cost of living petrol and 52 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,799 Speaker 2: coffee and groceries, things like climate change in COVID and Russia, 53 00:02:41,919 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 2: things that happen on a much bigger scale than we 54 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:46,639 Speaker 2: have the capacity to change overnight. And I think it's 55 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:49,320 Speaker 2: fair to say Sam, poor old Sam, left that conversation 56 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 2: a little bit deflated about our capacity to do anything. 57 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:53,960 Speaker 2: I'm not sure that we're going to bring a heap 58 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:55,680 Speaker 2: more hope in this conversation, but we are going to 59 00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:58,120 Speaker 2: look a little bit closer, as you say, on what 60 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:01,240 Speaker 2: exactly the government can do. And we're talking about another 61 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 2: one of my favorite subjects, tax I think it's maybe 62 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:07,480 Speaker 2: worth starting by talking about what goes into the price 63 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 2: of petrol. So we're talking about two dollars a liter 64 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:12,520 Speaker 2: and more for petrol. What is that two dollars? How 65 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:15,520 Speaker 2: does that actually get decided? And part of it is 66 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 2: these sort of global trends that we've talked about before, 67 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:19,920 Speaker 2: you know. Part of it is whatever's happening in the world, 68 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 2: demand and supply, all that sort of thing. But one 69 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 2: of the other things that affects the price of stuff 70 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:27,800 Speaker 2: is how much the government decides to tax stuff. And 71 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 2: when it comes to petrol, a pretty significant chunk of 72 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:33,280 Speaker 2: the cost that we pay for petrol is because of 73 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 2: taxes that the government puts on. So there are two 74 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:38,880 Speaker 2: taxes that are really relevant for our purpose. One of 75 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 2: them is the GST Goods and Services Tax. We pay 76 00:03:42,240 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 2: GST pretty much every time we go into a supermarket. 77 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:46,760 Speaker 2: We play it in all sorts of different places, on 78 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 2: all sorts of different things. It's a ten percent tax 79 00:03:49,160 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 2: on most forms of consumption and it applies to petrol 80 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 2: two So in a two dollars liter, twenty cents is GST. 81 00:03:58,320 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 2: Then there's a specific tax that the government levies on 82 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 2: petrol called the fuel excise, and the fuel excise is 83 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 2: about forty four cents per liter. And as I say, 84 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 2: that's a tax that just applies to fuel. It actually 85 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 2: technically applies to the people who are bringing the fuel 86 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 2: into the country, but it gets passed on to us 87 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:18,160 Speaker 2: at the petrol pump. So that's a total of about 88 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:20,720 Speaker 2: sixty four cents I think that comes out, which is 89 00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:23,640 Speaker 2: about a third of the price of a two dollars 90 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:26,720 Speaker 2: liter of petrol. That is government tax money. And so 91 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 2: that raises the question, well, couldn't the government cut those 92 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:31,440 Speaker 2: taxes if it wanted to reduce the cost of petrol 93 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,359 Speaker 2: because the government does make a contribution to that price. 94 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 2: And that's the question that I've been thinking about and 95 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:39,559 Speaker 2: talking to people about over the last couple of days, 96 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 2: and I think it's one that we'll get into today. 97 00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:46,240 Speaker 1: Okay, so where have you landed. Is there any indication 98 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 1: from the coalition, specifically from the Treasurer Josh Friedenberg, that 99 00:04:50,839 --> 00:04:53,880 Speaker 1: the government will look to cut this I mean, can 100 00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 1: you cut it in half? Can you cut it entirely? 101 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:59,039 Speaker 1: What are we seeing in other markets? 102 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:03,599 Speaker 2: Yeah, so you can. Basically, I think sometimes economics questions, 103 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 2: you know, the answer is sort of, Oh, it's a 104 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,159 Speaker 2: little bit more complicated than you think. In this case, 105 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,440 Speaker 2: it's pretty simple. If the government wanted to just sort 106 00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:12,320 Speaker 2: of have that fuel tax of forty four cents, It 107 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:14,919 Speaker 2: would save people twenty two cents for every leader of petrol, 108 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 2: simple as that, And it is something that the government 109 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:20,840 Speaker 2: is rumored to be thinking about. We're not quite sure 110 00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:22,280 Speaker 2: whether they're going to do it. There are a few 111 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 2: government MPs who are asking for it, a couple of 112 00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:28,800 Speaker 2: state premiers have asked for it, and New Zealand has 113 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 2: done something similar. I think in the US they're talking 114 00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:33,480 Speaker 2: about something similar. So it's an idea that's getting a 115 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:35,839 Speaker 2: bit of traction at the moment. Could you essentially just 116 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:39,240 Speaker 2: sort of temporarily drop the tax on fuel to give 117 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 2: people a little bit of relief while we're in this 118 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:44,720 Speaker 2: period of really high prices. And as far as kind 119 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 2: of the literal question of can you do it, the 120 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 2: answer is, yeah, absolutely you can. But the complicated question 121 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:53,080 Speaker 2: comes when you ask what are the potential consequences of that? 122 00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 2: What are the unintended consequences of doing that? And that's 123 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 2: where this gets a little messy, And a lot of 124 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 2: kind of economists and experts that I've spoken to this 125 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:03,960 Speaker 2: week kind of warn that you know the benefit you 126 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:05,840 Speaker 2: might get from doing this, Yes, you might say people 127 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 2: a little bit of money today, but you might create 128 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:10,800 Speaker 2: a few of those unintended consequences that may not be 129 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 2: worth the benefit you get. 130 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: Okay, So Tom, the pros are pretty clear to me. 131 00:06:15,080 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: Can you talk to those unintended consequences. What are some 132 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:20,920 Speaker 1: of the cons that the government would be deliberating right now, 133 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:23,480 Speaker 1: given that the budget is next week, so a decision 134 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:25,360 Speaker 1: would likely happen in the next week. 135 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:28,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely so. I guess maybe the place to start, 136 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:31,320 Speaker 2: right is, everybody loves a tax cut when you know, 137 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 2: you just sort of look at it in isolation. Would 138 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 2: you like to have some more of your money back? Yes, 139 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 2: of course, thank you, I would. But there's always a 140 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:39,320 Speaker 2: consequence to that, not only in terms of the fact 141 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:41,359 Speaker 2: that the government was going to spend that money on something, 142 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 2: but also I think that there's sort of a I 143 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 2: guess a political dynamic at play here where people do 144 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:49,760 Speaker 2: like tax cuts, people don't like taxes going back up again, 145 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:51,600 Speaker 2: And so a lot of the experts that I spoke 146 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:53,160 Speaker 2: to this week, they said, well, it's all very well 147 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,159 Speaker 2: and good to say you're going to sort of temporarily 148 00:06:55,240 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 2: cut this fuel tax now to give people a bit 149 00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:58,839 Speaker 2: of relief, But what if they don't want you to 150 00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 2: take it back up again? You know, can we trust 151 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 2: that governments will stick to the temporary part of it? 152 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,800 Speaker 2: Because we saw, you know, during COVID there was some 153 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 2: temporary income tax relief. That's another thing we've talked about 154 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 2: on the show before. That then became not so temporary, 155 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 2: and that's sort of sticking around, and that's proving really 156 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:16,760 Speaker 2: hard to get rid of. It's very unpopular for governments 157 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 2: to raise taxes again, and so a lot of the 158 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:21,320 Speaker 2: economists I spoke to you said, well, if you cut 159 00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 2: this tax and it sort of stays low permanently, and 160 00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:26,840 Speaker 2: if you don't really trust the idea that it's going 161 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:29,560 Speaker 2: to just be a temporary thing, then you've got to 162 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 2: ask what all the flow on consequences of that be. 163 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:35,280 Speaker 2: And one of those kind of comes back to the 164 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 2: idea of why we have a fuel tax in the 165 00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:40,240 Speaker 2: first place. And you know, you can kind of make 166 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 2: the argument that taxing fuel and taxing petrol in an 167 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:45,560 Speaker 2: era where we're worried about climate change and emissions kind 168 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:49,240 Speaker 2: of discourages people from driving petrol cars. That's certainly not 169 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 2: the reason it was originally put in. It's been around 170 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 2: for decades and decades, but certainly now making it more 171 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,240 Speaker 2: expensive to drive a fuel car. You could argue that 172 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 2: there is a climate change benefit to that. And so 173 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:03,360 Speaker 2: if you're dramatically dropping the tax to try and save 174 00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 2: people prices on petrol, now, are you helping them to 175 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 2: kind of break that habit? Which you know, if you 176 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:10,760 Speaker 2: think that we need to get to net zero emissions 177 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 2: over a reasonable timeframe, you know you might be really 178 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 2: keen to have people move beyond petrol cars. And there's 179 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 2: a lot of talk about electric vehicles and that kind 180 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:19,840 Speaker 2: of thing, so it sort of cuts into a bunch 181 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 2: of other issues, and a lot of the people I 182 00:08:21,160 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 2: spoke to this week said just kind of be careful 183 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:24,920 Speaker 2: that when you're trying to fix the problem sort of 184 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:27,520 Speaker 2: over here with expensive petrol, that you're not creating some 185 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:30,559 Speaker 2: other problems for yourselves in other areas that you care about. 186 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:34,840 Speaker 1: That makes sense, Tom, And what is the money that 187 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 1: is raised through these taxes traditionally used for I read 188 00:08:38,920 --> 00:08:41,079 Speaker 1: somewhere that it was something about roads. 189 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:44,240 Speaker 2: So that's a little bit of an urban myth, actually, 190 00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 2: and I think that maybe that's. 191 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 1: Worth mythbusting here on the daily OS. 192 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 2: Worth knocking on the head. Yeah, so that there is 193 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:53,439 Speaker 2: this idea that the fuel ex ice just raises money 194 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:56,600 Speaker 2: to pay for funding on roads. I believe that back 195 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 2: in the thirties or the forties that that was the case. 196 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 2: But basically we now know it just goes into general revenue, 197 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:04,600 Speaker 2: and that's true of pretty much all the money that 198 00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:06,920 Speaker 2: the government raises. So for example, you know, people may 199 00:09:06,960 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 2: know that there's a thing called the Medicare levey, which 200 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 2: is another kind of like little income tax that sort 201 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:14,880 Speaker 2: of talked about is helping to fund Medicare. But in 202 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:16,680 Speaker 2: both cases that's actually just kind of a bit of 203 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 2: a branding exercise. That money is money, and the government 204 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:20,800 Speaker 2: just sort of raises all of its dollars and decides 205 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 2: to you know, spend it wherever it likes. So no, 206 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 2: it's certainly not the case that harving the fuel excise 207 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:29,800 Speaker 2: would affect the government's ability to build roads or fund roads. 208 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 2: Those sorts of decisions are made separately. The consequences that 209 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 2: I heard more about when I spoke to people were 210 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:37,080 Speaker 2: really about this kind of you know, letting the genie 211 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 2: out of the bottle, and what happens if you can't 212 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 2: bring that price back up. 213 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 1: And thinking towards the future. We obviously have a federal 214 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 1: election coming up. A have we heard anything from Labor 215 00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:51,640 Speaker 1: about this and be if there was a change of government, 216 00:09:51,679 --> 00:09:53,680 Speaker 1: what would happen to this tax? Could it be that 217 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 1: Anthony Alberanzi comes in on day one and immediately hikes 218 00:09:57,280 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: it back up. 219 00:09:58,240 --> 00:10:00,520 Speaker 2: These are all very good questions, Zara, and my cop 220 00:10:00,559 --> 00:10:02,800 Speaker 2: out answer is going to be no idea yet, because 221 00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:04,840 Speaker 2: it's sort of and maybe this is a good opportunity 222 00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:07,440 Speaker 2: to kind of flag the fact the federal budget is 223 00:10:07,520 --> 00:10:10,120 Speaker 2: next week, and as always happens in the lead up 224 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 2: to the budget, both of the major parties are saying 225 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:15,600 Speaker 2: lots of things and saying nothing very much specific. So 226 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,320 Speaker 2: next week is a big week where on Tuesday we'll 227 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 2: hear for sure what all of the government's policies are 228 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:23,720 Speaker 2: heading into the election, essentially a lot of their spending policies. 229 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:26,199 Speaker 2: And then on Thursday we'll get a big speech from 230 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 2: Labor with a lot of their policies and a lot 231 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 2: of their responses. So right now there's a lot of 232 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:33,560 Speaker 2: kind of indications, and both parties are giving indications that 233 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,080 Speaker 2: they recognize cost of living is an issue and that 234 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 2: they're thinking about doing things, but they have to be 235 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 2: responsible things. That's the kind of level we're out at 236 00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:42,560 Speaker 2: the moment. As I said at the beginning, we don't 237 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:45,319 Speaker 2: know for sure that the government is going to actually 238 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:47,319 Speaker 2: have this fuel X size. We're just sort of hearing 239 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:49,640 Speaker 2: whispers that they're thinking about it, and we don't know 240 00:10:49,679 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 2: for sure what Labour's response is going to be either. 241 00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 2: But over the next week or so we'll have plenty 242 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 2: more clarity on both of those questions, I think, Zara, 243 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 2: so it'll certainly be an interesting one to watch. 244 00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:00,679 Speaker 1: It is suddenly fascinating. Tom. Thank you so much for 245 00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:03,800 Speaker 1: joining us. As always, if you want to follow updates 246 00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 1: throughout the day, follow us on Instagram at the Daily Odds. 247 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:09,320 Speaker 1: It's where over three hundred thousand Ozzies get their news 248 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:11,320 Speaker 1: every day and we'd love to have you over there. 249 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:12,400 Speaker 1: Have a great date.