Speaker 1: It has been the most surreal, like, the happiest, the
Speaker 1: most like fulfilling, craziest emotional ride of my life. And
Speaker 1: it's so crazy because when I was in it, I
Speaker 1: was like, you know, everyone tells you it's wild and
Speaker 1: it's intense and it's life changing, but until you actually
Speaker 1: experience it, I just can't. There's nothing to compare to it.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Rise and Conquer Podcast. I'm your host,
Speaker 1: Georgie Stevenson, former lawyer turned entrepreneur, social media personality and
Speaker 1: personal development junkie. This podcast is for my girl gang
Speaker 1: who want to feed their mind with positive and expansive
Speaker 1: thoughts to help them step into their power and live
Speaker 1: them most authentic life. We chat a variety of topics
Speaker 1: including mindset, business, relationships, health, and so much more. Basically,
Speaker 1: wherever you are on your journey, I want to help
Speaker 1: you feel inspired and empowered to rise up and conquer
Speaker 1: your next bold move. I know that's going to look
Speaker 1: different for everyone, but just no, I'm right here by
Speaker 1: your side and that you have the RNC community behind you.
Speaker 1: Let's do this. Hello and welcome back to the Rice
Speaker 1: and Conquer Podcasts. I am back in your ears in
Speaker 1: real time with a bit of a mum episode, and
Speaker 1: I just want to chat about the first six weeks
Speaker 1: of having a newborn because it has been the most surreal,
Speaker 1: like the happiest, the most fulfilling, craziest emotional ride of
Speaker 1: my life. And it's so crazy because when I was
Speaker 1: in it, I was like, you know, everyone tells you
Speaker 1: it's wild and it's intense and it's life changing, but
Speaker 1: until you actually experience it, I just can't. There's nothing
Speaker 1: too compare to it. Like I was explaining to a
Speaker 1: girlfriend any other life event, like you know, when you
Speaker 1: get married, it's obviously super special or engaged or whatever,
Speaker 1: like it's super special, but apart from the actual date,
Speaker 1: nothing really changes that much in your relationship, like maybe
Speaker 1: a little bit. But having a baby, like from the
Speaker 1: time they're born, your life changes. And it is the
Speaker 1: biggest just slip in the face and just reality check
Speaker 1: I have ever experienced. I'm not gonna lie. It was
Speaker 1: super challenging for me, going from someone who had a
Speaker 1: lot of independence, who did what she wanted when she
Speaker 1: wanted who you know, work wise, even like I'm very
Speaker 1: blessed in the way that I create my own schedule,
Speaker 1: I have a team, so I can take time off
Speaker 1: when I wanted, and yeah, just like I'm not gonna lie,
Speaker 1: we're really amazing life, really like care free, almost a
Speaker 1: bit selfish sort of situation. Then going to a scenario
Speaker 1: when you have this newborn who needs you twenty four seven,
Speaker 1: who has to feed every couple of hours, who keeps
Speaker 1: you up at night, who needs all your time, energy
Speaker 1: and attention, it is an adjustment and a challenge, to
Speaker 1: say the least. And even though you know people talk
Speaker 1: about it, when you're experiencing it, it is. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: wild and it's very emotional. And I remember thinking, why
Speaker 1: does no one talk about this? Why does Norman tell
Speaker 1: you how, you know, crazy and tense this time is?
Speaker 1: And I think they do. I just don't think you
Speaker 1: absorb it. But yeah, I wanted to do just a
Speaker 1: bit in an episode talking about the first six weeks because,
Speaker 1: to be completely honest, I wasn't really prepared for it,
Speaker 1: and I felt a bit isolated and a bit you know,
Speaker 1: it's such this transformation, it's such this transformative time when
Speaker 1: you're basically going from one person into two people. That's
Speaker 1: exactly what's happening, and it's just it's really surreal and
Speaker 1: it's a lot and yeah, and I feel like a
Speaker 1: lot of my new mums or soon to be mums
Speaker 1: will be able to resonate and yeah, resonate with this episodes.
Speaker 1: I just wanted to do a little episode about our experiences,
Speaker 1: you know, what's helped, what hasn't, what we've learned, and
Speaker 1: go from there. Obviously, every baby is so different, and
Speaker 1: we got a call of key Baby, which is very
Speaker 1: hard and challenging when your baby is upset most of
Speaker 1: the time, and collectus means when your baby cries a lot.
Speaker 1: And paul Ivy girl had a lot of stomach issues
Speaker 1: at the start, and I was doing a lot of
Speaker 1: things wrong to be honest, and yeah, so I'm just
Speaker 1: going to go through it. And so let's get into
Speaker 1: the first six weeks of being a mum. So the
Speaker 1: first one or two weeks, like you get home from
Speaker 1: the hospital and it's such a blur. You're you know,
Speaker 1: you're recovering from birth. You're probably wearing nappies or period
Speaker 1: undees or pads. There's a lot happening down there. You're
Speaker 1: quite sore, you're very tired, and then you've got to
Speaker 1: like work out this breastfeeding thing. Something I definitely recommend
Speaker 1: is asking for a lactation consultant. When you're in the hospital.
Speaker 1: They do get you to go to a lactation class.
Speaker 1: Definitely do that, but if you're not feeling one hundred
Speaker 1: percent confident, ask for a consultant and that's where the
Speaker 1: consultant will come to your room and talk to you individually.
Speaker 1: I cannot recommend that enough because breastfeeding is hard. Like
Speaker 1: I just thought, ibe will just latch on, it will
Speaker 1: be all fine, and it's just not. So you know,
Speaker 1: that can happen, but often it's quite complicated and there's
Speaker 1: all these things like them latching properly, you know, making
Speaker 1: sure they have a good latch so you don't have
Speaker 1: soret nipples, how how long you should have them on there,
Speaker 1: so they're getting not just the fore milk but the
Speaker 1: hind milk, because it's important for them not to just
Speaker 1: snack and have a little bit then get off, because
Speaker 1: that first milk is often quite sugary and it doesn't
Speaker 1: have a lot of nutrients in it, whereas the milk
Speaker 1: they get when they're on there for longer has a
Speaker 1: lot more nutrients. Is going to sustain them. So if
Speaker 1: you find that you have a baby that just like
Speaker 1: sucks for a little bit then gets off and on,
Speaker 1: they're not getting like a full feed, which Ivy was doing.
Speaker 1: And also the fore milk was creating a lot of
Speaker 1: tummy issues for her. It's high and lactose and it can,
Speaker 1: yeah create tummy issues. So also something I realize is
Speaker 1: I wasn't feeding her enough, so like she would jump on,
Speaker 1: she would breastfeed for like maybe six minutes, and then
Speaker 1: she would fall asleep and I would think, oh, she's
Speaker 1: had a feed. I'd put her down. What I didn't
Speaker 1: realize is newborn's love to sleep. So again what I
Speaker 1: just said is I realized I didn't realize. But then
Speaker 1: she would wake up and scream and basically she was
Speaker 1: hungry all the time, and I wasn't feeding her enough,
Speaker 1: and then it was causing all these issues. And so
Speaker 1: what we then realized is we had to feed her,
Speaker 1: wake her up a bit, make sure she has a
Speaker 1: full feed, and that helped so much. Another thing that
Speaker 1: we didn't realize at the start, And you're probably thinking, Georgia,
Speaker 1: this is like so silly, of course you do this,
Speaker 1: But because Ivy was a very gassy vomity baby. She
Speaker 1: needs to be burped so much more than like a
Speaker 1: normal baby. I've been told whereas as soon as she
Speaker 1: unlatches from the boob or the bottle, we get her
Speaker 1: up and burp. So I just thought you fed them
Speaker 1: and you burn them right at the end, and that
Speaker 1: just does not work for her. We have to burp
Speaker 1: her throughout the whole feed. Otherwise she doesn't burp, and
Speaker 1: she's got a burp stuck in there and she feeds
Speaker 1: on top of that, and then as soon as you
Speaker 1: get her up, she just vomits everything on top of burp,
Speaker 1: if that makes sense. So we had to burp her
Speaker 1: a lot more, feed her a lot more, and she
Speaker 1: started to get a bit more happier. The whole sleep
Speaker 1: depriving thing is insane. You're just not ready for it
Speaker 1: at all. And also then you just get so emotional.
Speaker 1: So I had the baby blues pretty hard, where I
Speaker 1: was crying every single day, multiple times a day, probably
Speaker 1: from day three or four for like two weeks. And
Speaker 1: it's not like I was sad, it was just well,
Speaker 1: sometimes I may have been, but I was just overwhelmed,
Speaker 1: like the feeling of the hormones the love you have
Speaker 1: for this newborn. It's just a lot, and you just
Speaker 1: cry all the time. And something that I would go
Speaker 1: back to myself and say, is it's all good. Like cry,
Speaker 1: let it out and just get a hug from Tim
Speaker 1: or your parents, and it's all good. Because those hormones
Speaker 1: really do settle by week three for me personally, and
Speaker 1: during it when I was feeling all those feelings, I
Speaker 1: started to get really worried that I would feel those
Speaker 1: feelings forever and that's what motherhood was, and it's just
Speaker 1: not you feel those feelings. It's just so intense from
Speaker 1: being pregnant and the birth. But like do not stri
Speaker 1: they go and they level out obviously for you still
Speaker 1: feel like that after, you know, the first six to
Speaker 1: twelve weeks. Definitely recommend seeing someone professionally, but personally, my
Speaker 1: hormones and emotions definitely leveled out by week three to four.
Speaker 1: Don't get me wrong. I still have some overwhelming moments now,
Speaker 1: but that is so normal and I just I never
Speaker 1: I've never cried so much my life, and it's just
Speaker 1: so normal and just sometimes and that's also another time,
Speaker 1: like as I'm recording this episode ivys nine weeks but
Speaker 1: sometimes I would just wake up and I still feel
Speaker 1: those feelings and I just feel a bit overwhelmed, and
Speaker 1: I just bit bland and very The biggest thing, the
Speaker 1: biggest like shocking thing for me has been is it
Speaker 1: literally feels like there has been a death, and that
Speaker 1: kind of has because your old self has died and
Speaker 1: you're now this new person who has this little person
Speaker 1: who depends on you twenty four to seven, And it
Speaker 1: really is it's a lot, and it's a big transformation.
Speaker 1: So if you sometimes you know, feel overwhelmed or sad
Speaker 1: and you think, oh my god, why do I feel
Speaker 1: like this. I'm so lucky. Look at this beautiful baby.
Speaker 1: You know, I have so much to be grateful for.
Speaker 1: I think it's about realizing that is so normal and
Speaker 1: not beating yourself up. Because I still have those days
Speaker 1: where I just feel a bit down and I feel
Speaker 1: a bit sad, and I get really angry at myself,
Speaker 1: and then I realize this is normal. It's a huge
Speaker 1: transformation and it is okay. I think we need to
Speaker 1: take the stigma away and normalize those feelings. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: first couple of weeks overwhelming af Okay, rn C, fam,
Speaker 1: We're just having a quick break. We will get back
Speaker 1: into the episode in one second, But firstly I have
Speaker 1: to ask you, do you get enough sleep? Do you
Speaker 1: wake up feeling recharged and rested. Do you fail to
Speaker 1: sleep easily? Do you struggle to wind down your mind
Speaker 1: before bed? If you're answering these questions and you're like, oh, Georgie, no,
Speaker 1: I don't get enough sleep, I can't wind down. I
Speaker 1: really struggle with all these issues, then girlfriend, you need
Speaker 1: to get onto Moon Milk. So if you guys have
Speaker 1: me on socials, you would know this is probably my
Speaker 1: favorite Naked Harvest product. So moon Milk was born in
Speaker 1: twenty nineteen when I myself really struggled and suffered from
Speaker 1: insomnia and basically switching off at bedtime. This was in
Speaker 1: the very beginning of Naked Harvest, so I had a
Speaker 1: lot going on. My mind was running wild, and I
Speaker 1: really struggled to get good sleep. And we know when
Speaker 1: you don't get good sleep, everything else suffers. So if
Speaker 1: you don't get good sleep, you're tied during the day,
Speaker 1: you're more hungry, you're more moody, you can't process things well,
Speaker 1: you can't think as well. So I knew I had
Speaker 1: to get my sleep sorted. I sat down with Cooper
Speaker 1: and our food tech and I kind of said, guys,
Speaker 1: we have to develop a product that is obviously or natural.
Speaker 1: I know there's so many unique herbs and minerals and
Speaker 1: vitamins that we could include that just helps your body
Speaker 1: unwind and recover during the night. A big thing with
Speaker 1: this is, I said, also, is I want something I
Speaker 1: can have at night while I'm watching Netflix that taste
Speaker 1: delicious that also takes away you know, that feeling of
Speaker 1: you're not hungry, but you want something sweet. I'm such
Speaker 1: a sweet tooth. So we also wanted to make sure
Speaker 1: it was that side of things, so introducing Moon milk.
Speaker 1: It is gluten free, dairy free, refined, sugar free, vegan,
Speaker 1: and all natural so honestly has no nasties. It tastes
Speaker 1: like the most delicious hot chocolate, It has no dairy
Speaker 1: in it, and get ready to have the best sleeps
Speaker 1: of your life. It's also really nice because even though
Speaker 1: it's a natural product, you definitely feel the difference. I
Speaker 1: can notice such a big difference of when I take
Speaker 1: it and when I don't, with just the deepness of
Speaker 1: my sleep, feeling restless, tossing and turning, and also feeling
Speaker 1: tired before bed. I'm someone who's super wired most of
Speaker 1: the time, so it's so nice to have a moon milk,
Speaker 1: sit down, watch Netflix and feel that wave of tiredness
Speaker 1: and go, yes, it is time to sleep. So guys,
Speaker 1: there are three new flavors with moon Milk. I am
Speaker 1: so excited. So the Ogi is chocolate. It's everyone's favorite.
Speaker 1: The next flavor is a salted caramel. We wanted to
Speaker 1: do this for the lovers of caramel. Obviously, it's got
Speaker 1: a very unique, yummy flavor. If you're assaulted caramel gal,
Speaker 1: that is for you. Next up is vanilla chai, so
Speaker 1: this one if you're a chai person. It also has
Speaker 1: like a twist of maple in there, so very very sweet.
Speaker 1: And then our last flavor that is new and I'm
Speaker 1: going to say it's my favorite, is Rocky Road. So
Speaker 1: basically think Ogi moonmilk with a hint of lollies of marshmallows.
Speaker 1: Like you literally smell it and it smells like Rocky Road.
Speaker 1: I'm not like the biggest Rocky Road person, but oh
Speaker 1: my god, the slaver will blow your mind. So, guys,
Speaker 1: if you're not getting good sleep, if you struggle to
Speaker 1: wind down, or if you just want something sweet before
Speaker 1: bed that you know is going to calm your mind
Speaker 1: and do really amazing things for your body, and it
Speaker 1: will mean that you will have a very productive next day.
Speaker 1: You have to try moon milk. I do have a
Speaker 1: code for my iron c fam. It is rise and
Speaker 1: Conquer at checkout to get a sneaky dissy. Ah, you
Speaker 1: will not regret it. There are hundreds and hundreds of
Speaker 1: positive reviews from the NH gang who will also obsess.
Speaker 1: So come join us. You will not regret it at all.
Speaker 1: Let's get straight back into the show. So then the
Speaker 1: next couple of weeks after that, things got a little
Speaker 1: bit better because we started realizing we need feed ib
Speaker 1: more and burper more. We figured out tummy pains. I
Speaker 1: have a highlight on Instagram just called ivy where I've
Speaker 1: put some things we tried out, like infan Cole and
Speaker 1: Wilby's and those different things that I did find worked
Speaker 1: for her colic. So you can check that out if
Speaker 1: you want. And I feel like we figured out the
Speaker 1: breastfeeding thing a bit more, and yeah, things started to
Speaker 1: get a bit normal. But in saying that, even after
Speaker 1: those you know, the first three weeks being such a blur.
Speaker 1: It's like this rollercoaster because like, one day they will
Speaker 1: feed perfectly, they will go to sleep, they won't cry,
Speaker 1: they will be super chilled, and you're like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: you'll have sleep and you'll just be a new person.
Speaker 1: You'll be like, oh my god, I understand this parenting thing.
Speaker 1: Look how happy my baby is, Like life is great.
Speaker 1: And then you'll have a day where they're not latching,
Speaker 1: they won't feed, they're so one happy and you just
Speaker 1: you take it so personally, and you also feel like
Speaker 1: crap because maybe you haven't had the sleep. You know,
Speaker 1: you're having fights with your partner, and it's just such
Speaker 1: a roller coaster and that is normal. That is the
Speaker 1: first six weeks. Well, actually, let's just say the you know,
Speaker 1: the first weeks when you have a baby, it is
Speaker 1: so normal. You have really amazing days and then you
Speaker 1: have really shocking days. And in those shocking days, I'm
Speaker 1: not like I would cry. I would like literally just
Speaker 1: like hand Ivy to Tim or my mom or whoever
Speaker 1: was there and just be like you need to take her.
Speaker 1: I need to like go cry in the shower. And
Speaker 1: that's okay. That's another thing, guys, is before we had Ivy.
Speaker 1: I remember my brother and his wife recently had a
Speaker 1: baby like six months before us, and Ash had her
Speaker 1: mom come over and stay with them for the first
Speaker 1: two weeks, and me and me and Tim were like,
Speaker 1: that's so weird, Like wouldn't you want to embrace the
Speaker 1: newborn stage? Like you know, just used to bit judging,
Speaker 1: I know. And then we had Ivy, and honestly, any
Speaker 1: help that you were offered, take it. That is the
Speaker 1: biggest thing. Like the first couple of weeks we had
Speaker 1: people cooking us dinner, we had my mom come over
Speaker 1: to help us, and or even just ask for it
Speaker 1: and take any help because holy shit, you really need it.
Speaker 1: And that's the biggest thing. Like if you have a
Speaker 1: friend who has a newborn baby, the biggest thing that
Speaker 1: you can offer is help, So you know, ask them,
Speaker 1: do you need me to pick up groceries? Do you
Speaker 1: want me to make dinner for you? Guys? What can
Speaker 1: I do to help? And if you have a new
Speaker 1: baby or your new mom, when someone asks what can
Speaker 1: I do to help? Literally just tell them, don't be like,
Speaker 1: oh I don't want to, you know, ask or put
Speaker 1: people out no, you need help because yeah wow, So yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna And then like all I can say
Speaker 1: is it just gets better and better. So at the start,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie. I literally thought to myself, what
Speaker 1: have we done? Like I honestly had a conversation with
Speaker 1: Tim where I was like, why do people want to
Speaker 1: have more than one baby? Like why do they go back?
Speaker 1: Why do people have like four kids like my parents?
Speaker 1: Because I'm never doing this again, like I blaintly said
Speaker 1: to Tim, We're not having a second child because I
Speaker 1: cannot do this again. Like it just feels so hard
Speaker 1: and so challenging, and like your life will never be
Speaker 1: the same the same again. Well it won't, but like
Speaker 1: in a shit way, like in a oh my god,
Speaker 1: what have I done? Way? But all I can say
Speaker 1: is hold on. It just gets better. And also, like
Speaker 1: Ivy's at a stage now where she's starting to smile,
Speaker 1: she's starting to interact, and you're just getting that little
Speaker 1: bit more from them. So when you're like, you know,
Speaker 1: having the sleepless nights when you're feeling super overwhelmed and
Speaker 1: sleep deprived, and they crack a little smile, You're like, oh,
Speaker 1: it's worth it, And then also like Cooper's baby, who's
Speaker 1: six months now, is so playful. He smiles the time,
Speaker 1: and he has such a personality. And yeah, so that's
Speaker 1: all I can say is it just gets better and better.
Speaker 1: And everyone that I've spoke to has said the first
Speaker 1: two to three months are so challenging, so overwhelming, and
Speaker 1: just like like not that great. And I'm just going
Speaker 1: to be the first person to say it, because I
Speaker 1: feel like there's a lot of crap on Instagram or
Speaker 1: social media where it's like I'm in the newborn bubble
Speaker 1: and it's so great and we're just soaking up on
Speaker 1: newborn and yes, I guarantee you they're doing that, but
Speaker 1: also it's hard and also they're going through shit and
Speaker 1: you're in the trenches and oft and you will think,
Speaker 1: holy crap, did I get up, you know, give up
Speaker 1: my previous life for this? What was I thinking? But
Speaker 1: it gets better? And yeah, so as I'm recording this,
Speaker 1: Ivy is nine weeks and just each week it gets better.
Speaker 1: More of a personally comes, personality comes out, we learn more,
Speaker 1: we get her into more of a routine, we get
Speaker 1: to sleep longer, we find our feet, and it's just
Speaker 1: getting better. I definitely want to chat to you guys
Speaker 1: about our sleep and feed routine we have. I beyond
Speaker 1: because it has helped her so much. I should have
Speaker 1: known my baby loves routine because I love routine. I
Speaker 1: know it's not for everyone and that's so fine, but
Speaker 1: for us, it's really working well. So I'm happy to
Speaker 1: chat about that. And yeah, so all I want to
Speaker 1: say is if you're a new mom or soon to
Speaker 1: be mum, or you know you have a baby, like
Speaker 1: you are doing amazing. And this is the big thing.
Speaker 1: If you have a friend who has a newborn baby,
Speaker 1: literally texts them and just say you were doing amazing,
Speaker 1: because I guarantee you they're going through a lot and
Speaker 1: it's hard for them and it's such a surreal, life changing,
Speaker 1: crazy experience, but it's beautiful and it's magical and it's
Speaker 1: so worth it. And also another big thing, like, for example,
Speaker 1: if your baby is having trouble with breastfeeding, see a
Speaker 1: lactation consultant, if they're not sleeping, see a sleep consultant,
Speaker 1: like ask for help and you know, do some research
Speaker 1: and just get help. Because we had a few scenarios
Speaker 1: where you know, we got to our wits end. We
Speaker 1: finally reached out. We got help from a professional or
Speaker 1: you know, a friend, and it was a game changer.
Speaker 1: And like, now we had help from a sleep consultant,
Speaker 1: and Ivy is sleeping through like long stretches through the night.
Speaker 1: She's having really good day sleeps, and it's just it's
Speaker 1: changing everything. She's stopped crying as much since, you know,
Speaker 1: we've been making these little changes. And yeah, so that's
Speaker 1: what I want to say, is ask for help. You're
Speaker 1: doing amazing. It only gets better. And if you're feeling
Speaker 1: overwhelmed and emotional and maybe a bit like you know,
Speaker 1: unattached from your life or your baby or anything like that,
Speaker 1: like it's it's all normal. You're doing amazing. It just
Speaker 1: gets better. And yes, I hope you enjoyed this little episode.
Speaker 1: I know it's a bit random, but I just wanted
Speaker 1: to say my feelings because again, I feel like when
Speaker 1: you're a new mum, you think you should just love
Speaker 1: every moment of the newborn stage. And I just don't
Speaker 1: think that's a reality for you know, ninety nine percent
Speaker 1: of us. If you're that one percent, you have a
Speaker 1: newborn who just sleeps and eats and is an angel.
Speaker 1: Amazing I'm so jealous, but I feel like that's not
Speaker 1: like I feel like that's not normal. But it is
Speaker 1: all well worth it, and it's a journey, and like
Speaker 1: I say, these talents just shape us and it's important.
Speaker 1: So thank you so much for listening. Please please let
Speaker 1: me know if you liked an episode like this, if
Speaker 1: you want me to talk more about you know, what
Speaker 1: we're doing for Ivy's sleep and feed routine and all
Speaker 1: that sort of stuff. Obviously happy to chat about everything.
Speaker 1: We will have some more normal rn C episode soon.
Speaker 1: Just bear with me while I get back into it.
Speaker 1: I love you guys so much. Thank you. I hope
Speaker 1: you're enjoying the mini EPs and I will be in
Speaker 1: your ears very soon. Bye. Thank you for listening for
Speaker 1: another RNC episode. I really appreciate taking the time to
Speaker 1: be here with me, and also for taking the time
Speaker 1: for yourself. If you found this episode helpful, it would
Speaker 1: be so amazing if you shared it on your stories
Speaker 1: and tagged us, or simply just send it on to
Speaker 1: a girlfriend or family member who would benefit from listening.
Speaker 1: We are an independent podcast run by me and my
Speaker 1: amazing podcast managers, so it would mean the world to
Speaker 1: us if you left a review on the Apple podcast app. Also,
Speaker 1: if you're vibing this podcast and the concepts we're chatting
Speaker 1: about and your craving community, please come and join us
Speaker 1: over at the RNC podcast community Facebook group. Just search
Speaker 1: Rise and Conquer Podcast Community on Facebook and I will
Speaker 1: be in there to chat to you until next time