1
00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:03,560
Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda

2
00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:08,600
Speaker 1: Bunjelung Calcottin woman from Gadigl Country. The Daily oz acknowledges

3
00:00:08,680 --> 00:00:10,799
Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the

4
00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:14,400
Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres

5
00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:17,319
Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the

6
00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,120
Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present.

7
00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:28,560
Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os It's Tuesday,

8
00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:31,120
Speaker 2: the fifteenth of August. I'm Sam Kazlowski.

9
00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:32,000
Speaker 3: I'm Nina Koppel.

10
00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:36,040
Speaker 2: The deadliest US wildfires in over a century are burning

11
00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:37,000
Speaker 2: in Hawaiian and.

12
00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:40,400
Speaker 3: The death toll from the devastating wildfires and Maui continues

13
00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:40,840
Speaker 3: to climb.

14
00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:43,640
Speaker 1: As the death toll from the wildfire climbs to at

15
00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:44,920
Speaker 1: least eighty At.

16
00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,360
Speaker 4: Least ninety three people are confirmed dead, and we also

17
00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:50,160
Speaker 4: know officials keep telling us that it's likely that death

18
00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:51,320
Speaker 4: toll is going to rise.

19
00:00:51,680 --> 00:00:53,600
Speaker 3: In the deep dive, I'm going to speak to someone

20
00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:54,680
Speaker 3: on the ground in Maui.

21
00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:59,240
Speaker 4: You have more than five thousand people displaced you in Australia,

22
00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,080
Speaker 4: to be the equivalent of like seven hundred and fifty

23
00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:05,800
Speaker 4: thousand people. I'm displaced by a single event the first am.

24
00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:07,279
Speaker 3: What's making headlines this morning.

25
00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:10,640
Speaker 2: Pauline Hanson has sacked Mark Latham as leader of the

26
00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:13,880
Speaker 2: New South Wales branch of the One Nation Party. Latham

27
00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:16,479
Speaker 2: said he was stripped of his role on Wednesday due

28
00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:20,000
Speaker 2: to a fall in One Nation votes during March's state election.

29
00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,399
Speaker 2: He accused Hanson of hypocrisy, saying she should buy a

30
00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:25,800
Speaker 2: mirror if she's worried about underperformance.

31
00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:30,360
Speaker 3: Quantas has unveiled three planes with designs supporting the Yes

32
00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:34,000
Speaker 3: vote for the upcoming Indigenous Voice referendum. The logo for

33
00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:37,160
Speaker 3: the official gas campaign is on two Quantas aircraft and

34
00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:38,319
Speaker 3: on a jet Star plane.

35
00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:42,800
Speaker 2: Alex Demonor has climbed to his best ever tennis ranking

36
00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:46,039
Speaker 2: two weeks before the US Open. Demonor rose to twelfth

37
00:01:46,120 --> 00:01:48,680
Speaker 2: in the world. That's pretty impressive after making the final

38
00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:51,360
Speaker 2: of the Canadian Open, which he then did lose in

39
00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:54,600
Speaker 2: straight sets. The US Open is the final Grand Slam

40
00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:56,960
Speaker 2: tournament of the year and will take place in.

41
00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:00,960
Speaker 3: New York and the good News Melbourne's tram network will

42
00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,600
Speaker 3: be more accessible for blind and low vision passengers. A

43
00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:08,360
Speaker 3: trial of QR codes across several routes will audibly inform

44
00:02:08,440 --> 00:02:12,280
Speaker 3: passengers of their current location. Routes serving the location and

45
00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:15,560
Speaker 3: arrival information codes can be scanned from an app that

46
00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:17,640
Speaker 3: can be used in over thirty languages.

47
00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:25,239
Speaker 2: Devastating fires are burning in Maui. That's an island in

48
00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:29,120
Speaker 2: the central part of Hawaii, Nina. You've spoken to someone

49
00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:32,520
Speaker 2: actually on the ground there. Before we get into that chat,

50
00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:34,600
Speaker 2: can you tell me a little bit about this situation

51
00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:35,799
Speaker 2: that's still unfolding.

52
00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:38,000
Speaker 3: So what you need to understand before we get to

53
00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:40,280
Speaker 3: that chat is that fires have broken out in a

54
00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:43,440
Speaker 3: few places on the island, but the most devastating was

55
00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,359
Speaker 3: in the historic town of Lahina, which was almost burnt

56
00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:47,040
Speaker 3: to the ground.

57
00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:49,480
Speaker 2: That's where we saw some of those photos coming out.

58
00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:53,440
Speaker 3: Exact weekend, some devastating images. The death toll is approaching

59
00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:56,040
Speaker 3: one hundred people, but it's likely to climb more as

60
00:02:56,120 --> 00:02:58,760
Speaker 3: only a small portion of the search area has actually

61
00:02:58,800 --> 00:03:02,600
Speaker 3: been covered so far. According to the AP, Maui County

62
00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:05,600
Speaker 3: estimates that more than eighty percent of the more than

63
00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,400
Speaker 3: two thousand, seven hundred structures in the town were damaged

64
00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:12,760
Speaker 3: or destroyed, and around four thousand, five hundred residents are

65
00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:15,240
Speaker 3: newly in need of shelter and some that's going to

66
00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:17,200
Speaker 3: be important to remember when we do get into that

67
00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:18,400
Speaker 3: interview a bit later on.

68
00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:20,320
Speaker 2: And do we know what's caused these fires?

69
00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:23,560
Speaker 3: We do understand a bit of what's contributed to these fires.

70
00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:26,760
Speaker 3: They were fueled by strong winds from Hurricane Dora, which

71
00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:28,880
Speaker 3: was a major hurricane that passed through the south of

72
00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:32,040
Speaker 3: Hawaii in the Pacific Ocean. And of course, am we've

73
00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:35,160
Speaker 3: spoken on the podcast in recent weeks about the fact

74
00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:38,120
Speaker 3: that you know, these fires aren't isolated events. The whole

75
00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:41,560
Speaker 3: Northern Hemisphere has been experiencing extreme heat waves and fires

76
00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:42,760
Speaker 3: over the last few months.

77
00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:45,600
Speaker 2: That's when we had that discussion about watch the really

78
00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:48,400
Speaker 2: hot summer for the Northern Hemisphere could mean for the

79
00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:50,760
Speaker 2: Australian summer. I'll put a link to that chat in

80
00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:51,640
Speaker 2: todays show notes.

81
00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:54,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, and just like in the case of those Northern

82
00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:59,360
Speaker 3: Hemisphere disasters, we've been speaking about environmental factors. Climate definitely

83
00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:02,560
Speaker 3: have played a role, but there's also been some discussion

84
00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:06,640
Speaker 3: in this case about some human contributions to this disaster.

85
00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:11,400
Speaker 3: There's actually law firms, one of which specializes in wildfire litigation,

86
00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:14,080
Speaker 3: which I didn't know was a thing. They're saying that

87
00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:17,719
Speaker 3: they're collecting evidence that could potentially show that damaged power

88
00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:22,040
Speaker 3: infrastructure owned by Hawaiian Electric Co created the spark which

89
00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,360
Speaker 3: led to the fires. Hawaiian Electric have said in a statement, though,

90
00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:27,839
Speaker 3: that they don't know what caused the fires. There's also

91
00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,680
Speaker 3: been criticism targeted at authorities for their response to the blaze,

92
00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:34,960
Speaker 3: namely that they failed to activate warning sirens and that

93
00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:37,400
Speaker 3: they've been slow off the mark with relief efforts.

94
00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:39,400
Speaker 2: Okay, so tell me who we're going to hear from today.

95
00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:42,279
Speaker 3: So obviously we're still really coming to terms with the

96
00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:45,200
Speaker 3: immediate devastation of these fires. But I did want to

97
00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,440
Speaker 3: reach out to Sterling Heiger. He's a teacher, a writer,

98
00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,440
Speaker 3: and he's the executive director of Housing Hawaii's Future, and

99
00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:55,880
Speaker 3: that's an NGO looking at the local housing shortage. Sterling,

100
00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:57,800
Speaker 3: thank you so much for joining us on the Daily

101
00:04:57,839 --> 00:04:58,520
Speaker 3: Earls this morning.

102
00:04:58,600 --> 00:04:59,480
Speaker 4: Thank you for having me.

103
00:05:00,360 --> 00:05:03,240
Speaker 3: Must be impacting everyone in Hawaii right now to watch

104
00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:06,680
Speaker 3: the devastation and loss of life that's unfolding. I know

105
00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:09,760
Speaker 3: that you have a personal connection to Maui. Is everyone

106
00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:11,440
Speaker 3: in your life safe at the moment?

107
00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:16,080
Speaker 4: Fortunately, Nina, everyone in my family is safe. My wife

108
00:05:16,160 --> 00:05:18,560
Speaker 4: is from Juno Kuai, which is just north of Lahino,

109
00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,280
Speaker 4: and for a couple of days we were nervous about

110
00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:23,800
Speaker 4: whether her parents were safe in Juno Koulai, but did

111
00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:24,920
Speaker 4: find that they were safe.

112
00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:27,480
Speaker 3: That's good, good to hear. Tell me a little bit

113
00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:30,800
Speaker 3: about the work you do in housing and how that

114
00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:33,839
Speaker 3: kind of comes into play when we're watching this disaster unfold.

115
00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,440
Speaker 4: The nonprofit I Lead Housing of What's Future was founded

116
00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:41,840
Speaker 4: two years ago because the founders, Evan and Zach realized

117
00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:45,160
Speaker 4: Evan is a current college student, Zach is a real

118
00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:49,479
Speaker 4: recent college graduate. They realized that looking forward ten to

119
00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:53,640
Speaker 4: fifteen years, they didn't think that some of their classmates

120
00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:56,760
Speaker 4: would be able to return to a vit because of

121
00:05:56,800 --> 00:05:59,479
Speaker 4: the cost of housing, and so Housing Hawaii's feature is

122
00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:02,280
Speaker 4: dedicated to ensuring that there's enough housing so that you know,

123
00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:05,120
Speaker 4: our children, our grandchildren, the next generation can afford to

124
00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:09,880
Speaker 4: stay here. Prior to this disaster, we were working on,

125
00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:13,440
Speaker 4: you know, one of the worst housing crises in the

126
00:06:13,480 --> 00:06:16,320
Speaker 4: world in Hawaii in terms of the cost of housing,

127
00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:18,640
Speaker 4: which is leading a lot of local people to leave.

128
00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:22,920
Speaker 4: And that's just gotten you know, ten one hundred times

129
00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:26,880
Speaker 4: worse on Maui. We were already dealing with a shortage

130
00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:31,440
Speaker 4: of housing and now to have five thousand or more

131
00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:36,719
Speaker 4: people displaced is tremendous. I think it's difficult for people

132
00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:40,520
Speaker 4: to appreciate the scale of the displacement. You know, Maui

133
00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:43,040
Speaker 4: is an island of one hundred and sixty five thousand people,

134
00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:47,040
Speaker 4: So to have more than five thousand people displaced, you know,

135
00:06:47,440 --> 00:06:50,320
Speaker 4: in Australia, that would be the equivalent of like seven

136
00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:54,040
Speaker 4: hundred and fifty thousand people displaced by a single event,

137
00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:56,279
Speaker 4: which is it's just massive.

138
00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:59,479
Speaker 3: Talk to me about what contributed to that housing crisis

139
00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:02,440
Speaker 3: before the because I think to understand how this is

140
00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:05,840
Speaker 3: going to exacerbate that ongoing situation, we need to know

141
00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:07,359
Speaker 3: where we started.

142
00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:11,160
Speaker 4: Hai first of all, is a tremendously desirable place to live.

143
00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:16,480
Speaker 4: Lots of people would love to have, you know, our climate.

144
00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,200
Speaker 4: They want to have access to the beaches and everything

145
00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:22,600
Speaker 4: that we love here, and that has led to a

146
00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:26,920
Speaker 4: lot of real estate speculation, investment properties, and because we

147
00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:29,960
Speaker 4: have such a strong tourist market, it's also led to

148
00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:32,480
Speaker 4: a lot of use of housing for short term rentals,

149
00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:35,840
Speaker 4: which has taken thousands of units away from our housing stop.

150
00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:41,840
Speaker 4: We've compounded this external demand with an internal system of

151
00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:46,240
Speaker 4: regulation that makes incredibly difficult to build housing. So a

152
00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:49,880
Speaker 4: recent study by the University of Hawaii found that the

153
00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:54,920
Speaker 4: four counties in Hawaii Kawaii, Oahu or Honolulu, Maui County,

154
00:07:54,960 --> 00:07:58,960
Speaker 4: and Hawaii Island had some of the most stringent regulations

155
00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:02,520
Speaker 4: on building housing in the United States, which means it

156
00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:05,920
Speaker 4: takes longer, it costs more, and it's more difficult to

157
00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:06,600
Speaker 4: build housing.

158
00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:09,880
Speaker 3: So talk to me about the people who've been impacted

159
00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,720
Speaker 3: by this disaster so far and potentially yet to be

160
00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:16,080
Speaker 3: impacted by this disaster. What does the future of their

161
00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:17,400
Speaker 3: housing look like.

162
00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:22,240
Speaker 4: It's going to be years before rebuilding can take place Leahina,

163
00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:24,360
Speaker 4: And if you look at the images, you can see

164
00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:27,560
Speaker 4: this was really raised to the ground, and because of

165
00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:32,640
Speaker 4: the scale of the devastation, there's a lot of toxic pollutants.

166
00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:36,000
Speaker 4: The water supply had been impacted because of the loss

167
00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,199
Speaker 4: of power, where there are now potentially toxic contaminants in

168
00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:43,160
Speaker 4: the water system. So it will be months, if not years,

169
00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:47,199
Speaker 4: before rebuilding can begin in Lahina. And this is complicated

170
00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:51,160
Speaker 4: by the fact that before this crisis, we had difficulty

171
00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:55,400
Speaker 4: getting contractors in to do work because many contractors on

172
00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:57,800
Speaker 4: now we couldn't afford to live here and have left,

173
00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:01,400
Speaker 4: and so we actually import people to build things on Maui.

174
00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:04,120
Speaker 4: They'll come in for a day from a Wahoo, they'll build,

175
00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:06,840
Speaker 4: they'll fly back, or maybe they'll stay the night. So

176
00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:09,400
Speaker 4: even getting the crews in here to do the work

177
00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:11,720
Speaker 4: of remediation and rebuilding is going to take a long

178
00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:15,559
Speaker 4: time as far as what the families can expect. Many

179
00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:20,040
Speaker 4: of the families didn't have insurance. Their homes were paid off,

180
00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:23,760
Speaker 4: so they weren't required to have insurance, and they may

181
00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,560
Speaker 4: not have the money to rebuild. We know from the

182
00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:31,880
Speaker 4: experience of communities like New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina that

183
00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:34,840
Speaker 4: federal aid can sometimes get tied up. It can be

184
00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:37,240
Speaker 4: difficult to work with federal agencies to get the aid

185
00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,400
Speaker 4: that people are owed. And in the interim, even if

186
00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:42,640
Speaker 4: the aid does come to these people, they have to

187
00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:46,680
Speaker 4: contend with the housing market that has very expensive rents

188
00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:50,760
Speaker 4: and very expensive for sale prices. So they're kind of

189
00:09:51,400 --> 00:09:54,560
Speaker 4: you know three things, Like one is they become homeless.

190
00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:58,240
Speaker 4: That's the worst outcome. Two, there's the possibility that they

191
00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:01,640
Speaker 4: just leave, whether that's to the the largest, most populated

192
00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:06,720
Speaker 4: island a lot or it's to the American mainline. And

193
00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:09,160
Speaker 4: then the third possibility is staying with you know, friends

194
00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:12,960
Speaker 4: or family. But you know a lot of these three

195
00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:18,120
Speaker 4: bedroom houses in Lachina had multi generational homes, potentially ten

196
00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:21,160
Speaker 4: to twelve people living in them. So a lot of

197
00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:25,760
Speaker 4: people were displaced in this process and they're going to

198
00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:29,760
Speaker 4: have a really hard time. And this is before we

199
00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:34,720
Speaker 4: think about the fall lawn effects where this will impact tourism,

200
00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:38,080
Speaker 4: which is the number one economic driver of Maui, and

201
00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:40,719
Speaker 4: people who work in these service jobs at the hotels

202
00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:44,680
Speaker 4: could potentially be impacted where they wouldn't have work either.

203
00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:47,920
Speaker 4: So you've gone from a situation where people were in

204
00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:51,240
Speaker 4: this tough place of working these low wage service jobs,

205
00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:53,920
Speaker 4: struggling to afford housing, to a situation where they may

206
00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:57,040
Speaker 4: not even have those jobs anymore and they don't have

207
00:10:57,080 --> 00:11:02,680
Speaker 4: the housing. You know, I want to be hopeful that

208
00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:07,320
Speaker 4: the government can allow, you know, the rapid construction and

209
00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:10,640
Speaker 4: deployment of emergency shelter, that we can build starter homes

210
00:11:10,679 --> 00:11:14,600
Speaker 4: for these people ideally close to where they live, if

211
00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:17,440
Speaker 4: not in line, are very close in the interim, and

212
00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:20,040
Speaker 4: that all the people who want to remain in Lahina

213
00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:25,360
Speaker 4: can afford to stay there. But if history has any guide,

214
00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:27,680
Speaker 4: that's not the way it's going to play out for

215
00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:28,720
Speaker 4: a lot of the families.

216
00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:31,480
Speaker 3: I do want to come back to that idea of hope.

217
00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,160
Speaker 3: We always like to end these discussions on a sense

218
00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:37,520
Speaker 3: of hope. What do you want a young Australian audience

219
00:11:37,559 --> 00:11:41,120
Speaker 3: to know about the potential of Hawaii to rebuild, to

220
00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:43,840
Speaker 3: move forward from this disaster. I mean there's still going

221
00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:47,079
Speaker 3: to be a period of discovery and grieving and coming

222
00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:49,400
Speaker 3: to terms with the magnitude. We still don't know what

223
00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:51,800
Speaker 3: you know, the actual death toll is going to be.

224
00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:55,320
Speaker 3: But what do you hope for coming out of this disaster?

225
00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:58,640
Speaker 4: You know, when the debtor counted, when shelter has been

226
00:11:58,679 --> 00:12:01,720
Speaker 4: built for those who are displayed, is when you know

227
00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:04,480
Speaker 4: families are made whole and people have had the chance

228
00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:09,160
Speaker 4: to grieve. My hope is that this is the kind

229
00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:14,880
Speaker 4: of event that moves people to understand that the status

230
00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:20,120
Speaker 4: quo is not sustainable, That we can't have you know,

231
00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:24,640
Speaker 4: unmanaged land where dry brush is allowed to accumulate, that

232
00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:29,120
Speaker 4: we really have to think about our infrastructure, our transportation infrastructure,

233
00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:32,800
Speaker 4: the highway that goes to West Maui in some parts

234
00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:35,760
Speaker 4: of a two lane highway along the sea that at

235
00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:40,120
Speaker 4: high tide is already impacted by sea level rise. And

236
00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:44,880
Speaker 4: so can you imagine if this disaster were compounded by

237
00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:48,880
Speaker 4: the fact that that highway were inundated or otherwise inaccessible.

238
00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,199
Speaker 4: We have to get a handle on the infrastructure. And

239
00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:55,640
Speaker 4: what makes me hopeful is in response to this, the

240
00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:59,880
Speaker 4: community has come together to provide aid to the people

241
00:12:59,880 --> 00:13:04,400
Speaker 4: in need, and that these conversations are starting in pockets

242
00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:06,760
Speaker 4: at first, but I think we're ready to have, you know,

243
00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:11,040
Speaker 4: a conversation across all of the vit about how do

244
00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:13,480
Speaker 4: we want our future to look? You know, at a

245
00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:18,080
Speaker 4: basic level, can we ensure true sustainability right where our

246
00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:21,720
Speaker 4: children and grandchildren can afford to stay here. Can we

247
00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:27,200
Speaker 4: make ourselves resilient to disaster? Can we be more food sustainable?

248
00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:30,199
Speaker 4: Can we have more energy production here? Can we make

249
00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:33,120
Speaker 4: sure that our infrastructure is not so vulnerable to a disaster.

250
00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:37,079
Speaker 4: And the hope is that now having seen what happens

251
00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:40,640
Speaker 4: and what could happen, the young people across the state

252
00:13:40,640 --> 00:13:42,640
Speaker 4: of Pavit who are taking an interest not only in

253
00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:46,600
Speaker 4: issues like housing, but in environmental issues and social justice

254
00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:52,160
Speaker 4: issues that there's enough overall momentum to finally solve these problems.

255
00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:55,000
Speaker 3: Stilling, thank you so much via Time Today. I really

256
00:13:55,040 --> 00:13:55,719
Speaker 3: appreciate it.

257
00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:56,280
Speaker 4: Thanking the.

258
00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:01,920
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to today episode of The Daily Oz. If

259
00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:04,440
Speaker 2: you enjoy this episode, give us a rating on Spotify

260
00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:07,200
Speaker 2: or ask a question. We always love reading your comments

261
00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:09,520
Speaker 2: and we'll speak to you tomorrow