WEBVTT - MINI: R U OK Day 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.960 Hey, this is Christian O'Connell. This is a very different 0:00:03.080 --> 0:00:05.440 kind of I would even call it podcasts that we're 0:00:05.440 --> 0:00:08.080 putting out, but it's just something Jack and I want 0:00:08.119 --> 0:00:11.319 to do after conversation we had and the lead up 0:00:11.360 --> 0:00:14.160 to and around are You Okay Day? So wherever you're 0:00:14.160 --> 0:00:17.560 listening to this, whether it's in Australia or it's anywhere else, wherever, 0:00:17.560 --> 0:00:20.320 you enjoy what we do. Are You Okay Day? It's 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:21.920 a great thing. It's a thing they do in Australia 0:00:22.079 --> 0:00:25.240 once a year, and it's about that. It's about starting 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:28.120 a conversation with someone you think might be struggling, whether 0:00:28.120 --> 0:00:31.280 that's a family member, someone at work, one of your friends. 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:35.000 The are You Okay is it's offering them a bridge. 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:38.400 And sometimes it's also about asking yourself the same question. 0:00:38.760 --> 0:00:42.040 And sometimes it's very hard for us to face our pain. 0:00:42.120 --> 0:00:43.560 We're not very good at that. We want to look 0:00:43.560 --> 0:00:45.640 the other way. We actually find it easier to help 0:00:45.680 --> 0:00:49.040 somebody else rather than actually extend that out to ourselves. 0:00:49.320 --> 0:00:52.480 So whenever you listen to this, if you are struggling, 0:00:52.960 --> 0:00:55.160 here's a story from Jack post on the show. You 0:00:55.240 --> 0:00:56.920 might not have known of the last couple of months 0:00:57.280 --> 0:00:58.880 he's got on or off the show. He's been going 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:02.000 through a really really tough but he did something really 0:01:02.040 --> 0:01:04.319 amazing and courageous. As you're about to hear from Jack, 0:01:04.640 --> 0:01:07.280 he actually accepted that he was struggling and he got help. 0:01:07.600 --> 0:01:09.240 And I can tell you now he's in a completely 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:12.840 different place. He's actually a better person for it. Our 0:01:12.920 --> 0:01:17.000 pain can can transform us and actually do us something 0:01:17.040 --> 0:01:20.000 really really special. But it starts with you accepting you 0:01:20.080 --> 0:01:23.039 need help. You're struggling. It's human to struggle, it is 0:01:23.080 --> 0:01:25.440 not human to be alone with it. So when Jack 0:01:25.480 --> 0:01:27.160 and I started to talk, and we'd be talking a 0:01:27.160 --> 0:01:28.760 lot over the last couple of months, as you want 0:01:28.800 --> 0:01:31.200 to hear, we actually went on for about twenty minutes. 0:01:31.240 --> 0:01:33.880 So obviously for the radio show we need to chop 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:36.319 that down, but I wanted to put this out in full. 0:01:36.440 --> 0:01:39.000 Jack is okay with this because I actually think it 0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:41.600 could help somebody. I know, eight years ago my life, 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:43.440 I would have loved to have heard something like this. 0:01:43.840 --> 0:01:46.240 It would have made me get help sooner. So if 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:48.720 you are struggling at the moment, you can take the 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:51.920 small risk, a small step and tell someone around you. 0:01:52.040 --> 0:01:55.520 There are also services that are waiting for your call. 0:01:55.960 --> 0:02:00.600 Lifeline is one of them. On thirteen eleven fourteen. Beyond 0:02:00.640 --> 0:02:04.000 Blue also do brilliant service. You can call them today 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:08.960 one three hundred double two four six three six. Do 0:02:09.120 --> 0:02:12.440 not be alone in your pain. I hope you get 0:02:12.520 --> 0:02:16.080 something from Jack's story. How have a listened to this? All? Right? 0:02:16.160 --> 0:02:19.920 So Jack, tell me then about the last couple of months. 0:02:20.120 --> 0:02:21.440 You've had a really tough time. 0:02:21.560 --> 0:02:27.040 Yeah, it's funny, actually, Okay, day. I'm looking at it 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:30.280 differently this year because I've always thought it's such an 0:02:30.280 --> 0:02:34.000 important day to have, and I've always tried to be 0:02:34.200 --> 0:02:37.560 consciously there for my mates and for my family, trying 0:02:37.600 --> 0:02:39.959 to ask those questions and probabe and trying to find 0:02:39.960 --> 0:02:42.120 out how people feel. And this is the first year 0:02:42.120 --> 0:02:44.000 where I'm seeing it from a different side of it, 0:02:44.040 --> 0:02:48.160 where I've come through something really difficult, and it kind 0:02:48.160 --> 0:02:49.799 of means something different to me now because there's the 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:53.280 people in my life who made me talk about what 0:02:53.400 --> 0:02:57.000 I went through that really saved me from a terrible space. 0:02:57.160 --> 0:02:58.880 And you were one of those people. My wife was 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:00.840 one of those people, my mum was one of those people. 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:05.240 It started when my son was born in March and 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:08.760 you remember how gidy I was during the pregnancy, Like 0:03:09.080 --> 0:03:13.520 I was so excited for it, I couldn't wait. I 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:15.839 felt like I was across everything, like I was trying 0:03:15.840 --> 0:03:17.520 to learn as much as I could about the pregnancy. 0:03:17.520 --> 0:03:20.239 I was trying to make it perfect for the anchor 0:03:20.280 --> 0:03:23.480 on the day. And I felt like in my own review, 0:03:23.600 --> 0:03:25.880 like I did a ten out of ten job of 0:03:25.919 --> 0:03:28.160 being a husband during that period and right up to 0:03:28.160 --> 0:03:31.000 the birth. And then something changed after he was born, 0:03:31.040 --> 0:03:32.480 and it was really strange. 0:03:36.040 --> 0:03:50.840 Hey, take your time, mate, It was some It just yeah, 0:03:51.240 --> 0:03:53.960 this is all still really happening for you. And I 0:03:54.000 --> 0:03:56.040 know you are in a better place but now, but 0:03:56.120 --> 0:03:58.080 you were in a really really you were in a 0:03:58.120 --> 0:04:02.200 really toughest place because paper where everyone expects you to be. Hey, 0:04:02.240 --> 0:04:04.600 your son's here, you're a dad, and you have all 0:04:04.600 --> 0:04:07.520 these expectations and somehow this image of who you want 0:04:07.560 --> 0:04:09.720 to be, who you should be, and then when you're 0:04:09.720 --> 0:04:13.120 having a really tough time, that gap between who you 0:04:13.160 --> 0:04:15.200 think you should be and who you really are when 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.200 you're struggling, it's horrendous, it's frightening. It pains you into 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:21.760 very small. Everything's too big, everything's too much, and you think, well, 0:04:21.760 --> 0:04:24.719 I can't be I can't be struggling right now IF's 0:04:24.760 --> 0:04:25.440 just given birth. 0:04:25.960 --> 0:04:29.120 Yeah, everyone tells you, like I even remember you and 0:04:29.160 --> 0:04:33.840 Patty saying this is like, when your child arrives, you'll 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:37.160 feel this like incredible love that you've never felt before. 0:04:38.040 --> 0:04:40.960 It will change your life. You'll look at your baby 0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:46.200 and you'll feel like an immense, incredible amount of love. 0:04:48.040 --> 0:04:50.239 And so I sorry, man. 0:04:50.640 --> 0:04:54.360 You only say sorry. Stay with it. Jack, It's all right, 0:04:55.520 --> 0:05:07.680 It's okay, mate, Yeah, it's all right. It's been hard. Yeah. 0:05:07.960 --> 0:05:10.480 So when he was born, I was getting I was 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:13.320 bracing for this feeling of like I'm going to feel 0:05:13.320 --> 0:05:17.159 this crazy amount of love for something that I'm just 0:05:17.200 --> 0:05:21.280 meeting for the first time, and it didn't come to 0:05:21.320 --> 0:05:24.760 me in that room. It didn't come to me straight away. 0:05:24.800 --> 0:05:29.760 I was so excited that he was born healthy and 0:05:29.839 --> 0:05:33.120 safe and that he came and that Bianc was safe 0:05:33.120 --> 0:05:38.000 and well. And I felt an immense love for Bianca 0:05:38.080 --> 0:05:41.279 to seen what she went through during the pregnancy. But 0:05:42.000 --> 0:05:46.239 to him, I didn't immediately feel a sense of connection 0:05:46.360 --> 0:05:50.800 to him. And that's really hard for me to say, 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:57.880 like I just felt. I guess what I felt. It's 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:01.880 just guilt and shame of like bringing this little guy 0:06:01.920 --> 0:06:04.440 into the world, who are mental love so much and 0:06:04.480 --> 0:06:05.720 I can't feel that for. 0:06:05.720 --> 0:06:11.080 Him, but chat you can't. You Actually, the pain you 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:13.800 feel right now is that you is the love you 0:06:13.839 --> 0:06:16.000 have for him. You do have love for him, It's 0:06:16.000 --> 0:06:18.400 just that you had so much other stuff going on. 0:06:19.080 --> 0:06:21.440 It's a it was a huge kind of moment in 0:06:21.480 --> 0:06:23.719 your life, and I think you were there was like 0:06:24.640 --> 0:06:27.800 a part of you was was was ending. It was 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:31.599 a painful ending, you know, it's a it's a it's 0:06:31.680 --> 0:06:33.240 a big thing you've gone through. 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:37.760 Thankfully that I didn't have that feeling anymore now I 0:06:37.800 --> 0:06:40.440 love him so much and that but that didn't come 0:06:40.520 --> 0:06:44.960 for three months, and it's that was a really scary time. 0:06:45.360 --> 0:06:48.479 And what happened to me in those three months on 0:06:48.600 --> 0:06:53.520 top of having that feeling is I went through what 0:06:53.720 --> 0:06:56.479 is called a post natal depression, something I didn't even 0:06:56.480 --> 0:06:59.440 think that father and new fathers could get. I thought 0:06:59.760 --> 0:07:01.480 it was something that we had to be worried about 0:07:01.560 --> 0:07:03.400 for Bianca because I know it could be a high 0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:08.000 rate of personator depression in New mums and I was 0:07:08.800 --> 0:07:11.320 and I was the one feeling it to points where 0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:13.960 I was like some nights, I was sitting alone on 0:07:14.080 --> 0:07:18.080 like the floor of his nursery, just with my head 0:07:18.080 --> 0:07:21.600 between my knees, crying uncontrollably, and I couldn't I didn't 0:07:21.640 --> 0:07:25.360 know why. I couldn't figure out why it was happening. 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:27.080 I couldn't figure out why, and. 0:07:27.000 --> 0:07:28.720 He must have felt so. We live in a shame 0:07:28.800 --> 0:07:32.280 based culture, so you would have felt ashamed. I'm not 0:07:32.320 --> 0:07:34.720 allowed to feel like this. This is not this can't 0:07:34.760 --> 0:07:35.240 be happening. 0:07:35.360 --> 0:07:38.679 I felt an immense amount of shame in multiple ways. 0:07:38.720 --> 0:07:43.000 Shame that I felt like I didn't connect with my son, 0:07:43.000 --> 0:07:46.800 incredible shame that I felt like Bianca was the one 0:07:46.800 --> 0:07:49.320 who did all the work. She brought him into the world, 0:07:49.400 --> 0:07:52.200 she went through the pregnancy, She's the one breastfeeding him, 0:07:52.200 --> 0:07:54.679 and I'm the one who has depression and he's crawling 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:57.160 on the floor. I felt so much guilt and shame 0:07:57.280 --> 0:07:58.600 and embarrassment about that. 0:07:59.760 --> 0:08:00.000 And I. 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:04.720 Felt embarrassed that I was a dad who had depression 0:08:04.720 --> 0:08:09.600 of postnatal depression, and I didn't For the first couple 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:12.400 of months of going through it, I didn't even say 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:14.600 that I had that, and I didn't want to acknowledge 0:08:14.600 --> 0:08:16.640 that word. I didn't want to attribute that word to 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:18.480 me because I felt like it didn't apply to me. 0:08:20.000 --> 0:08:25.120 And it actually using that word and getting help and 0:08:25.240 --> 0:08:28.280 understanding it made it a lot easier to talk with 0:08:28.320 --> 0:08:30.560 people about it, to talk with my family, to talk 0:08:30.560 --> 0:08:36.079 with you guys here at the station. It actually lifted 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:38.640 a lot of weight off my shoulders, being able to say, like, 0:08:38.840 --> 0:08:41.439 I'm going through some sort of depression at the moment, 0:08:42.040 --> 0:08:43.920 even though I pushed against it for so long. 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:48.360 And it's the hardest thing in the world is to 0:08:48.480 --> 0:08:52.160 actually be honest with ourselves. Yeah, it's so hard. And 0:08:52.240 --> 0:08:55.160 I remember when I have my sort of breakdown, it 0:08:55.280 --> 0:08:58.480 was the why can't I keep my shit together? I 0:08:58.480 --> 0:09:01.000 felt less of a man, a man that I'm not 0:09:01.000 --> 0:09:03.360 a good husband, I'm not a good dad. And these 0:09:03.360 --> 0:09:06.600 thoughts are terrifying. They really, I think they stop you 0:09:06.640 --> 0:09:08.920 from thinking that you're even allowed to ask for help. 0:09:09.200 --> 0:09:11.199 They make you feel very lonely alone with it. 0:09:11.520 --> 0:09:13.200 Tell me if you did this like I felt like. 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:16.280 As it was getting worse, I just had to clench 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:18.600 my drawer and like get through it. Like them, I 0:09:18.720 --> 0:09:20.040 just go work harder to get through. 0:09:20.120 --> 0:09:23.880 I remember, I remember that Friday where you've done the show, 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:26.280 but you were there but not there. And I remember 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:27.880 looking at you a couple of times, and you were 0:09:28.280 --> 0:09:30.360 where I was about seven eight years ago, where you 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:32.920 were actually hanging on, you know, the same you're hanging 0:09:32.960 --> 0:09:34.600 on for dear life. You were hanging on to the 0:09:34.600 --> 0:09:37.120 studio desk. Which is why I said after the show, 0:09:37.480 --> 0:09:40.600 Friday said, you're really struggling on because I could recognize 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:43.040 where I was, and like, oh my god, you poor thing. 0:09:43.600 --> 0:09:46.400 You know, you must be feeling so bad that you're 0:09:46.440 --> 0:09:48.319 not having You're not where you should be right now. 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:52.400 Yeah, And it's amazing. I think that people saw it, 0:09:52.880 --> 0:09:54.960 people who saw it in me before I did, because 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:57.240 when you had that discussion with me, and it was 0:09:57.679 --> 0:10:01.000 a few shows where I really felt like I couldn't 0:10:01.040 --> 0:10:02.959 cope and I was just waiting for nine am to 0:10:03.040 --> 0:10:05.040 come just so I could get out of here because 0:10:05.040 --> 0:10:08.760 I I was feeling just not myself. I feel like 0:10:08.800 --> 0:10:12.199 I couldn't keep up with the conversation. And after the 0:10:12.240 --> 0:10:14.800 show a couple of times I just broke out in tears. 0:10:15.760 --> 0:10:17.680 And I don't know if you remember that there's a 0:10:17.760 --> 0:10:19.280 moment where you sat with me for a long while 0:10:19.360 --> 0:10:22.160 after the show and you end up putting your hands 0:10:22.160 --> 0:10:24.120 on my shoulders and he said you need to take 0:10:24.160 --> 0:10:27.480 time off the show, and I was like, no, I don't. 0:10:27.880 --> 0:10:30.559 I'm just tired. It's just like overwhelming. But I'll be 0:10:30.559 --> 0:10:33.400 all right. And you're like, no, I'm not letting you 0:10:33.480 --> 0:10:35.599 come in Monday. You're taking time off the show. And 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:38.600 I did take two weeks off the show, which another 0:10:38.640 --> 0:10:40.120 thing I felt a lot of shame for and a 0:10:40.160 --> 0:10:43.600 lot of guilt about, because I wanted to prove that 0:10:43.640 --> 0:10:45.600 I was strong enough to come back to work quickly 0:10:45.640 --> 0:10:46.640 and then I could be here. 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:51.360 And that language we use, you know, prove to who? 0:10:51.480 --> 0:10:53.840 Who are you proven to? Actually you're what? Real courage 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:56.520 and strength is actually being honest with yourself and people 0:10:56.559 --> 0:10:59.080 around you. That's real courage. And saying I'm struggling at 0:10:59.080 --> 0:11:01.200 the moment, I need some how, i need some space. 0:11:01.480 --> 0:11:04.240 Those are the hardest words to say. It's the being 0:11:04.280 --> 0:11:07.640 alone with our pain, which causes so much suffering all 0:11:07.679 --> 0:11:10.320 around the world. It's that, yeah, well, if you had 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:13.400 something wrong physically, you were not feel embarrassed about and 0:11:13.480 --> 0:11:15.000 I'm going to go and see someone who can help 0:11:15.280 --> 0:11:17.240 help this right now. But why is it with the 0:11:17.280 --> 0:11:19.800 hardest stuff to be with, which is our own emotional 0:11:20.200 --> 0:11:23.600 pain that we feel so bad that we were not 0:11:23.679 --> 0:11:25.719 worthy of getting help. And yeah, I know that if 0:11:25.760 --> 0:11:28.839 any of this team, or Bianca Kanchu said I'm really 0:11:28.840 --> 0:11:31.640 struggling moment, can you help you? You drop everything? Of course? 0:11:31.679 --> 0:11:33.840 Why won't you extend that Why don't we extend that 0:11:34.400 --> 0:11:37.000 kindness to ourselves? Why do we find that so hard? 0:11:37.120 --> 0:11:42.320 Well, I remember convincing myself during it that it's so 0:11:42.440 --> 0:11:46.200 funny because you hear this time and time again like this. 0:11:46.440 --> 0:11:48.680 If I tell people about this, it's just going to 0:11:48.679 --> 0:11:52.440 be a burden on them. They're going to they're going 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:55.920 to think, oh, Bianca is the one who had the baby, 0:11:56.000 --> 0:11:57.840 why are you going through something? 0:11:58.160 --> 0:12:00.520 Well, I remember meeting who I want to make sure 0:12:00.559 --> 0:12:03.080 you meet me by the oak tree tangle car. Yeah, 0:12:03.440 --> 0:12:05.360 I'm not sure if that did help. But anyway, when 0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:07.240 you were sitting then you actually said to me, look, 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:09.719 thanks for it for let me have some time off 0:12:09.760 --> 0:12:11.640 and you know, I will pay you back. And I 0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:14.320 remember getting quite tiff, like you don't what do you? 0:12:14.440 --> 0:12:14.880 What do you think? 0:12:14.920 --> 0:12:17.680 I remember saying the yes, let me took. 0:12:17.679 --> 0:12:19.400 Jack start to my alleger and I was just like, 0:12:19.840 --> 0:12:22.120 what kind of you mean? You think I am going 0:12:22.200 --> 0:12:23.760 to go and make a note on my phone and 0:12:23.840 --> 0:12:27.000 a spreadsheet? Well I won't need that back. Yeah, but 0:12:27.040 --> 0:12:29.440 we do feel like that. You feel a burden and 0:12:29.520 --> 0:12:33.160 on a daylight today, are you okay? Day? It's really 0:12:33.240 --> 0:12:36.319 really hard, even if someone sends you that message. Sometimes 0:12:36.520 --> 0:12:38.760 all right, right now, there's a part of you is 0:12:38.800 --> 0:12:42.640 desperate actually screaming once ago. No I'm not, but you're 0:12:42.679 --> 0:12:44.880 wide about telling somebody that. 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:47.720 Definitely. I think there's a social implication that you fall 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:49.839 into you where you're like, you know what, it's just 0:12:50.000 --> 0:12:53.080 easier to not burden everybody. I appreciate the gesture, but 0:12:53.120 --> 0:12:55.720 I'll just say I'm fine. Yeah, And I know that 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:58.920 was with me. It took you repeated attempts, I think 0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:01.680 you or what was happening to me, And it took 0:13:02.040 --> 0:13:06.040 repeated attempts for me to admit it. Similar thing with 0:13:06.080 --> 0:13:08.640 my mum, similar thing with Bianca. I mean they saw 0:13:08.720 --> 0:13:12.280 me during those moments of crying uncontrollably, and you saw 0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:15.760 me breaking down after the show, and I was still 0:13:16.200 --> 0:13:20.120 reticent to believe what was going on, but I needed 0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:24.480 to because you were opening it up and talking about 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:27.280 it and just letting it. It takes such a burden 0:13:27.320 --> 0:13:29.920 off your back. You just can't believe the burden it 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:35.319 takes off you. Or already I felt half as overwhelmed 0:13:35.360 --> 0:13:36.880 as I was feeling when it was really bad. 0:13:37.040 --> 0:13:40.320 It's kind of like someone you need breathing space, and 0:13:40.400 --> 0:13:43.080 it's like you almost feel like you're drowning it. All 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:46.800 your thoughts and all your worries and all the emotions, 0:13:46.840 --> 0:13:50.080 they're just overwhelming and you need someone or somewhere of 0:13:50.120 --> 0:13:52.880 slamming it all down and getting some air pockets to 0:13:52.960 --> 0:13:55.360 just get a little bit of room that you can 0:13:55.520 --> 0:13:58.440 just expand into, because suddenly you become very tight with everything, 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:01.120 don't you. You can strict. You just need an extra 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:04.319 bit of space to breathe out and to be able 0:14:04.320 --> 0:14:06.160 to talk about it and work through it. And you 0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:09.320 needed that. I needed that seventy eight years ago, but 0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:11.280 I didn't do it the right way. And so when 0:14:11.280 --> 0:14:13.520 I saw what was going on with you, it's a 0:14:13.679 --> 0:14:16.199 chance to be to help somebody, and you did the well. 0:14:16.240 --> 0:14:18.520 I think it's still incredible you went and actually got help. 0:14:19.240 --> 0:14:23.720 It takes tremendous amount of courage. It's hard to actually 0:14:23.760 --> 0:14:26.480 go and accept and go and see a therapist because 0:14:26.960 --> 0:14:29.480 my first couple of sessions, I was an angry, relactant, 0:14:29.600 --> 0:14:33.560 reluctant patient. There I was. I shouldn't be here. I 0:14:33.600 --> 0:14:35.680 thought it was the screw ups. I'm not one of those. 0:14:36.120 --> 0:14:39.000 Why am I here? I felt? In fact, my dad 0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:41.400 had to work for forty years and a calf factory. 0:14:41.680 --> 0:14:44.040 He couldn't do this. What's wrong with me? I'm weak, 0:14:44.160 --> 0:14:46.240 I'm not a man, all of that cry. 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:48.440 And then I went through all of that, and you're 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:51.760 hesitant to go and see somebody who's a professional, who's 0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:55.240 there for these things, and they're just waiting to have 0:14:55.280 --> 0:14:58.120 this conversation with you. But you convince yourself like, oh, 0:14:58.160 --> 0:14:59.720 I'm going to go in there and say this is me, 0:15:00.120 --> 0:15:03.880 of like, get out. I only deal with real trauma. 0:15:04.080 --> 0:15:07.240 This is nothing that you're just being weak. Go suck 0:15:07.280 --> 0:15:08.760 it up. Of course they're not going to say that, 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:11.840 but you you just I don't know why I was 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:14.240 so reluctant to go see somebody, but thank god I did, 0:15:14.520 --> 0:15:17.760 and you put me onto a therapist and she, honestly 0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:21.760 it changed everything. Telling you and Bianco and my mum 0:15:21.880 --> 0:15:24.360 about what was going on with me, and then going 0:15:24.360 --> 0:15:29.040 to see a therapist combined change within a month and 0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:31.480 within two months it already felt amazing. 0:15:31.520 --> 0:15:34.040 And this is why why it's what you're doing is 0:15:34.080 --> 0:15:38.960 amazing talking about this right is because actually the transformation, 0:15:39.200 --> 0:15:42.280 the changes, getting to a different place, a different understanding. 0:15:42.880 --> 0:15:45.240 It's not about curing it or overcoming it or any 0:15:45.240 --> 0:15:48.280 of that kind of language. Is actually not as far 0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:50.240 away as you think it is. When you're really in it, 0:15:50.280 --> 0:15:54.200 you can't imagine ever being how you were. It's unthinkable. 0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:57.200 Everything is right in front of your face. There's no perspective, 0:15:57.320 --> 0:15:59.960 there's no sunny days that you can imagine. It's all glue. 0:16:00.480 --> 0:16:03.400 But actually, once you start to talk about it, and 0:16:03.440 --> 0:16:06.760 it isn't is even because we worry sometimes if I 0:16:06.800 --> 0:16:08.840 say are you okay? What do I then say to 0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:11.800 the tuner having a tough time, it's actually someone hearing 0:16:11.840 --> 0:16:15.520 you to your wife and you know, and you go, 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:17.280 after they've told you everything, you go, you know what 0:16:17.320 --> 0:16:19.440 you should do, and they go, I'm okay, now thanks 0:16:19.440 --> 0:16:21.520 for listening, and I'm quite stressed with this. You need 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:24.120 to do this actually is just allowing someone to be 0:16:24.240 --> 0:16:27.440 heard without being judged is all you need to be 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:28.920 you just need to be a witness sometimes. 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:30.800 And this has made me a better communicator with my 0:16:30.960 --> 0:16:33.800 wife because now I can be a better listener to her. 0:16:34.160 --> 0:16:36.160 And I was that person before that try to fix 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:38.720 everything as it comes up. But some things you just 0:16:38.800 --> 0:16:40.560 need to feel and you just need to talk about. 0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:44.200 And you didn't need fixing. Actually you needed to stay 0:16:44.240 --> 0:16:46.680 with your pain and work out what was behind it. Yeah. 0:16:46.760 --> 0:16:48.440 You know, one funny thing that you said to me 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:50.960 during that time is like, you look back on this, 0:16:51.040 --> 0:16:53.160 you go through it, You'll grow and you'll look back 0:16:53.160 --> 0:16:54.840 on this and it will it will be a gift 0:16:54.840 --> 0:16:55.680 for you. You'll see this. 0:16:55.640 --> 0:17:00.400 Gift at the time this guy that's such bullshit, Thank 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:01.880 you for trying to sugarcoat it. 0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:04.840 But that will never happen to me. And it's funny, like, 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:10.200 in less than six months, I already feel grateful for 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:13.280 that experience. I feel like I have a deeper empathy 0:17:13.320 --> 0:17:16.240 for people. I feel like I have less judgment for people. 0:17:17.359 --> 0:17:21.200 I feel like I could communicate better with my wife, 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:24.160 my friends. I've already had discussions with my friends who've 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:27.040 been friends with for over twenty years and I never 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:29.200 know they know and they went through a hard time 0:17:29.359 --> 0:17:32.280 until I told them what I went through this year. 0:17:32.240 --> 0:17:33.720 And what did it bring you? Only ever brings you 0:17:33.760 --> 0:17:35.600 closer to me. I think it's going to make us 0:17:35.640 --> 0:17:38.560 feel judged, separated, It only ever brings you. I know 0:17:38.600 --> 0:17:41.360 I'm closer to you now because of what's what's been 0:17:41.359 --> 0:17:42.000 going on for you. 0:17:42.160 --> 0:17:45.520 Yeah, it's incredibly difficult to take those first steps of 0:17:45.600 --> 0:17:48.240 opening it up and everything. I remember the feeling of 0:17:48.320 --> 0:17:51.359 everything inside you is going. Just grit and bear it. 0:17:51.520 --> 0:17:56.119 Don't want burning people with it. But it was life 0:17:56.200 --> 0:17:59.760 changing and it had to be done telling having you know, 0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:02.840 having Bianca know about it, having my friends and family 0:18:02.880 --> 0:18:07.800 know about it changed and the support was overwhelmingly positive. 0:18:07.840 --> 0:18:09.240 And what did you see? You saw that people. 0:18:09.400 --> 0:18:11.760 We want to have people care like I even was 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:15.280 worried about the state, like taking time off the radio 0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:19.960 show and feeling guilty about that. But even so, the boss, 0:18:20.000 --> 0:18:21.959 you know, like we joke sometimes that she's meant to us, 0:18:21.960 --> 0:18:25.199 but she was so lovely, she was so understanding. She 0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:27.680 didn't make me feel any guilt about coming back. Quickly 0:18:28.320 --> 0:18:31.240 she gave me assurances that my job will still be 0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:34.080 here when I come back. Having that assurance from you 0:18:34.119 --> 0:18:36.480 as well, and for you and Patsy and Rio to 0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:39.679 hold onto the show while I wasn't here and to 0:18:39.720 --> 0:18:42.840 give me that space, and just but above all, to 0:18:42.840 --> 0:18:45.760 feel the love from you all, to feel the love 0:18:45.840 --> 0:18:49.520 coming back in here again, and a deeper connection with 0:18:49.600 --> 0:18:51.879 everybody who works on the show and everybody who have 0:18:51.880 --> 0:18:52.159 told I. 0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:54.280 Think sometimes that's what our pain is for, is actually 0:18:54.320 --> 0:18:56.800 to connect us to people because I don't know about you. 0:18:56.920 --> 0:18:59.320 Is that I feel closer to friends of mine or 0:18:59.320 --> 0:19:01.360 people when they do open up and say I'm really 0:19:01.400 --> 0:19:04.000 struggling at the moment, I actually feel closer to them. Yeah, 0:19:04.040 --> 0:19:06.439 it's like you connect on a deeper level, you know, 0:19:06.560 --> 0:19:08.520 And I do with you, and I know. I saw 0:19:08.560 --> 0:19:11.800 you on Father's Day. It's amazing how Sunday was Father's Day. Yeah, 0:19:11.800 --> 0:19:13.520 And I saw how you were with Gordon, and I 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:16.720 saw how you were with your wife. That's his You've 0:19:16.720 --> 0:19:19.200 been through your dark knight the soul, but you are 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:20.560 in a better place. 0:19:20.880 --> 0:19:23.240 I am, Oh, no doubt about it at all. And 0:19:23.280 --> 0:19:26.800 I wasn't. Yeah. It's funny to think only three months 0:19:26.800 --> 0:19:28.920 ago I wasn't like that, and now I can't think 0:19:28.920 --> 0:19:31.160 of anything but out of love for him, for Bianca, 0:19:32.840 --> 0:19:35.280 for life like I get zest for life back, looking 0:19:35.280 --> 0:19:39.000 forward to things again and enjoying doing the show, enjoying 0:19:39.040 --> 0:19:42.679 doing my work. So I want to thank you, obviously, 0:19:42.760 --> 0:19:45.040 want to thank my wife. She was amazing through all 0:19:45.080 --> 0:19:49.399 the support. And if you're going, if you feel like 0:19:49.440 --> 0:19:51.520 this resonates with you, like you're in a feeling where 0:19:51.520 --> 0:19:53.640 you feel like you can't tell everybody and it will 0:19:53.640 --> 0:19:55.840 be a burden for people. People will be better off 0:19:55.880 --> 0:20:00.080