Speaker 1: Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud yr
Speaker 1: the Order KERNI Whoalbury and a waddery woman. And before
Speaker 1: we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
Speaker 1: would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
Speaker 1: of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
Speaker 1: acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming
Speaker 1: through as this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing
Speaker 1: and the storytelling of you to make a difference for
Speaker 1: today and lasting impact for tomorrow.
Speaker 2: Let's get into it.
Speaker 3: She's on the Money, She's on the Money.
Speaker 4: Hello, and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
Speaker 4: for millennials who want financial freedom. Welcome back to another
Speaker 4: shot back money Diary Monday, where we get to chat
Speaker 4: to one of our community members to learn about them,
Speaker 4: their money, their finance, all of the fun things in between.
Speaker 4: And Victoria, I've got a long one to read to
Speaker 4: you today.
Speaker 5: A long one.
Speaker 4: Let's take it away, my love, our diarist, says at
Speaker 4: age fifteen, my older sister and I found ourselves in
Speaker 4: government housing on our own due to a turbulent home life.
Speaker 4: I worked five days a week in retail as well
Speaker 4: as going to high school, but eventually dropped out at
Speaker 4: age eighteen to start working in a brothel to make
Speaker 4: lots of money quickly. I had big plans to work
Speaker 4: full time in the industry, but everyone around me told
Speaker 4: me I was young and dumb and I needed a
Speaker 4: different career, so I got a job working as a
Speaker 4: flight attendant for a few years. Fast forward to age
Speaker 4: twenty one, I found myself a single mum. I worked
Speaker 4: part time as a flight attendant and part time at
Speaker 4: the brothel, but found that too many commitments was overwhelming
Speaker 4: and exhausting, so I quit the flying career and became
Speaker 4: a full time sex worker. A few years later, at
Speaker 4: age twenty three, without a dollar to my name, me
Speaker 4: and my now husband, who I had only been seeing
Speaker 4: for two months, signed the contract on a block of land,
Speaker 4: and I had eleven days to come up with a
Speaker 4: twenty one thousand dollar deposit. Thanks to sex work, I
Speaker 4: was able to make this money in such a short
Speaker 4: period of time, and that purchase has set us up stunningly.
Speaker 4: I am now thirty one years old, I have another
Speaker 4: child with my husband, to investment properties, and life is
Speaker 4: very financially different than it ever would have been if
Speaker 4: I had not just started to do sex work full time.
Speaker 4: At the beginning of the pandemic, me and my husband
Speaker 4: lost the majority of their incomes overnight, and I had
Speaker 4: to pivot from in person sex work to creating and
Speaker 4: only fans, which has now taken over as my main
Speaker 4: source of income, and in person sex work is now
Speaker 4: very much a part time income for me.
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, what a hustler. Welcome to the show.
Speaker 2: Hello, thank you.
Speaker 5: I'm so excited to have you because I like to
Speaker 5: think that we're Instagram friends as well. So I've been
Speaker 5: so pervy about your journey because like I obviously know
Speaker 5: what you do and what you get up to, but
Speaker 5: I'm like, how did you get here? What does that mean? Like,
Speaker 5: obviously I know what your Instagram is and we're not
Speaker 5: going to share it, but obviously you are very successful
Speaker 5: in this industry and do a lot, so it makes
Speaker 5: sense that a majority of your income comes from only fans,
Speaker 5: and then the in person sex work is kind of
Speaker 5: like part time. Now, Like that's cool. Did you see
Speaker 5: that coming?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: And yeah, it's nothing I ever could have imagined. I
Speaker 2: started only fans just to sort of get me through
Speaker 2: the lockdowns and the pandemic. Being an in person sex worker,
Speaker 2: you can't really do that socially distanced. No, No, I
Speaker 2: heard it was pretty physical as a job. Yeah, So
Speaker 2: with all the lockdowns and everything, I just had to
Speaker 2: really push my only events to sort of be successful.
Speaker 2: And it really has. It's taken off and it's so great,
Speaker 2: Like the lifestyle is really good. So it has taken
Speaker 2: over and I still see clients, but that's not my
Speaker 2: number one like mainstream of income.
Speaker 5: Now, Oh my gosh. Well, let's get straight into the
Speaker 5: structured questions and kick it off with money. Doris, Can
Speaker 5: you tell us a little bit about your money story.
Speaker 2: So growing up, I had two like really hard working parents.
Speaker 2: They both did shift work. We had a nice home,
Speaker 2: and me and my siblings we all got to do
Speaker 2: like dancing and like gymnastics, whatever we wanted to do.
Speaker 2: Asides from that, we didn't really have much else, but
Speaker 2: like that, we had more than enough. Really. My parents
Speaker 2: would often like talk about money in front of us,
Speaker 2: but I just remember always hearing we're so broke, we're
Speaker 2: so broke, We're so broke, And in hindsight, I don't
Speaker 2: think my parents were ever so broke. They just yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm not sure where they put their money. They were
Speaker 2: pretty good with it though, to be honest, Like looking
Speaker 2: at them now, they've you know, they've got a house
Speaker 2: paid off and they've got a good chunk of souper
Speaker 2: and stuff like that. So that's what money was like
Speaker 2: growing up for me.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so talk to me about how when you were
Speaker 5: fifteen you found yourself in government housing, Like how did
Speaker 5: you go from this beautiful lifestyle that you just explained
Speaker 5: to going, all right, now I'm in government housing because
Speaker 5: of a turbulent home life, Like what happened? My friend?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so they were like they're good, they're great, hard workers,
Speaker 2: and I have a great relationship with them now. But
Speaker 2: as a teenager, my mum had lots of physical and
Speaker 2: mental health issues and it was very, very turbulent, and
Speaker 2: I got kicked out of home. My older sister left,
Speaker 2: my other sister ended up getting kicked out as well,
Speaker 2: and it was all sorts of fun. So it's weird
Speaker 2: because we kind of came from like a decent home,
Speaker 2: but it was real. We had a really rough, like
Speaker 2: teenage year. So yeah, so into government housing.
Speaker 5: That's a really interesting juxtaposition. How did you deal with that?
Speaker 5: Because I feel like going from a lifestyle that you
Speaker 5: just explained to going to government housing and having to
Speaker 5: have your own income and then obviously deciding an eighteen
Speaker 5: to drop out, that's a very big shift. How did
Speaker 5: you deal with that? Were you okay?
Speaker 2: Well, I've always been like really independent. Looking back, I
Speaker 2: probably did go through like moments of like depression and
Speaker 2: stuff like that, but at the time, I didn't really
Speaker 2: understand my own feelings and I didn't recognize like what
Speaker 2: depression was. But like looking back, I probably definitely experienced
Speaker 2: it as a teenager, but I was always really independent.
Speaker 2: I had a part time job, so I just picked
Speaker 2: up extra shifts there I was to work and that
Speaker 2: sort of thing. So I had a lot of good
Speaker 2: like friends as well at the time, so that was
Speaker 2: really good.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I love that. All right, Next question, my friend,
Speaker 5: I think we already got here, but what do you
Speaker 5: do for work? And the juicy part, how much money
Speaker 5: do you earn?
Speaker 2: So I do only fans and I do in person
Speaker 2: like sex works. I'm an escort. It varies a lot,
Speaker 2: so I average between five and ten k a week,
Speaker 2: but that's because I have, like I have two kids.
Speaker 2: I don't really work too hard. If I wanted to
Speaker 2: work harder, I could definitely.
Speaker 5: What do you mean you don't work too hard? You're like, oh,
Speaker 5: five and ten k a week, but I don't work hard.
Speaker 5: I'm like, what, I know, that's beyond most people's wildest dreams.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm pretty lazy. I only really work like I
Speaker 2: do one booking a day roughly, but that's all I
Speaker 2: really need to do. And like I've got such a
Speaker 2: busy home life, it's a perfect like balance. There has
Speaker 2: been times where I've worked a lot harder and you know,
Speaker 2: made double or triple that in a week, but generally
Speaker 2: between five and ten k.
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, cool. Can you tell us about the
Speaker 5: breakdown of that? So how much of that is only
Speaker 5: fans and how much of that is in person sex work.
Speaker 2: I find it really hard to focus on two things
Speaker 2: at once. So like if I have a week with
Speaker 2: lots of escort bookings, then I find my only fans
Speaker 2: takes a massive dip. Or if I find I don't
Speaker 2: have many escort bookings one week, then I can focus
Speaker 2: my time on my only fans, and then that goes up,
Speaker 2: So it really depends week to week, but like it
Speaker 2: just depends on what I'm focusing on or what's like
Speaker 2: busier that week. But yeah, so some weeks it's more
Speaker 2: only fans. Like it really just depends so ebbs and
Speaker 2: flows depending on where you're focusing your energy pretty much. Yeah, yeah, cool,
Speaker 2: I find this so interesting. Tell me next, my friend,
Speaker 2: what is your big money goal? So settling their two
Speaker 2: investment properties. So we bought them eighteen months ago, but
Speaker 2: they have settled yet, so I'm just putting money towards
Speaker 2: like making sure I've got the twenty percent deposits on
Speaker 2: both of them.
Speaker 4: That's a long settlement period. Is it two properties in
Speaker 4: one purchase or is it two separate properties with just
Speaker 4: really long settlements.
Speaker 2: They're two separate properties. The settlement has just been delayed.
Speaker 2: They're like townhouses, so they'll settle. It's is that like
Speaker 2: called turnkey? I think maybe?
Speaker 4: So you're building yep, bip yep.
Speaker 2: That makes sense. Yeah, So I put the five percent
Speaker 2: deposit down and then I don't pay anything until like
Speaker 2: I'm ready to have tenants move in basically, so yeah,
Speaker 2: it's a long time. But they've got to like settle
Speaker 2: the land and build as well.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: That I was like, normally when you purchase settlements like
Speaker 4: thirty to ninety days and I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 4: eighteen months what happened. No, yeah, it was like, yeah,
Speaker 4: it's off the plan basically, Yeah, yeah, airpic all right,
Speaker 4: next question, And I feel like the answer is yes,
Speaker 4: because you just told us about your properties.
Speaker 5: But do you have any investments? If so, what are they?
Speaker 1: So?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would include the two townhouses that I just
Speaker 2: told you. I've really been focusing on my SUPER the
Speaker 2: last two years because mostly being self employed throughout my life,
Speaker 2: I've definitely ignored that.
Speaker 5: I feel like that's a very common thing with people
Speaker 5: who are self employed to just completely forget their SUPER.
Speaker 5: But regardless of what type of job you do, it
Speaker 5: is a priority and a massive one totally.
Speaker 2: And like my dad would always like tell me, like,
Speaker 2: make sure you're putting money in your super, and I'm like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: And it was always a thing like yeah, when I've
Speaker 2: got more money, when I can afford it, I will
Speaker 2: start putting money into my SUPER. But I'm super glad
Speaker 2: that I've been able to sort of really focus on
Speaker 2: that and sort of get that up to sort of
Speaker 2: like an average I guess for my age. Finally it
Speaker 2: feels really good. I'm like, oh, I feel and I'd
Speaker 2: like to buy shares, but I'm really uneducated on them,
Speaker 2: so they're completely like worthless. Now. I've bought air Tasker
Speaker 2: shares when they first came out, and they were like
Speaker 2: a dollar thirty and now they're like like two cents.
Speaker 2: Oh really yeah, really shit?
Speaker 5: What made you purchase air Tasker shares? Like, what made
Speaker 5: you go? You know what? I'm going to get into
Speaker 5: the share market. This is my entry level share. Why
Speaker 5: air Tasker?
Speaker 2: I haven't got a clue to the honest I think
Speaker 2: I just like read probably on Reddit somewhere that they
Speaker 2: were like ipoing and at the time I was just
Speaker 2: like adhd super focusing on shares, and I was like, okay, great,
Speaker 2: this sounds like a good one.
Speaker 5: We've all been there, Like I shouldn't have been it
Speaker 5: on the podcast, But like I do super focus on
Speaker 5: particular shares, and I've made some really good decisions. But
Speaker 5: sometimes I'm like Vitora, why are you even looking at this?
Speaker 5: Like that makes no sense. It does not align to
Speaker 5: your risk profile. But that is very exciting. The next
Speaker 5: question for you is do you have any debt? If so,
Speaker 5: how much and what for.
Speaker 2: I have tax debt. I had like a six month
Speaker 2: mental health holiday last year and it cost me a
Speaker 2: fortune and I wasn't putting any like tax aside at
Speaker 2: the time, So I have a bit of tax set.
Speaker 2: I feel like being self employed. I feel like so
Speaker 2: many people find themselves in tax stet like I definitely
Speaker 2: have on multiple occasions. I'm trying to be so much
Speaker 2: better with it. But yeah, I'm just a bit behind
Speaker 2: on tax at the moment. But yeah, just tax and
Speaker 2: my mortgage.
Speaker 5: I need to get you onto my bookkeeper, but we'll
Speaker 5: take that conversation offline, my friend. Next question is do
Speaker 5: you you shop back?
Speaker 2: No, I die, I'm too basic for that.
Speaker 5: I'm not too basic. You downloaded Chrome to do this
Speaker 5: podcast interviews, So now all you need to do is
Speaker 5: get the shop back extension and then you're set to
Speaker 5: go because it's automatic. It's the best money when I've
Speaker 5: ever heard of.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'll tell it it.
Speaker 5: Next question is what do you think is your best
Speaker 5: money Habit.
Speaker 2: Probably setting like really high goals, like when we put
Speaker 2: our deposit down on our block of land, we didn't
Speaker 2: have any money to our name, and like just being
Speaker 2: able to come up with a lot of money really quickly,
Speaker 2: You know, it is great.
Speaker 5: That's not too bad. Being able to make money is
Speaker 5: a good thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Probably my ability to make lots of money is
Speaker 2: my best money habit.
Speaker 5: I don't know, that's a pretty good money habit. I
Speaker 5: feel like all of us want that. We want to
Speaker 5: be like we are able to make bank like Jesse,
Speaker 5: Is that not something you want to be able to
Speaker 5: say consistently? Ah, that's the definite dream. Yeah, exactly. So
Speaker 5: to flip that on its head, what's your worst money habit?
Speaker 2: Then budgeting one hundred percent? Like, I consider myself like
Speaker 2: a high income earner, and to someone who earns that
Speaker 2: much money, I'm always like having to brow money off
Speaker 2: my friends because I like, am just so bad with
Speaker 2: managing my money.
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, it sounds like you need our budgeting
Speaker 5: cashually masterclass.
Speaker 2: Stat I could probably deal with that.
Speaker 5: I will get you onto that next question, what grade
Speaker 5: would you give your money habits if we forced you
Speaker 5: to give yourself a grade A? Z?
Speaker 2: I said?
Speaker 5: Why is Z? I don't think we've ever had a
Speaker 5: Z on the podcast.
Speaker 2: I think the easy come, easygo of my money has
Speaker 2: like fostered really bad money habits for me. And I
Speaker 2: think the only reason I have gotten to where I'm
Speaker 2: in life is because I've had a high income for
Speaker 2: so long. But I'm like, I definitely haven't worked out
Speaker 2: I had a budget, I haven't worked out a save,
Speaker 2: I haven't worked anything out.
Speaker 5: So I do have to ask, what are you doing
Speaker 5: with that money?
Speaker 4: Then?
Speaker 5: Because if you're earning between five and ten thousand dollars
Speaker 5: each and every single week, I don't know if you've
Speaker 5: calculated this, but that's between two hundred and sixty and
Speaker 5: five hundred and twenty thousand dollars each and every single year,
Speaker 5: my friend, what are you doing with that money?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Good question. I just spent a lot on an
Speaker 2: overseas holiday. Well, at the moment, I'm saving, Like I
Speaker 2: am saving quite aggressively to the point where like I
Speaker 2: can't eat, you know, on the last day before I
Speaker 2: get paid because I've saved too much money that week.
Speaker 2: Like that's what I mean. Like I'm really bad with money,
Speaker 2: but like I do set pretty good goals like buying
Speaker 2: houses and stuff like that, and like putting heaps of
Speaker 2: money into my super the last two years and stuff
Speaker 2: like that.
Speaker 5: I don't think you're a sad I think we can
Speaker 5: do better than that. But I want to talk to
Speaker 5: you more in detail about your work and what you
Speaker 5: do and how much money you want. And also you
Speaker 5: mentioned ADHD before, but we'll do that after this really
Speaker 5: quick break. All right, we are back Money direst. You
Speaker 5: have what we would call a very colorful career, and
Speaker 5: the most exciting part of your career for me as
Speaker 5: a financial advisor is the part where you can scale
Speaker 5: your income based on just how much you want to work.
Speaker 5: And I mean it's one of those things where I
Speaker 5: look at a lot of freelancers and the same is true.
Speaker 5: But for you, you can go from earning five thousand
Speaker 5: dollars a week turning ten thousand dollars a week turning
Speaker 5: double that depending on I guess how much time, energy
Speaker 5: and effort you just want to put into your work.
Speaker 5: And as you said before, you were like, oh, I'm
Speaker 5: pretty lazy. I just don't want to do that much.
Speaker 5: I'll just do one a day and basically work part time, which,
Speaker 5: to be honest, is the dream. How did you get
Speaker 5: to this point? Because I feel like the industry you
Speaker 5: work in. Sex work is very shrouded with people saying like,
Speaker 5: oh my gosh, it's not good. It's you know, something
Speaker 5: that you know you're never going to earn as much
Speaker 5: as you think you're going to earn, whereas you are
Speaker 5: literally showing everybody that that is not the case at all.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So the reason why I got into sex work
Speaker 2: is because I just wanted this lifestyle. Like I wanted
Speaker 2: lots of time in my day to do whatever I wanted.
Speaker 2: That was my whole motivation. I grew up like in
Speaker 2: the outer suburbs, like in a really nice like area,
Speaker 2: and that's all I wanted for myself. So like I
Speaker 2: grew up in like a pretty sort of modest like
Speaker 2: lifestyle and that's all I really like aspired to And
Speaker 2: I was pretty happy and like being a mum, and
Speaker 2: I was a single mum for a couple of years
Speaker 2: as well. It's just really allowed me to like get ahead.
Speaker 2: I suppose, like I didn't have anything. I you know,
Speaker 2: I spent all my money traveling when I was younger,
Speaker 2: so when I had my oldest son, again, I had
Speaker 2: no money. So it's just allowed me to sort of,
Speaker 2: you know, get a couple of steps ahead and still
Speaker 2: be there for my kids and have time to do
Speaker 2: the things I want to do.
Speaker 5: I feel like you're living your own dream lifestyle would
Speaker 5: be Would that be hitting the nail on the head?
Speaker 2: I am, Yeah, it's not for everyone, but all right.
Speaker 5: Talk to me about your budget and your cash flow though,
Speaker 5: Like why are you earning so much money and not
Speaker 5: prioritizing putting this in place? You mentioned before, and it's
Speaker 5: something that I've resonated with you, not because we've discussed
Speaker 5: it before, but because I feel like I can pick
Speaker 5: a personality that's very similar to mine, and that is ADHD.
Speaker 5: You mentioned that sometimes you do deep dives on things
Speaker 5: and get really hyper focused on one thing. How has
Speaker 5: that impacted your ability to do budget and cash flow
Speaker 5: and the work that you do?
Speaker 2: Okay, it's definitely set a goal and like hyper focus
Speaker 2: on the goal and that'll be the only thing I
Speaker 2: think about for months on end. I recently did that
Speaker 2: with like my trip to America, and I ignored everything
Speaker 2: else in my life for a couple of months. I
Speaker 2: had bills like overd and everything. I'm like, that's okay,
Speaker 2: that can just wait. Yeah, Adhd is fun.
Speaker 5: Well, it's a dream I love having it not Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I've definitely found like for me, sex, work
Speaker 2: and ADHD like two p's in a pod. You know,
Speaker 2: Like if you are like having a bad day or
Speaker 2: a bad week, or like a whole bad period, you know,
Speaker 2: like it's not the end of the world. You've normally
Speaker 2: got like a bit of cash reserve to sort of
Speaker 2: prop you up for a couple of weeks to just
Speaker 2: get through whatever you're going through at the time. Yeah, although,
Speaker 2: like if you do have a goal, you can hyper
Speaker 2: focus and just smash out lots of work and you know,
Speaker 2: pay for whatever you want.
Speaker 4: You said before that partially because of your ADHD. You know,
Speaker 4: budgeting is definitely up there with what you would call
Speaker 4: your worst habits. Has that gotten worse for you as
Speaker 4: you've started earning more because we talk about a lot
Speaker 4: on the show, you know, lifestyle creep, where in your
Speaker 4: more money, you spend more money. Have you found that
Speaker 4: now that you do have more disposable income that's kind
Speaker 4: of aggravated your bad habits when it comes to budgeting
Speaker 4: because you can kind of push your cash for Uh.
Speaker 2: No, actually, I'd say it's the opposite. The way I
Speaker 2: earn money. So as a sex worker, a lot of
Speaker 2: the money I earn is through cash, but if I'm
Speaker 2: earning it online, it goes straight into my bank account,
Speaker 2: and seeing the numbers in my bank account, I can
Speaker 2: pay bills a lot easier. I don't know, it's a
Speaker 2: lot better as I've gotten older and my income's changed
Speaker 2: from cash income to like in my bank account income,
Speaker 2: because if it's in my bank account, I can just
Speaker 2: log on and pay a bill, whereas when it's cash,
Speaker 2: like I have to go to the bank and bank
Speaker 2: it and do all that, and it's just that's like
Speaker 2: just too many steps. You know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I totally know what you mean. It sounds a
Speaker 4: lot like everything that you've said through your diary has
Speaker 4: been super positive. You have this really infectious, upbeat energy
Speaker 4: around you. I want to ask, because we do try
Speaker 4: and show, you know, the shade and the light. What
Speaker 4: are some of the challenges that you found working in
Speaker 4: the industry that you work in. How does it go
Speaker 4: being a mom, juggling kids and then sex work. What
Speaker 4: challenges would you want people to know about before they
Speaker 4: kind of look into jumping into this kind of work themselves.
Speaker 2: It depends on what your networks are like you're possibly
Speaker 2: gonna have falling out with family or friends, you know,
Speaker 2: if you've got like another career, Like how could this
Speaker 2: potentially affect your other career? Those sorts of things. Kids
Speaker 2: as well, you have to consider, like what's going to happen,
Speaker 2: you know, if their friends find out that sort of thing,
Speaker 2: and yeah, and I guess you just have to weigh up,
Speaker 2: like the chance to make money in the sex industry
Speaker 2: does all the pros outweit the cons for me. So
Speaker 2: for me definitely, because I don't really have any fallback on,
Speaker 2: anything else to fall back on, Like I started sex
Speaker 2: work when I was eighteen, and this is like a
Speaker 2: forever thing for me. This is what I want to do.
Speaker 2: But it's put me in like such a different financial
Speaker 2: situation that I ever could have dreamt of. There's nothing
Speaker 2: like that would stop me. There is a few other
Speaker 2: bad things, the financial discrimination that we face as sex workers.
Speaker 2: So often sex workers will have their bank accounts closed down,
Speaker 2: it's really hard to get more. You can't have payment
Speaker 2: processes on any of your websites. So those things are
Speaker 2: really annoying and really tricky, and we don't fall under
Speaker 2: any antidiscrimination acts.
Speaker 5: That actually blows my mind. It wasn't until a few
Speaker 5: years ago that I was talking to clients and I
Speaker 5: was like, oh my gosh, you should just use like Stripe,
Speaker 5: or you should just use some kind of platform like
Speaker 5: Square reader or something. Sure, you can plug that into
Speaker 5: your website and you'll make your life so much easier.
Speaker 5: And one of my clients was like, Victoria, do you
Speaker 5: know we can't have that? And I was like watch,
Speaker 5: She's like I signed up for it and it got
Speaker 5: canceled and then they took all the money that was
Speaker 5: in there, and I was like what, Like, I had
Speaker 5: no idea that it was so hard. But it's a
Speaker 5: legal career in Australia, Like, it is a job that
Speaker 5: you are legally able to do. Do you know why
Speaker 5: they're so discriminatory? Like that to me is insane.
Speaker 2: They see it as like a high risk industry, which
Speaker 2: I don't agree with, Like, yeah, I think they see
Speaker 2: it as like potential for a high amount of chargebacks,
Speaker 2: but I don't know.
Speaker 5: I actually don't know. Before I've reached out to a
Speaker 5: platform before to get comment and have a chat and
Speaker 5: be like I'd love to understand this further, but I
Speaker 5: didn't hear back. So to me, it just sounds insane
Speaker 5: that you can't have the freedom to just process payments
Speaker 5: the way you would want to. And I think this
Speaker 5: is a challenge that most people don't understand exists. It's
Speaker 5: also around getting home loans and getting mortgages and people
Speaker 5: not respecting that as a genuine career, even though you'll go, well,
Speaker 5: you know what, at the crux of it, I'm a
Speaker 5: sole trader. I earned this amount of money and I
Speaker 5: can prove it for the last five financial years and
Speaker 5: my bookkeeping is clean, like it is really easy look
Speaker 5: at it. And they'll still look at that and go, oh,
Speaker 5: but it's sex work, can you go? But it's real work,
Speaker 5: Like I don't understand.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's one of the most like tricky things for
Speaker 2: me as a sex worker to get my head around,
Speaker 2: because we do all these things, but at the end
Speaker 2: of the day, like my bank account get me closed
Speaker 2: down tomorrow, right, and so, like society has this huge
Speaker 2: issue with sex workers paying tax is like okay, great,
Speaker 2: but to pay tax, I need to have a bank
Speaker 2: account and paying takes for my business, like I want
Speaker 2: to get something out of it, like a mortgage.
Speaker 5: Like yeah, like I genuinely want to contribute to this society.
Speaker 5: I want to pay taxes, like, please let me do that.
Speaker 5: I'm not trying to scam the system. This is good
Speaker 5: on a sex work.
Speaker 4: Are there accountants that specialize in your industry? Do you
Speaker 4: have an accountant that like knows all the ins and
Speaker 4: outs and the challenges like the bank account thing that
Speaker 4: sex workers have.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there is accountants that specialize in the industry. But again,
Speaker 2: like I don't. I think there's there's ways around it.
Speaker 2: You've got to get like someone who can help you
Speaker 2: with like a bro car and that sort of thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: and you yeah, you just have to get creative, which
Speaker 2: is you know, that's so interesting.
Speaker 4: I'd never thought about that being like a challenging part
Speaker 4: of it because, like Victoria said it, so you go,
Speaker 4: it's a job.
Speaker 2: It is what it is.
Speaker 4: Like people are doing the work, they're getting paid for it,
Speaker 4: and that should kind of be the end of the conversation.
Speaker 4: And I get that, you know, it's not for everybody,
Speaker 4: but it's crazy to think that businesses can you know,
Speaker 4: make those choices that really impact your ability to operate
Speaker 4: and there's no laws against that. I mean, if you're
Speaker 4: not doing anything wrong, I don't see why they should
Speaker 4: be able to just pull the plug on your bank account.
Speaker 5: And I think it really contributes as well, and maybe
Speaker 5: you might agree with this. I feel like it contributes
Speaker 5: to the stigma because it stops you from legitimizing your
Speaker 5: business in a way that means that you can talk
Speaker 5: about it more openly or you know, share your structures
Speaker 5: or share what's going on, or just go oh no,
Speaker 5: this is legit. This is how it's set up, this
Speaker 5: is how it is. Like people are like, oh, well,
Speaker 5: you're not allowed to do that. Like that to me
Speaker 5: just feels like it's a step in the wrong direction. Like, guys,
Speaker 5: it's twenty twenty two. We can do that if we
Speaker 5: want to. Like, it's not as though this is outlawed
Speaker 5: here in Australia. This is a genuine stream of employment,
Speaker 5: like you can pick it when you do your tax
Speaker 5: return from the drop down menu. It's not something that
Speaker 5: isn't recognized. So I don't understand why platforms don't support you.
Speaker 5: And to be honest, I think it would create a
Speaker 5: safer sex work environment if you were able to have
Speaker 5: that back up, right, Like if you were able to
Speaker 5: process payments through a third party platform, so if something
Speaker 5: doesn't go right, you are protected in the same way
Speaker 5: I would be if I went and did a financial advice.
Speaker 2: Meeting, Yeah, and saying with like income protection and like
Speaker 2: all the insurances in our superannuation absolutely not like I've
Speaker 2: checked emailed them and I've gotten confirmation like no, like
Speaker 2: sex work is not COVID, there is no way it's not.
Speaker 5: So it's not. So I'm pretty sure you can have
Speaker 5: life insurance. But TPD, trauma insurance, and income protection are
Speaker 5: all quite cagey around sex work because they just think
Speaker 5: it's too high of a risk industry for them to cover.
Speaker 5: And I mean, from my point of view, I can
Speaker 5: see where they're coming from, but I also can't see
Speaker 5: where they're coming from because the things they say, like
Speaker 5: I'll talk to underwriters and I'll be like, I don't understand,
Speaker 5: Like she's a sex worker, why won't you cover her?
Speaker 5: Because I always going to bat for my clients, and
Speaker 5: even if I've had the conversation before, I want to
Speaker 5: be able to say no money direst I literally called
Speaker 5: them again and they're still unwilling, but they'll say it's
Speaker 5: super high risk, Like the chance of STDs are really high,
Speaker 5: And I'm like, have you ever met a sex worker?
Speaker 5: Like do you realize that the chance that they have
Speaker 5: a STD is so much lower than the general population,
Speaker 5: Like I am higher risk, Like you don't ask me
Speaker 5: how much I sleep around in my you know, income
Speaker 5: protection applications, But you'll jump to a conclusion about a
Speaker 5: sex worker when in reality, I can guarantee you a
Speaker 5: lot of the general public are being a lot less safe.
Speaker 5: So I feel like it's just very counterintuitive and very
Speaker 5: driven by stereotypes, which is just blankantly unfair.
Speaker 2: It's so unfair. I'm so annoyed about it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, look, I share your frustrations, but I want to
Speaker 5: go back to something you said before, like, when you
Speaker 5: chose this industry, you had to be aware of you know,
Speaker 5: maybe your family, your friends not accepting it, or you know,
Speaker 5: people judging you, or people from your chi school or
Speaker 5: their friends finding out. How have you dealt with that?
Speaker 5: Is that something that's really hard for you.
Speaker 2: As I've gotten older, No, But when I was younger, yeah,
Speaker 2: it was hard because like I knew I was making
Speaker 2: the best decision for me, you know, growing up as
Speaker 2: someone with adhc. It was so hard to focus in school.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, I don't know what I'm gonna do. Like,
Speaker 2: life's just going to be so hard for me. I
Speaker 2: just know it. As soon as I found out about sex, like,
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, this is my chance to like
Speaker 2: live a normal life and be okay, Like I'm going
Speaker 2: to be fine now thanks to sex work. And because
Speaker 2: I started so young, I didn't expect my friends to
Speaker 2: really understand and they dropped me. And that was really hard,
Speaker 2: Like it was quite isolating. You know, there's no hard feelings.
Speaker 2: We've actually all reconnected now. Oh I love that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's nice. I told my family a few years later,
Speaker 2: and that all went down like really fine. My mum
Speaker 2: was just like, oh I wish I did that when
Speaker 2: I before I met your dad.
Speaker 5: She's like, you child, you're really smart.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. So my family are pretty like liberal and
Speaker 2: like very much like me, so you know, I was
Speaker 2: expecting that to be fine. My husband comes from a
Speaker 2: very very conservative family, so I think they just think
Speaker 2: that I don't even have a job at the moment.
Speaker 5: Is this really kept woman? You are a kept woman?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I think they think I'm just really lazy and
Speaker 2: don't do anything, let them, let them keep like I.
Speaker 5: Also, but guys, guys, I'm still contributing to this family.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, it was hard when I was younger, but
Speaker 2: now that I'm older and like, I've got thick skin
Speaker 2: and I don't know, I don't really care what people
Speaker 2: think of me either, So it's fun.
Speaker 5: I feel like I've obviously followed you and know your
Speaker 5: journey and your story and know that you have two
Speaker 5: kids and you have a loving husband. But I feel
Speaker 5: like that's such a juxtaposition to what people think the
Speaker 5: world of sex work is. Like, do you find that
Speaker 5: this is pretty comm Like in the sex industry, lots
Speaker 5: of people are married with kids, but they don't promote it,
Speaker 5: they don't talk about it, that's not part of their
Speaker 5: online personas. Like is that something as you were growing
Speaker 5: up you were like, oh my gosh, I don't know
Speaker 5: if I will have a family and a husband because
Speaker 5: I've chosen this career path. Or you're always like, no,
Speaker 5: it's not going to matter.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was actually talking about that with a girlfriend yesterday. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that actually was part of, you know, the reasoning for
Speaker 2: a lot of my life's choices. I thought i'd never
Speaker 2: be loved and I would never find a partner, like
Speaker 2: I'm a sex worker, no one's ever going to accept
Speaker 2: me and stuff like that. We're just talking about it yesterday.
Speaker 2: How like wild it is that you know, I've got this,
Speaker 2: you know, white picked fence, two and a half kids
Speaker 2: lifestyle and I'm a sex circus. I've got my cake
Speaker 2: and I'm eating it too, Like I've definitely got everything.
Speaker 5: I genuinely feel like you do, especially because you said, oh,
Speaker 5: we just went on a family holiday to the US,
Speaker 5: like that was really big. How as a sex worker
Speaker 5: did you travel to the US, because I know that's
Speaker 5: a massive hurdle for a lot of my clients.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so part of the ESTA requirements is you're not
Speaker 2: allowed to have been involved in prostitution in the last
Speaker 2: ten years. And obviously, like I am, so it's just
Speaker 2: like a punt. Really, you just have to like go
Speaker 2: there could be a chance you'll get in. There could
Speaker 2: be a chance you'll get sent home at the border.
Speaker 2: I was fully prepared to go and be sent home
Speaker 2: because I knew well and clear, like my face is
Speaker 2: all over the internet, they could have dirt on me,
Speaker 2: Like I could get sent home at the border. We
Speaker 2: had like plans in place for what my husband and
Speaker 2: kids would do if that was the case. It was
Speaker 2: only like landing there. I was like, oh, I am
Speaker 2: absolutely not prepared to get back on a plane and
Speaker 2: go back to Paha.
Speaker 5: I don't want this. I do not want this. I
Speaker 5: came all this way to be sent home.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it was fine I had. They didn't ask
Speaker 2: me any questions. I had no troubles getting in, and
Speaker 2: I'm really really grateful and really lucky for that because
Speaker 2: I know, like sex workers get sent back all the time,
Speaker 2: so I don't think there's any rhymal reasons into like
Speaker 2: getting in. It's just, yeah, you just have to like
Speaker 2: play your cards, right, I guess, and actually go there
Speaker 2: genuinely for a holiday. I think a lot of the
Speaker 2: time girls get sent back because they're going to and
Speaker 2: they're planning on working on a tourist visa. But if
Speaker 2: you're genuinely going for a holiday and you've got evidence
Speaker 2: of that, I think you should be okay. I mean,
Speaker 2: I'm not an expert, so I'm not going to give travel.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I definitely don't bank on it because I don't
Speaker 5: even have a clue. I find it really sad honestly
Speaker 5: that you know, we talk about sex work at Cheese
Speaker 5: on the Money so openly, and it's just another career
Speaker 5: that people in our community have and a job that
Speaker 5: people do, and it doesn't matter here nor there to us,
Speaker 5: and we just go, yeah, it's normal. But you start
Speaker 5: having these conversations with people in the industry and you
Speaker 5: realize how much discrimination still exists, Like the ability for
Speaker 5: you to go overseas is hindered, Like you can't be
Speaker 5: open and honest about your career while traveling Like that
Speaker 5: to me seems insane that if I was to go
Speaker 5: and put on my border entry pass to the US
Speaker 5: financial advisor, they look at me and be like, go home,
Speaker 5: So this isn't a place for you. I'd be horrified.
Speaker 5: But somehow we're not talking about the fact that all
Speaker 5: of our friends in the sex industry can't have payment
Speaker 5: platforms and can't travel freely and can't generate income in
Speaker 5: the same ways and get bank accounts shut down. Like
Speaker 5: this is an industry that if you're in, you've got
Speaker 5: to work really hard to stay in because they don't
Speaker 5: make it easy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and like these are things I've gotten so used to,
Speaker 2: Like I forget like how easy other people have it.
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, it would be so nice to get
Speaker 2: to America and not have anxiety about getting sent home
Speaker 2: and phone into an immigration prison.
Speaker 5: That risk would have stopped me from even going at all.
Speaker 5: I would have been like, absolutely not. I'm not a
Speaker 5: risk taker. I get anxious when a policeman drives past
Speaker 5: me in their car off duty. I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 5: am I going to get arrested? I don't understand. In fact,
Speaker 5: Jess and I were crossing the road the other day
Speaker 5: and they were you know in the CBD they do
Speaker 5: their traffic control training and they're like stop traffic and
Speaker 5: like you ignore the traffic lights. I was standing there
Speaker 5: like being like to Jess, can I cross and just
Speaker 5: was like, oh, I don't think so, you can't go yet.
Speaker 5: And I was like, oh, I don't want to be arrested.
Speaker 5: And the girl just looked at me and she was like,
Speaker 5: you're not going to get arrested. Don't worried. I was like,
Speaker 5: thank you, let me go to the shop, spy. But
Speaker 5: it was one of those things where I feel like
Speaker 5: your career would be full of anxieties because you're just
Speaker 5: trying to do the right thing and just make a
Speaker 5: career for yourself and look after your kids and look
Speaker 5: after your husband, and you know, have a life that
Speaker 5: you enjoy and you deserve to have because you've worked
Speaker 5: so hard for it. Yeah, and there's so many things
Speaker 5: just in everyday life where you have to like, you know,
Speaker 5: even just writing down your occupation details for like school
Speaker 5: enrollments or daycare enrollments. I'm like, well, if I write
Speaker 5: the truth, are they going to what are they going
Speaker 5: to do? Like, and how are they gonna judge your kids?
Speaker 5: Like I'm assuming it's not necessarily you anymore, because you
Speaker 5: said before, I've got a thick skin, I don't really
Speaker 5: care what you think of me. But are they going
Speaker 5: to treat your kids differently in school once they find
Speaker 5: out mum's a sex worker?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So these are other things you have to consider.
Speaker 2: And I guess being in the industry for so long,
Speaker 2: like I've kind of forgotten like what it would be
Speaker 2: like to not live without all these weird anxieties and
Speaker 2: stuff like that. But yeah, if you're considering getting into
Speaker 2: sex workio, the money is great, but there is a
Speaker 2: bit of a trade off sometimes and I feel like
Speaker 2: that's the same for every career, right, Like, in every
Speaker 2: career trades time for money, and there's always some level
Speaker 2: of additional compromise, whether it is you know, your safety
Speaker 2: or your security, or you know, working over time, or
Speaker 2: you know, not being treated well or not earning enough
Speaker 2: money and working too many hours. Like I feel like
Speaker 2: there's compromise in every industry. It just breaks my heart
Speaker 2: to think that yours has additional compromise when it's already
Speaker 2: so hard. Money diarists, thank you for joining us, but
Speaker 2: unfortunately I think that's all we have time for today.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, no, thank you for sharing your story
Speaker 5: and your journey. I feel like I've learned a lot
Speaker 5: but also had a pervy insight to what it's like
Speaker 5: to be a sex worker who has a white pike
Speaker 5: at VM's, two point five kids, gorgeous husband, and still
Speaker 5: goes out and makes absolute bank while still having a
Speaker 5: great lifestyle. Like, I just feel like you're living the dream,
Speaker 5: my friend.
Speaker 2: Thank you, definitely my dream.
Speaker 5: Yeah, just do you want to wrap the boring but
Speaker 5: important stuff? Absolutely don't forget guys.
Speaker 4: The advice shared on She's on the Money is generally
Speaker 4: in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's
Speaker 4: on the money, exists purely for educational purposes and should
Speaker 4: not be relied upon to make an investment or a
Speaker 4: financial decision. And don't forget Victoria divine and She's on
Speaker 4: the money. Our authorized representatives of Infocused Securities, Australia Proprietary
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Speaker 5: See you on Wednesday, guys.
Speaker 4: Bye,