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Speaker 1: Get a. I'm Laala Berry, nutritionist, author, actor, TV presenter,

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Speaker 1: and professional overshaer. This podcast is all about celebrating failure

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Speaker 1: because I believe it's a chance for us to learn,

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Speaker 1: grow and face our blind spots. Each week, I'll interview

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Speaker 1: a different guest about their highs as well as their lows,

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Speaker 1: all in a bid to inspire us to fearlessly fail. Hello,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the pod. I am so excited about today's podcast.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to be really honest with you. I didn't

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Speaker 1: expect it to come through and I'm so wrapped that

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Speaker 1: it just happened. And it was one of those experiences

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Speaker 1: that I will absolutely cherish forever. Today's guest is the

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Speaker 1: wonderful Owen Teal, incredible Welsh actor, and I was so

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Speaker 1: lucky be invited to the opening night of a play

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Speaker 1: that he's in Melbourne called a Christmas Carol and he

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Speaker 1: plays Scrooge and it is this beautiful story about humanity

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Speaker 1: and about facing our past and how the past can

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Speaker 1: affect the future and the present as well, and it's

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Speaker 1: just such a beautiful Christmas story, one for the whole fam.

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Speaker 1: And when I got invited to this opening night, I

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Speaker 1: responded and said, Oh, is there any way I can

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Speaker 1: interview Owen Teal. I'm a massive Game of Thrones fan,

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Speaker 1: and they were like, oh, you know, all these media

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Speaker 1: commitments are done. We'll try, We'll try. And I was like, ah,

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Speaker 1: if this is going to pull off, And it pulled off.

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Speaker 1: And he is the most wonderful human being, so giving,

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Speaker 1: so kind and honest and humble, like this is a

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Speaker 1: Tony Award winning actor and you know, if you are

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Speaker 1: a Game of Thrones fan like me, he plays is

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Speaker 1: the iconic and villainous Sir Alistair Thorn from Game of Thrones,

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Speaker 1: and he shared so many stories about you know, all

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Speaker 1: of it, like theater, movies, tally and just so honestly,

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Speaker 1: and he's very very funny as well. There's some fantastic

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Speaker 1: stories that I just hope you're driving along listening to

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Speaker 1: this or walking or whatever, you're on a flight listening

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Speaker 1: to this, and you're just like, oh, my goodness, I

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Speaker 1: hope you just burst out laughing because he was such

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Speaker 1: a joyous human being to sit down with and so

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Speaker 1: so giving, to the point that even when I got

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Speaker 1: to give him a hug goodbye, and I would nearly

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Speaker 1: got got teary because he's just so his spirit is

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Speaker 1: so kind and his heart is so kind, and you

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Speaker 1: know when you're around those people, they just kind of

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Speaker 1: like fill you up and make you feel so seen

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Speaker 1: and yeah, incredible human. I will cherish this episode forever

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Speaker 1: and I hope that you love it as well, and

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Speaker 1: I hope it inspires you to connect it and connect

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Speaker 1: but also like honor your passion and honor your calling.

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Speaker 1: And if you're in Melbourne, please go and see a

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Speaker 1: Christmas Carol. It's on till January seventh. That's actually had

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Speaker 1: to extend because it's so popular and it is just

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Speaker 1: such a great night out to get you into the

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Speaker 1: Chrissy spirit. And I think the kids are gonna love

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Speaker 1: it as well. And the production values are amazing. It's

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Speaker 1: just it's magical. It's pure magic and please do yourself

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Speaker 1: a favor and see it. And beautiful Ohen, thank you

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Speaker 1: so much for sharing an afternoon with me and doing

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Speaker 1: this pod. It means more than you know. You are

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Speaker 1: appsolutely wonderful. Welcome to the pod.

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Speaker 2: Owen Teale, Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 1: Do you know you have one of my favorite voices

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Speaker 1: in the world.

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Speaker 2: Oh you're so kind. Thank you it's obviously fashioned out

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Speaker 2: over my experiences.

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Speaker 1: Well like grab it out, like you've got this lucky thing.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's very strange because a lot of people ask

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Speaker 2: back home, that is it something to do with where

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Speaker 2: you come from? Because I come from a place called

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Speaker 2: Porl Tolbert, and that is where Michael Sheen, Anthony Hopkins.

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Speaker 1: I did do a Google.

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Speaker 2: Yeah you do all this. I'm Richard Burton. Yeah, you know.

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Speaker 2: And so you think, well, there is something going on

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Speaker 2: with all these voices, but I don't really understand what

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Speaker 2: it can be. Don't ask me. It must be in

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Speaker 2: the water.

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Speaker 1: I think since having a pod, I get so excited

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Speaker 1: when I get to hear someone's voice and I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 1: that's going to be fantastic. So first of all, I

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Speaker 1: have to say, yeah, I went. I went to see

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Speaker 1: Christmas Carol last night. Absolutely loved it. You did so

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Speaker 1: did you have so much fun? It seems like and

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Speaker 1: two sounding ovations last night? We were all just we

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Speaker 1: were drinking it up.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Yeah, it's it's designed, it's beautiful. It's a

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Speaker 2: real alchemy of a show that the writing, the direction,

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Speaker 2: and the musical arrangement. Carols they won a Tony Awards,

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Speaker 2: But I mean, you know it's up against musical, the

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Speaker 2: original scores and this is an arrangement of Christmas Carols.

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Speaker 1: Incredible, so incredible. Okay, so I want to talk everything

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Speaker 1: Christmas Eve start. Let's kick off straight away. So last

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Speaker 1: year you were Scrooge at the Old Vick, right, and

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Speaker 1: I've heard that you bought your costume with you from Yes,

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Speaker 1: this is a really weird question, but I feel like

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Speaker 1: actors a costume shoes like kind of helped form choices.

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Speaker 1: Was it quite special for you to bring that same costume.

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Speaker 2: Very much, very much, very much helped by the wonderful

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Speaker 2: designer Rob Howell. He knew that, so he put that

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Speaker 2: into action that to recover the bits that were mine

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Speaker 2: to come here. Because you're building a world and you

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Speaker 2: know you're playing a character that is sort of anti matter.

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Speaker 2: He's against the show. He doesn't want it to happen.

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Speaker 2: So you have to build you know, your armor around

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Speaker 2: you to go into battle even though you know you're

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Speaker 2: going to lose in the end, and give it up

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Speaker 2: for a good time.

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Speaker 1: How cool it was the first thing I thought when

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Speaker 1: I saw you because the I don't know, what's that like?

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Speaker 1: It's not a capy. It's like that over Cody.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, the old and then there's this with you yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, and I was like, oh, that would

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Speaker 1: totally affect choices as an actor. I nerd out over actors,

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Speaker 1: by the way, just to give you the heads up. So,

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Speaker 1: if this this was written one hundred and eighty years ago,

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Speaker 1: right originally Charles Dickens, what do you think makes it

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Speaker 1: so incredbly There's something it's there's something so like it

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter. One hundred and eighty years later it hit

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Speaker 1: it's still bits of it hit us in the heart.

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Speaker 1: And it's this especially Scrooged. Your character goes from this

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Speaker 1: beautiful arc and quite a transformation. What do you think

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Speaker 1: it speaks to to today's audience.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think it hasn't. The point is it hasn't

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Speaker 2: been disproved. So it's been around for all these years,

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Speaker 2: and each time you come back to it, you you

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Speaker 2: relearn or learn for the first time something that you

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Speaker 2: need for your life. So that's why it's still with us.

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Speaker 2: It's been revived in this particular version so beautifully by

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Speaker 2: Jack Thorn. So he has addressed certain things that he

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Speaker 2: wants to say about life now without so he's leaning

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Speaker 2: into Charles Dickens and taking a bit of his space.

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Speaker 2: But I think, you know, I would hope that Charles

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Speaker 2: Dickens would say, Wow, that's pretty good. Do you know what?

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Speaker 2: That is pretty good?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Well, i'll tell you what. Last night it felt

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Speaker 1: pretty good because look, he's created a character.

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Speaker 2: And this is why it's so real now, is that

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Speaker 2: he's not a two dimensional cartoon of a miser in

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Speaker 2: a nightcap and a candle and all those things. It's

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Speaker 2: about a man who has become a monster, and it

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Speaker 2: will tell you along the way, without slowing the story down,

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Speaker 2: how he became that monster, and you will relate to

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Speaker 2: that story because the values that made him that monster

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Speaker 2: we all have to deal with.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, big time. I think it was so powerful,

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Speaker 1: Like not to give too much a way, but like

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Speaker 1: at the very beginning the Ghost of Past, I was like,

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Speaker 1: oh it was so nice because I almost felt like

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Speaker 1: there was almost a very therapeutic quality to watching your

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Speaker 1: character go through and having to face uncomfortable go back

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Speaker 1: and sit with and face these uncomfortable things that have

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Speaker 1: happened and as a result shaped his choices in life.

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Speaker 1: I heard you right before we hit record on here

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Speaker 1: say that sometimes in the theater, the audience has such

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Speaker 1: an impact on how a show feels. How did it

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Speaker 1: feel last night? Because as an audience member, last night,

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Speaker 1: it felt like we were part of the whole experience

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Speaker 1: and it was this almost spiritually you know what I mean.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it did get a bit. It did for me

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Speaker 2: because you know, you put it out and then you

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Speaker 2: get a bit back from the audience, and so you

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Speaker 2: then take it on and you get more. And then

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Speaker 2: you think, as an old director like me, you mustn't

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Speaker 2: let an audience take control. If you allow them to

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Speaker 2: laugh too much, you'll interrupt the flow and the narrative

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Speaker 2: will will start to come down the land. You got

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Speaker 2: to keep it in the air. You've got to keep

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Speaker 2: it going. Look, the short version is it couldn't have

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Speaker 2: gone better. Yeah, last night.

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Speaker 1: It felt so I'm one of those people that get

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Speaker 1: I get quite emotional when I go to the theater

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Speaker 1: because it's like you get to touch our hearts and

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Speaker 1: that's what's so cool about theater and like and I

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Speaker 1: love like movies and TV shows. I think they have

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Speaker 1: a different kind of escapism quality. But there's something about

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Speaker 1: the theater where you get to be changed in that

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Speaker 1: moment with all that, it's a collective, it completely is,

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Speaker 1: and that's the I think that's one of the magical

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Speaker 1: things about theater, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's that's why I do it. It's the drug

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Speaker 2: that gets me up. And that's why I'm here, traveled

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Speaker 2: all this way because I believe in this show very much.

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Speaker 2: And so at the point when Scrooge actually then interacts

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Speaker 2: with the audience, he comes into the moment, he's in

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Speaker 2: the same he's on the same page as the audience.

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Speaker 2: You get to literally be amongst them. It's like a

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Speaker 2: camaraderie or extraordinary collective experience.

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Speaker 1: Well, thank you for last night. I have to say

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Speaker 1: you were phenomenal, as was the whole cast.

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Speaker 2: Look, you know, he's coming on and he's trying to

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Speaker 2: disprove what Christmas is supposed to be. You know, he says,

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Speaker 2: what is it but a time for paying bills without money.

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Speaker 2: It's a time for finding yourself a year older and

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Speaker 2: not one hour richer, and you know, these things ping

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Speaker 2: and people go, He's got a point, and I you know,

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Speaker 2: maybe we need people like that as well to balance.

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Speaker 2: You know, everything is in balance, is in a state

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Speaker 2: of balance, and it's just that he's gone far. He's

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Speaker 2: in a That's what I mean by monster. It's something

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Speaker 2: as the balance has gone.

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Speaker 1: But isn't it beautiful then to get to watch him? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like go through this? Can I ask a very practical question.

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Speaker 1: You must have to be stay quite fit and healthy

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Speaker 1: because there's a point where you run around the whole

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Speaker 1: or like bought the Stall's part, and I was like,

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Speaker 1: oh my goodness, and I'm imagining you're doing what eight

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Speaker 1: shows a week.

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Speaker 2: That's a lot, it is, And every time it comes up,

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Speaker 2: I think, am I really going to run now around? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: I'm doing it, and yeah I'm coming through. But I

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Speaker 2: think that's the you know by then, if it's worked,

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Speaker 2: we are greater than the sum of the parts in

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Speaker 2: the room. And that is this amazing Australian cast. They

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Speaker 2: can sing, dance, instruments, pick up each other's instruments and

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Speaker 2: start playing them a clog dance? What more do you want?

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Speaker 2: And they're wonderful actors.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and you could The thing that I loved most

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Speaker 1: I noticed that this especially with Well I was watching everyone,

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Speaker 1: but I could see it in Bernie Curry's face there's

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Speaker 1: like a passion for being in that moment on that stage,

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Speaker 1: sharing this energy, and there's you could just the whole

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Speaker 1: jaw that is that. I was like, Oh, you're meant

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Speaker 1: to be there, right, and this is like it feels

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Speaker 1: like that with you as well. But I just remember

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Speaker 1: thinking that person really.

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Speaker 2: Love like you know what I mean, an amazing performer,

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Speaker 2: an amazing kind of heart, a generous thing that can

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Speaker 2: fill a room with this smile.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, how lucky gift. So I just want to ask

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Speaker 1: a little bit more about theater because I think, I

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Speaker 1: know you've had such an incredible theater career, and I

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Speaker 1: know you're a bit of a Shakespeare nerd as well.

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Speaker 1: You've done something did you do four years of the

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Speaker 1: real Shakespeare? But I listened to this podcast it's called

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Speaker 1: play Crush, and you talked all about Macbeth and your

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Speaker 1: love for Macbeth and it made me fall completely and

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Speaker 1: I was like, I got to read Macbeth again, like

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Speaker 1: I need to record. And so you've had such an

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Speaker 1: incredible theatrical career. Is there any moments that stand out

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Speaker 1: to you aside? I definitely want to talk of course

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Speaker 1: about a Doll's House and Tony, but like in there

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Speaker 1: are moments where you're just like, oh yeah, like the

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Speaker 1: way you were saying last night, there's this alchemy kind

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Speaker 1: of thing that happens. But you've done Macbeth, You've done

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Speaker 1: I've got a whole list here he has said, No

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Speaker 1: Man's Land. That looked like a fun one.

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Speaker 2: Yeah with McKellen, Yeah, Patrick Stewart, Yeah, yeah, yeah, really

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Speaker 2: was that was like that was that was like being

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Speaker 2: part of the most famous circus in the world. And

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Speaker 2: we went on tour and whenever we talk it, you know,

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Speaker 2: there would there would be literally people like an entourage

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Speaker 2: forming and people falling and coming in and saying they're here,

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Speaker 2: come into the square, They're about to begin, you know,

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Speaker 2: and and there's these these two guys who were just legends.

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Speaker 1: And did you have to hide Ian behind your jacket

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Speaker 1: one day leaving at a stage door show? Was that

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Speaker 1: a different was That's why?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we came here with that. We came to Sydney.

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Speaker 2: It was a dance of death by Striinberg and Ian

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Speaker 2: myself and Francis still a tour was an amazing actress

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Speaker 2: and we came here. It's twenty years ago and so

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Speaker 2: it was the third of the Lord of the Rings film.

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Speaker 1: Oh, there we go.

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Speaker 2: So he was just yes, it was enormous, and there

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Speaker 2: would be these crowds of people outside the stage door.

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Speaker 2: It was in London, and as we came out and

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Speaker 2: not a lot of them had seen the show. They

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Speaker 2: were just they just knew Gandalf was going to be there.

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Speaker 2: And so he would be sort of, you know, well,

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Speaker 2: if they've bought the tickets, then that would be very nice.

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Speaker 2: I'd like to say thank you to them. But if

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Speaker 2: they haven't, then I'm not really interested. So I said, okay, well,

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Speaker 2: there's a lot of people out there. He said, so

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Speaker 2: so let's go for supper and you go out and

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Speaker 2: I'll come behind you. And you're very big, and he had,

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Speaker 2: you know, and he had his flat cap on and

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Speaker 2: his coat and said right, are you ready and he

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Speaker 2: went yes, So how we go. We go through the

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Speaker 2: store and it works. At first. Nobody's interested in me.

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Speaker 2: This is Pregame of Thrones. Yeah, just no problem at all.

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Speaker 2: So they're looking around me as I'm pushing influence. Excuse me,

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Speaker 2: excuse me, and he has tucked in behind me. It's

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Speaker 2: going to head down, whereupon I am confronted as I

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Speaker 2: the parting of the sea, and in front of me

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Speaker 2: is Gandalf life stick, life size. If I out, it's

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Speaker 2: a little bit bigger than me. And he's staring at

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Speaker 2: me saying, you know, nangel part in this pose. He's

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Speaker 2: looking at me like this thing, this is incredible and

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Speaker 2: it stops me. So Ian bumps into the back and

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Speaker 2: what and I just I'm afraid expose you and and

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Speaker 2: say I'm sorry, but you know there's somebody you might know.

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Speaker 2: He looks up, he looks up at himself, his Candalf,

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Speaker 2: and the man is standing there with the big shoppy pen.

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Speaker 2: He's ready and says Steie, and he's got him now,

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Speaker 2: and he says, could you sign it please? And Ian

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Speaker 2: is not very happy and looking at this and he's

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Speaker 2: wondering the provenance of this. Where's this guy got this from?

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Speaker 2: You know, it's an exhibition or only something's gone somewhere,

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Speaker 2: you know, a promotion, And so so he goes. He

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Speaker 2: grabs the pen and he says to whom and says sorry.

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Speaker 2: He says to whom, what's your name? So he says, no, no,

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Speaker 2: could you just sign it? And of course Ian knows

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Speaker 2: and we all know now that it's worth far more.

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Speaker 2: If he doesn't put a name on it. The guy

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Speaker 2: can put a ticket onto eBay, of course, if he

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Speaker 2: wants to. So the guy goes, no, no, no, could

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Speaker 2: you just sign it? It's just no, true, you have

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Speaker 2: a name, so good. Now there's a huge crowd.

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Speaker 1: Now, so good. Did he went out in the end?

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Speaker 1: Did you put a name?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he did, he put a name. But you know,

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Speaker 2: but but we kind of lost because then we were

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Speaker 2: surrounded by Gandalf lovers.

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Speaker 1: So funny it was.

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Speaker 2: It was surreal, totally Syria and surreal Syria and surreal.

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Speaker 1: So I have to say, I imagine a Tony nineteen

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Speaker 1: ninety seven adult's house. Yeah, that's got to be a

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Speaker 1: pinch yourself moment.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Yet again it's I think when these pinching moments happen,

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Speaker 2: you're not really in control of them. And that's part

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Speaker 2: of the wisdom is to learn to live with that.

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Speaker 2: So you just accept it because you get so many

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Speaker 2: things that don't work out, so much failure along the way,

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Speaker 2: and you know, you try to keep those things in

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Speaker 2: your head like, well it's just failed, better next time,

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Speaker 2: and but you you keep going and and then something

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Speaker 2: does really take off, and that was that was a

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Speaker 2: case in point. I mean, it did well in London

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Speaker 2: and it transferred, but there was something about the heat

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Speaker 2: of it and the New Yorkmnians and they got so involved.

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Speaker 2: So the winning award didn't feel like it was something

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Speaker 2: that I'd been the architect of. It was. I just

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Speaker 2: happened to be the vessel that it was happening to

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Speaker 2: because I would I don't know if you know the play,

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Speaker 2: but I don't.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, and you didn't your co actress also

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Speaker 1: like whyyah and the play one?

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Speaker 2: The play one, Yeah, incredible, I know, I know for

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Speaker 2: a Nibsen you know again about one hundred and forty

337
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Speaker 2: years old on Broadway, you know, and there was just

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Speaker 2: it just was the big hit of that of that year.

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Speaker 2: But it just sparked so much debate between men and women.

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Speaker 2: Of course, you know, when he's been rather brutal to

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Speaker 2: her when she when she says I'm going to leave,

342
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Speaker 2: and he says, is in a way you will leave

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Speaker 2: and your children? And you know, because he hasn't had

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Speaker 2: a drink, he hasn't gone off with another woman, he

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Speaker 2: hasn't ticked any of those boxes. So how can you

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Speaker 2: call me a monster, and she says, I'm going because

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Speaker 2: I don't know who I am. There's so many women

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Speaker 2: and in the audience, and he does shout a bit

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Speaker 2: and get a bit male and and she goes off

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Speaker 2: into the room and he says, instead of saying sorry,

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Speaker 2: he says, you shouldn't have pushed me. You see what

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Speaker 2: happens when you push me. And a woman on the

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Speaker 2: front row stood up, and I was sitting really near

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Speaker 2: the front of the stage and she stood up. She said,

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Speaker 2: you busted out. And I looked at her because I

356
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Speaker 2: was sitting down and she wasn't that much lower than

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Speaker 2: me by the time she'd stood up, And I thought, wow,

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Speaker 2: if I engaged now with this, I'm trying to talk

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Speaker 2: to her, the play's gone. Yeah, I've just got to

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Speaker 2: write it out. And then the nusher came along and

361
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Speaker 2: grabbed a hold of it, and she was so upset.

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Speaker 2: She clearly had an experience. Yeah, it would and a

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Speaker 2: sort of gaslighting thing where the man then starts to say,

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Speaker 2: why did you do that? It's your fault.

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Speaker 1: How incredible that theater can do that, though well, exactly

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Speaker 1: that's I mean, it would have been a very confronting

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Speaker 1: experience I imagine for you in the moment in quite

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Speaker 1: a light heavy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's about collaboration. You know, I'm not going to

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Speaker 2: come out, I'm not a one at any point in

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Speaker 2: this going to say yeah, because you know what, I'm

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Speaker 2: pretty good. It's it's there's lots of people who are

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Speaker 2: pretty good. It's about chemistry. It's about collaboration, and then

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Speaker 2: something happens between people that much greater than the two

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Speaker 2: can manufacture on their own.

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Speaker 1: And that comes back to that, like you're a conduit

377
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Speaker 1: or vessel and it's something yeah, happens to you. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's like that they say in a theater. Director said

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Speaker 1: to me once, it's like when an angel walks upon

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Speaker 1: upon the stage. There's this moment where there's just such

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Speaker 1: alchemy that you're just like, that's bigger than me. I'm

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00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:29,600
Speaker 1: just here completely enjoying completely. Yeah, it's pretty phenomenal. Okay,

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Speaker 1: Like I said, I could go Banana's asking you the

384
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Speaker 1: theatery stuff. I just you mentioned failure just then, and

385
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Speaker 1: I heard this brilliant quote from you, and I love it.

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Speaker 1: And I just think I interview a fair few actors, directors,

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Speaker 1: writers on this show, and for a young actor. If

388
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Speaker 1: they heard this, I think they'd be like, yeah, But

389
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Speaker 1: it's if you can survive the moments when things don't

390
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Speaker 1: go your way, you can make it. And it's that

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Speaker 1: like surviving the failure. There stepbacks and not backs, because

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Speaker 1: I imagine you've had them along the way.

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Speaker 2: Full of it, full of my I feel like I'm

394
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Speaker 2: free falling in failure because failure is what you have

395
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Speaker 2: in your head of what success might be. That's the

396
00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:19,680
Speaker 2: equation that can go wrong. If you can learn from

397
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Speaker 2: your mistakes, because you know what you were aiming at

398
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Speaker 2: and you haven't got there, a something else will appear.

399
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Speaker 2: You must be open and ready to adapt. The readiness

400
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 2: is all you know. That's a hamlet thing, you know.

401
00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:46,159
Speaker 2: It's so much is chance. So the chance will at

402
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:48,840
Speaker 2: times fall your way. But if you're not ready, if

403
00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:55,199
Speaker 2: you can't recognize that and seize it, then you'll miss

404
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:59,040
Speaker 2: the energy. You'll bump down again, Whereas if you pick

405
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:03,119
Speaker 2: it up, you can actually keep that energy up and

406
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,480
Speaker 2: you will have a greater energy to write the next.

407
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:07,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, not back, of course.

408
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 2: Yeah. I like the readiness, and it's the readiness is

409
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:13,720
Speaker 2: all you know, and that's why you're right. I do

410
00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:16,600
Speaker 2: have to keep as fit as I can at my age,

411
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Speaker 2: and I'm not party too heavily.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, well I was Opening Night last night. Friend.

413
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Speaker 1: I hope you had a little celebratory.

414
00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,720
Speaker 2: I had a little celebratory, but I did not hang

415
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:30,800
Speaker 2: one on, as they say I have done in my past.

416
00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:34,280
Speaker 2: I'm no stranger to that, but I did not. I

417
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:38,760
Speaker 2: was tired, and I ended up talking to people who

418
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:40,119
Speaker 2: are far more drunk than me. And do you know

419
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 2: that feeling when do you think, oh, yeah, I'm not

420
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:43,320
Speaker 2: sure you're making any sense.

421
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Speaker 1: I'm kind of like that's the perfect time too.

422
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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So can I just say you have been such a

424
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:55,440
Speaker 1: joy to research, because there's such a fun body of work.

425
00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:57,400
Speaker 1: Like I was watching Line of Duty, and then I'm

426
00:24:57,440 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 1: watching a Discovery of Witches. How fun, so much fun.

427
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:08,280
Speaker 1: And then I mean, of course Game of Thrones.

428
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:12,120
Speaker 2: But the rig, the rig, I love the rig.

429
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Speaker 1: The thing I love about this. Actually, before I talk

430
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Speaker 1: about that, I watched a movie two nights ago and

431
00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:21,359
Speaker 1: I cried five times in it, Dream Horse.

432
00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,120
Speaker 2: What a great, lovely film.

433
00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:31,000
Speaker 1: And your character Daisy had this like because we know

434
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,720
Speaker 1: you was like often the villain right in some things,

435
00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 1: but like that I was like, no, you're like the

436
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 1: soften like you hold space for other characters. Yeah, obviously

437
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:47,880
Speaker 1: stuff with strength, because that's your whole.

438
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:52,919
Speaker 2: It's thank you, Yes, And I I was very very

439
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:59,000
Speaker 2: touch starts to Winner after comery, for I just recognized.

440
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:02,399
Speaker 2: Do you know I think, as I'm talking to you

441
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:05,399
Speaker 2: now that when I say there's so much failure on it,

442
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:07,680
Speaker 2: the whole thing is I think that my idea of

443
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:12,639
Speaker 2: success as a young person was somebody who was like

444
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:16,119
Speaker 2: a like a typical Hollywood legend Carry Grant or something.

445
00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:20,200
Speaker 2: So you don't look like Carry Grant, so the world

446
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,080
Speaker 2: is not going to accept you as Carry Grant. So

447
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,680
Speaker 2: you feel you're failing all the time. But I've always

448
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 2: been able to say, well, well what else is there?

449
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:33,200
Speaker 2: Maybe I could audition for this other part. And I've

450
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,440
Speaker 2: learned an awful lot more about life by playing some

451
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 2: of the darker characters and finding that I could do that,

452
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 2: and that being recognized, and that's you know, those shows

453
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:52,879
Speaker 2: becoming successful at times, obviously Game of Thrones, and then

454
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:57,920
Speaker 2: that giving you greater opportunity, the more more choices, Yeah,

455
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:02,200
Speaker 2: but never really playing the out and note handsome hero anymore.

456
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:03,560
Speaker 2: I did when I was very young.

457
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:07,640
Speaker 1: I feel like everything you play that there is like yes,

458
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 1: so yes to talk about Yeah, Line of Duty and

459
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 1: Game of Thrones, there's there's like a villainous quality. Today,

460
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 1: I imagine that'd be a bit of fun.

461
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:20,800
Speaker 2: It's a lot of fun because if you're the if

462
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 2: you're the dark side of a story, a you'll get

463
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 2: tremendous dialogue, you'll get great lines. Everybody knows that, but

464
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:35,600
Speaker 2: the best lines of the devils. But but what you'll

465
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 2: also get is you will get your moment in the

466
00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 2: sun because the story needs it, It needs the opposition,

467
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 2: that's the drama. So if you're playing one of the

468
00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:48,480
Speaker 2: guys who's just in the office in the background and

469
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 2: you know is well meaning guy and he comes in

470
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:53,960
Speaker 2: and out and he's got quite a lot of scenes,

471
00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,760
Speaker 2: you won't have as much impact on the story as

472
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:00,399
Speaker 2: if you're the dark force, because you could they've got

473
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 2: to deal with the story has got to deal with it,

474
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:05,280
Speaker 2: and you're often there in order to make somebody look

475
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 2: heroic and beautiful, like Kit Harrington is.

476
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 1: John Snow, do you know when you said yes to

477
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 1: this part? I said to my boyfriend, I call him Boss.

478
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:18,640
Speaker 1: I was like Boss we're watching Game of Thrones. He goes,

479
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,639
Speaker 1: how much I go from the start again. So we

480
00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 1: every night we'd set it up and well it was

481
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 1: it's He's like, we're really going to strap in. This

482
00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 1: is a commitment. But I guess there are so the

483
00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:34,959
Speaker 1: thing that I love about your character in Game of Thrones,

484
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 1: Aster Thorne. You get these moments of like you said it,

485
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: you know that Henry the fifth kind of moment where

486
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 1: you know you're all these even I love your last

487
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:51,960
Speaker 1: lines like it's it's I thought I lost.

488
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:56,840
Speaker 2: And he accepts that. You know, he has an ethos

489
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 2: that you can buy into because he is he makes

490
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 2: the world very black and white. And those people are

491
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 2: very very powerful. They may be lying to you, but

492
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 2: they they're easy to follow, and they say to you,

493
00:29:11,680 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 2: don't think, just feel and come with me. I know,

494
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:21,080
Speaker 2: and it's it's amazingly powerful. And everybody's in interview situations

495
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 2: just like this will say, you know, how does it

496
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 2: feel to be to be hated? But I don't, I

497
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 2: can't hear. That's not what I guess I think.

498
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:31,640
Speaker 1: But I think also your character died in honor. Yeah,

499
00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 1: because even at that stabbing moment, it was for the

500
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 1: watch right.

501
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 2: For the watch. If there's three words I've had to

502
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:43,920
Speaker 2: say more in my life, then I have.

503
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 1: To ask this. And I like, as I asked this,

504
00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:50,160
Speaker 1: I asked I reckon five of my closes. I said

505
00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 1: to my mom, my dad, my wofriends, like, can I

506
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:54,280
Speaker 1: ask this question? But I heard you share on a

507
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,640
Speaker 1: podcast the most the funniest story I think I've ever

508
00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:01,200
Speaker 1: heard about a colon oscary. Oh, yeah, you don't have

509
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:02,360
Speaker 1: to be one of it's.

510
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 2: In the world, of course I will. Look, you've met

511
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:09,000
Speaker 2: me now for a few minutes. You you kind of

512
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:12,480
Speaker 2: know where we are. I don't really, it's all open.

513
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,360
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's a few years ago now, and they

514
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:18,680
Speaker 2: did this this kind of big wide sweeping program. Right,

515
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,200
Speaker 2: anybody over the age of fifty five, you've got to

516
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:23,760
Speaker 2: have a colonoscopy. We're going to, you know, improve the

517
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 2: figures on this. So went yeah, because my dad had, yeah,

518
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,520
Speaker 2: colonic cancer. Absolutely, So off I trot down to the

519
00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 2: local hospital. And I've been once before for colonoscopy because

520
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:40,719
Speaker 2: of this worry about my dad, probably about five years previously,

521
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 2: but it had been on a in a private, you

522
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 2: know situation. So you have all the nice touches.

523
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 1: Did you get sedated for the first time?

524
00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 2: Mildly, very mildly, lovely bit of something to take.

525
00:30:56,200 --> 00:30:59,120
Speaker 1: The edge of Yeah, because here you get knocked out,

526
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: Just so you know, are you really you're completely okay?

527
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:06,520
Speaker 2: No, I think I can remember it. But it was

528
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 2: a very pleasant memory and got it. When you think

529
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 2: about what's happening to you, that's amazing, of course, but

530
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 2: on this occasion, of course, no. I tell them at

531
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 2: the hospital next and it's like a cattle market. They're

532
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 2: just opening doors, men going through, filing through, fighting through.

533
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:22,960
Speaker 2: And then they said to me, I'm sorry, but there's

534
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 2: no more changing room space, but we've got this. You

535
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 2: wouldn't mind, would you? And I thought it would be

536
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,280
Speaker 2: in the in the loo, never mind, And it was.

537
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 2: It was a janitor's cupboard. It's a caretaker's cupboard, and

538
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 2: there was a mop and a bucket. And I said,

539
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 2: don't whatever you do, not at this point in your

540
00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 2: career start saying things like you realize who I am?

541
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 2: You know? No, no, no, no, no, just do it.

542
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,040
Speaker 2: Just so I get undressed, to put on the funny

543
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 2: the gown that you know, buttons up at the back

544
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 2: and you put on these funny little sort of see

545
00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:58,239
Speaker 2: through shorties and it's sold a bit. Okay, okay, here

546
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 2: we go, so take me nothing, no hint of any

547
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 2: sort of joke of what's going on. Very serious, serious,

548
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 2: and I said, I mentioned the anesthetist, any chance of

549
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 2: They said, oh no, we haven't got time for that.

550
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:17,960
Speaker 2: I said, oh, brutalless it's going to be brutally and

551
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:21,719
Speaker 2: they said, don't worry, you know, it's all right. We're professionals.

552
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:24,760
Speaker 2: And I said, yeah, yeah, of course. So there I am,

553
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 2: and I can lie on the bed and his nurses

554
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:32,200
Speaker 2: going around and I adopt the fetal position, and his

555
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 2: his nibs is standing at one end of me, and

556
00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:37,720
Speaker 2: I'm taking a look at him and making sure I

557
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:40,360
Speaker 2: can see what he's up to. And then he says, okay,

558
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,640
Speaker 2: now this is this is all it is. It's long,

559
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,520
Speaker 2: you know, it's a wire. It's quite quite firm, and

560
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 2: I'll be able to put I said, just do it,

561
00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:54,960
Speaker 2: just do it, and he starts his work and I'm

562
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,760
Speaker 2: getting on with it, and it's deeply uncomfortable, and I'm

563
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,160
Speaker 2: thrilled that he's looking at a screen and every thing

564
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 2: seems very clear. And then it starts to hurt really

565
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:06,959
Speaker 2: quite a lot. Now it's stun to her. And I said, oh,

566
00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:12,840
Speaker 2: that's that's My eyes are wading now. And he said, yeah, well,

567
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,280
Speaker 2: here we go. I've just got to take one more bend.

568
00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 2: I said, hold on, you've got a body yard and

569
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,960
Speaker 2: a half of them already, know, so just just calm

570
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:22,760
Speaker 2: it now. And he says, I'd love to take this

571
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 2: one last bend. And I said, all right, then, just

572
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 2: this one last bend. And he puts a little pressure,

573
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: shoves up a bit more and I go and he

574
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:39,520
Speaker 2: leans over and he says, that's for killing John Snow.

575
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 2: I look up at him. I mean just shocked. I

576
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:48,840
Speaker 2: turn around. All the nurses are diving out of the way,

577
00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 2: they're laughing, they're running out of the room. And then

578
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:54,320
Speaker 2: he said, oh, answer, sorry, that was a bit unprofessional,

579
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:59,560
Speaker 2: wasn't it. I said, yeah, just a little, just a little,

580
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:01,920
Speaker 2: And he said, oh sorry, But anyway, good news is

581
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 2: it's all clear. But can we have a photograph with

582
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:10,359
Speaker 2: you and me? Like a fool, says well yeah, well,

583
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:13,520
Speaker 2: what is there to lose now? Any dignity is gone,

584
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 2: so I said, and I'm still in the super stupid shorts,

585
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,720
Speaker 2: and they're all now with their arms around me going

586
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 2: for the watch.

587
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 1: That's incredible.

588
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,160
Speaker 2: My GP actually said to me, do you want to

589
00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:31,880
Speaker 2: make a formal complain about it? I said, no, no,

590
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,880
Speaker 2: it's a great story, a great story I have.

591
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 1: I've listened to that pod. That's my favorite pard you've done,

592
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:41,279
Speaker 1: and I reckon, I've listened to it three times. Still

593
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 1: it's the best. Sorry, honestly, thank you so much for

594
00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:49,920
Speaker 1: sharing that. I was I was quiet. I was like,

595
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:52,480
Speaker 1: can I ask it? Can I not? Can I? And

596
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 1: I haven't heard you talk about this before. What was

597
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 1: the audition process like for Game of Thrones? Because it

598
00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:00,080
Speaker 1: kind of picked up like it picked up, pa M

599
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:01,920
Speaker 1: because I remember you.

600
00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:08,720
Speaker 2: No. No, Well, so for me it was I hadn't

601
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 2: been around when they were doing the pilot. I'd been

602
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,920
Speaker 2: doing something else. And famously there was a pilot and

603
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:18,400
Speaker 2: then they that's right, and they changed a lot of

604
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:22,800
Speaker 2: the characters, and mine was one of the characters they changed.

605
00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 2: So I didn't have very much time to think about it,

606
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:30,360
Speaker 2: which is probably good in retrospect. One of the producers

607
00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:32,360
Speaker 2: had seen me in a doll's house. I knew that

608
00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 2: not David and Dan, the creators but Frank and he

609
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:47,719
Speaker 2: I think I thought I was pretty good casting. I

610
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:49,719
Speaker 2: don't really know, but they did anyway, the whole team

611
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:54,359
Speaker 2: very quickly. I did a test. They were already in Belfast. Yeah,

612
00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:57,279
Speaker 2: they said, get him on a plane and I came

613
00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:00,239
Speaker 2: out and I started to read it, and the time

614
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 2: I got off the plane, I was I had so

615
00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 2: many questions which weren't really what they were hoping. I

616
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 2: was going to say, such as, so it's got dragons

617
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:13,440
Speaker 2: in it? Is it for children? You thought this? And

618
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:16,360
Speaker 2: they said, no, no, it's not. It's not for children.

619
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:22,839
Speaker 2: Knowing okay, so how many different stories have you got

620
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 2: running at the same time? And I can't remember how

621
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:29,479
Speaker 2: The answer was how many houses? How many things the wall?

622
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:32,239
Speaker 2: And it's like it's exactly, It's like saying something right,

623
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 2: you've got to go back down and go to university

624
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 2: and study europeandie, you know, pre Renaissance history, and then

625
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:42,759
Speaker 2: actually the last bit is going to be the whole

626
00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 2: Renaissance and you go, oh, it's a bit daunting, isn't it.

627
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 2: So I when people ask me, I said, wow, I

628
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,959
Speaker 2: don't think it'll ever be mainstream because.

629
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,279
Speaker 1: Niche Yeah, it was so like fantasy and a whole

630
00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:00,200
Speaker 1: different people just they just did because I I.

631
00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:02,320
Speaker 2: Was still thinking, well, people want to come in a

632
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,439
Speaker 2: lot of working people work very hard. They may reach

633
00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:07,279
Speaker 2: for a beer or something, they want to have a

634
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:10,800
Speaker 2: meal and and hopefully it goes well. And the family

635
00:37:10,840 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 2: and the kids haven't you know, destroyed the house and

636
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:19,840
Speaker 2: and they want to chill. And yeah, they're like thrillers

637
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:22,279
Speaker 2: and that, but it's in short episodes things that they

638
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:26,360
Speaker 2: can go boom, yeah, oh I feel great, now, go

639
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:28,840
Speaker 2: go to bed or whatever you want to do. This

640
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 2: you would have to watch it and then rewatch it

641
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:37,839
Speaker 2: in order to make sure that you'd miss anything. Otherwise, people,

642
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:41,040
Speaker 2: you know, whole storylines are coming up and going where

643
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:41,879
Speaker 2: have we gone now?

644
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:42,359
Speaker 1: Yeah?

645
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:44,839
Speaker 2: So yeah, I was a doubter.

646
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:49,200
Speaker 1: Wow, my friend, what a fun What a fun thing

647
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:51,040
Speaker 1: to just be a part of. And just have you

648
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:55,400
Speaker 1: had such dark but fun moments like watching you like

649
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:57,239
Speaker 1: in the lead up to this, I was like, that

650
00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:58,759
Speaker 1: would have been so much fun, aren't that?

651
00:37:59,000 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 2: Yeah?

652
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:03,000
Speaker 1: And like great like scenes of camaraderie and like you

653
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 1: you know, no matter what happened to, your character never

654
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:08,279
Speaker 1: lost honor, No, even when it was kind of chips

655
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 1: were against you, and you know it's it would have

656
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 1: been fun to sit in that. Yeah, energy will be

657
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:14,080
Speaker 1: it dark.

658
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:16,920
Speaker 2: Well, I tell you what it reminded me of as well.

659
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:19,759
Speaker 2: He had an element to him is a character that

660
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:26,680
Speaker 2: pops up in politics a lot, and in terms of

661
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:29,480
Speaker 2: war and things like that. You know, there's a bit

662
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:33,240
Speaker 2: of Trump, you know that he that's what he puts forward,

663
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:38,320
Speaker 2: and whether that's true or not is a matter for debate,

664
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 2: but that's what he puts forward. It's very simple. But

665
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:43,880
Speaker 2: the greatness of what makes us and not to trust

666
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:48,759
Speaker 2: too many liberal ideas, you know, And that's what he's

667
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:50,880
Speaker 2: saying to John Snow, you're going to get us all

668
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:54,279
Speaker 2: killed if you carry on like this. And a lot

669
00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:58,399
Speaker 2: of people relate to that. It's a powerful So he's

670
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:02,320
Speaker 2: not a distant sort of baddie that doesn't exist in

671
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:05,640
Speaker 2: the world. He reminds them of people that they see

672
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 2: on their television screens and they feel comfortable with somebody

673
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,640
Speaker 2: who was so assured that they've got the answer. And

674
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:15,080
Speaker 2: it's based on experience as well.

675
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:18,400
Speaker 1: I imagine just sitting in that, I feel like it

676
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:22,960
Speaker 1: would have been so much fun, and even especially some

677
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:24,880
Speaker 1: of the latest scenes would have felt like being on

678
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:30,359
Speaker 1: a massive movie set, like protecting the Wall, like incredible,

679
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,040
Speaker 1: like so much fun, so much fun.

680
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:35,960
Speaker 2: The Battle of the War. Yes, the camera that did

681
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:39,400
Speaker 2: three hundred and sixty degrees sort of inside the battle

682
00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:42,719
Speaker 2: and was able to go round and round round, and

683
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:47,080
Speaker 2: we were all fighting, you know, at the same fun. Amazing.

684
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 1: Okay, I would talk to you all day long if

685
00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:55,640
Speaker 1: I could. There's one more quote that I think. This

686
00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:57,879
Speaker 1: one I've heard on a different really deep dive view

687
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:01,200
Speaker 1: in case you can't tell, but this was a different podcast.

688
00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:05,959
Speaker 1: You must equally distrust the opinions of others and also

689
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:09,480
Speaker 1: enjoy them at the exact same time, in a heartbeat,

690
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:12,000
Speaker 1: say thank you, even if somebody is slagging you off,

691
00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 1: say thank you so much. And if you can do that,

692
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,680
Speaker 1: then you've probably made the right You're probably made of

693
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 1: the right stuff to be an actor.

694
00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 2: Yes, that's very true.

695
00:40:21,280 --> 00:40:23,320
Speaker 1: It's like that water off a duck's back, right.

696
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:24,880
Speaker 2: It has to be water of for ducks back, but

697
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:27,279
Speaker 2: it also has to be put away. It's not that

698
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:31,080
Speaker 2: you ignored or said because even though it may be

699
00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:35,359
Speaker 2: coming from a rather vindictive place. That's a strong word,

700
00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:39,200
Speaker 2: but it could be rather really nast a little bit

701
00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:41,879
Speaker 2: of an edge to it. You have to be able

702
00:40:41,960 --> 00:40:46,760
Speaker 2: to take it, but to think about the content because

703
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:52,839
Speaker 2: it's they're unrelated sometimes who is saying it, whether it's

704
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 2: your greatest ally or your champion or your enemy and

705
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:04,160
Speaker 2: to some degree or somebody who somebody's so damaged themselves

706
00:41:04,239 --> 00:41:07,640
Speaker 2: that they want to just make you unhappy. I've had

707
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:09,320
Speaker 2: had quite a bit of that in my time, people

708
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 2: sort of distrusting and not liking the fact that I'm

709
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 2: quite easy going really and they want you to they

710
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:19,680
Speaker 2: want to bring you down.

711
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:22,759
Speaker 1: Wasn't there an expectation that you would follow in your

712
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:27,759
Speaker 1: dad's footsteps and go still works? And was it your

713
00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:32,200
Speaker 1: aunt that was like like this is a hobby. This acting,

714
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 1: it's a hobby, and look you've just what.

715
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:37,560
Speaker 2: Are you going to do when you come back? Because

716
00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:39,480
Speaker 2: you might not get into the steelworks. It was a

717
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:43,320
Speaker 2: huge employer. It was the sort of mothership that was

718
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:47,399
Speaker 2: feeding all these homes in South Wales. It was at

719
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:49,680
Speaker 2: one time the largest steel works in Europe.

720
00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:53,040
Speaker 1: It was so seene as a great opportunity.

721
00:41:52,640 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 2: Great opportunity, Why would you? And then the thing was

722
00:41:56,200 --> 00:41:59,240
Speaker 2: as I left and went to drama school, Margaret Thancher

723
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:02,920
Speaker 2: came into power completely dismantled. Oh there you go, took

724
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:06,440
Speaker 2: it apart and there was more unemployment. There was record unemployment.

725
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:08,239
Speaker 2: There you go.

726
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:12,560
Speaker 1: My final acting question is you would bury the Bear?

727
00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:13,160
Speaker 2: Yes?

728
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:15,279
Speaker 1: Was that a pleasure park?

729
00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:18,960
Speaker 2: It was Barry Island. Come on, I was Burry the Bear.

730
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 2: Did you get it? Yeah? Got it. He's the eponymous bet,

731
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:27,080
Speaker 2: he's important, he's big, and is it true?

732
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 1: You were like, oh, bit over this town, I'm going

733
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:30,280
Speaker 1: to jump on the ferris wheel.

734
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, come down.

735
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,800
Speaker 1: Eventually got fired and your mates, the dog and the rabbit,

736
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:38,279
Speaker 1: were like that, you can't fire him. And they're the

737
00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:40,000
Speaker 1: ones that inspired you to go to drama school.

738
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:42,799
Speaker 2: We had solidarity. Yes, yeah, they said no one out,

739
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:44,280
Speaker 2: all out, all the animals.

740
00:42:45,480 --> 00:42:47,840
Speaker 1: And that was kind of your first taste before drama school.

741
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:50,279
Speaker 2: It was I didn't really understand what drama school was.

742
00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 2: I knew people studied at university, but I didn't understand

743
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 2: about vocational training that you could go away and there

744
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:02,000
Speaker 2: was you could train how co in acting And they said,

745
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 2: but you've got all the right material, You've got to

746
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:08,480
Speaker 2: go and do this. So I had to say goodbye

747
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:11,040
Speaker 2: to Barry. You know, because I'd really become one with Barry.

748
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:13,600
Speaker 2: But we've been through so much together. I don't know

749
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 2: where I ended and Barry began. You know. It was

750
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:19,120
Speaker 2: it was like that moment when I was fired. There

751
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:21,520
Speaker 2: was a guy screaming at me, you're fucking fir in

752
00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 2: your neck, and there's loads of children seven or eight

753
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:27,840
Speaker 2: years of old age around me, going, why is he

754
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:31,400
Speaker 2: shouting at Barry? Why is the man shouting at Barry?

755
00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:33,480
Speaker 1: The happy bear?

756
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:34,319
Speaker 2: Happy bear?

757
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 1: I heard as well, you had a trick Like if

758
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:39,719
Speaker 1: a kid like tried to like play a trick on you,

759
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 1: knock your head.

760
00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:44,439
Speaker 2: On him, and you've really done your work, you really don't.

761
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:46,920
Speaker 1: I love knowing where people come from, Like I love

762
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:50,360
Speaker 1: the I'm here for the journey. So I think we

763
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:52,760
Speaker 1: should wrap this up with a little bit of something

764
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:56,800
Speaker 1: Christmas y. Yeah, I love the word oil.

765
00:43:57,160 --> 00:43:59,680
Speaker 2: Oil well said, Did I say it right? I did?

766
00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:02,040
Speaker 1: Can you teach the listeners what that's all?

767
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:08,319
Speaker 2: Right? Well, hoile is the spirit that is engendered when

768
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 2: you get together. You can't have hoil on your own.

769
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:14,080
Speaker 2: It's it is a bit of camaraderie, it's a bit

770
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:19,200
Speaker 2: of the crack. Is the Irish when people start spontaneously singing,

771
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 2: and usually there's a fair amount of alcohol involved, but

772
00:44:23,480 --> 00:44:26,600
Speaker 2: it's the collective we go back to that. It's about

773
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:30,520
Speaker 2: being part. So when we sing the national anthem that

774
00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:34,000
Speaker 2: is oil, that is you are part of something much

775
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:38,880
Speaker 2: much greater than your than yourself. I love it. You

776
00:44:39,040 --> 00:44:43,800
Speaker 2: tap your tapping into the spirit. And yeah, it's a

777
00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:47,160
Speaker 2: wonderful word. Very old. The Welsh language is much much

778
00:44:47,160 --> 00:44:47,960
Speaker 2: older than English.

779
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 1: It's such a beautiful dialect. And and I feel like

780
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:54,000
Speaker 1: we got to feel that last night.

781
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 2: Yes, at the play that was Hoil.

782
00:44:56,239 --> 00:45:00,080
Speaker 1: It felt real, especially when everything was going on to

783
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:02,760
Speaker 1: give too much way to the listener, So to the listener,

784
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:06,400
Speaker 1: please go and see Christmas. Carol absolutely wonderful in it.

785
00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:09,360
Speaker 1: And I feel very honored to have you on this podcast.

786
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:11,040
Speaker 1: So from the bottom of my heart, thank you.

787
00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:14,680
Speaker 2: It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you for having me.

788
00:45:17,320 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 1: That's a wrap on another episode of Fearlessly Failing. As always,

789
00:45:23,120 --> 00:45:26,440
Speaker 1: thank you to our guests, and let's continue the conversation

790
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 1: on Instagram. I'm at Yamo Lola Berry. This potty my

791
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 1: word for podcast is available on all streaming platforms. I'd

792
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:40,080
Speaker 1: love it if you could subscribe rpe and comment, and

793
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:41,879
Speaker 1: of course spread the love