1 00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:07,120 Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families Podcast. It's the podcast for the 2 00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:11,159 Speaker 1: time poor parent who just wants answers. Now, Welcome to 3 00:00:11,200 --> 00:00:13,840 Speaker 1: the Happy Family's Podcast. My name is doctor Justin Colson 4 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:16,680 Speaker 1: and the author of nine books about raising happy families 5 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:19,760 Speaker 1: and the co host and parenting expert on Channelin's hit 6 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:23,599 Speaker 1: TV show Rental Guidance. Also a dad to six kids. 7 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: Just recently we did something unusual, We did something a 8 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:31,680 Speaker 1: bit different online. We conducted an online conference called Breaking Point, 9 00:00:31,840 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 1: very much about the state of mental health and young 10 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 1: people around the country and what we can do to 11 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:40,919 Speaker 1: improve things because well, things aren't looking that great. I 12 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 1: was absolutely delighted and really honored to have the opening 13 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 1: speaker for our online conference. As the National Children's Commissioner 14 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: and Holland's and Hollands commenced as National Children's Commissioner in 15 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: November twenty twenty. It's a five year appointment. Before she 16 00:00:57,120 --> 00:00:59,680 Speaker 1: was appointed the role of National Children's Commissioner, she was 17 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:02,280 Speaker 1: the direct actor of the Australian Institute of Family Studies, 18 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 1: which is an independent authority run by the Australian Government 19 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:08,000 Speaker 1: responsible for conducting research and providing advice on child and 20 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 1: family wellbeing and in that role. She was also the 21 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:15,120 Speaker 1: director of the Australian Gambling Research Center and for twenty 22 00:01:15,160 --> 00:01:18,360 Speaker 1: three years was a CEO of government non government organizations 23 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 1: focused on research and policy and service delivery and health 24 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: and education and social services. Has two adult daughters, three 25 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:30,759 Speaker 1: grandchildren and has just done so much work MBA strategy 26 00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:34,400 Speaker 1: and leadership sessions at Harvard and Stanford Universities. We're talking 27 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:37,319 Speaker 1: top twelve as you would expect for the National Children's 28 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:41,560 Speaker 1: Commissioner in the online digital conference Breaking Point, and I 29 00:01:41,640 --> 00:01:44,720 Speaker 1: spoke for about an hour about so many things related 30 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 1: to our young people and their mental health. It was 31 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:50,160 Speaker 1: a wonderful, wonderful conversation. I'm going to share with you 32 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 1: an extract of that in today's podcast. Let's start with 33 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 1: the question what is the current state of mental health 34 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 1: for young people? 35 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 2: Well, we know that even before COVID just in that 36 00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 2: the rates of mental health issues for children and young 37 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:13,880 Speaker 2: people had been increasing. And you know, it's hard to 38 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:18,760 Speaker 2: remember back before the pandemic, but what was happening then 39 00:02:18,919 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 2: was that, you know, regularly the government was announcing more 40 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:26,040 Speaker 2: and more funding for what was called youth mental health 41 00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 2: services because of the increasing demand. But you know, I 42 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:32,560 Speaker 2: remember thinking at the time it never seemed to be 43 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:35,959 Speaker 2: quite enough, And of course then the pandemic hit, and 44 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:39,840 Speaker 2: a kind of what the pandemic did was it an 45 00:02:39,840 --> 00:02:45,320 Speaker 2: amplified the broken systems out there, the fact that kids 46 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,000 Speaker 2: weren't able to get what they needed. And we saw 47 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:54,880 Speaker 2: during the pandemic increased rates of presentations to emergency departments 48 00:02:54,919 --> 00:02:58,760 Speaker 2: of much younger children with much more serious mental health 49 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:03,080 Speaker 2: issues like eating disc orders and suicidality. And that was 50 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:07,480 Speaker 2: also shown through helplines like Kids' Help Line that they 51 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 2: there was this upteap during COVID. Since COVID, of course, 52 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 2: we've seen that long tail of the pandemic's effect which 53 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:20,919 Speaker 2: we all predicted for children, and that is, you know, 54 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 2: we've seen continued high rates of anxiety school refusal. We 55 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 2: just had a Senate inquiry about kids who are too 56 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 2: anxious to go to school, and also problems like eating 57 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:38,160 Speaker 2: disorders and so forth. On the positive side, I guess 58 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 2: what's happened is that now the discussion about mental health 59 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 2: issues is much more mainstream, so we are able to 60 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:50,320 Speaker 2: have these conversations. But unfortunately we haven't kept up with 61 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:54,520 Speaker 2: the services for children and young people, and particularly I'm 62 00:03:54,560 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 2: concerned about services for kids twelve and under. 63 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 1: And when you describe that situation, one thing that I 64 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 1: hear from parents time and time again is that when 65 00:04:06,560 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 1: it comes to this breaking point idea, they just can't 66 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:15,560 Speaker 1: get the kids into a psychologist. It's almost impossible to 67 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:17,599 Speaker 1: get the mental health access that they require, whether the 68 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 1: kids are under twelve or over twelve. It just seems 69 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 1: that waitlists are enormous. And then, of course, once you 70 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 1: get your child into a psychologist, if that therapeutic relationship 71 00:04:26,360 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 1: isn't ideal, if the child doesn't click with the psychologists, 72 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:33,480 Speaker 1: we know from research that the stronger that therapeutic alliance, 73 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:35,680 Speaker 1: the more likely it is that we get good outcomes 74 00:04:35,720 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 1: in that therapeutic context. So the kids get in, they 75 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 1: don't like the psychologists, and the parents says, well, I 76 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 1: can't go back to square one, because I'm going to 77 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: be eighteen months down the track before I finally find 78 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:50,719 Speaker 1: the psychological help that my child needs. Where do you go? 79 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:55,160 Speaker 1: Not necessarily from your view as the National Children's Commissioner, 80 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 1: but where do you go as a parent who is 81 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:03,240 Speaker 1: just crumbling under this weight and desperate for their child 82 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 1: to get help? What options do they have. 83 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:09,920 Speaker 2: Well, it's really really hard justin I mean, I've spoken 84 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 2: to families that have been unable to get help in 85 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 2: the public system for eleven and twelve year olds who 86 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:22,440 Speaker 2: are suicidal. I mean, that is to me shocking. They 87 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:25,839 Speaker 2: were told they were told to go find a private psychiatrist, 88 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:29,040 Speaker 2: which you know, like we know, there's not enough of them. 89 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:32,280 Speaker 2: There's not enough that are psychiatrists and psychologists that are 90 00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 2: trained to work with children. It's like ten percent or 91 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 2: less have the training to work with children. But also, 92 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 2: of course there's the cost, so you know, it is 93 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:45,920 Speaker 2: really hard. And I know from a personal experience in 94 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 2: my own family of a child that was struggling to 95 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:56,040 Speaker 2: return to school after COVID, that getting helpful children with anxiety, 96 00:05:56,160 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 2: even in a big city, even with a family that 97 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 2: has all the resources available, is near impossible. And you know, 98 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:05,680 Speaker 2: if you go out of the big cities and you're 99 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 2: in the regional or remote areas, you can pretty much 100 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 2: forget it. So you know, like it is, it's absolutely 101 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 2: a failure, I believe of our governments to leave families 102 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 2: in this die situation, and it is a sign that 103 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:23,159 Speaker 2: we're not making child well being the priority it should be. 104 00:06:23,200 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 2: In this country. But your question was what should parents 105 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:28,520 Speaker 2: do if they can't get their help? Well, all I 106 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:31,560 Speaker 2: can say is just you have to keep trying. You 107 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:34,600 Speaker 2: have to keep banging down those doors. I mean that 108 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:38,600 Speaker 2: is our job as parents to get the help for 109 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:43,320 Speaker 2: the children that they need, and you know, hopefully eventually 110 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:47,279 Speaker 2: something will open up. Look, the other thing parents should do, 111 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:50,480 Speaker 2: of course, is to be there for their child. Don't 112 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:55,839 Speaker 2: underestimate your own value. Even when it comes to teenagers, 113 00:06:56,520 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 2: they do need parental, very strong parental relationships. And in 114 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 2: order for you to be able to help your child, 115 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 2: you've of course look after your own mental health and 116 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 2: well being, and so you know, you need to address 117 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 2: whatever issues you have, and it could even be things 118 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 2: like you know, as adults, we're all addicted to devices 119 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 2: and we have to really, I think, put a mirror 120 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:25,000 Speaker 2: up to ourselves, and I think we need to focus 121 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 2: on building that very strong relationship with each child, like separately, 122 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 2: not children as a group. We need to know our 123 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 2: children so that we can be attuned to their needs 124 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 2: and just don't give up. Don't give up trying to 125 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 2: find that help. 126 00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:47,280 Speaker 1: And I really want to talk about the trends, especially 127 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 1: as they apply to social media. But a couple of 128 00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 1: things that you've highlighted, I'd really like to go a 129 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 1: little deeper on those. The first that I want to 130 00:07:55,920 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 1: pick up on is my understanding as I've looked at 131 00:08:00,440 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 1: research from right around the world. My understanding is that 132 00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:10,760 Speaker 1: providing parenting skills and parenting tools to adults, and even 133 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 1: providing parents with the help that they might need not 134 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: just for their own issues but for their children's issues, 135 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:20,920 Speaker 1: seems to be far more adaptive, far more helpful than 136 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 1: getting kids into therapy. I'll give you an example of 137 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 1: what I mean, and then I'll ask for your reaction 138 00:08:26,120 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 1: to what I'm describing. If I'm working with an eight 139 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:33,400 Speaker 1: year old or even a thirteen year old who is 140 00:08:33,760 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 1: dealing with anxiety or is emotionally disregulated, has some really 141 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 1: big challenges, and I'm working with them at I don't know, 142 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 1: two o'clock on a Tuesday afternoon, the likelihood of them 143 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 1: holding on to these skills that I've tried to practice 144 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 1: with them in a clinical setting at five point thirty 145 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:55,760 Speaker 1: on Thursday night, when everything's going haywire is practically zero. 146 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 1: I mean, even most adults struggle to do that. Because 147 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:00,560 Speaker 1: I want to get a little bit nittigritty for for 148 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 1: just a moment if I can. And we've been talking 149 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:07,800 Speaker 1: about these these trends with increased mental health challenges for 150 00:09:07,880 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: our young people. What do you think of the central 151 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 1: forces that are driving these trends? If you look at 152 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:19,439 Speaker 1: society right now, why are we where we are from 153 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 1: a mental health perspective? 154 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:24,320 Speaker 2: Well, you know, I'd be very rich if I had 155 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 2: that answer, wouldn't I. We are all scratching our heads 156 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 2: about this about why, and I think it is multi 157 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 2: layereds Often I think though we jump to blaming social 158 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:39,679 Speaker 2: media for the problem. Well, you know, while there are 159 00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 2: certainly issues with social media, by the way, for adults 160 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 2: as well as children and social media addictions, I don't 161 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:52,440 Speaker 2: think that's the whole story. And you know, I guess 162 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:56,440 Speaker 2: it's been well articulated what some of the issues are about, 163 00:09:56,480 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 2: sort of the cyber bullying thing and also the the comparison, 164 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:04,559 Speaker 2: you know, the sense of sort of my life is 165 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:07,680 Speaker 2: not as good as someone else's on social media piece. 166 00:10:08,360 --> 00:10:10,959 Speaker 2: But I think it's the other thing that has I mean, 167 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:13,600 Speaker 2: there are a lot of things that have changed the 168 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:18,800 Speaker 2: Internet itself, putting aside, social media has allowed kids to 169 00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:24,480 Speaker 2: become more exposed to a range of things in the 170 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:28,040 Speaker 2: world that they would previously not have been exposed to. 171 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:31,720 Speaker 2: And I think it's just when I'm talking just basic 172 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 2: information about what's going on in the world. And it 173 00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 2: struck me recently I heard that a big survey of 174 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:42,679 Speaker 2: young people just recently found that the top three things 175 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 2: that kids are worried about there were number one was 176 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:51,680 Speaker 2: cost of living, number two was mental health issues, and 177 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:56,720 Speaker 2: number three was climate change. And I think that really 178 00:10:56,800 --> 00:11:01,120 Speaker 2: says to us as adults that you know, the idea 179 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:06,240 Speaker 2: that kids can be protected from the you know, what's 180 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:09,280 Speaker 2: going on around in the world, and you know that 181 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:11,320 Speaker 2: we that they you know, we just don't talk to 182 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:13,360 Speaker 2: them about it, just you know, they let them go 183 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:17,000 Speaker 2: out and play. That doesn't work. Children these days will 184 00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:20,520 Speaker 2: know from a very early age about what's going on 185 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:22,320 Speaker 2: in the world, and again think it puts a lot 186 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 2: more pressure on us as parents to be talking with 187 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:29,600 Speaker 2: them about this, helping them to make sense of it, 188 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:33,719 Speaker 2: because if you're just seeing you know, negative news, and 189 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 2: there's been a lot lately that we've been worried about. 190 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:38,640 Speaker 2: Of course, if you're just sitting on your device and 191 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:45,120 Speaker 2: streaming this that all these bad news stories on your own. 192 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:48,440 Speaker 2: As a child, you're not able to you don't have 193 00:11:48,480 --> 00:11:51,560 Speaker 2: the maturity to put all of that in perspective. Right, 194 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:55,679 Speaker 2: So as adults, you know, for example, we might have 195 00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 2: been in shock over what happened at Bondi Junction on Saturday, 196 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 2: but we have some capacity to rationalize about it and 197 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 2: put it in some kind of context and perspective. Children 198 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 2: don't necessarily have that ability, and it can seem much 199 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 2: more catastrophic for a young person. I mean, this is 200 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 2: where parents really have a job to do, in my view, 201 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:20,319 Speaker 2: to be able to sit down and have an open conversation, 202 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:23,560 Speaker 2: to convey to kids that it is okay to talk 203 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 2: about these things and that as a parent, I also 204 00:12:26,559 --> 00:12:29,640 Speaker 2: feel sad and shocked, and I don't have all the answers, 205 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:32,600 Speaker 2: but let's have the conversation, and I'd like to hear 206 00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:36,439 Speaker 2: what you're thinking, how did this affect you? And you know, 207 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 2: to open up about it, because that helps the children 208 00:12:40,880 --> 00:12:44,960 Speaker 2: to process the bad news. And I'm not sure that 209 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:49,480 Speaker 2: as parents we've really understood how important our role is 210 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:55,600 Speaker 2: in an environment where where the kids are exposed much 211 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 2: much earlier to a whole lot of stuff that we 212 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:00,840 Speaker 2: didn't know about till you know, we were to anyone. 213 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:03,360 Speaker 1: And when I hear say that, I think that the 214 00:13:03,400 --> 00:13:06,080 Speaker 1: twenty four our news cycle has gotten to be a 215 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,679 Speaker 1: contributed to the stress, especially that our older kids are experiencing. 216 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:14,319 Speaker 1: But I can't help but think that we're creating this ourselves. 217 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:16,200 Speaker 1: I feel like in so many ways we are our 218 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:18,760 Speaker 1: own worst enemy. We've got the screens going all the time, 219 00:13:18,760 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: We've got the news going all the time. Our society 220 00:13:21,559 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 1: has built itself around this need to know and need 221 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:29,800 Speaker 1: to know now your reference BONDI and the awful tragedy 222 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:32,360 Speaker 1: that occurred there. In the days following that, I was 223 00:13:32,360 --> 00:13:36,199 Speaker 1: asked to do countless media interviews about how to talk 224 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:38,040 Speaker 1: to the kids about it. Several of those were on 225 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: the television. I'm sure you had the same experience. And 226 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:43,480 Speaker 1: so you're sitting in a TV studio or you're sitting 227 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: online watching the TV programming. And it was one thing 228 00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:50,560 Speaker 1: for me to hear about it and read about it 229 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:53,880 Speaker 1: across the weekend. It was another thing entirely to start 230 00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:57,480 Speaker 1: watching footage that people recorded on their phones of this 231 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:00,800 Speaker 1: of this man, what it was doing. 232 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 2: The imagery, I think it gets to you more than 233 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:05,559 Speaker 2: the word this thing. 234 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:07,480 Speaker 1: And now we now. 235 00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:11,320 Speaker 2: We've got CCTV iPhone images, you know, we get everything 236 00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:15,559 Speaker 2: instantly right, and again I don't think that we've really 237 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 2: come to terms with what effect that has on us psychologically. 238 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:23,160 Speaker 2: I'll tell you what happened to me on Saturday. So 239 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:25,880 Speaker 2: I had my little grandchildren with me, five and eight, 240 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 2: and I saw it on my newsfeed and I made it. 241 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:31,320 Speaker 2: I was really shocked. I didn't know how to process 242 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:33,560 Speaker 2: this in the moment, and I thought, well, I'm just 243 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 2: not going to turn the television off. And of course 244 00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:38,920 Speaker 2: they're still quite young, so they don't have their own phone, 245 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 2: so they did not know about this until the next day. 246 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,920 Speaker 2: And I made that decision too, that I needed time 247 00:14:46,760 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 2: to process what had happened as an adult first before 248 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 2: before you talking with kids about it. So, you know, 249 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 2: I think that we need to recognize that that that 250 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 2: that it is so confronting sometimes that even as adults, 251 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 2: but then it's going to be even more confronting and 252 00:15:05,320 --> 00:15:10,480 Speaker 2: difficult to you know, understand for children. And that's where 253 00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:13,160 Speaker 2: we as as parents come. 254 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: In from the Happy Families Online Digital Conference breaking point 255 00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: that is, the National Children's Commissioner and Holland's. You can 256 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:29,560 Speaker 1: find more of that conversation at happy families dot com 257 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 1: dot you just go to the shop and look for 258 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,400 Speaker 1: the Breaking Point Digital Conference. I think that you'll find 259 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 1: so much there of tremendous value. Tomorrow, on a Happy 260 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:42,320 Speaker 1: Families podcast, we look at this week in parenting. We're 261 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:44,440 Speaker 1: going to take a look at somebody who is arguing 262 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,000 Speaker 1: that vaping could actually be good for kids, and that 263 00:15:47,040 --> 00:15:50,720 Speaker 1: we need vaping vaping rooms for our kids, and also 264 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 1: a new nicotine threat that is taking over schools. That 265 00:15:54,680 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 1: and more This Week in parenting is on the Happy 266 00:15:56,720 --> 00:16:00,680 Speaker 1: Families podcast tomorrow. The Happy Families Podcast is produced by 267 00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:03,720 Speaker 1: Justin Rowland from Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer. 268 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 1: For more information about making your family happier, visitors at 269 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:08,640 Speaker 1: happy families dot com dot au.