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Speaker 1: I'm very excited about this guest. So she's one of

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Speaker 1: TikTok's most talked about voices on dating and relationships. She's

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Speaker 1: known for her brutally honest takes that make women cheer

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Speaker 1: and men's squirm. And we're lucky enough to have Margarita Nazarenko,

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Speaker 1: who has the world's best name, here to unpack why

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Speaker 1: her unapologetic truth bombs keep going viral. I'm obsessed with you.

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Speaker 1: Welcome MARGERITEA thank you.

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Speaker 2: I'm obsessed with you.

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Speaker 1: So I've got a million questions to ask you. Sure,

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Speaker 1: perhaps answer them, but the first one is okay. So

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Speaker 1: you've got this black cat Golden Retriever theory. My therapist

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Speaker 1: the other day said that I'm a golden retriever, which

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be. So can you explain to

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Speaker 1: us what the theory is and how I can become

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Speaker 1: a black cat?

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Speaker 2: So the theory originated on TikTok. It just happens. It's

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Speaker 2: like a mushroom that suddenly grows and everyone just resonates

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Speaker 2: with it and it takes on life of its own.

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Speaker 2: It started off with somebody talking about friendships in that

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Speaker 2: way where a golden retriever is a happy one and

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Speaker 2: the black cat is reserved and cool. And I think

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Speaker 2: where it comes to men and women and where I

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Speaker 2: talk about it is that women thrive in the position

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Speaker 2: of a black cat. Women feel good when they're loved

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Speaker 2: and admired. When a woman is chasing a man, she

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Speaker 2: feels a bit shit about herself. I've never been to

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Speaker 2: a wedding where a woman goes, oh, do you know what?

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Speaker 2: I chased him down. He wasn't sure about me, and

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Speaker 2: now you know I want him over or I impressed him.

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Speaker 2: But men are quite proud of that story. When they

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Speaker 2: talk about women that they kind of proved their affection

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Speaker 2: for and then she changed her mind, they see that

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Speaker 2: as a win. So the golden retriever energy, kind of

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Speaker 2: the chasing energy, suits a man in terms of a

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Speaker 2: relationship because he's feeling like he won something. Now.

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Speaker 1: In your podcast a lot, you talk about high value women.

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Speaker 1: What is a high value woman and how do I

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Speaker 1: become one?

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Speaker 2: Oh? You are, don't worry. But the thing is, I

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Speaker 2: take viral terms that exist on the Internet and I

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Speaker 2: talk about them from an angle that is actually helpful.

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Speaker 2: High value women as this whole like Andrew Tates scenario.

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Speaker 2: You know, what do you bring to the table, And

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Speaker 2: the answer for woman is nothing, because if you are

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Speaker 2: bargaining with what you bring to the table, that means

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Speaker 2: you don't have intrinsic feminine energy, which is the energy

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Speaker 2: of being yourself, being kind, being funny, being relaxed. And

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Speaker 2: masculine energy is everything that you are doing or what

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Speaker 2: you are becoming, because essentially, I heard a scientist say,

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Speaker 2: we're all born as women in the womb essentially, and

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Speaker 2: you become a man, you don't become feminine, you are

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Speaker 2: already Feminine's why boys insult each other with you're such

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Speaker 2: a girl. It's not just societal, it's because to become

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Speaker 2: masculine you have to become brave, become strong. No little

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Speaker 2: boy is brave and strong. Yeah, we're all feminine traits

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Speaker 2: are intrinsically ours and masculinity is developed.

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Speaker 1: So if someone is worried that they're in musculine masculine

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Speaker 1: energy too much and they want to sit in there

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Speaker 1: feminine in when they go on dates because I struggle,

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Speaker 1: I strug go on dates. I take over the chat.

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Speaker 1: I you know, I will happily go to the bar

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Speaker 1: and pay for our drinks.

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Speaker 2: And well, it's just the art of flirting, isn't It

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Speaker 2: is an art? Yeah, And to flirt with someone and

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Speaker 2: be feminine, that's the one thing men don't have. They're

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Speaker 2: not intrinsically feminine. So for them to see someone feminine,

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Speaker 2: someone relaxed, someone who's really easy to be with but

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Speaker 2: hard to get, that's the paradigm. Not hard to get

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Speaker 2: as in like she's running away for no reason, but

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Speaker 2: as in like she's busy, she's got her own life.

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Speaker 2: She's hard to get, but she's easy to be with,

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Speaker 2: because women these days are very easy to get. Yet

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Speaker 2: what time we're meeting? Sorry? Yeah, are you here at five?

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Speaker 2: You know, they're very like on it. And then if

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Speaker 2: he doesn't perform in the way she wants in any paradigm,

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Speaker 2: she's upset about it. She's really hard to be with

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Speaker 2: and it's not enjoyable.

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Speaker 1: But then are we playing games?

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Speaker 2: Like? If games?

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Speaker 1: Again? That's what I wanted to ask you, because I

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Speaker 1: can't decide because we're told so much on the tiktoks

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Speaker 1: and the instagrams and everything like don't play play games?

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Speaker 1: Be authentically yourself?

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Speaker 2: What is authentically yourself? A series of reactions you've had

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Speaker 2: from ways that you've learnt to be because of the

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Speaker 2: way you were parented or because of the way you

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Speaker 2: interacted with people. It's a series of algorith that you've

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Speaker 2: seen work. A lot of things that I talk about

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Speaker 2: is anxious attachment versus avoidant attachment versus secure Some of

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Speaker 2: us who got parented well and had a nice life

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Speaker 2: are securely attached. We know how to interact with people.

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Speaker 2: To them, be yourself as good advice. Yeah, be yourself

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Speaker 2: is like, yeah, you're a great person. Just be yourself.

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Speaker 2: To someone who's anxious and bombards people with texts and

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Speaker 2: doesn't know how to and they're all, you know, flinching

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Speaker 2: and glitch, be yourself is probably a disaster to them,

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Speaker 2: A good idea would be relaxed. So don't be yourself.

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Speaker 2: See what happens if you don't initiate another text.

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Speaker 1: So it's not even playing games, it's sitting in the

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Speaker 1: discomfort to make it shake the discomfort of who would

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Speaker 1: I be if I was comfortable with silence? Okay, I

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Speaker 1: want your own advice on a dating thing that happened

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Speaker 1: to me last week to really upset me. So this

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Speaker 1: guy had been I've dated him on and off for

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Speaker 1: years and he's a peeda pant so he will never

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Speaker 1: grow up. He's fifty three, and he kept like, you know,

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Speaker 1: I've moved to Palm Beach. So he said, oh, come

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Speaker 1: to Palm Beach. I'll take you up for lunch. We

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Speaker 1: can have like beautiful lunch, we'll go for a swim.

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Speaker 1: We'll be lovely. I said, perfect. And then he said

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Speaker 1: this thing which ruined it. So he said we'd organized

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Speaker 1: to meet on the Thursday for lunch. And so he said, oh,

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Speaker 1: can you just text me Monday or Tuesday to remind me.

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Speaker 1: I was like, you invited me on the date.

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Speaker 2: I actually have goosebumps.

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Speaker 1: Right, this man is fifty three, very capable in the

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Speaker 1: business world.

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Speaker 2: What did you do? Is the question. I think you'll

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Speaker 2: be proud of me.

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Speaker 1: So I sent him a message and said, I said, bro, though,

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Speaker 1: which is sitting in my masculine so I regret that,

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Speaker 1: but I said, bro, I don't go out with men

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Speaker 1: who I have to remind to hang out with me.

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Speaker 2: And then he.

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Speaker 1: Said, I'll put it in my diary. Like he backtracked

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Speaker 1: and was like, babab babe, We'll put in my day

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Speaker 1: and make sure it happened.

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Speaker 2: It didn't happen. It didn't happen, and I didn't remind

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Speaker 2: him because it's level zero. Let's call it level five

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Speaker 2: and level ten of unbothered feminine energy. Okay, so level

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Speaker 2: zero would be why would you tell me to do?

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Speaker 2: You know, all of this kind of like crying, sulking,

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Speaker 2: or reminding him being like, hi, reminding you to book

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Speaker 2: our date? That'd be zero. You did, which is good, Okay, good,

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Speaker 2: you said I don't book dates and I don't you

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Speaker 2: set a boundary? Great, fantastic, Okay. What you should have

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Speaker 2: done is not replied and forgot to remind.

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Speaker 1: Him, not reply at all when he said no.

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Speaker 2: And then when he says to you, oh, we were

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Speaker 2: supposed to go up, you go will we? Oh?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, because he messaged me this week.

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Speaker 2: That's the true essence of what would because you're still

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Speaker 2: controlling the situation. You're telling him how to act, what

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Speaker 2: to do, teach him by your actions that I'm not

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Speaker 2: the reminder.

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Speaker 1: I want to play a game of green flag Red

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Speaker 1: flag because.

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Speaker 2: My version of the reality.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I want brutal I want brutal honesty, because I

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Speaker 1: think you will surprise us with what is actually a

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Speaker 1: green flag and a red flag that we don't know

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Speaker 1: we're doing. Okay, so here's a few scenarios which I've

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Speaker 1: personally found myself in, and I think a lot of

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Speaker 1: our listeners have as well. This is just my free

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Speaker 1: therapy session. I wanted to find out green flag or

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Speaker 1: red flag? So he won't share his location settings with you,

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Speaker 1: so like, you know, like find my friend.

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Speaker 2: How long is the relationship? Six months? Green flag? That

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Speaker 2: he won't share them with you? Why are you asking him?

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Speaker 2: Because I want to know where he is at all time?

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Speaker 2: Bothering him, aren't you?

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Speaker 1: Oh? Gross, I was just mothering him. Okay, you're sor right.

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Speaker 2: Okay, you shouldn't even thinking about his location? Who is he?

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Speaker 2: He's already it's not going at all, Keep going.

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Speaker 1: Okay, he has a lot of girlfriends.

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Speaker 2: What kind of girlfriends?

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Speaker 1: Like, he's always texting them?

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Speaker 2: Texting them? Yeah, red flag? Why have you got time

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Speaker 2: for girlfriends? Get another job?

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's so brutal.

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Speaker 2: Listen, women believe in male female friendships. You believe that

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Speaker 2: men are your friends. You're also very attractive, so you

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Speaker 2: might be believing a unicorn that doesn't exist. Men can

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Speaker 2: be friends with women, if it's for a work reason

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Speaker 2: or for a project, or for things like that. I'm

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Speaker 2: not saying that they're never friends with women. It cannot

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Speaker 2: be possible. But usually if he's sitting there with you

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Speaker 2: texting a goal, if.

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Speaker 1: The opportunity came up to shag them, he yes, right, absolutely, wow, absolutely, Okay.

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Speaker 1: He only wants to see you on weekends.

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Speaker 2: What's his job finance.

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Speaker 1: Broh, No, because he's going out drinking at night. If

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Speaker 1: someone's late for you but on time everywhere else, that's

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Speaker 1: a red flag. Men don't change, you know, when you

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Speaker 1: meet them and they're like, oh, I'm just you know,

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Speaker 1: in the hustle right now.

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Speaker 2: You know I can't do much, I can't see much.

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Speaker 2: That's gonna be him forever. You're gonna be there with

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Speaker 2: the kids, and he's I can't do much, I can't

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Speaker 2: see you much. It changes how they act that way. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: But if he's not serious and he's out with his brows,

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Speaker 2: he'll be at the pub with his friends when he's

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Speaker 2: eight sixty as well.

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Speaker 1: He wants the second date at his house. The amount

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Speaker 1: of men that have said to me, oh, I'm a

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Speaker 1: really good cook, come to my house. I'll cook you dinner.

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Speaker 2: What do you think.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna die? I don't want to eat ly, I

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Speaker 1: don't care. Why am I going to your house? I

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Speaker 1: don't like sitting at home. You just want to shag day? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: No, red flag? Okay, good, I feel fly. It's fine.

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Speaker 2: It's fine. I mean he's trying. You're sexy, It's okay.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true, isn't it? Because I always say, at

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Speaker 1: least be like, if a guy hits you up for

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Speaker 1: sex on the first day, I'd be more offended if

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Speaker 1: they didn't. Yeah, okay, he still follows his x on Instagram.

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Speaker 2: He shouldn't have Instagram. What's he doing that? Unless it's

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Speaker 2: for work? Yeah, unless you have to post for work.

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Speaker 2: Unless you've got like a renovation company and you're posting

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Speaker 2: on their radio station. You're a cintematographer. Why is he

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Speaker 2: following people? What's he doing again? Get another job. Any

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Speaker 2: guy who wants to date and is like doesn't know

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Speaker 2: how to be attractive to say you're not on social media,

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Speaker 2: she'll be like, you are not. What social media is

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Speaker 2: for the girls.

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Speaker 1: On the game so Hot, it's for the girls and

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Speaker 1: the gays. You're changing it, like I'm gonna have to

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Speaker 1: get rid of my whole roster. And then the ones

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Speaker 1: who take a selfie. Okay, final one. He's great in bed,

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Speaker 1: but terrible at texting.

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Speaker 2: Green flag? Why why is he texting again? No, I'm kidding,

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Speaker 2: but honestly, like some men are women's see his lack

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Speaker 2: of verbal fluency compliments texting. Let me tell you like this,

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Speaker 2: when people are like, oh, just text your husband and

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Speaker 2: ask him, like, you'll get a reply in two business

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Speaker 2: days from me, from everyone, from the president. He's just

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Speaker 2: not on his phone so it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, because this same guy that I was

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Speaker 1: seeing last year, you're answering so many questions. But I

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Speaker 1: would unravel because he would take eight hours and he

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Speaker 1: would put his phone on do not Disturb, which would

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Speaker 1: drive me insane. And I took it so personally until

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Speaker 1: like a year later when I got to know him

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Speaker 1: away from trying to date him, and he's who he is,

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Speaker 1: does do that to everyone, And I had like, I

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Speaker 1: had called it off with him because I'm like, this

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Speaker 1: is so rude. Why doesn't he answer back to me?

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Speaker 1: And now I'm looking back, going, oh that is you

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Speaker 1: can I was gonna say, manipulate wrong word motivate. A

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Speaker 1: difference is to say I love it when you text

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Speaker 1: me every day. Let's say you haven't heard from him.

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Speaker 2: The worst thing you can do if you still want

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Speaker 2: him to want you is wow, okay, call me back.

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Speaker 1: Finally passive. Now you go, oh my god, It's so

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Speaker 1: good to hear from you.

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Speaker 2: I'm so excited. I know it hurts inside to do

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Speaker 2: it because you're like, how dare you? Yeah? But watch

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Speaker 2: you'll change. Another one is women have a problem with

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Speaker 2: You're sitting in a restaurant and he's looking at attractive women.

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Speaker 1: Okay, they call it red Ferrari syndrome. Is so yes,

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Speaker 1: I've written about this before. Where it's because this is

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Speaker 1: how guys get out of it, they say, because I

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Speaker 1: caught a guy out once on a date. Every hot girl,

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Speaker 1: he literally he didn't just you know, do that subtle look.

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Speaker 1: He would move his whole body to look at these

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Speaker 1: girls and was driving me insane. And then someone said

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Speaker 1: to me, no, it's Red Ferrari zone where you know,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to red Ferrari, but if one drives

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Speaker 1: past me on the street, I'm going to go, oh,

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Speaker 1: red Ferrari. And that's how I think people get around it.

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Speaker 1: But what's your take on it? I think it matters.

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Speaker 1: If he's completely swerving, that's disrespect to you. Yeah right,

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Speaker 1: It's just anyone can control themselves. You've got such lack

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Speaker 1: of control. I don't men effort to look yeah like yeah.

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Speaker 2: Then and he's either trying to insult you or trying

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Speaker 2: to put you down, or he doesn't care about you

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Speaker 2: that much that it doesn't matter. But if you're with

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Speaker 2: a guy and he just like this, come on, I

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Speaker 2: look at women who are in bright colors or bodies, etc.

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Speaker 2: The worst thing you can do is why did you

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Speaker 2: just look at her? It just creates such a bad scenario.

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Speaker 2: And then it creates competition. It means to him that

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Speaker 2: you're competing with her. That means you think that she's

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Speaker 2: got something that you don't. And men kind of buy

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Speaker 2: into marketing. I suppose if he sees you and you're

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Speaker 2: just engaged, you're talking, you're laughing, he's looked at her,

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Speaker 2: you haven't even noticed. He's like, oh my god, what

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Speaker 2: is going on here? She's not bothered about that. I've

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Speaker 2: learned so much. Can we please get you on a guess?

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Speaker 1: I think we should put a call out for listeners

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Speaker 1: to send in their questions and we need to get

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Speaker 1: you back and just do it.

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Speaker 2: Open the hotline if you need more Margarita in your life.

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Speaker 2: The podcast it's called Being Her, and the book The

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Speaker 2: New Rules. Margarita Nazarenko, thank you so much for joining

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Speaker 2: us on Saucy Secrets