1 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:06,120 Speaker 1: Good morning, and welcome to the Daily OS. It's Wednesday, 2 00:00:06,200 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 1: the fifth of May. My name is Zara Seidler, and 3 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:11,639 Speaker 1: helping me make sense of today's news is Sam Koslowski. 4 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: Making news today, Morrison defends the travel. 5 00:00:15,560 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 2: Ban, a proposal by the Victorian government. 6 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:21,799 Speaker 1: Some good news about solar energy in California, and a. 7 00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:24,720 Speaker 2: Look at the Indian travel ban through a legal lens. 8 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:26,920 Speaker 2: Here is today's Daily Digest. 9 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: So we're going to go into more of this in 10 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 1: our deep dive later. But yesterday Prime Minister Scott Morrison 11 00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: was out in the media defending the travel ban on India. 12 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:38,760 Speaker 1: Morrison noted that he believed it would be unlikely that 13 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 1: anyone would actually be charged or fined under the ban. 14 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 1: He said yesterday. The sanctions are there, they exist, but 15 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:49,720 Speaker 1: they will be exercised proportionately and responsibly. Ban is expected 16 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 1: to last until at least May fifteen, with Morrison confident 17 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: repatriation flights from India will begin again. 18 00:00:56,600 --> 00:00:59,959 Speaker 2: Story number two about Prime Minister Scott Morrison. He's reportedly 19 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:02,960 Speaker 2: considering a proposal by the Victorian government to build a 20 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:06,960 Speaker 2: five hundred bed quarantine facility. The Victorian government has committed 21 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:10,720 Speaker 2: fifteen million dollars to the detailed and comprehensive proposal as 22 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 2: an alternative to hotel quarantine, but has called on the 23 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:15,160 Speaker 2: federal government to assist with funding. 24 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,480 Speaker 1: A social media post from an official Communist Party account 25 00:01:20,480 --> 00:01:23,640 Speaker 1: from China has been removed by Chinese authorities after it 26 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 1: mocked India's deadly second wave of COVID nineteen. The image 27 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 1: in the post compared the launch of a space station 28 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 1: module with the image of mass cremations in India, accompanied 29 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:37,319 Speaker 1: by the caption China lighting a fire versus India lighting 30 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: a fire. The post true criticism from thousands of users 31 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: and was deleted about five hours later. 32 00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 2: And the Humpday good news the Biden administration has approved 33 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 2: a major solar energy project in the Californian Desert that 34 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 2: is set to power and estimated ninety thousand homes. So 35 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 2: the news has been dominated this week by the federal 36 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 2: government's sudden decision to ban Australian entering the country if 37 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:03,919 Speaker 2: they have been in India. Within the last fourteen days, 38 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:07,760 Speaker 2: we've seen outcry from human rights groups, members of the 39 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:12,400 Speaker 2: Australian Cricketing Fraternity Coalition MPs against their own government, and 40 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:15,359 Speaker 2: many members of the public. Including quite a chunk of 41 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 2: Dally Oz reader. What I thought would be helpful today 42 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 2: was to look at the legal issues of this argument, 43 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:25,119 Speaker 2: because I've heard the words citizenship thrown around a lot 44 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 2: in this debate. I've heard a High Court challenge being flagged, 45 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:31,200 Speaker 2: and it's time that we took a step back and 46 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 2: looked at the basics. 47 00:02:33,080 --> 00:02:35,160 Speaker 1: So we to look at the base six. Let's just 48 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: do a little comparison here. I think it's important to 49 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,320 Speaker 1: add here to that the conversations around the legality of 50 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:44,520 Speaker 1: this amendment to the Biosecurity Act that limits people who 51 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:46,079 Speaker 1: have been in India is. 52 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:47,560 Speaker 2: Actually also about the fact. 53 00:02:47,360 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: That the Australian government seemingly criminalized the act of returning 54 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:54,519 Speaker 1: to one's country. It was a really late night press 55 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:57,080 Speaker 1: release put out by the government that basically said that 56 00:02:57,240 --> 00:02:59,400 Speaker 1: if somebody was found to have been in India in 57 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 1: the last four teen days and then was still able 58 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,160 Speaker 1: to get back into the country, they were then facing 59 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:07,520 Speaker 1: either a sixty six thousand dollar fine or five years 60 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:09,919 Speaker 1: in jail. So when we're talking about this, I think 61 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:12,240 Speaker 1: it's important to keep in mind that aspect of it. 62 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:16,240 Speaker 1: Prime Minister Scott Morrison did yesterday say that the chances 63 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: of legal action actually being taken were very very limited 64 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:22,200 Speaker 1: and very low and unlikely. But that begs the question 65 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:24,919 Speaker 1: as to why this was included in the original press 66 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 1: release by the government. 67 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:29,799 Speaker 2: So why is this so important? Let's think about the 68 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 2: nine thousand Australians who remained stranded in India. 69 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 1: Sorry, going to stop you there, because we get a 70 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: lot of questions on our Instagram about what this word 71 00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 1: stranded means and how people could possibly be stranded when 72 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 1: they've had so long to come home, and Sam and 73 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:46,520 Speaker 1: I are often responding to people and actually also talking 74 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 1: to those who are stranded overseas. And there are a 75 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 1: number of reasons as to why Ozzie's are still overseas. 76 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 1: They might have been in jobs that didn't allow them 77 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:57,160 Speaker 1: to return home, or they were too pregnant to fly. 78 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 1: There are so many different reasons why Ozzie's asked stuck overseas. 79 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 2: And the common denominator across all of the reasons we've 80 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:07,080 Speaker 2: heard in the last twelve months is that nobody has 81 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:11,760 Speaker 2: done anything wrong here. Okay, So what is citizenship? Citizenship 82 00:04:11,880 --> 00:04:15,200 Speaker 2: in a legal sense is the relationship that I have 83 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 2: with my nation Australia as a nation owes fundamental obligations 84 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 2: to me, and I owe fundamental obligations to Australia. One 85 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:26,039 Speaker 2: of the obligations the nation has is to defend me 86 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:30,080 Speaker 2: via a defense force. One of the jobs that I 87 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 2: have for the nation is to not commit crimes. This 88 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 2: is what philosophers call the social contract we enter into. 89 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 2: Importantly for this story, one of the other basic principles 90 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:41,960 Speaker 2: of citizenship is that we can freely return to our 91 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:45,600 Speaker 2: countries when overseas. This notion is repeated across a number 92 00:04:45,640 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 2: of the really key human rights documents, like the Universal 93 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,919 Speaker 2: Declaration of Human Rights and the International Covenant on Civil 94 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:55,680 Speaker 2: and Political Rights. I actually talked about this earlier in 95 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 2: the year on this podcast when we discussed the lawsuit 96 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 2: brought by two Usustralians to the UN for the Australian 97 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 2: government failing to facilitate their return home. It's many of this. 98 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 2: It's many of the same issues, except this time Australians 99 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:12,159 Speaker 2: can't get home, not because of a lack of flights 100 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 2: or a lack of access, but rather because there's a 101 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:17,040 Speaker 2: hard block on their access into the country. At the 102 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:20,760 Speaker 2: center of the law in Australia, in this particular, case 103 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 2: is the Biosecurity Act, which we've heard about a lot 104 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 2: over the course of the pandemic. It gives the government 105 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 2: powers to evoke special measures to protect Australians from the 106 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:35,440 Speaker 2: spread of COVID nineteen. The buck stops with Health Minister 107 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:38,159 Speaker 2: Greg Hunt and he has to decide whether the special 108 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 2: powers he exercises under the Act are reasonably likely to 109 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 2: protect Australians and whether they impinge on other human rights laws, 110 00:05:46,040 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 2: and how that trade off should be managed. He takes 111 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 2: into account a number of key stakeholders advice and two 112 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:55,840 Speaker 2: days ago we saw the release of the advice from 113 00:05:55,880 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 2: the Chief Medical Officer Paul Kelly, who captured the tension 114 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 2: in this debate really clearly when he said that because 115 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 2: of the spread of COVID nineteen in India, it is 116 00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:07,720 Speaker 2: valid that Australians in India should not be allowed back 117 00:06:07,760 --> 00:06:10,880 Speaker 2: in the country. However, there is a risk to Australians 118 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,239 Speaker 2: then who are stuck in India of illness and perhaps death. 119 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:17,160 Speaker 2: So there's all of these legal arguments that are floating 120 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:18,719 Speaker 2: around and I'm not going to pretend to know what 121 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 2: the right answer is legally. But if we put all 122 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:25,239 Speaker 2: the legal issues to one side. The argument often comes 123 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:30,760 Speaker 2: back to Australia's quarantine capacities and our ability to process 124 00:06:30,800 --> 00:06:35,840 Speaker 2: people coming from overseas. Legal experts and health experts are 125 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 2: quite unified on bringing the argument back to this key point. 126 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,600 Speaker 2: For the nine thousand Australians in India who are anxiously 127 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:46,920 Speaker 2: waiting a change to the law, their access to Australia 128 00:06:46,960 --> 00:06:49,640 Speaker 2: would be made much easier if the quarantine system could 129 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:51,039 Speaker 2: facilitate their arrival. 130 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:55,039 Speaker 1: The news cycle hasn't revolved around questions of citizenship, this 131 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 1: predominantly since we had the citizenship crisis in our parliament 132 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 1: a couple of years ago. But all of these debates 133 00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 1: talk to what rights we as Australians are bestowed when 134 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:08,840 Speaker 1: we become citizens or are born citizens of this country, 135 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 1: and how that might play out in say a global pandemic. 136 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 1: This is uncharted territory and this story is very much developing, 137 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:18,440 Speaker 1: so we'll keep you updated as it develops. 138 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 2: It's time for us to take the next step in 139 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:24,679 Speaker 2: this podcast, and that involves you. We would really really 140 00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 2: love if you could subscribe or follow the podcast on 141 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 2: wherever you listen to podcasts, as well as leave us 142 00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:34,800 Speaker 2: a review on Spotify. Or Apple. 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