WEBVTT - The (500) Days Of Summer Breakdown 👩 ☀️👨 0:00:01.560 --> 0:00:04.480 Flex and Frooms, Flex and Frooms. This is the Flex 0:00:04.519 --> 0:00:06.560 and Frooms catch up podcast. 0:00:07.360 --> 0:00:08.760 It is Flex and Frooms on CATA. 0:00:08.760 --> 0:00:11.000 A couple of weeks ago, if not before we went 0:00:11.039 --> 0:00:14.120 on break, we were discussing that I would say ten 0:00:14.200 --> 0:00:17.400 years ago, when we all watched the hit indie movie 0:00:17.520 --> 0:00:20.320 Five Hundred Days of Summer. We all got it wrong, 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:24.919 and we're here to number one apologize for our misdemeanors. 0:00:24.960 --> 0:00:28.160 A number two set the record straight. This is also 0:00:28.200 --> 0:00:30.479 prompted by a listener question we got via the DMS. 0:00:30.520 --> 0:00:33.800 It's Flex and Frooms on Instagram. Any questions you have 0:00:34.000 --> 0:00:38.080 please feedback advice queries go to the Instagram DM. It'll 0:00:38.080 --> 0:00:41.040 be siphoned by producer Mickey. She'll bring us the questions. 0:00:41.080 --> 0:00:44.320 It'll reach us. I promise you don't get trapped in 0:00:44.360 --> 0:00:48.760 our personal dms to waste lands. So listener says, oh 0:00:48.840 --> 0:00:51.920 my god, please dissect five hundred Days of Summer. 0:00:52.200 --> 0:00:53.520 I need this explanation. 0:00:53.840 --> 0:00:55.960 I've always felt so many things about this movie and 0:00:56.000 --> 0:00:58.520 often think of it in life. Like producer MICHAELA, I 0:00:58.560 --> 0:01:01.840 want a deep analysis flex and Room style. Please ps, 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:06.720 you guys are the absolute best thing since Slice Spread. 0:01:06.880 --> 0:01:08.640 Look I hear you. And for that reason, I've actually 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:10.800 done some research. I fully not only. 0:01:10.640 --> 0:01:15.200 Did research notes notes, I haven't worked a day in 0:01:15.240 --> 0:01:18.760 my life since twenty ten. But for this, I said, 0:01:18.800 --> 0:01:21.160 I can do some research, all right. So five to 0:01:21.200 --> 0:01:26.880 Day's with Summer A funny, seductive, surprisingly honest dramaticization. 0:01:27.200 --> 0:01:29.240 So you say it anyway, is this your words or 0:01:29.360 --> 0:01:30.480 rotten tomato vibes? 0:01:30.680 --> 0:01:31.640 We're starting rotten tomato. 0:01:31.680 --> 0:01:37.520 We got to meet Okay, dramatization, dramamatization, Jay too much 0:01:37.840 --> 0:01:41.920 of the ways we subject ourselves into incompatible love, I said, 0:01:42.160 --> 0:01:46.040 this is it. So from the beginning, the story in 0:01:46.080 --> 0:01:48.960 itself tells us that the movie is not a love story. 0:01:48.960 --> 0:01:51.640 And that's the thing that by the end, how you 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:54.160 feel about it that should remain center in your brain. 0:01:54.200 --> 0:01:55.560 It's not a love story. It's not meant to be 0:01:55.640 --> 0:01:57.440 two people meet each other, they fall in love, it 0:01:57.480 --> 0:02:00.560 works out. It's meant to be two people people who 0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:02.720 are living a very similar life to the rest of us, 0:02:02.800 --> 0:02:05.240 experience something and we get to see it like a mirror. 0:02:05.400 --> 0:02:09.400 Right from the beginning, Summer, the woman protagonist says she 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:13.239 doesn't want to be in a relationship. From the beginning, Tom, 0:02:13.639 --> 0:02:17.320 the man protagonist, is head over heels for her. She's 0:02:17.360 --> 0:02:20.120 everything he could have ever wanted. They have the same interest. 0:02:20.240 --> 0:02:24.200 She's loose and fun and free, cool girl. The movie 0:02:24.360 --> 0:02:28.320 goes on and shares their five hundred days of incompatibility 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:32.040 all the ways, where he goes on to essentially hate 0:02:32.040 --> 0:02:34.680 her by the end for not agreeing to be in 0:02:34.720 --> 0:02:37.160 love with him and for not agreeing to a committed 0:02:37.600 --> 0:02:40.880 monogamous relationship. By the end, she's engaged to a whole 0:02:40.919 --> 0:02:43.200 new guy. We paint her the villain, we paint him 0:02:43.200 --> 0:02:46.720 the nice guy, and life moves on after ten plus 0:02:46.840 --> 0:02:53.120 years of existing. I've come on record to say Tom 0:02:53.560 --> 0:02:57.960 is all of us, a nice guy, deeply flawed, and 0:02:58.000 --> 0:03:02.400 would prefer that we sent his wants over the reality 0:03:02.440 --> 0:03:05.960 of a situation that requires two people to be compatible for. 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:06.400 It to work. 0:03:07.240 --> 0:03:12.280 Summer is someone who set a boundary, who provided context 0:03:12.600 --> 0:03:16.160 and presumed, because she had provided context, that she could 0:03:16.200 --> 0:03:18.519 behave in any which way and would not be held 0:03:18.520 --> 0:03:21.720 accountable for what she first said. So, yeah, she said 0:03:21.720 --> 0:03:23.600 she wanted to be single and proceeded to kiss him 0:03:23.600 --> 0:03:24.200 every other day. 0:03:24.760 --> 0:03:25.600 She said what she said. 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:29.760 Now you know how for the past I would say 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:32.800 eight weeks now. A core theme of what I've been 0:03:32.800 --> 0:03:35.520 trying to discuss on our show is the way that 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:39.560 misogyny is so insidious and it erodes at our ability 0:03:39.560 --> 0:03:43.680 to look at anything objectively because somehow, some way, a 0:03:43.720 --> 0:03:48.960 woman is often painted as the person who is uninformed, annoying, annoying, 0:03:49.760 --> 0:03:52.800 crosses the line, doesn't know what she's doing, la la 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:56.440 la la. And this man, we've infantialized him by saying, well, 0:03:56.680 --> 0:04:01.120 well like he no, okay. It's so much more so, 0:04:01.200 --> 0:04:03.520 as I was reading through the wiki trying to remind 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:06.320 myself what the movie was about, so many glaring I 0:04:06.360 --> 0:04:08.640 don't want to call them red flags, but glaring instances 0:04:08.680 --> 0:04:11.240 of incompatibility show up from the very beginning that we 0:04:11.320 --> 0:04:15.360 refuse to acknowledge. Like I said before, Tom ignores everything 0:04:15.680 --> 0:04:19.000 about Summer that doesn't fit into his delusion. Right, So 0:04:19.240 --> 0:04:21.720 in his head, he's like, we're perfect for each other 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:25.400 because we both work at this same place, or because 0:04:25.440 --> 0:04:27.719 we get along, or because we can both tell the 0:04:27.760 --> 0:04:31.560 same jokes. But everything else outside of this he challenges 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:34.839 so much. So she from the beginning said she doesn't 0:04:34.880 --> 0:04:38.679 want a committed relationship with him, and is he comfortable 0:04:38.680 --> 0:04:41.640 that he says, Yeah, all good, we can do whatever 0:04:41.680 --> 0:04:42.200 you want to do. 0:04:42.520 --> 0:04:43.800 I just want to be near you. 0:04:44.000 --> 0:04:45.280 Taylor's oldest time. 0:04:45.600 --> 0:04:50.000 Now, while we recognize that she said what she said, 0:04:50.440 --> 0:04:53.840 I think when people try and defend Summer, they remove 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:56.720 her of any responsibility from what Tom was feeling. Right, 0:04:56.760 --> 0:04:59.080 people say, well, she said she didn't want a relationship, 0:04:59.080 --> 0:05:01.960 and therefore she is absolved from any pain she causes 0:05:02.000 --> 0:05:04.160 from simulating a relationship with him, from sleeping with him, 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:08.200 going on dates, having fun. She's absolved, No, because someone 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:12.080 should have been responsible for how her actions affected him, 0:05:12.240 --> 0:05:13.839 knowing that it contradicted what she said. 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:17.120 Really, absolutely, but don't you say that some people just 0:05:17.120 --> 0:05:18.760 want to go on dates but don't want anything serious. 0:05:18.800 --> 0:05:19.680 And that's okay as well. 0:05:19.880 --> 0:05:24.960 Absolutely, But she's also knowingly interacting with a guy who 0:05:25.080 --> 0:05:29.039 is hopelessly devoting himself to her with the hopes that 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:31.279 she changes her mind, and she knows she's not going 0:05:31.320 --> 0:05:33.839 to It's okay for her to know that, But then 0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:38.839 to actors, though she is without responsibility is immature. She 0:05:38.839 --> 0:05:40.600 could bow out and say, look's actually not that fun 0:05:40.640 --> 0:05:43.040 to be with someone who won't let me live, who's 0:05:43.040 --> 0:05:44.880 angry at me, every day, souse, I want to love them. 0:05:45.320 --> 0:05:46.520 There's a scene in the movie where. 0:05:46.400 --> 0:05:49.599 They talk about She says that she doesn't believe in 0:05:49.680 --> 0:05:52.039 love or something like that, or that love is a fantasy, 0:05:52.040 --> 0:05:55.240 and he's like, I disagree. Even in that moment, what 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:58.440 he thinks he loves about her is fantastical because at 0:05:58.440 --> 0:06:00.960 this point in the movie she's shown him so many 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:03.880 ways that love is a fantasy to him. He doesn't 0:06:03.920 --> 0:06:06.559 even know her yet, He just knows that he could 0:06:06.720 --> 0:06:09.720 like her and he could be excited by her anyway. 0:06:10.720 --> 0:06:13.760 Also, there's a bit in the movie. 0:06:13.560 --> 0:06:16.360 Where Summer says, I can't promise you how I'm gonna 0:06:16.400 --> 0:06:20.919 feel in the future when he asks her about some 0:06:21.080 --> 0:06:23.320 kind of like commitment or monogamy. 0:06:23.360 --> 0:06:25.320 But even then he was like, I'll take what I 0:06:25.360 --> 0:06:25.800 can get. 0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:29.600 So many steps in this movie he has or they've 0:06:29.640 --> 0:06:34.960 both knowingly agreed to this ambiguity, hoping in both ways 0:06:35.000 --> 0:06:37.279 it's going to go their way, not realizing that something's 0:06:37.279 --> 0:06:39.920 got to give eventually. Right now, we don't want to 0:06:40.000 --> 0:06:42.880 label everything we see into neat categories, but we can 0:06:43.040 --> 0:06:47.160 view this dynamic from like an anxious attached, avoid attached perspective, 0:06:47.240 --> 0:06:51.240 where the more that Tom leans in it encroaches on 0:06:51.279 --> 0:06:55.200 Somemer's independence. She's like, ah, she goes the more time 0:06:55.279 --> 0:06:57.479 she spends with Tom, is she convinced that she doesn't 0:06:57.520 --> 0:07:00.600 want love generally, or she just doesn't want love with him, 0:07:00.839 --> 0:07:03.160 she doesn't want commitment generally, or just doesn't wt commitment 0:07:03.160 --> 0:07:05.159 with him, because what ends up happening is what she 0:07:05.240 --> 0:07:08.880 gets engaged ooh. In the five hundred days span that 0:07:08.920 --> 0:07:10.400 they've known each other a year and a half, she 0:07:10.440 --> 0:07:12.560 goes from I don't believe in love, love is a 0:07:12.600 --> 0:07:16.160 fantasy to now I'm engaged, And of course he's gobsmacked. 0:07:16.200 --> 0:07:16.840 Yeah, he's upset. 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:19.760 What do you mean engaged? What do you mean to 0:07:19.840 --> 0:07:20.800 whom be truthed? 0:07:21.200 --> 0:07:24.280 I thought this only happened to our grandparents, you know 0:07:24.320 --> 0:07:25.120 what I mean? Yeah? 0:07:25.240 --> 0:07:26.000 Yeah, do you know what? 0:07:26.160 --> 0:07:27.960 And he's like, how is this possible? And she's like, 0:07:27.960 --> 0:07:30.880 how is it not possible? How is any of this 0:07:31.040 --> 0:07:33.200 not possible? Like? Were you living in the same reality 0:07:33.240 --> 0:07:35.880 I was living in when we had this engaged in 0:07:35.880 --> 0:07:38.800 a moment and entanglement, and you refuse to see that 0:07:38.880 --> 0:07:41.720 what I wanted compatible with what you wanted. So I 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:44.239 went to seek out what I wanted and you stayed 0:07:44.280 --> 0:07:50.440 pining after me. Damn, another thing I've written down. Another 0:07:50.480 --> 0:07:54.760 thing please. Obviously, the internalized misogyny, especially when you're a 0:07:54.760 --> 0:07:56.240 young person watching rom coms. 0:07:56.320 --> 0:07:58.000 Oh, it comes out really really quick. 0:07:58.040 --> 0:08:01.360 But I think also we don't consider that we're watching 0:08:01.360 --> 0:08:04.080 the movie from Tom's perspective, and that man is an 0:08:04.200 --> 0:08:08.000 unreliable narrator, not because he can't be trusted, but because 0:08:08.280 --> 0:08:09.720 you've seen what happens. 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:12.160 When you get a little bit, a little bit. 0:08:12.120 --> 0:08:19.400 Love sick, a little bit love sick, you see what happens. 0:08:20.160 --> 0:08:22.000 There's not a lot of people to pull you out. 0:08:22.000 --> 0:08:25.000 And Tom's an isolated character. There's not many people to 0:08:25.000 --> 0:08:26.840 pull him out of this delusion that he's in. And 0:08:29.800 --> 0:08:31.800 also the way that he's painted to us is that 0:08:31.880 --> 0:08:35.520 classic nice guy because he's not bad and he's not 0:08:35.559 --> 0:08:38.120 a villain. Why can't she just fall in love with him? 0:08:38.400 --> 0:08:39.160 Good question. 0:08:39.520 --> 0:08:44.480 I have the answer. She does not want him. 0:08:44.679 --> 0:08:47.520 God, I need it. Where can we watch the movie? Flex? 0:08:47.880 --> 0:08:50.440 Also, I'm not done because if you can see here, 0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:54.679 there are more notes to come. Also, the reason why 0:08:54.760 --> 0:08:57.840 I think we the viewer sympathize a lot with Tom 0:08:58.240 --> 0:09:01.120 is that he reflects these beliefs and these assumptions that 0:09:01.160 --> 0:09:03.960 we all have about romance that if we get along 0:09:04.000 --> 0:09:06.240 well enough and we're both attracted to each other, then 0:09:06.240 --> 0:09:08.880 why won't it just work? Why can't you just be 0:09:09.000 --> 0:09:10.920 with me? What is the answer to that? 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:14.480 Because it's not always the right time. 0:09:15.000 --> 0:09:18.840 My closing statement, yes disguises it is a question disguise 0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:25.840 as a statement. Is Summer actually a manic pixie dream 0:09:25.880 --> 0:09:28.800 girl or does Tom just want her to be one 0:09:29.320 --> 0:09:33.160 because his delusion would have it. So? Is she really 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:35.440 a girl that was like, Oh, I'm so kooky and 0:09:35.520 --> 0:09:39.400 crazy and down, or just a chick with interest existing 0:09:39.800 --> 0:09:41.319 who's a pleasure to be around. 0:09:42.120 --> 0:09:45.160 Thank you, rewrite that history. Rewrite that history. You run 0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:46.720 a arrest. My case. 0:09:47.880 --> 0:09:50.479 You've been listening to The Flex and Froom's daily podcast. 0:09:50.720 --> 0:09:54.360 For more, tune Indicater on DAB or stream it on iHeartRadio.