1 00:00:04,071 --> 00:00:10,431 Speaker 1: Black Cast, Unite our voices. Black Magical Podcast acknowledges the 2 00:00:10,511 --> 00:00:14,071 Speaker 1: traditional owners of the land we have recorded this episode on. 3 00:00:14,431 --> 00:00:16,951 Speaker 1: We also acknowledge traditional owners of the land where you, 4 00:00:17,431 --> 00:00:20,671 Speaker 1: the listener or viewer are tuning in from. We would 5 00:00:20,711 --> 00:00:22,871 Speaker 1: like to pay our respects to our elders past and 6 00:00:22,951 --> 00:00:26,831 Speaker 1: present and acknowledged that this always was Aboriginal land and 7 00:00:26,911 --> 00:00:28,791 Speaker 1: always will be Aboriginal land. 8 00:00:29,431 --> 00:00:31,991 Speaker 2: That's what I love about art. It gives that opportunity 9 00:00:32,071 --> 00:00:35,271 Speaker 2: to have those discussions and not being seen as angry 10 00:00:35,511 --> 00:00:38,911 Speaker 2: or violent or you know, protesting. Is it really protesting 11 00:00:38,951 --> 00:00:41,671 Speaker 2: when you're protesting your own body or controversial? 12 00:00:45,111 --> 00:00:49,671 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Black Magic Woman Podcast with Mandanara Bail. 13 00:00:54,191 --> 00:00:57,351 Speaker 1: Welcome back to another episode of the Black Magical Podcast. 14 00:00:57,471 --> 00:01:00,791 Speaker 1: I am here on Cameragle Country, which is in beautiful 15 00:01:00,791 --> 00:01:05,151 Speaker 1: Sydney also known as the Orination. I can't wait for 16 00:01:05,151 --> 00:01:08,511 Speaker 1: you to meet my next guest, and we've got a 17 00:01:08,551 --> 00:01:10,471 Speaker 1: few things that we were to unpack and even made 18 00:01:10,911 --> 00:01:15,151 Speaker 1: some connections before we press record. So I can't wait 19 00:01:15,231 --> 00:01:18,271 Speaker 1: for you to share a little bit about yourself. Sis 20 00:01:18,671 --> 00:01:20,791 Speaker 1: tell our listeners if you don't mind, and have yours 21 00:01:20,831 --> 00:01:23,271 Speaker 1: on YouTube, your name, your mob and a bit about 22 00:01:23,391 --> 00:01:24,111 Speaker 1: where you grew up. 23 00:01:24,311 --> 00:01:27,271 Speaker 2: Yeah, hello and thank you for having me. My name 24 00:01:27,351 --> 00:01:30,151 Speaker 2: is Kobe and Edgunn and I'm a girl from Darwin. 25 00:01:30,271 --> 00:01:32,031 Speaker 2: I grew up in Darwen and moved when I was 26 00:01:32,071 --> 00:01:35,391 Speaker 2: about five years old to Adelaide. I've got biggest mob 27 00:01:35,431 --> 00:01:39,631 Speaker 2: family and lots of different I guess races, all the 28 00:01:39,751 --> 00:01:41,871 Speaker 2: naughty and ice and everything with a bit of spice. 29 00:01:41,911 --> 00:01:50,311 Speaker 2: So Filipino, Aboriginal from lat three different language groups, English, Austrian, Irish, Scottish, 30 00:01:50,671 --> 00:01:53,551 Speaker 2: a bit of everything. That melting pot of Darwin, you 31 00:01:53,591 --> 00:01:54,471 Speaker 2: know it is. 32 00:01:54,751 --> 00:01:56,991 Speaker 1: It is if people say that the Darwin's a melting 33 00:01:57,031 --> 00:01:58,031 Speaker 1: pot and. 34 00:01:58,671 --> 00:02:02,831 Speaker 2: Here I am. Yeah, yeah, big family adlade. 35 00:02:02,831 --> 00:02:03,551 Speaker 1: You said you grew up. 36 00:02:03,751 --> 00:02:06,511 Speaker 2: Yeah, when we moved to Adelaide or Tasmania for a year, 37 00:02:06,551 --> 00:02:10,591 Speaker 2: weirdly because my stepfather he grew up there and his 38 00:02:10,751 --> 00:02:12,831 Speaker 2: grandfather passed away. So we stayed there for like a 39 00:02:12,911 --> 00:02:15,311 Speaker 2: year and then moved to Adelaide and that's where I 40 00:02:15,351 --> 00:02:20,151 Speaker 2: did my high school and university studies, and then wanted 41 00:02:20,151 --> 00:02:23,911 Speaker 2: to come to Sydney because I'm a big Boodoo queer 42 00:02:24,191 --> 00:02:25,551 Speaker 2: and wanted to run a mark. 43 00:02:25,711 --> 00:02:30,711 Speaker 1: Oh my god, my family down here too, do you 44 00:02:30,791 --> 00:02:32,351 Speaker 1: know Caira comes sing. 45 00:02:32,711 --> 00:02:35,951 Speaker 2: I do know Caira. Yeah, she works up with Marley there. Yeah, 46 00:02:36,071 --> 00:02:39,351 Speaker 2: she's Brenda's niece, Brenda Crofts niece. Yeah, I know her 47 00:02:39,351 --> 00:02:41,551 Speaker 2: from around the track. She does deadly work over there. 48 00:02:41,631 --> 00:02:45,391 Speaker 2: She's clear too, one of our biggest mob queer to 49 00:02:45,431 --> 00:02:46,151 Speaker 2: days around here. 50 00:02:46,271 --> 00:02:50,911 Speaker 1: Well, I marched to Marti Grass with her, that's deadily first. 51 00:02:51,191 --> 00:02:53,831 Speaker 1: It was actually a dream of mine to get on 52 00:02:53,871 --> 00:02:55,471 Speaker 1: that parade, but I just didn't want to be on 53 00:02:55,551 --> 00:02:59,311 Speaker 1: anyone's float. So I was on the float that actually 54 00:02:59,391 --> 00:03:03,111 Speaker 1: won for the best float, which one was. It was 55 00:03:03,151 --> 00:03:06,151 Speaker 1: the memorial real float okay, yeah, for a brother boy 56 00:03:06,191 --> 00:03:09,191 Speaker 1: who passed away. Yes, I was on that one. Yeah, 57 00:03:09,231 --> 00:03:12,871 Speaker 1: and my brother Greg Phillips was a queen on the 58 00:03:12,911 --> 00:03:16,791 Speaker 1: front of it. But my yeah, my lot of my 59 00:03:16,831 --> 00:03:20,391 Speaker 1: family and community here. I grew up partying in Oxford Street. 60 00:03:21,231 --> 00:03:23,671 Speaker 2: I didn't get that, like they closed that down before 61 00:03:23,671 --> 00:03:24,111 Speaker 2: I could. 62 00:03:24,191 --> 00:03:26,671 Speaker 1: Like, well, I was here then and it was the best. 63 00:03:26,831 --> 00:03:29,551 Speaker 2: That's why I came. Because my uncle was just like 64 00:03:29,631 --> 00:03:33,551 Speaker 2: you know, uncle Gary Lee, his beautiful uncle, great great 65 00:03:33,631 --> 00:03:35,951 Speaker 2: artist as well. And he yeah, when I was younger, 66 00:03:35,951 --> 00:03:38,911 Speaker 2: he was I was had like mohawk and wearing like 67 00:03:39,031 --> 00:03:41,831 Speaker 2: butch clothes and stuff. And he's like, but I know 68 00:03:41,871 --> 00:03:44,151 Speaker 2: you're not real feminine. But I know you're not real 69 00:03:44,191 --> 00:03:47,671 Speaker 2: butch either, So gave me Tiffany jewelry and he's like, 70 00:03:48,111 --> 00:03:50,111 Speaker 2: you can be a bit of a mix of both, 71 00:03:50,231 --> 00:03:52,231 Speaker 2: you know. And I'm like, thanks uncle, and he's like, 72 00:03:52,271 --> 00:03:54,471 Speaker 2: you need to go to Sydney. I grew up in 73 00:03:54,511 --> 00:03:58,751 Speaker 2: Sydney and go run on. Yeah. And then I was like, 74 00:03:58,751 --> 00:04:03,991 Speaker 2: all right, oh, come Sydney, lock out laws, no party. 75 00:04:03,671 --> 00:04:04,951 Speaker 1: In COVID, I know. 76 00:04:05,511 --> 00:04:09,031 Speaker 2: So it's adown woman, I'm married. Oh good, I did it. 77 00:04:09,151 --> 00:04:09,631 Speaker 2: You did it. 78 00:04:09,831 --> 00:04:11,191 Speaker 1: You didn't need the night live. 79 00:04:11,431 --> 00:04:13,351 Speaker 2: No. I came to the Big Pond, I found myself 80 00:04:13,351 --> 00:04:16,271 Speaker 2: a fish and said, you're not related. No, No, she'. 81 00:04:16,231 --> 00:04:23,191 Speaker 1: White because of the bloody stolen generation. Right, but we're 82 00:04:23,231 --> 00:04:27,391 Speaker 1: here today, and I know that you're doing a lot 83 00:04:27,431 --> 00:04:31,871 Speaker 1: of work in so many different spaces. Yeah, and you're 84 00:04:32,191 --> 00:04:35,231 Speaker 1: representing out there in Bankstown all over the shop, but 85 00:04:35,351 --> 00:04:36,791 Speaker 1: living here in Redfern. 86 00:04:37,111 --> 00:04:39,551 Speaker 2: Yeah, living in Redfern. I've lived all over. When I 87 00:04:39,591 --> 00:04:41,391 Speaker 2: moved to Sydney, I was working at the Art Gallery 88 00:04:41,431 --> 00:04:44,071 Speaker 2: of New South Wales. I was working for Tracy Moffin. 89 00:04:44,151 --> 00:04:46,951 Speaker 2: Actually she was doing the Venice BIONALI and I was 90 00:04:47,031 --> 00:04:51,071 Speaker 2: one of her assistants. So I moved over and then 91 00:04:51,111 --> 00:04:53,911 Speaker 2: started working for the art gallery there for like eight years. 92 00:04:54,431 --> 00:04:56,631 Speaker 2: And during that time, when you land in Sydney you 93 00:04:56,831 --> 00:04:59,671 Speaker 2: just end up, you know, hop scotching around the city. 94 00:05:00,151 --> 00:05:02,911 Speaker 2: It's really hard to find your roots. So I lived 95 00:05:02,951 --> 00:05:06,511 Speaker 2: in Red fan fresh Water, over this side and then 96 00:05:06,871 --> 00:05:10,431 Speaker 2: all over you know, Australia Street in Merrickville there with 97 00:05:10,511 --> 00:05:12,911 Speaker 2: all the queers and all the lovelies there. My local 98 00:05:12,951 --> 00:05:16,271 Speaker 2: pub was super queer. I loved it. Just a hop, 99 00:05:16,311 --> 00:05:18,711 Speaker 2: skip and jump away from my house. I could walk 100 00:05:18,751 --> 00:05:20,831 Speaker 2: home at two o'clock in the morning and be right 101 00:05:21,271 --> 00:05:24,031 Speaker 2: yeah and have biggest mob fun with everyone. And then 102 00:05:24,111 --> 00:05:26,151 Speaker 2: now I'm back in Redfern. I lived in Red Fernd 103 00:05:26,151 --> 00:05:28,791 Speaker 2: with my one of my sister girls, Nicole Monks, and 104 00:05:28,831 --> 00:05:31,711 Speaker 2: she's an artist. She had a little boy, little boy, 105 00:05:31,751 --> 00:05:33,711 Speaker 2: Bitty Biddy, at five years old, and she's like, well, 106 00:05:33,751 --> 00:05:36,471 Speaker 2: if you can deal with a kid, you can come 107 00:05:36,551 --> 00:05:38,391 Speaker 2: live with me. And I'm like, yeah, I'm right with kids. 108 00:05:38,591 --> 00:05:39,431 Speaker 1: I got a lot of mob. 109 00:05:39,551 --> 00:05:41,551 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm right. She's like, well, in Sydney, most people 110 00:05:41,551 --> 00:05:42,911 Speaker 2: don't want to live with five year old kids, and 111 00:05:42,951 --> 00:05:44,071 Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, I don't give. 112 00:05:43,911 --> 00:05:47,311 Speaker 1: A stuff, Like I serious side. 113 00:05:47,751 --> 00:05:49,671 Speaker 2: I moved in and first thing I cooked for her. 114 00:05:49,951 --> 00:05:50,751 Speaker 1: Now you're auntie. 115 00:05:50,871 --> 00:05:54,511 Speaker 2: Yeah, chili mudcrab, first meal. And now that kid loves 116 00:05:54,551 --> 00:05:58,671 Speaker 2: his seafood, he's full. I'm getting him like Darwin Palette. Yeah, 117 00:05:58,671 --> 00:05:59,231 Speaker 2: making sure. 118 00:05:59,111 --> 00:06:03,191 Speaker 1: Because there's that kind of Malaysian Indonesian. There's even Chinese 119 00:06:03,231 --> 00:06:04,431 Speaker 1: Japanese influence. 120 00:06:04,871 --> 00:06:05,671 Speaker 2: Yeah, we're Asian. 121 00:06:06,031 --> 00:06:06,271 Speaker 1: Yeah. 122 00:06:06,751 --> 00:06:10,151 Speaker 2: Yeah. We traded with Silhouesi for two hundred years prior 123 00:06:10,151 --> 00:06:13,071 Speaker 2: to colonization. You know, tripang ce cucumber that went all 124 00:06:13,151 --> 00:06:15,351 Speaker 2: the way up to China and back. And people don't 125 00:06:15,391 --> 00:06:19,111 Speaker 2: talk about that because that is a really amazing piece 126 00:06:19,111 --> 00:06:21,751 Speaker 2: of evidence of us being, you know, a very well 127 00:06:21,791 --> 00:06:22,831 Speaker 2: developed economy. 128 00:06:22,871 --> 00:06:24,911 Speaker 1: We had training, having international relations. 129 00:06:24,951 --> 00:06:28,231 Speaker 2: We had international relations for two hundred years prior to colonization. 130 00:06:28,351 --> 00:06:30,551 Speaker 2: The mccasson mob will come over six months of the 131 00:06:30,631 --> 00:06:33,871 Speaker 2: year and set up camp. Our word for money is 132 00:06:34,031 --> 00:06:41,871 Speaker 2: rule pier, our word for suscils, breast for milk, word 133 00:06:41,871 --> 00:06:42,431 Speaker 2: for milks. 134 00:06:42,671 --> 00:06:48,951 Speaker 1: So their language became part of our local dialects and languages. 135 00:06:48,671 --> 00:06:51,791 Speaker 2: And culture to like, you know, they traded still with us. 136 00:06:52,591 --> 00:06:56,431 Speaker 2: You know, steal all the there's like heaps big history 137 00:06:56,471 --> 00:07:00,831 Speaker 2: of steel cloth, tobacco, you know, marriage as well. You 138 00:07:00,831 --> 00:07:03,191 Speaker 2: know they went over there and married up and had 139 00:07:03,231 --> 00:07:07,391 Speaker 2: family and were buried there and biggest story there. 140 00:07:07,471 --> 00:07:10,191 Speaker 1: But there was a actual what do you call it 141 00:07:10,231 --> 00:07:15,791 Speaker 1: when there's a reunion. There was something in the early 142 00:07:15,911 --> 00:07:22,471 Speaker 1: nineties where the Darwin government flew over Indonesian people, about 143 00:07:22,511 --> 00:07:25,351 Speaker 1: six of them who were descendants of Abersham people, to 144 00:07:25,711 --> 00:07:27,471 Speaker 1: honor that trade. 145 00:07:27,551 --> 00:07:30,031 Speaker 2: Yea, yeah, that relationship. Yeah, we still do it, Like 146 00:07:30,071 --> 00:07:33,831 Speaker 2: I went to Gama three two years ago now and 147 00:07:33,871 --> 00:07:36,791 Speaker 2: that Yeah, we had brother Abdi there. Abdi's an artist 148 00:07:36,831 --> 00:07:40,071 Speaker 2: and he came over and you know, did that ceremony 149 00:07:40,151 --> 00:07:42,071 Speaker 2: with the I think it was a good match mob 150 00:07:42,111 --> 00:07:44,551 Speaker 2: that he did it with. I can't remember, but you know, 151 00:07:44,631 --> 00:07:47,551 Speaker 2: that ceremony, so they you know, he did his dance 152 00:07:47,591 --> 00:07:50,551 Speaker 2: and then they had their reply and reenacted that meeting 153 00:07:50,551 --> 00:07:52,311 Speaker 2: on the beach that they'd usually have at the start 154 00:07:52,311 --> 00:07:52,871 Speaker 2: of a season. 155 00:07:53,391 --> 00:07:55,791 Speaker 1: Did we watch that plant? We were there that year, 156 00:07:56,711 --> 00:07:58,271 Speaker 1: so we've been a garment at the same time. 157 00:07:58,471 --> 00:08:00,871 Speaker 2: We've probably been walking down the street and have not 158 00:08:00,911 --> 00:08:01,711 Speaker 2: even seen each other. 159 00:08:01,991 --> 00:08:05,111 Speaker 1: Because Marrickville is like like the place to be. 160 00:08:05,351 --> 00:08:08,191 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm quiet person unless someone puts the camera in 161 00:08:08,231 --> 00:08:10,031 Speaker 2: front of my face and change. 162 00:08:09,791 --> 00:08:13,111 Speaker 1: And the next minute, So what are you doing now? 163 00:08:13,151 --> 00:08:16,791 Speaker 2: Like you're curating still, So I'm curated by trade. So 164 00:08:17,311 --> 00:08:19,631 Speaker 2: I finished high school and I was the first person 165 00:08:19,671 --> 00:08:23,431 Speaker 2: from my family to finish high school. Immediate family, real 166 00:08:23,551 --> 00:08:28,751 Speaker 2: geek like Choristar school captain type geek, proper geeks. 167 00:08:28,871 --> 00:08:31,831 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, high achiever. 168 00:08:32,551 --> 00:08:34,751 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know b's and you know, a couple 169 00:08:34,791 --> 00:08:37,351 Speaker 2: of a's and caesar, but not hugely high achiever in 170 00:08:37,391 --> 00:08:38,631 Speaker 2: comparison to the rest of the world. 171 00:08:38,711 --> 00:08:41,951 Speaker 1: But but what the still and in a leadership position? 172 00:08:42,351 --> 00:08:43,191 Speaker 1: Why are you at school? 173 00:08:43,391 --> 00:08:45,271 Speaker 2: I was in the you know, in the ring. I 174 00:08:45,351 --> 00:08:48,031 Speaker 2: want to go so yeah, and then yeah, my art 175 00:08:48,071 --> 00:08:51,911 Speaker 2: teacher was like, you should probably do an arts degree 176 00:08:51,951 --> 00:08:53,351 Speaker 2: because I was like, I don't know what I want 177 00:08:53,351 --> 00:08:56,311 Speaker 2: to do. I like sports or my brothers in art 178 00:08:56,351 --> 00:08:59,551 Speaker 2: do sports my art, but you know, you can't really 179 00:08:59,591 --> 00:09:02,071 Speaker 2: make money from art. Maybe I'll be a teacher. I've 180 00:09:02,111 --> 00:09:05,831 Speaker 2: got a scholarship to do a teaching did one term 181 00:09:05,871 --> 00:09:08,431 Speaker 2: of it and was like, I can't do this. If 182 00:09:08,471 --> 00:09:10,431 Speaker 2: this woman tells me that I have to do X 183 00:09:10,511 --> 00:09:12,431 Speaker 2: Y and z to teach a class. Like there's so 184 00:09:12,511 --> 00:09:14,591 Speaker 2: many different ways to teach something. It's just like you 185 00:09:14,631 --> 00:09:17,071 Speaker 2: can't do this, this and this, and I'm like I can. 186 00:09:17,191 --> 00:09:21,231 Speaker 1: I don't want to do that non completely different approach. 187 00:09:21,431 --> 00:09:23,511 Speaker 2: Yeah, so I worked to Adelaide High School for ages 188 00:09:23,551 --> 00:09:25,831 Speaker 2: when I was a kid or a kid eighteen nineteen, 189 00:09:25,871 --> 00:09:28,671 Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, and then yeah, it was like I'll 190 00:09:28,711 --> 00:09:31,751 Speaker 2: just try curating. Like it's this big, kind of scary 191 00:09:31,791 --> 00:09:34,711 Speaker 2: looking thing when you look at curators and what they do, 192 00:09:34,911 --> 00:09:37,071 Speaker 2: but Adelaide was a good place to do it. I 193 00:09:37,071 --> 00:09:39,591 Speaker 2: did Time and Do Festival, which was the inaugural festival 194 00:09:39,591 --> 00:09:43,791 Speaker 2: with Nikki Comeston there I was twenty four. That was 195 00:09:43,831 --> 00:09:46,031 Speaker 2: a huge amount of experience for me. You know, I 196 00:09:46,151 --> 00:09:48,631 Speaker 2: just roughed it like most art curators for the first 197 00:09:48,671 --> 00:09:51,831 Speaker 2: few years, you know, six different jobs and in one 198 00:09:51,871 --> 00:09:55,431 Speaker 2: calendar year and having to apply for grants and just 199 00:09:55,511 --> 00:09:57,511 Speaker 2: exhausted all the time. But nothing changes. 200 00:09:58,671 --> 00:10:01,351 Speaker 1: So there's no money as a curator, Like tell me. 201 00:10:01,751 --> 00:10:04,591 Speaker 2: It's like all arts practices, like there's no money until 202 00:10:04,591 --> 00:10:07,311 Speaker 2: you're the top like ten percent. And everyone wants to 203 00:10:07,351 --> 00:10:09,751 Speaker 2: wear something that you've made or been in a room 204 00:10:09,751 --> 00:10:10,551 Speaker 2: that you've curated. 205 00:10:10,671 --> 00:10:16,191 Speaker 1: I can. I didn't realize it. I know it's quite 206 00:10:16,351 --> 00:10:18,551 Speaker 1: I know the arts in Genue that a lot of 207 00:10:18,591 --> 00:10:21,031 Speaker 1: our mob in particular like Struggle. 208 00:10:21,391 --> 00:10:24,831 Speaker 2: I'm basically ADMIN last, so it's like yeah, same same, 209 00:10:24,871 --> 00:10:25,871 Speaker 2: different as admin. 210 00:10:26,071 --> 00:10:30,111 Speaker 1: Yeah. So you're here in Sydney you're curating. Yeah yeah, 211 00:10:30,311 --> 00:10:34,671 Speaker 1: what are you working on now? Anything that ye can hear? 212 00:10:34,751 --> 00:10:37,791 Speaker 2: There's so much we see. There's like the National Portrait 213 00:10:37,831 --> 00:10:40,271 Speaker 2: Gallery down in Canberra. I've just there's a show up 214 00:10:40,311 --> 00:10:42,351 Speaker 2: at the moment with Joan Ross and that's my first 215 00:10:42,351 --> 00:10:46,271 Speaker 2: show working with a non Indigenous person. Actually, she's Glaswegian 216 00:10:46,351 --> 00:10:48,991 Speaker 2: and really really fun. She's just a really good friend 217 00:10:48,991 --> 00:10:54,311 Speaker 2: of mine, and she confronts the colonial, colonial greed, the superiority, 218 00:10:54,511 --> 00:10:57,911 Speaker 2: superiority complexes that came on the shores with those big boats, 219 00:10:57,951 --> 00:11:00,911 Speaker 2: and how we've ended up where we are today because 220 00:11:00,911 --> 00:11:02,951 Speaker 2: of all of that. And she's really good fun. I 221 00:11:03,071 --> 00:11:06,471 Speaker 2: like working on with different people. And you know, we've 222 00:11:06,511 --> 00:11:09,791 Speaker 2: got that big Captain cook that's like worth several million 223 00:11:09,831 --> 00:11:11,871 Speaker 2: dollars hanging up next to one that she's made out 224 00:11:11,911 --> 00:11:12,791 Speaker 2: of krusty. 225 00:11:12,391 --> 00:11:15,311 Speaker 1: Carpet at the National Gallery. 226 00:11:15,711 --> 00:11:18,431 Speaker 2: National Portrait Gallery, National Portrait Gallery. 227 00:11:18,711 --> 00:11:21,671 Speaker 1: Is this where there was also a Gina Ryan Hark piece. 228 00:11:21,911 --> 00:11:24,311 Speaker 2: Oh no, that's across the road, but yeah. 229 00:11:24,271 --> 00:11:27,831 Speaker 1: From me, and she was demanding that they remove it. Yeah, 230 00:11:27,871 --> 00:11:28,911 Speaker 1: and they were like, but this is. 231 00:11:28,871 --> 00:11:31,791 Speaker 2: Our it is Yeah, you can't. Sorry, it did it. 232 00:11:31,911 --> 00:11:33,871 Speaker 1: It went all around the world, didn't it. And now 233 00:11:33,911 --> 00:11:35,991 Speaker 1: more people seen it. No one would have even known 234 00:11:36,071 --> 00:11:36,751 Speaker 1: that it was there. 235 00:11:36,951 --> 00:11:39,111 Speaker 2: Nah. And she didn't kick up stink and he does 236 00:11:39,151 --> 00:11:39,791 Speaker 2: portress like that. 237 00:11:39,791 --> 00:11:43,151 Speaker 1: That's what it gave the artist, this kind of global 238 00:11:43,351 --> 00:11:44,591 Speaker 1: spotlight and recognition. 239 00:11:44,751 --> 00:11:48,871 Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, Vincent's really lovely. He's quite shy sometimes, 240 00:11:48,911 --> 00:11:51,631 Speaker 2: but when he speaks he can be very you know, 241 00:11:51,831 --> 00:11:55,671 Speaker 2: his work's very serious as well. I've bumped into him 242 00:11:55,671 --> 00:11:56,271 Speaker 2: a fair bit. 243 00:11:56,111 --> 00:12:01,231 Speaker 1: Through his grandson. Yeah, great grandson, grandson, great grandson, great 244 00:12:01,311 --> 00:12:05,911 Speaker 1: grandson for Albert Namage. Oh yeah, wow, you've met him, 245 00:12:06,271 --> 00:12:09,591 Speaker 1: I've worked with talk about him. We do art tours. 246 00:12:10,071 --> 00:12:10,831 Speaker 1: We need to connect. 247 00:12:11,151 --> 00:12:13,911 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's been my career curators. That's what we do. 248 00:12:13,951 --> 00:12:16,471 Speaker 2: We do art tours and explain art and write lots 249 00:12:16,511 --> 00:12:19,911 Speaker 2: of stuff and do heaps of research. I basically make 250 00:12:19,951 --> 00:12:23,111 Speaker 2: a beautiful space for people to tell their stories and 251 00:12:23,151 --> 00:12:26,311 Speaker 2: try to be the translator between their world and the 252 00:12:26,351 --> 00:12:29,031 Speaker 2: rest of the world and the institutions all of it 253 00:12:29,071 --> 00:12:29,751 Speaker 2: at the same time. 254 00:12:29,831 --> 00:12:32,751 Speaker 1: Yeah, you got to know how to navigate all of that. 255 00:12:33,431 --> 00:12:36,391 Speaker 2: Yeah. So ten years working in institutions. Started at the 256 00:12:36,511 --> 00:12:38,911 Speaker 2: Art Gallery of South Australia, moved over to Art Gallery 257 00:12:38,951 --> 00:12:41,751 Speaker 2: of New South Wales and then Powerhouse. And I quit 258 00:12:41,791 --> 00:12:44,751 Speaker 2: working for institutions when the referendum happened and I just 259 00:12:44,831 --> 00:12:47,551 Speaker 2: didn't like the way that the world was, the politics 260 00:12:47,551 --> 00:12:50,031 Speaker 2: were treating our lives. 261 00:12:49,711 --> 00:12:53,191 Speaker 1: And you know, yet again just who was showing up 262 00:12:53,231 --> 00:12:53,591 Speaker 1: for us? 263 00:12:53,871 --> 00:12:55,831 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I was like, I can't keep working for 264 00:12:55,911 --> 00:13:00,151 Speaker 2: government if government doesn't work for me. And I've learned 265 00:13:00,151 --> 00:13:02,911 Speaker 2: the playbook. I know what you're about. I respect you, 266 00:13:02,991 --> 00:13:05,631 Speaker 2: but you can't have any more of my time. Sorry. 267 00:13:05,911 --> 00:13:08,471 Speaker 1: My mum said you what do you keep your friends 268 00:13:08,671 --> 00:13:13,511 Speaker 1: close but your enemy is closer. But she also said 269 00:13:13,791 --> 00:13:16,071 Speaker 1: to go and learn the white men's ways. 270 00:13:16,831 --> 00:13:18,631 Speaker 2: Well that's why I was there, and learn and. 271 00:13:18,591 --> 00:13:22,431 Speaker 1: Then come back and bring those skills or experiences back 272 00:13:22,431 --> 00:13:25,111 Speaker 1: to committees. So the Powerhouse is was it more independent? 273 00:13:27,351 --> 00:13:30,431 Speaker 2: Little brother of Gallery Evening South Wales? So back in 274 00:13:30,471 --> 00:13:31,951 Speaker 2: the day, all right, here we go. You want to 275 00:13:31,951 --> 00:13:36,711 Speaker 2: hear about histories? Now The first kind of ever gallery 276 00:13:36,791 --> 00:13:39,191 Speaker 2: or space that held objects in Sydney was in the 277 00:13:39,191 --> 00:13:42,271 Speaker 2: Botanic Gardens and Jonathan Jones made a really amazing work 278 00:13:42,311 --> 00:13:45,391 Speaker 2: for the Cawdor Public Art Projects bar Angle Jara and 279 00:13:45,431 --> 00:13:47,831 Speaker 2: it was about these this building and this building had 280 00:13:47,871 --> 00:13:51,111 Speaker 2: all of these artifacts from Polynesia and Melanesia. Huge building. 281 00:13:51,151 --> 00:13:52,831 Speaker 2: It was during the time when they first figured out 282 00:13:52,831 --> 00:13:58,231 Speaker 2: how to make electricity. It fire, biggest fire. Everything went 283 00:13:58,351 --> 00:14:02,151 Speaker 2: up only ash. That's it. It was that hot that 284 00:14:02,231 --> 00:14:05,191 Speaker 2: fire and all of these cultural artifacts died. And from 285 00:14:05,271 --> 00:14:09,111 Speaker 2: there they set up the Art Gallery Society, which became 286 00:14:09,111 --> 00:14:11,031 Speaker 2: the Art Gallery of New South Wales, which was the 287 00:14:11,031 --> 00:14:13,631 Speaker 2: whole heap of you know, people who were really keen 288 00:14:13,631 --> 00:14:15,391 Speaker 2: on the arts and wanted to collect art and wanted 289 00:14:15,391 --> 00:14:18,191 Speaker 2: Sydney to be a hub for art and be the 290 00:14:18,191 --> 00:14:22,111 Speaker 2: place to be in Australia for art. And then the 291 00:14:22,151 --> 00:14:24,951 Speaker 2: Powerhouse Museum was established as it's like brother and that's 292 00:14:24,951 --> 00:14:27,911 Speaker 2: more about the activity of doing, and you know they 293 00:14:27,991 --> 00:14:30,871 Speaker 2: look more at processes of things, so you know, one 294 00:14:30,871 --> 00:14:33,831 Speaker 2: of their first big projects was the Castle Hill site 295 00:14:33,871 --> 00:14:38,391 Speaker 2: of eucalyp plantations, and those eucalyp plantations they tested all 296 00:14:38,391 --> 00:14:41,271 Speaker 2: the different eucalypt types to see, Okay, which one's best 297 00:14:41,271 --> 00:14:43,551 Speaker 2: for oils, which one's best for tannins, which one's best 298 00:14:43,591 --> 00:14:46,711 Speaker 2: for making houses with all of that kind of scientific stuff, 299 00:14:46,831 --> 00:14:49,271 Speaker 2: And the Powerhouse holds that knowledge and then the art 300 00:14:49,311 --> 00:14:52,391 Speaker 2: gallery holds like, like I guess, a high art and 301 00:14:52,511 --> 00:14:55,591 Speaker 2: expression of art in that context. 302 00:14:55,711 --> 00:14:58,231 Speaker 1: Yeah, you see a lot of shows though at the Powerhouse, 303 00:14:58,471 --> 00:15:00,111 Speaker 1: like it's a creative space. 304 00:15:00,591 --> 00:15:03,351 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's about showing that process as well as the product, 305 00:15:03,711 --> 00:15:04,151 Speaker 2: which is why. 306 00:15:05,591 --> 00:15:09,551 Speaker 1: Yeah, because there's like the Prisbone Powerhouse, Sydney Powerhouse, and 307 00:15:09,631 --> 00:15:12,631 Speaker 1: they all kind of connected to the galleries. 308 00:15:13,551 --> 00:15:16,991 Speaker 2: No, not always. Those guys are just like they kind 309 00:15:16,991 --> 00:15:22,271 Speaker 2: of established via state or territory, and they're not always. 310 00:15:22,271 --> 00:15:25,391 Speaker 2: They're all independent from from themselves and kind of had 311 00:15:25,391 --> 00:15:28,231 Speaker 2: different ways of establishing. But a lot of the time 312 00:15:28,231 --> 00:15:33,231 Speaker 2: it was to create places for Australian art and to 313 00:15:33,311 --> 00:15:36,071 Speaker 2: be housed. And the importance of that obviously goes back 314 00:15:36,111 --> 00:15:39,511 Speaker 2: to the collecting and collecting institutions and why do we collect? 315 00:15:39,871 --> 00:15:43,031 Speaker 2: Who decided to collect things? It wasn't you know, within 316 00:15:43,071 --> 00:15:46,751 Speaker 2: indigenous culture, we most of our objects are ephemeral for 317 00:15:46,791 --> 00:15:49,711 Speaker 2: a reason. You know, they're meant to die after time, 318 00:15:50,551 --> 00:15:54,031 Speaker 2: whereas this kind of where did the collecting methodologies come from? 319 00:15:54,071 --> 00:15:59,951 Speaker 2: Their scientific methodologies of collecting, you know, and then now 320 00:15:59,991 --> 00:16:02,551 Speaker 2: we have these beautiful art galleries and museums. But the 321 00:16:03,271 --> 00:16:07,191 Speaker 2: hard of it is we first started to collect scientific things, 322 00:16:07,231 --> 00:16:11,911 Speaker 2: including people's bodies, yes, and cultural artifacting heads, and that 323 00:16:12,071 --> 00:16:14,151 Speaker 2: was a part of the colonial process. I own this 324 00:16:14,231 --> 00:16:16,791 Speaker 2: object now, and that's a part of my collection. This 325 00:16:16,991 --> 00:16:19,311 Speaker 2: thing that where you think you own it because you've 326 00:16:19,351 --> 00:16:22,351 Speaker 2: got a sample of it, and that idea of ownership, 327 00:16:22,391 --> 00:16:24,991 Speaker 2: and that's a psychological thing. You know, blackfellows might have 328 00:16:25,271 --> 00:16:27,711 Speaker 2: a piece of land, but I don't feel like you 329 00:16:27,791 --> 00:16:28,191 Speaker 2: own it. 330 00:16:28,191 --> 00:16:32,271 Speaker 1: It's like a paper. Yeah, you do, you own a property. 331 00:16:32,351 --> 00:16:35,231 Speaker 1: You own the piece of paper, not the actual land. 332 00:16:35,271 --> 00:16:37,711 Speaker 2: And what was colonization like it was you know, these 333 00:16:37,751 --> 00:16:40,271 Speaker 2: beautiful words written on a piece of paper that people 334 00:16:40,271 --> 00:16:43,671 Speaker 2: that spoken understood that language said all right, yeah, well 335 00:16:43,671 --> 00:16:45,991 Speaker 2: that makes sense to me, all right, it must be true. Yeah, 336 00:16:46,071 --> 00:16:49,031 Speaker 2: move on, let's not ask the person that's actually you know, 337 00:16:49,191 --> 00:16:53,031 Speaker 2: the person being subjected to this thought or idea. 338 00:16:53,111 --> 00:16:55,991 Speaker 1: And this is the beauty of art, right, that representation 339 00:16:56,711 --> 00:17:01,391 Speaker 1: still retelling, you know, keeping history alive and keeping people accountable, 340 00:17:01,391 --> 00:17:04,391 Speaker 1: and I think that's an issue. It isn't issue. I 341 00:17:04,431 --> 00:17:08,471 Speaker 1: don't think in this country where there's a massive denial 342 00:17:08,551 --> 00:17:10,471 Speaker 1: of our history, our shared history. 343 00:17:10,991 --> 00:17:12,071 Speaker 2: I think that's about. 344 00:17:13,831 --> 00:17:15,431 Speaker 1: That you must get so much. 345 00:17:15,991 --> 00:17:19,511 Speaker 2: It's an intellectual field, so it's seemed different like so 346 00:17:19,991 --> 00:17:22,031 Speaker 2: I think R and B is an intellectual field, but 347 00:17:22,111 --> 00:17:25,391 Speaker 2: it's not necessarily appreciated as such by you know, the 348 00:17:25,391 --> 00:17:29,271 Speaker 2: white canon of what is important to their lives and 349 00:17:29,311 --> 00:17:31,951 Speaker 2: knowledge and systems and blah blah blah. But art is 350 00:17:32,591 --> 00:17:35,951 Speaker 2: art is something that we can kind of meet them 351 00:17:36,111 --> 00:17:39,351 Speaker 2: intellectually on a level. And it's a really good football 352 00:17:39,391 --> 00:17:41,751 Speaker 2: field for us to get a few good tackles in 353 00:17:42,031 --> 00:17:44,591 Speaker 2: because we can re evidence what they've written in their 354 00:17:44,591 --> 00:17:47,191 Speaker 2: books and put in their museums and say, hey, hold 355 00:17:47,231 --> 00:17:50,111 Speaker 2: on a second, right here, you wrote that in your 356 00:17:50,151 --> 00:17:52,911 Speaker 2: own words, and I've just made an artwork about it. 357 00:17:52,911 --> 00:17:56,631 Speaker 2: It's not political, it's just the truth telling. So that's 358 00:17:56,631 --> 00:17:59,071 Speaker 2: what I love about art. It gives that opportunity to 359 00:17:59,511 --> 00:18:03,431 Speaker 2: have those those discussions and not being seen and angry 360 00:18:03,751 --> 00:18:08,151 Speaker 2: or violent or you know, protesting. Is it really protest 361 00:18:08,191 --> 00:18:12,471 Speaker 2: when you're protesting your own body or controversial, it's not 362 00:18:12,711 --> 00:18:14,711 Speaker 2: So that's why I went into the arts because and 363 00:18:14,831 --> 00:18:18,111 Speaker 2: Richard Bell has this really great quote he's amazing political artist. 364 00:18:18,311 --> 00:18:21,391 Speaker 2: My uncle get out, well then fuck you would know 365 00:18:21,471 --> 00:18:24,111 Speaker 2: that he's like all of his art. Why did he 366 00:18:24,151 --> 00:18:26,871 Speaker 2: become an artist because he wouldn't get arrested for saying 367 00:18:26,871 --> 00:18:29,311 Speaker 2: what he wanted to say? Yeah, like he would have 368 00:18:30,031 --> 00:18:33,591 Speaker 2: was he become He's like everyone loves him. He's like 369 00:18:34,231 --> 00:18:37,031 Speaker 2: Aboriginal arts uncle. He's not just your uncle. We think 370 00:18:37,071 --> 00:18:37,911 Speaker 2: he's all our uncle. 371 00:18:37,991 --> 00:18:41,271 Speaker 1: He's like, yeah, we love He's kind of led the way, 372 00:18:41,591 --> 00:18:43,711 Speaker 1: one of many people that have been part of a 373 00:18:44,231 --> 00:18:46,831 Speaker 1: So he's part of Proper Now collective and they're in 374 00:18:46,871 --> 00:18:49,471 Speaker 1: Brisbane and there's a whole of deadly people. 375 00:18:49,511 --> 00:18:51,911 Speaker 2: Marley's kind of like the Sydney version of the Sydney. 376 00:18:51,591 --> 00:18:55,751 Speaker 1: Version Proper Now that it's I don't know why though, 377 00:18:55,911 --> 00:18:58,231 Speaker 1: like still in twenty twenty four that people like uncle 378 00:18:58,311 --> 00:19:00,911 Speaker 1: Richard seen is Oh that's a bit provocative or that's 379 00:19:00,951 --> 00:19:06,071 Speaker 1: a bit radical. It's truth telling and that's the issue 380 00:19:06,071 --> 00:19:10,311 Speaker 1: in this country. People don't don't feel comfortable with some 381 00:19:10,391 --> 00:19:11,031 Speaker 1: of the truths. 382 00:19:11,271 --> 00:19:13,511 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I guess that's what happens when you're not 383 00:19:13,631 --> 00:19:18,271 Speaker 2: used to I don't know, looking at your own privilege 384 00:19:18,431 --> 00:19:22,311 Speaker 2: and understanding why that might make you feel uncomfortable, Because 385 00:19:22,351 --> 00:19:26,311 Speaker 2: if you're uncomfortable from what he says, then maybe it's 386 00:19:26,351 --> 00:19:29,511 Speaker 2: because you should be self work. 387 00:19:29,991 --> 00:19:39,191 Speaker 1: Yeah, animal soul searching, that might need to happen. 388 00:19:38,951 --> 00:19:41,191 Speaker 2: And it doesn't come from anywhere either. Like even his 389 00:19:41,271 --> 00:19:43,551 Speaker 2: bell serum is still popular today. You know, you know, 390 00:19:43,671 --> 00:19:45,911 Speaker 2: Aboriginal arts are white thing, is what it says, and 391 00:19:46,191 --> 00:19:47,951 Speaker 2: he's not wrong in a lot of senses. You know, 392 00:19:48,271 --> 00:19:51,791 Speaker 2: arnam Land Mob they change their barks from just being 393 00:19:51,831 --> 00:19:54,871 Speaker 2: wrapped to putting in pictures of the animals so that 394 00:19:54,911 --> 00:19:59,271 Speaker 2: Blunders could try and figure it out easier. So you know, 395 00:19:59,391 --> 00:20:02,791 Speaker 2: he altered, they altered those specific paintings to make it 396 00:20:02,831 --> 00:20:06,511 Speaker 2: easier for Blunder Mob, not for their own people. So 397 00:20:06,591 --> 00:20:09,071 Speaker 2: it was the white thing to do that and introduce 398 00:20:09,151 --> 00:20:12,111 Speaker 2: those things to try and make it easier for non 399 00:20:12,151 --> 00:20:16,471 Speaker 2: Indigenous people to understand us. Same with Uncle Vincent, then 400 00:20:17,271 --> 00:20:23,871 Speaker 2: Albert Namajera, his uncle, grandfather, gre great grandfather. He painted 401 00:20:23,871 --> 00:20:28,071 Speaker 2: watercolors in that vein so that it could be appreciated 402 00:20:28,231 --> 00:20:31,671 Speaker 2: for a like picturesque. He could paint dot paintings. He 403 00:20:31,791 --> 00:20:35,031 Speaker 2: chose not to for a reason because it's easier for 404 00:20:35,071 --> 00:20:37,871 Speaker 2: people to see, oh yeah, that's that range there, that 405 00:20:37,991 --> 00:20:40,791 Speaker 2: Mount Gillen Rangers if you're a blunder because you've seen 406 00:20:40,831 --> 00:20:42,831 Speaker 2: it with your eyes, than it is for you to 407 00:20:42,871 --> 00:20:47,591 Speaker 2: see it in their symbolic representations, which is dot paintings. 408 00:20:47,671 --> 00:20:52,791 Speaker 1: And that's when we talk about abational art. It's it's versatile. 409 00:20:52,911 --> 00:20:56,231 Speaker 1: People have adapted, it's evolved. It's not just traditionally not 410 00:20:56,431 --> 00:20:59,631 Speaker 1: painting anymore. So you see a lot of art these days, 411 00:20:59,911 --> 00:21:05,751 Speaker 1: like Honey, Judy Watson, it is work. Yeah, she's big 412 00:21:05,831 --> 00:21:09,351 Speaker 1: bronze sculptures. You've got Megan Cope over on you know, 413 00:21:09,511 --> 00:21:15,151 Speaker 1: Quenuba doing oysters and stuff. You've got weavers doing all 414 00:21:15,191 --> 00:21:19,431 Speaker 1: different art in the work that you're doing. Now, I 415 00:21:19,471 --> 00:21:23,791 Speaker 1: guess is there a massive art show happening, is it? 416 00:21:24,871 --> 00:21:27,151 Speaker 2: Yeah? Well on Saturday, we've got that same, same different 417 00:21:27,191 --> 00:21:31,311 Speaker 2: show at Black Blacktown Art Center, which is a bi 418 00:21:31,351 --> 00:21:34,711 Speaker 2: Anali Blacktown Bnali actually, and that's a it's not a 419 00:21:34,831 --> 00:21:38,031 Speaker 2: huge show, but it's a it's it's more of a 420 00:21:38,071 --> 00:21:40,591 Speaker 2: local community. It's a local community like art center. 421 00:21:41,551 --> 00:21:43,671 Speaker 1: Quite like there's a lot of people that are engaged 422 00:21:43,671 --> 00:21:44,871 Speaker 1: with it. In the community. 423 00:21:44,991 --> 00:21:47,591 Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, that's why I want to see them. Yeah. 424 00:21:47,671 --> 00:21:51,111 Speaker 2: So usually most of my work I've done either like 425 00:21:51,511 --> 00:21:54,071 Speaker 2: you know, training people in desert, you know, how to 426 00:21:54,111 --> 00:21:57,671 Speaker 2: hang a painting, or you know, I like being at 427 00:21:57,711 --> 00:22:01,111 Speaker 2: bush most of the time. I'm not a curator who 428 00:22:01,231 --> 00:22:03,991 Speaker 2: likes to be you know, over in New York referred 429 00:22:03,991 --> 00:22:07,871 Speaker 2: to be in your color, thank you. And so when 430 00:22:07,911 --> 00:22:09,951 Speaker 2: I work in institutions, a lot of my work is 431 00:22:09,951 --> 00:22:13,711 Speaker 2: focused in cities and in big buildings that are you know, 432 00:22:13,791 --> 00:22:16,551 Speaker 2: made out of beautiful marble that I'm scared I'll slip on. 433 00:22:17,991 --> 00:22:20,471 Speaker 2: And so it's nice to go into the communities. And 434 00:22:20,551 --> 00:22:23,191 Speaker 2: I've lived in Sydney for nearly eight years now and 435 00:22:23,471 --> 00:22:25,631 Speaker 2: I haven't had the opportunity to work with the local 436 00:22:25,831 --> 00:22:28,591 Speaker 2: arts center. I did a show out the Bearded Tit, 437 00:22:28,871 --> 00:22:33,951 Speaker 2: my favorite gay little pub courts, sucking the black tit 438 00:22:34,671 --> 00:22:38,991 Speaker 2: it It's called that's what it was called. Yeah about 439 00:22:39,031 --> 00:22:41,031 Speaker 2: how you know, people need to get off the black 440 00:22:41,071 --> 00:22:43,151 Speaker 2: tit and maybe you know, start trying to find their 441 00:22:43,191 --> 00:22:44,351 Speaker 2: own resources and shit. 442 00:22:46,071 --> 00:22:48,391 Speaker 1: So some of these shows, right, that's taking a piss, 443 00:22:48,471 --> 00:22:50,831 Speaker 1: but it's humor. 444 00:22:50,911 --> 00:22:53,511 Speaker 2: You need a bit of humor with all the trauma, 445 00:22:53,551 --> 00:22:55,191 Speaker 2: and that's kind of what I've been doing a lot 446 00:22:55,231 --> 00:22:57,351 Speaker 2: with my work, is focusing on joy, like I can. 447 00:22:57,951 --> 00:22:59,951 Speaker 2: You know, I've studied art for long enough to know 448 00:23:00,311 --> 00:23:02,751 Speaker 2: I can be real serious and give a two hour 449 00:23:02,791 --> 00:23:05,751 Speaker 2: presentation on the stey of an artist. But that doesn't 450 00:23:06,031 --> 00:23:08,511 Speaker 2: move me, and I don't think it moves many people anymore. 451 00:23:09,351 --> 00:23:11,311 Speaker 2: I think we need a little bit of humor and same, 452 00:23:11,351 --> 00:23:13,191 Speaker 2: same with different and different. You know. I was brought 453 00:23:13,231 --> 00:23:16,511 Speaker 2: on by Rachel Kang there, she's the director. She had 454 00:23:16,511 --> 00:23:18,471 Speaker 2: a bit of an idea about what she wanted to 455 00:23:18,751 --> 00:23:21,911 Speaker 2: focus on and look at ways that different people connect 456 00:23:21,951 --> 00:23:25,831 Speaker 2: and people connect with nature in different cultures. And I 457 00:23:25,871 --> 00:23:28,591 Speaker 2: was like, I was sitting in Darwin with my uncle Gary, 458 00:23:28,791 --> 00:23:32,711 Speaker 2: and I was like, it's all just same, same, different. 459 00:23:32,791 --> 00:23:35,551 Speaker 2: But I was like, okay, yeah, that's the title of 460 00:23:35,591 --> 00:23:37,791 Speaker 2: the show. Uncle. Then he's like well, I was like, Uncle, 461 00:23:37,791 --> 00:23:39,231 Speaker 2: what do you mean by that? And he's like, well, 462 00:23:39,271 --> 00:23:43,391 Speaker 2: you know black follows that were colonized here, we eat rice, 463 00:23:43,471 --> 00:23:47,231 Speaker 2: black follows on that side, they eat potatoes, same, same, different. 464 00:23:48,271 --> 00:23:51,071 Speaker 2: We all have these different ways of connecting with each other. 465 00:23:51,151 --> 00:23:53,271 Speaker 2: It's our ways of being doing annoying if you want 466 00:23:53,271 --> 00:23:57,151 Speaker 2: to get into like axiologies, you know, ontologies, the scientific 467 00:23:57,191 --> 00:24:02,311 Speaker 2: ways of looking at it and pistemologies jumping into that. 468 00:24:02,711 --> 00:24:05,351 Speaker 1: I reckon on colin jeez, that's cancer. 469 00:24:06,631 --> 00:24:10,031 Speaker 2: On colleges. These big words they are, they're big words, 470 00:24:10,071 --> 00:24:13,111 Speaker 2: but it's just it's just the same, same different Like. 471 00:24:13,271 --> 00:24:15,351 Speaker 1: I love that the fact you're saying, you know, I 472 00:24:15,391 --> 00:24:17,671 Speaker 1: can talk this talk, go and present on this for 473 00:24:17,711 --> 00:24:21,311 Speaker 1: two hours and give a Harley intellect your account of 474 00:24:21,511 --> 00:24:25,271 Speaker 1: somebody's life, or just go out bush and just be 475 00:24:25,431 --> 00:24:25,791 Speaker 1: with mob. 476 00:24:25,831 --> 00:24:28,951 Speaker 2: I'd just rather be with Mob. Yeah, it's that's the 477 00:24:28,991 --> 00:24:32,031 Speaker 2: where I get my joy from. And so same same 478 00:24:32,071 --> 00:24:33,991 Speaker 2: different kind of looks at that I want people to 479 00:24:34,031 --> 00:24:37,551 Speaker 2: talk about. You know, I was talking about the Siluesi 480 00:24:37,591 --> 00:24:42,111 Speaker 2: in our Indonesian we're very Asian in Darwin. You know. 481 00:24:42,431 --> 00:24:44,551 Speaker 2: The only reason I reckon that we're called like, you know, 482 00:24:44,591 --> 00:24:48,151 Speaker 2: Australia is because of the colony. We actually are very Asian. 483 00:24:48,351 --> 00:24:50,191 Speaker 1: We are in the Asian neighborhood. 484 00:24:50,311 --> 00:24:52,471 Speaker 2: Yeah, we're closer to them Mob over there than we 485 00:24:52,511 --> 00:24:54,391 Speaker 2: are to you know, people down in Tasmania. 486 00:24:54,511 --> 00:24:54,951 Speaker 1: Yeah. 487 00:24:54,991 --> 00:24:58,071 Speaker 2: So we have that Asian culture and people forget about it. 488 00:24:58,111 --> 00:25:00,471 Speaker 2: And I'm like, you know, all the way that people 489 00:25:00,711 --> 00:25:06,391 Speaker 2: migrate here and then start families, especially people of color, same, same, 490 00:25:06,471 --> 00:25:08,191 Speaker 2: different a lot of the time, you know, getting away 491 00:25:08,231 --> 00:25:11,151 Speaker 2: from war, getting away from poverty, trying to start a 492 00:25:11,151 --> 00:25:15,751 Speaker 2: better life, whatever it is. And they have similarities within that. Also, 493 00:25:15,871 --> 00:25:18,511 Speaker 2: the way that we we pray, the way that we 494 00:25:19,631 --> 00:25:23,591 Speaker 2: religiously do things, you know, religious religion is you know, 495 00:25:23,791 --> 00:25:26,631 Speaker 2: the repetitive movements of something, you know, with intention. And 496 00:25:27,631 --> 00:25:29,511 Speaker 2: you know the way that we cook food together, the 497 00:25:29,511 --> 00:25:33,191 Speaker 2: way we prepare food. There's similarities. Blood chung is. We 498 00:25:33,231 --> 00:25:36,831 Speaker 2: could talk about blood chung for three hours, and you know, 499 00:25:36,991 --> 00:25:40,071 Speaker 2: just as a food, and how many different families have 500 00:25:40,151 --> 00:25:43,991 Speaker 2: different ingredients that they Salty plums, Yeah, saldi plums. 501 00:25:44,151 --> 00:25:47,871 Speaker 1: Everyone eats soldy plums most people in Yeah. I love 502 00:25:47,951 --> 00:25:48,711 Speaker 1: soldy plums. 503 00:25:48,871 --> 00:25:49,591 Speaker 2: That was our lollies. 504 00:25:49,671 --> 00:25:52,791 Speaker 1: My husband's Fijian and he loves salty plums. 505 00:25:52,871 --> 00:25:53,671 Speaker 2: Yeah. 506 00:25:53,911 --> 00:25:59,631 Speaker 1: I was like, what the heck? Olia, the lemon with vinegar, 507 00:26:00,191 --> 00:26:02,631 Speaker 1: some salt, nah, but not salty plums. 508 00:26:02,631 --> 00:26:04,151 Speaker 2: No, SALTI plums are girl up on them. 509 00:26:04,311 --> 00:26:06,471 Speaker 1: Just had misstaple and your teeth for. 510 00:26:06,511 --> 00:26:10,071 Speaker 2: Red, teeth are red all the time, Yes, stains on 511 00:26:10,111 --> 00:26:13,311 Speaker 2: your hands for days. Taste Yeah, used to they were 512 00:26:13,311 --> 00:26:15,751 Speaker 2: our lollies, you know, we didn't have like you know, and. 513 00:26:15,671 --> 00:26:17,071 Speaker 1: When they come from they're an Asian. 514 00:26:17,671 --> 00:26:20,831 Speaker 2: Yeah, they're they're dried plums, dried plums. They're dried preserved 515 00:26:20,871 --> 00:26:22,911 Speaker 2: plums with heaps of salt on them so they're super 516 00:26:22,911 --> 00:26:26,031 Speaker 2: sour and put them in your mouth and mango dried mango. 517 00:26:26,831 --> 00:26:28,231 Speaker 1: Pray for salty plums, I know. 518 00:26:28,431 --> 00:26:30,311 Speaker 2: Yeah, I pray for Soldi plums. I've got salty plumbs. 519 00:26:30,351 --> 00:26:32,071 Speaker 2: They're just sitting in there when I miss home. 520 00:26:32,871 --> 00:26:36,711 Speaker 1: Yeah, here in Sydney, there is a community here and 521 00:26:36,751 --> 00:26:39,391 Speaker 1: you're mentioning like it's rewarding and you get joy from 522 00:26:39,431 --> 00:26:43,031 Speaker 1: being with MOB. Do you ever get to go back home. 523 00:26:43,031 --> 00:26:46,911 Speaker 2: All the time? Yeah? I do because I work in 524 00:26:46,951 --> 00:26:50,711 Speaker 2: the arts and well and Tea's kind of a hub 525 00:26:50,751 --> 00:26:52,911 Speaker 2: for you know, to scatter from there if you want 526 00:26:52,951 --> 00:26:55,831 Speaker 2: to go to art centers. So I go home a 527 00:26:55,831 --> 00:26:58,831 Speaker 2: lot because if I want to work with MOB, I 528 00:26:58,871 --> 00:27:00,511 Speaker 2: try to go out there and make sure that my 529 00:27:00,551 --> 00:27:03,351 Speaker 2: projects I'm going out there. I don't like being a 530 00:27:03,391 --> 00:27:05,991 Speaker 2: cute reader who just sits there and is like I 531 00:27:06,031 --> 00:27:09,111 Speaker 2: want five of those beautiful bags from that community by 532 00:27:09,191 --> 00:27:11,831 Speaker 2: this date. Thank you very much, like I need to 533 00:27:11,831 --> 00:27:12,431 Speaker 2: go there. 534 00:27:12,271 --> 00:27:17,471 Speaker 1: And relationships and is there advice then for our mom 535 00:27:18,111 --> 00:27:20,071 Speaker 1: who might want to work in this space. 536 00:27:21,551 --> 00:27:24,191 Speaker 2: What if there's so much work there? Honestly, there's so 537 00:27:24,271 --> 00:27:26,631 Speaker 2: much work. Come and join me. Honestly, I love it. 538 00:27:26,631 --> 00:27:29,431 Speaker 2: It's good fun. There's different ways that you can curate, Like, 539 00:27:29,511 --> 00:27:32,071 Speaker 2: I'm not a very serious curator. I like to have 540 00:27:32,111 --> 00:27:34,511 Speaker 2: fun with my work. I have a joke, you know. 541 00:27:34,551 --> 00:27:37,111 Speaker 2: I do some writing. I'm on stage sometimes you can 542 00:27:37,311 --> 00:27:39,111 Speaker 2: There's lots of different things you can do. I'm sitting 543 00:27:39,111 --> 00:27:41,311 Speaker 2: here talking to you. You know. I thought i'd be 544 00:27:41,351 --> 00:27:42,431 Speaker 2: a book bitch, but I'm. 545 00:27:42,351 --> 00:27:44,271 Speaker 1: Not self in plot your own boss. 546 00:27:44,351 --> 00:27:45,671 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm independent. 547 00:27:45,791 --> 00:27:46,271 Speaker 1: Independent. 548 00:27:46,631 --> 00:27:49,111 Speaker 2: I work part time for Agency Projects, which is just 549 00:27:49,231 --> 00:27:53,591 Speaker 2: me to move to advertise for its first CEO indeed CEO. 550 00:27:53,911 --> 00:27:56,351 Speaker 2: So please, if you know anyone who's deadly that wants 551 00:27:56,391 --> 00:27:58,231 Speaker 2: to come work with me and Leila and Mately and 552 00:27:58,271 --> 00:28:01,951 Speaker 2: the team we're looking for a deadly indigenous CEO. Really 553 00:28:02,391 --> 00:28:06,871 Speaker 2: are in Melbourne National Remit. I work part time for 554 00:28:06,911 --> 00:28:08,791 Speaker 2: them and then the rest of the time I do 555 00:28:08,831 --> 00:28:13,511 Speaker 2: things like this. Yeah, Bankstown working with Joan writing. I 556 00:28:13,511 --> 00:28:15,231 Speaker 2: did lots of writing. I love writing. 557 00:28:15,551 --> 00:28:17,471 Speaker 1: And what do you do with the writing I write. 558 00:28:17,271 --> 00:28:22,591 Speaker 2: About artists, Yeah, I write essays for artists, write diaristically 559 00:28:22,631 --> 00:28:26,231 Speaker 2: as well about people like you. Today you're like, I'm 560 00:28:26,271 --> 00:28:29,151 Speaker 2: not going to read your bio. You can introduce yourself. Yeah, 561 00:28:29,271 --> 00:28:33,071 Speaker 2: the credentials, that's a big part of like being advertising yourself. 562 00:28:33,111 --> 00:28:35,231 Speaker 2: I think as a person nowadays, I don't think it 563 00:28:35,231 --> 00:28:37,471 Speaker 2: comes well for black fellows at all. Yeah, I don't 564 00:28:37,511 --> 00:28:39,231 Speaker 2: do it. I've refuse to do it. You know, some 565 00:28:39,431 --> 00:28:41,111 Speaker 2: will sit there and to you and be like I 566 00:28:41,111 --> 00:28:43,071 Speaker 2: did this and I did that, and like you can 567 00:28:43,111 --> 00:28:44,951 Speaker 2: google me if you really want to, but maybe just 568 00:28:44,991 --> 00:28:46,511 Speaker 2: get to know me as a person and if you 569 00:28:46,631 --> 00:28:47,471 Speaker 2: like me, then work with me. 570 00:28:47,871 --> 00:28:49,471 Speaker 1: Well that's the thing, right, relationships. 571 00:28:49,551 --> 00:28:52,511 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I prefer those things. And you know, just 572 00:28:52,791 --> 00:28:55,711 Speaker 2: the kind of credentials freaks me out a little bit, 573 00:28:55,871 --> 00:28:57,231 Speaker 2: so I try to go away. 574 00:28:57,271 --> 00:29:00,511 Speaker 1: It's a kind of borderline where you're big noting it is. 575 00:29:00,551 --> 00:29:02,791 Speaker 1: I know, when you're growing up in community, you kind 576 00:29:02,831 --> 00:29:05,271 Speaker 1: of I don't know, there's something about our culture where 577 00:29:05,311 --> 00:29:06,911 Speaker 1: there's this kind of humbleness about it. 578 00:29:07,071 --> 00:29:09,031 Speaker 2: You can't pretend like you're better than the person that 579 00:29:09,071 --> 00:29:10,831 Speaker 2: sits next to you, even if they. 580 00:29:10,871 --> 00:29:12,951 Speaker 1: Otherwise people said, we're we're supposed to come from Yeah, 581 00:29:13,071 --> 00:29:15,751 Speaker 1: it's no, that's not how we work for you. 582 00:29:16,431 --> 00:29:18,991 Speaker 2: So it's like, yeah, a bit weird trying to do curating, 583 00:29:19,111 --> 00:29:21,951 Speaker 2: but the curating is good fun. You get really good opportunities, 584 00:29:21,951 --> 00:29:23,951 Speaker 2: Like I've traveled so much, I've gotten to see so 585 00:29:24,031 --> 00:29:27,391 Speaker 2: many different parts of the world, had so many amazing opportunities. 586 00:29:27,591 --> 00:29:31,391 Speaker 1: Favorite country Is there a favorite country? It has to 587 00:29:31,431 --> 00:29:34,751 Speaker 1: be outside of this beautiful place. 588 00:29:35,071 --> 00:29:37,431 Speaker 2: Honestly, I just got I get home. 589 00:29:37,471 --> 00:29:40,311 Speaker 1: Nowhere else in the world you could go. That was 590 00:29:40,471 --> 00:29:42,151 Speaker 1: like reminded me of home. 591 00:29:42,271 --> 00:29:45,511 Speaker 2: Na I liked Singapore because people looked like me, and 592 00:29:45,631 --> 00:29:48,671 Speaker 2: I like their food, like they have amazing food. I 593 00:29:48,671 --> 00:29:51,071 Speaker 2: could just live there and eat all day every day. Yeah, 594 00:29:51,111 --> 00:29:51,831 Speaker 2: that was good fun. 595 00:29:51,871 --> 00:29:53,951 Speaker 1: Well, my kids are looking for the next holiday. 596 00:29:54,271 --> 00:29:56,031 Speaker 2: Oh is that what we ask So they're asking. 597 00:29:56,151 --> 00:29:58,551 Speaker 1: One wants to go to Singapore, one wants to go 598 00:29:58,591 --> 00:30:00,951 Speaker 1: to Thailand, and the other one wants to go to Japan. 599 00:30:01,071 --> 00:30:03,511 Speaker 2: So I've been to Japan. Japan's good too. Yes, that's 600 00:30:03,631 --> 00:30:07,431 Speaker 2: real deadly. Yes, that's freak out though, like it's not 601 00:30:07,471 --> 00:30:10,071 Speaker 2: for like, you know, going into nature or anything. Yeah, 602 00:30:10,231 --> 00:30:11,671 Speaker 2: you want to go to all the big mulls and 603 00:30:11,671 --> 00:30:14,791 Speaker 2: stuff and eat all the food. Yeah, and then Singapore 604 00:30:14,831 --> 00:30:17,311 Speaker 2: a bit same, but they've got like it's freaky city 605 00:30:17,351 --> 00:30:20,311 Speaker 2: because it's real multicultural. It's kind of like you know 606 00:30:20,311 --> 00:30:22,351 Speaker 2: how Venice was like a you know, a port for 607 00:30:22,351 --> 00:30:23,991 Speaker 2: people to come in and out of. It's a bit 608 00:30:24,111 --> 00:30:26,791 Speaker 2: like that, and but heaps of Asian mob. So it's like, 609 00:30:26,831 --> 00:30:29,431 Speaker 2: I don't know, I've traveled overseas to plenty of places, 610 00:30:29,471 --> 00:30:35,111 Speaker 2: but I'm like racially ambiguous, like people can't pick me 611 00:30:35,231 --> 00:30:38,951 Speaker 2: like from and so it's like being around places where 612 00:30:38,991 --> 00:30:42,711 Speaker 2: I can blend in weirdly, like yeah, another rada. 613 00:30:42,871 --> 00:30:43,311 Speaker 1: Sometimes. 614 00:30:43,311 --> 00:30:44,911 Speaker 2: We went to Belgium with my wife a couple of 615 00:30:44,951 --> 00:30:46,871 Speaker 2: weeks ago, and I did not like it at all. 616 00:30:47,511 --> 00:30:50,791 Speaker 2: It was just different liken, Like I just didn't enjoy it. 617 00:30:50,871 --> 00:30:53,991 Speaker 2: I'm like, no birds, no trees, like no one had 618 00:30:54,031 --> 00:30:55,991 Speaker 2: dogs walking down the street. I don't know, just weird. 619 00:30:56,431 --> 00:30:59,751 Speaker 2: Just everything was brick and beer. It's slat, and I'm 620 00:30:59,791 --> 00:31:02,391 Speaker 2: like that's good, Like you've got beautiful the culture. 621 00:31:02,071 --> 00:31:04,871 Speaker 1: Here, that's part of that's the that's what they do. 622 00:31:04,871 --> 00:31:06,871 Speaker 2: I don't want a street market, not a pub, I 623 00:31:06,871 --> 00:31:09,951 Speaker 2: don't know, So yeah, that's what I like I guess preference, 624 00:31:09,991 --> 00:31:10,831 Speaker 2: personal preference. 625 00:31:11,111 --> 00:31:12,991 Speaker 1: I just I know that a lot of listeners are 626 00:31:12,991 --> 00:31:16,831 Speaker 1: going to be like blown away that you've makes people 627 00:31:16,951 --> 00:31:21,271 Speaker 1: just kind of don't think blackfellows can do what you do, 628 00:31:21,591 --> 00:31:24,991 Speaker 1: can do what I do, travel to twenty different countries, 629 00:31:25,471 --> 00:31:27,671 Speaker 1: you know, Like there's so limited. A lot of people 630 00:31:27,711 --> 00:31:31,271 Speaker 1: are very limited. They're thinking of what we can do 631 00:31:31,311 --> 00:31:34,071 Speaker 1: and achieve, and it's sounded one thing, but at the 632 00:31:34,111 --> 00:31:35,151 Speaker 1: same time doesn't bother me. 633 00:31:35,311 --> 00:31:37,831 Speaker 2: I'm just flukin as this, Like honestly, I've been fluking 634 00:31:37,871 --> 00:31:38,671 Speaker 2: it since day one. 635 00:31:39,151 --> 00:31:40,871 Speaker 1: I keep going that plan. 636 00:31:40,991 --> 00:31:42,631 Speaker 2: I just do what I love to do. I try 637 00:31:42,671 --> 00:31:46,751 Speaker 2: and challenge myself, and you know, if someone says that 638 00:31:46,791 --> 00:31:49,031 Speaker 2: I'm stupid, I try and prove them wrong, which is 639 00:31:49,551 --> 00:31:54,311 Speaker 2: probably why I ended up very successful academically, you know. 640 00:31:54,671 --> 00:31:57,631 Speaker 2: But now I'm in my thirties and I'm moving out 641 00:31:57,671 --> 00:32:00,551 Speaker 2: of that and I'm comfortable. You know, I've proven to 642 00:32:00,631 --> 00:32:02,831 Speaker 2: myself that I can get these really good jobs and 643 00:32:02,951 --> 00:32:04,911 Speaker 2: go and do all that is really deadly things. And 644 00:32:05,311 --> 00:32:07,391 Speaker 2: now I just want to work with mob again and 645 00:32:07,431 --> 00:32:10,751 Speaker 2: young people again and be like it's hard work, but 646 00:32:10,791 --> 00:32:14,191 Speaker 2: it's fulfilling work, and there's heaps of jobs out there 647 00:32:14,191 --> 00:32:15,991 Speaker 2: in the arts. It's a really good space for you 648 00:32:16,071 --> 00:32:20,271 Speaker 2: to work on yourself and your community as well, because 649 00:32:20,391 --> 00:32:22,831 Speaker 2: you have to. When you're working in arts, you're not 650 00:32:22,911 --> 00:32:25,951 Speaker 2: doing a skilled job for hire. You're talking about something 651 00:32:25,991 --> 00:32:29,111 Speaker 2: that belongs to you, your identity, and you belong to 652 00:32:29,111 --> 00:32:31,431 Speaker 2: that community as well. So it can also be really 653 00:32:31,431 --> 00:32:34,951 Speaker 2: fulfilling moralistically for yourself. 654 00:32:35,711 --> 00:32:39,191 Speaker 1: Getting people to reconnect if they're not connected to community. 655 00:32:39,271 --> 00:32:42,351 Speaker 1: That's probably a good way to wrap up the art 656 00:32:42,351 --> 00:32:44,151 Speaker 1: because a lot of our mob especially that come to 657 00:32:44,151 --> 00:32:46,431 Speaker 1: the big cities, a lot of them don't come with 658 00:32:46,591 --> 00:32:48,911 Speaker 1: much family or some thought and they've got to start 659 00:32:48,951 --> 00:32:51,831 Speaker 1: from scratch. So I hope that some of the people 660 00:32:51,831 --> 00:32:56,391 Speaker 1: that are listening are inspired about what you've been doing 661 00:32:56,631 --> 00:32:58,391 Speaker 1: and all the things you've achieved. And you're only in 662 00:32:58,391 --> 00:33:03,431 Speaker 1: your thirties. I'm like far but I don't get to 663 00:33:03,471 --> 00:33:06,311 Speaker 1: meet many people here that are in Sydney that are 664 00:33:06,311 --> 00:33:08,911 Speaker 1: doing the things that you've done. And I think listeners 665 00:33:08,951 --> 00:33:10,911 Speaker 1: are probably thinking, wow, where have you been? How do 666 00:33:10,951 --> 00:33:13,151 Speaker 1: we connect? So do you have a website? How do 667 00:33:13,231 --> 00:33:15,431 Speaker 1: people reach out to you on your socials? 668 00:33:15,511 --> 00:33:19,391 Speaker 2: Yeah, you can jump on my Instagram. It's which means 669 00:33:20,031 --> 00:33:24,271 Speaker 2: associ in Lalarakia language or old people, it means something else. 670 00:33:24,431 --> 00:33:26,831 Speaker 1: Yeah, how do you spell it? 671 00:33:26,951 --> 00:33:30,711 Speaker 2: B u d ju? Would you? Yeah? 672 00:33:31,071 --> 00:33:33,631 Speaker 1: You know you know what a budgigin is. 673 00:33:34,791 --> 00:33:36,711 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's all purpose. 674 00:33:37,991 --> 00:33:43,111 Speaker 1: When you went in Brisbane right when you're Bourdill your ship, 675 00:33:43,391 --> 00:33:45,871 Speaker 1: you gam it? So where people going, hey are you Budgell? 676 00:33:46,031 --> 00:33:48,231 Speaker 1: When I was like under the Murray School leaving Redford, 677 00:33:48,271 --> 00:33:50,311 Speaker 1: I'm like, am I bud? What do you mean? Am 678 00:33:50,311 --> 00:33:50,591 Speaker 1: I bud? 679 00:33:51,511 --> 00:33:53,071 Speaker 2: So there was this is going to make you laugh? 680 00:33:53,151 --> 00:33:57,791 Speaker 2: So means vagina in Larakia from old ways, yes, and 681 00:33:57,831 --> 00:34:01,591 Speaker 2: then it was appropriated by heaps of black queer mob 682 00:34:01,911 --> 00:34:04,591 Speaker 2: to mean sexy, So lots of like queer black men 683 00:34:04,631 --> 00:34:07,191 Speaker 2: are like are you look body? And it became really 684 00:34:07,231 --> 00:34:09,391 Speaker 2: popular and I was like, stuff you mob, I'm the 685 00:34:09,431 --> 00:34:14,111 Speaker 2: original Boudio. I'm a lesbian and I'm Larakia. So that's 686 00:34:14,151 --> 00:34:16,111 Speaker 2: my tag, that's your Instagram. 687 00:34:16,231 --> 00:34:20,311 Speaker 1: Yeah easy. Well we've got to connect and then hopefully 688 00:34:20,351 --> 00:34:21,751 Speaker 1: how long is the show? And banks don't going to 689 00:34:21,791 --> 00:34:22,271 Speaker 1: go for I. 690 00:34:22,231 --> 00:34:23,831 Speaker 2: Was going into next year and we've got biggest more 691 00:34:23,871 --> 00:34:26,151 Speaker 2: programs and stuff over summer, so have a look on 692 00:34:26,231 --> 00:34:29,511 Speaker 2: that website. We've got like Salvage doing DJing and he's 693 00:34:29,871 --> 00:34:31,991 Speaker 2: curating like a whole day's worth of events, which is 694 00:34:32,031 --> 00:34:34,311 Speaker 2: his first time doing it. So come and support him. 695 00:34:34,391 --> 00:34:36,991 Speaker 1: Yes, I think it's important to support community. So on 696 00:34:37,031 --> 00:34:38,951 Speaker 1: that note, thanks for coming all the way over the 697 00:34:38,991 --> 00:34:42,231 Speaker 1: other side of the harbor. Oh right the city to 698 00:34:42,311 --> 00:34:46,591 Speaker 1: have a yarn with me. It's if we don't get 699 00:34:46,591 --> 00:34:54,071 Speaker 1: many young deadly black women, and I've the queer conversation 700 00:34:54,191 --> 00:34:57,351 Speaker 1: for young black fellows that are navigating their identity. There 701 00:34:57,391 --> 00:34:59,911 Speaker 1: was one thing I want to ask you really quickly. Yeah, 702 00:34:59,991 --> 00:35:01,831 Speaker 1: I had Felicia. 703 00:35:01,431 --> 00:35:04,311 Speaker 2: Fox, Yes, Deadly Felicia, and. 704 00:35:04,471 --> 00:35:08,151 Speaker 1: That was one of the best performing that rated and 705 00:35:08,271 --> 00:35:10,271 Speaker 1: episodes and downloads. One of the best out of about 706 00:35:10,271 --> 00:35:14,311 Speaker 1: one hundred and thirty episodes was full and I thought, oh, 707 00:35:14,391 --> 00:35:18,671 Speaker 1: can I drop this yarm? I can't censor the arm 708 00:35:18,951 --> 00:35:24,031 Speaker 1: because I'm asking people to just be themselves and feel comfortable. 709 00:35:24,071 --> 00:35:26,711 Speaker 1: And next minute, I was thinking, how's the audience, my audien, 710 00:35:26,751 --> 00:35:30,391 Speaker 1: it's gonna respond. When I dropped that episode, I was worried. 711 00:35:30,991 --> 00:35:33,311 Speaker 1: And it was one of the best yarns in the 712 00:35:33,391 --> 00:35:35,911 Speaker 1: last four years. So I know that we've got a 713 00:35:35,911 --> 00:35:39,151 Speaker 1: lot of people that are probably big supporters of our 714 00:35:39,191 --> 00:35:42,631 Speaker 1: mob and also queer mob. Is there any advice? What 715 00:35:42,671 --> 00:35:45,191 Speaker 1: would you share with any of our young mob that 716 00:35:45,751 --> 00:35:47,271 Speaker 1: try to navigate their identity. 717 00:35:47,991 --> 00:35:50,511 Speaker 2: Go gently on yourself. I think like there's a lot 718 00:35:50,551 --> 00:35:54,951 Speaker 2: of expectation about you know, looks, and you know who 719 00:35:54,951 --> 00:35:56,591 Speaker 2: you should hang out with, what you should wear, what 720 00:35:56,591 --> 00:35:59,111 Speaker 2: you should listen to. And then my wife sits and 721 00:35:59,151 --> 00:36:03,111 Speaker 2: crochets every night, and I have an acqu escaping hobby, 722 00:36:03,871 --> 00:36:06,031 Speaker 2: but I do all this deadly stuff. I think it's 723 00:36:06,031 --> 00:36:09,431 Speaker 2: about really understanding yourself and allowing yourself to go through 724 00:36:09,471 --> 00:36:14,031 Speaker 2: those chapters of reinvention. You know, I'm not going to 725 00:36:14,111 --> 00:36:18,671 Speaker 2: go back to wearing tied shirts with the mohawk anytime soon, 726 00:36:18,711 --> 00:36:20,631 Speaker 2: but I needed to go through that. It's okay to 727 00:36:20,711 --> 00:36:24,271 Speaker 2: change and find the people that support you in that 728 00:36:24,431 --> 00:36:26,631 Speaker 2: change is the most important thing because a lot of 729 00:36:26,671 --> 00:36:28,911 Speaker 2: people are going to feel very uncomfortable that you're changing. 730 00:36:29,231 --> 00:36:32,271 Speaker 1: Yeah. I love that. Well, that's a deadly way to 731 00:36:32,271 --> 00:36:35,071 Speaker 1: wrap up the yarn. Thank you, Thank you so much 732 00:36:35,151 --> 00:36:37,551 Speaker 1: for coming and having a yarn. I'll see a garma 733 00:36:37,591 --> 00:36:41,311 Speaker 1: next year. Oh got we got on the garma. Yes, 734 00:36:42,511 --> 00:36:45,111 Speaker 1: look all you mob that have been listening. I hope 735 00:36:45,111 --> 00:36:47,831 Speaker 1: you've enjoyed this episode, Until next time, by for now. 736 00:36:48,871 --> 00:36:52,271 Speaker 1: If you'd like any more on today's guest, please visit 737 00:36:52,311 --> 00:36:57,151 Speaker 1: our show notes in the episode description. A big shout 738 00:36:57,191 --> 00:37:00,071 Speaker 1: out to all you Deadly Mob and allies who continue 739 00:37:00,111 --> 00:37:04,031 Speaker 1: to listen, watch, and support our podcast. Your feedback means 740 00:37:04,031 --> 00:37:06,991 Speaker 1: the world. You can rate and review the podcast on 741 00:37:07,031 --> 00:37:10,071 Speaker 1: Apple and Spotify, or even head to our socials and 742 00:37:10,191 --> 00:37:12,871 Speaker 1: YouTube channel and drop us a line. We'd love to 743 00:37:12,911 --> 00:37:16,551 Speaker 1: hear from you. The Black Magic Woman podcast is produced 744 00:37:16,591 --> 00:37:17,631 Speaker 1: by Clint Curtis