1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:05,000 Speaker 1: Would you like to improve the quality of your thinking, Well, 2 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:08,240 Speaker 1: then you need to improve the quality of your writing. 3 00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:12,799 Speaker 1: If you need proof, look no further than Francis Fry, 4 00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:16,800 Speaker 1: an author, ted speaker, and professor at Harvard Business School. 5 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:22,000 Speaker 1: Clearly she's an excellent thinker, but it doesn't happen by accident. 6 00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 1: Francis believes writing is the key to unlocking and improving 7 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: our thinking, and she takes it seriously. She writes draft 8 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:35,720 Speaker 1: after draft after draft, continuously shedding flabby thinking until her 9 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:40,360 Speaker 1: presentations are lean, meaned, thought machines. And she didn't get 10 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: here alone. All those drafts, and especially the ones written 11 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:49,520 Speaker 1: well after Francis thinks she's done, are mandated by her 12 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 1: wife and fellow leadership expert, Anne Morris. Francis credits much 13 00:00:55,560 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 1: of her success to Anne's attention to detail and dogged persistence, 14 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:02,520 Speaker 1: not just as a co writer, but as an in 15 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:07,200 Speaker 1: house mentor. So, what is the most valuable piece of 16 00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:15,559 Speaker 1: advice Francis has received from her wife, Anne? My name 17 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: is doctor amanthe Imber. I'm an organizational psychologist and the 18 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 1: founder of behavioral science consultancy Inventium, and this is how 19 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 1: I work A show about how to help you do 20 00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:30,080 Speaker 1: your best work. On today's My Favorite Tip episode, we 21 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:31,920 Speaker 1: go back to an interview from the past and I 22 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 1: pick out my favorite tip from the interview. In today's show, 23 00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:39,199 Speaker 1: I speak with Francis and Anne, and I asked Francis 24 00:01:39,480 --> 00:01:43,680 Speaker 1: what the best career advice she has ever received would be. 25 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:46,959 Speaker 2: Well, by far, the best career advice I receive is 26 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 2: from Anne, so I may if I ever have disproportionate success, 27 00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:54,840 Speaker 2: I get twenty four to seven of this, so it's 28 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 2: so fair. But I'll tell you some of the things. 29 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 2: I mean. Anne helped me understand the window mirror metaphor, 30 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 2: and that to be other distracted. I had intuition about it, 31 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 2: but she really helped me understand that you met me 32 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 2: at the trust. Well, Anne and I worked on that talk. 33 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:16,919 Speaker 2: I happened to be the one that delivered it. So 34 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 2: I would work overnight and she would work in the morning, 35 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 2: and then I would work overnight. And what I learned 36 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,080 Speaker 2: is that the purpose of a first draft is to 37 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:29,799 Speaker 2: be embarrassed by it by the second draft. I did 38 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 2: not know that, and I mean, and then I thought 39 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:35,040 Speaker 2: the first draft, okay, well, the second draft, let's poor 40 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 2: liquid svent on that and then she would do another, 41 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:43,240 Speaker 2: and another and another, and it just blew my mind 42 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:46,920 Speaker 2: on that part. So it's the looking out the window 43 00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:51,959 Speaker 2: of others, and that writing is a really wonderful form 44 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 2: of thinking. And I just always thought I was a 45 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 2: bad writer, so I didn't participate in it very much. 46 00:02:57,720 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 2: And it has just unleashed my ability to think and 47 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:05,320 Speaker 2: improved my ability to communicate, even though I still communicate 48 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:08,600 Speaker 2: with shapes more than words. I hear it like in 49 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:10,600 Speaker 2: that Ted talk, I had to draw shapes on the 50 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:14,520 Speaker 2: on the blackboard. But I think those two things really 51 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:21,400 Speaker 2: the mirror and the and the revision of ideas, and 52 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:24,120 Speaker 2: that that's and that writing is a great form of thinking. 53 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 2: I love that. 54 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:29,799 Speaker 3: How about you, Ann I'm gonna I'm going to answer 55 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 3: this as a category advice of advice with the headline 56 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 3: of don't believe everything you think, and I'll add a 57 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 3: little texture to that, which so I'm an authenticity wobbler, 58 00:03:44,560 --> 00:03:49,520 Speaker 3: an empathy anchor authenticity wobbler in our lexicon. When I 59 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 3: was starting companies in a previous career, I spent a 60 00:03:57,040 --> 00:04:01,400 Speaker 3: lot of time raising money from venture capitalists, a task 61 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 3: at which I was terrible in the beginning and back 62 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 3: to our conversation about trust. You know, it is one 63 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 3: of those conversations that is all about I mean, particularly 64 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 3: when you're raising money for a company that does not 65 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 3: yet exist. You are asking people to jump off a 66 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 3: cliff with you, and so if they don't trust you 67 00:04:23,279 --> 00:04:27,559 Speaker 3: even a little bit, there's no way they're taking that leap. 68 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 3: And so in the beginning, I would, you know, get 69 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:34,159 Speaker 3: up at the front of the room. And I was 70 00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 3: very distracted by the idea that I was a woman, 71 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:41,040 Speaker 3: and I was young, and I had never done this before, 72 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:43,800 Speaker 3: and I was queer, and I was in some rooms 73 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 3: where no woman had been in except to like take 74 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:50,680 Speaker 3: a lunch order or deliver a man like I was 75 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:55,680 Speaker 3: so distracted by the surroundings, and as I tried to 76 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 3: figure out what was going wrong, I kept misdiagnosing and 77 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 3: kept you know, confidence and swagger, and I just became 78 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 3: more There was more and more preteenpse pretending to be 79 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 3: the person in the front of the room that they 80 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:11,039 Speaker 3: wanted to see, which people can figure out very quick. 81 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:15,039 Speaker 3: The human animal can smell that one from all well anyway, 82 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 3: So I figured out it was authenticity. One of the 83 00:05:19,080 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 3: frameworks that was very helpful to me was the wonderful 84 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 3: Byron Katie's for essential questions, and the idea is to 85 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:32,800 Speaker 3: identify the thought so that you know the thought in 86 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:35,359 Speaker 3: that room might be this is a room that doesn't 87 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:39,360 Speaker 3: value me. So the first question on the list of 88 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:43,359 Speaker 3: essential question is is it true? And your answers, of 89 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:49,520 Speaker 3: course it's true. The second question is is it really true? 90 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 3: She's as zooming your answer the first one is the 91 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:58,720 Speaker 3: wrong and in fact, it's never totally true. And then 92 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 3: the questions get really fun, which is they're like, well, 93 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:04,880 Speaker 3: could the opposite be true? Could it be that you 94 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 3: don't value the other, you don't value the people in 95 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:10,400 Speaker 3: the room, or you are undervaluing your It's not that 96 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 3: they're undervaluing you, it's that you're undervaluing you. And let's 97 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 3: take a look at the data. Your name seems to 98 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 3: be on the lit like you seem to be invited 99 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 3: to stand up at the front of the room and 100 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:28,680 Speaker 3: take everyone's time. Somehow you've concluded that your voice is 101 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 3: not being valued, and yet you are the only one speaking. 102 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:37,360 Speaker 3: Everyone is taking notes on what you're saying, right, So 103 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 3: it's really fun. And then the last question is really 104 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 3: the moment of liberation. And I think this idea of 105 00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:44,960 Speaker 3: freedom is what is most motivating to me in this work. 106 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 3: Can I help get people in touch with a sense 107 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 3: of freedom that they have not been able to give 108 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:54,520 Speaker 3: themselves up to this point? But the moment of liberation is, well, 109 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 3: who would you be if you weren't dragging the story around? 110 00:06:57,880 --> 00:06:59,520 Speaker 3: And do you have the power to let it go? 111 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 3: And what's on the other side of letting that story go? 112 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 3: And it doesn't mean that there's no data to support 113 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:07,599 Speaker 3: your original story, and it doesn't mean that there's not 114 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:11,000 Speaker 3: someone in the room that's thinking, well, I really prefer 115 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:15,520 Speaker 3: a dude, maybe, but that's not helpful to me, and 116 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 3: that's not what everybody's thinking. And that guy may be 117 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:22,360 Speaker 3: easily persuaded once I actually say something useful as opposed 118 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:25,840 Speaker 3: to getting stuck in my own head and that like, 119 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:30,080 Speaker 3: those are the sandboxes that are really fun for me. 120 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 3: And that's part of the experimentation. Is if I'm not 121 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:35,600 Speaker 3: willing to do that work in my own life, then 122 00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 3: I cannot be helpful in facilitating that kind of work 123 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 3: for anybody else. 124 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 1: If you would like to listen to the rest of 125 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:45,200 Speaker 1: my chat with Anne and Francis You can check out 126 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 1: the link to the full episode in the show notes. 127 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:51,120 Speaker 1: If you're looking for more tips to improve the way 128 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: that you work, I write a short fortnightly newsletter that 129 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 1: contains three cool things that I've discovered that helped me 130 00:07:57,680 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 1: work better, ranging from soft and gadgets that I'm loving 131 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 1: through to interesting research findings. You can sign up for 132 00:08:04,920 --> 00:08:08,520 Speaker 1: that at Howiwork dot co. That's how I work dot co. 133 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 1: How I Work is produced by Inventium with production support 134 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 1: from Dead Set Studios, and thank you to mat Nimba 135 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: who does the audio mix for every episode and makes 136 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:21,920 Speaker 1: everything sound so much better than it would have otherwise. 137 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: See you next time.