Speaker 1: Welcome back to TV Reload. My name is Benjamin Norris,
Speaker 1: and on this podcast, I'll be going behind the scenes
Speaker 1: with the biggest players in television. I want to quickly
Speaker 1: thank all the TV enthusiasts who have come back weekly
Speaker 1: to check out the podcast. I'm really getting spoiled for
Speaker 1: choice right across the streaming platforms and freeedoware networks. There's
Speaker 1: so many shows to explore, and I want to thank
Speaker 1: everyone for their weekly suggestions. I appreciate it, and hopefully
Speaker 1: I'll get a chance to talk about every show that's
Speaker 1: ever been made. I also like to suggest other people's
Speaker 1: podcasts as a way to kick off my own. I
Speaker 1: listen to so many different podcasts during the week, and
Speaker 1: I love them all too much. Tully is working overdrive
Speaker 1: at the moment with Tully smythe dissecting the latest series
Speaker 1: of Big Brother and chatting with all the evicted housemates.
Speaker 1: I think she's doing a great job, and it's a
Speaker 1: great opportunity for new and old people to check out
Speaker 1: the world through Tully's eyes like only Tully can tell it.
Speaker 1: This week, I've watched a lot of shows, and while
Speaker 1: I'm still hooked on celebrity Apprentice and so many other
Speaker 1: staple freeowear programs. I've fallen in love with the original
Speaker 1: series Eden, which has debuted on STAN this weekend. It's
Speaker 1: another show produced by STAN and Everycloud Productions, and it
Speaker 1: will be the feature interview on today's episode. We will
Speaker 1: get into Eden and what the whole show's about. But
Speaker 1: as a teams it is a bit of a who
Speaker 1: Done It with a modern twist, and I don't want
Speaker 1: to give too much more away than that. I'm really
Speaker 1: excited for you to check out the series, and I
Speaker 1: hope all of you can let me know what you
Speaker 1: think around the episode four part, because I think you'll
Speaker 1: be on the edge of your seat and you're going
Speaker 1: to need someone to talk to. Today's guest is Vanessa Gazig's
Speaker 1: series creator, executive producer and writer of the new series Eden.
Speaker 1: Vanessa might have started with some humble beginnings in Canberra,
Speaker 1: but dreaming of writing and storytelling has led her to
Speaker 1: the frontline as one of Australia's brightest and smartest players
Speaker 1: in television, with a journalistic mind at times and a
Speaker 1: thirst for the human condition. We get to discuss women
Speaker 1: in the industry and her upcoming work but we also
Speaker 1: will dissect the new series Eden. I'm so inspired by Vanessa,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure you will be too. She's bright and
Speaker 1: pathetic and is bringing you original content that will expand
Speaker 1: the way in which you watch television and cinema. So
Speaker 1: let's get into the chat. I'd like to welcome you
Speaker 1: and Vanessa Gazi to the podcast.
Speaker 2: I was writing little stories from a very young age
Speaker 2: because I think I was inspired by the books that
Speaker 2: I was reading.
Speaker 3: Every single thing in life is about love.
Speaker 2: Which basically this film world and the TV world have merged.
Speaker 3: Every place and everyone has their secrets.
Speaker 4: I feel like Eden has a very natural home. Instance.
Speaker 2: Eden is finally here and you can watch every single
Speaker 2: episode now only on step. We have amazing actors here,
Speaker 2: and we have amazing directors and writers.
Speaker 4: Do you people think you can do anything you want
Speaker 4: with me?
Speaker 3: Your relationship isn't open, It's fucked.
Speaker 4: I'm always very interested in chance and sliding doors.
Speaker 1: Moment mate, how are you good day?
Speaker 2: How are you? Do you know?
Speaker 1: What's really funny is that my partner hates it. Is
Speaker 1: that I've basically said the whole way through the podcast,
Speaker 1: whether it's a guy or a girl, I say get
Speaker 1: a Mate. It's interesting because some people are like, oh
Speaker 1: I love that, Like it's a good way to signature
Speaker 1: yourself as being Australian on this podcast because people listen
Speaker 1: to it internationally. Our partners like, you can't say mate
Speaker 1: to women.
Speaker 4: No, I like it.
Speaker 2: I actually like being called mate, and I also like
Speaker 2: gooda but I always forget about it. So when people
Speaker 2: stay it to me, I'm like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: good day.
Speaker 1: Scripto drama for me is actually my favorite television programming.
Speaker 1: And I wanted to ask you how did you get started?
Speaker 1: Like what got you hooked?
Speaker 4: Oh well, it's actually quite a good story.
Speaker 2: There was a Screen Australia I think I was back
Speaker 2: in twenty seventeen, maybe twenty sixteen. Twenty seventeen, Queen Australia
Speaker 2: ran that initiative called Gender Matters, which wanted to address
Speaker 2: the imbalance in the industry between male voices and female
Speaker 2: voices and to try and get more women into the
Speaker 2: industry in roles like writing and directing and you know,
Speaker 2: just get those voices heard.
Speaker 5: Screen Australia launch Gender Matters, an ambitious five point plan
Speaker 5: to sure that their production funding is targeted to creative
Speaker 5: teams that are at least fifty to fifty, so I was.
Speaker 4: Sort of part of that.
Speaker 2: There was this initiative called Smart for a Girl, which
Speaker 2: was run by Image and Banks and alis Bell with
Speaker 2: Endemol Shine, and my project was selected for that show
Speaker 2: called ID, which is pretty far along now in the process.
Speaker 2: So this was kind of the amazing origin story of that.
Speaker 2: From there, they put a professional writer's room around that
Speaker 2: I got the experience of working in that environment, and
Speaker 2: then I got some funding to actually write the pilot,
Speaker 2: which was it just felt like a million dollars back then.
Speaker 4: It was like someone's going to pay me to write.
Speaker 2: That's incredible, And then got pitched to Netflix and went
Speaker 2: into development with Netflix. So it was just kind of
Speaker 2: this fairy tale run with that show. And it was
Speaker 2: actually also the pilot that I'd written for that show
Speaker 2: that got me the job on Eden because the producers
Speaker 2: read part of that pilot and decided.
Speaker 4: They wanted to work with me. So that it was
Speaker 4: a really.
Speaker 2: Nice way in We're very lucky in this country to
Speaker 2: have the kind of support that we get from Screen Australia.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, you know, I want to go back to some
Speaker 1: of the origin stories as well, because along the way
Speaker 1: you credited your mum for your passionate storytelling. Is you
Speaker 1: know she read to you from a really early age,
Speaker 1: with authors such as Enid Blyton. How important do you
Speaker 1: think it is to read to children and you know,
Speaker 1: how do you think that helps stimulate the creative brain.
Speaker 2: I think it's fundamental, and I think it's It might
Speaker 2: sound really old fashioned to me, and it maybe shows
Speaker 2: that I'm actually.
Speaker 4: Not that young anymore.
Speaker 2: But you know, I credit reading with how I evolved
Speaker 2: as a writer, because I think from a very young
Speaker 2: age I was reading, I was devouring books, and you
Speaker 2: just say, that's the time when your brain's actually good.
Speaker 2: Like now, I can't retain information. I forget everything. I
Speaker 2: cannot learn really in any way the same way as
Speaker 2: I used to be able to learn. But back then
Speaker 2: you're this amazing sponge and that's when it all kind
Speaker 2: of goes in. And so I really think that's where
Speaker 2: it developed from. And I used to read a lot,
Speaker 2: and then I used to write stories in primary school
Speaker 2: about things that you know, a little kid cares about,
Speaker 2: like a girl with her or you know, a girl
Speaker 2: whose parents have an accident. I mean, that is pretty
Speaker 2: hardcore actually, But you know, I was writing little stories
Speaker 2: from a very young age because I think I was
Speaker 2: inspired by the books that I was reading. But I
Speaker 2: think the same can apply to watching great TV and film.
Speaker 2: But I do think there's something special about the way
Speaker 2: you learn through reading, in the way stories go. In
Speaker 2: that way, I think you have to do a little
Speaker 2: bit more work in your imagination when you're reading books.
Speaker 2: I think obviously, when you watch, it's kind of already
Speaker 2: visualized for you, whereas when you're reading, you have your
Speaker 2: imagination builds the rest of the piece. It's like you
Speaker 2: read the author's words and then something beautiful happens in
Speaker 2: your brain, which is that their words come together with
Speaker 2: your imagination.
Speaker 4: And it means that every single person's version of like
Speaker 4: that book, I guess, is actually different if you think
Speaker 4: about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I always think that as well. You know, we
Speaker 1: always have our own interpretations of everything. I remember reading
Speaker 1: a book The Beach while I was in Bali once
Speaker 1: and I had such a really different take on that
Speaker 1: book to a friend of mine who just read it
Speaker 1: every night after work. And so it's such a personalized experience,
Speaker 1: but it's such a formulative approach to getting people to
Speaker 1: use their own imagination, which I think is really important.
Speaker 1: Can you remember the first story that you wrote that
Speaker 1: kind of set you apart from the other kids, that
Speaker 1: made you realize that you had a bit of a
Speaker 1: superpower with writing.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Actually, one of my old friends from primary school
Speaker 2: wrote to me just the other day because she'd seen
Speaker 2: all the Eden posters around and she was like, I
Speaker 2: was just talking to our other friend from school like
Speaker 2: high school days, and I hadn't.
Speaker 4: Spoken to his friend in like a very long time.
Speaker 2: But she kind of popped up and was like, we
Speaker 2: were remembering the story that you wrote in your age,
Speaker 2: the novel that you wrote in near eighte.
Speaker 4: So we all had this fantasy.
Speaker 2: We all hated to get out of Canberra and moved
Speaker 2: to Sydney, and we all had this kind of collective
Speaker 2: fantasy that they were all going to just live in Sydney.
Speaker 2: I wanted to live in a sharehouse with my best
Speaker 2: friends and we'd all have you know, partners, and it
Speaker 2: would be like fun and sexy, and so I.
Speaker 4: Wrote I wrote the story about that, and.
Speaker 2: I put us all in as characters and made up
Speaker 2: fictional boyfriends for us, and every you know, I'd write
Speaker 2: a chapter overnight and then to my friends and ang
Speaker 2: read the chapter at school and yeah.
Speaker 1: How did it turn out? Is everyone now living any
Speaker 1: kind of similarities to this parallel universe that you created
Speaker 1: in your eight Yeah?
Speaker 4: Weirdly, I was a writer.
Speaker 2: Yep, I was a writer, and I lived in Sydney
Speaker 2: and I still I'm a writer that lived in Sydney.
Speaker 2: And my friend Bethany was living in la We all
Speaker 2: ended up sort of doing versions of this as well.
Speaker 2: It kind of became a bit of a thing where
Speaker 2: we'd all write our own little novels about our futures.
Speaker 4: I don't know if that's really weird, but.
Speaker 1: That no, I think it's good. It's like a vision
Speaker 1: board for children, you know. Look, I think that's important
Speaker 1: to be able to do that, and I think it's
Speaker 1: hilarious that now, as an adult, we can reflect back
Speaker 1: on that with you today and ask you, you know,
Speaker 1: what's the similarities there? Because there are some great similarities
Speaker 1: that you have achieved something amazing. I'm sure if we
Speaker 1: would go back and talk to yourself in your eight
Speaker 1: and say what it is that you're doing today? You know,
Speaker 1: you have a show launching on stand like it's just
Speaker 1: it's quite impressive.
Speaker 2: Heh, that is amazing, And I don't think I could have.
Speaker 2: I don't think my vision of myself was anyway that ambitious. Actually,
Speaker 2: I think it was just like all I want to
Speaker 2: do was like live in a terrorist house. I don't
Speaker 2: even think I knew what a screenwriter really did or
Speaker 2: was back then, and it wasn't something I really kind
Speaker 2: of thought about until much later.
Speaker 1: Well, you know, when it comes to your work and
Speaker 1: when you think about your writing and conceptualizing the story,
Speaker 1: you know, is there a signature theme that you feel
Speaker 1: you bring, like, is there something that you think that's
Speaker 1: my niche?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I like to deal in the kind of this
Speaker 2: probably sounds slightly generic, but I'm really interested in kind
Speaker 2: of facades and the interior life versus the external presentation
Speaker 2: of self, and kind of the dissonance that happens, you know.
Speaker 4: If those two things are at odds.
Speaker 2: And I guess kind of the psychology about and the
Speaker 2: psychology of lying and secrets. And I think across all
Speaker 2: of my a lot of the work I'm doing, that's
Speaker 2: a big theme.
Speaker 4: I think identity is a big theme.
Speaker 2: I think like sexual power dynamics and female sexuality and
Speaker 2: sexuality in general are definitely themes that keep coming through
Speaker 2: in my work.
Speaker 4: And yeah, also I'm.
Speaker 2: Always very interested in chance and sliding doors moments and
Speaker 2: things like that.
Speaker 1: I always say to people, flawed people, And I like
Speaker 1: flawed people, you know, especially in my reading and my
Speaker 1: watching of television and cinema and theater and all of
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. You know, the more flawed the
Speaker 1: characters are, the more they lift to me. And it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, they just seem more interesting.
Speaker 2: Oh, completely, And I think I mean, to me, it's
Speaker 2: just everyone's flawed.
Speaker 4: There is no such thing as a perfect person.
Speaker 2: So every character you write, I mean, if you're writing
Speaker 2: them without flaws, then they're not real people. I think
Speaker 2: you're totally right, and I think I agree. That's the
Speaker 2: most exciting access point, and I think we're seeing that
Speaker 2: more and more in modern television. It's not about these
Speaker 2: perfect heroes. It's about sort of these flawed, damaged people
Speaker 2: that aren't necessarily even don't even necessarily.
Speaker 4: Behave that well. They're complex, just like all humans are.
Speaker 1: It's a great segue into talking about Eden, which is
Speaker 1: as an original series and launching on stand this weekend.
Speaker 1: So I hope people get a chance to check it out.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: It is a bit of a mystery set in a
Speaker 1: coastal town, which you know could be seen as something
Speaker 1: of a similar idea, but with this series there's this
Speaker 1: unbelievable character study which lands and it digs deeper the
Speaker 1: further you know, you go into the series. I felt, like,
Speaker 1: you know, episode one, it felt like a wider, more
Speaker 1: elusive story and more questions were kind of asked than
Speaker 1: really answered. But then by the time you get to
Speaker 1: episode four, it had me thinking about mayor of East
Speaker 1: Town and it had me so hooked that and it's
Speaker 1: so happy about the idea that I realized as Australians,
Speaker 1: we can do this, and that we can tell just
Speaker 1: as good as stories as anyone anyone in the world.
Speaker 1: For you, how do you explain Eden?
Speaker 2: Well, you know, I think fundamentally, Eden's a story of
Speaker 2: a portrait of a town and it's I guess, you know,
Speaker 2: going along with that theme of facades.
Speaker 4: I think Eden the town can be seen as one.
Speaker 2: Big, beautiful, glossy, gorgeous facade over this town, you know,
Speaker 2: and underneath this surface there's you know, there are human
Speaker 2: beings with all the normal human voibles and some very
Speaker 2: abnormal ones as well. I think, well, not many, but
Speaker 2: but some some push the limits a little bit.
Speaker 3: Do you trust me? Let me take you somewhere. Well,
Speaker 3: we don't have to pretend to be anything but us,
Speaker 3: but every place and everyone has their secrets.
Speaker 6: Okay, So it goes these two young kids packed all
Speaker 6: their worldly positions into a car, drove it into the lake,
Speaker 6: and then vanished and said.
Speaker 5: It, why are you all buying into this?
Speaker 4: Things are wrong, everything's wrong.
Speaker 2: I think the show does in many ways. It's a mystery,
Speaker 2: and it plays out a mystery person goes missing. But
Speaker 2: I really hope it's kind of a very new approach
Speaker 2: to that form. So it's like a fresh and bold
Speaker 2: take on that familiar form. So I hope that within
Speaker 2: that there's this really nice kind of feeling of both
Speaker 2: strangeness and familiarity when.
Speaker 4: You watch it.
Speaker 2: And I do just hope that people do really connect
Speaker 2: to the characters and their complexity and sort of keep
Speaker 2: watching to see how these stories interweave and overlap. Because
Speaker 2: episode one, yes it's elusive at us, sort of questions
Speaker 2: so much about what happens in that episode starts to
Speaker 2: kind of take on such a deeper meaning as the
Speaker 2: stories unfold throughout the series.
Speaker 1: I like to consider it as screen printing, like it's
Speaker 1: such an unusual format, you know, Whilst I did say before,
Speaker 1: you know, some similar themes or some similar storytelling might
Speaker 1: appear at the first episode, but you know, as that
Speaker 1: screen print happens and you layer it, you know, you
Speaker 1: put the color over the top of it, and the
Speaker 1: picture starts to come together more. You know, it's a
Speaker 1: real reward for the viewer to go and commit to
Speaker 1: the series and then just keep getting those layers because
Speaker 1: as they appear. Is that a good way to describe it.
Speaker 4: No, I love that way of describing it.
Speaker 2: I think that that is completely I couldn't have said
Speaker 2: it better myself. Yeah, so the layers become it. It
Speaker 2: just becomes richer and richer the more you watch, I think,
Speaker 2: And that was always the idea, and I think it's
Speaker 2: it was a bit of a risk telling the story
Speaker 2: this way, because it's a slightly unusual and bold approach
Speaker 2: to time and to structure. But I do think it
Speaker 2: has paid off, and I think it's exciting work for
Speaker 2: the audience to piece these elements together and get to
Speaker 2: know these characters over time and do a little bit
Speaker 2: of detective work themselves and just join the dots and
Speaker 2: do a little bit of their own sort of mental
Speaker 2: gymnastics to access the secrets of the story too.
Speaker 1: I think there's some real authentic and courageous work being
Speaker 1: done here.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 1: I always found what's interesting is sex, drugs and misbehavior.
Speaker 1: You know, we say that we're we try to present
Speaker 1: ourselves as being these amazing people, you know, on sex
Speaker 1: and drugs, and you know, it's always sort of been
Speaker 1: a bit taboo. Why do you think it's taken so
Speaker 1: long to tell the truth about those parts of our lives,
Speaker 1: which you've explored so well in this series.
Speaker 4: I just think, you know, it's people are scared. You know.
Speaker 2: I think we're in a really interesting and good moment
Speaker 2: in history because I think a lot of boundaries are
Speaker 2: being pushed and a lot of those you know, a
Speaker 2: lot of people who were afraid to express who they
Speaker 2: really were, and now I think feeling much more able
Speaker 2: to just come out and say this is who I am,
Speaker 2: and I'm not.
Speaker 4: Ashamed of that.
Speaker 2: And look, I have a community and I have you know,
Speaker 2: and I think the internet, much as Internet has done damage,
Speaker 2: I think the Internet's also done incredible things in terms
Speaker 2: of people finding communities, people finding the courage to express
Speaker 2: who they are, and I think it's formed this collective
Speaker 2: feeling that, yeah, we can push.
Speaker 4: Further and we don't have to be so you know,
Speaker 4: victorian about everything.
Speaker 2: I think that was previous generations, but I don't think
Speaker 2: the younger ones of us that are coming through, and like,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm gen hy and you know, the younger
Speaker 2: ones was the millennials are even more this way. I
Speaker 2: think they're even more because even I look back in
Speaker 2: high school and there was a lot of shame still
Speaker 2: and a lot of like I went to a Catholic school, guilt,
Speaker 2: all of that. But I think even this new generation.
Speaker 2: My brother's young, his twelve, he is younger than me,
Speaker 2: one of my brothers, and I can just see the
Speaker 2: changes even you know, in high schools, and yeah, it's
Speaker 2: really refreshing, and it's such an exciting time to be
Speaker 2: telling stories because you know, nobody tells you not to
Speaker 2: be bold, and nobody tells you you're too much, or
Speaker 2: at least in this case, that didn't.
Speaker 4: Happen for me.
Speaker 2: And I'm really really grateful, and in fact, I was
Speaker 2: encouraged to be bold, and that was my mandate.
Speaker 4: That's what I was. That was my brief, like, be bold,
Speaker 4: go for.
Speaker 1: It, be bold. Yeah, I think that that really works.
Speaker 1: I mean I think sometimes we've thought that, you know,
Speaker 1: you don't want to glorify drug use, or you know,
Speaker 1: you don't want to glorify some of the darker themes
Speaker 1: that we have in our lives. But what I thought
Speaker 1: with Eden was that there is a lot of drug use,
Speaker 1: there is a lot of sex and sexuality and new
Speaker 1: topics that we just haven't seen in Australian storytelling, and
Speaker 1: it isn't glorifying it, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like it's in that fear of being glorifying that kind
Speaker 1: of stuff I think has been misplaced, because if you
Speaker 1: can tell stories authentically, then you're not glorifying.
Speaker 2: It, absolutely, And I just think it's about part of
Speaker 2: the sort of wider thing they're talking.
Speaker 4: About about just being honest.
Speaker 2: This is what's going on, and sometimes it's you know,
Speaker 2: sometimes it's fun, but sometimes it's really damaging. And in
Speaker 2: Eden there is drug use and both those things apply
Speaker 2: and ultimately gets it's not a moralizing show. I mean,
Speaker 2: that was kind of something fundamental about it. I didn't
Speaker 2: want to moralize. I just wanted to show people as
Speaker 2: they are and hopefully present empathetic characters sometimes doing things
Speaker 2: that you might not agree with, but who hopefully you
Speaker 2: can still see their humanity and hopefully their humanity reflects
Speaker 2: humanity as a whole. And I think that's what all
Speaker 2: art should really be. Creatives and artists are trying to
Speaker 2: mirror society to itself, and that's what artists have always
Speaker 2: done throughout history, and I think that's kind of our
Speaker 2: responsibility as artists. Well it's like something that we do
Speaker 2: without even thinking about it, but that's kind of the
Speaker 2: purpose of our And so yeah, I think for me,
Speaker 2: it's just let's show the truth, but let's show the
Speaker 2: truth in a very heightened reality where things are bigger.
Speaker 2: And you know, Eden is not a grounded it's not realism,
Speaker 2: it's hyperrealism. So even though I think the characters are
Speaker 2: really realistic and that they're real, authentic people, they're operating
Speaker 2: in a heightened space and in a kind of heightened state,
Speaker 2: which was another one of the sort of main things
Speaker 2: that we discussed about what we wanted Eden to be
Speaker 2: and how we were going to make it feel different
Speaker 2: and bold and fresh.
Speaker 1: Well, there's just so much to be proud of, you
Speaker 1: know in this show. I wanted to ask you about
Speaker 1: the casting process when you were sort of writing and
Speaker 1: conceptualizing and working with the team of writers. Did you
Speaker 1: have people in mind when you're writing some of these people?
Speaker 1: You know, were you sitting there going, oh, Samuel Johnson,
Speaker 1: this is his role or did that come down to
Speaker 1: the casting process later on?
Speaker 2: You know, you've always got I think when you start out,
Speaker 2: you've always got you've got your own interpretation of these people,
Speaker 2: that there's.
Speaker 4: Made up people in your head.
Speaker 2: And then you start this incredible one of the best
Speaker 2: parts of the whole thing. You start actually pairing those
Speaker 2: characters you kind of summoned out of thin air, and
Speaker 2: can you realize that you know, they're made for certain
Speaker 2: people and somehow, you know Sam Johnson like who else
Speaker 2: could possibly be cats?
Speaker 4: Like he just is And he even said.
Speaker 6: That my name is Samuel Johnson, and I am privileged
Speaker 6: enough to be playing Detective Ezra Katz in Eden. I
Speaker 6: would say that Kats is the heart and soul of
Speaker 6: the show. He's deeply human. Most of the other characters
Speaker 6: have got a lot going on in terms of shadiness.
Speaker 6: Whereas I'm a true author, I don't trust us down.
Speaker 6: I think he's a bad comp crazy. Well, I know
Speaker 6: bad comps.
Speaker 2: It's why I'm friendless beautiful Ezra Katz. He is truly
Speaker 2: someone who understands what it means to be a good person,
Speaker 2: and he really tries to stand up for what's right.
Speaker 6: Katz's moral compass is both a good and a bad thing.
Speaker 6: If he gets lost in that area, chances are will
Speaker 6: end up drowning and a pull it here, So yes,
Speaker 6: just stay strong.
Speaker 2: He was like, I feel like I was want to
Speaker 2: play this role, and it feels like across the.
Speaker 4: Board that really applies.
Speaker 2: And I think the cast all felt very that there
Speaker 2: were big points of connection between them and kind of
Speaker 2: very joyful being finding that cast.
Speaker 4: And it's exactly what I imagine really in.
Speaker 1: So many ways, these actors really do magnify and take
Speaker 1: these characters in such really intricate places. And the thing
Speaker 1: that I was really shocked with, and I had to
Speaker 1: get out my IMDb and go back and have a
Speaker 1: look at some of the notes that I'd already started,
Speaker 1: was I didn't know that Cody Fern was an Australian.
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, I'd only seen him in his
Speaker 1: American work with Ryan Murphy in an American horror story,
Speaker 1: and then I realized he was Australian. Was he really
Speaker 1: a good get for this series?
Speaker 2: Yeah? And you know what, that was an inspired casting choice.
Speaker 2: I think he was on all the original casting lists,
Speaker 2: and as soon as I saw him there, I was like,
Speaker 2: that version of Andy Dolan is special. That's like that,
Speaker 2: that's just going to take that character to the next level.
Speaker 4: If it's the Cody.
Speaker 2: Fern version, then I'm super excited. And you know, we
Speaker 2: kind of getting that character was a big thing for us.
Speaker 2: We knew that Andy Dolon character had to be somebody.
Speaker 3: I'm Cody Fern and I'm playing Andy Dolan. The thing
Speaker 3: about Andy is that he's a very broken individual who's
Speaker 3: experienced some significant trauma in his life, particularly in his
Speaker 3: recent career downgrade, shall we say, in Hollywood.
Speaker 7: He's in the middle of downward spiral into complete self oblivion,
Speaker 7: and he's returned to Eden to recuperate and to figure
Speaker 7: out where he's at in life and to get his
Speaker 7: bearings back. His journey is really one of figuring out
Speaker 7: who he is what he means, if he has any
Speaker 7: purpose in the world and if he can continue on
Speaker 7: in life.
Speaker 2: You know, Cody came all the way back from la
Speaker 2: to do this, and he hasn't done an Australian show,
Speaker 2: Like he doesn't really work. He works there, and he
Speaker 2: came back to do this show because he really connected
Speaker 2: with the scripts and the character and with John Carr
Speaker 2: and the director, and he put everything into it and
Speaker 2: I think he had a great time and it was
Speaker 2: really nice for him to come home. I really love
Speaker 2: Cody and Cody's version of Andy.
Speaker 1: You know, I have been reading so much about you,
Speaker 1: and You've got so much going for you. There's so
Speaker 1: much happening for you as well. I hear that you're
Speaker 1: writing a feature film at the moment. What is it
Speaker 1: that you're working on at the moment? What's coming up?
Speaker 2: That show that I spoke about it originally that came
Speaker 2: through the Gender Matters initiative, that has kind of gone
Speaker 2: through a long development process with Netflix, So we're kind
Speaker 2: of getting to the end of that, which is pretty exciting.
Speaker 2: So it could be some exciting things happening soon and
Speaker 2: I could be having a little trip to America.
Speaker 4: Pretty soon.
Speaker 2: And meanwhile, I've about to submit a new draft of
Speaker 2: my feature film, which is loosely based on my short
Speaker 2: film Highway, and that is with Goalposts and Automatic, which
Speaker 2: is a US production company, and that's really exciting. That's
Speaker 2: that's a sort of genre piece that's close to my
Speaker 2: heart and it's been percolating away and you know, while
Speaker 2: these other two sort of things have been going on
Speaker 2: in the past couple of years, and so it's just
Speaker 2: been really nice to work on a feature actually because it's.
Speaker 4: Such a it's a different process.
Speaker 1: And it's a different based I mean, it's.
Speaker 2: Also hard because it's just you, whereas obviously, you know,
Speaker 2: writing TV series is it's such a team effort, and
Speaker 2: it's nice having both. I think, you know, TV's great
Speaker 2: and features are obviously, Like I think I entered the
Speaker 2: film industry film and TV industry in the first place
Speaker 2: because I wanted to make.
Speaker 4: Films, like write and direct films.
Speaker 2: But you know, then TV kind of I sort of
Speaker 2: came into that world and I feel like there's no
Speaker 2: looking back. Really, it's like an amazing job and I'm
Speaker 2: just hoping to kind of keep on learning about how
Speaker 2: to show run and how to become more and more
Speaker 2: efficient at the job and just a better and better writer.
Speaker 4: And it's an exciting period.
Speaker 2: It feels like after many many years of slogging away
Speaker 2: as you do, and you're entering this industry, so many
Speaker 2: years of unpaid work and just like being so poor
Speaker 2: and relying on grunts and.
Speaker 4: Having to go on the dole and all of that stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's kind of right time, right place for
Speaker 1: you in a certain way because you know, all that
Speaker 1: time of you know, going to Afters and getting all
Speaker 1: of this, you know, sort of musculating your work and
Speaker 1: getting all of that experience has led you to a
Speaker 1: place where film and television are almost on the same platform.
Speaker 1: You know, they were so different for so long, you know,
Speaker 1: film was considered to be the more prestigious brand. But
Speaker 1: now you know, with like we mentioned before, Mayor of Eastown,
Speaker 1: but even the undoing and even Game of Thrones, you know,
Speaker 1: we've just really seen that storytelling on television is just
Speaker 1: as powerful, more sought after, and probably more seen these
Speaker 1: days than cinema.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I you know, to give my someone came
Speaker 2: into Afters and visited and sort of they did like
Speaker 2: a talk to us at the end of our year,
Speaker 2: our master's year, and they said, you know, you guys
Speaker 2: would be very silly not to be looking at TV.
Speaker 2: And this was twenty fourteen. That was kind of just
Speaker 2: just at that.
Speaker 4: Point where I think TV.
Speaker 2: I mean, obviously it ever happened before with HBO and
Speaker 2: everything like, it was on the way to happening, but
Speaker 2: it wasn't happening to this extent. And they were really right,
Speaker 2: and I think that was where it was. But I
Speaker 2: think with someone maybe from Screen Australia or maybe it
Speaker 2: was an agent, but yeah, that was good advice. I
Speaker 2: actually during that year, that's where I came up with
Speaker 2: the concept for the one that's with Netflix now, and
Speaker 2: it was just a one page sort of thing and
Speaker 2: quite vague, and it's just interesting how things build, and yeah, no,
Speaker 2: it's a TV is an exciting place to be and
Speaker 2: it is, as you're saying, so cinematic these days, and
Speaker 2: you know, the actors a caliber of class you can
Speaker 2: now attract, and the caliber of cinematographers. It's basically this.
Speaker 4: Film world and the TV world have merged.
Speaker 2: So you've got top crew and top cast doing both.
Speaker 2: And I think that's wonderful for everyone that just makes
Speaker 2: the quality better and it means more work for everyone,
Speaker 2: and it's good, it's great.
Speaker 1: How do you think we've changed with Australian storytelling since
Speaker 1: we've expanded to having streaming services? You know? And do
Speaker 1: you think that people are moving away from free toow
Speaker 1: are television to get onto streaming services because of the
Speaker 1: idea of getting more eyes on it and maybe being
Speaker 1: more global.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think so. I think I've really experienced this
Speaker 4: with Eden. I feel like Eden has a very natural
Speaker 4: home with STAN because of the nature of what STAN does.
Speaker 2: You know, start a happy for you to be bold,
Speaker 2: and it's just a different set of rules, I think. So,
Speaker 2: you know, I think free to AIRTV there's certain rules
Speaker 2: and there's certain ways you kind of certain expectations of
Speaker 2: something that goes to you know, free to air TV,
Speaker 2: and I think that maybe is what has kept a
Speaker 2: lot of TV a little bit samey seey, not just
Speaker 2: in it.
Speaker 4: It hasn't been incredible like we.
Speaker 2: Do so we do drama so well, and we have
Speaker 2: amazing actors here, and we have amazing directors and writers.
Speaker 4: But you know, I think now.
Speaker 2: We're all able to kind of go, oh, there's there's
Speaker 2: new possibilities because we don't have to subscribe to that
Speaker 2: structure anymore. We don't have to kind of write for
Speaker 2: ad breaks and all of that stuff, which I actually
Speaker 2: never even did. You know, I don't even know how
Speaker 2: to do that. But that's kind of how everyone was
Speaker 2: changed before to write for TV and that's just now
Speaker 2: and you know, people still have to do it, but
Speaker 2: it's just kind of nice to you also don't necessarily
Speaker 2: have to know how to do it and can kind
Speaker 2: of throw a form out the window a little bit
Speaker 2: and try something new and you've got an amazing home
Speaker 2: like Stan, you know, which is very nurturing.
Speaker 1: Why last question that I always ask all my guests
Speaker 1: before they go is what is an amazing story from
Speaker 1: behind the scenes that we as an audience would appreciate
Speaker 1: that we might not necessarily know.
Speaker 2: You know. Initially there were some like really interesting additions
Speaker 2: to the show from the director John Carr and from
Speaker 2: the lead director, like crazy costumes that we'd see appearing
Speaker 2: in preproduction and we're like, what is going on? Like
Speaker 2: what is with those bodysuit things? Like I have no
Speaker 2: idea why people like you know, cast are like wandering
Speaker 2: around trying on these like full body like resuits and
Speaker 2: really garish colors, and we were kind of like, what
Speaker 2: is it? And it was kind of like, don't ask,
Speaker 2: don't as don't ask, don't worry about it, just like
Speaker 2: you know, leave the director to do his work. And
Speaker 2: you know, those were part of John's vision to heighten
Speaker 2: the tone and the aesthetic. I mean I always wanted
Speaker 2: it heightened, but you know, obviously a director comes in,
Speaker 2: it's like I know how to heighten is and I
Speaker 2: think he did a great job with those elements. But
Speaker 2: at the time, I think we were.
Speaker 4: All like what is that? Like, how does that? How's
Speaker 4: that going to work?
Speaker 2: And then you watch it and it all kind of
Speaker 2: makes sense in the in the landscape of a strange
Speaker 2: sound called Eden, where people are a little you know,
Speaker 2: people are a little different and they wear what they
Speaker 2: want and yeah, anything can happen.
Speaker 1: Well, I just want to say thank you so much
Speaker 1: for your work on this show. I really hope people
Speaker 1: get a chance to watch it. I hope people do
Speaker 1: like what I was saying and continue to see the
Speaker 1: layers as they get layered. And I look forward to
Speaker 1: your feature film coming out and more of your work
Speaker 1: and just keep pushing those boundaries. So thank you so
Speaker 1: much for being here today and sharing your story.
Speaker 4: Thank you so.
Speaker 2: Much, Benjamin, it was lovely to talk to you, and
Speaker 2: thanks for all your insights as well.
Speaker 4: It's nice to hear someone talk about the show that's
Speaker 4: not me