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Speaker 1: Well, it's been an eventful time in Canberra lately, you'd

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Speaker 1: have to say, thanks to the implosion of the coalition

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Speaker 1: marriage between the Liberals and the Nationals. And joining me

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Speaker 1: on the line to give us some insights into the drama.

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Speaker 1: It's Nines Political Editor Charles Croucher. Good morning to you, Charles.

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Speaker 2: Hey, Katie, lovely to have.

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Speaker 1: You on the show.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: What's it been like being in the bubble down there?

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Speaker 1: I mean, it just sort of makes us all shake

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Speaker 1: our heads wondering what they're doing.

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Speaker 2: I think that's probably the thing that most strikes me

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Speaker 2: as well. There is so much that has happened in

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Speaker 2: the past sort of two months unfortunately, starting with Bondai

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Speaker 2: and then playing out to now where we have the

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Speaker 2: situation where there's possibly a rate rise next week. So

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Speaker 2: much there that is going to change and impact the

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Speaker 2: way Australians live. And the surprising part is it's instead

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Speaker 2: of being this test for the government, which it started

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Speaker 2: out as, it's now become a test for the coalition,

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Speaker 2: for the opposition, who are trying to do this balance

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Speaker 2: of keeping them themselves together and also decide who they

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Speaker 2: want to lead them into the future. I mean, the

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Speaker 2: simple maths in the Parliament dictate that there's not a

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Speaker 2: lot of power the Coalition could wield, and yet they

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Speaker 2: seem to be focusing the majority of that power in

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Speaker 2: on themselves. And we're now facing the prospect that next

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Speaker 2: week there could be two leadership challenges. Wonder David little

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Speaker 2: Growd Wonder Susan Lee again on a week where interest

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Speaker 2: rates might rise, which is devastating for Australians but can

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Speaker 2: also be brutal for a government.

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Speaker 1: You spot on and you know, just talking about themselves

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Speaker 1: rather than talking about issues that every day Australians care about.

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Speaker 2: And we've all lived through this drama right, certainly federally

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Speaker 2: the early part of the twenty tens. The territory went

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Speaker 2: through it in a real way during the c or

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Speaker 2: P government in particular, and then towards the back end

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Speaker 2: of the Labor government. It's and everyone knows what the

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Speaker 2: result is. Everyone knows this is focusing time on yourself.

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Speaker 2: I'm shocked that it's come this way. There was certainly,

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Speaker 2: you know, the Prime Minister is a strategical person. He's

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Speaker 2: fairly coming when it comes to the way parliament and

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Speaker 2: legislation runs. He laid some traps for the Coalition in

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Speaker 2: that post Bondo bill. But this wasn't the trap this

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Speaker 2: set of legislation. It was the handcuffing with the gun

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Speaker 2: laws that I think those in the government thought might

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Speaker 2: have caused some drama. And then beyond all that, it

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Speaker 2: was the opposition who were demanding that Parliament returned to

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Speaker 2: pass the laws that then ended up dividing them. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's a remarkable situation, it truly is.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that Susan Lee can survive?

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Speaker 2: I mean survived next week? Maybe, But there are just

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Speaker 2: too many traps that lay ahead for Susan Lee. She

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Speaker 2: is someone who has made her career overcoming the doubters

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Speaker 2: and proving people wrong. Start with that, But in the

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Speaker 2: next month and a half there's going to be a

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Speaker 2: whole heap of poles that seem to be getting worse

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Speaker 2: for the coalition. And the fact that we're talking about

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Speaker 2: the coalition talking about themselves means the polls will likely

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Speaker 2: get worse. When the polls get worse, particularly not just

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Speaker 2: to Labor but to one Nation. When there's a poll

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Speaker 2: out of South Australia yesterday that had the Liberal Party

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Speaker 2: running fourth behind Labor One Nation in the Greens, which

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Speaker 2: I find unthinkable in South Australia. So the polls, each

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Speaker 2: one of those is a threat to her leadership. The

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Speaker 2: party room will gather next week, that's a threat to

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Speaker 2: her leadership. She has to then appoint, it seems, new

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Speaker 2: shadow ministers, and there's a lot of talent sitting on

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Speaker 2: that back bench through either resignations like just since an

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Speaker 2: average of a price and Andrew Hasty, or through people

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Speaker 2: that were left out in the first place, and of

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Speaker 2: Jane Hume and Sarah Henderson. A lot of vocal capable

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Speaker 2: backbenches that will be expecting a promotion, and that's another

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Speaker 2: threat to her leadership. Then there's another out of Poles,

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Speaker 2: then there's the South Australia and look, each of those

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Speaker 2: is a hurdle that might prove the final one for

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Speaker 2: Susan Lee. She survived next week, maybe, but it just

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Speaker 2: it seems so hard to see the path from here

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Speaker 2: on without something drastically changing. And the most drastic change

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Speaker 2: is when you replaced the leader. So she can't do

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Speaker 2: that if she wants to survive. It's a tough situation,

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Speaker 2: it truly is.

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Speaker 1: Well and then of course you've got you know, you've

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Speaker 1: got the GNATS that seem to be imploding as well.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the NATS is that's a curious one because they

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Speaker 2: remain reasonably united off the back of what's happened. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it was the fact that three of them got had

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Speaker 2: their resignations accepted, that they decided to all walk. It

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Speaker 2: was a one out, all out mentality. It's hard to

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Speaker 2: know what Colin boss is doing challenging David Little Proud.

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Speaker 2: I'd somewhat ring around yesterday, and just from what I

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Speaker 2: know of the NATS, I don't know where the numbers

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Speaker 2: come for him. If he genuinely thinks he can lead,

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Speaker 2: which I suspect he doesn't, So there's two other paths.

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Speaker 2: Then he's doing it for someone else or trying to

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Speaker 2: flush out someone like Michael McCormack or Matt Canavan. But

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Speaker 2: again they've both said both publicly and privately, they're not

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Speaker 2: interested at the moment. Or he's doing this as he's

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Speaker 2: launching off point to go join one Nation like Barnaby Joyce.

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Speaker 2: He's very close to Barnaby Joyce. Colin Boyce, he is

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Speaker 2: one of the people that voted against the hate speech

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Speaker 2: law in the House at a time when not a

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Speaker 2: lot of the NAT's voted. There was only three of them,

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Speaker 2: two voted against and one voted four that's how much

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Speaker 2: it divided them. And so I don't know if this

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Speaker 2: is a step one or this is just out of

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Speaker 2: frustration or exactly where it's at, but it's again guaranteeing

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Speaker 2: that they're looking at themselves at the start of next

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Speaker 2: week when the Parliament returns, and not looking at theustrail people.

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Speaker 1: It's really unbelievable to me and Crouch. I don't know

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Speaker 1: about you, but here in the Northern Territory, like we

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Speaker 1: get quite a few messages on the tech signe as well.

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Speaker 1: People are concerned about things like you know, immigration, like

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Speaker 1: rightly or wrongly, but particular after what happened at Bondi.

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Speaker 1: They're concerned about the cost of living and you know,

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Speaker 1: you can't have a strong, a really strong sort of

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Speaker 1: government and strong policy without having strong opposition. And at

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Speaker 1: the moment it's just embarrassing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the real point, right. The strongest of governments

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Speaker 2: usually have a strong opposition, and when Australia gets things done,

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Speaker 2: it's not compliant but an assissful opposition. I think of

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Speaker 2: two of note, you know, the way Kim Beasley worked

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Speaker 2: with John Howard posted PORTAFA and then even in the

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Speaker 2: early days of COVID, although you spared a lot of

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Speaker 2: it in the territory, which you're all thankful forward, the

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Speaker 2: way that the Albernezi government worked, opposition worked with work

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Speaker 2: with the Morrison government really sort of got astraight off

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Speaker 2: to the best possible start. And the COVID factor beyond that.

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Speaker 2: I mean, you're right about the cost of living. I

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Speaker 2: have an old saying which I stole from one of

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Speaker 2: the governors of Mississippi, and that is that the main

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Speaker 2: thing is to keep the main thing the main thing.

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Speaker 2: And for four years now the main thing being for

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Speaker 2: voters all across Australia, certainly the territory bit around the

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Speaker 2: country has been the cost of living. And any day,

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Speaker 2: any day the opposition is not speaking about the cost

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Speaker 2: of grocery, of electricity, of insurance, of any of those

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Speaker 2: things that we've all seen go up. I mean, particularly

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Speaker 2: these two weeks. I when kids go back to school

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Speaker 2: and there's the shoes and the stationery and the books

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Speaker 2: and the bags and all those things that cost money.

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Speaker 2: And then next week if interest rates go up, it's

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Speaker 2: going to cost everyone who thought that perhaps this was

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Speaker 2: the relief we'd finally got over all those interest rate

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Speaker 2: hikes in a row and maybe they were coming down.

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Speaker 2: If they go back up, then that puts everyone on

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Speaker 2: the edge again. Small businesses have to pay more for

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Speaker 2: their loans, homeowners have to pay more for their mortgages,

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Speaker 2: and then often that flows through to renters as well.

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Speaker 2: It's one of the few things that really impacts so

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Speaker 2: much of the community. There are some that are self

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Speaker 2: funder retirees and they enjoy the bonus to their savings,

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Speaker 2: and good on them because they've done the hard work beforehand,

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Speaker 2: but they've usually got kids or no young people who

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Speaker 2: struggle as world, or even the benefits they get are

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Speaker 2: outweighed by some feeling for those that aren't quite as fortunate.

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Speaker 1: That's exactly right. Like I cannot tell you the number

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Speaker 1: of discussions I've had with people in recent weeks and

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Speaker 1: months where they're sort of saying, I don't know how

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Speaker 1: my children are ever going to be able to enter

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Speaker 1: the housing market. You know, they're the kind of discussions

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Speaker 1: that real people are having. And then you've got our politicians,

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Speaker 1: you know, just talking about garbage and talking about themselves,

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Speaker 1: So I hope they can sort it out, Charles. But

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Speaker 1: I tell you what, one of the other areas of

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Speaker 1: interest for us here in the Northern Territory is the

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Speaker 1: fact that yesterday the Chinese ambassador spoke to media and well,

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Speaker 1: the Darwin port was a topic of discussion. You were there,

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Speaker 1: I was what happened.

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Speaker 2: He was asked about dah and port. Look, it was

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Speaker 2: generally a glowing address from the ambassador. It does them

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Speaker 2: once or twice a year if we're lucky. And he

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Speaker 2: spoke about China being this stable, the force of stability

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Speaker 2: in the region as an attack on President Trump in America,

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Speaker 2: But when asked about dah Dahalen Ports, it was quite

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Speaker 2: forceful and said that the Chinese government has an obligation,

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Speaker 2: in his words, to protect the assets and the operations

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Speaker 2: of Chinese companies, and if someone comes along and takes

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Speaker 2: Dalenport by force or by forceful tactics, then they'll be

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Speaker 2: forced to use force back. Now. I don't think that

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Speaker 2: means they're going to repel Chinese troops into Darwin, but

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Speaker 2: what it could mean is that they increase economic sanctions

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Speaker 2: on Australia. That means perhaps no more investment, and someone

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Speaker 2: like Darwen benefits greatly from Chinese investment. Perhaps it means

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Speaker 2: targeting industries as they've done before, for higher tariffs, and

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Speaker 2: what you really don't want is that to mean the

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Speaker 2: cattle industry in the Northern Territory or some of the

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Speaker 2: minerals industries throughout Wa. So I don't think this was

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Speaker 2: a direct you know, here is what's happening threat. I

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Speaker 2: think it's probably laying the foundations for negotiations that are

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Speaker 2: going to go ahead, because the Chinese government must know

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Speaker 2: and land Bridge must know that the intention of the

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Speaker 2: government is to force a sale of the Dahinport. I

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Speaker 2: think in a lot of ways what this is trying

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Speaker 2: to do is extract the most possible, be it money

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Speaker 2: or something else, out of these negotiations before they even start.

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Speaker 2: But it was by far the most direct I've heard

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Speaker 2: the ambassador any Chinese representative on Darwenport and something it

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Speaker 2: came back to a couple of times. This wasn't an

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Speaker 2: accident that the ambassador was saying something like this.

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Speaker 1: Very interesting stuff. And of course we know that the

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Speaker 1: Prime Minister, you know, it was an election commitment, But

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Speaker 1: it does all seem a lot more complex then you

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Speaker 1: know what it'd sort of originally promised.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean this is something that has you know,

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Speaker 2: confounded federal governments for a while now. It was signed

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Speaker 2: off on by I think the Turnbull government, but certainly

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Speaker 2: something that was raised by Barack Obama to either Abbot

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Speaker 2: or Turnbull during one of their early meetings. So that's

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Speaker 2: how this is. And then there's been a real thought

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Speaker 2: in the side of Australia's relationship with the US because

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Speaker 2: they are concerned obviously about the marine rotation and Chinese

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Speaker 2: access to a port that is of such importance geographically

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Speaker 2: and the rest. And then also obviously territory governments and

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Speaker 2: federal governments have got to somehow work out how you

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Speaker 2: get out of an agreement that is so iron Cladden,

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Speaker 2: it's going to cost a lot of money to take

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Speaker 2: this back. So look, both parties said it was their policy.

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Speaker 2: It was going to happen one way or the other.

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Speaker 2: It's sort of landed in Anthony Albernezi's court now and

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Speaker 2: he's got some work today.

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Speaker 1: Yep. We will wait and see what unfolds. Will Charles

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Speaker 1: Croutcher nine News political editor, It is always wonderful to

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Speaker 1: get your insight. Thanks so much for having a chat

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Speaker 1: with us today.

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Speaker 2: Anytime, Katy.

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Speaker 1: Thanks mate,