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Speaker 1: As we've been speaking about this morning, and we certainly

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Speaker 1: spoke about it yesterday. We heard about the absolute havoc

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Speaker 1: on the streets of Alice Springs, multiple cars stolen and

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Speaker 1: driven dangerously through the CBD, riding in the back of utes,

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Speaker 1: pushing police to urge locals and tourists to avoid the

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Speaker 1: area in Alice Springs. Now, the Northern Territory Police Association

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Speaker 1: says that crime has exceeded crisis point, with officers deliberately

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Speaker 1: being targeted by offenders who were allegedly driving at those

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Speaker 1: marked police cars, putting lives at risk. President of the

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Speaker 1: Police Association, Paul McHugh joins me on the line. Good morning, Paul,

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Speaker 1: Morning Katie Paul. What is the association's response to the

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Speaker 1: incidents in Alice Springs.

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Speaker 2: Oh, look, it's a borient behavior. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 2: you've seen the vision. Most people have seen the vision

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Speaker 2: now and you know, sadly, this doesn't come as a

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Speaker 2: surprise to us. And this is a blatant, violen attack

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Speaker 2: on our members and of course the community itself, and

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Speaker 2: we condemn that type of behavior in the strongest terms.

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Speaker 2: I mean, the last thing we need to see are

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Speaker 2: our police targeted who are out there. You know, Heaven forbid,

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Speaker 2: they're the ones out there keeping us safe. And now

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Speaker 2: they're under attack themselves from young people, regardless of age,

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Speaker 2: who are using a deadly weapon to attack our police.

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Speaker 2: And you know, people think, well, the last thing we

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Speaker 2: want to see someone lose their life. We've already seen that.

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Speaker 2: We've already seen that. In the last year or two,

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Speaker 2: a man lost his life down there in Alice Springs

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Speaker 2: at an intersection. It was horrific. And you know, here

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Speaker 2: we've got behavior from young individuals that they need to

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Speaker 2: be held to account. I don't care about their age.

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Speaker 2: This is a current behavior and our members are under

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Speaker 2: attack and something needs to happen.

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Speaker 1: Paul, how are police officers in Alice Springs feeling right

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Speaker 1: now after what has unfolded?

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Speaker 2: Look, it's terrible. I mean, this is sadly nothing new.

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Speaker 2: As I've said, our members have been taunted by young

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Speaker 2: offenders in our springs and across the territory for a

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Speaker 2: long time now. And you know that, you know, we're

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Speaker 2: talking about ten eleven year old children and they've had

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Speaker 2: some horrific upbringings and they've had, you know, a really

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Speaker 2: not an opportunity to have a start in life, really,

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Speaker 2: yet they do know what they're doing is right or wrong.

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Speaker 2: When you're driving around in a vehicle like has been happening,

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Speaker 2: you know, blatantly flaunting the laws and the safety of

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Speaker 2: the community. Something stronger than a lift in the back

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Speaker 2: of a car to somewhere to have a chat needs

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Speaker 2: to be done.

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Speaker 1: Paul, what are police officers saying to you in Alice

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Speaker 1: Springs right now? And like, have you spoken to any

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Speaker 1: of those officers after Tuesday night? I certainly don't want

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Speaker 1: to identify any of them or anything like that, but

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Speaker 1: what are they saying to you?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you look at representatives down there in Alice Springs.

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Speaker 2: Of course have been in touch with some of the officers,

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Speaker 2: and it's righting. I mean, obviously the last thing police remember,

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Speaker 2: their families see them go off to work each day,

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Speaker 2: and they're seeing this unfold of course on social media

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Speaker 2: and knowing their families at work wondering if they're okay.

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Speaker 2: I mean, the last thing we want to see is

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Speaker 2: them in fear of their own lives while they're out

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Speaker 2: there keeping us safe. But what really is of concern

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Speaker 2: is we really haven't even hit the busy summer period Katie.

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Speaker 2: So that is traditionally the busiest time down there in

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Speaker 2: Alice Springs, and we're already seeing these types of this

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Speaker 2: types of behavior and that's probably the biggest concern. Given

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Speaker 2: the police numbers down there.

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Speaker 1: What is going to happen as well when this age

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Speaker 1: of criminal responsibility changes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, obviously government of and now they've been doing

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Speaker 2: some work you know, in the lead up to this

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Speaker 2: legislation on what they perceive is going to be you know,

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Speaker 2: I guess keeping the kids off the street in one

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Speaker 2: form or another. But you know what is of concern,

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Speaker 2: of course, is the age of criminal responsibility doesn't change crime,

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Speaker 2: it doesn't reduce crime. Crime will still occur, police will

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Speaker 2: still need to attend and now quite possibly we're going

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Speaker 2: to be used as a I guess a taxi service

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Speaker 2: to run kids around at the same time, and I

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Speaker 2: really question where the police numbers are coming from. I mean,

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Speaker 2: the last thing the Commissioner needs and his senior executive

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Speaker 2: down their analysis police tied up running children around when

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Speaker 2: there's many other aspects to policing than that. So you know,

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Speaker 2: it's not to say they're not going to do that bit,

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Speaker 2: but you can't expect the police to do it all.

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Speaker 1: Paul, what do you make of the announcement that was made, Well,

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Speaker 1: the government's been flagging this for a couple of weeks,

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Speaker 1: but they fleshed out some of that detail yesterday. Under

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Speaker 1: this plan, where young people will be picked up by police,

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Speaker 1: they could then be taken to a safe place for

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Speaker 1: a child protection assessment instead of being returned home. So

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Speaker 1: the minister has said that the measure was a clear

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Speaker 1: message to parents and caregivers and what we need is

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Speaker 1: to make sure that those parents in Alice Springs understand

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Speaker 1: fully that if they're young people are out night and

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Speaker 1: if they're returned to them the next time, that may

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Speaker 1: not happen, so they may be taken into care and protection.

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Speaker 1: What do you make of that announcement.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, look, obviously you know we support measures that you know,

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Speaker 2: I mean the government are looking at trying to implement

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Speaker 2: a program that removes the children off the street and

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Speaker 2: I guess intervenes in ongoing criminal behavior or behavior that

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Speaker 2: you know, the community do not find acceptable any life

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Speaker 2: threatening and danger. So when we support that, but the

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Speaker 2: devil's in the detail, and you know what power is

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Speaker 2: the police going to have to arrest or detain or

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Speaker 2: transport the children. What powers are they going to be

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Speaker 2: to for police when in the three o'clock in the

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Speaker 2: morning they can't find another agency or you know, we

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Speaker 2: just don't know some of those details yet, and we're

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Speaker 2: looking forward to having those discussions with government to see

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Speaker 2: what it means for our members because ultimately, changes like

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Speaker 2: this always policing, there's no question about that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a really good point to make that,

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Speaker 1: you know, the devil is going to be in the

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Speaker 1: detail where exactly if there isn't a service available for

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Speaker 1: them to be taken to, what exactly is going to

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Speaker 1: be the procedures and protocols. Paul, What do you think

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Speaker 1: could be happening in Central Australia right now from a

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Speaker 1: policing perspective to try to really minimize what's going on.

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Speaker 2: Well, obviously with the community, you want to make sure

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Speaker 2: our police are safe. They want to make sure there's

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Speaker 2: enough police out there. The behaviors we're seeing are antisocial

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Speaker 2: behavior as well as at times very serious criminal behavior,

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Speaker 2: and of course we can't deal with that without enough police.

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Speaker 2: And we've said previously we need to get our police

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Speaker 2: auxiliaries off of those bottle shops. We need to transition

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Speaker 2: those positions to constable positions. Quite clearly, there's going to

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Speaker 2: be a need for more police with some of the

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Speaker 2: changes in legislation and the interventions looking at being implemented

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Speaker 2: down there and at times across the territory, and of

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Speaker 2: course we can't do that without additional numbers. It's as

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Speaker 2: simple as that.

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Speaker 1: And so you reckon they need to be transitioned off

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Speaker 1: those bottle shops. That's something that you and I have

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Speaker 1: spoken about before. And so the liquor inspectors transitioned out

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Speaker 1: of those roles and into constable positions. How exactly would

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Speaker 1: that work in terms of, you know, would they require

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Speaker 1: additional training and that kind of thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, I mean, obviously those individuals have been trained

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Speaker 2: to be a police auxiliary liquor inspector. It's a far

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Speaker 2: different role of being a constable. So those individuals themselves

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Speaker 2: would need to meet the requirements of a constable and

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Speaker 2: do additional training. But of course what we're talking about

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Speaker 2: is the positions, not necessarily the individuals, and we want

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Speaker 2: those positions to become constable positions. They can then be deployed.

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Speaker 2: The Commission will have additional resources to deploy around Alison,

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Speaker 2: around remote areas. That can only be a positive. And

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Speaker 2: let's get our police off doing that role. Let's get

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Speaker 2: locky licensing inspectors or another format to take over the

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Speaker 2: bottle shops.

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Speaker 1: And you are also calling for an urgent meeting of

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Speaker 1: the working group that was established by the former Police

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Speaker 1: Minister Nicole Madison. What is that one all about?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there was, I guess I'm looking at sentencing options

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Speaker 2: for offenders who assault frontline workers and we haven't seen

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Speaker 2: really any movement in that for over a year. There

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Speaker 2: was a commitment from then then Minister for Police Madison

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Speaker 2: around looking at assaults on frontline workers. And I think

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Speaker 2: what we've seen lately, of course in the footage and

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Speaker 2: what we know is taking place now, this is more

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Speaker 2: important than ever when we're looking at protecting those frontline

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Speaker 2: workers and our police cannot afford to be under a

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Speaker 2: tack lock they are at the moment.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Honestly, what we'd seen earlier in the week. If

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Speaker 1: it's not the point that something needs to one hundred

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Speaker 1: percent change, then I don't know what can be. And

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Speaker 1: I know that I've said that on this show on

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Speaker 1: so many occasions, there's been so many different in it

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Speaker 1: instead of happened that I've thought this has got to

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Speaker 1: be there's got to be some change. But from what

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Speaker 1: we saw on Tuesday, it was dangerous to absolutely everybody.

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Speaker 2: Everyone, every member of the community's at risk when you

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Speaker 2: see that form of behavior. And you know, we've got

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Speaker 2: some incredibly terrific committed police down there in Alice Springs.

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Speaker 2: The assistant commissioner there has lived there previously. He knows

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Speaker 2: that part of the world very well, and you know,

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Speaker 2: we just want to make sure that community is safe.

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Speaker 2: It's a great town, but we can't have this sort

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Speaker 2: of behavior, and of course police need support and protection

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Speaker 2: if they're going to keep that community safe well.

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Speaker 1: Police Association President Paul mchwe we always appreciate your time.

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Speaker 1: Thanks very much for speaking with me this morning.

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Speaker 2: Good on you. Thanks Katie, Thank you