1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:02,960 Speaker 1: Now we know that it has been revealed that it's 2 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:07,320 Speaker 1: going to cost taxpayers more than ninety two thousand dollars 3 00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:09,920 Speaker 1: for the Chief Minister and two staff members to travel 4 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:13,000 Speaker 1: overseas to America. She's going to be traveling, as I said, 5 00:00:13,039 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: with two staff Now. In a statement last week, the 6 00:00:15,560 --> 00:00:17,479 Speaker 1: government said that the Chief Minister is going to be 7 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:21,319 Speaker 1: traveling to the United States to reaffirm defense ties and 8 00:00:21,360 --> 00:00:25,799 Speaker 1: promote the Northern Territory's abundance of critical minerals and emergency 9 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: response capability. But the question really is this morning, I 10 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 1: mean more than ninety thousand dollars, is that too much money? 11 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,640 Speaker 1: Or are these meetings required? Now joining me in the 12 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:39,680 Speaker 1: studio to discuss this and other things is the Opposition 13 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 1: leader Leah fanochiiro Good morning to you, Leah. 14 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:43,559 Speaker 2: Good morning Katie and to your listeners. 15 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:47,239 Speaker 1: Now, Leah, is ninety thousand dollars too much to be 16 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:51,360 Speaker 1: spent on going overseas for what has been described as 17 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: critical meetings? 18 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 3: Look, I think it doesn't pass the pub test, Katie. 19 00:00:55,840 --> 00:00:58,440 Speaker 3: At a time when our debt is at ten billion dollars, 20 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:01,680 Speaker 3: cost of living pressures on family are really forcing people 21 00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 3: to make decisions on how they put food on the table. 22 00:01:04,520 --> 00:01:06,920 Speaker 3: And then you've got a government that's literally spent an 23 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:09,760 Speaker 3: entire week in Parliament telling people that crime is just 24 00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 3: a perception and gossip, and then they've all flitted off 25 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:17,039 Speaker 3: overseas at ten thousand dollars a day. I mean, I 26 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 3: just can't understand why it's costing Natasha Philes ten thousand 27 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:23,000 Speaker 3: dollars a day to be in the US. And then 28 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 3: we know earlier this year Minister Moss went overseas and 29 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:28,759 Speaker 3: it costs ten thousand dollars a day for that trip 30 00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 3: as well. 31 00:01:29,160 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 2: We've got Eva Lawler. 32 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:32,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, look there are by the look of it, there 33 00:01:32,680 --> 00:01:35,240 Speaker 1: is a number of trips. And during the trip though, 34 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:37,200 Speaker 1: the Chief Minister I want to just focus on hers 35 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 1: for one moment. The Chief Minister is going to meet 36 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 1: with key US federal government decision makers to advance the 37 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 1: territory's role in supporting US defense training initiatives under the 38 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:51,680 Speaker 1: Australian United States Alliance in the Northern Territory. They say 39 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:55,760 Speaker 1: it's also an opportunity to develop US defense planned infrastructure 40 00:01:55,760 --> 00:02:00,360 Speaker 1: investments in the Northern Territory which will create local jobs. LEA, 41 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: isn't this work and these meetings. Isn't it important? 42 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:06,520 Speaker 3: Look, it is important, and our relationship with the United 43 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 3: States is important. But for the Chief Minister to spend 44 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:13,560 Speaker 3: nine days at ten thousand dollars a day, there are 45 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:16,160 Speaker 3: questions around that. You know, people, this is a government 46 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 3: that promised to be open and transparent when they came 47 00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:21,799 Speaker 3: to government in twenty sixteen, they said they would be 48 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:25,800 Speaker 3: publishing in advance the cost of overseas holidays, and of 49 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:27,839 Speaker 3: course this has had to be extracted. 50 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: Hang on, so it's not holidays, they're not overseas sorry, 51 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:32,080 Speaker 1: overseas troops. 52 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 3: Obviously that was asleep, but it's probably what everyone's thinking. 53 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:37,079 Speaker 2: But look, you know, I do. 54 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:39,240 Speaker 1: Think that there does need to be you know that 55 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: we do need to be honest here. I mean, it 56 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 1: is a situation where obviously there are important meetings that 57 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,959 Speaker 1: need to happen. But I do think that there was 58 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:51,399 Speaker 1: a time, if I recall correctly, where they were actually 59 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 1: publishing the amount on pressure releases that it was costing. 60 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 1: That was in the early days of the government. And 61 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: I actually think that that's a good idea. Then people 62 00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 1: know it's very up front, you're very straightforward about how 63 00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 1: much it's costing. So that taxpayers actually have an understanding now. 64 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:08,160 Speaker 1: I know even last week I'd heard from Master Builders 65 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: and they'd said that Katie. Yes, we do believe that 66 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 1: these discussions are important, particularly when you look at the 67 00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:15,080 Speaker 1: amount that he's going to be coming into the northern 68 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 1: Territory around infrastructure from from defense. But you know the 69 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: point that you're making about sort of ten thousand dollars 70 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 1: a day, it is one that needs to be made. 71 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 1: It's an awful lot of money. 72 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is. 73 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 3: And I'm off the back of the context, Katie. So 74 00:03:29,680 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 3: we've got a government that's not able to control the basics. 75 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:36,280 Speaker 3: Our hospital is constantly and Code yellow crime is totally 76 00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 3: out of control. Things are a mess in the territory 77 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 3: and we're going backwards. Then you've got the government picking 78 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,840 Speaker 3: up and going overseas at a pretty penny. I mean, 79 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 3: this is not their money, this is territory taxpayers dollars. 80 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:52,040 Speaker 3: And people want to know why it's costing ten thousand 81 00:03:52,080 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 3: dollars a day seemingly for every minister to go overseas. 82 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:57,360 Speaker 3: What's that money being spent on. Does it have to 83 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 3: be that expensive and what's the outcome? Want to know 84 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 3: that they're getting value for money. Members of Parliament are 85 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 3: accountable to the people and so this is really around 86 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:09,720 Speaker 3: transparency with when it comes to Lauren Moss's travel, that 87 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 3: information came out way after the fact, and we know 88 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 3: with the Chief Minister's travel this week it's been extracted 89 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 3: by the media. So we do have a government that's 90 00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 3: not got a good track record on transparency and people, 91 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:22,720 Speaker 3: you know, people don't like that. 92 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 1: So by the sounds of things, you know, you don't 93 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 1: have an issue obviously with the Chief Minister going for 94 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:32,080 Speaker 1: these meetings or having these meetings, But when it then 95 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:35,359 Speaker 1: comes to something like Minister Lauren Moss going away for 96 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,080 Speaker 1: that water conference, you're sort of going, well, hang on 97 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:40,680 Speaker 1: a sec is that travel essential? Yeah? 98 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:43,720 Speaker 3: So Lauren Moss went away for six days I think 99 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 3: to New York. It was for the United Nations Water Conference. 100 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 3: Now does she need to do that, probably not. Did 101 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 3: it need to cost sixty thousand dollars, absolutely not. Does 102 00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 3: the Chief Minister need to be in Washington for nine days? 103 00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 3: Probably not? Does it need to cost ninety thousand dollars? 104 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:04,320 Speaker 3: So there's all degrees here. Territorians are very reasonable people 105 00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 3: and we want our best foot forward on the national stage. 106 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 1: Sod Leah, what would the COLP do differently when it 107 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: comes to overseas travel? I mean, would you not meet 108 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 1: with the likes of those US Defense Force. 109 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:19,360 Speaker 3: Like I said, it's not about not going on these trips, 110 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 3: but it's about ensuring that you have value for territory. 111 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 3: So Natasha Files has taken two staff members with her. 112 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:28,080 Speaker 3: Could she have taken one staff member that would make 113 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 3: the trip a third of you know, one third cheaper. 114 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 3: It's all those types of decisions, and of course being 115 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:37,359 Speaker 3: open about it at the start. The comments from the 116 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 3: Deputy Chief Minister around oh well it's transparent because you'll 117 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:43,719 Speaker 3: see it on Facebook, just laughable, Katie. 118 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:45,480 Speaker 2: It's it's not what people want to hear. 119 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:48,359 Speaker 3: Especially again, what we're talking about is a context for 120 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 3: real life territorians out there making tough decisions on where 121 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 3: do I park my car, can I go to the shop, 122 00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 3: will I be safe tonight? 123 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 2: Can I put food on the table? 124 00:05:57,120 --> 00:05:58,880 Speaker 3: And then off the back of that, we've got a 125 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:02,039 Speaker 3: government not dealing with those issues and off overseas at 126 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:03,119 Speaker 3: an extraordinary cost. 127 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:06,640 Speaker 1: So, Leah, would the COLP commit to publishing those costs 128 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: before traveling away? 129 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:10,919 Speaker 2: We're very happy to continue that going. 130 00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:13,400 Speaker 3: Of course, it was a labor commitment in twenty sixteen 131 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:18,159 Speaker 3: that they started and have totally disbanded, but we're very 132 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:19,360 Speaker 3: happy to pick that back up. 133 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:20,840 Speaker 2: We've got nothing to hide. 134 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 3: This is about making sure that we spend every penny 135 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:26,080 Speaker 3: as wisely as we can. And when we've got a 136 00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:29,599 Speaker 3: ten billion dollar debt and the territories falling apart with 137 00:06:29,720 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 3: crime and cost of living in our economy going backwards, 138 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:35,920 Speaker 3: it's prudden and responsible to be really upfront about making sure, 139 00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 3: you know, can things be done more? 140 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:40,719 Speaker 1: Publish it in a pressure release before traveling away. Yeah. 141 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 3: Well, I've got absolutely no qualms about doing that, Katie. 142 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 3: It's not an issue for us. It always governments have 143 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 3: to travel, but it's about putting enough public pressure and 144 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 3: scrutiny on it to make sure when they are making 145 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:54,080 Speaker 3: those decisions that it really is in the best interest 146 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:54,919 Speaker 3: of the territory. 147 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:56,919 Speaker 1: All right, Lea. I do want to move along because 148 00:06:56,920 --> 00:06:59,839 Speaker 1: in other news, the Northern Territory governments refusing to release 149 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:03,080 Speaker 1: a secret letter from the Chief Minister Natasha Files to 150 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:06,279 Speaker 1: the former police Commissioner Jamie Chalker. It was sent before 151 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:09,679 Speaker 1: his sudden leave of absence and legal fights earlier this year. 152 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:13,840 Speaker 1: Now the ABC News putting a request through Freedom of 153 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:17,200 Speaker 1: Information to access the letter, but after a five month wait, 154 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: the Northern Territory government has formally declined the request, citing 155 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 1: confidentiality and privacy concerns. Lea, do you think that this 156 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: letter should be made public? 157 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:28,960 Speaker 2: This is very interesting, Katie. 158 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 3: I think this government again has got no runs on 159 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 3: the board when it comes to being open and transparent. 160 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:37,880 Speaker 3: They promised changes to FOY to be able to make 161 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 3: more things accessible to the public. And this letter has 162 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 3: public interest because of course it's what sparked this whole 163 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 3: disaster and uncertainty around the Jamie Chalker payout. It's what 164 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 3: led to that Supreme Court proceeding, and what Territorians know 165 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 3: is that the settlement with Jamie Chalker happened the night 166 00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:58,840 Speaker 3: before Natasha Files was due to hit the stand and 167 00:07:58,880 --> 00:08:01,080 Speaker 3: be a witness in those court proceedings. 168 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 2: All around that letter. 169 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:05,400 Speaker 3: So I think the question on people's mind is whether 170 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:08,440 Speaker 3: or not the Australian Federal Police were asked to come 171 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 3: to the Territory to support our crime crisis, and people 172 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:12,840 Speaker 3: want to know the answer to that. 173 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:15,640 Speaker 1: So do you think that the public interest here outweighs 174 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 1: the detriment. 175 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 3: Well, I think there's lots of ways that government could 176 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 3: do it. Instead, they've just closed the lid on it. 177 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 3: They haven't redacted parts of it, they haven't even tried 178 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 3: to sort of offer up sections of the letter that 179 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 3: could be made available. They've just absolutely said no, we're 180 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:33,400 Speaker 3: not doing it and made that decision. And I'm glad 181 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 3: the ABC are appealing that decision because people want to know. 182 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 3: This of course led to a payout from the police. 183 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:42,360 Speaker 3: Bottom line, it led to Supreme Court proceedings that our 184 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 3: Chief Minister would have had to front as a witness, 185 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:47,080 Speaker 3: and of course it ended in the demise of a 186 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:51,199 Speaker 3: police commissioner. So there is significant public interests around this matter. 187 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:54,640 Speaker 3: Territorians are the ones who paid, and ultimately, in a 188 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 3: crime crisis, people want to know whether or not this 189 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 3: all sparked from the commissioner asking for the AFP to 190 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 3: come and support us. 191 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:03,960 Speaker 1: He was on the record though, I was saying that 192 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:06,960 Speaker 1: he didn't need the AFP to come in and support us. 193 00:09:06,960 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 1: And I know because this is something that I'd asked, 194 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: I'd put to him, i'd put to the Chief Minister, 195 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:13,520 Speaker 1: I put to a lot of decision makers over that 196 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 1: period of time, so he was on the record as. 197 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:19,439 Speaker 3: Saying that he didn't ask yes, but it obviously appeared 198 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 3: in this letter, and because we don't have it, I 199 00:09:21,120 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 3: guess we were wondering. I think the allegation was at 200 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:26,880 Speaker 3: the time that perhaps the Chief Minister had said that 201 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:27,680 Speaker 3: he had done that. 202 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 2: So who knows right? 203 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 3: And I guess that's the whole point of wanting to 204 00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 3: get to the bottom of it. 205 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:33,839 Speaker 2: This letter is. 206 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:36,320 Speaker 3: Really pivotal and will answer a lot of questions for 207 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 3: a lot of people. 208 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:39,040 Speaker 2: So we'll see where ABC get with it. 209 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:41,960 Speaker 3: But again government just shutting it down straight up without 210 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 3: even trying to release some information. 211 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 2: All right. 212 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:47,360 Speaker 1: It is being reported that the COLP has a proposal 213 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,920 Speaker 1: for council local government boundaries to change back to the 214 00:09:50,920 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 1: way that they used to be. So this was flagged 215 00:09:53,080 --> 00:09:56,560 Speaker 1: last week and would see the return of community councils 216 00:09:56,600 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: to the Northern Territory's local government structure fifteen years after 217 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,920 Speaker 1: that model was scrapped in favor of a shire council model. 218 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 1: Why is the COLP looking. 219 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 2: To do this? 220 00:10:07,120 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 3: We have had overwhelming feedback for the entire period that 221 00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:15,840 Speaker 3: we've been in opposition Katie from every part of the 222 00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:19,360 Speaker 3: Northern Territory. No matter which remote Aboriginal community we go to, 223 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:22,559 Speaker 3: people raise it with us as the number one concern 224 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 3: that the super shires that Labor brought in in two 225 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:29,960 Speaker 3: thousand and eight have totally disempowered Aboriginal people on communities. 226 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:35,440 Speaker 3: It's removed leadership structures, it's removed control, and has not 227 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 3: led to better outcomes for anybody. So it's something we're 228 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:42,360 Speaker 3: really focused on working with Aboriginal people in remote communities 229 00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 3: around what a new model could look like. You know, 230 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:48,040 Speaker 3: the original model wasn't perfect either. There's got to be 231 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:51,679 Speaker 3: a way to do this properly. But certainly having highly 232 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:56,680 Speaker 3: centralized councils or you know, regional councils in the major 233 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:58,320 Speaker 3: towns is not delivering the outcomes. 234 00:10:58,760 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: Money saving measure that was well, I mean, was it 235 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 1: costing an enormous amount of money to have like various 236 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: different local councils throughout different regions when you could actually 237 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 1: you know, when you could actually refine things. 238 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 3: Look, it could have been a cost saving at the time. 239 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:15,240 Speaker 3: It was right back in two thousand and eight, but 240 00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:17,720 Speaker 3: you know, all these decades later, we need to be 241 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:20,319 Speaker 3: reviewing that and saying has this worked? And I think 242 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:23,599 Speaker 3: the resounding answer to that is no, it hasn't. Aboriginal 243 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 3: people want to be in control of their communities, creating 244 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:31,040 Speaker 3: those jobs, creating the opportunities and the leadership structures, and 245 00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 3: we're very, very supportive of that. So we're excited about 246 00:11:33,520 --> 00:11:37,840 Speaker 3: this consultation process that has begun. We're actively out talking 247 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:40,320 Speaker 3: with people about what it could look like, and we'll 248 00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 3: carry that through into next year. 249 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 1: Before I let you go, the Coalition leader Peter Dutton 250 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:47,600 Speaker 1: has come out with plans of his own. He says 251 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:51,520 Speaker 1: that he plans to do a second referendum seeking constitutional 252 00:11:51,559 --> 00:11:55,000 Speaker 1: recognition of Aboriginal people with no voice element if the 253 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:56,200 Speaker 1: current bid fails. 254 00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 2: Do you support this? 255 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:02,079 Speaker 3: I've always been supportive of constitutional recognition. I think Territorians 256 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:05,160 Speaker 3: are probably thinking, oh, another referendum or another election and 257 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 3: more money. So probably the best way to go off 258 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 3: the Coalition want to do that is to tie in 259 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 3: with the next federal election. That way, there's not additional 260 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:16,960 Speaker 3: cost or impost on the community to vote. But I 261 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:19,559 Speaker 3: think a lot of people are really disappointed that Labor 262 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,280 Speaker 3: have not split the questions so that people can vote 263 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:25,559 Speaker 3: yes for constitutional recognition and then vote how they want 264 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:26,960 Speaker 3: to vote on the issue of the voice. 265 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:28,960 Speaker 1: Leah Finocchiaro, we are going to have to leave it. 266 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:30,560 Speaker 1: They're good to catch up with you as always. 267 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 2: Thank you, take care, thank you.