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Speaker 1: A couple of weeks ago.

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Speaker 2: Obviously, Parliament sat in the Northern Territory and there was

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Speaker 2: quite a bit of legislation introduced and indeed passed. There

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Speaker 2: were also motions introduced by some on the cross bench.

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Speaker 2: Now we try our best to catch up with the

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Speaker 2: independent members of Parliament and also those in opposition weekly

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Speaker 2: to find out what is on the agenda. And we

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Speaker 2: know we've got a Greens member of Parliament and that

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Speaker 2: is the Greens member for Nightcliff Cat McNamara, who joins

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Speaker 2: me in the studio right now.

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Speaker 1: Good morning, Cat, morning, Katie morning everyone.

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Speaker 2: Lovely to have you in the studio. Thanks so much

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Speaker 2: for your time now. I was watching Parliament when it

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Speaker 2: was sitting a couple of weeks ago, and I was like, oh,

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Speaker 2: I've got to make sure I get Kat on about that,

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Speaker 2: because there are a couple of motions that you you know,

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Speaker 2: that you put on the agenda. But it's been so

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Speaker 2: busy and there's been so much happening, so I thought, no,

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Speaker 2: I've still got to make sure I'll get you on

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Speaker 2: to find out more about this stuff.

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Speaker 1: But one of the.

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Speaker 2: Things that you did say that you're certainly i think

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Speaker 2: hoping for a bit more transparency on and and tougher

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Speaker 2: rules and regulations, I guess is probably the right way

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Speaker 2: of putting it.

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Speaker 1: He is the lobbyist Register.

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Speaker 2: Now we know the COLP obviously introduced or announced the

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Speaker 2: lobbyist Register to coincide with the start of the twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty five parliamentary year.

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Speaker 1: Did you feel it went far enough?

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Speaker 3: Well, the short answer is no, Katie. I mean, so

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Speaker 3: I put a notice up last year, notice a motion

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Speaker 3: to say I'm going to be introducing emotion about the

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Speaker 3: lobbyist Register.

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Speaker 4: So that came up at the.

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Speaker 3: Last sitting the day before we were bent to debate

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Speaker 3: my motions, and they did their announcements. So I'm pretty

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Speaker 3: glad that I got to push the government in terms

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Speaker 3: of enacting that lobbyist register. But when I saw the details,

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Speaker 3: I was really disappointed. It was such a missed opportunity

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Speaker 3: to actually implement something with teeth, you know, operate to

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Speaker 3: the highest standard, like we've got to be achieving high

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Speaker 3: and unfortunately the details of this register means it's not

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Speaker 3: going to be effective at all. It's pretty it's going

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Speaker 3: to be honestly woefully inadequate at stopping that revolving door

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Speaker 3: between lobbyists and politicians that we see. They're not extending

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Speaker 3: the cooling off period any longer than six months. Six

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Speaker 3: months is just in Canada it's five years.

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Speaker 2: So that's it once you leave politics a month period.

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Speaker 2: In terms of getting a job afterwards, well.

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Speaker 3: Getting a job, not any job, just a job within

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Speaker 3: an industry that you previously regulated.

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Speaker 2: Right. Oh yeah, so was that kind of was that

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Speaker 2: I guess sparked by the fact that we saw Nicole

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Speaker 2: Madison the previous minister, but she'd been not a minister

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Speaker 2: then for a year within parliament and then obviously took

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Speaker 2: on that job in the resources sector or in the

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Speaker 2: gas sector.

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Speaker 1: Is that what you mean?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely that, and we've seen it and as far

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Speaker 3: back as you go in territory, you know, we saw

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Speaker 3: it with Michael Gunner six months and three days i think,

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Speaker 3: until he walked into a role like that. And the

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Speaker 3: problem is that it just gives the public, It puts

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Speaker 3: doubt in their mind are these people there for the

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Speaker 3: best interest of the community or are they there to

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Speaker 3: just feather their own nests and walk into like a

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Speaker 3: cushy role afterwards. And we just need to really, really

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Speaker 3: be disincentivizing any of that behavior in our politics. And

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Speaker 3: you know, most of other other jurisdictions have much longer

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Speaker 3: cooling off periods. It's a pretty reasonable ask. I think

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Speaker 3: six months is just not enough.

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Speaker 1: So how long do you reckon it should be?

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Speaker 3: So we asked for a four year cooling off period,

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Speaker 3: so yeah, watually I've only still got six months.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, look to look at it from the other side,

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Speaker 2: and I agree with you because I do think it's

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Speaker 2: a really big you know, it's a concern, right, you

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Speaker 2: want to make sure that people are in those if

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Speaker 2: they are in ministerial roles, that they're not then walking

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Speaker 2: into other jobs after they leave those roles and have

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Speaker 2: potentially made decisions while they're in their ministerial roles that

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Speaker 2: could help them. But then the other side of it

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Speaker 2: is a lot of the people that we've got in

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Speaker 2: Parliament at the moment, yourself included. You know, your young

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Speaker 2: dynamic people, what do you do when you leave politics?

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Speaker 3: I mean, if everyone else in the communities expected to

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Speaker 3: find work, I'm sure we can too.

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Speaker 4: And we are young, dynamic people with lots of skills.

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Speaker 4: There are lots of roles you can go into.

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Speaker 3: And I mean Look, politicians get paid leave at the

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Speaker 3: end of it. Two, it's not like they're desperate to

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Speaker 3: get back into work. You can just be a little

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Speaker 3: bit broader, I think in terms of finding it. And look,

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Speaker 3: it wasn't just the cooling off period in their motion.

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Speaker 4: It was also the fact that.

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Speaker 3: There is no transparency for the public. So we heard

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Speaker 3: the Chief Minister say that lobbyist register was going to

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Speaker 3: be good because it will tell the ministers who's lobbing them,

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Speaker 3: which it's just a fundamental misunderstanding of what a lobbyist

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Speaker 3: register is. Right, it's for the public. That's how you

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Speaker 3: hold people accountable. So other lobbyist registers, you have to

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Speaker 3: publicize the minister's diaries, so you have to publicize, you know,

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Speaker 3: who are they're meeting with, how many times they're meeting

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Speaker 3: with them, what the topics are about that they're meeting.

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Speaker 3: So we don't get any of this, So any lobbyists

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Speaker 3: who's meeting with their ministers, we've actually got no idea.

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Speaker 2: And that happens in other states, doesn't it. That's really

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Speaker 2: what you're pushing for.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And I mean because it's a state by

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Speaker 3: state thing, there are different different rules across But the

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Speaker 3: good thing is is that because we're so late to

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Speaker 3: the party, we can actually look at all the different

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Speaker 3: states and territories around Australia and go, okay, we can

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Speaker 3: pick the best from each of them. And that's what

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Speaker 3: I put forward in my motion. And so on the day,

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Speaker 3: even though they'd announced that they implemented it. The next

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Speaker 3: day I did my motion and they all voted against it.

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Speaker 1: Well, you know, at least you've had a crack, I suppose.

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Speaker 2: And no matter what I think, even with you know,

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Speaker 2: even in terms of those meetings and the publish the

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Speaker 2: publishing of the diary and that kind of stuff, I

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Speaker 2: actually think that in politics we do want things to

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Speaker 2: be as open and transparent as possible. So regardless everybody's

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Speaker 2: you know, everybody's keeping a close on things, the last

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Speaker 2: thing we want is anything dodgy going on. Now.

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Speaker 1: I do want to ask you, Kat.

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Speaker 2: I know that you'd also introduced emotion as I understand it,

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Speaker 2: around rental rights.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk me through what this one was? Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Sure, So I've just put those notices up so they'll

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Speaker 3: come up at a later date in Parliament. But basically

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Speaker 3: we've got almost fifty percent of the population here in

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Speaker 3: the territory are renters, which is actually the highest proportion

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Speaker 3: of renters compared to other states and territories.

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Speaker 4: And renters here.

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Speaker 3: We've got a cost of living crisis that's only getting worse,

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Speaker 3: and renters are really bearing the brunt of this. They

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Speaker 3: have to bear the brunt of like unlimited rent increases,

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Speaker 3: no grounds, evictions. We have very poor renters rights and

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Speaker 3: protections here in the territory. So I just want to

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Speaker 3: see that improved. I've been speaking to a lot of

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Speaker 3: my constituents who are renters who are really struggling. So

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Speaker 3: I've popped up emotion for a bunch of things too.

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Speaker 3: Hopefully the government can look at and we can see

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Speaker 3: how can we improve life for renters in the territory.

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Speaker 2: Anything in particular that we should be aware of, because

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Speaker 2: I know that some that are home owners right now

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Speaker 2: might also be listening, or property owners that might be going.

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Speaker 1: We'll hang on a set.

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Speaker 2: Is this going to mean that I've got less rights

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Speaker 2: in terms of if I've got a you know, not

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Speaker 2: a very good tenant.

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Speaker 3: I mean, there are already lots of rights for landlords

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Speaker 3: and people who are into property. It's also a larger

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Speaker 3: question right that we have to be asking ourselves in

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Speaker 3: terms of is property just there for wealthy people to

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Speaker 3: get wealthier or is it part of a human right

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Speaker 3: for people to have access to secure affordable housing. And

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Speaker 3: so the things that we are looking at that we

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Speaker 3: could do is, for example, introducing a rent freeze for

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Speaker 3: two years. You could limit rent increases to two percent

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Speaker 3: every two years after a freeze.

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Speaker 4: We also need an independent bond board.

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Speaker 3: So right now, so other jurisdictions have independent bond boards

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Speaker 3: they hold it's an independent body here the landlords or

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Speaker 3: the agents holds a bond, which creates quite a difficult

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Speaker 3: situation for people trying to get their bonds back, and

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Speaker 3: it's just kind of messy. It wastes a lot of time.

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Speaker 3: In ntact, if we had an independent board, a lot

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Speaker 3: simpler fair everyone.

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Speaker 1: So how would that independent board sort of work.

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Speaker 3: Well, we can look at the different models into state,

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Speaker 3: but it's just basically someone who's independent of the two

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Speaker 3: parties to hold that to hold that bond.

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Speaker 4: And because you know the effects.

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Speaker 3: Of this are when someone's struggling to get their bond back,

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Speaker 3: they might have done everything right, but unfortunately it's with

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Speaker 3: the landlord or the agent, and whatever reason they're not

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Speaker 3: getting it back, they can't then move on to the

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Speaker 3: next property. They need that bond back to be able

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Speaker 3: to move to the next property. And so having an

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Speaker 3: independent group to hold it and just release it again

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Speaker 3: just makes thing simple, and it also helps us not

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Speaker 3: get overburned with anti cat cases that people trying to

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Speaker 3: battle together there.

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Speaker 2: How would some of those other protections potentially work, I

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Speaker 2: suppose in a practical sense.

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Speaker 3: Oh, in terms of the rent freeze, Yeah, so this

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Speaker 3: is something that the Greens in other states as well

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Speaker 3: have been trying to put on the table, the fact

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Speaker 3: that we have unlimited rent increases and it's really unfair

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Speaker 3: on renters that if we put a rent freeze for

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Speaker 3: two years, it just I mean, landlords are still get

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Speaker 3: they're still people are still paying their rents.

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I suppose.

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Speaker 2: I look at it though, as somebody who has got

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Speaker 2: an investment property, and I'm like, well, you know, I'm

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Speaker 2: paying through my eyeballs in interest rates at the moment,

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Speaker 2: you know, the cost of everything's going up. I'm not

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Speaker 2: putting up you know, significant rent increases. But sometimes they're

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Speaker 2: actually required to be able to hang on to the

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Speaker 2: property as well.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, look, and.

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Speaker 3: I'm sure there are landlords that are doing the right thing.

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Speaker 3: But I mean I've spoken to people. I spoke to

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Speaker 3: someone on the doors when I was door knocking. They

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Speaker 3: just had a baby, and they got like a two

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Speaker 3: weeks notice because supposedly landa was going to move back in,

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Speaker 3: they have to move out and then they see the

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Speaker 3: properties put back on the market for double the rent.

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Speaker 3: So that kind of stuff is happening all the time,

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Speaker 3: and that's what we need to put some safeguards in

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Speaker 3: to protect people.

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Speaker 1: So we're too with that motion.

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Speaker 2: Now obviously you've put it on the you've put it

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Speaker 2: on the list or whatever, so next parliamentary sittings.

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Speaker 3: No, it we a bit further down the list because

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Speaker 3: kind of like first investigatress. Yeah, and so someone's gonna

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Speaker 3: be hard to estimate, I'd say a bit further down

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Speaker 3: in the year.

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Speaker 1: All right.

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Speaker 2: One of the other things that you've raised concerns around

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Speaker 2: is gambling. Now, the introduction of some gambling restrictions, is

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Speaker 2: that what you're potentially looking at.

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Speaker 3: Oh, absolutely, we really need to reform the gambling industry

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Speaker 3: here in the territory. We know it does matterif harm

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Speaker 3: to our community for example, you know Pokey's, they're embedded

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Speaker 3: in our community, and we know that Pokey's in particular

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Speaker 3: really actually target the most vulnerable in our community. They're

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Speaker 3: the people who can least afford to be losing the money.

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Speaker 3: And Pokey's are something that are designed. They are designed

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Speaker 3: by very sophisticated people with technology that is designed to

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Speaker 3: get the most out of people's wallets. So I would

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Speaker 3: like to see some pretty simple things implemented, actually, things

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Speaker 3: like a pre commitment system to venues with Pokey so

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Speaker 3: people can gives a bit of power back to them.

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Speaker 3: All right, when I walk in, I'm only going to

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Speaker 3: commit to this much. I can't spend any more.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, right, so you do that before you enter the door.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, there's different ways you can do that. There's

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Speaker 3: also for example, they're call it the load up limits,

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Speaker 3: so how much you can put it each time? Our

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Speaker 3: load up limit here in the territory is like ten

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Speaker 3: times out of other states. So we could just put

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Speaker 3: a limit of one hundred dollars at a time, like

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Speaker 3: that's the max you can put in a time.

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Speaker 2: Well, how do we differ from other states? And can

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Speaker 2: we look at what they do in some of those

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Speaker 2: other locations potentially.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, this is a I mean the downside to

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Speaker 3: some things in the territories, we're lagging in some regard

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Speaker 3: in terms of regular but then the flip side of

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Speaker 3: that is we've got examples into.

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Speaker 4: State we can look at, so like the load up limit,

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Speaker 4: let's just reduce that. And you're just trying to give

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Speaker 4: a bit more power back.

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Speaker 3: To people who may be struggling with an addiction with gambling.

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Speaker 2: Kat I want to also ask you about a topic

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Speaker 2: that's had a lot of people really upset over the

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Speaker 2: last week or so, and that is, indeed the closure

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Speaker 2: of the well you know it's happening, the closure of

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Speaker 2: the maternity ward at the Darwin Private Hospital. I know,

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Speaker 2: the likes of yourself also, Selena Rubo, you know you

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Speaker 2: guys are moms of littlies. A lot of people feeling

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Speaker 2: really upset that this diminishes the choices for Northern Territory women.

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Speaker 2: What was your take on it when you learned what

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Speaker 2: was happening.

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Speaker 3: I just felt so bad the parents who were making

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Speaker 3: those choices because they didn't get enough notice. So the

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Speaker 3: disappointing thing is that the government knew this in September

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Speaker 3: that this was probably going to happen, and they did

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Speaker 3: not reach out to families to let them prepare. And

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Speaker 3: when you're pregnant at making, I mean, I've given birth

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Speaker 3: at both the public and the private actually, and we

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Speaker 3: have the most wonderful healthcare staff here and just like

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Speaker 3: and just those parents that are having to make those

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Speaker 3: choices now, what they're going to do would be terrible.

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Speaker 3: And I think this is a real wake up call

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Speaker 3: for us in that the private system is that viable.

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Speaker 3: We need to be funding our public system so everyone

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Speaker 3: knows that they can access that and that we can

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Speaker 3: support the entire community.

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Speaker 1: Do you reckon that.

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Speaker 2: There could be I mean, I don't know what more

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Speaker 2: can kind of be done in this space, and I

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Speaker 2: know that the government's obviously come out with their other

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Speaker 2: two options in terms of being able to go home

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Speaker 2: earlier and also go into a hotel if that's what

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Speaker 2: you need. But I mean, the fact is that if

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Speaker 2: you have any additional needs when your baby is born,

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Speaker 2: if there's any concerns that kind of thing, you're not

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Speaker 2: really in a situation where you can do either of

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Speaker 2: those things. It is going to cause a lot of

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Speaker 2: additional austraining you would think on the public health system. Look,

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Speaker 2: do you think there's anything more that could be done?

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Speaker 3: Well, what should have been It should have been done

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Speaker 3: back in September when the Health Minister found out about this.

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Speaker 3: Why were they not going, Okay, contingency plan, what are

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Speaker 3: we going to do and to support the public system

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Speaker 3: to help these patients that are eventually going to be there.

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Speaker 3: So that's just just a massive failure I think on

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Speaker 3: path those.

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Speaker 2: Point, we didn't know that they realized in September. I

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Speaker 2: thought they'd come out like I thought that literally they

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Speaker 2: were telling us that they had that confirmation just a

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Speaker 2: couple of weeks ago.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I saw the Health Ministry and I think it

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Speaker 3: was an ABC article say that they were aware of this.

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Speaker 4: Being a possibility in September.

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Speaker 2: Well, it does explain why they were able to come

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Speaker 2: out very quickly after with those other options though. So

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Speaker 2: I guess that's a good thing in terms of that

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Speaker 2: bit of you know, moving on your feet. But but

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Speaker 2: it does go back to the concerns I reckon that

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Speaker 2: we've gotten the NT at the moment with the population

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Speaker 2: not growing and you know, needing to get things ticking along.

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Speaker 2: I know that the COLP has been critical of yourself

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Speaker 2: and also of the opposition in terms of, you know,

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Speaker 2: some of the other legislation that they're pushing for with

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Speaker 2: the Territory Coordinator and stuff like that, in terms of

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Speaker 2: trying to get things moving to increase the population.

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Speaker 1: I mean, what do you make of that argument?

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean, I think the thing with the private

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Speaker 3: health is not so much. It's that the population of

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Speaker 3: burs at the private is not increasing, and it's not

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Speaker 3: that they're not increasing at our public hospitals.

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Speaker 4: And that's because I mean a range of things.

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Speaker 3: I'm guessing the cost of living people can't afford private

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Speaker 3: health anymore. So really this is about like, these are

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Speaker 3: essentially businesses that are there to make money, so should

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Speaker 3: we be having you know, this is also one of

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Speaker 3: those larger questions, right is public health? Is our healthcare

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Speaker 3: best placed in a business model that needs to make money,

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Speaker 3: because then things like this happen, they can't make the

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Speaker 3: money and then they close.

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Speaker 2: Hey, Kat, before I let you go, I know that

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Speaker 2: you have spoken certainly towards the end of last year

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Speaker 2: about the need to get things moving around the voluntary

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Speaker 2: assisted dying.

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Speaker 1: Where are we at with that?

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Speaker 2: Is it going to be like from your perspective, because

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Speaker 2: I know there's been yourself and Justine Davis and others

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Speaker 2: who really want to see this moving. The COLP had

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Speaker 2: said that it's not sort of top of mind for

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Speaker 2: them at the moment, and we're too next.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so thanks for bringing up Katie. I actually was

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Speaker 3: just in a meeting just yesterday with so we were

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Speaker 3: talking about this issue. So I know it is something

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Speaker 3: that a lot of people care deeply about. So we

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Speaker 3: have a motion that Justine put up in the Assembly

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Speaker 3: that will be coming up soon, possibly at the next sittings.

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Speaker 3: We are also looking at options. Can we introduce a

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Speaker 3: private member's bill and us put that bill on the table?

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Speaker 4: Is that possible?

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Speaker 3: We're looking at all options at the moment because I

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Speaker 3: know that the colps said that it's not a priority

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Speaker 3: for them, which is incredibly disappointing seeing that between seventy

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Speaker 3: five percent and eighty five percent of territories actually support

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Speaker 3: it and want it to DOE.

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Speaker 1: So that private members bill? Could that happen? What do

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Speaker 1: you know what the process is with that?

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Speaker 3: Look, I mean, obviously I'm still kind of new to

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Speaker 3: this and this is yes, I mean, and so I

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Speaker 3: know private members can.

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Speaker 4: Put across bills.

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Speaker 3: The thing is, it takes a lot of work to

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Speaker 3: actually draft the legislation, which is why the government usually

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Speaker 3: does it a lot of time and resources and money.

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Speaker 3: So we would hope that the government would listen to

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Speaker 3: the community and draft the legislation. But if they're not

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Speaker 3: going to do it, we're still determined to look at

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Speaker 3: what options we have and if that takes, if we

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Speaker 3: can do a govern member's bill, we want to try,

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Speaker 3: all right, well.

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Speaker 1: We'll keep in contact on that.

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Speaker 2: I really appreciate you coming in this morning and having

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Speaker 2: a chat to us about all of those things that

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Speaker 2: you have put on the agenda. Thank you very much

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Speaker 2: for your time.

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Speaker 1: Much thank you