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Speaker 1: But joining me in the studio right now is the

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Speaker 1: opposition leader the Colps, Leah fanocchi Aro. Good morning to you,

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Speaker 1: Good morning Katie, and to your lovely listeners out there.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much for your time this morning. Now, Leah,

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Speaker 1: we know that last week, obviously the government changed this

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Speaker 1: roadmap when the border is open on December twenty. As

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Speaker 1: we've extensively covered here on the show, these changes are

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Speaker 1: debilitating for many in the tourism sector, as well as

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Speaker 1: hospitality and essential workers and indeed boarding school students trying

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Speaker 1: to get home to their families. Leah, what are Territorians

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Speaker 1: telling you at the moment about these changes.

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Speaker 2: It's a total mess, Katie. People are very, very confused

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Speaker 2: and very disappointed. Of course, for a number of weeks

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Speaker 2: the Gunner government had been building up people's hopes and

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Speaker 2: expectations around the December twenty milestone. I was at Carroll's

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Speaker 2: by candle line and watched the Chief Minister, you know,

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Speaker 2: profess to the crowd how wonderful that was going to be.

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Speaker 2: And then people feel like they've been dealt a really

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Speaker 2: big blow this week. The details of it are just

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Speaker 2: so complex and confusing.

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Speaker 3: It's really unworkable.

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Speaker 2: We've seen every industry just about come out against it,

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Speaker 2: and people. The saddest thing for me, Katie, is when

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Speaker 2: I'm out and about, people are just canceling all their

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Speaker 2: plans left right and center because they just feel like

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Speaker 2: it's too hard, it's too confusing, it's too understand real uncertainty.

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Speaker 1: I think that's got a lot of people really worried.

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Speaker 1: Like I'm getting pulled up about this absolutely everywhere.

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Speaker 3: That I go.

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Speaker 1: What do you think needs to happen though? Do you

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Speaker 1: think that they need to relook at biosecurity zones? Do

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Speaker 1: you think that there needs to be some tourism bubbles established?

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Speaker 3: What needs to happen here?

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Speaker 2: I think whenever happens, it has to be really simple.

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Speaker 2: I think what we've got now is the government on

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Speaker 2: the back foot. They're starting to talk about exemptions for

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Speaker 2: some people and bubbles for this and bits and pieces.

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Speaker 2: I think that's just going to add to the complexity now.

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Speaker 2: Of course, we will support it if it happens, because

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Speaker 2: if that means people can come and visit Lichfield like

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Speaker 2: we were saying, or boarding school students can come home,

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Speaker 2: or nurses and teachers can come back to work.

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Speaker 3: You know, we're not going to be against that.

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Speaker 2: But I think what this has shown is that the

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Speaker 2: practical reality of their plan isn't working, and I'd like

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Speaker 2: to see them go back to the drawing board and

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Speaker 2: really look at a way that we can do this safely.

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Speaker 2: But to me that there's sort of a very simplified

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Speaker 2: system of rules that apply to everyone across the territory.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they are saying that this is all about

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Speaker 1: making sure that we've got measures in place, though to

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Speaker 1: protect those in remote communities. I would assume that you

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Speaker 1: know that you indeed think that they do need to

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Speaker 1: be protected as well, but you know at what cost

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Speaker 1: I guess, to the rest of the Northern Territory population.

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Speaker 2: But people in remote communities want to travel as well,

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Speaker 2: and a lot of remote communities have got extremely high

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Speaker 2: vaccination rates. So it really is a mixed bag depending

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Speaker 2: on where you go. But it's really the fact that

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Speaker 2: the application of these rules have not been looked at practically.

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Speaker 2: So in Catherine, for example, they've literally picked a few

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Speaker 2: streets and it's like, if you live.

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Speaker 3: Within these streets, then you're okay.

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Speaker 2: But if you live outside of those streets, then you're

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Speaker 2: going to have to stay in a hotel.

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Speaker 3: In your own town. That one's quite unbelievable. It's arbitrary,

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Speaker 3: It's really arbitrary.

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Speaker 2: It makes no sense of course people in the entire

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Speaker 2: Barkley region. I mean, if you live in TenneT Creek

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Speaker 2: and have gone to Mount Isa for holidays, you will

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Speaker 2: have to literally drive back past your house and drive

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Speaker 2: another five hundred kilometers to Alice Springs and stay there

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Speaker 2: for two weeks, or another four hundred kilometers up to Castromin.

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Speaker 2: It just doesn't make any sense, and people are just

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Speaker 2: you know, why have we gone from rapid antigen testing

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Speaker 2: to PCR testing And there's a number of broken promises

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Speaker 2: and people just feel deflated by the whole thing.

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Speaker 3: Leah, if you were in charge, what would you be

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Speaker 3: doing today?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so we would not be in this situation in

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Speaker 2: the first place, Katie. But it's about consultation. I think

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Speaker 2: what needs to happen now, And of course we've all

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Speaker 2: heard very loud and clear, but government needs to do

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Speaker 2: a round table with every industry body even well, I mean,

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Speaker 2: how hard is it you grab a get on a

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Speaker 2: team's meeting or a zoom meeting. It could be called

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Speaker 2: in an hour If you want in, you better clear

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Speaker 2: your diary. If you don't, don't win from the sidelines.

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Speaker 2: It's pretty simple. Cooler teams meeting. Have everyone in the room,

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Speaker 2: what are the about, you know, get some clear goals

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Speaker 2: and aims, have the chief Health officer there and not

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Speaker 2: out a plan, roll out for your press conference at

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Speaker 2: one o'clock, and we can all move on with our

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Speaker 2: lives no matter.

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Speaker 3: What they do.

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Speaker 1: Though some people are still going to be upset for sure,

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Speaker 1: for sure, like, really, how do we balance this? How

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Speaker 1: do they realistically balance this? Because I guess it's all

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Speaker 1: fine for us to throw these firing shots from the sidelines,

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Speaker 1: but like, at the end of the day, there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of people that are affected here. And you know,

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Speaker 1: when you talk about boarding school students not being able

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Speaker 1: to come home, when you talk about essential workers not

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Speaker 1: being able to go on holidays, when you talk about

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Speaker 1: people living between Catherine and Tindall having to quarantine and

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Speaker 1: Catherine rather than their home, I mean some of these

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Speaker 1: decisions there needs to be some second thought on it.

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Speaker 2: Does I think it would be much simpler to bring

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Speaker 2: everyone together, look at it across the board and try

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Speaker 2: and find another way where we can obviously, have the

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Speaker 2: right restrictions in place, but have them uniform, have them simple.

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Speaker 2: If things aren't s simple, people won't comply. That's the

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Speaker 2: other problem. If you make it too complicated, people will

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Speaker 2: miss things, and then we're just going to see more

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Speaker 2: trouble than it's worth. The government should have consulted in

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Speaker 2: the first place, but it hasn't. Fine, draw a line

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Speaker 2: in the sand, work out what works and what doesn't,

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Speaker 2: and then and now it's one plan for everyone.

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Speaker 3: Do we need to just go back.

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Speaker 1: To biosecurity zones for those communities that aren't up to

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Speaker 1: ninety percent or eighty percent vaccination? Right?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know that that's necessarily the answer,

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Speaker 2: but it might be part of the picture. Again, you know,

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Speaker 2: we don't have that all important health advice. But what

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Speaker 2: we do know is that when you make rules and

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Speaker 2: expect a society to comply, you have to think through

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Speaker 2: the practicalities. You can't just sit in an office and

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Speaker 2: decide all these arbitrary things and then expect everyone to

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Speaker 2: be able to deal with it, you know, And it's

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Speaker 2: really important that the government do listen. It's not about

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Speaker 2: just wanting to travel for Christmas. This is about getting

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Speaker 2: workers into the territory to support the cattle industry, the

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Speaker 2: farming industry. You know, this is about tea which is

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Speaker 2: not being back in schools in times. This is about

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Speaker 2: the pressure on nurses and staff and ardi h I

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Speaker 2: mean with patient travel and all of these different types

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Speaker 2: of things. I mean, no one is left unscathed by

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Speaker 2: this decision. They've managed to upset everyone. You know, no

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Speaker 2: one is happy. So they need to rework this. There's

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Speaker 2: still time. Just knuckle down, get it done and spit

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Speaker 2: out a good result.

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Speaker 1: Now, Leah, I know that the COLP say, well that

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Speaker 1: you've referred a four point three million dollar contract which

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Speaker 1: was awarded to Ernst and Young Consultancy by nt Health

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Speaker 1: to the Independent Commissioner against Corruption after the Territories Order

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Speaker 1: to General found it was against procurement rules. What rules

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Speaker 1: has this contract broken?

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Speaker 2: So we've been very suspicious about this contract right back

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Speaker 2: from May, Katie. So we asked questions back in May,

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Speaker 2: asking the Health Minister when this secret report would be

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Speaker 2: made public. Of course, it was pitched to territorians to

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Speaker 2: be about a seven hundred thousand dollar report and it

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Speaker 2: was meant to look specifically at our response to COVID

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Speaker 2: back him. In May, we got the ring around by

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Speaker 2: the Minister for Health, of course, saying oh no, this

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Speaker 2: is Cabinet and confidence, you're not going to get your

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Speaker 2: hands on it. And now we've had our Order to General,

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Speaker 2: who is the person who looks at the books of

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Speaker 2: the government, come out and say that some of the

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Speaker 2: forty three procurement rules have not been followed and that

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Speaker 2: that original seven hundred thousand dollars contract has been varied

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Speaker 2: so much four hundred and thirty percent, that it ended

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Speaker 2: up being a four point three million dollar contract.

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Speaker 3: So there's it. Yeah, it's a big difference.

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Speaker 2: We started with one project that costs seven hundred and

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Speaker 2: we ended up paying four point three and the scope

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Speaker 2: of that report ended up being much bigger than was

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Speaker 2: originally intention and just.

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Speaker 1: The CLP here is sort of going, alright, it's blown out.

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Speaker 1: This is the Order to General has actually gone through

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Speaker 1: this and found well that the agency didn't comply with

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Speaker 1: the procurement rules, including forty two of the required criteria.

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Speaker 3: How has this happened? How is this allowed to happen?

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Speaker 2: Well, it's not allowed to happen, and it's good that

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Speaker 2: we have in Order to General to provide that level

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Speaker 2: of scrutiny. Of course, like I said, we've been asking

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Speaker 2: questions about it since May and now the government are

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Speaker 2: exposed on this issue, but still haven't come forward with

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Speaker 2: any explanation as to why that was allowed to happen.

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Speaker 2: We still don't know if and when the report's going

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Speaker 2: to be made public, why it went from seven hundred

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars to four point three million dollars, and why

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Speaker 2: the rules of procurement weren't.

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Speaker 1: Followed right from the outset. What exactly was this consultancy

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Speaker 1: firm hired to do it?

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Speaker 2: So my understanding was originally it was hired to review

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Speaker 2: our response to COVID right in those early days. So

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Speaker 2: going back to last year, it's since blown out to

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Speaker 2: have covered.

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Speaker 3: I don't know a number of things. Of course we

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Speaker 3: don't have.

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Speaker 2: It's a secret report, so no one's got it, but

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Speaker 2: certainly Territorians deserve to know what's what it's about. I mean,

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Speaker 2: if it's gone into looking at how our health system's working, well,

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Speaker 2: I'd love to see it because we've had four yellows

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Speaker 2: this year. Of course, we've got nurses working extraordinary amounts

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Speaker 2: of overtime under pressure we've had a failed remote vaccine rollout,

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Speaker 2: So I think Territorians are really keen to see what

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Speaker 2: this assessment of our health system is because certainly it's

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Speaker 2: been suffering under this government.

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Speaker 1: Well we will wait and here I know, like you said,

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Speaker 1: it has now been referred to the ikak leah. Before

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Speaker 1: I let you go, just very quickly, we're about to

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Speaker 1: catch up with K Densely from the CPSU. And we

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Speaker 1: know that Northern Territory public sector workers at Power and

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Speaker 1: Water and also Jacana Energy have both once again voted

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Speaker 1: no to the gunn of government's pay bonus.

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Speaker 3: What does this say?

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Speaker 2: It shows that people want job security, it shows they're

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Speaker 2: not buying the government's bogus bonus.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's just a joke.

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Speaker 2: Government have completely walked away from budget repair and a

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Speaker 2: punishing public servants for that. We've been very clear that

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Speaker 2: people should have real wages growth. We think that cap

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Speaker 2: on one thousand dollars per years of a genuine pay

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Speaker 2: eyes is.

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Speaker 3: Enough.

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Speaker 2: It gives people opportunity for growth in their employment, but

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Speaker 2: also that budget restraint that we need. And instead the

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Speaker 2: government have claimed we've lost four hundred public servants for

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Speaker 2: people who won't get vaccinated, and instead of putting that

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Speaker 2: money back on the dead or doing something more positive

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Speaker 2: with it, like our health system, they've dispersed it or

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Speaker 2: want to disperse it amongst the remaining public servants.

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Speaker 3: And I think public servants are.

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Speaker 2: Turning around as saying, we've had enough of your garbage

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Speaker 2: chief minutes.

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Speaker 3: So this isn't what we want.

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Speaker 1: Well, we'll find out exactly what the public service are

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Speaker 1: saying when we catch up with Kate Densley in a

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Speaker 1: couple of minutes. Lea Fanocchiaro, the opposition leader, good to

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Speaker 1: speak with you. Will we see you Friday.

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Speaker 3: You will see me frid and very excited. Is it

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Speaker 3: our last one? For the last time, I'll.

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Speaker 1: Unfortunately this year, unlike other years where we've been able

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Speaker 1: to sort of go back over issues throughout the year,

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Speaker 1: there's still so many issues flowing this year that.

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Speaker 3: We've got to just well, Robbie, see you Friday. Thank you,