1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,160 Speaker 1: As I've mentioned earlier this morning, we know that Sky 2 00:00:03,320 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: News is reporting that community leaders are demanding urgent action 3 00:00:08,360 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: after a sixteen year old girl was stripped and bashed 4 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 1: by a group of youths on the streets in Alice Springs. 5 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 1: The footage is absolutely appalling now. It ran on Sky 6 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:22,960 Speaker 1: News yesterday. It also ran on nine News Darwin last night. 7 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:26,239 Speaker 1: It's horrifying stuff. Joining us on the line right now 8 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:29,160 Speaker 1: to talk more about this and the issues that continue 9 00:00:29,240 --> 00:00:32,320 Speaker 1: to be experienced in Alice Springs, your br and your 10 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: school principal, Gavin Morris, Good morning to you, Gavin. 11 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 2: Morning Smith. 12 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,560 Speaker 1: Now, Gavin, you said yesterday to Sky News at the 13 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:44,080 Speaker 1: footage was the worst that you'd seen in twenty five 14 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:48,720 Speaker 1: years working as an educator. I mean it was appalling. 15 00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 1: There's no other way to put it. 16 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:55,480 Speaker 2: It is an i'm most shrinking violence. I've worked on 17 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:57,960 Speaker 2: the front line in obrigal communities right across the top 18 00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:00,200 Speaker 2: end in central Australia and it's clearly the word thing 19 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 2: I've ever seen. I do have the I do have 20 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:08,640 Speaker 2: the unblurred version of that footage and it's absolutely well, 21 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:15,240 Speaker 2: it's r rated and it's abhorrent. It's it's Aboriginal traditional 22 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:19,520 Speaker 2: law and the form of payback getting corrupted by gang lands, 23 00:01:19,720 --> 00:01:23,199 Speaker 2: street violence, young people out of control and a tip 24 00:01:23,240 --> 00:01:25,000 Speaker 2: for tat which has been going on now for a 25 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:29,400 Speaker 2: couple of weeks, Katie, in response to the fatal the 26 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 2: fatality that the tragic fatality of the young man two 27 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:35,600 Speaker 2: weeks ago in the stolen car where aid of his 28 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:37,720 Speaker 2: mate sort of climbed over the top of him, left 29 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:39,600 Speaker 2: in the door when they scurried off into the night. 30 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 2: So it's footage that is absolutely it's confronting in every 31 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:46,160 Speaker 2: way and it's the worst thing I've seen in twenty. 32 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: Five Some of these some of these girls are they 33 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:51,279 Speaker 1: from your school? 34 00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:55,320 Speaker 2: They are we know the identity of some of the 35 00:01:55,360 --> 00:01:57,800 Speaker 2: girls and they are from you pretty school. And we're 36 00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:03,320 Speaker 2: absolutely devastated, absolutely devastated our wrap around support mechanisms. We 37 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:05,520 Speaker 2: should be working with these girls for so long and 38 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:08,280 Speaker 2: keeping them out of palm's way and keeping them out 39 00:02:08,280 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 2: of their judicial system. It feels like that, you know, 40 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 2: that's just been thrown right back in our faces, dealing 41 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 2: with staff who are absolutely guarded. So some of those 42 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 2: kids are from your friend school. I will take responsibility 43 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 2: for that as you know, Katie'll be only prague and 44 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 2: numerous times, you know, I do advocate for a trauma 45 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 2: and form practice where a nonpumunitive approach to it to education, 46 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 2: which I think why the numbers that your prenious school 47 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 2: have grown so much because the kids feel safe here. 48 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 2: But for those girls involved with that the other night, 49 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 2: that's gone too far and you know the book needs 50 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:45,880 Speaker 2: to be thrown at that. That's just way beyond what 51 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:47,359 Speaker 2: society norms allow. 52 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 1: I mean, like, what are your educators? You work so 53 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:55,320 Speaker 1: closely with the indigenous community and with the community there, 54 00:02:55,360 --> 00:02:57,839 Speaker 1: Like what are people saying to you this morning? Gave 55 00:02:58,040 --> 00:03:01,840 Speaker 1: as this, Like as this footage goes around the. 56 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:07,760 Speaker 2: Nation, there's an absolute feeling of despair and helplessness because 57 00:03:07,800 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 2: we've taken you an example of those girls. You know, 58 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 2: some of those girls with five or six percent attenders 59 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 2: this time last year and now there are eighty plus percent. 60 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:21,080 Speaker 2: You know, we're carrying our load, and we'll take responsibility 61 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 2: for the stuff that we're doing well in the stuff 62 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 2: that we need to improve on. But there's just despair 63 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 2: kating in terms of you know, what, what are the 64 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 2: other services providing? What are you know, what's happening when 65 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 2: these kids go home, and who's responsible for providing the 66 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 2: service delivery to ensure that these girls in this instance, 67 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:43,840 Speaker 2: or any any child or family in need in crisis 68 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:46,560 Speaker 2: gets a support that they need. And Katie, we know 69 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:49,040 Speaker 2: that there's hundreds of mellions of dollars getting pumped into 70 00:03:49,160 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 2: Central Australia to deal with these issues. And enough is enough. 71 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:56,200 Speaker 2: We need we need more than an audit in terms 72 00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:58,520 Speaker 2: of who's doing right. There needs to be a Royal 73 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:01,800 Speaker 2: commission into this, that the standard of the town camps. 74 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 2: You know, these girls that they don't go home. These 75 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 2: houses aren't safe, they aren't up to Australian standards in 76 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 2: tween twenty four. They're just the concentration sites of abject 77 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 2: generational poverty and as a result of a whole range 78 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 2: of stuff not happening, not occurring, and things not being 79 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:30,080 Speaker 2: delivered in community, they're being compounded and now the symptoms 80 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:33,159 Speaker 2: of that are flowing in the streets and the footage 81 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 2: we saw the other day is just an extraordinary example 82 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 2: of how wrong it's gone in Central Australia. 83 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 1: Devin, you know we have heard over the last let's 84 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:48,280 Speaker 1: say year and a half of an extraordinary amount of 85 00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:52,840 Speaker 1: money earmarked for Central Australia. You know, we know that 86 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: the federal government's announced bucket loads of money. I mean, 87 00:04:57,200 --> 00:04:59,039 Speaker 1: is it flowing in and by the sounds of it 88 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 1: from what you're saying, do you think there needs to 89 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:05,560 Speaker 1: be a royal commission because it's not actually being effective 90 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: or impacting in the way that it should be. 91 00:05:09,960 --> 00:05:12,320 Speaker 2: Exactly, there needs to be a royal commission. You can't 92 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:15,000 Speaker 2: you can't see that footage from these goals the other night. 93 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 2: Know that there's hundreds of meanings that dollars coming into 94 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:22,000 Speaker 2: two community to work with those families in these communities 95 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:26,280 Speaker 2: and accept those things happening. So there are hundreds of 96 00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 2: millions of dollars, we know that that's happening. Organizations are 97 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:31,200 Speaker 2: quick to stick their hand up when the money is 98 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,000 Speaker 2: coming into other screens. But it's a bit of a 99 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 2: different story when the robber hits the road in terms 100 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 2: of service delivery, and Katie, I'm not suggesting for a 101 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,760 Speaker 2: moment this isn't a very complex issue. It's very difficult 102 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:45,200 Speaker 2: to work on the front line in the most one 103 00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:49,599 Speaker 2: of the most complex environments in Australia. But if you're 104 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,400 Speaker 2: charged with the responsibility of being here, and you're an 105 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 2: organization who attracts large buckets of money, you need to 106 00:05:56,120 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 2: be had accountable to ensure there's outcomes in community. And 107 00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 2: if you're getting the money and it's now outcomes, well 108 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 2: then we need an honest conversation. And that's where I 109 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:08,719 Speaker 2: think we're at now that the hard conversations need to occur. 110 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:12,600 Speaker 2: They're not nice, but they're right. And the hard conversations 111 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:15,599 Speaker 2: are your organizations attract one hundreds of millions of dollars, 112 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:18,479 Speaker 2: there's no way outcomes on the ground. We need to 113 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,800 Speaker 2: move you on. And until those conversations happen, until the 114 00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:25,239 Speaker 2: investigation into where the money comes in, where the money 115 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 2: goes in, the outcomes that we see tangibly in the 116 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 2: community on the ground. Until that happens, this escalation that 117 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:38,600 Speaker 2: we're seeing at the moment around Payback and around this 118 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:43,159 Speaker 2: game land Street type violence will continue, and it's compounding 119 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:47,839 Speaker 2: and it's escalating, and certainly, you know, I'm absolutely not 120 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:50,720 Speaker 2: trying to sensationalize it, and I understand that, you know, 121 00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:54,480 Speaker 2: shining the lights on these events goes that in some way. 122 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:57,720 Speaker 2: But we're in a truth telling We need to tell 123 00:06:57,760 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 2: our truth and this is what it actually looks like, 124 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:02,599 Speaker 2: and then come up with the solutions to address it 125 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:06,240 Speaker 2: and to respond to it. And the first response I 126 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 2: believe needs to happen is an audit at the very 127 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:13,680 Speaker 2: least and a raw commission at the very most into 128 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:17,560 Speaker 2: who's responsible for what in Central Australia, where's the money 129 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 2: going and where's the bloody outcomes on the ground in community. 130 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:23,400 Speaker 1: I agree with you. I think it has reached the 131 00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:27,000 Speaker 1: point now where there is so much money flowing into 132 00:07:27,040 --> 00:07:31,880 Speaker 1: Central Australia, I cannot understand why there's not some outcomes. 133 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:35,480 Speaker 1: I mean, Gavin, are you, like, are you concerned that 134 00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:38,760 Speaker 1: by being so honest that by rocking the boat to 135 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: some degree here and talking about this so openly and 136 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 1: honestly you know that like that the school might not 137 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 1: get that funding for the boarding school law? Or where 138 00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 1: are you at with that? Are you worried? Like, are 139 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: you worried about that? In any way? 140 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:55,720 Speaker 2: Oh, I'm worried about that footage, KT, I'm worried about 141 00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 2: you know, That's not the only piece of footage that 142 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 2: I've got carriage of. You know, there's other stuff that's 143 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 2: come out, you know, with a whole range of anti 144 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,240 Speaker 2: social behavior and youth crime. And you know, with our 145 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 2: community being in the crisis that it's in and when 146 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 2: I make comments as I do, it's from a strength 147 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 2: based perspective with the kids at heart. That's the starting 148 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 2: point and that's the endpoint. It's for the kids. I'm 149 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 2: here for the kids. But absolutely when I make comments 150 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:27,960 Speaker 2: and come into your program and others like it, it 151 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 2: does come at a personal and professional risk to me. 152 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,280 Speaker 2: But that's a load that I'm willing to carry to 153 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 2: ensure that we get a truth telling to help these 154 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 2: kids out, to get to make sure that we understand 155 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:43,559 Speaker 2: what's actually occurring, the challenges that are getting faced by 156 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 2: service providers, by community, by families in Central Australia and 157 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:51,120 Speaker 2: our springs, so then we can come up with a 158 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,680 Speaker 2: real response to change the conversation. Otherwise what's going to 159 00:08:54,679 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 2: happen is we're just going to have a continuation of 160 00:08:56,280 --> 00:09:00,240 Speaker 2: people walking past the problem or accepting it. Where and 161 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:03,360 Speaker 2: absolutely no other part of Australia would we be accepting 162 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:08,319 Speaker 2: keep the runs or keeps dying and stolen cars and 163 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 2: climbing over people dying in patient a seat. And then 164 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 2: you know that's what he's with the girls the other night. 165 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,720 Speaker 2: In no other part of Australia is that even close 166 00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 2: to acceptable, and that shouldn't be the case here, That 167 00:09:19,520 --> 00:09:21,600 Speaker 2: shouldn't be normalized in Central Australia. 168 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:23,600 Speaker 1: I agree with you. I agree with you. You know, 169 00:09:23,679 --> 00:09:28,480 Speaker 1: what we've seen is utterly appalling and unfortunately, you know, 170 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:30,959 Speaker 1: from an outsider perspective, it does not seem to be 171 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:34,080 Speaker 1: getting any better. And I do think at the very least, 172 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: like you've said, there needs to be an audit into 173 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:41,480 Speaker 1: these different organization, into the millions of dollars being invested 174 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:45,240 Speaker 1: into Central Australia that is meant to be delivering outcomes 175 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:48,640 Speaker 1: and is meant to be helping on the ground, and 176 00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:51,240 Speaker 1: at this point in time it does not seem to 177 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: be helping in any way. 178 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 2: No, it doesn't. I'm really keen to find out what's 179 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 2: happened to the Court of the d which was announced 180 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:03,320 Speaker 2: at the start of last year. I know forty men 181 00:10:03,360 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 2: of that was carved off the forty six schools in 182 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:08,960 Speaker 2: Central Australia on country learning, and that's been spent in 183 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 2: different ways. But you know, you know, I'm on the ground, 184 00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:15,319 Speaker 2: I'm on the front line, and I'm willing to stand 185 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:17,959 Speaker 2: up on behalf and advocate for the kids and their 186 00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 2: families in Central Australia. I understand the complexities of working here, 187 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 2: and I understand the complexities of living here, and I 188 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 2: see every day the barriers that our families face in 189 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 2: terms of getting access to basic services like safe and 190 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:36,960 Speaker 2: fable accommodation, food security, financial security. We've been able to 191 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 2: get access to education and health and other services. You know, 192 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:43,920 Speaker 2: it's a very strong and resilient community in Central Australia. 193 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:47,079 Speaker 2: But where is the money going and where's the outcomes? 194 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 2: Where can we see the measurable outcomes. That's that's attracting 195 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:55,680 Speaker 2: huge buckets of funding. And if we can't see the 196 00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:59,559 Speaker 2: outcomes or if they're not occurring, then tough conversations need 197 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 2: to occur and they need to start a caring from today. 198 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:05,480 Speaker 2: And Katie, you brought up the funding for the boarding school, 199 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:08,199 Speaker 2: and it's that's the same way if eight or ten 200 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:10,080 Speaker 2: or twelve million dollars gets pumped in the your perna 201 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:13,120 Speaker 2: or a boarding school, their expectations should be on your 202 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:16,439 Speaker 2: paringa to be had accountable to ensure that the boarding 203 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:20,080 Speaker 2: school's operational and there's measurable outcomes in the community as 204 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:20,760 Speaker 2: the results of. 205 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 1: That absolutely not. 206 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,200 Speaker 2: Then we need to be hod accountable just like everyone 207 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:27,720 Speaker 2: else should be. Yeah, that's the conversation that needs to 208 00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:28,680 Speaker 2: be happening from today. 209 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 1: Well, doctor Gavin Morris, you're bring your school principal and 210 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:36,760 Speaker 1: also counselor. I really appreciate your time. As always, we'll 211 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: stay in contact with you. Let's wait and see whether 212 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 1: we get any movement from the Northern Territory or federal 213 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:46,000 Speaker 1: government around some kind of order or a Royal commission 214 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:48,720 Speaker 1: into these services being delivered into central Australia. 215 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:52,440 Speaker 2: Time will tell. Thanks so much, Katie Almus appreciate it. 216 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:53,319 Speaker 2: Goodbyeing for you listening. 217 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:54,240 Speaker 1: Thanks Gavin. See