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Speaker 1: Parliament does indeed kick off again today. So I know

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Speaker 1: we don't have a huge amount of time with the

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Speaker 1: Chief Minister, but we know that yesterday changes in parliament

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Speaker 1: to the IKAK with the NTS corruption watchdogs set to

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Speaker 1: soon be prevented from investigating minor misconduct, while journalist shield

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Speaker 1: laws have been strengthened. Not everybody agreed with what was

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Speaker 1: going on. Two MLAs did try to delay the new laws,

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Speaker 1: claiming that the Independent Commissioner Against Corruptions Office is currently

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Speaker 1: investigating some labor ministers and that changes would water down

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Speaker 1: the iqaq's powers. Now, the Independent member farrahlu and Robin

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Speaker 1: Lamley raise concerns before Parliament that some ministers may have

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Speaker 1: a conflict of interest in this matter. Now the Chief Minister,

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Speaker 1: Natasha Files joins me on the line. Good morning to

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Speaker 1: your Chief Minister.

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Speaker 2: Good morning Katie, Good morning listeners, and I hope you're

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Speaker 2: feeling better.

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Speaker 3: Thank you. Now why were these changes needed to the

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Speaker 3: i CACK.

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Speaker 2: So the ICAC has been in place for a few

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Speaker 2: years here in the territory and as good practice with

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Speaker 2: any legislation, it's important to review its function. We had

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Speaker 2: a discussion paper, an exposure draft bill, and we then

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Speaker 2: made amendments to the Act around how it operates in

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Speaker 2: the territory.

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Speaker 1: But so Robin Lanley's raised concerns and said that in

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Speaker 1: the House we have people that are being no doubt

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Speaker 1: investigated by the i caact ICAC, that should recuse themselves,

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Speaker 1: that should declare that they've got a conflict of interest.

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Speaker 1: Are there any MLAs currently being investigated by the IKAC

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Speaker 1: and would that mean that there is a.

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Speaker 2: Conflict, Okatie, when you're under investigation or you're involved in

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Speaker 2: an ICAC matter, you I serve noticed that you cannot

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Speaker 2: discuss that. But what I can say this bill there

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Speaker 2: was no conflict with any minister's government members or I

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Speaker 2: believe anyone in the Parliament. The bill was, as I said,

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Speaker 2: a discussion paper, an exposure draft, and it clarifies the

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Speaker 2: intention for the IKAC to investigate the matters of most

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Speaker 2: serious and systemic improper conduct and corruption. But Katie, to

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Speaker 2: give you an example of the changes just quickly, what

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Speaker 2: we clarified yesterday was that if you are involved in

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Speaker 2: an ICAC matter, but you are a low level you

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Speaker 2: are not found of any finding. You don't need to

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Speaker 2: be named unless you're an MLA, so we strengthen if

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Speaker 2: you're a member of the Legislative Assembly, I believe you

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Speaker 2: should have a higher level of scrutiny. But we've seen

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Speaker 2: reports where low levels and it's just inappropriate behavior has

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Speaker 2: seen people named and they've got that tarnish if you

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Speaker 2: google their name forever. So that's what the act change.

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Speaker 1: I get that, Like, I understand what you're saying with that,

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Speaker 1: and I think that that is fair enough.

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Speaker 3: But the point that I understand.

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Speaker 1: Robin Lamley was trying to make is that if there

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Speaker 1: are conflicts of interest or are there conflicts of interest,

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Speaker 1: because essentially, if there was a member in the House

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Speaker 1: yesterday that could be involved in an investigation, but then

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Speaker 1: is voting on changes to do with the IKAK, is

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Speaker 1: that appropriate?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, there is no conflicts of interest in the

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Speaker 2: legislative changes that were made yesterday, and if there is,

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Speaker 2: if there are any matters underway, and there may be

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Speaker 2: matters investigating other members of the House, Katie, But as

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Speaker 2: I said, this legislation did not create a conflict. I

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Speaker 2: believe for any member of the Parliament yesterday.

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Speaker 1: Are the icac's powers being watered down with these changes?

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Speaker 2: No Katie, I believe this strengthens and I just gave

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Speaker 2: you one example where an MLA is held to a

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Speaker 2: high level of accountability, but fix up in terms of

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Speaker 2: that aspect around the people that are not found of

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Speaker 2: corruption or misconduct, but to get caught up in this.

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Speaker 2: We also, Katie, when someone has given a notice to

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Speaker 2: appear to the ikak, the legislation now requires the IQACK

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Speaker 2: could let that person know what it's about. We have

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Speaker 2: had feedback from submissions of people that went through the

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Speaker 2: ARCAC process where it caused great stress because they didn't

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Speaker 2: know what raw brush elements they were being asked to

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Speaker 2: go to the ikat for. So, as I said, the

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Speaker 2: act has been in place for a number of years,

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Speaker 2: it's good governance to review it. But I don't believe

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Speaker 2: it watered down any aspect.

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Speaker 1: I mean, from what I can gather, the concern here

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Speaker 1: is that essentially we've got politicians determining how exactly the

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Speaker 1: aykak is going to operate, when in actual fact, there

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Speaker 1: may be times when the Aykak is going to need

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Speaker 1: to investigate matters that do pertain to those politicians. So

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Speaker 1: can you see how people might feel as though those

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Speaker 1: lines are a bit blurred.

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Speaker 2: So it was the Northern Charactor of Parliament that passed

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Speaker 2: the legislation initially to establish an independent Commissioner against corruption.

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Speaker 2: It is appropriate for the Parliament to make amendments to

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Speaker 2: the legislation, but it's based off Red Shanahan did a review,

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Speaker 2: a discussion paper, and an exposure draft skill so it's

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Speaker 2: not like it's being done these changes behind closed doors.

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Speaker 2: They've been very open in what the changes are strengthening.

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Speaker 2: For example, as you mentioned journalist protections, if they are

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Speaker 2: providing information around individuals.

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Speaker 1: All right, I'm going to have to move along because

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Speaker 1: there is quite a bit that I want to cover

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Speaker 1: this morning, and I want.

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Speaker 3: To talk alcohol.

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Speaker 1: Last week you tabled a three year review into the

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Speaker 1: Liquor Act in Parliament and said that you intend to

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Speaker 1: introduce legislation in the November sittings.

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Speaker 3: Now a very quick listener question.

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Speaker 1: First, could these proposed changes mean that someone done for

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Speaker 1: low range drink driving would end up on the band

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Speaker 1: drinkers Register?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, there was a report handed into looking at

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Speaker 2: the legislation that was introduced in twenty nineteen. The review

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Speaker 2: there was fifty five recommendations. We will now work with agencies,

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Speaker 2: but particularly police, around which recommendations will target problem drink is.

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Speaker 2: In terms of that actual recommendation for someone on a

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Speaker 2: low live, low level drink driving range absolutely unacceptable. But

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Speaker 2: as I said, I will work with police around what

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Speaker 2: they think will be effective, and I think that there

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Speaker 2: has been early indication from police that that is not

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Speaker 2: a priority. There's other priority areas will tackle alcohol.

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Speaker 1: Related harm, all right, So a huge actually just to

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Speaker 1: go back to that, So you're ruling that out.

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Speaker 3: If you're a lowlan range drink driver, you're not going

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Speaker 3: to go on the bdr OK.

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Speaker 2: I don't want to make policy on the run, but

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Speaker 2: I don't believe that that recommendation targets the problem drinkers.

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Speaker 2: I do not find it acceptable at all for drink driving.

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Speaker 2: You know that alcohol as a factor in pedestrian and

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Speaker 2: vehicle accident is far too high, But at the same time,

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Speaker 2: for me, I'm not convinced that to priority.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 1: A huge point of contention in recent months has been

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Speaker 1: this two kilometer law when it comes to public drinking.

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Speaker 1: You and your government have been at pains to say

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Speaker 1: that this is still an offense, but the review outlines

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Speaker 1: clear as day that in Section one hundred and thirty

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Speaker 1: one hundred and seventy one two provides that if a

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Speaker 1: person contravenes the provision, the person may be searched under

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Speaker 1: Section two hundred and thirty six of the Liquor Act,

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Speaker 1: and the liquor may be seized and disposed of under

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Speaker 1: Section two hundred and forty three of the Liquor Act.

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Speaker 1: There is no penalty for the contravention of this provision,

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Speaker 1: which aligns with Recommendation seventy nine of the Royal Commission

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Speaker 1: into the Aboriginal Deaths in Custody.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 1: Northern Territory Police Foreign Emergency Service has raised concerns that

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Speaker 1: while they're empowered to conduct searches of persons for possible

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Speaker 1: contraventions of Section one hundred and seventy one, they do

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Speaker 1: not have the correlating power to identify the person that

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Speaker 1: they're searching or seizing alcohol from. Why have you not

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Speaker 1: been honest with territorians about.

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Speaker 2: This, Katie. We've been every bit upfront with Territory.

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Speaker 1: Well you haven't though, because you've been saying that it's

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Speaker 1: you know that it's still an offense. But the reality

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Speaker 1: is all that can happen is that alcohol gets tipped out,

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Speaker 1: So Katie, it.

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Speaker 2: Is not legal. Is not permitted to drink within two kilometers.

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Speaker 2: If someone is drinking within two kilometers, there is a

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Speaker 2: range of steps that police can take. But Katie, in

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Speaker 2: terms of the recommendation around identification and third strengthening police powers,

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Speaker 2: we are very much committed to doing something in that

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Speaker 2: space and it's finding that balance where we target the

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Speaker 2: problem drink is. But we don't inadvertently have someone getting

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Speaker 2: potentially fine or facing offenses for having a beer when

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Speaker 2: they're at a boat ramp, for example. So it is

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Speaker 2: not permitted to drink within two kilometers. It is illegal

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Speaker 2: to drink within two kilometers.

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Speaker 1: But literally all that can happen is that your alcohol

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Speaker 1: gets tipped out. The police can't even search somebody's well,

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Speaker 1: they can't even look at someone's license.

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Speaker 2: So Katie, there they can if someone is committing another offense,

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Speaker 2: they can do that. There is a range of steps

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Speaker 2: they can take. But this is trying to find the balance.

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Speaker 2: But we take on board the feedback around them requesting

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Speaker 2: information around who that individual is and will work towards them.

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Speaker 1: But you really did try to steer the public in

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Speaker 1: another direction here with this rule didn't.

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Speaker 2: You, Katie, I disagree. It is not. It is against

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Speaker 2: the law to drink, and it's not just within two

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Speaker 2: kilometers of a license venue. It's around dal and Ala Springs,

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Speaker 2: Catherine Parmerston, TANet Creek, the waterfront for example, and declared

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Speaker 2: local government areas. There is exceptions, but Katie, it is

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Speaker 2: illegal to drink within two kilometers. We've been very upfront, but.

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Speaker 1: We've been everybody's been saying right from the get go

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Speaker 1: when this discussion started. You know, if it is illegal,

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Speaker 1: why are there still people drinking publicly in those areas?

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Speaker 1: And I mean your own review really demonstrates why.

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, alcohol is a space alcohol policy where we

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Speaker 2: need to continue to be agile. You put in place

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Speaker 2: one measure, you need to do further work on that

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Speaker 2: or work on other measures. And that's what we're doing.

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Speaker 2: We've released this report, we're having a discussion around the recommendations,

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Speaker 2: and we'll keep doing the work in this space. It's

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Speaker 2: not straightforward, all right.

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Speaker 1: So with the recommendation in terms of police officers being

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Speaker 1: able to you know, being able to identify somebody, being

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Speaker 1: able to actually check their license to see whether they

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Speaker 1: have got any warrants, out for their arrest or anything

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Speaker 1: like that. Are you going to move forward and try

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Speaker 1: and introduce some legislation at the next parliamentary sittings?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, I've committed to doing legislation based on this review.

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Speaker 2: I think to me that is a very practical step.

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Speaker 2: We are going to see police change over to a

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Speaker 2: new IT system surpro in the coming weeks, which I

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Speaker 2: think will be excellent in terms of them having real

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Speaker 2: time information out on the beat. So I'll work with

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Speaker 2: the commissioner around how that would be enacted.

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Speaker 3: So is practical?

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Speaker 1: Why didn't you go along with the oppositions legislation last week?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, that bill was introduced some time ago. Like

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Speaker 2: the fuel bill, they just leave them sitting. They brought

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Speaker 2: it back in simply to pay politics. I'm going to

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Speaker 2: work with the Police Commissioner and make sure we have

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Speaker 2: the correct laws in place, that we're not inadvertently doing

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Speaker 2: something that will create loops or gaps further down the process.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the police have actually said though in this report,

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Speaker 1: why they need it to happen. So wouldn't it be

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Speaker 1: a better thing to get it happening sooner rather than later.

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Speaker 2: I just outlined my concerns around their legislation, and I said,

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Speaker 2: when I cabled this report in the House, we would

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Speaker 2: be doing legislation, but rather than tabling the reports and

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Speaker 2: introducing legislation in the same sitting, give it the space

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Speaker 2: of just a few weeks so that we can make

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Speaker 2: sure that we hear feedback from the community, feedback from

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Speaker 2: those t stakeholders before that next trans is introduced.

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Speaker 1: Now, one of the other really interesting changes that I'd

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Speaker 1: noted when reading the document was that as part of

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Speaker 1: this part of the suggestions to address that public drinking

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Speaker 1: and associated anti social behavior, that the Liquor Act be

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Speaker 1: amended to empower the other appointed officers like transit officers,

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Speaker 1: public housing safety offices, park ranges and council ranges, and

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Speaker 1: contracted security officers with the authority to search individuals and

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Speaker 1: seize any unopened container that's believed to contain liquor. Is

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Speaker 1: this something that the government's looking at? I mean, is

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Speaker 1: it really the job of those kind official?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, we need to find that balance between if

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Speaker 2: someone can be trained and have the skills and it's

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Speaker 2: safe for them to do that, would that work. At

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Speaker 2: the same time, I have had conversations and I don't

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Speaker 2: want to burble our Lord Mayor, but the Mayor said

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Speaker 2: he didn't think it would be appropriate for ranges. It's

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Speaker 2: a discussion point. The practicality of implementing it. How would

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Speaker 2: we do that is what's under consideration.

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Speaker 3: All right.

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Speaker 1: So, I mean the counselor said that they feel that

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Speaker 1: it's going to be dangerous situation for their ranges.

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Speaker 3: So wouldn't you just rule that out?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, I've had feed that from some security organizations

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Speaker 2: that they would welcome that ability if their people could

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Speaker 2: be trained up in that. And for example, if someone

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Speaker 2: was doing the wrong thing and they could just tip

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Speaker 2: that alcohol out, would that be appropriate. That's what's being considered.

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Speaker 3: Is that going to be a safe move?

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Speaker 1: I mean, even the police have said that it can

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Speaker 1: be quite a dangerous situation when you're approaching people and

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Speaker 1: tipping out their alcohol.

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Speaker 2: That's what needs to be considered, Katie. We want to

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Speaker 2: make sure that everyone is safe and that we're not

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Speaker 2: inadvertently people in danger. So that is a suggestion, a

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Speaker 2: recommendation from this review. And as I said, there is

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Speaker 2: different points of view in the community. Can we find

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Speaker 2: a way to work that through potentially?

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Speaker 3: All right? Another aspect.

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Speaker 1: At this stage, it doesn't sound as though the government's

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Speaker 1: really going to implement this one, but I'll ask anyway.

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Speaker 1: During COVID nineteen we know that the Director introduced special

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Speaker 1: requirements for the sale of takeaway alcohol, including the requirement

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Speaker 1: for a person to prove that they've got a legitimate

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Speaker 1: residence to consume takeaway alcohol. The same measure has been

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Speaker 1: voluntarily applied in places like Perapp and Fanny Bay with

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Speaker 1: the Liquor accord. At this stage, is it something that

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Speaker 1: the government's going to look at to cater that as you.

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Speaker 2: Just outline, was bought in under an emergency provision. People

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Speaker 2: did feel authority self that was a useful tool. So again,

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Speaker 2: some of the liquor accords have been doing it. They

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Speaker 2: would like to see that across all the outlets to

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Speaker 2: stop that issue. So we're investigating how would it be

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Speaker 2: implemented ahead of any possible changes.

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Speaker 3: So not ruling it out.

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Speaker 2: No, Katie. I think that any tool that stops people

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Speaker 2: that are get caused harm with alcohol we must consider.

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Speaker 2: Remembering the majority of people do the right thing. They

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Speaker 2: just would like to have a drink after work or

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Speaker 2: with friends on the weekend. But it causes so much

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Speaker 2: anti social behavior of crime and harm in our community.

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Speaker 2: We should try and stop it from getting to those

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Speaker 2: that do the wrong thing.

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Speaker 1: All I know you pressed for time because Parliament is

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Speaker 1: getting under way this morning, but there's a couple of

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Speaker 1: things I want to ask you about.

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Speaker 3: Firstly, worker safety.

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Speaker 1: The union representing shop and retail workers has accused your

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Speaker 1: government of breaking its promise of a safety audit at

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Speaker 1: late night outlets which is committed which are committed to

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Speaker 1: of course, in the wake of the bottle shop worker

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Speaker 1: Decklan Lavity's death. Now seven months later, the SDA union's

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Speaker 1: calling for action with an audit only conducted at thirty

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Speaker 1: five businesses, why hasn't this gone further?

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, it has gone further. The audits that did

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Speaker 2: have undertaken. Also, Work Safe Inspectors have undertaken a campaign

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Speaker 2: about providing information and guidance to like late night retail

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Speaker 2: venues and they've carried out eighty nine visits to relevant outlets.

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Speaker 2: So in terms of the audits, as you said, thirty

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Speaker 2: five are being conducted where we've engaged with the business owners.

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Speaker 2: The sea race concerns around some businesses might not be

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Speaker 2: keem to do that work, but the workers feel unsafe,

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Speaker 2: and that's where WorkSafe have also conducted those visits to

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Speaker 2: premises to ensure that they're as safe as possible.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the calls were made after a service station

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Speaker 1: worker lost an eye after being assaulted recently in a

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Speaker 1: terrible attack. Even earlier this week, we saw a female

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Speaker 1: servo worker who was forced to hide under the counter

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Speaker 1: as people threw soft drinks at her before stealing cigarettes

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Speaker 1: and money from the till. Do you can see that

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Speaker 1: you're letting those workers down right now, Katy.

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Speaker 2: That's disgusting behavior. It's unacceptable. How can we, through the

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Speaker 2: design of these shops make it safer, particularly when we

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Speaker 2: know it's higher risk late at night, and that's exactly

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Speaker 2: what those eighty nine visits to relevant retail outlets are about.

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Speaker 1: But how can we actually stop it as well by

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Speaker 1: stopping people engaging in this behavior in the first place, Katie.

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Speaker 2: We work in that space as well with then know

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Speaker 2: that a multitude of factors that lead to it, but

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Speaker 2: we can't just have one solution. And in terms of

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Speaker 2: those late night retail venues, we will continue to work

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Speaker 2: with workers and businesses to make them as safe at.

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Speaker 1: All, right, just a very quick one before we finish up.

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Speaker 1: The Northern Territory Labor Party not holding its annual conference

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Speaker 1: this year. The conference is well in the party's constitution

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Speaker 1: as I understand it, and happens every year bringing together

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Speaker 1: delegates from sub branches and trade unions to debate motions.

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Speaker 1: Let's go on to form your party platform. Why is

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Speaker 1: it not happening so.

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Speaker 2: Katie, they're not held every year. They are held regularly

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Speaker 2: I think by annually. But the party has made a

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Speaker 2: decision to focus on developing policy the work that we've

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Speaker 2: done in government ahead of the twenty twenty four election.

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Speaker 2: But we absolutely talk to our members right across the

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Speaker 2: territory on a regular basis and anyone that's seen to

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Speaker 2: join jump online.

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Speaker 1: Has it been canceled because the left faction don't agree

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Speaker 1: with your moves on fracking and middle arm.

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Speaker 2: No, Katie. I meet with the left faction regularly, engaged

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Speaker 2: with the unions and I don't feel it that reason.

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Speaker 1: So you're not copying flack because of those decisions around fracking.

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Speaker 2: O Katie. I caught flack every day from everybody, but

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Speaker 2: I can assure you it's nothing to do without the

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Speaker 2: reason why the conference. As I said, it's around that

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Speaker 2: policy work. We've done a huge amount in government. There's

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Speaker 2: a huge amount more to do.

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Speaker 1: Is it appropriate, though, to go into an election without

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Speaker 1: having that conference or without hearing the rank and file

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Speaker 1: of the party.

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Speaker 2: So, Katie, we will continue to work with the rank

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Speaker 2: and file. They meet regularly in their branchers and will

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Speaker 2: continue to work with them.

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Speaker 1: I guess there'll be people listening this morning, Chief Minister, thinking,

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Speaker 1: if you're not even prepared to listen to the Labor Party,

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Speaker 1: how can they expect that you're going to listen to them?

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Speaker 2: Katie, There's plenty of structures within the Labor Party that

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Speaker 2: allow for.

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Speaker 1: We seem to have lost the Chief Minister there. I'm

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Speaker 1: not too sure what's going on. Can you hear can

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Speaker 1: you hear me their Chief Minister?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, ky, I do need to head into Parliament.

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Speaker 3: I do apologize so sorry.

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Speaker 1: You were just saying though that there's plenty of platforms

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Speaker 1: or plenty of ways that Territorians can get hurt or

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Speaker 1: just the Labor Party.

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Speaker 2: Everybody, Katie. As you know, I make myself available, whether

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Speaker 2: it's through the media, local community groups, key stakeholder groups,

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Speaker 2: or party members.

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Speaker 1: Chief Minister, thank you for your time this morning. We

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Speaker 1: appreciate you moving the days around.

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Speaker 2: And apologize for that frank connection just on the run

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Speaker 2: to get into Parliament.

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Speaker 3: No worries, thank you,