1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:03,040 Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda 2 00:00:03,279 --> 00:00:08,040 Speaker 1: Bungelung Calcottin woman from Gadighal Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 3 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:10,280 Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 4 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 5 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:16,799 Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the 6 00:00:16,840 --> 00:00:19,599 Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present. 7 00:00:25,079 --> 00:00:28,159 Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to a special budget edition of 8 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:30,920 Speaker 2: The Daily OS. It is Wednesday, the tenth of May. 9 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:33,239 Speaker 2: I'm Billy Fitzsimon's the editor of The. 10 00:00:33,280 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 3: Daily OS and I'm Tom Crowley, tda's political journalist. 11 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 4: The budget we present to the Australian people tonight provides 12 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 4: cost of living relief that is responsible and affordable and 13 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:46,960 Speaker 4: prioritizes those most in need. 14 00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:51,479 Speaker 2: Treasurer Jim Chalmers has delivered this year's federal budget and 15 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:53,760 Speaker 2: there's a lot to unpack for you, so we're going 16 00:00:53,800 --> 00:01:01,320 Speaker 2: to get straight to it now before we do anything else, Tom, 17 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 2: can you just set the scene and explain exactly where 18 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:05,520 Speaker 2: we're sitting right now. 19 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:08,000 Speaker 3: Well, we're huddled in a podcast booth in the halls 20 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:10,920 Speaker 3: of Parliament House. Billy where we've just come out of 21 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:12,960 Speaker 3: the budget lock up. This is the third time you 22 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:15,320 Speaker 3: and I have done this together. It's kind of like 23 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 3: an exam for journalists. I think is probably the best 24 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:21,320 Speaker 3: way to explain it. So journalists on Budget Day get 25 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 3: to see the papers six hours earlier. We're not allowed 26 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 3: any phones or internet or communication with the outside world. 27 00:01:26,720 --> 00:01:29,560 Speaker 3: But we've spent the afternoon reading through the budget papers 28 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:32,039 Speaker 3: and getting our heads across it for the coverage. And 29 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 3: we're recording this just after Treasurer Jim Chalmers has handed 30 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:36,840 Speaker 3: down the budget with his speech, so we're ready to 31 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 3: chat through it all. 32 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:39,640 Speaker 2: Now let's move on to what we actually just learned 33 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 2: in the past six hours. So part of what the 34 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,480 Speaker 2: budget does is tell a kind of story about the 35 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:49,360 Speaker 2: state of the economy and how the government's actions fit 36 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 2: into that. So, Tom, what story is the government trying 37 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:53,800 Speaker 2: to tell us with this budget. 38 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 3: Well, it's a similar story, Billy, to what we foreshadowed 39 00:01:57,200 --> 00:01:59,160 Speaker 3: on the pod last week, So that the government really 40 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 3: has two elements to the balancing act that it is 41 00:02:02,200 --> 00:02:04,200 Speaker 3: trying to pull off here. On the one hand, it 42 00:02:04,240 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 3: wants to support people through a cost of living crisis. 43 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 3: On the other hand, it's trying to deal with what 44 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:14,360 Speaker 3: it says is a problem in the government's finances that 45 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:18,040 Speaker 3: for fifteen years the government has been spending more money 46 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 3: than it is collected in tax We call that a 47 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 3: budget deficit, and that as a result, it's been taking 48 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:26,720 Speaker 3: on more debt basically, which is imposing a growing cost. 49 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:28,680 Speaker 3: So the government is set on the one hand it 50 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:31,079 Speaker 3: wants to find as much space as it can to 51 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 3: support people through the cost of living crisis, but on 52 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 3: the other hand to try and do what it would 53 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 3: call budget repair to rain in spending and perhaps to 54 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:41,679 Speaker 3: raise a little bit more money to get a control 55 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:45,960 Speaker 3: on those deficits. I guess, as treasure Jim Chalmer said tonight, Billy, 56 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:49,440 Speaker 3: it's really kind of trying to find a balance between 57 00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 3: generosity and responsibility. That they're the words that the government 58 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:54,239 Speaker 3: would use to describe the task that it was trying 59 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 3: to set up in a context where we know that 60 00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:58,440 Speaker 3: the economy is of course going through a lot of difficulty. 61 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,640 Speaker 4: In all of our decisions, we seek to strike a 62 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:06,720 Speaker 4: considered methodical balance between spending restraint to keep the pressure 63 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 4: off inflation while doing what we can to help people 64 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 4: struggling to make ends. Meet. So, Tom, you. 65 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 2: Mentioned fifteen years of deficit, but one of the big 66 00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:19,040 Speaker 2: headlines for this year has been that there's a surplus. 67 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 3: Yes, so surplus. The opposite of a deficit. Surplus is 68 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:26,520 Speaker 3: when the government is collecting more tax than it spends, 69 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:29,240 Speaker 3: and this year we have a one off surplus and 70 00:03:29,280 --> 00:03:31,720 Speaker 3: as I mentioned before, that will be the first for 71 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:36,440 Speaker 3: fifteen years. The reason for it is probably best described 72 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 3: as a bit of a tax sugar hit. So basically, 73 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 3: because iron, ore, coal and gas are so expensive at 74 00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 3: the moment, the companies that sell them overseas in Australia 75 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:49,040 Speaker 3: are making a lot of money. They are paying a 76 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 3: lot more corporate tax than the government expected. And at 77 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 3: the same time, more people are in work than we 78 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 3: expected and wages are going up by slightly more than 79 00:03:58,200 --> 00:04:00,320 Speaker 3: we expected, and that means that people are paying more 80 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 3: income tax as well. So those two things delivered quite 81 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 3: a significant sugar hit to the budget bottom line, which 82 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 3: means for one year only the budget will be in surplus, 83 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:11,760 Speaker 3: which is interesting and certainly something that the government has 84 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 3: wanted to emphasize. But over the long term it doesn't 85 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:17,840 Speaker 3: really change that story of the financial pressure on the 86 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:20,479 Speaker 3: budget because the year after it goes straight back to 87 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:22,839 Speaker 3: a deficit, and we're expected to be in that sort 88 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 3: of deficit situation again for the foreseeable future after that. 89 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 2: So let's talk about the actual measures that the government announced. 90 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,039 Speaker 2: When we asked our audience what was important to them, 91 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:35,480 Speaker 2: the overwhelming majority said cost of living. So Tom, what 92 00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 2: is in the budget to address cost of living? 93 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:41,240 Speaker 3: So there were really three key elements to the cost 94 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:44,279 Speaker 3: of living relief. They were welfare, health, and energy. So 95 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:46,919 Speaker 3: I'll take them one by one. So on the welfare front, 96 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:50,440 Speaker 3: there's an increase across the board to job seeker of 97 00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 3: forty dollars a fortnight or two dollars eighty five a day. 98 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:56,400 Speaker 3: It's the first permanent increase in a budget in over 99 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:59,360 Speaker 3: twenty years. It also applies to related payments, including the 100 00:04:59,400 --> 00:05:02,560 Speaker 3: Youth Allowance. Then on top of that rental assistance, so 101 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:05,880 Speaker 3: that's a payment that goes to welfare recipients who rent. 102 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,640 Speaker 3: That will increase by thirty one dollars a fortnite, and 103 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:11,920 Speaker 3: fifty five to fifty nine year olds will get an 104 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 3: extra boost, so they'll go on to a higher rate 105 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:17,159 Speaker 3: that is already paid to the over sixties, a slightly 106 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,840 Speaker 3: higher rate of job seeker. The other major change on 107 00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:23,720 Speaker 3: the welfare front was to parental support, So, as we 108 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 3: heard earlier in the week, eligibility will be expanded to 109 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 3: that support payment for about fifty seven thousand single parents, 110 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 3: most of those single mothers. That'll give them a bit 111 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 3: under two hundred dollars extra fortnite. Then on the health front, 112 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 3: we've got cheaper medicines as was announced last month and 113 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 3: I think we talked about that on the POD. And 114 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:47,440 Speaker 3: then there's also a new financial incentive for GPS to 115 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 3: do more bulk billing for low income patients and for children. 116 00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:53,600 Speaker 3: So bulk billing meaning that no out of pocket cost 117 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 3: for those patients. And that's into contexthere. We know that 118 00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 3: bulk billing rates been falling in Australia and the idea 119 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 3: there is that will incur GPS to deliver more no 120 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:06,279 Speaker 3: cost medical consultations to low income people into children. And 121 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 3: then finally, on the energy front, there was a confirmation 122 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 3: of some support for energy bills in coordination with states 123 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 3: and territories. It's about five hundred dollars per person. It's 124 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 3: not going to decrease your energy bill, but the government 125 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:19,040 Speaker 3: says it'll make the bill go up by less than 126 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:21,000 Speaker 3: it would have otherwise in a context where bills have 127 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:23,800 Speaker 3: been rising very fast. So that's a quick wrap of 128 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 3: the cost of living relief. 129 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,719 Speaker 2: Okay, let's now talk about how the government plans to 130 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 2: rain in spending in the budget. There were a few 131 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 2: different cuts happening. How does the budget do that? 132 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, so coming back to that what the government would 133 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 3: call it's budgeting responsibly story, there are a couple of 134 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:41,479 Speaker 3: spending changes. So in particular, some money has been saved 135 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 3: in age care, basically by shifting away from residential care 136 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 3: places towards home based care places, which has saved the 137 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 3: government a little bit of money. And then over the 138 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 3: longer term, there's some money that will be saved by 139 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:58,000 Speaker 3: capping spending growth on the NDIS, so that sort of 140 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:00,680 Speaker 3: won't take effect until the next time kind of maybe 141 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:02,520 Speaker 3: sort of five ten years from now, but it is 142 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 3: something the government has flagged it will try and rain 143 00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 3: in the cost of the very fast growing National Disability 144 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 3: Insurance scheme. On the other side of things, I guess 145 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 3: the other way that you can deal with these sort 146 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 3: of long term deficits, apart from cutting spending, is to 147 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:17,920 Speaker 3: raise tax and there were some new taxes in this budget. 148 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:20,120 Speaker 3: They were all really things that we'd heard about in 149 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:21,920 Speaker 3: the lead up to the budget. There's a high attax 150 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:25,840 Speaker 3: on tobacco, there's a high at tax on large superannuation balances, 151 00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 3: and there's a high attax on large gas drilling projects. 152 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:32,800 Speaker 3: As far as how it changes that story that the 153 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 3: government is talking about, this question of the government spending 154 00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 3: more than it raises in tax. The overall figures so 155 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 3: this budget overall will increase spending by about forty four 156 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:46,680 Speaker 3: billion over the next four years, and it'll raise about 157 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:49,720 Speaker 3: twenty two billion in new tax. So forty four billion 158 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 3: in new spending twenty two billion in new tax. There 159 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 3: was a little bit in this budget in terms of 160 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 3: you know, bad news and trying to reign in spending, 161 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:01,080 Speaker 3: but those numbers suggest there's one new dollar spent in 162 00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 3: this budget for every dollar saved. So that that sort 163 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:06,720 Speaker 3: of fundamental situation where the government is spending more than 164 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 3: it raises in tax. We expect that, apart from a 165 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 3: one off surplus, to continue for the rest of the 166 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 3: next ten years at least. 167 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 2: Well like with any budget, I think we will continue 168 00:08:16,320 --> 00:08:19,559 Speaker 2: to find interesting details to pull apart in the days ahead. 169 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 2: There are literally thousands of pages to get through, but 170 00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:25,240 Speaker 2: thank you so much for helping to unpack some of 171 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 2: the headlines for us. 172 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 3: Tom Thanks billionaires. I'm sure the budget festivities will roll 173 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:30,920 Speaker 3: on for a few more days. Will get the opposition's 174 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 3: response on Thursday night, so we'll hear a little bit 175 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:35,040 Speaker 3: more then about what they think of the budget. We'll 176 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 3: hear from a whole variety of different politicians, community sector groups, 177 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:41,840 Speaker 3: experts over the next few days, no doubt. In the meantime, 178 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:44,080 Speaker 3: you can head to the Daily Os Instagram where we 179 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:46,120 Speaker 3: broke down all of the key topics in the budget 180 00:08:46,120 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 3: for you, and we'll have more coverage throughout the week 181 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:51,839 Speaker 3: as it unfolds. 182 00:08:54,240 --> 00:08:57,080 Speaker 2: Thank you so much for joining us for this budget special. 183 00:08:57,200 --> 00:09:00,320 Speaker 2: Sam and Zara will be back as normal tomorrow. But 184 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 2: in the meantime, if you learn something from this episode 185 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 2: of rating and review, wherever you do your podcast listening 186 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 2: is always super appreciated, and I hope you have a 187 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:11,000 Speaker 2: great day.