WEBVTT - Rest as Resistance: Ella Noah Bancroft on First Nations Knowledge, Feminine Leadership, and Decolonisation 0:00:04.071 --> 0:00:09.031 Quae Cast Unite our voices. This podcast is brought to 0:00:09.031 --> 0:00:19.311 you by on Track Studio. Welcome to Yannier, the podcast 0:00:19.351 --> 0:00:24.871 that showcases First Nations stories and conversations to help us 0:00:24.991 --> 0:00:31.191 learn and unlearn Australia's history to work towards a better future. 0:00:32.111 --> 0:00:36.031 I'm your host, proud barber woman and founder of Blackwattel 0:00:36.071 --> 0:00:43.511 Coaching and Consulting, Caroline cow We acknowledge the Runderi people 0:00:43.671 --> 0:00:47.311 and elders where this podcast is taped, but we also 0:00:47.391 --> 0:00:51.031 acknowledge the lands that you are listening in from today. 0:00:52.031 --> 0:00:56.391 It always was and always will be unseated aboriginal and 0:00:56.511 --> 0:01:04.071 tourist Red Islander Land. Well, I'm super grateful for today's guest. 0:01:04.431 --> 0:01:07.991 I had the privilege of connecting with Allah Noah Bancraft 0:01:08.231 --> 0:01:11.511 a couple of years ago at a retreat and I 0:01:11.711 --> 0:01:18.391 just left feeling so inspired by their gentle but fierce 0:01:18.631 --> 0:01:21.751 honesty in how you know they see the world and 0:01:21.911 --> 0:01:25.111 challenge us to think about our places in the world. 0:01:25.671 --> 0:01:28.791 And so yeah, it's an incredible honor and privilege today 0:01:28.831 --> 0:01:32.431 to be sitting down with Alan Noah Bancroft. Thank you 0:01:32.471 --> 0:01:35.911 so much for being here, my sis, and welcome to yarning. 0:01:35.631 --> 0:01:37.111 Up dingy lasses. 0:01:37.591 --> 0:01:41.471 Yeah, as we always do on this show. It's beautiful 0:01:41.511 --> 0:01:44.311 to just sort of check in and ground ourselves with 0:01:44.431 --> 0:01:48.351 person and place. So I'm wondering if you could introduce 0:01:48.391 --> 0:01:51.111 yourself how you'd like to be introduced? 0:01:51.391 --> 0:01:55.431 Sure, elegaate. My name is Ella. 0:01:55.551 --> 0:01:58.431 I'm a proud andreline woman from the northern New South 0:01:58.431 --> 0:02:01.951 Wales region and also have ties to Scotland and Poland 0:02:01.951 --> 0:02:05.791 on my maternal line. Currently run an indigenous charity here 0:02:05.791 --> 0:02:12.351 on country and privilege to work and play and live 0:02:12.391 --> 0:02:13.591 on my ancestral lands. 0:02:13.711 --> 0:02:16.791 Beautiful and beautiful country there, Bundolong country as well. 0:02:16.831 --> 0:02:17.551 You're so lucky. 0:02:17.951 --> 0:02:21.951 I'm a bit biased, you know. I always think it's paradise. 0:02:21.511 --> 0:02:26.231 Fat No, it really is so lovely up there, and 0:02:26.231 --> 0:02:29.991 I imagine that, you know, the country there would sort 0:02:30.031 --> 0:02:33.551 of like shape, you know, really deeply. Yeah, some of 0:02:33.591 --> 0:02:35.551 the places and spaces that you are because you're just 0:02:35.591 --> 0:02:39.511 surrounded by lush and green and moving with the seasons, 0:02:39.591 --> 0:02:40.431 I imagine there. 0:02:40.671 --> 0:02:43.871 Yeah, And Bungelin is also you know where the five rivers. 0:02:43.871 --> 0:02:47.911 We've got five major rivers that run through. It's where freshwater, meat, saltwater, 0:02:48.111 --> 0:02:52.871 and also first light it's the most easily point of Australia. 0:02:52.951 --> 0:02:56.591 So like literally the sun Yelgin hits that part of 0:02:56.671 --> 0:03:01.071 Joggon Country first and foremost, but we're with anywhere else 0:03:01.151 --> 0:03:01.791 on the continent. 0:03:01.991 --> 0:03:05.351 Wow. So what time is the sun rising there for 0:03:05.511 --> 0:03:07.911 you follows. 0:03:06.311 --> 0:03:10.551 It's around six ish. Yeah. Yeah, we've got some long days. 0:03:10.591 --> 0:03:14.191 I mean, because we're quite close up to the Queensland border, 0:03:14.351 --> 0:03:15.791 we've definitely got longer days. 0:03:15.791 --> 0:03:17.231 But I feel like they're longer and now. 0:03:17.751 --> 0:03:21.311 M Yeah, I think that's just because the seasons are 0:03:21.431 --> 0:03:25.071 very abrupt here and everyone's just working their holes. Also, 0:03:25.151 --> 0:03:29.151 everything feels long and drawn out and gray. 0:03:29.711 --> 0:03:30.391 Good lays. 0:03:31.031 --> 0:03:34.031 So you're born and raised on your country, on your homelands. 0:03:34.431 --> 0:03:37.751 I was actually born in Gadagall Country and my mom 0:03:37.791 --> 0:03:41.711 and my dad moved there in the early eighties and 0:03:41.911 --> 0:03:44.511 mum had a home birth with me and my brother 0:03:44.551 --> 0:03:47.311 because you know, in our family line, hospitals have never 0:03:47.351 --> 0:03:50.031 been a safe place to birth. I'm not let alone 0:03:50.031 --> 0:03:53.151 a safe place for our family, so she birthed us 0:03:53.151 --> 0:03:55.951 there and both our placentas are buried somewhere in the 0:03:55.991 --> 0:04:00.951 inner West of Syday. But when I was about just 0:04:00.991 --> 0:04:03.751 before I turned five, we moved back up to country 0:04:03.791 --> 0:04:05.951 and then you know, had a lot of like my 0:04:06.071 --> 0:04:08.471 primary school life being raised here, and we've always been 0:04:08.511 --> 0:04:12.351 deeply connected and come home all the time my whole life. 0:04:12.391 --> 0:04:15.431 Well, how special and how special to hear that you 0:04:15.511 --> 0:04:17.991 were brought into this world in a home birth. I 0:04:17.991 --> 0:04:20.911 think that's just so beautiful and so special. So born 0:04:20.951 --> 0:04:23.991 on Gadigall. Your placenter's there in the Inner West. I'm 0:04:23.991 --> 0:04:26.631 actually pregnant at the moment, and I've been thinking about 0:04:26.631 --> 0:04:28.671 what i want to do with my placenter, and I 0:04:28.711 --> 0:04:31.191 think I'm still deciding, but I think I'm going to 0:04:31.271 --> 0:04:34.191 put it in some capsules and eat it back in 0:04:34.271 --> 0:04:34.751 my body. 0:04:34.831 --> 0:04:36.111 I hear, that's really good for you. 0:04:38.471 --> 0:04:41.671 My younger sister, we drove we actually kept her pleasenter 0:04:41.751 --> 0:04:44.031 in the freezer for like ten months and then drove 0:04:44.071 --> 0:04:46.591 it up in an eski from Sydney. 0:04:46.231 --> 0:04:48.871 To Banjoe and buried it on our ancestral land. 0:04:48.991 --> 0:04:53.351 How special, Oh my goodness, the legacies continue. 0:04:53.431 --> 0:04:53.991 I love that. 0:04:55.231 --> 0:04:57.671 Well, you know you you carry the stories as you 0:04:57.711 --> 0:05:02.871 save many bloodlines. Bundelung woman Scottish Polish. I mean I'm 0:05:02.911 --> 0:05:05.711 keen to sort of understand a bit more about Yeah, 0:05:05.751 --> 0:05:07.951 your personal story and you know what it was like 0:05:08.031 --> 0:05:08.831 for you growing up. 0:05:08.951 --> 0:05:11.351 Yeah, I guess as a mixed raced woman. But living 0:05:11.391 --> 0:05:15.471 in Australia and growing up with my community both on Gatigol, 0:05:15.471 --> 0:05:18.591 I was always around a big Indigenous community there when 0:05:18.631 --> 0:05:20.871 I was growing up, and also on Bunjelung. I've always 0:05:20.911 --> 0:05:24.431 identified a lot with my indigenous side. But as I 0:05:24.431 --> 0:05:27.551 got older, I started to realize that, like if I 0:05:27.631 --> 0:05:30.511 wanted other people to not claim the colony and the 0:05:30.511 --> 0:05:34.791 immature culture we called Australia, I also needed to re 0:05:34.991 --> 0:05:38.031 establish a relationship with my ancestors on that Polish and 0:05:38.031 --> 0:05:41.831 Scottish side. And as I actually dive deeper into understanding 0:05:41.911 --> 0:05:45.431 some research, I've actually became like, I'm really proud of 0:05:45.471 --> 0:05:48.711 my Scottish side. I feel like the Scots were really 0:05:48.751 --> 0:05:53.471 fierce in not only fighting colonization and their indigenous people 0:05:53.511 --> 0:05:54.751 were called the Pinks. 0:05:54.471 --> 0:05:57.151 But they feel like real. 0:05:56.991 --> 0:06:00.311 Warriors and like tied in with my Bungelung ancestors. I 0:06:00.311 --> 0:06:02.711 feel like that's what gives me the kind of fire 0:06:02.791 --> 0:06:05.511 to walk through the world that I do. I do 0:06:05.631 --> 0:06:08.751 hope one day to do some kind of pilgrimage with 0:06:08.791 --> 0:06:11.471 my mum and my sister back to that place, and 0:06:11.991 --> 0:06:14.031 I always kind of tend to go more with my 0:06:14.111 --> 0:06:15.151 maternal sign. 0:06:14.991 --> 0:06:18.551 Because it feels, it just feels the truest. 0:06:18.151 --> 0:06:20.831 For me to be claiming that those ancestral lines. But 0:06:20.911 --> 0:06:21.831 that's just for me. 0:06:22.071 --> 0:06:25.191 Yeah, so beautiful to hear that and hear about Yeah, 0:06:25.271 --> 0:06:28.711 your early experiences. Yeah, it's interesting I sort of share 0:06:28.751 --> 0:06:31.551 a similar sort of Definitely, it's very resonant. I grew 0:06:31.591 --> 0:06:34.591 up with an aboriginal mom, single mom, and didn't really 0:06:34.631 --> 0:06:37.391 know my dad and way up until later in life, 0:06:37.471 --> 0:06:39.671 until I was, you know, my late twenties, and my 0:06:39.751 --> 0:06:44.391 mom's aboriginal. My dad is yes, Scottish English, And yeah, 0:06:44.471 --> 0:06:47.431 similarly went on like a path after he passed away, 0:06:47.631 --> 0:06:49.831 just being like, what is this white side of me? 0:06:49.871 --> 0:06:53.791 And how do I reconcile my whiteness? I guess or 0:06:53.831 --> 0:06:56.951 try to understand that and how it's located and defined? 0:06:57.151 --> 0:06:59.711 And yeah, it was really painful because we came across 0:06:59.751 --> 0:07:04.751 like all these links between colonizers of course and our mob. 0:07:05.471 --> 0:07:09.191 But then also yeah, kind of similarly saw that they 0:07:09.191 --> 0:07:15.071 were fierce anti colonial warriors fighting the resistance, and so 0:07:15.151 --> 0:07:17.511 sometimes I'm like, oh, is this my white side, it's 0:07:17.551 --> 0:07:21.711 my black side, who knows. But there's this real strong 0:07:21.831 --> 0:07:24.351 sense of fight and justice and resolve on both of 0:07:24.391 --> 0:07:26.311 our sides, and it's yeah, it's nice to sort of 0:07:26.311 --> 0:07:28.871 make space for them all in some ways. 0:07:29.151 --> 0:07:29.431 Hey. 0:07:30.071 --> 0:07:32.991 Yeah, And also like I think I hope to inspire 0:07:33.191 --> 0:07:36.671 or encourage other people to do their own ancestual work. 0:07:36.751 --> 0:07:39.511 Like I feel like, as indigenous people in this country, 0:07:39.551 --> 0:07:42.031 every day we get up and we research more about 0:07:42.031 --> 0:07:45.831 our families and our culture because it was almost taken 0:07:45.831 --> 0:07:49.191 from us, you know, So every day we're relearning or 0:07:49.271 --> 0:07:53.831 learning or getting given the knowledge systems passed down to us. 0:07:53.871 --> 0:07:56.311 But it's not just like that all just came to us. 0:07:56.391 --> 0:07:59.431 And so I feel like other people should step into 0:07:59.471 --> 0:08:03.631 that space too and reclaim the ancestors. I recently found 0:08:03.791 --> 0:08:06.671 that that we carry fourteen generations in our body, which 0:08:06.671 --> 0:08:11.311 equates to sixty five plus thousand ancestors, like their cellular 0:08:11.391 --> 0:08:15.711 memory is carried within our body. And for me, I'm like, 0:08:16.111 --> 0:08:19.031 how could you just call yourself austrayan? It just seems 0:08:19.111 --> 0:08:21.271 like such an injustice. 0:08:20.751 --> 0:08:23.351 To all of those people who fought so hard to 0:08:23.391 --> 0:08:25.591 get you to this place, to be here right now. 0:08:25.911 --> 0:08:27.831 And I don't know if anybody knows my work, but 0:08:27.871 --> 0:08:31.071 I'm not the greatest fan of the colony too, And 0:08:31.111 --> 0:08:33.111 I think one of the ways that we can really 0:08:33.151 --> 0:08:35.391 resist it is by not identifying with it. 0:08:35.431 --> 0:08:37.351 Oh my god, there's so much to sort of like 0:08:37.471 --> 0:08:40.511 unpack there. But I mean, firstly, sixty five thousand ancestors, 0:08:40.551 --> 0:08:43.191 doesn't that give you, like, when you're walking into a room, 0:08:43.271 --> 0:08:47.071 especially as a black follow that legitimacy of who you are, 0:08:47.631 --> 0:08:50.711 to know that you carry, that you carry those stories 0:08:50.751 --> 0:08:55.391 and that strength and that love and reciprocity and that fight. 0:08:55.991 --> 0:08:58.551 But yeah, you're so right, And I feel like that's 0:08:58.591 --> 0:09:00.911 really where we're at right now in terms of like 0:09:01.311 --> 0:09:05.071 what we're seeing here and global is that there is 0:09:05.191 --> 0:09:09.031 just countries forge in denial of who they are and 0:09:09.071 --> 0:09:13.191 how they've come to be, and that it's so people 0:09:13.231 --> 0:09:17.271 almost divorced of themselves. They're divorced of community, and they 0:09:17.511 --> 0:09:22.231 would much rather sit in this like very comfortable manufactured 0:09:23.111 --> 0:09:26.551 sense of nationalism't it, instead of really doing that inner 0:09:26.591 --> 0:09:30.871 work and thinking about themselves. And yeah, you're right, we 0:09:30.911 --> 0:09:33.911 sort of have to do that as well and honor that. 0:09:34.271 --> 0:09:38.271 But yeah, people are just so incredibly disconnected from all 0:09:38.311 --> 0:09:40.951 of those ancestors and their stories and then and it's 0:09:41.031 --> 0:09:43.831 quite sad in some ways. Hey, like as much as 0:09:43.831 --> 0:09:46.791 it really puts it, you get real wild at it. 0:09:46.911 --> 0:09:48.511 There's a part of me that just bes like these 0:09:48.551 --> 0:09:49.711 more be hurting, you. 0:09:49.671 --> 0:09:50.511 Know for sure. 0:09:50.551 --> 0:09:54.431 And also you know, it's something in the like, how 0:09:54.471 --> 0:09:57.991 do we retrace the unified story that the colony or 0:09:57.991 --> 0:10:03.151 colonization and capitalism doesn't actually benefit us, not just mob 0:10:04.231 --> 0:10:07.351 but us as a society. You know, For me, I 0:10:07.391 --> 0:10:10.271 feel like until we peel back those layers and find 0:10:10.311 --> 0:10:13.831 that unifying story of serious disconnect which you know, the 0:10:13.871 --> 0:10:16.551 doctrine of discovery is one of the seed letters for 0:10:16.831 --> 0:10:19.711 colonization and how they took over so many indigenous lands 0:10:19.751 --> 0:10:22.751 across the globe. But this was happening back in Europe too, 0:10:22.791 --> 0:10:25.951 when they brought in the commons and they started taking 0:10:25.991 --> 0:10:30.191 and discolocating people from their lands. So when we reclaim 0:10:30.271 --> 0:10:34.551 that and our ancestry, we say a big fuck you too, 0:10:34.951 --> 0:10:35.391 or I don't. 0:10:35.231 --> 0:10:36.831 Know if I can say that, but yeah, you can. 0:10:37.151 --> 0:10:38.991 You the money, because. 0:10:39.311 --> 0:10:42.511 This isn't just our story, but we are touched by 0:10:42.671 --> 0:10:45.271 it because it's much closer to home, because we sit 0:10:45.311 --> 0:10:47.471 at the table with our NaN's and our aunties and 0:10:47.511 --> 0:10:50.271 our uncles and our brothers who are still impacted by 0:10:50.311 --> 0:10:51.511 colonization today. 0:10:51.751 --> 0:10:52.511 So so true. 0:10:52.591 --> 0:10:54.871 You know, building on that, I saw that you wrote 0:10:54.871 --> 0:10:58.151 a think tank recently around this topic, and it's something 0:10:58.191 --> 0:10:59.831 I sort of had the privilege of being us to 0:10:59.871 --> 0:11:03.231 sort of think about too. And yeah, it's interesting, like 0:11:03.311 --> 0:11:06.031 for for the first time in maybe a long time, 0:11:06.071 --> 0:11:09.351 and it's an awful it's an awful symptom of the 0:11:09.391 --> 0:11:13.631 colony and the centuries of harm across civilizations which we 0:11:13.671 --> 0:11:17.431 have seen that for the first time in a long time, 0:11:17.551 --> 0:11:22.031 it feels like indigenous like long standing issues of indigenous 0:11:22.031 --> 0:11:27.311 sovereignty and legitimacy are no longer just aboriginal issues indigenous 0:11:27.351 --> 0:11:32.551 issues anymore. And we're seeing it in climate action, in 0:11:32.671 --> 0:11:37.111 action crime, We're seeing it in like economic collapse, fossil 0:11:37.151 --> 0:11:41.951 fuel greed. We're seeing you know, this hyper individualization and 0:11:42.151 --> 0:11:47.311 relationship to imperialism affecting all people from all walks of life. 0:11:47.711 --> 0:11:51.871 And you're right, it's almost like we've been knocking on 0:11:51.991 --> 0:11:55.591 the doors and screaming into the abyss and all these 0:11:55.591 --> 0:11:58.471 things on looking at this from this holistic perspective, just 0:11:58.471 --> 0:12:01.791 so like the colony is making us all unwell and 0:12:01.871 --> 0:12:04.951 it kind of feels like they're is a growing momentum 0:12:05.031 --> 0:12:05.871 in this space. 0:12:06.671 --> 0:12:08.631 I'd love to sort of talk a little. 0:12:08.351 --> 0:12:10.911 Bit around you know, what has led you on this 0:12:11.111 --> 0:12:16.351 path to having these conversations about you know, decolonization and 0:12:16.831 --> 0:12:20.751 trying to reclaim and return back to our practices, you 0:12:20.791 --> 0:12:23.511 know where there's some moments in your journey that really 0:12:23.591 --> 0:12:26.831 led to that. And yeah, I guess these sort of 0:12:26.831 --> 0:12:31.031 conversations help with this bigger, growing, expansive movement which we're 0:12:31.031 --> 0:12:32.231 seeing right now as well. 0:12:32.391 --> 0:12:36.831 Yeah, I mean, I think definitely the juxtaposition of being 0:12:36.871 --> 0:12:39.391 born in gadagl and I don't really remember that much, 0:12:39.551 --> 0:12:42.351 you know, of my younger childhood, but being back on 0:12:42.431 --> 0:12:45.391 country with my community and we live an hour and 0:12:45.471 --> 0:12:48.951 a half northwest of Grafton, where my ancestral lands by 0:12:49.031 --> 0:12:52.151 Jagama from and just being in that space of like, 0:12:52.591 --> 0:12:55.391 you know, we lived off grid before off grid was trendy, 0:12:55.631 --> 0:12:59.591 and we had our big washpool river that provided everything 0:12:59.591 --> 0:13:04.031 for us water, food, entertainment, play, and we got by 0:13:04.031 --> 0:13:06.311 that place all the time and we still do as 0:13:06.311 --> 0:13:09.551 a family. But actually having that lived experience of growing 0:13:09.631 --> 0:13:12.791 up really disconnected in a way from the dominant society 0:13:12.871 --> 0:13:16.511 and much more embedded in land based connection and community. 0:13:16.871 --> 0:13:19.831 And not to romanticize either, because you know, we also 0:13:19.911 --> 0:13:24.031 in northern New South Wales impacted here very heavily by 0:13:24.151 --> 0:13:27.711 massacres and the invaders coming through in the late eighteen hundreds, 0:13:28.031 --> 0:13:30.671 so it was still a mission that was created there. 0:13:30.711 --> 0:13:33.071 But you know the essence of just being with my 0:13:33.631 --> 0:13:36.351 family and just making a fire and swimming in the 0:13:36.351 --> 0:13:39.231 creek was so simple. And then when I kind of 0:13:39.231 --> 0:13:42.871 went back to Gadigul, I was like overwhelmed by the city, 0:13:43.031 --> 0:13:47.551 you know, and also just really this juxtaposition between Sydney 0:13:47.631 --> 0:13:50.791 and like couldn't get more remote and rule New South Wales. 0:13:51.271 --> 0:13:55.311 And I think that is probably like the first seed 0:13:55.511 --> 0:13:58.551 of when I started to realize the difference between these 0:13:58.991 --> 0:14:02.191 two very opposing cultures that were trying to coexist in 0:14:02.271 --> 0:14:05.191 the same continent. And then obviously growing up, like my 0:14:05.271 --> 0:14:08.911 mother is a very strong black artist and activist, and 0:14:09.031 --> 0:14:12.591 my whole life has always kind of you know, told 0:14:12.671 --> 0:14:15.391 us who we are and ensured that we've remained connected 0:14:15.431 --> 0:14:18.111 to our ancestral lands, our culture, and our family, because 0:14:18.151 --> 0:14:21.471 she didn't ever want us to just assimilate into what 0:14:21.671 --> 0:14:23.871 was the wider culture. And so I think I've always 0:14:23.871 --> 0:14:27.791 been really rebellious because of her in that way, and 0:14:27.831 --> 0:14:30.431 then finishing school, which, like you know, I was horrible 0:14:30.471 --> 0:14:33.511 at school. I had dyslexia. I was like put in 0:14:33.631 --> 0:14:36.671 special ed classes and I hated it. I hated the 0:14:36.711 --> 0:14:39.751 whole concept of the Western institution. And so when I 0:14:39.791 --> 0:14:42.231 finally broke free of that, I actually ended up at 0:14:42.231 --> 0:14:44.751 Sydney UNI, but I was just going there to socialize, 0:14:44.751 --> 0:14:49.031 like the little Geminiam. I got out of UNI there 0:14:49.271 --> 0:14:52.671 to work for my brother's organization AIM and again just 0:14:52.911 --> 0:14:56.111 you know, trying to support our younger people with an 0:14:56.151 --> 0:14:58.751 amazing model when he first started that, you know, really 0:14:58.791 --> 0:15:01.751 just going into schools and helping high school students. But 0:15:02.351 --> 0:15:05.271 again I just felt like this isn't the way for me. 0:15:06.431 --> 0:15:08.751 It's not the way to try and get our kids 0:15:08.791 --> 0:15:09.631 in those spaces. 0:15:09.671 --> 0:15:09.911 For me. 0:15:09.991 --> 0:15:14.151 I'm like, we need to actually make society realize how 0:15:14.231 --> 0:15:17.871 valuable our culture is and how valuable our cultural leaders are. 0:15:17.951 --> 0:15:21.351 And I guess I kind of disassociated for most of 0:15:21.351 --> 0:15:25.151 my twenties from Australia and didn't really want to be here. Actually, 0:15:25.471 --> 0:15:29.231 I found the culture quite repulsive in many ways and 0:15:29.791 --> 0:15:32.151 didn't feel like it had a lot of substance, especially 0:15:32.191 --> 0:15:36.231 coming from where I've come from. And I think travel 0:15:36.311 --> 0:15:38.711 really put a lot of things in perspective. I started 0:15:39.271 --> 0:15:43.351 just hitchhiking my way around the world and Mexico, Guatemala, 0:15:43.631 --> 0:15:45.791 ended up on the west coast of the States, and 0:15:45.831 --> 0:15:49.431 then met a really beautiful Native American brother and he 0:15:49.511 --> 0:15:52.871 actually introduced me to the concept of decolonizing, and that 0:15:53.031 --> 0:15:55.711 was kind of like maybe fifteen years back now, and 0:15:55.991 --> 0:15:58.831 I think he kind of planted that seed for me, 0:15:59.071 --> 0:16:01.591 and then I started to kind of investigate it, and 0:16:01.791 --> 0:16:02.071 you know. 0:16:02.031 --> 0:16:04.391 They were really progressive of there a lot. 0:16:04.231 --> 0:16:06.911 Of the native indigenous mob over there, so I was 0:16:06.991 --> 0:16:08.591 kind of sitting with them and seeing what they were 0:16:08.631 --> 0:16:11.471 talking about, and then come back home and then started 0:16:11.831 --> 0:16:17.111 exploring that through just recognizing, wow, this is such a juxtaposition, 0:16:17.191 --> 0:16:19.991 and actually if everyone returned to these more like earth 0:16:20.031 --> 0:16:22.951 based indigenous ways, we would not only be healthier, but 0:16:23.031 --> 0:16:25.391 country would be singing. You know, she would be in 0:16:25.431 --> 0:16:29.231 a day of joy again, because I really do think 0:16:28.791 --> 0:16:32.551 the colony is built on us being disconnected from not 0:16:32.631 --> 0:16:36.351 only the country, but ourselves and each other and it's 0:16:36.391 --> 0:16:40.231 also a culture that glorifies greed and status. And so 0:16:40.311 --> 0:16:42.951 this is what we communicate to our young people. We say, 0:16:42.951 --> 0:16:45.551 we see you when you are greedy and you hold 0:16:45.591 --> 0:16:48.311 and you accumulate wealth and you put yourself above others. 0:16:48.751 --> 0:16:51.431 And we also see you when you place yourself above 0:16:51.671 --> 0:16:54.551 another being and think you're better than And what I 0:16:54.591 --> 0:16:56.271 got taught with the law of the Land is like, 0:16:56.391 --> 0:16:59.911 you don't think you're better than anything, including the jari, 0:17:00.031 --> 0:17:03.911 the trees, you know, the animals that coexist with us. 0:17:03.951 --> 0:17:07.271 And I think this culture is just so dangerous because 0:17:07.311 --> 0:17:10.551 of these values and belief systems that are really embedded 0:17:10.551 --> 0:17:12.591 in such a young age to many of us, you know, 0:17:12.711 --> 0:17:15.831 especially if we went through the Western education system and 0:17:15.871 --> 0:17:16.671 didn't question it. 0:17:18.711 --> 0:17:23.271 Wow, gosh, so fascinating to hear that. Yeah, I guess 0:17:23.311 --> 0:17:26.951 you know, tracing back, so your early life was living 0:17:26.951 --> 0:17:31.951 on country, living in pretty humble, beautiful spiritual place in beginnings, 0:17:32.031 --> 0:17:34.551 and I guess how that sort of like transcends the 0:17:34.631 --> 0:17:39.191 lessons of your mom, understand Bronwan Bancruft, Your mom, Yeah, deadly, 0:17:40.031 --> 0:17:42.911 and just that sort of that early experience, like you say, 0:17:42.991 --> 0:17:46.111 living on country, off grid before it was kind of trending, 0:17:46.311 --> 0:17:48.271 and then I guess, yeah, interesting to hear that you 0:17:48.471 --> 0:17:51.151 had to abandon all that you sort of had learned 0:17:51.471 --> 0:17:53.751 in search for something that you didn't quite know you 0:17:53.871 --> 0:17:57.111 needed until you found it. And even even the language. 0:17:57.391 --> 0:18:00.271 I mean, it's interesting decolonization in a way too, because 0:18:00.271 --> 0:18:03.111 it still does very much center the colony, isn't it. 0:18:03.111 --> 0:18:05.991 It's still using that language. But so I imagine coming 0:18:06.071 --> 0:18:09.191 to this realization, meeting this beautiful person, but first and foremost, 0:18:09.271 --> 0:18:12.751 going on that real journey for yourself in naming your 0:18:12.791 --> 0:18:16.151 experience would be pretty pretty powerful. I want to just 0:18:16.231 --> 0:18:18.751 quickly ask about your mom. You know, what lessons do 0:18:18.831 --> 0:18:21.711 you think your mom sort of instilled in you in 0:18:21.791 --> 0:18:23.391 this sort of conversation as well? 0:18:23.551 --> 0:18:25.631 Oh my god, she's like everything. 0:18:25.751 --> 0:18:29.191 She's my greatest mentor my biggest teacher, my best friend, 0:18:29.431 --> 0:18:32.991 sometimes my daughter sometimes, you know, And. 0:18:32.911 --> 0:18:34.031 What a journey we've been on. 0:18:34.071 --> 0:18:34.231 You know. 0:18:34.351 --> 0:18:35.831 My mom was also a single mom. 0:18:36.391 --> 0:18:40.071 She also had my sissy eleven years apart, so I 0:18:40.151 --> 0:18:43.351 was her birthing partner and I helped bring my sissy 0:18:43.431 --> 0:18:45.711 out of my mom and cut her in bilical cord. 0:18:45.791 --> 0:18:50.231 And we've just had such a life together, like She's 0:18:50.271 --> 0:18:52.831 taught me everything, and she is the reason I am 0:18:52.871 --> 0:18:53.911 the woman I am today. 0:18:53.991 --> 0:18:54.871 You know, I. 0:18:54.831 --> 0:18:58.031 Always say to people, I was raised by a proud Indigenous, 0:18:58.111 --> 0:19:01.671 independent single woman, and that's how I feel now that 0:19:01.711 --> 0:19:02.471 I'm an adult. 0:19:02.711 --> 0:19:05.671 My mom always to me, you never through action, not 0:19:05.791 --> 0:19:06.351 just through. 0:19:06.191 --> 0:19:09.831 Words, but you never value your worth in the gaze 0:19:09.871 --> 0:19:12.311 of whoever your partner is. You know, you don't look 0:19:12.351 --> 0:19:15.031 for somebody else to tell you what you are and 0:19:15.111 --> 0:19:18.031 who you are. You find that within yourself. She always 0:19:18.031 --> 0:19:21.071 taught me to be grassroots and never go too big. 0:19:21.311 --> 0:19:23.751 She always taught me, I never rise until I bring 0:19:23.791 --> 0:19:26.551 my community with me. And even just getting the privilege 0:19:26.591 --> 0:19:30.311 of being able to be raised around her storytelling through 0:19:30.431 --> 0:19:34.551 her visual artwork and the Indigenous community that welcomed u 0:19:34.631 --> 0:19:39.631 Song Gadigl and you know, made us family, was just. 0:19:39.711 --> 0:19:42.391 The best experience. Like, I'm so stoked that I picked 0:19:42.431 --> 0:19:43.191 ITR to be my mum. 0:19:43.311 --> 0:19:47.351 I really also only ever seen her work so hard. 0:19:47.431 --> 0:19:50.591 You know, she doesn't really take holidays, and not that 0:19:50.671 --> 0:19:53.191 I think that's a good thing, but her fight is 0:19:53.191 --> 0:19:57.191 for her people and know her stories and keeping our 0:19:57.271 --> 0:20:00.071 culture really strong and alive, even in the face of 0:20:00.471 --> 0:20:02.871 growing up in a small country town where there wasn't 0:20:02.911 --> 0:20:07.031 actually many other Indigenous families either, you know, So I 0:20:07.231 --> 0:20:09.991 just she's everything to me, and I don't know like 0:20:10.071 --> 0:20:12.671 other people who are listening. You know, when you have 0:20:12.791 --> 0:20:16.711 an Indigenous mother, it's like they are everything for you. 0:20:17.271 --> 0:20:20.551 In the colony, they tend to disregard their elders. But 0:20:21.071 --> 0:20:23.191 my mom is going to be by my side until 0:20:23.271 --> 0:20:25.911 the day she goes, and I will be looking after 0:20:25.951 --> 0:20:28.151 her the way she looked after me, because that is 0:20:28.191 --> 0:20:30.431 what the reciprocity of relationships look like. 0:20:30.711 --> 0:20:35.071 Well, she sounds like a pretty fierce and loving and 0:20:35.231 --> 0:20:39.151 staunt person and has instilled some beautiful values in you. 0:20:39.231 --> 0:20:42.791 And I'd love to sit around the campfire with someone 0:20:42.831 --> 0:20:44.871 like you and your mum one day, because yeah, I 0:20:44.871 --> 0:20:48.911 can only imagine the yarns and that sharing and reciprocity 0:20:48.991 --> 0:20:51.591 that shared. Yeah, and I think it's such a powerful 0:20:51.631 --> 0:20:55.831 act of resistance to raise strong black kids, our jar gems. 0:20:56.231 --> 0:20:59.631 You know, we are trying to seek love in a 0:20:59.671 --> 0:21:02.471 world that doesn't really love us that and so it's 0:21:02.471 --> 0:21:07.271 so powerful to to raise self assured and strong and 0:21:07.791 --> 0:21:11.551 loving black kids. So good on, your mum did a 0:21:11.551 --> 0:21:14.071 great job, and it's funny, my daughter's actually going to 0:21:14.151 --> 0:21:14.791 be a Gemini. 0:21:15.031 --> 0:21:16.231 So good ways. 0:21:17.871 --> 0:21:19.871 Because we got a bad rap, but it's just because 0:21:19.871 --> 0:21:22.511 we're mutable and we can flou in every single space. 0:21:24.351 --> 0:21:26.911 I heard and also really talkative I hear, and I'm like, 0:21:26.951 --> 0:21:29.751 oh god, I love ya. So my partner might I hear. 0:21:29.791 --> 0:21:33.071