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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the

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Speaker 1: time poor parent who just wants answers. Now, Hello and

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Speaker 1: welcome to the Happy Families Podcast. This is doctor Justin Colson,

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Speaker 1: dad to six kids, author of nine books and counting.

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Speaker 1: Every Tuesday on the pod, I answer your questions. I

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Speaker 1: love this. I love Tuesdays. I get to answer the

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Speaker 1: questions that you're asking about how to make your family happier.

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Speaker 1: If you would like to submit a question, go to

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Speaker 1: Happy families dot com dot au. You can click on

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Speaker 1: the podcasts link and then push the record button. It's

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Speaker 1: so simple you can do what Lisa has done.

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Speaker 2: Hi Grimes, I'm Lisa from the Central Coast in New

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Speaker 2: South Wales. Talk to me about ADHD and odd in preschoolers.

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Speaker 2: What is early finds of this and what's just being three?

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Speaker 2: I'd love to know some tips on how to manage

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Speaker 2: that behavior and for how to get help if it is, yeah,

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Speaker 2: something that needs to be diagnosed.

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Speaker 1: Thanks guys, Love you Rick, Lisa from the Central Coast,

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Speaker 1: so glad to hear from you. Love the Central Coast.

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Speaker 1: I grew up there. Let me go down memory lane

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Speaker 1: for a sec before I answer these questions. I grew

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Speaker 1: up at Niagara Park. When my local school was Niagara

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Speaker 1: Park Primary School. I lived in Joppa Street. Used to

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Speaker 1: walk to school even as a kid, like six years

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Speaker 1: of age. I'd walk up over the hill, down the

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Speaker 1: huge footpath, ramp up this really steep or down this

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Speaker 1: really steep incline, decline across the road, go to Nigra

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Speaker 1: Park School. There's a little shopping center just in there.

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Speaker 1: I used to steal twenty cent coins from my parents

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Speaker 1: and run into the shopping center and spend it on

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Speaker 1: that video game called nineteen forty eight I think it

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Speaker 1: was forty eight, the World War II fighter plane sort

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Speaker 1: of game. And then when we got a little bit older,

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Speaker 1: I moved across to Erina. Lived just behind Aeron Affair,

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Speaker 1: not too far from there. Before that whole area was

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Speaker 1: developed one in a quarter acres. It was just fantastic.

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Speaker 1: Used to climb up the back of kingcom Out and

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Speaker 1: check the surf and then go down to Aeron Affair

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Speaker 1: and catch buses to the beach, Terryble Beach, Warmbra Beach,

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Speaker 1: Forester's Beach, of Ookra and Northovoka Copra and Max. My

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Speaker 1: first job was at the Woolworths at Aeron affair. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: I digress. Great place, what a great place to raise

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Speaker 1: a family. Absolutely beautiful, Lisa, You're in a fantastic place

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Speaker 1: for those kids. But obviously I mean the I can

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Speaker 1: hear the challenge in your voice. Raising little kids is hard,

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Speaker 1: and I totally get what you're saying. Does my three

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Speaker 1: year old have ADHD? I'll tell you why. This is

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Speaker 1: a time of enormous, just explosive brain development. Through those

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Speaker 1: first early years of life. The brain creates literally billions

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Speaker 1: of neurons synaptic connections, and this is just such an

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Speaker 1: explosive time in an in a child's brain, and there's

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Speaker 1: so much going on there that they really have a

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Speaker 1: hard time trying to figure out how to do life.

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Speaker 1: As a result of four things, most parents of two

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Speaker 1: and three and four and even five year olds will struggle. Now,

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Speaker 1: I've got an entire webinar about this called Little People,

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Speaker 1: Big Feelings. It's on the Happy Family's website. For the

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Speaker 1: small price that it will cost you, I would highly

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Speaker 1: recommend it. It'll make a difference. But let me give

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Speaker 1: you like a five minute summary. Four things that can

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Speaker 1: make these young years really challenging. Number One, limited language capacity,

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Speaker 1: so your child doesn't have a whole lot of words,

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Speaker 1: especially around the age of two or three or four,

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Speaker 1: and quite often when they're driving as crazy, we'll say

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Speaker 1: things like use your words, but they don't have the vocabulary.

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Speaker 1: They can't really tell us what's going on. It's very

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Speaker 1: unusual for you to say to a child, what's happening

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Speaker 1: and for them to look at you and say, so

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Speaker 1: glad you asked, mum, let me describe to you everything

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Speaker 1: that's happened in the last fifteen minutes that is alleged.

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Speaker 1: And they don't have the self awareness. Even if they

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Speaker 1: had the language, they don't have the self awareness, the

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Speaker 1: cognitive capacity to reflect on what's going on. They really

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Speaker 1: are hugely reactive, which leads me to items two and

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Speaker 1: three on this important four point list. They have limited

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Speaker 1: emotional regulation, and obviously, when you can't regulate your emotions,

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Speaker 1: extremely hard to regulate your behaviors. Therefore, with limited language

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Speaker 1: and emotion regulation that's just beginning to develop. I mean

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Speaker 1: this starts around about three, and I know plenty of

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Speaker 1: adults that still don't regulate their emotions well. But usually

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Speaker 1: you can. You can regulate your emotions reasonably well under

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Speaker 1: most circumstances somewhere around about the age of nine, based

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Speaker 1: on what developmental psychologist research has pointed to somewhere about nine.

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Speaker 1: So you're dealing with a three year old who's going

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Speaker 1: to fly off the handle with big emotions and the

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Speaker 1: big behaviors follow. One more, really big challenge that you

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Speaker 1: have with kids this age is they haven't yet developed

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Speaker 1: this thing that psychologists call theory of mind. It's just

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Speaker 1: a fancy way of saying perspective taking. That is, am

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Speaker 1: I able to get that somebody in my environment wants

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Speaker 1: something different to me. When Mum says it's time to

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Speaker 1: leave the park and I don't want to do I

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Speaker 1: understand that there is another agenda operating here. And the

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Speaker 1: simple reality is that kids under about the age of

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Speaker 1: five ish don't get it. Most research points to four

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Speaker 1: and a half to five and a half being the

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Speaker 1: developmental stage where theory of mind or perspective taking kicks in.

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Speaker 1: Now there is some more recent research, it's still a

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Speaker 1: point of contention that suggests that it could even be

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Speaker 1: later as late as seven. But we're talking about averages here.

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Speaker 1: We know that boys develop neurologically more slowly than girls,

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Speaker 1: and we also know that when it comes to things

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Speaker 1: like ADHD, which is widely and fairly well accepted as

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Speaker 1: a neurological disorder, we know that this is going to

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Speaker 1: slow down regulation and inhibition. Even more so, it's not

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Speaker 1: unusual for ADHD kids to not really get a handle

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Speaker 1: on their emotional regulation until they're I don't know, eleven

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Speaker 1: or twelve, especially if they're boys. And of course that's

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Speaker 1: when they step into adolescence and the brain goes through

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Speaker 1: another huge explosion and there's a whole lot of new

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Speaker 1: neural wiring and neural development occurring. So, Lisa, based on

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Speaker 1: what you're describing, I'm really, really, really reluctant to suggest

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Speaker 1: that ADHD could be a thing or even odd. Let

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Speaker 1: me go through some stats for you. ADHD stands for

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Speaker 1: attention deficit hyperactivity disorder. Ultimately, it's a disorder of inhibition,

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Speaker 1: that is, regulation of emotions and behaviors is limited treatment.

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Speaker 1: I've seen it happening with kids from the age of

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Speaker 1: two or three. I think that's crazy. I actually think

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Speaker 1: except in the most extreme cases, it's unconscionable, and I

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Speaker 1: just don't believe that it's appropriate when you're dealing with

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Speaker 1: all of the other developmental realities of that age group.

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Speaker 1: Peak diagnosis somewhere between five and ten years of age.

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Speaker 1: That's where most kids are getting the diagnosis. Usually, usually

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Speaker 1: you've got to be at least five before any pediatrician,

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Speaker 1: GP psychologists, psychiatrist is going to step in and say, yep,

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Speaker 1: I think we've got ADHD here. Like I said, got

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Speaker 1: to be pretty extreme for it to happen below the

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Speaker 1: age of five. Prevalence somewhere between six and ten percent

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Speaker 1: of Aussie kids have a diagnosis of ADHD. That's based

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Speaker 1: on twenty twenty three National Institute of Health data, so

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Speaker 1: that it is pretty well up to date. It is

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Speaker 1: the most diagnosed disorder for kids under about the age

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Speaker 1: of twelve to fourteen, depending on what DADI you look at. Now,

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Speaker 1: ODD oppositional defiant disorder. Once again, when you look at

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Speaker 1: the reality of development for children under the age of

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Speaker 1: five or six, it's just not appropriate for us to

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Speaker 1: say that a kid, a little kid's got ODD. Around

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Speaker 1: about three percent of children are diagnosed with ODD. It

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Speaker 1: co occurs with ADHD a lot, but typically you won't

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Speaker 1: get an ODD diagnosis until the age of eight ARP. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so what do we do if Lisa, you're feeling the

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Speaker 1: way you're feeling, and you're looking at looking at this

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Speaker 1: three rod and going, oh, my goodness, what in the

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Speaker 1: world is going on here? Look, kids are tolf, they're exhausting,

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Speaker 1: they've got their l plates on. They are really really challenging.

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Speaker 1: And in a world where we have lost our village,

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Speaker 1: a world where there is limited social support, where we

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Speaker 1: don't have aunties and grandma's and uncles and grandpa, and

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Speaker 1: we don't have lots of big siblings, and we don't

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Speaker 1: have cohorts of kids running around and supporting each other,

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Speaker 1: and we're trying to raise our kids within the confines

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Speaker 1: of the four walls of our house. This is the

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Speaker 1: stuff that's not natural, what we're doing in terms of

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Speaker 1: what society demands of parents today. It's not fair, it's

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Speaker 1: not natural. It's reality. I don't know what we can

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Speaker 1: do about it. But what you're dealing with is the

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Speaker 1: reality of a system that has been built up around

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Speaker 1: our children that does not cater for them. The world

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Speaker 1: is not kind in catering for kids. Here are a

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Speaker 1: couple of things that they need. Number One, when you've

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Speaker 1: got a three year old, they need physical activity. Ideally,

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Speaker 1: mixed with a whole lot of social activity, in other words,

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Speaker 1: free play with friends. What I'm talking about as many

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Speaker 1: hours per day as possible. Play has been widely called

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Speaker 1: the work of childhood. And how many hours a day

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Speaker 1: do we work? Well, six, eight, ten hours a day.

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Speaker 1: I don't think that it's appropriate. I don't think it's

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Speaker 1: possible for us to realistically have our kids playing for

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Speaker 1: six or eight or ten hours a day. Good luck

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Speaker 1: with that if you're paying rent and mortgages and that

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Speaker 1: kind of thing. The world's demands are inappropriate for child development, health,

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Speaker 1: child development, and so this is a really big challenge.

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Speaker 1: But what I basically say is, if you're worried about

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Speaker 1: your child's behavior and they are behaving in these adhd

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Speaker 1: odd kinds of ways, I reckon it's because they need

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Speaker 1: more physical activity or play, more social engagement. Secondly, brings

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Speaker 1: screen time as close to zero as possible. And third

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Speaker 1: big behaviors in this age group are totally normal. So

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Speaker 1: when this happens, remember this is an issue of inhibition

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Speaker 1: and regulation because they don't know how to do it yet.

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Speaker 1: It's a slow process. From about the age of three

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Speaker 1: through to about the age of nine, they get better

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Speaker 1: and better as they go on. Talk to any kindergarten

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Speaker 1: teacher they don't. They'll just say the kids are not

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Speaker 1: very good at this. By the time they get to

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Speaker 1: grade three, they've mostly got it dialed in most of

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Speaker 1: the time. So your child needs empathy, your child needs

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Speaker 1: developmentally appropriate limits, but mostly lots of kindness and lots

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Speaker 1: of understanding. I really hope that that's a helpful summary

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Speaker 1: of where we're at and why we don't diagnose young

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Speaker 1: kids with ADHD and ODD. If you're looking for more resources,

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Speaker 1: check out my webinar Little People, Big Feelings or my

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Speaker 1: book What Your Child Needs from You. Both are available

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Speaker 1: at Happy Families dot com dot au. I think they're

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Speaker 1: going to make a really big difference. Question number two.

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Speaker 3: Hi Jain and Kyle. My name is Jess. I'm a

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Speaker 3: mum of four boys and we have a neurodivergent family.

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Speaker 3: We have ADHD, especially myself, and what I find is

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Speaker 3: that there is not a lot of information regarding about

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Speaker 3: parents with ADHD and how to navigate life stresses and

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Speaker 3: their own, you know, neurodivergent issues on top of the

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Speaker 3: chaos that kids come along with their what because most

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Speaker 3: of it's kind of like towards their research on kids.

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Speaker 3: So I just want to see if we go have

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Speaker 3: a podcast about that.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Okay, Jess really appreciate the question. A prevalence

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Speaker 1: of adult ADHD somewhere between two and six percent in Australia,

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Speaker 1: so that means approximately eight hundred thousand adults are walking

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Speaker 1: around Australia right now with ADHD. That is adult Australians

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Speaker 1: who are a little bit hyperactive, a little bit impulsive,

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Speaker 1: a little bit intentive and just struggling to hold it

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Speaker 1: all together. Also much more likely if you have ADHD

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Speaker 1: that your kids will as well, which only compounds the challenges.

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Speaker 1: Once again, that's based on May twenty twenty three National

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Speaker 1: Institut of Health data here in Australia. So what do

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Speaker 1: I recommend as a grown up? You've made it this far,

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Speaker 1: You've functioned, Okay, Obviously there's all sorts of challenges that

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Speaker 1: are associated with it. I really do relate to this fundamentally.

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Speaker 1: If it's about inhibition and regulation, it's about setting up

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Speaker 1: systems that require you to rely less on will power

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Speaker 1: and that kind of push you through the day and

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Speaker 1: you can kind of you can get into the flow

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Speaker 1: of I do this, then I do this, then I

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Speaker 1: do that, then I do that. And it's about minimizing

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Speaker 1: the distractions, minimizing the things that are going to pull

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Speaker 1: you away from the things that matter most. Oh, by

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Speaker 1: the way, our world has been designed to make that

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Speaker 1: increasingly hard, and of course adult adhd amplifies, magnifies, just

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Speaker 1: makes it even harder. Again, here are three ideas that

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Speaker 1: might be helpful. Number one, get enough sleep. The more

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Speaker 1: sleep you have, that is, the more well rested you are,

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Speaker 1: the better you'll be as a parent, The more you'll

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Speaker 1: be able to regulate, the more effectively you'll be able

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Speaker 1: to engage with the day and do the stuff that

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Speaker 1: you need to do. Number two, I'm going to recommend

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Speaker 1: that you get organized. And I don't know that's counterintuitive

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Speaker 1: and antithetical to everything that your brain wants to do,

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Speaker 1: but that's why you need it so much. So sit

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Speaker 1: down and develop literally map it out. Here's my routine,

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Speaker 1: here's my structure, here's my schedule, here are my lists,

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Speaker 1: this is what I'm doing on Mondays, this is what

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Speaker 1: I'm doing on Fridays. Get the calendar out, cluster your tasks.

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Speaker 1: And number three, I would say, minimize distractions, turn off

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Speaker 1: your notifications on your device, hide the phone. Because the

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Speaker 1: digital world is fuel to a fire, especially for an

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Speaker 1: adult with ADHD. It just it pulls you away from

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Speaker 1: all the stuff that matters. The more you can reduce

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Speaker 1: your interactions with electronic media digital media, the better off

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Speaker 1: you're going to be. There's a handful of websites. If

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Speaker 1: you just google around the players and say what do

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Speaker 1: I do? I'm an adult, I'm a parent with ADHD,

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Speaker 1: and I can't get organized. There's a handful of really

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Speaker 1: helpful websites that are out there. Lists, there's some youtubes.

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Speaker 1: Of course, you could go down the rabbit hole and

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Speaker 1: spend days there. So just find one that's got a

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Speaker 1: good list of ten or twenty things, pick out the

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Speaker 1: two or three that you think are going to move

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Speaker 1: the needle the most, and then get organized after that.

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Speaker 1: Inhibition regulation, try to hold it together. That's going to

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Speaker 1: be the hardest thing. But if you can, you're going

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Speaker 1: to find that your functionality increases. Your adaptability and healthy

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Speaker 1: capacity to deal with it is going to be magnified,

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Speaker 1: and you will make progress. Hard work, lots of challenges,

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Speaker 1: that's life. I get it, I really, really really get it, Jess,

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Speaker 1: Thanks so much for the question. Lisa, you as well.

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Speaker 1: Big day about ADHD today. You know what, when I'm

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Speaker 1: traveling around and speaking with parents, it's one of the

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Speaker 1: most commonly asked questions. Whether it's child or adult ADHD.

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Speaker 1: People really want to know. It's a real pain point

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Speaker 1: right now, so I'm glad we could answer those two today.

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Speaker 1: Tomorrow we're back with the Happy Families podcast and more

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Speaker 1: to make your family flourish. Thanks so much for listening.

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Speaker 1: If you'd like to submit a question Happy families dot

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Speaker 1: com dot Au, click on the podcasts link press record.

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Speaker 1: It's that simple. More questions being answered next Tuesday on

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Speaker 1: the pod. The Happy Family's podcast is produced by Justin

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Speaker 1: Roland from Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer.

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Speaker 1: For more information about how to make your family happier,

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Speaker 1: Happy Families dot com dot Au.