1 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: In twenty nineteen, middle distance runner Katrina Bissett became the 2 00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:12,559 Speaker 1: first Australian woman in a decade to break the two 3 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 1: minute barrier in the eight hundred meters. 4 00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 2: Later that year, she set. 5 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:20,160 Speaker 1: A new Australian record of one fifty eight point seven eight, 6 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:24,800 Speaker 1: surpassing the forty three year old record set by Charlie Rendina, 7 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,159 Speaker 1: one of the most dominant middle distance runners in the 8 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 1: world that year. Katrina describes her return to the sport 9 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:34,360 Speaker 1: as a happy accident after nearly a decade away from the. 10 00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 2: Sport while battling and eating disorder. 11 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:39,640 Speaker 1: One of my favorite parts of this episode was Katrina's 12 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 1: discussion around her post graduate degree in architecture and in 13 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:46,239 Speaker 1: particular her thesis on running tracks. 14 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:47,760 Speaker 3: A really beautiful. 15 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 1: Connection that she feels between movement and making spaces a home. 16 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 1: I hope you enjoy this one, Katrina. Welcome to the 17 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 1: Female Athlete Project. 18 00:00:57,520 --> 00:01:01,600 Speaker 2: Hey Chloie, thanks for having me. Very excited, big fan 19 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:02,520 Speaker 2: of yourers as well. 20 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:03,840 Speaker 3: Thank you very much. 21 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:05,959 Speaker 1: We've had a bit of a chat off air, and 22 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:10,200 Speaker 1: I'm very much looking forward to this discussion Bes and 23 00:01:10,240 --> 00:01:12,960 Speaker 1: I as we host our weekly podcast. We've followed you 24 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:15,000 Speaker 1: for a long time and your running career, and we 25 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 1: love kind of cheering you on from a far so 26 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:19,120 Speaker 1: it's often a really special opportunity for us to actually 27 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 1: get to know you a little bit better, and for 28 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:23,040 Speaker 1: our audience and followers to get to know you a 29 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:25,920 Speaker 1: little bit better as well. Can we take a look 30 00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:29,840 Speaker 1: back at your childhood? Can you describe yourself as a 31 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:30,399 Speaker 1: little kid. 32 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:34,679 Speaker 2: I think the best way I can describe like my 33 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:38,800 Speaker 2: childhood is like the relationship with my parents and also 34 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 2: my relationship to the landscape of canber So. I grew 35 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:45,640 Speaker 2: up in Canberra, and I don't know if you've spent 36 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 2: much time there, but it's like it's like a bush capital, right, 37 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 2: So there's a lot of trails, lots of mountains, lots 38 00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 2: of bush land, lots of ovals, just a lot of 39 00:01:56,480 --> 00:02:00,559 Speaker 2: open space and just a really beautiful place to grow 40 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 2: up as a runner and as an active kid, so 41 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:06,960 Speaker 2: I did a lot. So a lot of my running 42 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:09,880 Speaker 2: was just centered around my relationship with my dad. So 43 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:14,079 Speaker 2: he is a well not anymore. He's like seventy five 44 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 2: now and like super injured all the time. He's got 45 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:21,400 Speaker 2: like old man cars or whatever they say. But before 46 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 2: when I was a kid, he was like a really 47 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 2: good distance runner, and yeah, we would just go on 48 00:02:27,600 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 2: these really long runs through Canberra, through like the fire 49 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 2: trails around like Mount Taylor, and yeah we would just 50 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 2: talk about you know, like school and my friends, and yeah, 51 00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 2: those are like my strongest memories of being an active 52 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 2: running kid. And I did the whole little athletics thing 53 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 2: from when I was like a six year old and 54 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 2: that was amazing. And that was something I did with 55 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:59,400 Speaker 2: my mom, was like going to little athletics on Saturday 56 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 2: mornings and she would always volunteer and she was like 57 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:09,360 Speaker 2: a champion shop putter in her youth, so nice. My 58 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,800 Speaker 2: dad would always be like the distance running guy, and 59 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:14,960 Speaker 2: then my mom would teach me how to do like 60 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:18,560 Speaker 2: the cool shot put spinning technique and stuff. So I 61 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 2: was like this like super elite, like seven year old 62 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 2: do it. Well, that's not true, but I was like 63 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:31,799 Speaker 2: dominating the multi events, but yeah, that's that's definitely. Yeah, 64 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 2: that was what I was like as a kid. I was. 65 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 2: I was very active. I also played other sports like 66 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:40,080 Speaker 2: swimming and netball and touch boody, but yeah, I think 67 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 2: just spending that time with my parents was in sharing 68 00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:48,520 Speaker 2: athletics with them that's where I really and yeah, I 69 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:50,680 Speaker 2: really enjoyed myself as a kid. 70 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 1: Did you ever have a look at something like keptathon 71 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: with like your multi sports skills? 72 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:01,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, in hindsight, I'm like hmm, And even now I'm like, 73 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 2: well maybe that would be really fun. No, I kind 74 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:09,200 Speaker 2: of I always really loved running. That was definitely my favorite. 75 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:13,320 Speaker 2: Like sprinting middle distance that was my Yeah, that was 76 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 2: my big thing, even though like I loved the field events, 77 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:18,440 Speaker 2: my heart wasn't running. 78 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 1: It's interesting the way you describe your connection and kind 79 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: of those core memories with nature and your parents, they 80 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:28,640 Speaker 1: seem like quite powerful connections to the sport. Like I 81 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:31,919 Speaker 1: think a lot of kids that, like everyone has their 82 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:33,800 Speaker 1: different stories, right, Like some people kind of just fall 83 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 1: into sport or the siblings are doing or whatever. But 84 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:37,840 Speaker 1: it sounds like your connection is quite a powerful one 85 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:38,239 Speaker 1: to sport. 86 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:41,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it's something that has carried on 87 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 2: through my life as well of like yeah, yeah, how 88 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,600 Speaker 2: would I describe it? And I think, like, so, I 89 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:56,599 Speaker 2: ended up studying architecture and a big part of looking 90 00:04:56,920 --> 00:05:01,479 Speaker 2: like studying architecture is the relationship between people in space, 91 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 2: and I think so I've had a lot of time 92 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 2: to sort of reflect on my past and how movement 93 00:05:08,880 --> 00:05:14,280 Speaker 2: and being in these different places really form those strong connections, 94 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 2: just connections, and that can be things like really mundane 95 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:21,240 Speaker 2: everyday rituals like just going out for a run in 96 00:05:21,240 --> 00:05:27,279 Speaker 2: your local area, and how that really connects me to 97 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:31,359 Speaker 2: Canberra and to my home city and like, and I 98 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 2: think like bringing that with me across around the world 99 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:38,159 Speaker 2: now traveling as a professional athlete being based in Melbourne. Now, 100 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:41,680 Speaker 2: it's like that's how I cultivate a sense of home, 101 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 2: is like through the action of running and just the 102 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:51,040 Speaker 2: repetitive like going to Collingwood Athletics Track, my local track, 103 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 2: and and like that's where I feel a sense of 104 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 2: home because I go there and I, yeah, it smells 105 00:05:58,880 --> 00:06:01,480 Speaker 2: the same, like I'm from me with like the sound 106 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 2: of the cars driving cars, of the birds, of like 107 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 2: experiencing the seasons across the year like in the same place. Like, yeah, 108 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 2: it's that's I think it is a really I think 109 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:17,479 Speaker 2: a lot of sports people have that powerful connection to 110 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:21,279 Speaker 2: place and like their relationships to other people just through 111 00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 2: sharing sport. 112 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:24,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's quite a beautiful thing. 113 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 1: Have you noticed, like from the general population, You're obviously 114 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:29,840 Speaker 1: at the very elite of the elite, but general pot 115 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,040 Speaker 1: there's obviously been a lot more people taking up running, 116 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 1: joining run clubs and things like that. Do you think 117 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 1: that's that connection that people have the ability to make 118 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:38,240 Speaker 1: through something like running. 119 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 2: I think it's like, yeah, people are getting addicted to 120 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:48,040 Speaker 2: it's just the rituals of it, and like, we don't 121 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 2: have a lot of opportunities out yeah, especially as an 122 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:56,039 Speaker 2: adult of like if you're you know, not a religious 123 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 2: person or have a really you know, like strong hobbies 124 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:02,039 Speaker 2: or community, to just meet up with a group of 125 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 2: people at a certain time of the day and just 126 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:05,800 Speaker 2: be out in nature and it doesn't matter what the 127 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:09,520 Speaker 2: weather is like. And I also think that sort of 128 00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 2: what's the word for it, like incidental interaction or connection 129 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 2: and that sort of thing is like I think there's 130 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 2: been studies and stuff on this sort of thing, like 131 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:26,440 Speaker 2: that's that's how you develop strong bonds and relationships. It's 132 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 2: just yeah, sharing those those everyday experiences and that sort 133 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 2: of thing. Yeah, And I think running is perfectly that. 134 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:39,560 Speaker 2: I remember having a podcast actually a while ago talking 135 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,120 Speaker 2: about like the parallel of like when you go for 136 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:44,320 Speaker 2: a job with a friend and you can have some 137 00:07:44,400 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 2: of the most deep and like the biggest dnms because 138 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:52,600 Speaker 2: you're just like it's like a contained amount of time 139 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:56,960 Speaker 2: and you're doing one task, and it's also like you're 140 00:07:56,960 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 2: not looking at each other, like there's no none of 141 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:02,120 Speaker 2: the social etiquettes social pressures of like making eye contact. 142 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 2: And you know, like how sometimes you have the best 143 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:07,680 Speaker 2: conversations when you're in a long road trip with a 144 00:08:07,760 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 2: friend and you're not looking at each other, and it's 145 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:13,720 Speaker 2: like it's there something there's something to that of just 146 00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:18,280 Speaker 2: like this this shared movement where you're not really like 147 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 2: set out to have a big DMM, but it just 148 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 2: sort of comes. You just feel really comfortable together. 149 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's not something that I'd really thought about, 150 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 1: but it does. It makes sense when you're not in 151 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 1: this not that it's a forced environment when you're making 152 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 1: eye contact and spending time like that, but it is. 153 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:37,199 Speaker 1: It's it's quite comfortable space for people, well, people who 154 00:08:37,200 --> 00:08:38,960 Speaker 1: are fit enough to be able to breathe and run 155 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:40,320 Speaker 1: and talk at the same time. 156 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 2: Imagine it, I mean walking. Yeah, like, well, i's good 157 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:47,480 Speaker 2: super advocate for Warkshop. 158 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:50,600 Speaker 3: I love it nice. I like that. 159 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 1: So take us back to your day's little athletics. What 160 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: did that look like for you heading into your teenage years. 161 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:00,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, so this is one of the I guess, non 162 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 2: atypical parts of my transition into being a professional athlete 163 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:08,760 Speaker 2: that I've talked about quite a lot, and I'm a 164 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:12,000 Speaker 2: huge advocate for talking more about, which is that, Yeah, 165 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:17,320 Speaker 2: I had a long stretch of really bad mental health issue. 166 00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 2: So towards the end of my high school and early 167 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:26,200 Speaker 2: early university, had a lot of had a lot of 168 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:32,760 Speaker 2: trouble with an eating disorder, depression, and anxiety that really 169 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:35,720 Speaker 2: made it hard for me to just do all the 170 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:39,680 Speaker 2: things that I wanted to do. And yeah, I gave 171 00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:43,040 Speaker 2: up running for a long time and really fell out 172 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 2: of love for it because a lot of young athletes, 173 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:50,280 Speaker 2: I think, especially when your body is growing and changing 174 00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:56,440 Speaker 2: female athletes, that time transitioning from like a junior to 175 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 2: a senior is really tricky because you have all of 176 00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:03,080 Speaker 2: the other life pressures of you know, going to UNI 177 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:05,319 Speaker 2: and moving out of home for the first time. And 178 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 2: I think definitely the eating just sort of was exacerbated 179 00:10:09,520 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 2: by a lot of the pressures on young young athletes 180 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:19,000 Speaker 2: of being skinny, being you know, little professionals. When you're 181 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:24,000 Speaker 2: sixteen year old when you should just be having a 182 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:30,719 Speaker 2: fun time. So yeah, I definitely I'm even hesitant to 183 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 2: say that I stepped away because a part of me 184 00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 2: really wanted to still be an athlete, but I was 185 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:40,120 Speaker 2: just too sick to be able to pursue that part 186 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:43,440 Speaker 2: of myself, and so I never really consciously stepped away. 187 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:47,319 Speaker 2: I was kind of like forced to make other decisions 188 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:50,960 Speaker 2: because it was no longer a bible career path for me. 189 00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:55,560 Speaker 2: But yeah, then it kind of, you know, opened up 190 00:10:55,640 --> 00:11:00,440 Speaker 2: things for my academic career. So going to Sydney, I 191 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:03,960 Speaker 2: moving from cambrid to Sydney. I started a bachelor's degree 192 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:09,520 Speaker 2: in architecture, and then I once I finished that, I 193 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:12,760 Speaker 2: worked full time in two different architecture firms in Sydney, 194 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:17,200 Speaker 2: and then moved to Melbourne to start my master's And 195 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 2: that's where I sort of took up running more seriously again, 196 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:23,319 Speaker 2: and yeah, fell in love with it for a second time. 197 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 2: I'd say this time wasn't the sort of purity as 198 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 2: it was as in simplicity as I was as a kid, 199 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:34,319 Speaker 2: but still a lot of the same thing. It was 200 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 2: things of like remembering how much just like some of 201 00:11:38,480 --> 00:11:43,160 Speaker 2: the most beautiful runs through our bend in Melbourne, like 202 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 2: discovering Melbourne as a city through running basically, and all 203 00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:52,800 Speaker 2: my early friendships in Melbourne was through the running groups 204 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 2: and that sort of thing, And yeah, easily fell back 205 00:11:55,240 --> 00:11:58,719 Speaker 2: into it. And then I sort of describe becoming a 206 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:03,840 Speaker 2: professional athlete as like a happy accident because I never 207 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:07,120 Speaker 2: when like sought that out and was much more focused 208 00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:12,200 Speaker 2: on my master's studies at Melbourne UNI. And yeah, and 209 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:17,640 Speaker 2: then I last year graduated from my studies and have 210 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:22,959 Speaker 2: been juggling being a professional athlete and completing my architecture 211 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:26,960 Speaker 2: studies at the same time. And yeah, in twenty nineteen 212 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 2: that was like my breakout year, and so I undo 213 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 2: contract with Nikes, which enabled me to be able to 214 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:38,760 Speaker 2: pursue all these parts of my life and finally having 215 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 2: like the financial support too. Yeah, and also just like 216 00:12:43,160 --> 00:12:45,520 Speaker 2: how Nike has always been really supportive of these other 217 00:12:45,559 --> 00:12:47,800 Speaker 2: parts of my life as well, and seeing me as 218 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:51,960 Speaker 2: a multi faceted person, not just being the person on 219 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 2: the on the screen at the Diamond Leagues. Yeah, being 220 00:12:58,400 --> 00:13:02,600 Speaker 2: really encouraging of my other interests and career as well. 221 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:06,600 Speaker 1: You talked about that twenty nineteen breakout year How did 222 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:09,240 Speaker 1: it feel for you to the happy accident. 223 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:10,680 Speaker 3: I really like that phrase. It's really cool. 224 00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 1: How did it feel to be thriving in something You 225 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 1: talked about the fact that you wouldn't describe it as 226 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 1: stepping away, but kind of reflecting on what you had 227 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 1: to go through as a teenager to get to that 228 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,720 Speaker 1: point in twenty nineteen to be performing on the world stage. 229 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:28,520 Speaker 2: To be honest, it was. It was fantastic, But at 230 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:33,119 Speaker 2: the same time, it was a massive identity shift for myself. 231 00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:38,680 Speaker 2: Like I think I spent those years away from competitive 232 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:43,480 Speaker 2: running really shedding this identity as a runner. I'm like, I, 233 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:47,359 Speaker 2: you know, as a kid, being a runner, being outdoors 234 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 2: like that was who I was. Everyone knew me for being, 235 00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:55,280 Speaker 2: you know, the sporty girl. And then I really had 236 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:59,880 Speaker 2: to work hard well almost yeah, I guess, reluctantly turn 237 00:14:00,120 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 2: into like the architecture kid, like, you know, pursuing these 238 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:07,000 Speaker 2: other parts of me and then sort of being thrown 239 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:11,280 Speaker 2: into right like and then picking up running again as 240 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 2: a hobby and then you know, finding it myself as 241 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:20,960 Speaker 2: a professional. Like it was incredible but also extremely intense, 242 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:25,440 Speaker 2: this transition where it's like a lot of athletes they 243 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:29,400 Speaker 2: get many years to transition from a junior to a senior. 244 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 2: It's something they're targeting. Where does it happened to me 245 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 2: in about a six month stretch of time of going 246 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:41,760 Speaker 2: from just seeing running as this really serious hobby into 247 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:47,560 Speaker 2: making my first representative team, you know. And I remember 248 00:14:47,880 --> 00:14:53,640 Speaker 2: there was this one race at the University Games in 249 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 2: Sydney where I ran sub two minutes for the first time, 250 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 2: which is like a big deal in the a jama world, 251 00:15:00,720 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 2: and and an sam run. I hadn't done that in 252 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 2: ten years, Like it was a big deal that I 253 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:11,520 Speaker 2: broke through this barrier and I did it at this 254 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 2: really low key I just solo ran this this fantastic 255 00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:19,640 Speaker 2: time and I think it might have even been a 256 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:21,760 Speaker 2: world lead at the time as well. Like it was 257 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 2: just very, very overwhelming, And after the race, I just 258 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:30,040 Speaker 2: burst into tears, like I was just it was just 259 00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 2: so incredibly intense for me, this sudden realization of like 260 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:38,920 Speaker 2: this is bigger than what I thought it was. You know, 261 00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:43,120 Speaker 2: It's like I didn't know that. I like, obviously this 262 00:15:43,160 --> 00:15:46,720 Speaker 2: is fantastic and I'm loving this, but change is really hard. 263 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:50,200 Speaker 2: And then to have the change happened so suddenly it 264 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:53,920 Speaker 2: did take me quite a while to adjust, and then 265 00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:58,440 Speaker 2: and then suddenly it was COVID twenty twenty and I 266 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 2: stepped back into the architecture world again, and who was 267 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 2: just Yeah, It's only really been the last year or 268 00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:12,080 Speaker 2: two where I've properly, properly felt that I am an 269 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:15,840 Speaker 2: architect and I am a professional athlete, and both of 270 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:22,160 Speaker 2: those things are important, and both of those things by careers. Yeah, 271 00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 2: but it was a long period of pushing and pulling 272 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 2: and trying to figure out what on earth I was doing. 273 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:29,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's yeah, it's full on to think that you 274 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:34,080 Speaker 1: go through this immense change and then the pandemic happens, 275 00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:36,560 Speaker 1: and at that point in time, I imagine you're trying to 276 00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:39,160 Speaker 1: qualify for the Tokyo Olympics. 277 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:44,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, one hundred percent exactly. So yeah, both basically being 278 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:48,720 Speaker 2: my first team being twenty nineteen, that being really sudden, 279 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:53,119 Speaker 2: having a huge sort of twelve eighteen months of no competition, 280 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 2: no international competition, and then the next big one being 281 00:16:55,920 --> 00:17:00,120 Speaker 2: the Olympics. So yeah, it was and then especially all 282 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 2: the unknowns around it too, if like whether I was 283 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 2: able to travel, what the restrictions were, and yeah, not 284 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:09,959 Speaker 2: having a crowd at the Tokyo Olympics, like all that 285 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:13,440 Speaker 2: sort of thing. So yeah, it was a lot. 286 00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:17,080 Speaker 1: Quite a bizarre Olympics for there to not be a crowd. 287 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:20,000 Speaker 1: But how did it feel to you to represent your 288 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 1: country over there? 289 00:17:20,960 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 2: It was amazing, It was Yeah, I think about it 290 00:17:25,080 --> 00:17:30,520 Speaker 2: a lot. I like, my partner is he's amazing, but 291 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:34,480 Speaker 2: he's kind of funny. So he he's like a writer 292 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:38,880 Speaker 2: and artist as well. And there he bought this thing. 293 00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:43,160 Speaker 2: It's like a it's this little cylinder and I'm looking 294 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:46,800 Speaker 2: at it now in my living room, but it's called 295 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 2: like time since launch and so basically it's like a 296 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 2: time it just counts you pull this pin and from 297 00:17:56,119 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 2: that second it just counts the time from then onward. 298 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:04,240 Speaker 2: So when I ran the heat of the Olympics, he 299 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:06,560 Speaker 2: pulled the pin on it, and so I think it 300 00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 2: just ticked over one thousand days. So it's like one 301 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:14,200 Speaker 2: thousand days since I became an Olympian. So he made this, 302 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 2: so he got this little time counting capsule kind of thing, 303 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:24,080 Speaker 2: and yeah, I think that sort of that sort of 304 00:18:24,119 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 2: talks to the importance of it, where at the time 305 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:28,960 Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, it's just another race just in the 306 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,640 Speaker 2: cool experience in this crazy you know, last twenty four 307 00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:35,399 Speaker 2: months or whatever. And then yeah, when I look at that, 308 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:38,440 Speaker 2: it's like, oh my god, like I became an Olympian, 309 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:41,040 Speaker 2: Like it's one of those things. I'm sure you experienced 310 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:44,320 Speaker 2: it as well, of like you don't really know that 311 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 2: it's special until it's finished. 312 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:51,159 Speaker 1: Absolutely, it's a weird thing to process. Like I was 313 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,120 Speaker 1: chatting to some of my SEVENS teammates the other day 314 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,680 Speaker 1: and the fact that Rio twenty sixteen was eight years ago, 315 00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:00,280 Speaker 1: like it's just it almost still feels like it was 316 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:02,359 Speaker 1: just a year or two ago, because it's such a 317 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:05,199 Speaker 1: huge thing for your brain to even think, like this 318 00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 1: is what is it something that you always wanted to 319 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:09,200 Speaker 1: do as a young kid. Did you talk to your 320 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: parents about one day becoming an Olympia? Oh? 321 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:15,280 Speaker 2: Absolutely, Yeah, in those early days, like when running was 322 00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 2: my like everything I thought about and wanted to be. Yeah, 323 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:23,200 Speaker 2: I remember telling them about wanting to go to the 324 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:26,840 Speaker 2: Olympics and that sort of thing. But yeah, then really 325 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:31,399 Speaker 2: quickly shedding that and then being that very long chunk 326 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 2: of many years where it was like no, I was 327 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:40,160 Speaker 2: even thinking ridiculous, Yeah, and it was like sad, it's 328 00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 2: kind of sad to think that I really shut that 329 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,560 Speaker 2: all down and then yeah, and then it's all just 330 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,679 Speaker 2: coming back really quickly all these things and having to 331 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 2: remember what I loved so much about running as a kid, 332 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:55,840 Speaker 2: and finally like meeting those two parts, like, yeah, marrying 333 00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 2: those two parts myself together again. 334 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 1: It's quite an amazing thing that you touched on this 335 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:03,760 Speaker 1: idea of elite athletes and who we pictured to be. 336 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 1: Elite athletes often have been training their entire lives, Like 337 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:11,040 Speaker 1: you've really challenged that stereotype in quite an incredible way. 338 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:13,600 Speaker 1: Like I imagine for people hearing your story, that's quite 339 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:15,919 Speaker 1: an empowering thing to challenge what people think you have 340 00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:18,360 Speaker 1: to be to become an Olympian and the very best 341 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:18,920 Speaker 1: at what you do. 342 00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:24,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, I think And that's been one of the 343 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:30,600 Speaker 2: most wonderful things about talking and having this platform and 344 00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 2: talking about my experience, like the number of young women 345 00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:37,119 Speaker 2: coming up to me and being like, oh, I listened 346 00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:40,000 Speaker 2: to your podcasts on you know, X platform, or I 347 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:43,280 Speaker 2: saw you on like this Nike ad or whatever, and 348 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:46,520 Speaker 2: they were like, and so I took up Ronnie again, 349 00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 2: you know, like I had a similar experience where it 350 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,520 Speaker 2: was like, yep, I thought I wasn't good enough. I 351 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 2: didn't look the part. I didn't you know, people telling 352 00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:58,440 Speaker 2: me that, you know, focus on blah blah blah instead, 353 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:01,160 Speaker 2: and then they were and then I heard what you did, 354 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:02,840 Speaker 2: and then I was just like, actually, I really love 355 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:04,720 Speaker 2: running and I'm just gonna I'm going to do it. 356 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:07,920 Speaker 2: I'm not going to care what other people think. And yeah, 357 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,159 Speaker 2: that's that's the best part I think of that, like 358 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:16,440 Speaker 2: having like everyone has a different journey into the sport. 359 00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:20,159 Speaker 2: Like I'm sure the athletes you have had like the 360 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:24,399 Speaker 2: quote unquote typical experience. Would hear me say this and 361 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:31,240 Speaker 2: they're like, what are you talking about? It wasn't easy. Yeah, 362 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:36,320 Speaker 2: So it's all everything's complex and everyone has a different experience. 363 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:38,919 Speaker 3: What you touched on there, that idea of not looking 364 00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:39,640 Speaker 3: the part. 365 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:42,480 Speaker 1: What do you think sport and athletics role can be 366 00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:46,239 Speaker 1: to like really shift people's attitudes about to be an 367 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:47,679 Speaker 1: athlete or to be whoever you want to be. 368 00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:49,600 Speaker 3: You don't have to fit in this perfect box. 369 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:53,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fascinating this shift. In the last you know, 370 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 2: couple of years, we've talked more about body diversity and 371 00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:02,919 Speaker 2: neurdiversity as well, and I mean it's something that like 372 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:05,920 Speaker 2: I've loved about working with Nike as well, like talking 373 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:10,520 Speaker 2: to people like Jared Clifford, for example, who's one a 374 00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 2: good friend of mine. I actually yeah, I interviewed him 375 00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:19,159 Speaker 2: as part of my thesis project, which yeah, we can 376 00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:23,960 Speaker 2: talk about gels through horn into this conversation no matter 377 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 2: what it takes, because I love it so much. But yeah, 378 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:34,879 Speaker 2: talking about people different, different abilities and how yeah, and 379 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 2: like even thinking back of how when I was a 380 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:41,280 Speaker 2: young athlete growing up in Canberra, I would train at 381 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:46,119 Speaker 2: the AIS and it was like that was where the 382 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:51,040 Speaker 2: center of power athletics was in Australia. And so I'd 383 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 2: just be you know, training after school on a Tuesday 384 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:58,280 Speaker 2: afternoon and you would have the wheelies going around, and 385 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:01,400 Speaker 2: you'd have people of different prosthetics and all this kind 386 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:03,359 Speaker 2: of stuff and it would just be so normal to 387 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,120 Speaker 2: me as like a ten year old or whatever, and 388 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,480 Speaker 2: it would just be like, oh yeah, like wheelchair sport 389 00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 2: is just like, you know, a different event. You know, 390 00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:16,240 Speaker 2: It's like the difference between a steeple chaser and a 391 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 2: discus thrower, Like it's not like, yeah, it just made 392 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:24,960 Speaker 2: everyone just it was just normalized different abilities to me, 393 00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:27,159 Speaker 2: And I think that's a really powerful part about sport, 394 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:34,119 Speaker 2: being able to have those discussions about different bodies. And yeah, 395 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,919 Speaker 2: I think the conversation is shifting. There's a lot of 396 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 2: I think people are embracing more the actual science around 397 00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 2: so I'm fueling ourselves and how someone's aesthetic appearance can 398 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:55,040 Speaker 2: look very different is very different to someone's actual health. 399 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 2: I've got a great story one of my training partners, Lindenhall, 400 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:04,040 Speaker 2: who's a diety. We were in like a dining hall 401 00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:08,879 Speaker 2: like before World Champs a year or two ago, and 402 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:12,480 Speaker 2: there were some athletes talking about how, you know, there 403 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:16,200 Speaker 2: were this weight when they ran this time and they 404 00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:20,200 Speaker 2: were like oh, I was like, you know, basically talking 405 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:25,760 Speaker 2: about how much weight like was related to their performance 406 00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:29,240 Speaker 2: and how and like this is something Lynda and I 407 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,880 Speaker 2: are very passionate about of how like it's it's much 408 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:35,359 Speaker 2: more complicated to that than that and health is much 409 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:38,199 Speaker 2: more important. And I just remember this one sprinner was 410 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:41,639 Speaker 2: one guy being like, yeah, I was a kilo lighter 411 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,560 Speaker 2: when I ran this time or something, and then Lynnen 412 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 2: was like, did you just take a really big shit 413 00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:49,720 Speaker 2: that morning? Like is that why you're a kilo lighter, 414 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:54,200 Speaker 2: like just like how people don't understand the basic things 415 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:57,679 Speaker 2: like that, like, yeah, your weight fluctuates a lot, like 416 00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:01,719 Speaker 2: it's it's more looking about how your body moves, like 417 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 2: the times that you're that you're doing and training, like 418 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:11,440 Speaker 2: too much emphasis on weight and food and aesthetics too 419 00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:15,800 Speaker 2: much just lazy coaching around that. And yeah, so I 420 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:17,920 Speaker 2: think I think we're getting better at it as a 421 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:18,600 Speaker 2: as a whole. 422 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 1: You talked about Linden Hall. When we look at the 423 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:24,919 Speaker 1: Australian Middle Distance Cohort at the moment, it is like 424 00:25:25,040 --> 00:25:28,160 Speaker 1: another level as you just holds you're their bendaria. 425 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:29,000 Speaker 2: Boy is there. 426 00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 1: Claudia Hollingsworth, Like it is elite of the elite. What 427 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:34,720 Speaker 1: is it like being part of a group like that 428 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 1: from a high performance perspective, but a group that then 429 00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:42,919 Speaker 1: has to compete for limited qualification spots for the Paris Olympics. 430 00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:47,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely a whole new landscape now, a whole 431 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:52,719 Speaker 2: new generation of younger athletes, not just in the women's 432 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:54,720 Speaker 2: but the men's as well. That's going to be a 433 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:59,919 Speaker 2: crazy like Stewing explain, you know, all these athletes fighting 434 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:04,080 Speaker 2: for three positions. I think it's just that's how you 435 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 2: get Australians making fine or was getting medals. Is that 436 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,240 Speaker 2: when we have a like we're such an isolated country 437 00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 2: to have this sort of local competition, to have this 438 00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:20,919 Speaker 2: culture is just going to bring everyone up. Like it's 439 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,560 Speaker 2: that that cliche of like the rising tide, you know, 440 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 2: lifts all ships kind of thing. I love it, yeah, 441 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:33,360 Speaker 2: and obviously it's stressful for someone like me, but it's 442 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:37,119 Speaker 2: also like it's stressful because of the uncertainty. You know. 443 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:40,119 Speaker 2: It's like in the past, you know, I was a 444 00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:43,639 Speaker 2: head and shoulders above the next athlete and making a team. 445 00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 2: I maybe even took it for granted a little bit, 446 00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:50,639 Speaker 2: but now it's like, yeah, uncertainty is scary, but you 447 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,560 Speaker 2: have to fight now, Like you have to really lift 448 00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 2: your game to earn that place. And I think that's 449 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:02,920 Speaker 2: only kind of just create better performances and better athletes 450 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:06,000 Speaker 2: and more hardened athletes that have performed better at championships 451 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,479 Speaker 2: because we have that domestic competition, which all the other 452 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:11,960 Speaker 2: countries have anyway, and that's why they have that edge 453 00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:16,040 Speaker 2: at the major champs. I think it's awesome. And I 454 00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:19,560 Speaker 2: think also it's not only is the is there the depth, 455 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 2: but these are all really wonderful women, Like they're all 456 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:29,280 Speaker 2: lovely people with their own interesting stories, and like they're 457 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 2: all advocates for you know, all the things we've talked 458 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 2: about before about, Yeah, positive body image, like just having 459 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:46,600 Speaker 2: a holistic approach to sport and just being really kind 460 00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,120 Speaker 2: to each other, really inspirational to the next generation coming up. 461 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,400 Speaker 2: I think that in the past there could have been 462 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:57,199 Speaker 2: a little bit of I don't know, animosity between people 463 00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 2: of fighting for these finite places. But it's like I 464 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:05,080 Speaker 2: always found that to be really sad sometimes and isolating 465 00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,440 Speaker 2: that these are the people who really understand what it's 466 00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:09,959 Speaker 2: like and we can't talk to each other about it. 467 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:13,000 Speaker 2: But I think there's such a good culture amongst all 468 00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:15,680 Speaker 2: of us, and I think that comes from yeah, the 469 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:21,679 Speaker 2: older generation like me and Lindon of just like, you know, 470 00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,919 Speaker 2: being really uncompromising about being like, no, I love you 471 00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 2: as a person off the track, but I want to 472 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:33,240 Speaker 2: crush you when we're on the track, but afterwards, let's 473 00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:34,440 Speaker 2: go hang out and get a coffee. 474 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:35,840 Speaker 3: Nice. Nice. 475 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,600 Speaker 1: What is your headspace like during the training sessions? Like 476 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:42,760 Speaker 1: I feel like the discipline you have chosen, you can 477 00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 1: not get me to do that in a million years. 478 00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:47,880 Speaker 1: Like you guys are incredible athletes. What you put your 479 00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 1: body through but also put your mind through, right, like 480 00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 1: that lactic acid that you must belong in for a 481 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 1: lot of your training, Like it's rough. 482 00:28:55,520 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 2: Ah, yeah, I definitely picked middle distance is not the 483 00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 2: distance that you pick if you you know it's to 484 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,640 Speaker 2: be an easy ride, like it's it is a pain 485 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 2: based sport, like insurance is a pain based bat It's 486 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,120 Speaker 2: same as like rowing, same as like cycling, like it. 487 00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:17,360 Speaker 2: A lot of it is just how much you can 488 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 2: take through training in a race. How much Yeah, you 489 00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:28,400 Speaker 2: can train your mind to push through all those warning 490 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 2: signals that your body is telling you. Yeah, it's something 491 00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:36,960 Speaker 2: that you can learn. I think. I think some people 492 00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 2: might be like, oh, I could never do that, or 493 00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:43,200 Speaker 2: but it is really something that you just practice day 494 00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,440 Speaker 2: in day out. Like let me give you an example 495 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:52,080 Speaker 2: of a session. So and then also it's like you 496 00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 2: often just blow up and it's just a terrible session, 497 00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 2: like and you just have to get through it. Like 498 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:04,160 Speaker 2: the there was a session a couple of weeks ago 499 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 2: that I did where it was like four reps just 500 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:13,640 Speaker 2: all basically you know, first lap pace with an eight hundred, 501 00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:18,840 Speaker 2: just like quick and minimal recovery. And my training partner 502 00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:21,680 Speaker 2: and I we just went out too hard in the 503 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 2: first rep, and we both just sort of look at 504 00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:28,080 Speaker 2: each other and we're like, this is we have really 505 00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:31,000 Speaker 2: stuff this up, and you just have to keep going 506 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:34,880 Speaker 2: and you and the thing is as well, it's like 507 00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 2: it gets exponentially harder once you have sort of tipped 508 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,360 Speaker 2: over the scales of the lactic and the heart rate. 509 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 2: It's not something that you can come back from a 510 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,480 Speaker 2: little bit. So you kind of have to Not only 511 00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 2: is it the mental game of pushing through, it's the 512 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,680 Speaker 2: mental space of being able to readjust on the fly 513 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,520 Speaker 2: and being like, Okay, I spent all my money in 514 00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:58,520 Speaker 2: this first rep, so now I have to just be 515 00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 2: kind to myself and getting through this and not just 516 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 2: throwing in the towel, but just making the most of 517 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:06,840 Speaker 2: what we've got what we've got now. And you kind 518 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 2: of have to do that in a race too, like 519 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,080 Speaker 2: sometimes like you go out too hard and then you're 520 00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 2: like all right, like now I just have to remain 521 00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:18,680 Speaker 2: calm and execute what I can knowing what I'm capable of. 522 00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's hard work. I am really really take 523 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:24,640 Speaker 1: my hat off to you guys. 524 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,560 Speaker 2: It's different to what you guys do. It's but I 525 00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:28,960 Speaker 2: couldn't do what you guys are. I would never be 526 00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:29,800 Speaker 2: able to take a hit. 527 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:33,760 Speaker 1: Before we get to I'm gonna let you get to 528 00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:36,480 Speaker 1: your thesis in a second. I didn't prap you with 529 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:38,959 Speaker 1: this question, but I've brought back this question because I 530 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:41,840 Speaker 1: really love hearing people's responses, and it's what is your 531 00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:43,160 Speaker 1: favorite failure? 532 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:47,000 Speaker 2: Hmmm, favorite failure? 533 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 1: Oh? 534 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:51,720 Speaker 2: I failed so many times I failed. You fail all 535 00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:57,880 Speaker 2: the time, like my favorite failure. I think that's a 536 00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:01,480 Speaker 2: really tricky question because it's like there are failures that 537 00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:05,840 Speaker 2: become opportunities, you know, to change your life kind of thing, 538 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:10,240 Speaker 2: and then there are failures that are just really funny 539 00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:20,120 Speaker 2: and totally unnecessarily say and stew food. I get, okay, 540 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,080 Speaker 2: I'll answer it in a serious way. So I think 541 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:27,560 Speaker 2: one of the big failures is like, okay, one of 542 00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:30,360 Speaker 2: the big failures of athletes is like getting injured, right, 543 00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,520 Speaker 2: And I had a really major injury in twenty nineteen. 544 00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:37,000 Speaker 2: I had a stress fracture in my fibula so and 545 00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:44,280 Speaker 2: my ankle and it became this, yeah, this huge like 546 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:46,800 Speaker 2: I had never had a c injury like that, and 547 00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:50,120 Speaker 2: it meant that I really had to reassess pretty much 548 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,479 Speaker 2: all aspects of my life, like sort of think about 549 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:58,520 Speaker 2: how much I could balance the study and the athletics 550 00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:03,360 Speaker 2: at the same time, how much I could balance all 551 00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:07,240 Speaker 2: these yeah, different stresses in my life. I really had 552 00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 2: to go hard on seeing a dietitian and addressing any 553 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:15,600 Speaker 2: nutritional deficiencies, seeing a psychologist to deal with all of, 554 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:21,840 Speaker 2: you know, the psychological aspects of injuries, working really closely 555 00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:27,680 Speaker 2: with the BIS and and and dealing with my strengths, 556 00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 2: deficiencies and all that. So I basically just like you 557 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,120 Speaker 2: that that big failure is an opportunity to just reassess 558 00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:36,760 Speaker 2: everything and to try new things, because like when things 559 00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 2: are going really great, you don't you don't change anything. 560 00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:43,560 Speaker 2: You're kind of just like desperate to make sure nothing 561 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:49,240 Speaker 2: changes and then maybe miss out on things. But yeah, 562 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:51,800 Speaker 2: I think my favorite failures are in training, where it 563 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 2: is just absolutely hilarious, like like that example before of 564 00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:57,479 Speaker 2: just going out too hard in a wrap and then 565 00:33:57,520 --> 00:33:59,960 Speaker 2: you're like, well, I don't no one to blame, but. 566 00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:03,240 Speaker 3: Here we are, here we go. 567 00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:07,320 Speaker 1: I really liked what you said there, though I probably 568 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:09,719 Speaker 1: haven't thought about it in the sense of when everything's 569 00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 1: going really well, how desperate you are for things not 570 00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,880 Speaker 1: to change, and it often limits you in that space 571 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:19,000 Speaker 1: of being really afraid to trial and error different things exactly. 572 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:21,280 Speaker 2: I like that, have you done that before? 573 00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:24,600 Speaker 1: Yeah? I think for me, I found the injury piece 574 00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:28,800 Speaker 1: a really refreshing space once I deal, once I process 575 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 1: the emotion of what it means, what I'm missing out on. 576 00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:34,359 Speaker 1: But I've had this perspective. I've had a couple of 577 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:37,360 Speaker 1: really horrible injuries throughout my career that meant I fractured 578 00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:39,719 Speaker 1: my cheap bone four weeks out from the Tokyo Olympics 579 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:41,960 Speaker 1: and meant I didn't get to go to my second Olympics. 580 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:47,359 Speaker 1: And what I've noticed with the injuries is you can 581 00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:51,640 Speaker 1: make these big progressions in short periods of time, Whereas 582 00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 1: when you're at your peak and you're in that space 583 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,200 Speaker 1: of everything going right and being afraid to change things, 584 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:00,040 Speaker 1: the progress that you make is so tiny and so 585 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,520 Speaker 1: incremental that it doesn't necessarily feel like you're moving forward. 586 00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:05,719 Speaker 1: Whereas for me, I've tried to always frame rehabs that 587 00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:07,600 Speaker 1: thing of every single day I get to move forward 588 00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 1: and I make bigger jumps. Hmm. 589 00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's also a hard thing about things not 590 00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:17,200 Speaker 2: going bad in some ways, Like I've also had the 591 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:20,759 Speaker 2: trap of not having an injury for a really long 592 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:24,960 Speaker 2: stretch of time and then overtraining a little bit because 593 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,640 Speaker 2: I haven't Like I've been like, well, I don't need 594 00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:30,480 Speaker 2: a break, Yeah, because I'm not injured. Why would I 595 00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:33,400 Speaker 2: have a break? And then and then that being a 596 00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:38,080 Speaker 2: failure in itself, and then also not being able to 597 00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 2: step back and seeing the long progression over years. Yeah, 598 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:43,680 Speaker 2: because it is so incremental. 599 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:46,520 Speaker 3: It's time to talk about the thesis. 600 00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:50,960 Speaker 1: You did your thesis in athletics tracks, tell us about this. 601 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:58,480 Speaker 2: Yes, Okay, buckle up, everybody, this is what we've all 602 00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:02,520 Speaker 2: been waiting for. Yeah. So, basically, as I've said before, 603 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:07,000 Speaker 2: I studied architecture and then became a professional athlete, and 604 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:08,920 Speaker 2: then at the end of my master's I had this 605 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,600 Speaker 2: opportunity to have an independent thesis so study a topic 606 00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:16,200 Speaker 2: that was unique to that I could pick basically, and 607 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:20,279 Speaker 2: for a while there I was really resisting any overlap 608 00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 2: or cross contamination between my two identities as a runner 609 00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:27,799 Speaker 2: and as an architect because I didn't want it to 610 00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:29,440 Speaker 2: be a gimmick. I didn't want it to be this 611 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,239 Speaker 2: embarrassing thing where people are like, oh, of course you 612 00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:35,200 Speaker 2: would do some you know, like when your friends come 613 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,520 Speaker 2: up to you and then and you're like, they're like, oh, 614 00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,399 Speaker 2: you study architecture, You're going to design stadiums, And I'd 615 00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:46,480 Speaker 2: be like, no, I'm a real architect, Like I'm going 616 00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:49,440 Speaker 2: to do beautiful museums, and you know, like I don't. 617 00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:51,720 Speaker 3: Know, like you know that kind of thing, yep, yeah. 618 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,279 Speaker 2: And then finally, you know, I think it's a sign 619 00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:59,200 Speaker 2: of maturity with this thesis. I spoke to my incredible supervisor, 620 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:03,480 Speaker 2: Hannah Robertson, and basically within sort of like ten minutes, 621 00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:06,560 Speaker 2: we were like, I have to do athletics tracks because like, 622 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:11,439 Speaker 2: for one thing, that is where I learnt like how 623 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:15,719 Speaker 2: movement connects people to space, or it was how I 624 00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:20,360 Speaker 2: learned how I connect to space is through repetitive movement 625 00:37:21,719 --> 00:37:26,680 Speaker 2: and just you know, everyday activity, ordinary activities, and so 626 00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:28,759 Speaker 2: I decided to study athletics tracks. And it was also 627 00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:33,040 Speaker 2: a beautiful opportunity as well because I'm traveling across the 628 00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:38,320 Speaker 2: year and so going overseas, I could photograph athletics tracks 629 00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:42,279 Speaker 2: around the world and be able to experience something that 630 00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,200 Speaker 2: I couldn't if I was just an architecture student, Like 631 00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:46,680 Speaker 2: like I wouldn't be able to have the time or 632 00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:48,919 Speaker 2: the money to go and travel and have this sort 633 00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:53,480 Speaker 2: of informal architecture tour of athletics tracks. And so basically 634 00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:56,440 Speaker 2: the question I was asking was, how do these spaces, 635 00:37:56,560 --> 00:38:00,920 Speaker 2: community sports spaces function as public basis, Like, how do 636 00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:04,520 Speaker 2: they interact with the public, how do they contribute to 637 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:09,920 Speaker 2: a sense of home, a sense of a neighborhood, And yeah, 638 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:15,400 Speaker 2: basically advocating for their value in the urban fabric beyond 639 00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:19,080 Speaker 2: sort of our ideas of sports infrastructure being these mega stadiums, 640 00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:26,560 Speaker 2: and so, yeah, it was this incredible opportunity to like 641 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:30,480 Speaker 2: I interviewed various athletes, like, for example, Jared and what 642 00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:33,480 Speaker 2: I brought up before, a vision impaired athlete, another incredible 643 00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:39,880 Speaker 2: Nike athlete, him talking about how an athletics track was 644 00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:43,080 Speaker 2: the first place he felt of a true sense of independence, 645 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:47,720 Speaker 2: that that was where he didn't feel like his vision 646 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:51,440 Speaker 2: impairment made him any different to anybody else. And a 647 00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:58,760 Speaker 2: lot of that was because of this completely predictable space, 648 00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:02,720 Speaker 2: this very same predictable four hundred meter track, the same 649 00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:06,640 Speaker 2: thing universal across the world. You're always experiencing the same thing. 650 00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:11,040 Speaker 2: And he would count the steps from the streets and 651 00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:13,480 Speaker 2: the bend, so he always knew where he was in space, 652 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:18,040 Speaker 2: and he would love the sounds of the other athletes 653 00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:21,560 Speaker 2: training it being a busy track, other people doing other things. 654 00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:26,720 Speaker 2: Like I found that really incredible and like, yeah, bringing 655 00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:28,719 Speaker 2: back to my own childhood, Like I was talking about 656 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:33,640 Speaker 2: the start of this of how much those landscapes, those 657 00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:40,000 Speaker 2: environments contributed to my childhood and my sense of home. 658 00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:43,160 Speaker 2: And one of the questions I want to ask you 659 00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:46,920 Speaker 2: as well is like I asked people like what their 660 00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:52,600 Speaker 2: earliest memories were of like a sporting space and how 661 00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:54,799 Speaker 2: that contributed to their future career and how they made 662 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,520 Speaker 2: that feel about their identity. Yeah, what was your earliest memory? 663 00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:00,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a it's a great I think one of 664 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:02,840 Speaker 1: my early memories. I used to play a lot of 665 00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,799 Speaker 1: touch footy as a kid. It was called Kitchener Park 666 00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:08,799 Speaker 1: down by my home, and it was Friday nights and 667 00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:11,319 Speaker 1: we'd go down there and I'd play with a team 668 00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:13,120 Speaker 1: of girls who are a couple of years older than me, 669 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:17,960 Speaker 1: and just the field. I just remember the field so clearly, 670 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:20,799 Speaker 1: And it was also what came with it, Like every 671 00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:23,879 Speaker 1: single time we'd walk across like with me, my mom 672 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:25,640 Speaker 1: and dad and my two brothers, we'd walk across the 673 00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:28,080 Speaker 1: road and I'd get my subway, I'd get my meatball 674 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:29,880 Speaker 1: sub after touch footy, and it was like that was 675 00:40:29,960 --> 00:40:32,040 Speaker 1: the experience, you know, there was so much that came 676 00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:32,400 Speaker 1: with that. 677 00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,760 Speaker 2: Oh totally. Yeah, So these are the stories that I loved. 678 00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:40,440 Speaker 2: It's like what does it taste like, what does it 679 00:40:40,480 --> 00:40:43,880 Speaker 2: smell like? What did it sound like like? And then 680 00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,800 Speaker 2: how did it make you feel? Yeah, with the people 681 00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,399 Speaker 2: that you were sharing the space with, and like that's 682 00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:52,320 Speaker 2: what architecture is. And like, I think it's been really 683 00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:55,359 Speaker 2: interesting maybe pivoting this conversation a little bit, like how 684 00:40:55,400 --> 00:41:00,799 Speaker 2: I'm bringing that design perspective into my professional career as 685 00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:03,439 Speaker 2: in athletes. But it was like a two way, two 686 00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:07,920 Speaker 2: way street and sort of how architecture is all about 687 00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:13,600 Speaker 2: not just like aesthetics, it's about function as well. And 688 00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,120 Speaker 2: I think it's been really cool working with like the 689 00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:21,719 Speaker 2: Nike product team around like performance where and how it's 690 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:27,520 Speaker 2: like incorporates aesthetics but also above all all function And 691 00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:31,719 Speaker 2: like I've become really passionate about fashion, and I've been 692 00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,960 Speaker 2: really passionate about clothing as well as being this really 693 00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:39,960 Speaker 2: interesting offshoot of this thesis and and my sort of 694 00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:45,480 Speaker 2: design background and finally really embracing these dual personalities. I 695 00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:49,879 Speaker 2: had this amazing experience in Glasgow for World Indoors this 696 00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:54,000 Speaker 2: year where I met up with the Nike design team 697 00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:59,000 Speaker 2: around the innovations on the new spikes that we use 698 00:41:59,160 --> 00:42:01,920 Speaker 2: for Middle Just's running. So I had met with them 699 00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:05,239 Speaker 2: London last year where they were talking about they had 700 00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:06,920 Speaker 2: interviewed me, and they were interviewing a whole lot of 701 00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:11,319 Speaker 2: athletes about what we'd liked, what were our opinions were 702 00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:15,640 Speaker 2: on the different shoes, like help felt around our foot, 703 00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:19,560 Speaker 2: like the and like how like talking about the different 704 00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:22,279 Speaker 2: parts of our training and then different parts of the 705 00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:24,359 Speaker 2: race and how you want to feel in different things 706 00:42:24,480 --> 00:42:27,280 Speaker 2: and and yeah, and then meeting up with them again, 707 00:42:28,040 --> 00:42:30,399 Speaker 2: you know, being able to talk to them about not 708 00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:35,000 Speaker 2: just like the shoe function and also like the one 709 00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:37,480 Speaker 2: of the most fascinating things was talking about like stack height. 710 00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:41,240 Speaker 2: You know, like this this idea of like the heel 711 00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:44,239 Speaker 2: of the shoe being a certain height to match the 712 00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:48,000 Speaker 2: regulations of world athletics and how you can use those 713 00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:52,400 Speaker 2: rules and regulations to innovate and that I found that 714 00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:56,080 Speaker 2: really reflective. I found that really an interesting parallel and 715 00:42:56,160 --> 00:42:58,840 Speaker 2: architecture because it's like when you have a site, you 716 00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:01,080 Speaker 2: have all these restrictions, all the building codes that you 717 00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:03,239 Speaker 2: have to have to work your way around, and that's 718 00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:05,680 Speaker 2: like kind of where the cool innovations come out as well. 719 00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:08,680 Speaker 2: Like some of the most interesting designs have come out 720 00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:13,000 Speaker 2: of a really big restriction, like whether it's you know, 721 00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:17,239 Speaker 2: like a height limit or you know whatever. But yeah, 722 00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:21,399 Speaker 2: and then talking to them about just like aesthetics and 723 00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:24,520 Speaker 2: and they were asking me about like my own personal 724 00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:27,640 Speaker 2: style and how you know, Like for me, like I'm 725 00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:30,719 Speaker 2: half Chinese and I've been really sort of embracing these 726 00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:34,960 Speaker 2: deal I think everything I'm talking about is about bringing 727 00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:37,920 Speaker 2: like these different budes in your life, like bring all 728 00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:41,640 Speaker 2: these loose breads together about Yeah, Like my own personal 729 00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:44,200 Speaker 2: style is very much like I just want to be 730 00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:47,160 Speaker 2: a teenage boy in career in China. Like that's my 731 00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:50,640 Speaker 2: love that view I lothetic. 732 00:43:53,360 --> 00:43:54,319 Speaker 3: I'm still here for that. 733 00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:57,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just like this little Chinese school girl like 734 00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:00,279 Speaker 2: that is what I want to butt Like cool like that, 735 00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:04,480 Speaker 2: that's what I want to look like and and yeah, 736 00:44:04,520 --> 00:44:06,840 Speaker 2: and like talk and like talking to them about like 737 00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:11,160 Speaker 2: the one of my like favorite pieces that I own 738 00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:15,960 Speaker 2: is this Sakai jacket collaboration with Nike, which is so 739 00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:19,840 Speaker 2: Ssakaia is this luxury Japanese brand and so they obviously 740 00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:23,920 Speaker 2: have a lot of like connections to Japanese craftsmanship and 741 00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:25,719 Speaker 2: that sort of thing in those aesthetics in the street 742 00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:30,719 Speaker 2: where aesthetics, And they made this really great performance piece 743 00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:32,520 Speaker 2: which was like a raincoat. It was like a trench 744 00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:35,440 Speaker 2: coat but not. But one of the things that I 745 00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:37,759 Speaker 2: love so much about it was that it really reminded 746 00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:41,880 Speaker 2: me of like, you know, drovers like in the Australian outback, 747 00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:45,560 Speaker 2: like yeah, yeah, yeah, like the drovers on the horseback 748 00:44:46,440 --> 00:44:50,239 Speaker 2: and they would wear these big brown raincoats and they 749 00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:53,440 Speaker 2: they were like trench coat length and they have like 750 00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:54,960 Speaker 2: the hood and that's. 751 00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:57,360 Speaker 3: Like a double yeah yeah. 752 00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:00,760 Speaker 2: Yeah exactly exactly, and like like the the dark brown 753 00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:03,720 Speaker 2: oil skin like that sort of stuff. And it really 754 00:45:03,719 --> 00:45:05,600 Speaker 2: reminded me of that as well, which why I love 755 00:45:05,600 --> 00:45:07,560 Speaker 2: it so much because it's like ooh, this is like 756 00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,279 Speaker 2: this kind of like fusion of all these things like 757 00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:14,520 Speaker 2: the Australian and the Asian the sports where the streetwear 758 00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:17,560 Speaker 2: like and I think that, yeah, Nike does that so 759 00:45:17,680 --> 00:45:20,320 Speaker 2: well of like not only it being like these really 760 00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:25,400 Speaker 2: amazing functional pieces, but then like design, architecture is always 761 00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:29,560 Speaker 2: more about the culture of the time and then and 762 00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:32,480 Speaker 2: then bringing that all together. But anyway, sorry, that was 763 00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:33,760 Speaker 2: most super long rant. 764 00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:36,160 Speaker 3: I'm so here for it. 765 00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:38,759 Speaker 1: I'm glad we waited for that because it's I think, 766 00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:41,600 Speaker 1: what's a really beautiful thing of the coming together of everything. 767 00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:44,439 Speaker 1: Like at the Female Athlete Project, what we love doing 768 00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:47,280 Speaker 1: is using our platform, obviously to share the athlete stories 769 00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:49,279 Speaker 1: so that people who listen to this the next time 770 00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:51,239 Speaker 1: they see you, like even me thinking already to the 771 00:45:51,239 --> 00:45:53,160 Speaker 1: next time I watch you compete out on the track, 772 00:45:53,640 --> 00:45:55,400 Speaker 1: I'll be thinking about those things, you know, I'll be 773 00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:57,719 Speaker 1: thinking about your connection to nature in the track and 774 00:45:58,040 --> 00:45:59,600 Speaker 1: to the clothes and the shoes that you're wearing. And 775 00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:02,200 Speaker 1: I think it such a powerful thing. So thank you 776 00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:05,560 Speaker 1: so much for your time today and your honesty and 777 00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:08,359 Speaker 1: vulnerability and for sharing your stories. It's been really really 778 00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:10,080 Speaker 1: special to have the chance to chat to you. So 779 00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:12,239 Speaker 1: thank you so much, Katrina, Oh no. 780 00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:14,920 Speaker 2: Thank you. It was a pleasure. Any opportunity to talk 781 00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:17,040 Speaker 2: about these things am massively nerdy about. 782 00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:24,480 Speaker 1: Love it amazing, amazing, Thanks so much for listening. If 783 00:46:24,520 --> 00:46:27,000 Speaker 1: you got something out of this episode, I would absolutely 784 00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:28,799 Speaker 1: love it if you could send it on to one 785 00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:32,919 Speaker 1: person who you think might enjoy it. Otherwise, subscribe, give 786 00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:34,799 Speaker 1: us a review, and make sure you follow us on 787 00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:37,600 Speaker 1: Instagram at the Female Athlete Project to stay up to 788 00:46:37,680 --> 00:46:41,520 Speaker 1: date with podcast episodes, merch drops, and of course news 789 00:46:41,520 --> 00:46:43,880 Speaker 1: and stories about epic female athletes.