WEBVTT - How is the NDIS changing? 0:00:00.600 --> 0:00:05.720 Already and this da this is the Daily os. Oh, 0:00:05.920 --> 0:00:16.079 now it makes sense. Good morning and welcome to the 0:00:16.160 --> 0:00:19.479 Daily Odds. It's Friday, the fourth of October. I'm Harry, 0:00:19.720 --> 0:00:24.160 I'm Zara. Yesterday the approved list of NDIS support services 0:00:24.239 --> 0:00:28.560 came into effect. Wheelchairs, railings at home and hearing aids 0:00:28.560 --> 0:00:31.200 are among the supports that got the tick, but the 0:00:31.240 --> 0:00:35.920 government's list has removed some supports, including alternative therapies, sex 0:00:35.960 --> 0:00:39.680 services and gym memberships. The list dropped two days before 0:00:39.680 --> 0:00:43.919 it came into effect, raising concerns from disability advocates that 0:00:43.960 --> 0:00:46.400 it didn't provide them enough time to adjust to the 0:00:46.479 --> 0:00:49.520 new rules. In today's deep dive, we'll look at how 0:00:49.640 --> 0:00:53.920 and why the NDIS is changing. But first, Sarah, what's 0:00:53.920 --> 0:00:54.800 making headlines. 0:00:58.360 --> 0:01:01.760 Foreign Minister Penny Wong is urging all Australians in Lebanon 0:01:01.840 --> 0:01:04.800 to leave the country. The Department of Foreign Affairs and 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:08.440 Trade has allocated five hundred seats for Australians on two 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:11.840 flights to Cyprus this weekend, but Wong said that flights 0:01:11.920 --> 0:01:15.760 are depending on the airport in Beirute remaining operational. In 0:01:15.800 --> 0:01:18.600 oppost to x the Foreign Minister said, and I quote 0:01:18.840 --> 0:01:20.560 if you are able to secure a seat on a 0:01:20.560 --> 0:01:22.959 flight out take it. Now is not the time to 0:01:23.000 --> 0:01:25.240 wait and see. Now is the time to leave. 0:01:28.240 --> 0:01:31.560 New South Wales has recorded the largest outbreak of EMPOC 0:01:31.680 --> 0:01:35.080 since twenty twenty two, with four hundred and thirty three 0:01:35.200 --> 0:01:39.080 recorded cases since the beginning of June. Empox is a 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:43.800 viral disease that can cause skin and muscle lesions, high temperatures, 0:01:43.920 --> 0:01:47.800 headaches and muscle aches. The state's chief health officer, Carry 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:52.080 Chance Set quote, the rapidly rising numbers are very concerning 0:01:52.360 --> 0:01:55.360 and said twenty six people have since been hospitalized with 0:01:55.520 --> 0:01:59.520 severe symptoms. Chant is urging sex workers and men who 0:01:59.520 --> 0:02:03.080 have had with other men to get vaccinated against MPOs. 0:02:03.320 --> 0:02:06.160 It requires two doses, which are available for free in 0:02:06.240 --> 0:02:07.080 New South Wales. 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:13.240 One hundred and sixty five pages of court documents relating 0:02:13.240 --> 0:02:16.320 to a criminal case against former President Donald Trump have 0:02:16.440 --> 0:02:19.760 now been made public. Prosecutors say there's new evidence in 0:02:19.800 --> 0:02:23.079 the documents to prove that Trump intentionally tried to overthrow 0:02:23.120 --> 0:02:25.800 the results of the twenty twenty election, which he lost 0:02:25.800 --> 0:02:29.240 to Joe Biden. The unsealed files include an account from 0:02:29.240 --> 0:02:32.400 a staffer who alleges they overheard Trump telling his family 0:02:32.520 --> 0:02:35.320 it quote didn't matter who won or lost the election, 0:02:35.600 --> 0:02:38.280 he would still quote fight like hell to remain in 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:41.520 the White House. The US Department of Justice said that 0:02:41.560 --> 0:02:44.480 Trump resorted to crimes to try to stay in office 0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:48.200 and launched a series of increasingly desperate plans to overturn 0:02:48.360 --> 0:02:51.880 the results of the election. Authorities are seeking to convince 0:02:51.919 --> 0:02:54.920 the court that the former president is not immune from prosecution. 0:02:58.000 --> 0:03:01.720 And today's good news, neuroscientist have completed the first map 0:03:01.800 --> 0:03:05.960 of a fruitfly brain. Scientists from Princeton University found the 0:03:06.000 --> 0:03:10.000 poppy seed sized brain of a fruitfly contains over one 0:03:10.120 --> 0:03:13.960 hundred and thirty nine thousand nerve cells with nearly fifty 0:03:13.960 --> 0:03:17.560 five million connections. It took nearly two decades to map 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:21.440 the tiny brain in such detail. Researchers said most people 0:03:21.440 --> 0:03:25.160 thought the project was either not possible or that even 0:03:25.160 --> 0:03:28.800 if they were successful, the data would be useless. However, 0:03:28.919 --> 0:03:33.079 the findings have given neuroscientists new insight, for example, how 0:03:33.160 --> 0:03:36.680 brains react to changes in light and motion, and how 0:03:36.720 --> 0:03:39.880 information flows to the brain. The map could also give 0:03:39.960 --> 0:03:42.280 new insights into how nervous systems work. 0:03:42.400 --> 0:03:49.040 Generally, Harry I think that sometimes in the news. We 0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:52.800 can use acronyms very often that sometimes don't get explained 0:03:52.920 --> 0:03:56.080 as such and are used as this kind of assumed knowledge. 0:03:56.480 --> 0:03:59.240 So to start us off for this deep dive, can 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:02.200 you just explain what actually is the NDIS. 0:04:02.600 --> 0:04:06.840 So it's the National Disability Insurance Scheme and I think 0:04:06.960 --> 0:04:09.600 most people would associate it with two things, people with 0:04:09.720 --> 0:04:14.600 disability and money. But to recap, the NDIS is a 0:04:14.640 --> 0:04:18.680 scheme helping to support people with disabilities to live as 0:04:18.760 --> 0:04:22.800 independently as possible. And it's set up for people nine 0:04:22.880 --> 0:04:26.000 to sixty five years old and they are given a 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:29.080 budget to spend on the things that they need, so 0:04:29.279 --> 0:04:32.960 that includes things like hearing aids, wheelchairs or railings to 0:04:33.000 --> 0:04:37.159 be installed in your house. Australia's quite advanced in terms 0:04:37.279 --> 0:04:41.720 of this funding model because it's entirely government funded. And 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:45.440 when it was first hatched and brought into existence in 0:04:45.520 --> 0:04:49.400 twenty thirteen under the then Gillard government, they would use 0:04:49.440 --> 0:04:54.599 words like world leading pioneering support for people with disabilities. 0:04:55.200 --> 0:04:58.520 Okay, And so this scheme has been in existence since 0:04:58.680 --> 0:05:02.280 twenty thirteen. We're talking about it today because some things 0:05:02.279 --> 0:05:03.120 have changed. 0:05:02.880 --> 0:05:05.920 Right, Yeah, So I think it's important to note that 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:10.560 the NDIS isn't cheap. It is a very costly program. 0:05:10.720 --> 0:05:14.720 So in the last year, the government spent forty four 0:05:14.760 --> 0:05:17.719 point six billion dollars on the scheme and it was 0:05:17.760 --> 0:05:21.560 the fastest growing expenditure out of all the government's spending categories, 0:05:21.760 --> 0:05:25.520 and the only thing that topped it was its interest repayments, 0:05:25.560 --> 0:05:30.520 which is a whole other separate economic category. Now, the 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:34.520 majority of the funding in the NDIS goes towards the 0:05:34.640 --> 0:05:38.640 NDIS plans for each individual participant, so that's forty two 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:40.800 out of the forty four point six billion dollars that 0:05:40.800 --> 0:05:45.160 we're talking about. The question of the scheme's viability financially 0:05:45.320 --> 0:05:48.279 has been something that both sides of politics have long 0:05:48.360 --> 0:05:52.520 grappled with, both Labor and the Coalition, and there is 0:05:52.560 --> 0:05:55.960 a bit of flame shifting about why the scheme has 0:05:56.160 --> 0:06:00.839 blown out. Now, the government passed legislation under the title 0:06:00.960 --> 0:06:04.120 Getting the NDIS back on Track earlier this year. 0:06:03.960 --> 0:06:06.880 So that was their attempt to try and cut those 0:06:06.880 --> 0:06:09.080 costs that you said have blown out so much. 0:06:08.920 --> 0:06:12.480 That's right, and they wanted to introduce ways to just 0:06:12.640 --> 0:06:15.680 rein in a bit of the spending associated with the NDIS. 0:06:16.400 --> 0:06:19.280 The government said the reforms that they were introducing would 0:06:19.320 --> 0:06:22.719 save about fourteen point four billion dollars over the next 0:06:23.000 --> 0:06:23.839 four years. 0:06:24.160 --> 0:06:26.720 What were the type of reforms we're talking about here. 0:06:27.000 --> 0:06:30.240 So that's the kind of support services that someone on 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:35.599 an NDIS plan can claim. So that's why we're talking 0:06:35.600 --> 0:06:38.000 about it this week because we found out what is 0:06:38.040 --> 0:06:41.760 categorized as an approved support service and what is. 0:06:41.760 --> 0:06:44.960 Not harry For people that might not be on the 0:06:45.000 --> 0:06:48.080 NDIS themselves or know someone on the NDIS, can you 0:06:48.240 --> 0:06:52.279 just talk us through what sort of services are we 0:06:52.360 --> 0:06:56.720 talking about? What can people claim as part of the NDIS. 0:06:57.000 --> 0:07:00.279 So it's a pretty comprehensive list that's meant to act 0:07:00.360 --> 0:07:02.720 like kind of a set of guardrails about what you 0:07:02.760 --> 0:07:06.200 can claim on the scheme. So that includes things like 0:07:06.320 --> 0:07:10.760 a guide, animal hearing, envision AIDS. There's some broader categories, 0:07:10.880 --> 0:07:13.400 so a home modification, so if you need a rail, 0:07:13.560 --> 0:07:16.480 or if you need an access ramp, or you might 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.120 need to make adjustments to your car, so that would 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:23.880 include installing a hoist or modifying your seat. And also 0:07:24.120 --> 0:07:30.080 things to help you physically move around, so mobility, scooters, wheelchairs, walkers, 0:07:30.640 --> 0:07:34.440 those kinds of things are what's been categorized as approved 0:07:34.720 --> 0:07:38.720 NDIS support services. There was a bit of commentary through 0:07:38.760 --> 0:07:41.920 the year about whether menstrual products would be part of 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:43.480 an approved support service. 0:07:43.680 --> 0:07:47.480 That's because the government published a draft list that said 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:49.800 that they weren't included those menstrual products. 0:07:49.840 --> 0:07:52.880 That's right, and now they've walked back on that and 0:07:53.040 --> 0:07:56.560 they have included menstrual products. So that's things like applicators 0:07:56.600 --> 0:07:58.000 and period underwear. 0:07:58.520 --> 0:08:01.760 Okay, so Harry, just to recap here, we're saying the 0:08:01.800 --> 0:08:05.240 government wants to bring down its spending on the NDIS, 0:08:05.520 --> 0:08:08.600 and the government of the day, the Labor government, has 0:08:08.640 --> 0:08:11.600 identified that one way they can do that is to 0:08:11.680 --> 0:08:15.720 more carefully define what supports someone on the NDIS can 0:08:15.760 --> 0:08:19.160 access using that money versus what they can't. So you 0:08:19.280 --> 0:08:21.480 run through a bit of a list of what they can, 0:08:21.640 --> 0:08:24.080 but I think a lot more of the media attention 0:08:24.200 --> 0:08:28.040 has been now on what people on the NDIS cannot access. 0:08:28.560 --> 0:08:30.920 Take me through some of the things that we now 0:08:31.040 --> 0:08:35.160 understand cannot be accessed using NDIS funds. 0:08:35.520 --> 0:08:38.400 So the list of things that you can't access is 0:08:38.480 --> 0:08:42.360 also quite comprehensive. And as I mentioned about the guard rails, 0:08:42.440 --> 0:08:45.520 these are the things that exist outside those guardrails, and 0:08:45.720 --> 0:08:49.680 the government went to some length to define what won't 0:08:49.720 --> 0:08:52.240 be approved. And that's not to say that all these 0:08:52.240 --> 0:08:55.120 things that I'm about to talk through have been claimed 0:08:55.120 --> 0:08:58.080 in the past. Some of them have, but Bill Shorten, 0:08:58.120 --> 0:09:01.040 the NDIS minister, has said that not all of these 0:09:01.080 --> 0:09:04.800 things have been claimed previously. So day to day expenses 0:09:04.800 --> 0:09:08.800 for things like rent, food, internet, gym memberships, they won't 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:13.640 be covered under the NDIS. Surrogacy and fertility treatments aren't 0:09:13.960 --> 0:09:17.600 classified as an NDIS expense either, and then the government 0:09:17.640 --> 0:09:21.559 went into a range of what it described as alternative 0:09:21.640 --> 0:09:27.480 therapies that can't be claimed. So crystal cuddle, yoga, wilderness 0:09:27.520 --> 0:09:33.680 and sound therapies are all out. Frequency healing, REYKI, deep 0:09:33.800 --> 0:09:38.679 energy cleansing, no Tarot card reading either. The NDIS also 0:09:38.720 --> 0:09:42.720 won't cover what the government turns wellness and coaching, so 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:46.480 that's areas that it says aren't based in evidence, so 0:09:46.600 --> 0:09:50.800 that's life coaches, hypnotherapy, or a career advisor. 0:09:51.400 --> 0:09:53.559 One of the things that's been spoken about a lot 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:56.200 was sex services, and we've spoken about it before on 0:09:56.240 --> 0:10:00.160 this podcast. Which category have sex services actually fallen in? 0:10:00.360 --> 0:10:04.800 Now they're not an approved NDIS support service. The government 0:10:04.800 --> 0:10:07.600 has also given a bit of a grace period, so 0:10:07.840 --> 0:10:10.920 over the next year, if someone accidentally claims something that 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:14.720 isn't covered by the NDIS, that will be flagged and 0:10:14.880 --> 0:10:19.679 they won't necessarily get in trouble. Sex services, alcohol and 0:10:19.840 --> 0:10:23.160 illegal drugs are the only exception to that. You can't 0:10:23.160 --> 0:10:26.200 claim that, and if you are flagged, you could face 0:10:26.240 --> 0:10:28.600 a bit of trouble. It's not so clear what that 0:10:28.640 --> 0:10:32.760 would be just yet, but the government was definitely quite 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:35.680 clear that you can't try and claim any of those things. 0:10:36.160 --> 0:10:40.280 Okay, so those new rules came into effect yesterday, but 0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:43.520 we only got those lists this week as well. You know, 0:10:43.600 --> 0:10:45.959 there's been lots of speculation about what would be on them, 0:10:45.960 --> 0:10:48.480 what wouldn't be on them, but the government only actually 0:10:48.559 --> 0:10:50.240 published them earlier this week. 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:56.240 The disability community had two days to really comb through 0:10:56.320 --> 0:11:00.880 everything that has been either categorized as approved or not approved, 0:11:01.240 --> 0:11:03.800 and it's fair to say that some of the advocacy 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:06.800 groups were not only concerned about it, they weren't happy 0:11:06.840 --> 0:11:09.800 about it at all. The deadline had been approaching for 0:11:09.800 --> 0:11:12.319 some time, so we knew that October third was the 0:11:12.440 --> 0:11:16.160 date that the new Support Services list would come into effect, 0:11:16.520 --> 0:11:18.360 but we didn't know what was officially going to be 0:11:18.440 --> 0:11:21.760 on that list until two days before that. We've heard 0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:25.960 from a number of organizations now who said they're quite concerned, 0:11:26.000 --> 0:11:30.520 so the Disability Advocacy Network Australia and People with Disability 0:11:30.559 --> 0:11:34.000 Australia who said there just wasn't nearly enough time to 0:11:34.520 --> 0:11:37.559 fully adjust to the new rules. And those groups had 0:11:37.600 --> 0:11:40.600 been asking the government to give what they termed reasonable 0:11:40.720 --> 0:11:44.800 notice about what was changing, and they're basically saying that 0:11:44.960 --> 0:11:47.160 two days is really pushing the friendship. 0:11:47.520 --> 0:11:50.959 But just to clarify here, there's not two days in 0:11:51.000 --> 0:11:53.680 which this changes forever. There is that grace period that 0:11:53.720 --> 0:11:55.280 the government has outlined. 0:11:55.440 --> 0:11:58.880 That's right. So if you are an NDIS participant and 0:11:59.320 --> 0:12:02.960 you claim something under one thy five hundred dollars and 0:12:03.040 --> 0:12:06.760 you weren't meant to claim that thing, the agency overseeing 0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:11.000 the NDIS would flag that and you would then just 0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:14.199 be told you can't claim that and there wouldn't be 0:12:14.280 --> 0:12:17.679 necessarily any punishment. So that's their way of sort of 0:12:17.760 --> 0:12:21.040 transitioning into this new support system. 0:12:21.320 --> 0:12:24.360 Okay, but there still is this criticism that remains from 0:12:24.400 --> 0:12:28.320 as you mentioned, these advocacy groups. How has the government 0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:30.239 responded to that criticism. 0:12:30.640 --> 0:12:33.880 So the NDIS Minister Bill Shorten has said that nobody 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:38.280 would lose their NDIS funding to help manage their disabilities 0:12:38.320 --> 0:12:40.800 for the things that they need. He also said that 0:12:40.880 --> 0:12:44.240 this list is pretty much a continuation of the status quo, 0:12:44.400 --> 0:12:48.280 that these are things that are currently being claimed and 0:12:48.520 --> 0:12:51.679 that the vast majority of cases won't be affected by 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:55.880 setting out these approval lists. The President of People with 0:12:55.920 --> 0:13:00.160 Disability Australia, Murray A. Kred Jonk, has said the comber 0:13:00.240 --> 0:13:04.280 nation of the narrow time frame and some possible confusion 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:07.920 about the changes coming into effect mean that some people 0:13:08.040 --> 0:13:11.920 could go without critical supports that they do need. So 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:14.560 it's going to be a really big test for the 0:13:14.600 --> 0:13:19.520 government and the agency overseeing the NDIS who is implementing 0:13:19.520 --> 0:13:24.160 these changes and whether people with disabilities are going to 0:13:24.600 --> 0:13:27.079 still get the right level of support that they need. 0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:31.360 Harry, this is a scheme that involves some six hundred 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:34.320 thousand people in this country. As you said, you know, 0:13:34.520 --> 0:13:37.640 the costs associated with it have been something that both 0:13:37.679 --> 0:13:41.600 political parties have really grappled with. So understanding how these 0:13:41.679 --> 0:13:44.840 changes affect, you know, the communities and the people who 0:13:45.120 --> 0:13:47.880 need them and who rely on them, but also understanding 0:13:47.880 --> 0:13:51.240 whether that will make a difference then to the government's budget. 0:13:51.760 --> 0:13:54.120 It's certainly something that we'll be keeping an eye on. 0:13:54.720 --> 0:13:57.120 Thank you for explaining that story to us today, and 0:13:57.200 --> 0:13:59.720 thank you for tuning into another week of The Daily. 0:14:00.800 --> 0:14:03.400 If you are listening on Apple or Spotify, we would 0:14:03.520 --> 0:14:06.000 love you to hit follow. It sends a signal to 0:14:06.000 --> 0:14:08.320 the platforms that you like what they're doing. If you 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:11.120 are watching us on YouTube, you can hit subscribe and 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:13.840 never miss another video. We'll be back again on Monday, 0:14:13.880 --> 0:14:15.840 but until then, have a fabulous weekend. 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:20.920 My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda 0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:25.960 Bungelung Kalkuton woman from Gadighl Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:28.200 that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 0:14:28.200 --> 0:14:31.760 Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 0:14:31.800 --> 0:14:34.720 Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:37.520 first peoples of these countries, both past and present.