1
00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:04,520
Speaker 1: Hello, my name is Satasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud

2
00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:08,240
Speaker 1: yor the Order Kerni Whaltbury and a waddery woman. And

3
00:00:08,320 --> 00:00:10,719
Speaker 1: before we get started on She's on the Money podcast,

4
00:00:11,000 --> 00:00:13,880
Speaker 1: I would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the

5
00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:17,599
Speaker 1: land of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,

6
00:00:18,079 --> 00:00:22,200
Speaker 1: acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming

7
00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:26,880
Speaker 1: through as this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing

8
00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:30,040
Speaker 1: and the storytelling of you to make a difference for

9
00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:34,120
Speaker 1: today and lasting impact for tomorrow. Let's get into it.

10
00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:53,519
Speaker 2: She's on the Money, She's on the Money.

11
00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,240
Speaker 3: Hello, and welcome to She's on the Money.

12
00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:02,920
Speaker 4: The podcast that's all about empowering you to make informed

13
00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:07,280
Speaker 4: financial decisions, not emotional ones, and definitely not decisions based

14
00:01:07,319 --> 00:01:12,120
Speaker 4: on hehan messages in your DMS. I'm Victoria Devine, finance expert,

15
00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:15,680
Speaker 4: MLM exposer and the person who's here to help you

16
00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:19,000
Speaker 4: navigate all the sneaky traps designed to separate you from

17
00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:22,479
Speaker 4: your hard earned cash. Today is part two of our

18
00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:26,160
Speaker 4: very special episode. We are chatting to Emily Lynn Paulson,

19
00:01:26,440 --> 00:01:30,360
Speaker 4: an actual unicorn million dollar earner in an MLM, if

20
00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:32,679
Speaker 4: you haven't listened to part one yet, where she gave

21
00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:35,440
Speaker 4: us a very cheeky behind the scenes look at the

22
00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:38,920
Speaker 4: business side of MLM's hit pause my friend, right now,

23
00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:41,720
Speaker 4: head back and give it a listen. Trust me, you're

24
00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:45,040
Speaker 4: going to want the full story. But if you've already listened,

25
00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:48,960
Speaker 4: stick around today we are going deeper. We're diving into

26
00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:52,760
Speaker 4: the psychological tactics MLMs used to hook you, keep you,

27
00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:55,960
Speaker 4: and then convince you that it's all your fault when

28
00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:59,240
Speaker 4: things go sideways. It's time to pull back the curtains

29
00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:02,520
Speaker 4: and get into the why behind the decisions people make

30
00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:04,640
Speaker 4: when it comes to these schemes.

31
00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:06,720
Speaker 3: So let's go. Let's flip on.

32
00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:09,320
Speaker 4: Over to the psychology side of things, because I feel

33
00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:12,560
Speaker 4: like we're starting to delve into that, he said, She

34
00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:16,839
Speaker 4: said emlms are designed to, I guess, make hitting that

35
00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:20,600
Speaker 4: first rank basically effortless, like and then they jump up

36
00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:22,200
Speaker 4: and down and go, oh my god, you made it,

37
00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:24,600
Speaker 4: like look how easy it is. This is so good,

38
00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:27,960
Speaker 4: And you get that instant dopamine hit and it kind

39
00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:30,600
Speaker 4: of keeps you hooked. Can you remember what it felt

40
00:02:30,600 --> 00:02:33,400
Speaker 4: like when you hit your first milestone? So you decided

41
00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:35,440
Speaker 4: to sign up, and you were like, all right, I

42
00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:36,079
Speaker 4: could do this.

43
00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:37,520
Speaker 3: How did you feel?

44
00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:40,880
Speaker 5: You know, it was kind of double edged because I

45
00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:44,320
Speaker 5: signed up, and then as soon as I signed up again,

46
00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:46,640
Speaker 5: I was totally ignorant, didn't know what I was doing.

47
00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:48,040
Speaker 5: I kind of ran with it. I met with a

48
00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:50,920
Speaker 5: friend that night after I signed up, and I was like, hey,

49
00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,520
Speaker 5: I bought this skincare stuff, like I don't know what

50
00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:55,400
Speaker 5: I'm doing, and she's like, oh, I'll do it with you.

51
00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:58,320
Speaker 5: So like she literally seemed like that first day, right,

52
00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:02,160
Speaker 5: And so the next there was a post on Facebook

53
00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:06,280
Speaker 5: like outing me from my upline. You know, Emily signed up,

54
00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:10,760
Speaker 5: she started her business, and she's already hit her first promotion,

55
00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,120
Speaker 5: and so here I am like, like I felt a

56
00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:17,640
Speaker 5: little cringe that she put that out there without my permission.

57
00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:20,960
Speaker 5: And then I had all of these people, all reps

58
00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:25,360
Speaker 5: for the company, posting underneath like congratulations, congratulations, congratulations. All

59
00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:28,840
Speaker 5: these new friends, all these new followers. It's very intoxicating, right,

60
00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:31,640
Speaker 5: It's like you said, it's that dopamine hit. And so

61
00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:34,400
Speaker 5: it was like, oh, that was easy. I could do

62
00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,040
Speaker 5: that again, Like I could do more of that. And

63
00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:39,760
Speaker 5: then you start getting gifts. It's the love bombing just

64
00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:40,720
Speaker 5: off the bat.

65
00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:44,360
Speaker 4: It's actually insane because I don't think it's a sacred

66
00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:47,080
Speaker 4: If you follow me on my personal Instagram, you know

67
00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:49,760
Speaker 4: I've signed up to an MLM under a fake name,

68
00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:50,560
Speaker 4: and I have been.

69
00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:51,560
Speaker 3: Doing that, and that happened to me.

70
00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:55,160
Speaker 4: I hit my first one and I was mortified that

71
00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,200
Speaker 4: they're tagging me in the same One day, I'll share

72
00:03:58,240 --> 00:04:01,200
Speaker 4: who I was and what I joined under.

73
00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:02,960
Speaker 3: But they fully love bomb you.

74
00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:05,920
Speaker 4: And you mentioned a lot in the book the intense

75
00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:08,520
Speaker 4: love bombing that happens when someone joins an MLM, and like,

76
00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:10,640
Speaker 4: I guess that's a good example of it. You get

77
00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:14,200
Speaker 4: constant praise and attention and some validation, and that's really

78
00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:16,919
Speaker 4: sexy and we want more of that. How did that

79
00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:20,719
Speaker 4: level of affection impact you early on? And I guess

80
00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:23,719
Speaker 4: when did it start to feel a little bit less genuine?

81
00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:27,560
Speaker 5: When at first it feels genuine because you know, the

82
00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:30,400
Speaker 5: person I joined with someone from high school. I wasn't

83
00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:32,760
Speaker 5: friends with her, we didn't know each other well. But

84
00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:35,120
Speaker 5: then it was like, Okay, she's someone I know, she's

85
00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:37,360
Speaker 5: someone from my hometown. Like I kind of felt that

86
00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:42,360
Speaker 5: instant kinship. And then by proximity, you're spending a lot

87
00:04:42,400 --> 00:04:45,200
Speaker 5: of time, whether it's across the zoom screen or in

88
00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:47,160
Speaker 5: a Facebook group, you're spending a lot of time in

89
00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:50,760
Speaker 5: proximity with these people, more than you're probably spending with

90
00:04:50,839 --> 00:04:54,279
Speaker 5: people in your real life, you know. And you're really

91
00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:58,599
Speaker 5: taught to share personal things and connect over personal things

92
00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,640
Speaker 5: and how hard life is as mom and you know,

93
00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:05,480
Speaker 5: blah blah blah. It's so it's kind of like trauma bonding.

94
00:05:05,279 --> 00:05:08,680
Speaker 4: Early, which is terrifying, and it's a genuine tactic that

95
00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:10,400
Speaker 4: they are using as trauma bonding.

96
00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:13,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, And I think it also is by nature.

97
00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:16,120
Speaker 5: MLMs are mostly women, you know, it's like eighty five

98
00:05:16,160 --> 00:05:21,640
Speaker 5: to ninety percent women, and so women are more connected

99
00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:24,600
Speaker 5: on an emotional level. And so when you already have

100
00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:28,400
Speaker 5: that baked in to a financial transaction where people are

101
00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:30,280
Speaker 5: making money off of you and you're making money off

102
00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:35,080
Speaker 5: of people, it's just it's going to be exploited. And

103
00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:37,240
Speaker 5: so when you're used to getting all these this attention

104
00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:39,640
Speaker 5: and you're on these top ten lists and you're being

105
00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:42,960
Speaker 5: asked to speak and then maybe a new shiny penny

106
00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:45,280
Speaker 5: rolls around. Someone else comes in quick and makes their

107
00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:49,080
Speaker 5: first promotion and gets a lot of attention, like the

108
00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:52,400
Speaker 5: spotlight gets taken off of you, and and so there's

109
00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:57,000
Speaker 5: just automatic like clause coming out, there's automatic jealousy. You're

110
00:05:57,040 --> 00:06:02,039
Speaker 5: being ranked publicly among other people all of the talk,

111
00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:04,640
Speaker 5: You're being put on top ten lists by the company

112
00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:08,120
Speaker 5: by different team leaders all of the time. So it's

113
00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:11,360
Speaker 5: just kind of a breeding ground for hostility.

114
00:06:11,560 --> 00:06:13,760
Speaker 3: Really, yeah, yah yak, Yeah.

115
00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:17,760
Speaker 4: And I guess this love bombing and we just touched

116
00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:21,920
Speaker 4: on trauma bonding. Those are actually two tactics that are

117
00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:27,000
Speaker 4: used by cults to keep people engaged and involved and

118
00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:31,000
Speaker 4: consistently feeling like their cult is their home. And you

119
00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:33,880
Speaker 4: have said before that an MLM is like a cult,

120
00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:36,200
Speaker 4: Like I guess a lot of people say that. I

121
00:06:36,279 --> 00:06:38,159
Speaker 4: say that lots of people do. I want to know

122
00:06:38,920 --> 00:06:42,479
Speaker 4: what is the most jaw dropping I guess culty behavior

123
00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:44,960
Speaker 4: that you saw and how it kind of messed with

124
00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:45,800
Speaker 4: people's lives.

125
00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:48,520
Speaker 5: I mean, I think the financial exploitation we've talked about.

126
00:06:48,520 --> 00:06:51,320
Speaker 5: There's a lot of financial exploitation, but you know, and

127
00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:55,240
Speaker 5: like the emotional exploitation with friendship love bombing, I think

128
00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:59,760
Speaker 5: the worst, in my opinion is the like you touched

129
00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:04,159
Speaker 5: on a little bit the spiritual manipulation religious manipulation, and I,

130
00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:08,160
Speaker 5: thankfully I wasn't in a lot of that. Thankfully my upline.

131
00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:12,240
Speaker 5: You know, nobody was super religious in my team, but

132
00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:15,720
Speaker 5: I knew people, you know, crossline or whatever, who I

133
00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:20,720
Speaker 5: did you know, events with, who were very manipulated, who

134
00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:23,960
Speaker 5: were like forced to go to a different church, they

135
00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,760
Speaker 5: had to pray before events. And so it throws in

136
00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:30,840
Speaker 5: this extra layer of not only are you not succeeding

137
00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:32,960
Speaker 5: because you're not working hard enough, but you're also not

138
00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:37,920
Speaker 5: devoted enough to Jesus or you know, you're not thankful enough,

139
00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:41,080
Speaker 5: you're grateful enough to God. And that's I think really

140
00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:42,440
Speaker 5: best up in a lot of ways.

141
00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:44,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's what kind of scares me as well,

142
00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:51,520
Speaker 4: because you are blurring the lines between your spiritual life,

143
00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:54,800
Speaker 4: your home life, your work life. That then when you

144
00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:59,000
Speaker 4: decide to leave, you're left absolutely high and dry. Immediately

145
00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:01,720
Speaker 4: you've gone from having what I would say, you know,

146
00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:03,760
Speaker 4: regardless of the fact that a lot of it was

147
00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:07,960
Speaker 4: not genuine, you go from feeling very supported to being

148
00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:11,160
Speaker 4: completely isolated and on your own. So a lot of

149
00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:13,320
Speaker 4: people they know they want to leave but they don't

150
00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:15,360
Speaker 4: want to leave because they don't want to lose that connection.

151
00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:17,400
Speaker 4: They don't want to lose their friends or their so

152
00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:20,800
Speaker 4: called friends. And then to add religion to that, like,

153
00:08:20,800 --> 00:08:23,680
Speaker 4: what are you going to do? Leave your religion like that,

154
00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:29,800
Speaker 4: to me is absolutely insane. How do multi level marketing businesses?

155
00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:33,360
Speaker 4: I guess use dopamine hits because obviously there's lots of

156
00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:36,000
Speaker 4: them built in. Like the people that run multi level

157
00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:40,000
Speaker 4: marketing businesses. Through all of my research, I've realized they're

158
00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:44,920
Speaker 4: not skincare experts like mone Right good example, they do

159
00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:48,080
Speaker 4: hair care and they do skincare. The founders of Money

160
00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:51,400
Speaker 4: are not hair care or skincare people at all. In fact,

161
00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:54,439
Speaker 4: they have a very rich history in network marketing and

162
00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:58,240
Speaker 4: multi level marketing business building, and they have just seen

163
00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:01,880
Speaker 4: that hair care and skincare is incredibly popular with the

164
00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:04,480
Speaker 4: women that are the best victims. And so I think

165
00:09:04,520 --> 00:09:07,520
Speaker 4: we might go down that route. Let's create a haircare

166
00:09:07,559 --> 00:09:10,120
Speaker 4: skin care line with all of these wild you know,

167
00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,280
Speaker 4: things that we can say about them that no one

168
00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:15,679
Speaker 4: can really validate, and then we are going to recruit

169
00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:18,760
Speaker 4: all of these women underneath. But to keep them involved,

170
00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:22,160
Speaker 4: we actually need to give them consistent gratification and consistent

171
00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:25,800
Speaker 4: dopamine hits. And I feel like it's quite clear that

172
00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:28,360
Speaker 4: through their model they use it to hook you like

173
00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:30,760
Speaker 4: an addiction. And you've spoken about this in your book.

174
00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:35,640
Speaker 4: How does their structure keep you chasing that next high?

175
00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:39,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, because they have hierarchy built in everywhere. You know,

176
00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,360
Speaker 5: not only you join an upline, who then is like

177
00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:45,679
Speaker 5: your master, who you have to take information from and

178
00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:48,560
Speaker 5: distill it down and then recruit other people and tell them,

179
00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:50,680
Speaker 5: you know, like a baby bird. You've got to feed

180
00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:53,679
Speaker 5: them the information. So you've got this hierarchy. But then

181
00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:57,480
Speaker 5: there's different levels, and you know, you promote to meet

182
00:09:57,520 --> 00:09:59,400
Speaker 5: these levels, and every time you get there, there's some

183
00:09:59,440 --> 00:10:02,480
Speaker 5: sort of it's like a constant game of like candy

184
00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:03,720
Speaker 5: crush or something.

185
00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,160
Speaker 3: And I love candy Crush. I would have been the worst.

186
00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:09,880
Speaker 4: I'm so glad, honestly, Emily, I see so much of

187
00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:11,920
Speaker 4: me and you like, I just go.

188
00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:14,440
Speaker 3: You know what, if someone had given me that opportunity

189
00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:16,439
Speaker 3: and I didn't know any better, I would have loved it.

190
00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:19,880
Speaker 3: It's like gammification. I would have been all over it.

191
00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:23,720
Speaker 5: It is. It's like analogue gamification. That's exactly what it

192
00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:25,880
Speaker 5: is where they send you little gifts and just when

193
00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:27,840
Speaker 5: you start to feel a little bit like, oh, my

194
00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,040
Speaker 5: sales aren't good, they're like, we're going to have a

195
00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:32,720
Speaker 5: sale this month, and you know, you get a free

196
00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:34,960
Speaker 5: whatever for every one of these that you sell. And

197
00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:39,360
Speaker 5: it's just constantly built in so you have something to

198
00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:42,560
Speaker 5: look forward to. And they plan the convention. It's six

199
00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:46,240
Speaker 5: months in advance and you have to start like making

200
00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:50,440
Speaker 5: your way to advancing to earn certain gifts at convention.

201
00:10:50,559 --> 00:10:53,160
Speaker 5: They just make it a year long thing and then

202
00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:55,600
Speaker 5: during the month there's different goals. You know, every month

203
00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:58,840
Speaker 5: you have to read up to the same title. Like

204
00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:00,800
Speaker 5: it starts over every month. It's not like you get

205
00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:02,920
Speaker 5: to a rank and then you're there. You have to

206
00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:06,240
Speaker 5: do it every month. It's just a constant hamster wheel.

207
00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:09,200
Speaker 4: And the higher you climb, from what I can say,

208
00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:12,559
Speaker 4: the more pressure you have on you to spend like

209
00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:17,440
Speaker 4: first class lights assistance. This idea of retiring your husband

210
00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:21,679
Speaker 4: that everyone wants to talk about, how did projecting that

211
00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:24,200
Speaker 4: lifestyle keep you stock even when I guess it wasn't

212
00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:25,479
Speaker 4: financially sustainable.

213
00:11:25,679 --> 00:11:28,600
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean that's one thing when people ask, like

214
00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:30,679
Speaker 5: about the car and how the car is not really free.

215
00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:33,240
Speaker 5: You actually have to buy the car, right, the free car.

216
00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:34,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it has to be white. It has to

217
00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,959
Speaker 4: be a white Range Drover, absolutely, And people have.

218
00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:39,920
Speaker 5: Asked me like, well, why get it then, if it's

219
00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:43,880
Speaker 5: such a financial drain, why get it? Well? Can you imagine?

220
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:46,360
Speaker 5: You know, you see all over social media like so

221
00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,120
Speaker 5: and so earned her Lexus and then you're not driving

222
00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:52,880
Speaker 5: the car. So it's almost like you're forced, your shamed

223
00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:56,040
Speaker 5: into spending and you don't want your downline thinking like well,

224
00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:57,840
Speaker 5: why are you flying in coach when so and so

225
00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:00,439
Speaker 5: is flying in first class? Or why are you doing

226
00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:03,840
Speaker 5: this when she's doing this. It's the comparison where you

227
00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:07,280
Speaker 5: have to look like this is aspirational and if you

228
00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:09,920
Speaker 5: don't earn the trip and you're not there, well, your

229
00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:12,720
Speaker 5: team's not going to feel motivated to want to try

230
00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:15,480
Speaker 5: and earn it. And so you do feel pressure to

231
00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:18,920
Speaker 5: buy stuff and to fit in and have the shoes

232
00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:21,839
Speaker 5: that kind of match everybody else. And that's why when

233
00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:24,240
Speaker 5: people say like, oh, well, you know, what what did

234
00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:26,360
Speaker 5: you do with all the money, It's like it was

235
00:12:26,559 --> 00:12:30,000
Speaker 5: constantly going back in. The more you made, the more

236
00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:32,920
Speaker 5: you were expected to spend all of the time, and

237
00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:36,040
Speaker 5: even if it wasn't over, it was between the lines.

238
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:38,240
Speaker 5: You know, what gifts are you going to give your

239
00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:41,160
Speaker 5: people who promote to level five? What retreat are you

240
00:12:41,240 --> 00:12:43,400
Speaker 5: going to take your team on? And if you're not

241
00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:45,480
Speaker 5: doing it well, why is someone going to want to

242
00:12:45,520 --> 00:12:46,080
Speaker 5: be on your team.

243
00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:47,120
Speaker 3: It's a lot of pressure.

244
00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,360
Speaker 4: It sounds like we're going to take a really quick break,

245
00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:52,679
Speaker 4: but don't go anywhere because I've got so many more

246
00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:59,720
Speaker 4: juicy questions. All right, way, all back. And I feel

247
00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:04,600
Speaker 4: like you were thankfully also not thankfully, like I'm glad

248
00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:06,000
Speaker 4: that you made it to the top, so that we

249
00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,480
Speaker 4: got you fighting the good fight against multi level marketing

250
00:13:09,520 --> 00:13:12,479
Speaker 4: businesses now. But you've said that a lot of consultants

251
00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:15,240
Speaker 4: are often presenting a life of success that's a little

252
00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:19,560
Speaker 4: bit more like illusion rather than reality. Oh, I don't know,

253
00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:23,000
Speaker 4: what's the wildest thing you've seen someone do. I feel

254
00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:24,800
Speaker 4: like you were in a lucky position where you had

255
00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:27,840
Speaker 4: the income coming in, so like if you were spending it, okay,

256
00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,960
Speaker 4: but like, what did you see someone do to kind

257
00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:34,000
Speaker 4: of like fake the dream to keep it alive?

258
00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:36,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I think one of the cringiest things.

259
00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:40,600
Speaker 5: Was something that a lot of people and everyone did.

260
00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:44,320
Speaker 5: This is like you pose next to your uplines lexus, right,

261
00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:46,960
Speaker 5: So I was like, this is what my upline earned.

262
00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:48,600
Speaker 5: It's like, well, you haven't earned it, Like what are

263
00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:50,719
Speaker 5: you talking about? You know. It was this aspirational thing.

264
00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:54,560
Speaker 5: And then also the posting of paychecks. Sure you've seen

265
00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:56,480
Speaker 5: tons of that where they're like, oh, I got my

266
00:13:56,559 --> 00:13:59,480
Speaker 5: monthly check or whatever, and then it's pexed out.

267
00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:01,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I saw one the other day.

268
00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:04,040
Speaker 4: It actually I forgot to screenshot it, and then when

269
00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:06,320
Speaker 4: I went back, they'd removed it. Because like, I have

270
00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:09,240
Speaker 4: an account where I follow all the MLM girlies just

271
00:14:09,280 --> 00:14:12,280
Speaker 4: to keep up with the goss and one girl had

272
00:14:12,280 --> 00:14:14,600
Speaker 4: done it, but she clearly moved her photo so the

273
00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:16,880
Speaker 4: exes were not in the right spot, and she's like

274
00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:19,800
Speaker 4: the caption was, oh my god, I got my monthly paycheck.

275
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,440
Speaker 3: I'm so grateful for whatever. I don't even care. But

276
00:14:22,520 --> 00:14:25,240
Speaker 3: it was twenty three dollars and like forty cents, and

277
00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:27,359
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, that's embarrassing.

278
00:14:27,640 --> 00:14:31,200
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, it'll be like the right number of numbers,

279
00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:34,040
Speaker 5: but they'll cover up where the decimal point is or whatever.

280
00:14:34,040 --> 00:14:36,520
Speaker 5: So it looks like way more one hundred percent, and

281
00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:38,360
Speaker 5: even if it was like even if it was one

282
00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:42,600
Speaker 5: thousand dollars, like again, subtract everything they're spending, which is

283
00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,080
Speaker 5: probably close to one thousand dollars. Tax is like how

284
00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:47,200
Speaker 5: much should they spend to go on that trip? It

285
00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:48,640
Speaker 5: never accounts for that.

286
00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:53,080
Speaker 3: But the trip was free Emily, they earned that trip.

287
00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:54,880
Speaker 5: Which and then they get to pay for it at

288
00:14:54,920 --> 00:14:57,160
Speaker 5: the end of the year. Right, it's added as income.

289
00:14:57,280 --> 00:14:59,640
Speaker 5: That's the other thing that of course I didn't know

290
00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:01,880
Speaker 5: why I but when you get to the end of

291
00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:04,400
Speaker 5: the year and you get your ten ninety nine statement

292
00:15:04,920 --> 00:15:07,200
Speaker 5: and it's like, you know, you have your money that

293
00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:09,640
Speaker 5: you actually aren't dollars, and then at the end it's like,

294
00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:13,480
Speaker 5: you know, whatever for we leave it on bag and

295
00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:15,120
Speaker 5: that's added as income.

296
00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:17,280
Speaker 4: And that happens in Australia too when we get our

297
00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:20,520
Speaker 4: tax statements, because they do give you a tax statement

298
00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,960
Speaker 4: because surprise, surprise, it's actually not your own business, because

299
00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,600
Speaker 4: they have to issue you with your own tax statement

300
00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,720
Speaker 4: because they've done all of their maths in the background,

301
00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:33,280
Speaker 4: and you have like your non monetary income that needs

302
00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:36,280
Speaker 4: to be disclosed and if you've been gifted anything.

303
00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:39,120
Speaker 5: And you don't get to write it off exactly, they

304
00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:42,160
Speaker 5: already wrote it off. You don't get to write it off.

305
00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:44,720
Speaker 4: You just have to pay tax on that quote income

306
00:15:44,760 --> 00:15:48,120
Speaker 4: that you achieved and it's not actually income, So you're

307
00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:49,920
Speaker 4: paying for something that.

308
00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:50,920
Speaker 3: You thought was free.

309
00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:53,640
Speaker 5: Yeah, is it great to get a purse? Sure? Can

310
00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:56,960
Speaker 5: you pay your rent with that? No? So there's a

311
00:15:57,000 --> 00:15:59,520
Speaker 5: lot of people who they end up getting pushed over

312
00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:03,720
Speaker 5: the threshole of having to file quarterly taxes in the US.

313
00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:05,560
Speaker 5: You know, it's over a certain amount yet to fail

314
00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:08,640
Speaker 5: quarterly and they didn't know that because they were like

315
00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,800
Speaker 5: making a couple hundred bucks a month, but because they

316
00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:15,040
Speaker 5: went on this trip that was added as income. Then

317
00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:17,240
Speaker 5: they get this ten thousand dollars fine from the IRS

318
00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:19,640
Speaker 5: because they didn't file quarterly taxes. And I heard this

319
00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:23,120
Speaker 5: story over and over and over because how would you know?

320
00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:25,120
Speaker 4: But the MLM is not going to tell you that

321
00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:28,800
Speaker 4: because that's not sexy, and that's your problem. Remember, it's

322
00:16:28,840 --> 00:16:31,320
Speaker 4: your business. You need to work out your own taxes.

323
00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:36,120
Speaker 4: That's not their responsibility. That is all honestly outrageous, But

324
00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:39,520
Speaker 4: one of the most outrageous things that I read in

325
00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:40,000
Speaker 4: your book.

326
00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:41,800
Speaker 3: I nearly threw it across the room.

327
00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:45,240
Speaker 4: Emily, Oh my lord, I like put it down in

328
00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,200
Speaker 4: bed and I looked at my husband and I was like,

329
00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:50,320
Speaker 4: you're not going to believe this, and he was like,

330
00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:53,520
Speaker 4: all right, laid on me. What is it in your book?

331
00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:57,920
Speaker 4: You talk about your cancer diagnosis and then how the

332
00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:02,560
Speaker 4: multi level marketing business encouraged you to use that as

333
00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:08,040
Speaker 4: a selling point. That is a deeply personal and very

334
00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:11,000
Speaker 4: vulnerable time to be going through for them to be

335
00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:16,400
Speaker 4: like great sales, black fantastic selling point. Can you walk

336
00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:19,200
Speaker 4: us through what happened and how that made you feel?

337
00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:21,959
Speaker 3: Because that was a lot Yeah.

338
00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:26,439
Speaker 5: I think again, this is something that's preemptively trained into you,

339
00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:28,880
Speaker 5: like a lot of things, just like how they'll say, oh,

340
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:30,560
Speaker 5: you'll have a lot of haters and you'll get a

341
00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:32,320
Speaker 5: lot of people saying no to you. And here's all

342
00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:35,639
Speaker 5: the talking points like preemptive right, you are from the

343
00:17:35,640 --> 00:17:39,840
Speaker 5: beginning again, you're doing all that love bombing. You're telling

344
00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:42,879
Speaker 5: you like deeply personal stories. You're talking about your trials

345
00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:47,240
Speaker 5: and tribulations. And when you go to events you hear

346
00:17:47,359 --> 00:17:50,720
Speaker 5: people's sob stories. It's the rags to riches, it's the

347
00:17:50,760 --> 00:17:54,480
Speaker 5: pain to profit. Right, those are the stories you always hear,

348
00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,199
Speaker 5: and so this is just cooked into your brain. And

349
00:17:57,240 --> 00:18:00,199
Speaker 5: so when something troubling comes up, like when some one

350
00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:03,520
Speaker 5: you know, their husband who's a firefighter die is in

351
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,919
Speaker 5: a fire, well, the company is right on that to

352
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:09,159
Speaker 5: be like, oh gosh, you know you really need the

353
00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:11,000
Speaker 5: money right now. You know you could use this as

354
00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:15,680
Speaker 5: a way to earn money. Ew no, but it sounds like, oh, yeah,

355
00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:18,600
Speaker 5: you're right, I have my own business. This would be

356
00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:22,200
Speaker 5: a good way to help. It's really hard to explain

357
00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:23,520
Speaker 5: when you're out of it because that's one of those

358
00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:26,120
Speaker 5: things people are like, well, that's really gross. So I'm like, yeah,

359
00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:31,040
Speaker 5: it is, and it seems like the most natural thing

360
00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:33,359
Speaker 5: to do when that is the sea you're swimming in,

361
00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:37,320
Speaker 5: when you are around all of this quote unquote charity

362
00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:40,920
Speaker 5: again the air quotes. That's not charitable. It feels like

363
00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:42,160
Speaker 5: you're doing a very good thing.

364
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:46,600
Speaker 4: It's actually insane to me that they literally take advantage

365
00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:50,640
Speaker 4: of every situation like you're right, maybe you did need

366
00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:53,639
Speaker 4: some money during that period of time. But the way

367
00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,679
Speaker 4: that they manipulate that I have scene it time and

368
00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:01,160
Speaker 4: time again here in Australia, like oh, it. Actually, yeah,

369
00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:03,639
Speaker 4: I did want to throw your book. I'm so sorry,

370
00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:06,399
Speaker 4: Like I wouldn't have heard it, but like I wanted

371
00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:07,919
Speaker 4: to throw it across the room and be like this

372
00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:11,520
Speaker 4: is ridiculous, Like the fact that this was normal and

373
00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:16,240
Speaker 4: that you've exposed it, right, that's so fantastic. But it's

374
00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:19,359
Speaker 4: still going on, and they're like, I'm sure you've been

375
00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:22,119
Speaker 4: absolutely outcast. You've been like you've been kicked out of

376
00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:24,040
Speaker 4: the Church of MLM's.

377
00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:25,840
Speaker 3: Right, Oh yeah, oh yeah, So talk to.

378
00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:28,480
Speaker 4: Me about that process, because I feel like the second

379
00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,560
Speaker 4: you start being one of the quote haters, you like,

380
00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:34,640
Speaker 4: went from being their queen to i would say, being

381
00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:37,240
Speaker 4: exiled and they wanted to put you on an island

382
00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:39,720
Speaker 4: in the middle of the Pacific and never hear from

383
00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:40,200
Speaker 4: you again.

384
00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:41,439
Speaker 3: What was that like?

385
00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:45,159
Speaker 5: So my process was kind of interesting because it was

386
00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:48,640
Speaker 5: twenty nineteen where I was like, ooh, where I really

387
00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:50,760
Speaker 5: you know again, I'd had my team do like profit

388
00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:52,840
Speaker 5: loss statements, and where I got to the point where

389
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:54,919
Speaker 5: I'm like, no, all of these people are doing the

390
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,479
Speaker 5: work and they are not having the success that I

391
00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:00,600
Speaker 5: had had, and I knew it was a system. So

392
00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:04,280
Speaker 5: I was like, I'm turning everything off. I'm not selling anymore.

393
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:07,560
Speaker 5: I'm just going to slowly back away. So I was

394
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,480
Speaker 5: very transparent with my upline who brought me in, like,

395
00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:13,720
Speaker 5: you know what, I love you, thank you for this opportunity.

396
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:15,800
Speaker 5: I'm just I'm not going to do this anymore. And

397
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:17,720
Speaker 5: I kind of thought I would like silently collect a

398
00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:21,640
Speaker 5: check until it dissolved and went away. And then COVID happened,

399
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:27,440
Speaker 5: and I mean the off the wall like the predatory

400
00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:31,359
Speaker 5: posts and comments and trying to use the pandemic to

401
00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:35,600
Speaker 5: recruit people was so gross to me. Again, I sold nothing,

402
00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:38,000
Speaker 5: did nothing, and yet I still hit the top rank

403
00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:40,840
Speaker 5: of the company that year. And that's when I was like,

404
00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:44,600
Speaker 5: this system is so rigged, this is so messed up.

405
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:47,480
Speaker 5: And I quit. So by that time I had been

406
00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,680
Speaker 5: so off the radar for so long. It really wasn't

407
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:54,560
Speaker 5: a huge surprise to anyone that I fully terminated. But

408
00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:58,560
Speaker 5: when my book announcement came out, oh they would have rioted,

409
00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:02,879
Speaker 5: It was oh they I had messages and calls like

410
00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:04,280
Speaker 5: I can't believe you're going to talk about this? Are

411
00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:06,080
Speaker 5: you going to talk about me? You know, there were

412
00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:08,400
Speaker 5: a lot of people going on the offense, like you're

413
00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:10,639
Speaker 5: not going to tell about this and about this, about this,

414
00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:12,879
Speaker 5: and no, I am very afraid of like what I

415
00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:16,280
Speaker 5: was going to say. So that's really when the clause

416
00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:18,960
Speaker 5: came out, where it was like, you know, you did

417
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:21,159
Speaker 5: all of this stuff and now you're going to profit

418
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:23,720
Speaker 5: off it with a book or whatever. You know, It's

419
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:29,680
Speaker 5: like yeah, I am yeah. So anyway, that's really when

420
00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:32,080
Speaker 5: the clause came out. So I think by the time

421
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:34,719
Speaker 5: I was like brave enough to talk about it, I

422
00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:37,800
Speaker 5: had been out much longer than I was out, if

423
00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,240
Speaker 5: that makes sense, Like I had backed away for so long,

424
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:42,639
Speaker 5: and I think that was an advantage to me, and

425
00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 5: I that's the number one thing I do tell other people.

426
00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:49,959
Speaker 5: It's like, Okay, you made the realization. Obviously not everyone

427
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:53,240
Speaker 5: can just immediately quit, you know, if they're making money,

428
00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:57,320
Speaker 5: you know, figure out an exit strategy and slowly back away,

429
00:21:57,560 --> 00:21:59,760
Speaker 5: you know, have a conversation with the people on your team,

430
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:03,560
Speaker 5: start posting, start promoting, and you know you can kind

431
00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,120
Speaker 5: of get out that way. And the more you back away.

432
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 5: And I think COVID helps in this situation too, that

433
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:10,639
Speaker 5: I couldn't go to conventions, I couldn't be around people,

434
00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:12,040
Speaker 5: I couldn't be indoctrinated.

435
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:13,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's pretty lucky.

436
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:16,639
Speaker 5: Yeah, when you take yourself out of that bubble, you

437
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:19,240
Speaker 5: really can start to see a lot of realizations come

438
00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:20,960
Speaker 5: to the service. When that happens, too.

439
00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:24,320
Speaker 4: It's absolutely insane to me, Like it drives me nuts

440
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:27,879
Speaker 4: because I think the position that I'm sitting in, I

441
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:29,920
Speaker 4: just want the best for women, and I think we

442
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:31,879
Speaker 4: also want the best for ourselves, and that's why we

443
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,240
Speaker 4: get involved in these things because it sounded like a

444
00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,960
Speaker 4: great opportunity at the time, and realizing that it's not

445
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,440
Speaker 4: the opportunity you thought it was can be incredibly confronting.

446
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:46,240
Speaker 4: And I'm sure it was. But what's something that you

447
00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:49,400
Speaker 4: would tell someone who's still involved in an MLM, because

448
00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 4: I know they're going to listen, like I can't wait,

449
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:54,240
Speaker 4: Like hi, babies, Like I know you're all watching on

450
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 4: you know. I have had a plethora of them send

451
00:22:57,840 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 4: me messages being like you're going to hear from head,

452
00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:02,679
Speaker 4: you're going to get a safe and desist, you're going

453
00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:06,200
Speaker 4: to get sued, And I'm like, okay, let's.

454
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:08,320
Speaker 3: Go for what for what?

455
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:09,360
Speaker 5: Yeah?

456
00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:10,440
Speaker 3: What would you say?

457
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:14,000
Speaker 5: Yeah? What I usually tell people is I say, you know,

458
00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:16,840
Speaker 5: slowly you know, do a profit loss statement. It's the

459
00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:18,960
Speaker 5: first thing to tell people to do, and all of

460
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:22,199
Speaker 5: your expenses. Really write down all of the time that

461
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:25,119
Speaker 5: you're working and do some math, do a little bit

462
00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 5: of math, figure out what you're making per hour and

463
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:28,919
Speaker 5: that for a lot of people that is enough. They're like,

464
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:30,719
Speaker 5: oh my god, this is not worth my time? What

465
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,119
Speaker 5: am I doing? And then it's usually like how do

466
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:36,280
Speaker 5: I tell my upline? You know, and again like, just

467
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,960
Speaker 5: be honest, I'm not making any money. I don't care

468
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:40,720
Speaker 5: if it's my fault. I don't care if you tell

469
00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 5: me it's my fault. A lot of it's just unlearning

470
00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:47,480
Speaker 5: the things you've been told and asking yourself like why

471
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:49,680
Speaker 5: do I believe this? Who told me this? And who

472
00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:54,520
Speaker 5: is benefiting from this? Right? Because if your upline wants

473
00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 5: you to stay in and they're encouraging you to stay in,

474
00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,040
Speaker 5: what's the reason. Do they really believe in you? Do

475
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:00,640
Speaker 5: they really want the best for you? Or they're making

476
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:02,639
Speaker 5: money off of you. They're making money off of you,

477
00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:07,399
Speaker 5: So go to outside sources. Really do the math, like

478
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:11,840
Speaker 5: get actual critical thinking skills and think about what you're doing.

479
00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:13,960
Speaker 3: It drives me insane, Yeah.

480
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,080
Speaker 5: And I think the sunk cost fallacy is one thing

481
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 5: people are whether it's friends, time or money. Yeah, I

482
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:23,159
Speaker 5: put so much into this, how can I leave now?

483
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:27,959
Speaker 5: And you just do like you just.

484
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:27,919
Speaker 3: Do well you do.

485
00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:30,520
Speaker 4: And I get that because you don't want to just go, oh, well,

486
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 4: that was all a waste, like you want to make

487
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 4: the most of it, but you're throwing good money after

488
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:37,840
Speaker 4: bad And something that my dad told me once, he said,

489
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 4: the sooner you get off the train, the cheaper the

490
00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:44,880
Speaker 4: return ride home. And I think that that is a

491
00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:47,600
Speaker 4: really good analogy to go, all right, well, the longer

492
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:49,159
Speaker 4: you stay on the train, the more it's going to

493
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,480
Speaker 4: cost you to come back home. And I think that

494
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 4: that's a really important thing to remember. I have taken

495
00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 4: up a lot of your time. Emily. Thank you so

496
00:24:56,960 --> 00:24:59,680
Speaker 4: much for chatting with us today sharing your story. It's

497
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:02,719
Speaker 4: been really fun, really pervy, but also kind of really

498
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:07,800
Speaker 4: concerning your honesty and insight honestly eye opening, and not

499
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,200
Speaker 4: to mention it is so important for anyone who's ever

500
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:13,679
Speaker 4: been I guess drawn into the MLM world or you

501
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 4: know someone that has. I feel like we all know

502
00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,639
Speaker 4: someone who's doing MLM. I get so many messages, and

503
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 4: I'm sure you do of like, oh my god, Victoria,

504
00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:22,959
Speaker 4: you're never going to believe this. My cousin signed up

505
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:24,560
Speaker 4: and I just know Christmas is going to be so

506
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:27,440
Speaker 4: awkward now, and you're just like, oh, I.

507
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 3: Feel for you.

508
00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:30,960
Speaker 4: But it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much for

509
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:35,080
Speaker 4: joining us. Thanks Victoria, of course, for anyone listening, Emily's

510
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:39,200
Speaker 4: book Hayhun Sales, Sisterhood and Supremacy and the Other Lies

511
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:41,080
Speaker 4: behind Multi Level Marketing.

512
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:43,680
Speaker 3: Is a must read. Just don't throw it at your husband.

513
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 4: It dives even deeper into her experiences and breaks down

514
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,640
Speaker 4: the truth behind these business models. I'm going to put

515
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:51,280
Speaker 4: a link in our show notes so that you can

516
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:51,920
Speaker 4: check it out.

517
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:53,960
Speaker 3: And if you know someone who needs.

518
00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 4: To hear this, I would love it if you shared

519
00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 4: it with them. Let's keep saving women from these dodgy

520
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 4: schemes and empower bowing them with the truth.

521
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:08,760
Speaker 3: The advice shared.

522
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 6: On She's on the Money is general in nature and

523
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:14,560
Speaker 6: does not consider your individual circumstances. She's on the Money

524
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:18,200
Speaker 6: exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied

525
00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:20,720
Speaker 6: upon to make an investment or financial decision.

526
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:23,600
Speaker 3: If you do choose to buy a financial product.

527
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:26,880
Speaker 6: Read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial.

528
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:30,399
Speaker 4: Advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Divine and She's on

529
00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:34,680
Speaker 4: the Money are authorized representatives of Money. Sheper Pty Ltd

530
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:38,359
Speaker 4: ABN three two one six four nine two seven seven

531
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:43,080
Speaker 4: zero eight AFSL four five one two eight nine