Speaker 1: We all have rules that kind of govern how we
Speaker 1: spend our time, and some of this is internalized as
Speaker 1: a child or as a young adult. Maybe some of
Speaker 1: that serves you still there could be something that might
Speaker 1: serve you better.
Speaker 2: Today we are diving into part two of my chat
Speaker 2: with New York Times best selling author Chris Gilibo. In
Speaker 2: this episode, Chris shares how to break free of the
Speaker 2: unnecessary subconscious rules that often waste your time and his
Speaker 2: trick to figuring out what is and isn't a valuable
Speaker 2: use of your time. Oh and by the way, if
Speaker 2: you missed part one of this chat, then you might
Speaker 2: want to check out your feed in How I Work
Speaker 2: and go listen to part one first.
Speaker 1: Like, I was pretty good at the productivity game. At
Speaker 1: a certain point, I just realized, like, ultimately, I think
Speaker 1: I'm getting better at doing the wrong things. The way
Speaker 1: that my life is going to be disrupted is much
Speaker 1: more likely because I fail to take action. The far
Speaker 1: greater problem is my own resistance. The way that I
Speaker 1: address that is like.
Speaker 3: Welcome to How I Work, a show about habits, rituals,
Speaker 3: and strategies.
Speaker 2: For optimizing your date. I'm your host, doctor Amantha Imber
Speaker 2: what have you found, because I imagine you know, you've
Speaker 2: been doing lots of publicity for the book, which practices
Speaker 2: seem to have resonated with the most amount of people.
Speaker 1: One that people really like. I have been doing a
Speaker 1: lot of events here in the States, have been in
Speaker 1: about ten cities so far. I'm doing a couple of
Speaker 1: stops in Canada in a couple of weeks, hopefully beyond
Speaker 1: North America as well at some point. One of the
Speaker 1: things people respond to a lot is this idea of
Speaker 1: the eighth day of the week. And so it's it's
Speaker 1: like imagining you have an extra day every week, and
Speaker 1: what does that look like? And how would you choose
Speaker 1: to spend this day which is a recurring day. And
Speaker 1: so that's the big difference from thinking about like what
Speaker 1: is your ideal perfect day. That's kind of a classic
Speaker 1: like thought exercise, and it can be helpful, but it's
Speaker 1: also maybe there's some pressure involved with that. It's like
Speaker 1: my perfect day, like my one perfect day, you know,
Speaker 1: And if you think about what if I had an
Speaker 1: extra day that came around fifty two times a year,
Speaker 1: like how would I spend that? And so that's something
Speaker 1: that's additive. You could like, there's a lot you could
Speaker 1: do if you had this extra time that came around
Speaker 1: every week. You could write a book, you could learn
Speaker 1: a language, you could learn all kinds of other skills.
Speaker 1: And so people have found that to be kind of interesting.
Speaker 1: As they think about like freeing up their time, they're
Speaker 1: also thinking about how would I choose to spend it,
Speaker 1: and so those two things can kind of work together. Well,
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's some others. That's the first one that
Speaker 1: comes to mind.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I liked a con't rid of the terminology used,
Speaker 2: but helping people to unpack what are the assumptions that
Speaker 2: they have around the time. I'm trying to remember the
Speaker 2: language that you used around that and really challenge those
Speaker 2: assumptions around oh we do this then, or this is
Speaker 2: how we spend our time at this point in time.
Speaker 2: Tell me more about that and help me with the
Speaker 2: remember the language that you use, because I really liked
Speaker 2: that thinking about what are the assumptions that I'm off
Speaker 2: for writing.
Speaker 1: By for sure? Yeah, I think I was writing about
Speaker 1: time rules. Yes, this notion of like we all have
Speaker 1: rules that kind of govern how we spend our time,
Speaker 1: and some of this is internalized, like as a child
Speaker 1: or as a young adult. In some of our primary relationships,
Speaker 1: this is like how we spend our time, and this
Speaker 1: is how things work, and this is what time that
Speaker 1: meal times are at this time, you know, based on
Speaker 1: when you are a kid typically, and this is how
Speaker 1: long it's acceptable to go before you call someone back
Speaker 1: or message them back. And you know, there are many others,
Speaker 1: but basically, like how we kind of go about our
Speaker 1: day and spend our time. Most of us have not
Speaker 1: actually thought about that very intentionally. It's not something that's
Speaker 1: ever really brought up about, like, Okay, you're living your
Speaker 1: life this way because this is what you learned, this
Speaker 1: is what your parents did. Maybe some of that serves
Speaker 1: you still, but maybe you know, you're a different person,
Speaker 1: it's a different time, it's a different generation xxx, Like
Speaker 1: there could be something that might serve you better, So
Speaker 1: it's helpful to maybe consider, like what are the time
Speaker 1: rules that govern my life and what might be better,
Speaker 1: you know for me. And these can kind of coincide with,
Speaker 1: you know, other life hacks or other things that you
Speaker 1: do just to try to, you know, have a better life.
Speaker 1: Like I'm looking at my phone for an hour before bed.
Speaker 1: Maybe I should try not doing that, you know, or
Speaker 1: you know, I have this belief that I we were
Speaker 1: talking about email, that I must respond to every person
Speaker 1: you know, the same day, or I must respond to
Speaker 1: them at all. Well maybe that's the case, but maybe
Speaker 1: maybe not, you know, there could be something else. So
Speaker 1: I think it's very freeing. It can be very freeing
Speaker 1: for people once they understand that a lot of how
Speaker 1: they spend their time is governed by these kind of
Speaker 1: assumptions that are kind of baked in, and they can
Speaker 1: go and perhaps rewrite some of those or create something
Speaker 1: that serves them better.
Speaker 2: What are some of your time rules or time assumptions
Speaker 2: that you have that you've crushed. You're questioned, crushed is
Speaker 2: a bit aggressive, Let's go questioned.
Speaker 1: Questioned, I mean I like crush depending on the context.
Speaker 1: So I'm sure you've been familiar with this for a while,
Speaker 1: but I hadn't really known a lot about a lot
Speaker 1: of this research about the limited amount of cognitive attention
Speaker 1: that we have each day and it's only a few hours.
Speaker 1: And I've also found that shifting a little bit as
Speaker 1: I get older. I do feel like maybe this is
Speaker 1: this could be somewhat perception, but I do feel like
Speaker 1: I used to be able to process or focus a
Speaker 1: lot more. And so whether that's my perception or reality,
Speaker 1: I do feel that focus is more limited for me
Speaker 1: than it used to be ten years or twenty years ago.
Speaker 1: And so whatever the case is, I need to be
Speaker 1: mindful of that. So this idea that we only have
Speaker 1: maybe three hours a day on average of actual cognitive attention,
Speaker 1: and it's just true, you know, for prolific people throughout history,
Speaker 1: and you know Mozart and Beethoven and all these artists
Speaker 1: and famous writers and everybody else, like they pretty much
Speaker 1: got like three hours a day. And so I've tried
Speaker 1: to be really really careful about what does that time
Speaker 1: look like for me and how do I spend it?
Speaker 1: So I've tried to be careful. That's something I've tried
Speaker 1: to like think a little bit more about.
Speaker 2: So how do you then, like protect those precious focus hours?
Speaker 2: I don't know, like, do you have new rules in
Speaker 2: place or ways that you think about your day that
Speaker 2: have helped served you.
Speaker 1: I feel like more than protecting them from anybody else,
Speaker 1: I am the problem. Like it's me, I'm the problem.
Speaker 1: I feel like the way that my life is going
Speaker 1: to be disrupted is much more likely because I fail
Speaker 1: to take action, I fail to plan or actually like
Speaker 1: use that time. Well, you know, there's nobody else that's
Speaker 1: going to take that time away from me. It will
Speaker 1: only be taken away from me, you know, if I
Speaker 1: agree to do things in certain hours that I shouldn't
Speaker 1: do them or whatever. You know, Like, the far greater
Speaker 1: problem is my own resistance. And so I think the
Speaker 1: way that I address that is, like, like I always say,
Speaker 1: the greatest productivity hack is to love what you do.
Speaker 1: I know that probably sounds very basic and reductive, but
Speaker 1: if you actually love what you do, it's going to
Speaker 1: be so much easier to get up and go and
Speaker 1: do that thing, versus, Oh, I have to do this thing.
Speaker 1: How can I psych myself up? How can I manufacture
Speaker 1: motivation to do this thing that I have to do?
Speaker 1: And you know, it's theoretically possible to do that for
Speaker 1: a certain amount amount of time, But wouldn't it be
Speaker 1: so much better to like craft a life or craft
Speaker 1: at least some projects some parts of our life around
Speaker 1: those things that we're really excited about, And then you know,
Speaker 1: you feel a lot less resistance to you know, diving
Speaker 1: into them and working and they're still resistance. There's still problems,
Speaker 1: but honestly, I feel like that solves like eighty percent
Speaker 1: of the motivation problem.
Speaker 2: We will be back with Chris soon and when we
Speaker 2: writ down we'll discuss why he stopped trying to use
Speaker 2: and follow productivity hacks and his trick to figuring out
Speaker 2: what is and isn't a valuable use of your time.
Speaker 2: If you're looking for more tips to improve the way
Speaker 2: you work can live. I write a short weekly newsletter
Speaker 2: that contains tactics I've discovered that have helped me personally.
Speaker 2: You can sign up for that at Amantha dot com.
Speaker 2: That's Amantha dot com. It's funny, like when I think
Speaker 2: about time rules actually, and again, when I was reading
Speaker 2: the book, I was reflecting on this a lot, and
Speaker 2: not to bring it back to email, but it's my
Speaker 2: achilles heel. And interestingly, I find that for a lot
Speaker 2: of the you know, the productivity folk that I have
Speaker 2: on the podcast, Like I think of Jake Napp, for example,
Speaker 2: who I've had on a few times, and I feel like, yeah,
Speaker 2: email was his achilles heel, and there have been others.
Speaker 2: And one of the things that I've been catching myself
Speaker 2: thinking is that generally, like ninety percent of the time,
Speaker 2: my phone does not have email on it, So don't
Speaker 2: have my email app on my phone, which I think
Speaker 2: in and of itself is quite unusual. And I do
Speaker 2: that so that I can't just mindlessly check email whenever
Speaker 2: I want when I'm on the go, but sometimes I'll
Speaker 2: need it on my phone, whether it's there's a link
Speaker 2: to tickets that I've bought for a show, and so
Speaker 2: I'm just like, I'll just get email on my phone
Speaker 2: so I can do that easily and frictionlessly, and then
Speaker 2: it'll stay on my phone for a few days because
Speaker 2: I'll forget to delete it, and I will experience this
Speaker 2: sense of stress when I see an email come through,
Speaker 2: because my brain whenever it reads an email, and I'm
Speaker 2: sure this is how most people's brains work, is that
Speaker 2: they go, I need to respond to that, and then
Speaker 2: the stress starts because there's something that is on how
Speaker 2: to do list that is not yet done, and I
Speaker 2: think about what if I haven't seen that email for
Speaker 2: two days, I wouldn't have had that thought, and I
Speaker 2: would have responded at some stage in the future, and
Speaker 2: that worry wouldn't have been there, or that task taking
Speaker 2: up space in my mind wouldn't have been there. Just
Speaker 2: these self imposed deadlines and assumptions cause us a lot
Speaker 2: of stress, whereas if we just didn't see the thing,
Speaker 2: the stress wouldn't be there. And just how artificial it is?
Speaker 2: Can you relate to any of this, Chris No.
Speaker 1: One hundred percent. I think it's interesting. Two things. One,
Speaker 1: it's you know, even if you decide I'm not going
Speaker 1: to respond until later, that thing is already like in
Speaker 1: your brain, like you've already taken it in, so you're
Speaker 1: going to be it's going to be like you're going
Speaker 1: to be thinking about it, or even if you're not
Speaker 1: thinking about it, you're not thinking about thinking about it,
Speaker 1: and you are thinking about it. Right. But also the
Speaker 1: second thing is is like, is it just the notification
Speaker 1: that's the problem, right, Because if you have the email
Speaker 1: app on your phone but you don't have the notifications
Speaker 1: turned on, then you don't actually see when the new
Speaker 1: messages are coming in. Right, it's accessible to you if
Speaker 1: you need to go get the tickets for the show
Speaker 1: or whatever else. But it sounds like in that case,
Speaker 1: maybe the notification is the problem.
Speaker 2: I don't have my notification switched on for email, This
Speaker 2: is me.
Speaker 1: How do you know that the email has come through.
Speaker 2: Because I check it? Because I don't really have social
Speaker 2: media on my phone. My phone is quite boring, and
Speaker 2: so when email is on it, it's like, well, that's
Speaker 2: an exciting thing that's going to possibly give me a
Speaker 2: dope for meat hit. If there's like a good email
Speaker 2: in there, it's entirely my own doing, which is why,
Speaker 2: as many productivity people say, don't rely on willpower. Set
Speaker 2: up your systems so that you're not relying on willpower
Speaker 2: to not do the thing. And so if email is
Speaker 2: not on my phone, I don't think about email and
Speaker 2: I don't check my email.
Speaker 1: I kept trying to get better and better at doing
Speaker 1: these things, and this is part of why I wrote
Speaker 1: the book, as like I tried to follow all these
Speaker 1: rules right, and these habits about like I shouldn't have
Speaker 1: this app on my phone, and this is how my
Speaker 1: notifications need to be set up. And there's a thousand
Speaker 1: other things right, like we've all read them in like
Speaker 1: all the books and so on, And I guess I
Speaker 1: was pretty good at it, Like I was pretty good
Speaker 1: at the productivity game. And at a certain point I
Speaker 1: just realized what am I actually getting better at? Like,
Speaker 1: ultimately I think I'm getting better at doing the wrong things,
Speaker 1: or even if some of those things can be helpful,
Speaker 1: like the more I do them, the more things that
Speaker 1: will come back. And are these things really making it,
Speaker 1: you know, measurable difference in my life or some of
Speaker 1: them actually stressing me out? You know. It's like the
Speaker 1: number of questions I get about even from people who've
Speaker 1: read the book, because I'm like, the system doesn't matter.
Speaker 1: You should probably have some kind of list making system
Speaker 1: and task things. It's fine, but it doesn't really matter
Speaker 1: what it is. You should do what's best for you.
Speaker 1: But still I'm going on book tour and people are like,
Speaker 1: tell me a little bit about your productivity setup and
Speaker 1: your stack and like what apps you use. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm fine to talk. I don't mind talking about that.
Speaker 1: But I guess for me again, that was the problem.
Speaker 1: Like I thought those things were going to help me
Speaker 1: or like remedy the distress I felt, and really they
Speaker 1: did not. And so honestly, the more simple the solution
Speaker 1: you can find, the better. Or if there's some productivity
Speaker 1: tool that requires a lot of learning, then I don't
Speaker 1: think that's a helpful tool, you know, if you're learning
Speaker 1: to edit film, if you're learning to code, Like, these
Speaker 1: are things in which you need to go and like
Speaker 1: spend hours maybe watching some courses or YouTube and such,
Speaker 1: because there is like higher knowledge required there. But for
Speaker 1: learning like these various systems and such, you know, keeping
Speaker 1: up a task, it should be very simple. So all
Speaker 1: that to say, like learning these things and trying to
Speaker 1: apply all these tools was not helpful to me.
Speaker 2: Ultimately, Oh gosh, it's funny. I'm amused by that question
Speaker 2: because I feel like it mildly misses the point of
Speaker 2: the book. But then also part of my mind is going, hmm,
Speaker 2: what software does Chrissy use what it is told? And
Speaker 2: it's got me thinking, But that would just be totally
Speaker 2: beside the point. I like some of the practices in
Speaker 2: the book that are more around get around, like that
Speaker 2: deeper reflection. And I think one of the questions that
Speaker 2: you recommend people ask is what is special about this day?
Speaker 2: Can you tell me more about like when should we
Speaker 2: ask that question? And what is the impact of doing sorry, what.
Speaker 1: Is special about this day? I think I came to
Speaker 1: that practice out of the belief or the concept that
Speaker 1: when we think about life, people tend to think about
Speaker 1: big moments. They tend to think like these milestones of
Speaker 1: like here's this thing that happened in my life. It
Speaker 1: was like a one off kind of thing. But really
Speaker 1: our lives consist much more of like ordinary moments and
Speaker 1: just the day to day, and a lot of that is,
Speaker 1: you know, unmemorable or maybe in some ways like to
Speaker 1: make it more active, forgettable, but yet at the same time,
Speaker 1: like every day has something at least one thing, probably
Speaker 1: more than one thing that is special. And for me,
Speaker 1: I've tried to work on being more present, on noticing,
Speaker 1: more on mindfulness, but I also had to come to
Speaker 1: it from a different perspective because I'm not really good
Speaker 1: at meditation, and I've tried some of those practices and
Speaker 1: they don't work super well for me. But to get
Speaker 1: to the same place, like noticing what is special about
Speaker 1: this day, the ordinary moments that make up our life,
Speaker 1: and there are things we can do to like inspire
Speaker 1: that specialness. There are things we can do to like
Speaker 1: make days special, whether it's a change in routine or
Speaker 1: just doing something a little bit different or asking what
Speaker 1: matters right now? I also like this one about did
Speaker 1: today matter? So you ask this question at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, like looking back, and it's really interesting
Speaker 1: because it's not like asking was it a good day
Speaker 1: or a bad day? You know, like sometimes you can
Speaker 1: actually have a bad day, but you feel like you
Speaker 1: made some progress in something, you spent time with people
Speaker 1: that you loved, like you actually felt alive even though
Speaker 1: the day was kind of stressful for whatever reason. Or
Speaker 1: you can have days in which everything was kind of fine,
Speaker 1: but you look back and you're like, today, I'm not
Speaker 1: really going to ever think about again. And so if
Speaker 1: you think about did today matter and being able to
Speaker 1: answer yes, today mattered because of AB and C and
Speaker 1: those answers might be different for each person, that's helpful
Speaker 1: because the next day you want to do more of
Speaker 1: those things and you know, hopefully like build up this
Speaker 1: streak of days that matter to you. So I think
Speaker 1: all of those things together, it's like pointing towards mindfulness,
Speaker 1: but maybe a way that's a little bit different from
Speaker 1: how other people have gotten there.
Speaker 2: It's an interesting question did today matter? I feel like
Speaker 2: and I'm going to try this asking myself that question
Speaker 2: certainly at the end of today and hopefully for a
Speaker 2: few days. But I feel like I would answer that, well,
Speaker 2: of course it did, and I would look for the meaning,
Speaker 2: which would ultimately be a good thing to reflect on. Well,
Speaker 2: what did matter about today? Because I think as humans,
Speaker 2: you know, we don't want to go I've just wasted
Speaker 2: a day, even though I think a lot of people
Speaker 2: have that thought. At the end of the day, today
Speaker 2: felt like I wasted it. I messed around, I you know,
Speaker 2: I spent too much time on social media or whatever.
Speaker 1: Sure, sure, okay, that's a good point. Yeah, you could
Speaker 1: like look back and find the meaning in it and
Speaker 1: find what was special. But maybe here's another way to
Speaker 1: think of it. Then, So if we think about that pressure,
Speaker 1: another question is like how valuable were my last forty minutes?
Speaker 1: And so this is a much shorter time period, and
Speaker 1: I do think if most people ask that question, there
Speaker 1: are lots of times during the day that we will
Speaker 1: say the last forty minutes, I don't know that they
Speaker 1: were that valuable. And so value can also mean productivity,
Speaker 1: It can mean like satisfaction, enjoyment, learning. You know, there's
Speaker 1: lots of different ways for your time to be valuable.
Speaker 1: But if you say, at any point during the day,
Speaker 1: actually the last forty minutes not that valuable. Then you
Speaker 1: can make a little shift and be like, oh, what
Speaker 1: do I want to do differently for the next forty minutes,
Speaker 1: And so it's not that long of a time that
Speaker 1: you have wasted, and it gives you a little chance
Speaker 1: to reset. Perhaps.
Speaker 2: Yes, I love that question, and I'm curious how often
Speaker 2: do you ask yourself that question?
Speaker 1: A lot of these kind of activities and practices I
Speaker 1: kind of cycle between, and I'll be doing one for
Speaker 1: a while and then I'll do something else for a while.
Speaker 1: For a long time, I was really into the five
Speaker 1: goals thing. Do you know that whole model of like
Speaker 1: you can only have five things, and you make a
Speaker 1: list of your top twenty five, and then you choose
Speaker 1: like the top five and then the other twenty or not.
Speaker 1: Things you do on the side. There are things that
Speaker 1: you absolutely must not do because they're keeping you from
Speaker 1: your five. That's a whole like other rubric. I was
Speaker 1: into that for a while, and so every day for
Speaker 1: like six months, I would have like a paper journal
Speaker 1: and I would write down like one, two, three, four, five,
Speaker 1: like did I do that? You know? But this is
Speaker 1: not like a lifelong practice It's something that helped me
Speaker 1: for a little while, and then I kind of moved on.
Speaker 1: So when you say, like this particular one, how often
Speaker 1: am I doing it? I think I'm probably doing it
Speaker 1: a couple times a day. But it's not like I
Speaker 1: have like an alarm setup, you know, on my phone,
Speaker 1: and it's not like I have a journal that It's like,
Speaker 1: that's the old old Chris would would have like systematized
Speaker 1: it and had it, like I don't know, built some
Speaker 1: spreadsheet or something for it. And thankfully I don't do
Speaker 1: things like that now.
Speaker 2: What other practices like, because I always love knowing, like,
Speaker 2: particularly when you've written a book, and I mean you
Speaker 2: would have submitted this manuscript twelve months ago or something
Speaker 2: like that. I imagine like one of the things I'm
Speaker 2: so curious about. And I feel like I've experienced when
Speaker 2: I'm doing publicity for the books that I've written, it's like,
Speaker 2: oh gosh, I've either moved on from that or I'm
Speaker 2: only using a subset of what I wrote about. What
Speaker 2: are those things like right now? You know in the
Speaker 2: last few weeks that you're like, yeah, I'm doing that
Speaker 2: a lot.
Speaker 1: Actually, Well, at the beginning of this conversation. I think
Speaker 1: we touched on legacy versus living well. That is something
Speaker 1: that I think about a lot. I try to think
Speaker 1: about what is living well look like for me at
Speaker 1: this season. I am very like project focused and like
Speaker 1: goal oriented, and I'm always going to be that way.
Speaker 1: Like I haven't given that up. I think I said
Speaker 1: that too, but I'm often going back to, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: what should I be doing right now? You know things
Speaker 1: I could be doing. And then also I wrote a
Speaker 1: good bit about choice and about how life ultimately is
Speaker 1: about choice and choosing and there are more things that
Speaker 1: we want to do then we'll be able to do.
Speaker 1: Desire is limitless, and there's actually joy in selecting and
Speaker 1: choosing and making decisions. And so I started writing the
Speaker 1: book because I felt like, IRE's not enough time. I've
Speaker 1: missed my I've already pequked and I've missed my chance
Speaker 1: or whatever, and like now I'm like, there's still time.
Speaker 1: There's still time for things that I can do new things.
Speaker 1: You know, I can change, I can adjust and adapt.
Speaker 1: And so I think that is something that is very
Speaker 1: much with me. I know that sounds kind of a
Speaker 1: big picture, but it actually really doesn't form like my
Speaker 1: day to day and think about what is it that
Speaker 1: I want to work on. I just put on a
Speaker 1: new event a couple of months ago in Austin, Texas
Speaker 1: for the neurodivergent community. And like I used to produce
Speaker 1: another annual event. I did it for ten years with
Speaker 1: David Fugate, our mutual friend and literary agent, and you know,
Speaker 1: we built that event up year after year and then
Speaker 1: it came to a natural end. So I wanted to
Speaker 1: start this new event, and so to make a long
Speaker 1: story short, I did it and it went really well,
Speaker 1: and it was for a relatively small number of people.
Speaker 1: There were just like a couple hundred people there, and
Speaker 1: it took several months of like full time work. So
Speaker 1: on the scale of like you know, like from like
Speaker 1: a hard business and analysis like is this the best
Speaker 1: thing for me to be doing? Maybe somebody would say no,
Speaker 1: but I'm like, this is absolutely what I should be doing.
Speaker 1: Like it was totally the right thing. I'm excited about,
Speaker 1: you know, building it more for a year or two.
Speaker 1: So maybe just thinking about what really matters and how
Speaker 1: do I apply that is something that I try to do.
Speaker 2: Have you changed, you know since writing time? Anxiety like
Speaker 2: your process of thinking about what projects you do take
Speaker 2: on versus what you say no to or get left
Speaker 2: on the cutting room floor.
Speaker 1: I don't know if the process has changed so much
Speaker 1: as I no longer feel bad or not as bad
Speaker 1: about the things I'm not doing or the things that
Speaker 1: I'm not great at. I have a lot of friends
Speaker 1: who are really good at social media, and they're just
Speaker 1: crushing that, and they're all these profiles and like new
Speaker 1: videos and reels every day. It's just so so great
Speaker 1: to watch. And you know, I used to feel very
Speaker 1: envious of it, and now I just feel like, I mean,
Speaker 1: maybe I feel like ten percent envious of it, but
Speaker 1: it's more just like, that's what they do. They're really
Speaker 1: good at that. That's not me. You know, There's other
Speaker 1: things I'm going to do. So I don't know if
Speaker 1: it's the process that's changed, it's more of the FOMO
Speaker 1: has decreased. So that's good, that's awesome.
Speaker 2: Well, Chris, how useful has the last forty minutes been
Speaker 2: for you? Has it been a good use of your time?
Speaker 2: Longer than forty minutes we're recorded for though.
Speaker 1: I really love this conversation. You have asked some really
Speaker 1: smart questions. You actually read the book, I can tell,
Speaker 1: and you are someone who's worked in this field for years.
Speaker 1: I have a lot of respect for you. It has
Speaker 1: been a wonderful conversation and a wonderful use of forty
Speaker 1: plus minutes.
Speaker 2: I hope you love the second part of this chat
Speaker 2: with Chris as much as I did. I am definitely
Speaker 2: going to be trying that forty minute reflection tip. I
Speaker 2: personally think that is just gold. Now. If you want
Speaker 2: to learn more about Chris, I highly recommend checking out
Speaker 2: his new book, Time Anxiety. You'll find a link to
Speaker 2: that in the show notes. If you like today's show,
Speaker 2: make sure you gid follow on your podcast app to
Speaker 2: be alerted when new episodes drop. How I Work was
Speaker 2: recorded on the traditional land of the Warrangery People, part
Speaker 2: of the Cool and Nation