1 00:00:00,560 --> 00:00:03,880 Speaker 1: My name's Kate Robinson. I'm a storyteller on Finean Tell. 2 00:00:04,720 --> 00:00:09,160 Speaker 1: I am an Iranian Australian podcaster who currently lives on 3 00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:13,640 Speaker 1: Warundrii Woong and Bunoran country. I'd like to recognize the 4 00:00:13,680 --> 00:00:17,599 Speaker 1: traditional custodians of this continent whose land was stolen nearly 5 00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:21,400 Speaker 1: two hundred and fifty years ago, in particular the Camereaga 6 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:25,040 Speaker 1: and Warunduri people whose land this podcast was recorded on. 7 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: And we extend our respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 8 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:32,960 Speaker 1: Strait islander peoples that are listening. The rich storytelling history 9 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:36,200 Speaker 1: of the world's oldest living culture is what we pay 10 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:38,959 Speaker 1: homage to when we tell stories on Finan Tell. 11 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:46,520 Speaker 2: Hello, I'm Jimilla Risby, and this is Fine and Tell 12 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:50,559 Speaker 2: the search for the next generation of Australian storytellers and 13 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:53,280 Speaker 2: a chance to honors some stories that we might not 14 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 2: otherwise have heard. Each episode, our storytellers go head to 15 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:01,120 Speaker 2: head to tell a story related to the episode's theme. 16 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:04,120 Speaker 2: Whoever finds and tells the best story will win the 17 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:07,480 Speaker 2: episode and be one step closer to being crowned the 18 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:12,600 Speaker 2: Find and Tell Champion and win best in Class podcast. 19 00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:15,240 Speaker 2: In goodies and gear from the amazing team at Road 20 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 2: Australia and we are excited to welcome the Australian Film, 21 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:23,760 Speaker 2: Television and Radio School on as a partner. After us, 22 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:26,600 Speaker 2: we'll provide our winner with a range of short courses 23 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:29,760 Speaker 2: and mentoring so they can continue to find and tell 24 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:34,679 Speaker 2: stories into the future. In today's episode, our storytellers are 25 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:36,920 Speaker 2: tackling the theme today was. 26 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:37,559 Speaker 3: A bad day. 27 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 2: First up, it's Ben, who last time took us on 28 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 2: a Teddy Bear hunt. Let's hear what he's got in 29 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 2: store for us today. Hey, Ben, welcome back to Find. 30 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 4: And Tell, Happy to be guest. Thank you tell me. 31 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 2: During the process of making your three podcast episodes, did 32 00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:58,240 Speaker 2: you start to feel more comfortable as you went along 33 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:00,880 Speaker 2: or with a new challenges at every stage? 34 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:03,040 Speaker 4: I mean, today was a bad day was a hard 35 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 4: topic for me because no one really wants to talk 36 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 4: about the bad days most times, you know, the stories 37 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 4: that we tell are positives, like no one really wants 38 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 4: to hear about you're feeling down or you're feeling negative. 39 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:15,360 Speaker 4: And I wanted to kind of take that as an 40 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:19,400 Speaker 4: opportunity to do, you know, I guess put myself out 41 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:23,640 Speaker 4: there and feel pretty vulnerable to address address how I 42 00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:25,040 Speaker 4: felt about that day. 43 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:27,799 Speaker 2: All right, I want to hear this episode. Your theme 44 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,359 Speaker 2: this week was today was a bad day. Let's get 45 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:31,680 Speaker 2: to it. 46 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,880 Speaker 4: Brenna grew up in the landlocked state of Kansas, USA. 47 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:38,760 Speaker 4: She would recall the stories from her father about living 48 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:40,960 Speaker 4: on the coast in Australia and the culture that came 49 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 4: with it. The moment Brenna turned eighteen do she wanted 50 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 4: to experience this for herself. So Brenna made the move 51 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 4: to the Ilahara with her older sister Tanil to live 52 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 4: with their grandmother, and not too long after that, Brenna 53 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:58,120 Speaker 4: met me. I remember many memories from the tour I 54 00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:01,239 Speaker 4: spent with Brenner, movies, heading the different bars and clubs, 55 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:03,760 Speaker 4: and just jumping in the car chasing adventures, you know, 56 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:07,799 Speaker 4: the average eighteen year old life, although one day will 57 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 4: forever stand out amongst the rest, a day that shadowed 58 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 4: all the good memories from that year, one bad day 59 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 4: that I would carry the burden of for the next 60 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:20,640 Speaker 4: ten years. This is a story I've told friends and 61 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 4: family before. Usually when conversations turn to past mistakes in life, 62 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 4: this story is the first one that comes to mind, 63 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 4: and every time I tell it, I get this overwhelming 64 00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:32,920 Speaker 4: feeling rush over me and sit in the pit of 65 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 4: my stomach guilt. The times I would tell the story 66 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 4: to friends, I'd always ask myself, I wonder how Brenner 67 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 4: is doing. And so, after many years of no contact, 68 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:47,600 Speaker 4: in the hopes she might be willing to sit down 69 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 4: and talk about that day, I reached out. 70 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 5: Even when he sent me that message, I just was like, what, 71 00:03:56,840 --> 00:04:01,400 Speaker 5: it's been one you okay? I messaged to Nil and 72 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 5: I said, you'll not believe who's messaged me. And she 73 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:07,800 Speaker 5: said who? And I said Ben Heyward And she's like, 74 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 5: what does that boy want? And I said, well, I 75 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 5: don't know, and she's like, we'll better open that message. 76 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:17,520 Speaker 4: Hi, Brenner, it's been a while. I know this is 77 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:20,240 Speaker 4: out of the ordinary, but I'm reaching out to ask 78 00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:22,280 Speaker 4: you'd potentially be up to chat with me about the 79 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:25,240 Speaker 4: day over ten years ago when you were seriously injured. 80 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:27,160 Speaker 6: I thought of this story because. 81 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:28,720 Speaker 4: I've carried a lot of guilt for some time now, 82 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:33,160 Speaker 4: and I feel responsible for what happened to you that day. Obviously, 83 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:35,160 Speaker 4: it's a lot to take in, and I understand if 84 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 4: you need more information or time. Once again, thank you 85 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 4: for considering. I hope your chat soon. 86 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 7: Ben. 87 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 4: Hello, how are you good to see you? 88 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 5: Yeah? 89 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:51,719 Speaker 4: Really good to see you. 90 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 6: Yeah. 91 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:54,720 Speaker 4: This was the first time I've seen Brenner in over 92 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:57,160 Speaker 4: ten years, and the first time I've ever spoken to 93 00:04:57,200 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 4: her about that day when we were kids. 94 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:03,760 Speaker 5: We were eighteen. I was eighteen, new to Australia. I 95 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:06,160 Speaker 5: think I was just craving like new experiences and then 96 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 5: meeting you and obviously like we were like good, would 97 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 5: go on a few dates and things you offered. I 98 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:15,760 Speaker 5: just remember us having a conversation of things to do around. 99 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:16,040 Speaker 6: The ill Worra. 100 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:18,600 Speaker 4: Brenna was keen to learn how to surf, and I 101 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 4: was excited to be the one to teach her. 102 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:22,360 Speaker 5: I was like, oh, that's so cool because I haven't served. 103 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:25,840 Speaker 5: You know, I've never served in a grow up surfing. 104 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 4: So after a few weeks we planned to finally put 105 00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:31,520 Speaker 4: the wetsuits on and head out. But that day the 106 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 4: other war was hit with severe storms, pouring rain and 107 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:38,679 Speaker 4: huge swell. I could see the disappointment in Brenna's face, 108 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:41,120 Speaker 4: knowing that she was so excited to go out and 109 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 4: surf for the day, so I decided I could take 110 00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:45,119 Speaker 4: it to a local nine gem. 111 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:48,160 Speaker 6: What did you call it again, the washing machine? The 112 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:50,440 Speaker 6: washing machine, Yes, that's what you called it. 113 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:53,560 Speaker 5: Yeah. 114 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 4: The washing machine is a large flat slab of natural 115 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 4: rock at the tip of Barrack Point, a local popular 116 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:03,039 Speaker 4: surf break. The rock drops down vertically about two feet 117 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:06,719 Speaker 4: and as kids, we would crouch down, lay hard against 118 00:06:06,720 --> 00:06:09,920 Speaker 4: the rock wall and let the whitewash flow seamlessly over 119 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 4: the top of us, allowing you to experience what it's 120 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:15,080 Speaker 4: like in the inside of a barrel of a wave. 121 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:18,799 Speaker 4: It's perfect for someone to get the experience of surfing 122 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:22,520 Speaker 4: without actually doing it. I picked Brenner up and just 123 00:06:22,560 --> 00:06:25,359 Speaker 4: before leaving, I remember Brenda's grandmother looking me in the 124 00:06:25,400 --> 00:06:29,320 Speaker 4: eyes and saying, you look after my granddaughter now. I 125 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:31,800 Speaker 4: gave him my word that I would. 126 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:37,480 Speaker 5: We walked out to the cliff edge. We looked down 127 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,120 Speaker 5: and there was the expanse of the rock. It just 128 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:41,720 Speaker 5: looked like a little rectangular slab. 129 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:45,040 Speaker 6: I think the tide was high. 130 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 5: It was stormy as well, so it was a bit rough. 131 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 6: But like at that. 132 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:53,159 Speaker 5: Point, you know we're going to experience this, you know, 133 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:55,200 Speaker 5: barrel of a wave. Because you kept talking about how 134 00:06:55,240 --> 00:06:59,080 Speaker 5: beautiful it was. I did have some reservations going all 135 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:01,279 Speaker 5: the waves are a little bit high, but you were like, no, like, 136 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 5: this is how it needs to be. Okay, let's do it, 137 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 5: you know, because I trusted you, and I. 138 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:09,560 Speaker 6: Was just like if people have done this before. 139 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:13,240 Speaker 5: Like they didn't really have any kind of initial fears 140 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:18,080 Speaker 5: for safety when I went there with you, I wasn't 141 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:21,320 Speaker 5: even thinking about, you know, what would it happen. 142 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 4: This is exactly how I remember that day. Besides one 143 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 4: important piece. See, what Brennan didn't know was that I 144 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 4: knew it was too dangerous to be out there. I 145 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 4: knew we shouldn't have gone out that day. I've replayed 146 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 4: this scenario so many times in my head trying to 147 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 4: figure out why I ignored my instincts. The answer that 148 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:46,960 Speaker 4: I'd given myself was that I was too embarrassed to 149 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 4: admit that I was in over my head. I let 150 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 4: ego cloud my judgment, and I really just wanted to 151 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 4: impress Brenner. 152 00:08:00,120 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 5: Then you told me, okay, like it's time to go, 153 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 5: time to you know, crouch beneath the washing machine. 154 00:08:06,560 --> 00:08:09,680 Speaker 4: And by this point I'm screaming because the sound of 155 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:12,360 Speaker 4: the waves are just so loud, crashing against the rocks, 156 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:12,760 Speaker 4: I was. 157 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 5: You know, pretty thrilled, like it was exhilarating, you know, 158 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 5: your your adrenaline's pumping. 159 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 4: I'm screaming, telling her, when the waves come, you have 160 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 4: to duck hold on tight, and. 161 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 6: So we crouch along this rock. 162 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 5: I think you're holding on to me and I'm holding 163 00:08:28,440 --> 00:08:30,880 Speaker 5: on to you, and you're like, okay, are you ready? 164 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 4: And we ducked down and the first wave crashed over 165 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:35,320 Speaker 4: the top of us. 166 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:40,440 Speaker 5: And I think I remember just thinking, oh my god, 167 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:42,760 Speaker 5: this wave is really powerful. 168 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 4: Like that was crazy, and the excitement on her face 169 00:08:46,200 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 4: was that feeling didn't last too long because after the 170 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:55,200 Speaker 4: first wave come over, the second wave, the third wave 171 00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:56,960 Speaker 4: came over crashing. 172 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 5: I just remember going, oh my god, like please, like 173 00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:05,840 Speaker 5: just stop, just stop, just stop. 174 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:10,120 Speaker 6: It was white wash everywhere. 175 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:13,480 Speaker 5: I was skidding on my bum had my hands out, 176 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 5: my feet in front of me, and I was just skidding. 177 00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 4: By the time I had enough kind of stable grip 178 00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 4: to lift my hands off the rock face and white 179 00:09:22,880 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 4: wash out of my eyes. 180 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 6: I looked up and Brenna was gone. 181 00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:32,200 Speaker 4: I jumped up and I turned around and I could 182 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:37,840 Speaker 4: just see Brenna's body just laying hard up against the cliff. Face, 183 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 4: which is in a pool of her own blood. She said, 184 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:44,560 Speaker 4: I can't stand my feet. Her feet had been sliced 185 00:09:44,640 --> 00:09:47,079 Speaker 4: by oysters and cut by the sharp rock face, and 186 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:51,199 Speaker 4: they had cut her to the bone. Brenna was losing 187 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:53,120 Speaker 4: like a lot of blood, like there was blood everywhere. 188 00:09:53,160 --> 00:09:56,440 Speaker 4: She was soaking wet. I could see muscles and bone 189 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:58,160 Speaker 4: and flesh. 190 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 7: We have to go to the hospital. We get to 191 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:08,199 Speaker 7: the hospital and I say, wait here, I'm going to 192 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:10,960 Speaker 7: go get your wheelchair and I run in. They were like, oh, 193 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:13,000 Speaker 7: you're okay, you're bleeding, and I remember saying, it's not 194 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 7: my blood. 195 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:14,679 Speaker 4: I need a wheelchair right now. 196 00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:16,319 Speaker 3: They had to. 197 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 5: Put me in the shower to remove the wet suit, 198 00:10:18,840 --> 00:10:22,040 Speaker 5: and they basically washed all the wounds with me, and 199 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 5: then they popped me back into the bed. 200 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:27,120 Speaker 4: I remember standing next to the hospital bed, still dripping 201 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:30,840 Speaker 4: wet and salt water and blood. Brenna told me to 202 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:34,960 Speaker 4: call her grandmother. There's a phone, rang I remember thinking, 203 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:38,040 Speaker 4: the last time I spoke to this woman, I told 204 00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 4: her that her granddaughter would be safe. 205 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 1: Now. 206 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:43,840 Speaker 4: Only hours later, I was calling to tell her that 207 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:48,960 Speaker 4: Brenner was in the emergency department. Making that call and 208 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:52,200 Speaker 4: happened to hear your grandmother say what's going on and 209 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 4: I've gone Brenna's in the hospital. 210 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:57,000 Speaker 7: After she told me you make sure you look after 211 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:58,640 Speaker 7: my granddaughter, I was like. 212 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:00,440 Speaker 5: Fuck. 213 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:07,680 Speaker 7: So that for me was like a pretty heavy moment 214 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:11,439 Speaker 7: because I was responsible and I knew better, because I 215 00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:14,559 Speaker 7: knew we shouldn't have want to anything that day. I 216 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:18,760 Speaker 7: knew looking at the size of the swell and the conditions, 217 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 7: but I was too embarrassed and I let my ego 218 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:25,160 Speaker 7: get in front of me. I remember you getting swept away, 219 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:31,120 Speaker 7: and that feeling was just horrific because I didn't address 220 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 7: the guilt then, I just allowed it to kind of 221 00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:37,040 Speaker 7: make me feel worse. 222 00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 6: I felt bad that you felt so bad about it. 223 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:48,240 Speaker 5: The experience that we shared together, it was not just 224 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:51,680 Speaker 5: you choosing to go out there and making me go 225 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:54,079 Speaker 5: out there. I went out there on my own accord 226 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:58,000 Speaker 5: as well. I wanted to be cool and I wanted to, 227 00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:02,640 Speaker 5: you know, experience life in Australia, and I thought that 228 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:06,679 Speaker 5: this was how people did it over here. And I 229 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 5: felt embarrassed too, because I was like, oh, you know, 230 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 5: he's probably taken that many people to the washing machine, 231 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 5: and I'm the first person that's actually you know, didn't 232 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 5: do it properly, and you'd probably think all some dumb American. 233 00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:26,319 Speaker 5: I never had any sort of like harsh feelings towards you. 234 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:30,280 Speaker 5: It was more just I think self reflection from my 235 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 5: own self to go what I did was my decision 236 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 5: was pretty stupid, but I've learned from it. There's so 237 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:42,360 Speaker 5: many things that happen in people's lives that have such 238 00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:45,480 Speaker 5: a big effect on maybe someone personally, but another person 239 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 5: you know, might not think it as much. When you 240 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,640 Speaker 5: were talking about the locals and how it was like 241 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 5: a local gym, it kind of resonated with me a 242 00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 5: little bit because I wanted to feel like a local 243 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:02,080 Speaker 5: because I wanted to live here and I wanted to 244 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 5: be a part of Australia because it is part of 245 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:09,960 Speaker 5: my heritage. And I think maybe that was that was 246 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 5: kind of the crux of it, you know, I wanted 247 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:16,120 Speaker 5: to feel, you know, one with Australia. 248 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:19,880 Speaker 6: Have you been back there that day? 249 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 5: So I live I live around that area and I 250 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:29,360 Speaker 5: go for a lot of runs along Barrick Point where 251 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:32,080 Speaker 5: it's located out, but I've never actually been back down 252 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:39,080 Speaker 5: to that rock surface. It definitely doesn't look as menacing, 253 00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:43,200 Speaker 5: I think as as I remember it. So is this 254 00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:46,040 Speaker 5: the kind of weather that you would take people? 255 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:46,559 Speaker 6: Yeah? 256 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:51,160 Speaker 4: Wow, see right now, that's perfect that this is the 257 00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:52,600 Speaker 4: type of weather. We should have come. 258 00:13:52,480 --> 00:14:00,719 Speaker 5: Out still potentially get dragged, but definitely not at the 259 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:01,679 Speaker 5: rate that I did. 260 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:04,560 Speaker 7: Did you want to go give it a gay? Oh? 261 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 5: No, definitely not. 262 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:09,840 Speaker 3: No, I got enough of it. 263 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 5: But yeah, one and done. 264 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:15,760 Speaker 6: I don't think I could ever know that moment. 265 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 5: We got to have a big slap in the face 266 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 5: with our mortality. We are not immortal, even though we're 267 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:28,120 Speaker 5: eighteen and feel like we are and feel like we're 268 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:31,280 Speaker 5: on top of the world and the world is our oyster. No, 269 00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:35,840 Speaker 5: the world has oysters and they cut off your feet. 270 00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:43,960 Speaker 2: Ben, What are you most proud of hearing that? 271 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:45,240 Speaker 1: Ah? 272 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:48,800 Speaker 4: One of my most proud of I think I'm proud 273 00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 4: of myself that I took the opportunity and the chance 274 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:54,400 Speaker 4: to address the guilt that I've carried for such a 275 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:58,360 Speaker 4: long time. You know, I don't know if I would 276 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:01,480 Speaker 4: have done it otherwise. Yeah, And given the opportunity to, 277 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 4: I guess have the courage to, I guess reach out 278 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:07,680 Speaker 4: to Brennan after so many years I don't know if 279 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:10,840 Speaker 4: I would have put myself out there if it wasn't 280 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:14,320 Speaker 4: for this, if it wasn't for you know, find and 281 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,040 Speaker 4: tell and giving me the platform to do it. 282 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 2: She was incredibly generous with her contribution and forgive me 283 00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:24,160 Speaker 2: for making a story that's close to you a bit 284 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:26,320 Speaker 2: too in the business. But she was also great talent, 285 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:29,600 Speaker 2: like she can really tell a story. How did you 286 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:33,880 Speaker 2: coach or prepare her ahead of the interview. 287 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 4: I didn't, I didn't at all. I yeah, Wow, the 288 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 4: Brenner that I remembered from when we were kids and 289 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 4: when we used to hang out when we were teenagers, 290 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 4: I knew that she was going to be able to 291 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 4: tell a good story, just because she's so intricate with 292 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:50,600 Speaker 4: the way she speaks. And I remember telling her that 293 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:53,240 Speaker 4: as well. I said, the Brenner that I know can 294 00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 4: can speak amazing like she can speak amazingly well. So 295 00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:00,840 Speaker 4: I didn't really have to coach in any way. I 296 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:04,800 Speaker 4: just asked her to just recap the events of that day. 297 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 4: And yeah, obviously in that interview that we did do 298 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,000 Speaker 4: was the first time that she had heard that I 299 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 4: carried the guilt from that day as well, So it 300 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 4: was a bit of a surprise to her, but as 301 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:18,120 Speaker 4: you heard, like, she's such an amazing person and she 302 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:19,880 Speaker 4: just for her to be willing to sit down and 303 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 4: talk to me after ten years of no contact was 304 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 4: someone really special. So I'm glad that. I'm glad that 305 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 4: it turned out the way it did. 306 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 2: You've shown us what it is to have two people 307 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 2: experience the same event and have very different memories of 308 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 2: it and very different perceptions and processing of it. And 309 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:38,520 Speaker 2: you didn't have to tell us that and give us 310 00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 2: a lecture on that being the case or what the 311 00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:43,560 Speaker 2: psychology of that is. You sort of made that point 312 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:46,120 Speaker 2: so beautifully, and I think much more powerfully by showing 313 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:49,400 Speaker 2: us rather than telling us. One of the sequences in 314 00:16:49,440 --> 00:16:53,480 Speaker 2: there that really struck me was the section where you're 315 00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:57,240 Speaker 2: recalling that day at the washing machine, and you're going 316 00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:01,040 Speaker 2: backwards and forwards between your retelling and then Brenner's retelling. 317 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:07,640 Speaker 2: How did you make that choice to use both recollections simultaneously. 318 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 4: The first time I recapped my memories of the event, 319 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:15,800 Speaker 4: which were much more traumatic than Brenner's, and you can 320 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 4: kind of hear the difference of it, you know, I 321 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:22,320 Speaker 4: recorded my recap first of all, and then in the 322 00:17:22,320 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 4: interview with Brenner, and I just said, you know, go 323 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:27,359 Speaker 4: for it, told me what you can remember, and that 324 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:30,159 Speaker 4: was her one take. I guess it's like a bit 325 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 4: of a juxtaposition. I guess that is that the word 326 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 4: that we. 327 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:36,440 Speaker 2: Use in the internet got Yeah, and you've kept it. 328 00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:39,560 Speaker 2: You've kept your retailing quite pure by making sure you 329 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:42,160 Speaker 2: did yours first, and you weren't you weren't colored by 330 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:43,440 Speaker 2: what she said. 331 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:43,879 Speaker 3: Yeah. 332 00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:48,359 Speaker 2: Next, I suppose in your last episode you interviewed someone 333 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 2: you'd never met before who could have been a teddy bear, 334 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:54,200 Speaker 2: and in this episode you interviewed someone who you hadn't 335 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,119 Speaker 2: seen for a long time, but you who you knew. 336 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:56,440 Speaker 4: Well. 337 00:17:57,320 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 2: What was the difference in preparing for those two inter 338 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:03,520 Speaker 2: use and was it more or less daunting to interview Brenner. 339 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:09,160 Speaker 4: I definitely had more nerves sitting down with Brenner because 340 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 4: it's such a sensitive topic and we hadn't had no 341 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:17,560 Speaker 4: contact for such an extended amount of time. I think 342 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:21,159 Speaker 4: it was just a little bit nerve wracking. Yeah, reaching 343 00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:24,719 Speaker 4: out to somebody from your past and for me to 344 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:27,679 Speaker 4: carry something, you know, that I felt like I was 345 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:29,960 Speaker 4: responsible for for such a long time. And for her 346 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:31,560 Speaker 4: to be like, oh, that was just a silly thing 347 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:32,680 Speaker 4: that happened when we were kids. 348 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:32,919 Speaker 1: You know. 349 00:18:33,520 --> 00:18:35,879 Speaker 4: I think we both kind of left that a little 350 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:40,360 Speaker 4: bit more, I guess, wiser from both people's perspective on 351 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 4: the situation as well. So I was glad I had 352 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:45,080 Speaker 4: that opportunity. I'm so grateful that Brenna wanted to actually 353 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:46,600 Speaker 4: sit down and then revisit that. 354 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:47,400 Speaker 6: Ben. 355 00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:50,480 Speaker 2: I think you've made a really stunning piece of audio. Congratulations, 356 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:56,680 Speaker 2: Thank you so much. How will Ben fair up against Nar? 357 00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:00,440 Speaker 2: We're going to hear what story she found. The theme 358 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 2: of today was a bad day in just a moment. 359 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:13,440 Speaker 2: This is Fined and Tell, and our theme this week 360 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 2: is today was a bad day. When we last heard 361 00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 2: from Nan, she made us consider what it's like when 362 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:25,159 Speaker 2: your name becomes a global phenomenon and helped us sympathize 363 00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:28,920 Speaker 2: with Karen's around the world. Let's see what she's made 364 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:33,040 Speaker 2: for us this time. Hey, Nayan, welcome back to Find 365 00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 2: and Tell. 366 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:35,359 Speaker 3: Hello, it's good to be back. 367 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 2: All right, we're going into story number two, so we're 368 00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:40,119 Speaker 2: not quite you know, old hands at this, but I 369 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:42,399 Speaker 2: feel like we've had a little bit of practice. Is 370 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:44,680 Speaker 2: a little less nerve wracking sending this one out into 371 00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:46,120 Speaker 2: the world than it was last time. 372 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:51,439 Speaker 3: No, I thought it'd got easier, but no. And I 373 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 3: feel also because this story is the one that I'm 374 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:59,200 Speaker 3: most yeah, feel most personal and passionate about, So I'm 375 00:19:59,359 --> 00:19:59,840 Speaker 3: extra and O. 376 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:04,120 Speaker 2: You're a news journal in your day job, so this 377 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 2: is a little bit different for you, but at the 378 00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 2: same time it's a little bit familiar. I feel like 379 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:11,200 Speaker 2: the big shift is you. You're being asked to bring 380 00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:15,719 Speaker 2: more of you to this project. How does that feel? 381 00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:17,000 Speaker 2: Is that comfortable for you? 382 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:21,280 Speaker 3: It makes me feel very vulnerable. Yeah, it's yeah, definitely 383 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 3: a great opportunity to explore topics that I normally wouldn't 384 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:29,480 Speaker 3: be able to. And my initial reaction to you know, 385 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:32,920 Speaker 3: the theme today was a bad day. I mean, every 386 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:35,160 Speaker 3: day is a bad day news. There's lots of bad 387 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:39,360 Speaker 3: things happening here. So I thought, yeah, I could hopefully 388 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:41,719 Speaker 3: make this something a bit more personal, something a bit 389 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 3: more poignant, and something that even though it's a bit 390 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:48,480 Speaker 3: uncomfortable to hear to at least think about. Yeah, because 391 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:51,440 Speaker 3: I think it will help everyone understand each other more. 392 00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 3: And yeah, I'm. 393 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,760 Speaker 2: Really looking forward to hearing it. This is today was 394 00:20:56,800 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 2: a bad day. That's the theme we're tackling, and it's 395 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 2: NaN's second contribution to find and tell. 396 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 4: Life is changing in Australia and around the world. 397 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:13,080 Speaker 3: Those were Twenty twenty was a weird year, but particularly 398 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:13,920 Speaker 3: for Asians. 399 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:17,280 Speaker 4: Police in London say the number of hate crimes against 400 00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 4: people of East Asian descent has tripled since the beginning 401 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 4: of the coronavirus pandemic. 402 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:27,560 Speaker 6: We had been seeing things about attacks already, like in 403 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:31,040 Speaker 6: the US, and that boiled our blood every time we 404 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:33,119 Speaker 6: saw it, Like I saw a really sad one in 405 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 6: New York about a man who literally got like beat up, 406 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:39,800 Speaker 6: beat up for being Asian in the subway. 407 00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 3: Sophie Doe first saw these kind of news headlines as 408 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,880 Speaker 3: Sydney was locking down. Like most of us. She thought 409 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:54,000 Speaker 3: the pandemic would pass quickly. Obviously it didn't. Sophie has 410 00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:57,000 Speaker 3: a younger sister, Rosa. They've shared a room for most 411 00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 3: of their lives, finish each other's sentences and even sound 412 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:00,879 Speaker 3: a little alike. 413 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:04,399 Speaker 6: Me and Rosa are like two peas in a pod 414 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:07,240 Speaker 6: where best friends were like, literally we're the same person, 415 00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:10,440 Speaker 6: except I feel like I grew up a little more 416 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:11,440 Speaker 6: tomboyish than her. 417 00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:16,000 Speaker 3: The sisters of Vietnamese Australian It's like wearing another layer. 418 00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:20,040 Speaker 3: According to Rosa, I feel like growing up Asian in 419 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 3: Australia is something that only Asian Australians have to think about, right, 420 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:32,119 Speaker 3: Like being Asian was almost a disadvantage and almost something 421 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 3: that I had to leverage. There were the usual insults, 422 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:42,640 Speaker 3: things like ching chong and where are you really from, 423 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:46,360 Speaker 3: which they learned to brush off. I would hear comments 424 00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:48,439 Speaker 3: being like, oh, like you're really cool for an Asian, 425 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:50,880 Speaker 3: or like you're really pretty for an Asian, or you're 426 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:55,080 Speaker 3: really funny for an Asian. Before twenty twenty, they didn't 427 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:58,119 Speaker 3: have to think twice about walking around Merrickfilm, the suburb 428 00:22:58,200 --> 00:22:58,840 Speaker 3: they grew up in. 429 00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:02,960 Speaker 6: This place is predominantly an Asian area. That is where 430 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 6: all the Asian grocery stores are, that's where all the 431 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:08,199 Speaker 6: Asian restaurants are, and it's a place where I was like, 432 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:09,360 Speaker 6: I'm always safe here. 433 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:16,000 Speaker 3: March thirty was a mundane not that you could tell. 434 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:19,760 Speaker 3: The streets were empty, most shops were closed, and social 435 00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:24,320 Speaker 3: distancing was mandatory. The sisters wanted Bubble Team an excuse 436 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:26,119 Speaker 3: to go outside or. 437 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:28,800 Speaker 6: Azara and I were going out for gong cha, that's 438 00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:30,840 Speaker 6: what we wanted, and we were like, I need to 439 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 6: get out of the house. We could just go for 440 00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:33,359 Speaker 6: a nice walk. 441 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:35,719 Speaker 3: I remember we were like leaving the house and we 442 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,479 Speaker 3: were like, oh, we should drive, but then we're like, oh, 443 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 3: it's a nice day. We've been locked in like like 444 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:42,880 Speaker 3: how long, so let's just go for a walk. 445 00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:45,240 Speaker 6: And it's not that far. That day was just kind 446 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,399 Speaker 6: of like a fluke. We kind of just decided like, 447 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 6: let's just go a different way. 448 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,520 Speaker 3: They eventually come to the main road where they noticed 449 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:55,600 Speaker 3: they're not the only ones around, and. 450 00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:58,119 Speaker 6: When we got down to that crossing, I remember like 451 00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:02,639 Speaker 6: hearing people, two girls specifically being like super loud, and 452 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:04,200 Speaker 6: I was just like, why are they going too loud? 453 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,200 Speaker 6: It's like super quiet and dead on the streets right. 454 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 3: Now, So seeing anyone was like, oh, like someone's there, 455 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:14,920 Speaker 3: rosa notices. One of the girls was especially noisy, and 456 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 3: she had her hair in like a like a high bun, 457 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,919 Speaker 3: and she had like a headband. 458 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:24,840 Speaker 6: She was white, and she also had like this like 459 00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:29,080 Speaker 6: shoulder bag with her. They looked, honestly, like the best 460 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:30,960 Speaker 6: way to describe the two girls where they looked a 461 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:35,000 Speaker 6: little sketchy, like they looked as though they got in 462 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:35,880 Speaker 6: trouble frequently. 463 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:39,520 Speaker 3: The sisters were on the other side of the street, 464 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 3: but felt like something was off, so they continued to 465 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,240 Speaker 3: wait for the pedestrian light. But then the two girls 466 00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:50,040 Speaker 3: start to cross the road towards Sophie and Rosa, and 467 00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:53,560 Speaker 3: they walked past us, saying us stay away from those girls. 468 00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 6: They've got coronavirus shit, like you guys eat bats and 469 00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:00,560 Speaker 6: shit and like Eurasian dogs. And I'm like, what does 470 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:07,760 Speaker 6: that even mean? At first, I. 471 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:10,919 Speaker 3: Didn't think I heard it right, but then I was like, 472 00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,439 Speaker 3: wait a second, did she actually just say that? 473 00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:16,399 Speaker 6: So that was why Rosa and I were both like 474 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:18,960 Speaker 6: almost in unison, like what did you say? 475 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,880 Speaker 3: As Rosa recalls, the reaction set the girl off even more. 476 00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 6: She drops her bag and then starts running out Elson, 477 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:33,160 Speaker 6: I'm like, oh shit, like this isn't gonna go well. 478 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:38,520 Speaker 3: Like she had like her fists up and she was 479 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:41,200 Speaker 3: like jumping around and like looking like she wanted to swing. 480 00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:46,400 Speaker 6: It was like pure like ftal flight. 481 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 3: It was pure fear because I remember like feeling my 482 00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:51,639 Speaker 3: legs shaking, you know, when you're like about to do 483 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:53,600 Speaker 3: a speech in class and you're really nervous and your 484 00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:54,880 Speaker 3: legs start like shaking. 485 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:57,200 Speaker 6: That's how I felt, but like jelly. 486 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 3: Rosa, Sophie, and the two girls were roll in the 487 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:05,880 Speaker 3: middle of the road. People were watching and filming from 488 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:10,440 Speaker 3: their apartments and shops, but no one came out to help. Eventually, 489 00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 3: a man walking by carrying his groceries tries to come 490 00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:15,680 Speaker 3: between them. It looked as if the two girls were 491 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,200 Speaker 3: finally moving on when one of them stops and turns 492 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,720 Speaker 3: to face Rosa, and. 493 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,439 Speaker 6: That's when she turned around and she spat on me. 494 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,399 Speaker 3: In that moment, Sophie felt powerless. 495 00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 6: I watched the whole thing in slow motion, like it 496 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,159 Speaker 6: happened so slow in my eyes, like I remember seeing 497 00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:43,240 Speaker 6: it so like vividly, and I felt dumb for not 498 00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:46,399 Speaker 6: stopping it, like I felt guilty. I was like, I 499 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:47,320 Speaker 6: wish it got on me. 500 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:53,960 Speaker 3: Sophie's furious and wants to protect her younger sister. She 501 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:56,439 Speaker 3: tries to retaliate, but the man with his groceri is 502 00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:57,960 Speaker 3: intervenes and. 503 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 6: I was like, oh man, I want to do something 504 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:03,199 Speaker 6: so bad. And I was just like, you're so disgusting, 505 00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:04,200 Speaker 6: Like what's wrong with you? 506 00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:07,880 Speaker 3: The man gives Rosa some water to wash her eye 507 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:11,119 Speaker 3: out while the two girls run off, Sophie and Rosa 508 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:13,120 Speaker 3: and left to process what had just happened. 509 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 6: I was just like shocked and disgusted. 510 00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:19,359 Speaker 3: I was like, how, like, no one's ever spoilt on 511 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:21,880 Speaker 3: me before, first of all, And I was like, how 512 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 3: could she. 513 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:24,160 Speaker 6: I just felt very. 514 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:29,960 Speaker 3: Like angry, very angry, very disrespected. The feelix spitting on 515 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,719 Speaker 3: someone is like, it's such a disrespectful thing to do, 516 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:34,439 Speaker 3: Like I probably would have rather have punched me in 517 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:38,400 Speaker 3: the face, to be honest. After reporting the incident to police, 518 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:42,280 Speaker 3: the sisters make their way back home. Now they have 519 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:43,720 Speaker 3: to tell their family. 520 00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 6: And my dad was very upset. 521 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:49,960 Speaker 3: So my dad's very protective of us, obviously, and he 522 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,800 Speaker 3: was really really angry, really upset. And I also remember 523 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,720 Speaker 3: my hearing from my cousins that my aunties and uncles, 524 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 3: a few of them had said like, oh, they shouldn't 525 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 3: have done anything, like should have just like ignored it. 526 00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:04,879 Speaker 6: They should have just like turned the other cheek. I 527 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:10,520 Speaker 6: remember not crying until like the night of like everyone 528 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:12,200 Speaker 6: went to sleep and I was in my own room 529 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:14,159 Speaker 6: and I had time to myself, and I finally like, 530 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,320 Speaker 6: broke down and cried because I was just like, how 531 00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:23,919 Speaker 6: could this happen to us? 532 00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 3: Later that night, Rosa and Sophie posted videos of the 533 00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:31,560 Speaker 3: incident online. It wasn't long before people on the internet 534 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,479 Speaker 3: identified the girls behind the attack. It turns out the 535 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:39,160 Speaker 3: main perpetrator was already known to police, but she was 536 00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 3: seventeen years old, meaning she was charged as a minor. 537 00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,920 Speaker 3: In the end, she only had to pay a fine 538 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 3: and received a good behavior bond. 539 00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:50,960 Speaker 6: Or Two women who were spat on in an alleged 540 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:54,719 Speaker 6: coronavirus fueled racist attack have spoken about the ordeal. 541 00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 3: The incident even made headlines internationally. Rosa and Sophie were 542 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 3: overwhelmed by the response. It made them feel like they 543 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 3: weren't so alone. 544 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,720 Speaker 6: A huge band of people, not just Asians but white 545 00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:12,520 Speaker 6: people too, of every background defending us and being like, 546 00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:15,160 Speaker 6: that's not how we treat people in Australia. And I 547 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 6: think meeting those made me feel very like there are 548 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 6: good people still and it just takes, unfortunately, something like 549 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:25,720 Speaker 6: this happening for people to be like, no, we got 550 00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:26,160 Speaker 6: your back. 551 00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:31,480 Speaker 3: Rosa and Sophia are grateful most of the internet stood 552 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:34,960 Speaker 3: up for them, but more importantly, they're proud of themselves 553 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:39,479 Speaker 3: speaking up during that whole thing that only lasted five minutes. 554 00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:42,600 Speaker 6: I'm happy that we spoke up. I'm happy that we, 555 00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,760 Speaker 6: you know, stood our ground, and I was also able 556 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 6: to make sure we both got out of it safely. 557 00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:03,560 Speaker 2: Neon, congratulations again on some really impressive storytelling and storytelling that. 558 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:04,160 Speaker 3: I think. 559 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:06,760 Speaker 2: There's a lot of complexity of what's going on in 560 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:10,080 Speaker 2: that story, and so I'm hoping we can unpack that 561 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 2: a little bit. You're an Asian Australian woman yourself, so 562 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:19,360 Speaker 2: how did you manage your own well being and your 563 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:24,240 Speaker 2: own feelings about the situation while you were creating the narrative? 564 00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:28,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, good question. If you remember at the time, you know, 565 00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 3: the pandemic was so chaotic, there was so much coming 566 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:33,960 Speaker 3: out in the news every day, let alone in a 567 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,600 Speaker 3: daily news cycle, a lot of stories. You know, you 568 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 3: hear maybe twenty thirty seconds best from them, you know, 569 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,719 Speaker 3: in a small news report, and you get the crux 570 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:45,800 Speaker 3: of what they're saying, but you don't get the nuances. 571 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:50,080 Speaker 3: And there's yeah, so many things I feel aren't able 572 00:30:50,160 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 3: to be shared in news reporting. So that's why I felt, Yeah, 573 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:56,800 Speaker 3: because this was such a personal piece, and I remember 574 00:30:56,880 --> 00:31:01,120 Speaker 3: at the time I was so outraged and helpless at 575 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:03,840 Speaker 3: the same time. I am just confused, and it was 576 00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 3: just one of those stories that always lingered at the 577 00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:08,680 Speaker 3: back of my head and it was hard at times. 578 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:11,280 Speaker 3: Even listening back to the story. I was getting a 579 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:13,600 Speaker 3: bit teary just then, and I thought this would be 580 00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:18,440 Speaker 3: the perfect opportunity to really let Sophie and Rosa share 581 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:23,560 Speaker 3: their experiences and let them share how that moment hasn't 582 00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 3: defined them, but rather how they've been able to move 583 00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:28,520 Speaker 3: on from it and define it themselves. 584 00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:32,920 Speaker 2: As part of you bringing it to life, we heard 585 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:37,880 Speaker 2: audio of the incident. What were we listening to there? 586 00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 3: So that was raw footage of the actual whole incident 587 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:46,600 Speaker 3: that happened. Oh wow. It was a mix of people 588 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 3: bystanders who had filmed and then eventually they uploaded it 589 00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 3: or sent it to Rosa and Sophie, And one of 590 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 3: the videos was Rosa filming herself because she wanted to, 591 00:31:57,320 --> 00:32:00,560 Speaker 3: I guess, in that moment defend and protect us. So 592 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:03,960 Speaker 3: that was actually what happened on the day. 593 00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:07,560 Speaker 2: I think it's a really impressive piece of storytelling and 594 00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:10,520 Speaker 2: something that's important to revisit. You know, I think there's 595 00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:12,560 Speaker 2: a bit of a sense of, well, that's something that 596 00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:14,959 Speaker 2: happened in COVID and that was COVID specific, rather than 597 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,440 Speaker 2: recognizing the underlying racism that's going on there. That doesn't 598 00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:21,160 Speaker 2: go anywhere just because the virus isn't something people are 599 00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,680 Speaker 2: as scared of anymore. Thank you so much for sharing it. 600 00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:24,520 Speaker 3: Thank you. 601 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,080 Speaker 2: The theme was today was a bad day and we 602 00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:35,120 Speaker 2: heard some really heavy stories. I'm going to take a 603 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:37,720 Speaker 2: moment and try and figure out who's going to win 604 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,600 Speaker 2: this contest. Are we back in a moment and we'll 605 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:52,280 Speaker 2: let them know. From the opening moments to the final 606 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:56,800 Speaker 2: seconds of Ben's episode, I found it utterly captivating. I 607 00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,400 Speaker 2: really commend him on being so vulnerable and going and 608 00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:02,320 Speaker 2: finding an girlfriend to be able to tell this story 609 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:06,640 Speaker 2: is actually really brave. Ben is embodying the purpose of 610 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:10,160 Speaker 2: this competition and how he's celebrating different parts of Australia, 611 00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,400 Speaker 2: and he's managed to bring the physicality of the setting 612 00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:15,920 Speaker 2: to life for us as well as the characters in 613 00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 2: his story. He really should be congratulated on the emotion 614 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 2: that was at the forefront. The heart that was in 615 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 2: this story this week is a very difficult contest to call, though, 616 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:31,719 Speaker 2: because Naan also did an outstanding job. Obviously, the subject 617 00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:35,960 Speaker 2: matter is an incredibly important one, and Naan's reporting prowess 618 00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:39,920 Speaker 2: is really clear. The way she sequenced how we heard 619 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,360 Speaker 2: that story as the audience. It's sort of something you 620 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:44,680 Speaker 2: don't notice when you're just listening to a news story, 621 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,960 Speaker 2: but actually that's very hard to achieve. She's really thought 622 00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:51,080 Speaker 2: about how she told us each piece of information and 623 00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:55,240 Speaker 2: in what order. Now, if I had any notes, and 624 00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:59,160 Speaker 2: I'm grasping here, I wouldn't expect Naan to put herself 625 00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,560 Speaker 2: and her opinions in the story normally, but Naance an 626 00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 2: Asian Australian, and I would have really lacked to hear 627 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:09,279 Speaker 2: her reflections even briefly on the story she was trying 628 00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:14,760 Speaker 2: to tell. I have complained about how tough this decision 629 00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:17,680 Speaker 2: making stuff is every week, folks, I really have. But 630 00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 2: this one, this one might be the toughest yet. And 631 00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:24,680 Speaker 2: the winner I've picked is I think the strongest piece 632 00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:31,000 Speaker 2: of raw storytelling that I've heard in the competition. Ben, Honestly, 633 00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:33,440 Speaker 2: I am so impressed you are this week's win out. 634 00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:36,160 Speaker 4: Congratulations, thank you so much. I can't believe it. I 635 00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:38,480 Speaker 4: honestly can't believe it. Thank you so much. You are 636 00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:39,520 Speaker 4: most welcome. 637 00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:42,400 Speaker 2: I think the way that you put that story together, 638 00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:50,520 Speaker 2: you help me from the first second to the last. Okay, 639 00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:53,799 Speaker 2: that was an extremely hard decision to make. It's a 640 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:58,200 Speaker 2: real testament to our storytellers who are absolutely raising the 641 00:34:58,239 --> 00:35:01,399 Speaker 2: bar week by week. Thanks are starting to get very 642 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:04,000 Speaker 2: exciting as we get close to the finals, so make 643 00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,680 Speaker 2: sure you don't miss an episode of Find and Tell. 644 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 2: Just hit follow in your podcast app. A big thank 645 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:15,480 Speaker 2: you to our show partners Afters and Roade Australia. Find 646 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:18,759 Speaker 2: in Tell is a co production between iHeart Australia and 647 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,680 Speaker 2: the black Cast podcast network. Black Cast empowers First Nations 648 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:26,560 Speaker 2: people and people of color to reclaim their narratives, strengthen 649 00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:30,359 Speaker 2: cultural identity, and contribute to a more inclusive Australia by 650 00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:35,880 Speaker 2: showcasing exciting emerging talent from Australian communities.