1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: Now, as we learned yesterday, transit safety and public housing 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:07,720 Speaker 1: officer roles are set to be scrapped, with new officers 3 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:11,600 Speaker 1: transitioning to a stream of police dedicated to tackling anti 4 00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:18,560 Speaker 1: social behavior, the fifty six strong police Public Safety Officer Unit, 5 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 1: the PbSO it's going to focus on public housing, buses, 6 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,400 Speaker 1: shopping centers, bottle shops, events and other public areas. They're 7 00:00:26,440 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 1: going to be retrained at the Police College, they're going 8 00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:32,600 Speaker 1: to wear a police uniform and they'll be authorized, it's 9 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: reported to carry guns. Now, joining us on the line 10 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:38,839 Speaker 1: to talk a little bit more about this is the 11 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:42,559 Speaker 1: independent member for Ara lun She is indeed also the 12 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:46,279 Speaker 1: Speaker of the Northern Territories Legislative Assembly. Robin Lambley. Good 13 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:47,240 Speaker 1: morning to you, Robin. 14 00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:48,960 Speaker 2: Good morning Katie. 15 00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 1: Robin, lovely to have you on the show. What do 16 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 1: you make of this announcement? 17 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 2: Well, I wasn't aware that the government was going down 18 00:00:56,920 --> 00:00:59,880 Speaker 2: this track, but from my perspective, I think it was 19 00:00:59,880 --> 00:01:05,640 Speaker 2: always going to happen that these positions were upgraded. We 20 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:10,280 Speaker 2: saw just a few years back the police outside of 21 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:15,320 Speaker 2: bottle shops they were upgraded to constable police constable positions 22 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:18,720 Speaker 2: and even going back further, there was a lot of 23 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:26,960 Speaker 2: controversy around those powllies they call them having guns. So 24 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 2: I think the fact that our world has become crazier, 25 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:35,120 Speaker 2: more violent, the incidents of crime has increased. I think 26 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:39,120 Speaker 2: it was only a matter of time that transit safety 27 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:43,480 Speaker 2: and public housing safety offices were upgraded to police too. 28 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 2: It's about the safety of the community, but it's also 29 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:51,040 Speaker 2: about the safety of these workers. I years ago, I 30 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:53,800 Speaker 2: used to go out with the public housing safety offices 31 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 2: fairly regularly, and even in those days, the situations they 32 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 2: walked into were were insane. I just remember going onto 33 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 2: a town camp years ago and it was like walking 34 00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:11,200 Speaker 2: into a war zone, potentially very very dangerous, explosive situations. 35 00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 2: So I'm not surprised they've done it. 36 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I guess you know, we have got so 37 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:19,959 Speaker 1: many issues with crime, anti social behavior, that public drunkenness 38 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 1: around the Northern Territory. Robin, do you know if there's 39 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:25,919 Speaker 1: going to be a dedicated team in Alice Springs as well, 40 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 1: or what the situation will be for Alice at this point. 41 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 2: Look, I only know what I've read in the media. 42 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 2: I haven't been briefed on it yet. I'll get a 43 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 2: briefing as soon as I can, but i'd imagine that 44 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 2: Alice Springs would be a priority for these positions. We've 45 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 2: had public housing safety offices since twenty eleven. I remember 46 00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:50,280 Speaker 2: when both positions were created. I just came on board 47 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:54,000 Speaker 2: as a member. And originally they were kind of like 48 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:59,119 Speaker 2: welfare offices sent out to public housing complexes, town camps. 49 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 2: A lot of their work was to de escalate problems 50 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:09,520 Speaker 2: in a fairly non police way. But I think just 51 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 2: because things have got so difficult and more intense, and 52 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:16,679 Speaker 2: there's a greater level of crime and perhaps even a 53 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 2: greater severity in crime, I just think it makes sense 54 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:25,800 Speaker 2: to upgrade these positions. They can still have a welfare 55 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 2: sort of negotiating role, but they have to be safe, 56 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 2: and I think we all need to be safer on 57 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 2: our streets. I think that's the sad reality of where 58 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 2: we live now. 59 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:40,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's real. It's a real shame, isn't it. That 60 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 1: that's you know, that's the point that we've reached. But 61 00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 1: I think that you know, we already see security officers 62 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 1: patrolling the area sort of everywhere around Darwin and Palmerston. 63 00:03:51,120 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 1: I'm not sure how it is in Ella Springs, but 64 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 1: it's sort of become the norm. 65 00:03:56,280 --> 00:04:00,040 Speaker 2: It has become the norm. I think people will be 66 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 2: concerned about these officers carrying guns, but like what I 67 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 2: described with the Powis, the police outside of bottle shops 68 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 2: years ago, it just made sense for them to have 69 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 2: a gun on them. I don't think Powis have ever 70 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 2: used a gun, ironically, But you know, even when they 71 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 2: a couple of years ago, when the former Labor government 72 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 2: introduced capsican spray to the transit safety officers, there was 73 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 2: a lot of concern then about the training that these 74 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:37,560 Speaker 2: officers would have using a potentially dangerous weapon like capsican spray. 75 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 2: So we're kind of evolving, Katie, to a point where 76 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 2: we accept reluctantly that people working in these areas of 77 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:53,159 Speaker 2: security and safety need to have these things to protect 78 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,840 Speaker 2: themselves and to protect the public. I think it's just realistic, 79 00:04:57,240 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 2: sadly but realistic. 80 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:03,040 Speaker 1: How are things going in Alice Springs at the moment. 81 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: I mean, we've you know, we've spoken in recent weeks 82 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 1: about the issues that have unfolded there. How are things 83 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:09,520 Speaker 1: going at the moment. 84 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:16,479 Speaker 2: Look, we still have an unacceptable level of crime, Katie, 85 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:20,520 Speaker 2: We always have and we always will. It's a little 86 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 2: bit hard to gauge if there has been a reduction. 87 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:28,599 Speaker 2: The crime stats are coming out on Friday for April, 88 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 2: so we'll get to see if there has been a 89 00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 2: reduction since the new government has come in. But it 90 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:39,279 Speaker 2: still feels like we're living in fear. We're tentative. I 91 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:42,640 Speaker 2: think what happened with Cooman J. White in Coal's that 92 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:47,160 Speaker 2: sort of put us all on high alert. It's it 93 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:50,719 Speaker 2: hasn't changed a great deal, but I still hold out home. 94 00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 1: Katie Robert, I don't know whether you've got any info 95 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:56,280 Speaker 1: on these or not, and so feel free to, you know, 96 00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 1: to tell me no. But you know, it had been 97 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:03,160 Speaker 1: widely reported as well that there'd been an assault allegedly 98 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:07,080 Speaker 1: on a woman holding her baby in the lead into 99 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:11,680 Speaker 1: that event and then the tragic death of coleman Ji White. 100 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:15,120 Speaker 1: Do you know if that woman is all right? Do 101 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:17,320 Speaker 1: you know has there been a lot of discussion about 102 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 1: that in Central Australia. 103 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:22,960 Speaker 2: Not that I'm aware of, Katie, but I do know 104 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 2: a woman who was assaulted by someone in the leader 105 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:30,359 Speaker 2: to what happened to Pumen J. White. Now, I'm not 106 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:36,479 Speaker 2: going to speculate on who the offender was. It happened 107 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 2: in a short space of time before what happened in Cole's, 108 00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:46,839 Speaker 2: so people can extrapolate and speculate and all that sort 109 00:06:46,839 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 2: of thing. But I do know the woman involved reasonably well. 110 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:54,159 Speaker 2: That's why I know that it happened, because you know, 111 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 2: I've got a fairly good relationship with her and her husband, 112 00:06:57,279 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 2: and so I do know that she was a sol 113 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 2: by someone out in the front of the Commonwealth Bank on 114 00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:07,880 Speaker 2: that same day, and she's okay, But she was holding 115 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 2: her little baby, who's only a couple of months old. 116 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 2: So I can't say anything else. But I can confirm 117 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 2: that she's okay and she was assaulted, but I haven't 118 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 2: really I'm not in any position say anything more broadly, Katie. 119 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 2: Those things are still happening in Alice Springs all the time. 120 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 2: You know, people are getting pushed and shoved and assaulted, 121 00:07:33,400 --> 00:07:38,000 Speaker 2: and there's theft going on. You know, to walk around 122 00:07:38,040 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 2: Alice Springs at any time of the night or day 123 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:45,160 Speaker 2: is still something you have to take very seriously. Long 124 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 2: gone of the days and you're probably your listeners up 125 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 2: here in dar and are probably nodding their heads. Long 126 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 2: gone are the days where you can just jump out 127 00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 2: of the car and not even sort of think too 128 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:59,360 Speaker 2: much and wander around the streets of your town. You 129 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 2: just have to be on high alert. You have to. 130 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 2: You know, I walk around with my handbag across across 131 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:09,360 Speaker 2: my body now, which is something I never used to do, 132 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 2: and I have my you know, a hand sort of 133 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:16,600 Speaker 2: placed on my bag. I don't feel necessarily threatened, but 134 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 2: you have to protect yourself from our vigilance. Like the 135 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:25,240 Speaker 2: changes to the transit and public housing safety officers, we 136 00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 2: all have to change and step up and modify our 137 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 2: behavior to this increased level of threat and violence in 138 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 2: our community. And that's the sad state of affairs. But 139 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:38,559 Speaker 2: that is the reality. 140 00:08:38,920 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 1: Robin. What have the people of Ellis Springs thought about 141 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:45,840 Speaker 1: the announcement of OC spray being able to be utilized 142 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:48,000 Speaker 1: if required as well, If that's you know, if that's 143 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 1: what you choose to do potentially from September. 144 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 2: Well, I don't know that it's sunk in particularly that 145 00:08:54,320 --> 00:08:57,120 Speaker 2: was that was last week's announcement, wasn't it. So I 146 00:08:57,160 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 2: think we're trying to get our heads around it. Peculiar 147 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,560 Speaker 2: thing in Alice Springs is to buy this OC spray, 148 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:08,920 Speaker 2: this low level OC spray. It will as we've been 149 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:14,040 Speaker 2: told that they will be sold out of firearms dealers shops. 150 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 2: But we don't have shop fronts for firearms in Alice 151 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:21,040 Speaker 2: Springs anymore, which I didn't know, so you can't just 152 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:23,160 Speaker 2: walk into a shop and buy a gun anymore in 153 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 2: Alice Springs, So to get the OC spray, which most 154 00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 2: of us will be eligible to buy. The only exclusion 155 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 2: from what I was told is if you've got a 156 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:39,080 Speaker 2: history of committing serious violent offenses. So most of us 157 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 2: will be eligible to get an OC spray to use 158 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:45,280 Speaker 2: under this trial, But for people in Alice Springs will 159 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:49,160 Speaker 2: have to order it online I think, and then make 160 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 2: an appointment to go and pick it up from the 161 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:56,199 Speaker 2: back door of the local dealer that in our rows front. 162 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 2: Something wrong. Yeah, yeah, Well it's a bit seedy, doesn't it. 163 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:05,560 Speaker 2: It will be interesting to see what the takeup is, 164 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 2: Will people wander down and get an OC spray. I 165 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:15,679 Speaker 2: even got the the cost, the approximate cost of these sprays. 166 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 2: I think the smaller ones around forty dollars and the 167 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 2: next one up is about fifty or fifty five dollars, 168 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 2: so they're not exactly cheap, but I guess. But if 169 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:29,480 Speaker 2: people want to get an OC spray to make them 170 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:33,559 Speaker 2: feel safer, then it's probably you know, a good use 171 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:34,080 Speaker 2: of your money. 172 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: That's something you can do it. 173 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:39,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, it'll just be fascinating to see what the take 174 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:42,160 Speaker 2: up is and how many people actually use the spray, 175 00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 2: and yeah. 176 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:46,000 Speaker 1: I'll be interested. I'll be interested to see how it folds, 177 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 1: how it unfolds. Hey, Robin, before I let you go, 178 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:51,160 Speaker 1: obviously with your hat on as the Speaker of the 179 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:54,320 Speaker 1: Legislative Assembly. Of course, budget estimates have been going on 180 00:10:54,400 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: for the last sort of almost two weeks. What's the 181 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:01,160 Speaker 1: what's the sort of end process now with estimates? 182 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:05,960 Speaker 2: So it all wraps up at one thirty. I'm on 183 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:08,559 Speaker 2: between twelve thirty and one thirty for the Department of 184 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 2: Legislative Assembly, and I get one hour and then we 185 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 2: go back into Parliament at two thirty. There'll be no 186 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:21,680 Speaker 2: question time. It will be the only debate will be 187 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:26,120 Speaker 2: on the appropriation Bill, the budget and the maximum amount 188 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:29,959 Speaker 2: of time that that will go on for a five hours, 189 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 2: So we go in at two thirty at the most 190 00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:36,560 Speaker 2: we'll finish that debate at seven point thirty and I'd 191 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 2: say we'll be out of here by eight thirty at 192 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:42,400 Speaker 2: the latest. Well, it's a different day to half a day. 193 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:45,120 Speaker 2: And then we don't come back to Parliament until the 194 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:45,680 Speaker 2: end of July. 195 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:48,319 Speaker 1: End of July, all right, Well, it'll be interesting to 196 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,680 Speaker 1: see how it all goes today. It's always interesting to 197 00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 1: watch estimates as well. I mean, look, some aspects a 198 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 1: little bit boring. Some aspects, you know, a few interesting 199 00:11:58,200 --> 00:12:00,600 Speaker 1: bits of info, Robin, you never know what going to guess. 200 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,840 Speaker 2: Look, I find it fascinating, but you and I obviously 201 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:09,080 Speaker 2: political tragic, so the average person probably still rather watch 202 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 2: paint dry. 203 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 1: I reckon, you're right. 204 00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 2: I reckon, you're right. 205 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 1: Robin Lamley, thank you so much for your time this morning. 206 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 1: Much appreciated.