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Speaker 1: Mama always always, sir, be careful love those.

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Speaker 2: Umboo let We'll use your head. They will tear you

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Speaker 2: lack a purple talk.

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Speaker 3: Oh no, no, no, yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah yeah, oh no no no.

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Speaker 3: Hi. I'm Amanda and I'm Remy.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to It's layer.

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Speaker 3: We're in a long distance friendship that started over twenty

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Speaker 3: years ago when we were in high school.

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Speaker 1: We'll be talking about all things life, love, family, anything

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Speaker 1: and everything else under the sun.

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Speaker 3: Delve deeper with us because in life, you know, jine

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Speaker 3: my layers.

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Speaker 1: Oh no, no, no, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: How are you?

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Speaker 2: Am I beautiful? So good to see.

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Speaker 3: You, likewise as if we don't see each other relatively often.

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Speaker 2: But also good to see you for the episode.

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Speaker 3: There we go, there go. I'm good. As I said,

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Speaker 3: I'm not actually sipping tea, but you know my drink.

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Speaker 3: I thought about bringing wine on, but I was like,

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Speaker 3: you know what, I'm already tired. I'm just gonna get

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Speaker 3: more tired because's not being really tired.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we need to do a wine episode.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, wine down. I'm good, And how are you?

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Speaker 2: I'm good, I'm.

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Speaker 1: Bold, yeah yeah. In any way, parenting, Parenting is the

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Speaker 1: thanks exactly.

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Speaker 3: Exactly what we're talking about today African parenting. Okay, so

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Speaker 3: this topic you'll brings up a lot.

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Speaker 2: I don't know about a good point, a point trigger.

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Speaker 3: I'm sorry. So yeah, I will ask you in one word,

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Speaker 3: when you hear the term African parenting, what comes to

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Speaker 3: mind for you?

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Speaker 1: Authority? Like instantly, I'm like, disciplined. I ain't miss it definitely,

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Speaker 1: Like I don't know, I yeah, I just think because

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Speaker 1: I think that's something. And of course we're going to

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Speaker 1: be very even though we speak from a Zimbabwe and

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Speaker 1: lenz this one is like African.

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Speaker 2: We've made it quite.

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Speaker 1: Broad, but I think this is something we all have

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Speaker 1: in common, like especially if you're black African, we all

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Speaker 1: can relate where you're from Nigeria or Ghana, Zimbabwe, it

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Speaker 1: was South Africa. We're like, yep, this is one thing

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Speaker 1: we all have. Our parents all went to the same

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Speaker 1: parenting school.

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Speaker 3: Yes, there was some curriculum that was distributed and they

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Speaker 3: all signed up and passed with a plus plus plus

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Speaker 3: plus plus.

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Speaker 2: Yeah totally. What do you think?

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Speaker 3: The word that comes to mind is control?

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Speaker 1: That's just yeah, they go ahead and hand discipline and

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Speaker 1: control life and control, lack of freedom.

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Speaker 3: You are not your own They made you, so they

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Speaker 3: own you.

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Speaker 2: I don't know how.

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Speaker 1: Oh, yes, the ownership is a problem. We need to

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Speaker 1: be really getting into that. When did you first realize

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Speaker 1: that this existed, Like when you compared to like someone else.

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Speaker 3: You know, when you have your homies. So like I

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Speaker 3: had friends when I was like in primary school and

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Speaker 3: just the liberty they took around their parents and ability

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Speaker 3: to say no, and you know, it looked like their

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Speaker 3: parents negotiated with them and tried to understand them, and

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Speaker 3: they gave their parents a hard time. I think that's

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Speaker 3: where I learned and actually learned from the community that

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Speaker 3: was not African or not black. To the door on

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Speaker 3: my parents. I think I've mentioned the story.

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Speaker 2: Remember I still cannot believe.

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Speaker 3: You don't slap the door on my parents. I think

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Speaker 3: I was getting too confee watching my you know, counterparts,

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Speaker 3: not realizing it's a different, different household. So I think

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Speaker 3: it's definitely from friends going you know for play dates

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Speaker 3: or parties and seeing how they communicated with their parents,

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Speaker 3: and I was like, yeah, just be different. There's a

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Speaker 3: lot different to what I know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're for you when yeah, oh, I co

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Speaker 1: signed with you as well, Like that's probably why parents

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Speaker 1: don't like us paying for sleepovers because they were like,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna learn these things from other people, Like literally

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Speaker 1: all my white friends, that's where I learned.

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Speaker 2: Like we'd be like swimming in their pool and their

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Speaker 2: parents would be like, you know, do you want to

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Speaker 2: get out? And we're like they're like, oh no, mom,

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Speaker 2: And I'm like, you have a choice. You know what

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Speaker 2: is this?

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Speaker 1: What is the is the freedom of choice? Like it

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Speaker 1: literally was like that and also from TV of course.

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Speaker 1: And I remember this the time when I forced my

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Speaker 1: mom to tuck me in and read me your storybook

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Speaker 1: because I'm like, hey, bro, there's one of these folks

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Speaker 1: I've been doing on T If you didn't get a

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Speaker 1: kiss like that that.

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Speaker 2: I want that and obviously you know when you're young.

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Speaker 1: They I think she just placated me like this kid

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Speaker 1: like and I think in a way she probably thought

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Speaker 1: it was sweet because it wasn't too misaligned with you know,

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Speaker 1: how well normally operate. But definitely I fostered upon her

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Speaker 1: like I was like, did this book tuck me in?

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Speaker 1: You know? Like yeah, she was like and I know

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Speaker 1: what I know it is? That was what And I'm like,

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Speaker 1: but you got to tuck me in, you know. So

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Speaker 1: I definitely remember being very like assertive about that because

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Speaker 1: I learned that from TV years and but I definitely

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Speaker 1: did realize in real life that there's a difference. You know,

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Speaker 1: similar to you, you try to push the boundaries, then

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Speaker 1: you get told and you go straight back into the

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Speaker 1: you know, you're the edge of the comfort zone and

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Speaker 1: you go straight back right into the middle by like

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Speaker 1: one look, we just put you back.

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Speaker 3: One hundred percent. And that one look, I think everyone

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Speaker 3: can testify there's that look in public because I used

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Speaker 3: to see, you know, like white parents hitting their children

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Speaker 3: in public and it's like, hey, these children because they

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Speaker 3: throw tantrums and you know, the mom is trying to

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Speaker 3: negotiate screaming, and then they'll spank in public. My parents

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Speaker 3: never spanked me in public. It was just the look,

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Speaker 3: just the one eye. You just get the eye.

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Speaker 1: And the look meant murder. It wasn't even like I

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Speaker 1: was murder. You're gonna die, my guy, You want to die.

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Speaker 3: And you knew when you got home things are going

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Speaker 3: to be hot, hot, hot, hot, because if there's one

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Speaker 3: thing for African parents do not want to do is

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Speaker 3: to be embarrassed in public, So they're like.

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Speaker 1: Oh, sir, you embarrass me, especially in front of their peers.

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Speaker 1: Like public with strangers, and then there's public with peers.

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Speaker 1: So if you go to people's houses and you're eating

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Speaker 1: too much, talking too much, yes, getting yourself seen, They're like.

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Speaker 3: You need to come all the way down. That's yesil bruh.

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Speaker 3: I'll never forget it. But where do you think the

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Speaker 3: origins of this African parenting? This is this almost pan

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Speaker 3: African how to be an African parent Because when you

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Speaker 3: watch the meme, when you watch the TikTok see the meme,

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Speaker 3: you can like we relate, like from when you see

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Speaker 3: ice cream containers in the fridge and you get excited

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Speaker 3: in your life not ice cream, never what's going to

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Speaker 3: be ice cream? Like? You know, things like that, from

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Speaker 3: the biggest to the little thing. Where did they get.

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Speaker 1: I think to latch onto your word of control. I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of it comes from fear. Fear of

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Speaker 1: us not becoming a doctor, a doctor, lawyer, engineer. Fear

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Speaker 1: of us, you know, embarrassing them, Fear of us because

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Speaker 1: were reflection of them is always going to be a thing.

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Speaker 1: So it's like if you're going to be naughty, Oh

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Speaker 1: my gosh, and everyone will think I'm a failure. So

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Speaker 1: the fear of that failure then drives the parenting then

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Speaker 1: become so strict where it's like you have to be Cookiekata.

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Speaker 1: You can't let your yourself shine, you can't let your

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Speaker 1: quirks you show shine.

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Speaker 2: Show because no, no, no, you meant you meant to be.

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Speaker 1: And then the comparison as well, you know, like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you have to be like this other person who's now

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Speaker 1: rich and you got everything sorted seemingly right because you

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Speaker 1: never know optics. So I think it's just the fear

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Speaker 1: of They worked so hard to get where they were,

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Speaker 1: they didn't want it to like slip. But at the

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Speaker 1: same time they were they were probably also parented like that,

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Speaker 1: where it's like you have to conform, do not try

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Speaker 1: to be different, do not try stick out.

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Speaker 3: Stay in your lane, stay in your lane.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so so limiting.

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Speaker 3: Sent one hundred hundred percent. And I think because our

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Speaker 3: parents didn't have the tools to understand their emotions or

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Speaker 3: understand why it was so important for them not to

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Speaker 3: be embarrassed in public or to be seen a certain

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Speaker 3: way way or how you know, they they didn't have

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Speaker 3: the tools growing up, so then they just put together

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Speaker 3: this set of rules or this behavior that would fit

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Speaker 3: in their comfort zone without questioning them. Because the big

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Speaker 3: thing with African parents, I think we can all testify it.

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Speaker 3: You do not want to question them. They do not

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Speaker 3: want to be questioned.

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Speaker 2: They're always right, chal always always.

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Speaker 3: Right, because anything then makes them have to look at

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Speaker 3: why they behave a certain way. And they did not

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Speaker 3: possess those tools on expressing themselves or explaining why. It

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Speaker 3: was always like just because you know, because I said

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Speaker 3: those after world, So.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, because I'm older than you, because I'm said so,

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Speaker 1: there's And I think I actually sometimes wonder how they

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Speaker 1: went through our toddler phase when you're asking why why?

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Speaker 1: Why is literally and I think that's probably where it starts,

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Speaker 1: because I think when your toddlers they say, that's when

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Speaker 1: you experiment and push boundaries, do the tantrums, And I

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Speaker 1: think that's when you saw the eye starts because then

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Speaker 1: they like, that's the conclusion, like I told you, like

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Speaker 1: that doesn't I don't need to explore this further with you,

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Speaker 1: And I mean we've already touched on this in terms

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Speaker 1: of factors that you think shaped this particular type of parenting.

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Speaker 1: But I think another thing is because they had to

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Speaker 1: parent early themselves. Like I look at our grandparents' generation.

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking, if you're going to be having nine kids,

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Speaker 1: fourteen kids, you know, by the time the kid number

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Speaker 1: fourteen comes out, kid number one to five is already

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Speaker 1: like much older. Yes, So I think I feel like

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Speaker 1: they became parents so early without again having the tools

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Speaker 1: as you mentioned, so they used to also just rule

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Speaker 1: by I told you, I told you, And that's where

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Speaker 1: age and hierarchy becomes like you have.

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Speaker 2: To have it. Yeah, very paramount.

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Speaker 1: And I think because their parented so early, they didn't

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Speaker 1: know either at all.

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Speaker 3: And also for our parents, they straddled two worlds. They

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Speaker 3: had the world they grew up in and then the

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Speaker 3: modern world where they try to expose us to a

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Speaker 3: lot more to give us more opportunities to integrate us

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Speaker 3: with white communities, Western ideologies and without with their upbringing

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Speaker 3: and not understanding questioning or you know, and then we're

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Speaker 3: exposed to question they find themselves in the middle like

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Speaker 3: ah corn, he wants to come and tell me how

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Speaker 3: you do things? Who are you? Because they grew up

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Speaker 3: the mindset of But then also realizing they've exposed it.

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Speaker 3: So it's it's conflicting, yea, So how do you deal

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Speaker 3: with conflict? You shut that ish down and with the quickness,

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Speaker 3: and I think that's how they do it. Then it's

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Speaker 3: like they know, you know, no negotiation, We're just going

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Speaker 3: to shut it now, like completely.

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Speaker 2: So and I think it's like a pride thing where

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Speaker 2: you just don't want to say I.

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Speaker 1: Don't know, Like so you're like, ah, shut up, you know, yeah,

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Speaker 1: You're like, okay, just say you don't know my guy.

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Speaker 3: And then that's why they fine, that's where they hang

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Speaker 3: on to, as you said, hierarchy, the patriarchy side of things.

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Speaker 3: You know, I find good Zequa. They're not supposed to

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Speaker 3: be heard, children just be quiet and not heard and

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Speaker 3: all that kind of mindset. You know, there's that I

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Speaker 3: actually need to be exing my parents, just.

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Speaker 2: Like I know.

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Speaker 1: You have a psychologist on this episode, because I actally

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Speaker 1: think it's quite lad in in terms of they don't

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Speaker 1: even really realize that. I think a lot of it

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Speaker 1: is reactive, reactive, reactive, none of it is ever intentional,

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Speaker 1: Like I don't think they're just like, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: you're embarrassing.

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Speaker 2: You stop you know, like.

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Speaker 1: And like when and even the funny thing is even

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Speaker 1: when it comes to praise, I feel like they wait

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Speaker 1: for others. So it's like it doesn't even make sense

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Speaker 1: because it's like, when I'm doing good, you're also thinking

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Speaker 1: don't don't get a big head.

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Speaker 3: Yes, So it's like, yes, there's getting a compliment out

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Speaker 3: of an African parent.

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Speaker 2: It's lace with with this as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Like I remember even with my dad, like whenever

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Speaker 1: he wants to say I look good wearing something, you'll

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Speaker 1: be like and I guess that.

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Speaker 2: So it's like so it's like, okay, obviously.

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Speaker 1: You're saying you look good, but then it's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you don't bath at the days.

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Speaker 2: You know what I mean. So it's like, oh, this

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Speaker 2: is a twisted compliment.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that puts the that puts the thing in your

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Speaker 1: head right with the people say I've got makeup on

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Speaker 1: or I've got then you feel the need.

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Speaker 2: To always make looking that way. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And I think that's why even appearance is such a

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Speaker 1: huge thing for us, because it's like your parents, even

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Speaker 1: from when you're young, they're like, you know, you gotta look,

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Speaker 1: you have to put the vaselina on, You've got to

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Speaker 1: put your like everything on, then you look good.

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Speaker 2: So there's no none of that.

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Speaker 1: You're nurturing you and your self image and your because

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Speaker 1: it's like when you get to the peak, that's when

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Speaker 1: you start to look okay.

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Speaker 3: Yes, pigger yeah, and you're like, okay, are you saying

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Speaker 3: I'm dressed well? Or And I cannot take it a

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Speaker 3: complimenting yourself exactly? You know, so hey, the backhanded praises

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Speaker 3: is tough. And you have to have thick skin to

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Speaker 3: be an African child. The thick skin you gotta have. Bruh.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and let a lot of things go.

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Speaker 1: Don't spit the small stuff because you'll be lost in

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Speaker 1: the source because literally.

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Speaker 2: You will be touched on everything if you go in

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Speaker 2: like anything.

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Speaker 3: I was an emotional kid. I was an emotional kid.

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Speaker 3: And then I was like, WHOA, ain't gonna survive, ain't

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Speaker 3: gonna make we, ain't gonna make it. Repeat, we ain't

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Speaker 3: gonna make it. We need to put some some thick

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Speaker 3: layers on, like Shrek have onion layers, shields.

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Speaker 2: You don't make it, do you really think? So?

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Speaker 1: It takes a village to raise your children, like please,

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Speaker 1: you throw this a lot?

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Speaker 3: I think so I think that is definitely one value

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Speaker 3: system that African communities have that is so valuable. Gabantu

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Speaker 3: and that's a South African term which talks about a

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Speaker 3: person is a person because of other people and really

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Speaker 3: essentially the community raises a person. I'm sure Amana can

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Speaker 3: talk a bit more, you know, from first hand experience

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Speaker 3: now being a new mom around that. But I think

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Speaker 3: you know it takes It does take a village because

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Speaker 3: my parents poured into me, you know, with the financial

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Speaker 3: side of things, of raising me, educating me, clothing me,

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Speaker 3: providing me a home, helping me, you know, open my

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Speaker 3: mind a little and exposing me. But then grandparents play

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Speaker 3: a part because they teach you culture. They teach you tradition,

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Speaker 3: they teach you to respect elders, they teach you all that.

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Speaker 3: Then you have your cousins and families, extended families teaches

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Speaker 3: you empathy because in African culture we do not just

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Speaker 3: say English to say this is my cousin because it's

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Speaker 3: my first cousin. Everybody is your family. So you have

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Speaker 3: to learn to share and to be given and to

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Speaker 3: be empathetic. And if someone needs a hand and you,

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Speaker 3: let's say they're going through a tough time your parents,

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Speaker 3: the door was always open for people to get home

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Speaker 3: and stay. So it teaches you, you know, being considered

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Speaker 3: of others and being open to others. I think there's

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Speaker 3: so many values there, but I'm curious to hear how

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Speaker 3: you feel now as a young mom and if you

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Speaker 3: feel that that really it does take a village, and

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Speaker 3: if you've seen it first.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I definitely co sign with everything you've said and

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Speaker 1: for those reasons, those are definitely the positives. And I

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Speaker 1: think when it comes to parenting for me now, it's

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Speaker 1: almost like it's a shame that my Bible probably never

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Speaker 1: really have that community because in a Western world where

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Speaker 1: he's going to predominantly probably grow up, it's your own business,

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Speaker 1: Like I ain't gonna come and tell you how to

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Speaker 1: raise your kids. Like maybe I actually think right now

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Speaker 1: that he's a baby is gonna be in a Western way,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna be the time I get the most advice.

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Speaker 2: Because it's such a hard like hell to climb.

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Speaker 1: But then as he gets older, like five, six seven,

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Speaker 1: people are gonna start like drawing back more and more

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Speaker 1: because now it's going to be like, well, we're not

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Speaker 1: gonna come and mess up interfere things. And I think

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Speaker 1: that's also what drives African parenting because again their comparison again,

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Speaker 1: the certain you say, because they don't want to hear

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Speaker 1: there's nothing worse for an African parent that are not

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Speaker 1: that parent parenting you in front of them, because then

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Speaker 1: it's like, oh, you don't know what you do and

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Speaker 1: let me take over, you know, And then they can't

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Speaker 1: also come and say amana wangu you know.

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Speaker 2: So it's like I've noticed that the big difference.

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Speaker 1: Like a friend of mine had a birthday party and

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Speaker 1: she's saying, there four year olds and when the parents

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Speaker 1: all left, there was a hard line for her to cross,

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Speaker 1: like how do I tell these kids stop doing that?

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Speaker 1: But they're not too much that they can tell their

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Speaker 1: parents or she was telling me what to do, you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean. So it's like whereas in an

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Speaker 1: African setting, we'll just be like, well, if they left

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Speaker 1: their kids, child's gonna tell them what to do. There's

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Speaker 1: no asking for permission. Yeah, you're you're under my roof.

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Speaker 1: You will do what you know, whatever Auntie Ningy wants

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Speaker 1: you to do. And so I think, yeah, I've noticed

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Speaker 1: that here right now with Jerome I'm on my own,

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Speaker 1: like it's up to my saline, you know, whereas I

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Speaker 1: think if I was raising German Zimbabwe, I wouldn't have

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Speaker 1: that feeling.

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Speaker 2: Yes, you know, I'd obviously be very very embarrassed.

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Speaker 1: If another parent tells them what to do, I'll be

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Speaker 1: like yeah, But then I wouldn't I would know there

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Speaker 1: is a village to back me, Like if he's out

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Speaker 1: on these streets, he's going to be correct still because

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Speaker 1: the source will still be happening in the train and

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Speaker 1: you know as yeah, they really will look away.

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Speaker 2: They really will.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's very.

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Speaker 2: It's a big difference.

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Speaker 3: It's very interesting. In what way do you think African

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Speaker 3: parenting evolved. I think we've even spoken about it from

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Speaker 3: our grandparents generation, our parents' generation coming now to us.

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Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, howard generation like the evolution if you

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Speaker 3: could surmise it, how would you see it's played out.

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Speaker 1: I definitely think communication is becoming a bigger and bigger necessity.

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Speaker 1: I think our grandparents definitely were militant, which was very

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Speaker 1: very like representative of the time they were living. They

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Speaker 1: were living in militia times, so it is very like

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Speaker 1: do you watch but do what needs to be done,

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Speaker 1: like there's no let's not think about it, let's not

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Speaker 1: you know. And also they saw their kids as a resource.

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Speaker 1: That's why you get the fourteen kids, because everyone had

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Speaker 1: to help out.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: It's just like the more kids you have, the more

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Speaker 1: wealthy quote unquote you are, because again ownership.

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Speaker 3: Yes.

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Speaker 2: And I think from our parents.

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Speaker 1: Like you, like you said before, they're always balancing the

380
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Speaker 1: Western side and the Africans. I think there's like a

381
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Speaker 1: whole lot of confusion happening, but they're still trying to

382
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Speaker 1: make it work. And I think for us, we've definitely

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Speaker 1: adopted the Western style, you know, when we talk about

384
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Speaker 1: mom shaming, when we talk about you know, dads need

385
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Speaker 1: to do just as much as moms. You know, all

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Speaker 1: that is very very Western.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: Also, I feel like would.

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Speaker 3: You have different though, Like this is a question because

390
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Speaker 3: as you say that, I'm like, would I want to

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Speaker 3: maintain the status quo of the majority of responsibility of

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Speaker 3: rearing a child to be placed on me in terms

393
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Speaker 3: of the you know, care, changing the diapers, feeding, washing

394
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Speaker 3: the clothes, Like would you want That's my question because

395
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Speaker 3: we spoke to you about colonialism in you know, a

396
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Speaker 3: previous episode and it's like we are becoming more westernized,

397
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Speaker 3: but would we wanted to stay the same like you know,

398
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Speaker 3: And it's.

399
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Speaker 1: Such a good question because we again in that episode,

400
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Speaker 1: we talked about cherry picking and how cheer picking is like.

401
00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,200
Speaker 1: And I feel like with this parenting and the evolution

402
00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:07,160
Speaker 1: of us as the people, we are cherry picking because

403
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Speaker 1: I do want myself to you know, come in from

404
00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:12,439
Speaker 1: work and help me out with the bob, but I

405
00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:14,920
Speaker 1: do want him to cuddle bub and they have their

406
00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:18,199
Speaker 1: own separate relationship, you know, not just money, not just

407
00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:22,080
Speaker 1: to provide, but he actually thinks and knows his dad

408
00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:25,320
Speaker 1: as much as he knows me. Yes, So I want that.

409
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Speaker 1: At the same time, I also don't want him to

410
00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:30,119
Speaker 1: be like back chatting. I don't want him to be

411
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Speaker 1: So I feel like we're still going to be cherry

412
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Speaker 1: picking as well, and I don't I can't fully embrace

413
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Speaker 1: the Western style, but I can't fully embrace the African

414
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Speaker 1: So I think, yeah, I'm still going to be struggling

415
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Speaker 1: trying to balance this, and I.

416
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Speaker 3: Think we need a bit more of the Western style. Also,

417
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Speaker 3: in the world we live and where access to care

418
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Speaker 3: is really expensive or difficult, and people are going about

419
00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:57,240
Speaker 3: their own lives, so Dad has to show up unfortunately

420
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Speaker 3: back home, and soon you've got you've got yeah, you've

421
00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:04,400
Speaker 3: got begining year and help help, you know what I mean.

422
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Speaker 3: So it's it's that's also another it's it's a reality check.

423
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Speaker 3: But I was curious to us because I'm like, we've

424
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Speaker 3: been talking about this, but it's not practical anymore to

425
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Speaker 3: live in a certain certain.

426
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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, do you think it's evolved or how have

427
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:21,800
Speaker 1: you seen it evolving?

428
00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 3: I agree with what you said, I think though sometimes

429
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Speaker 3: I feel like.

430
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Speaker 4: I feel like it's evolved, but I still see the

431
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:42,080
Speaker 4: status quo being maintained, especially on the continent, especially where

432
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:46,879
Speaker 4: the women still feel the load of the responsibility on

433
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Speaker 4: them about how they read the child.

434
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Speaker 3: Dad's kind of being removed one in Obaua, like Dad's

435
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:58,760
Speaker 3: out of the pub with the boys. And I think

436
00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:01,600
Speaker 3: it's still very I think it's gonna take a while

437
00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:09,080
Speaker 3: because the thing is when something benefits one party, and

438
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:11,760
Speaker 3: it happened to be the party with a bit more

439
00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:16,959
Speaker 3: of a powerful voice because they're red winner. They you know,

440
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 3: provide their mail. The odds are stacked against true change

441
00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:25,359
Speaker 3: happening really fast, But I do think that. You know,

442
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 3: men these days are becoming more hands on and involved,

443
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,439
Speaker 3: not just if not from the physical like care playing

444
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:34,640
Speaker 3: with their kid, talking to their kids a little more,

445
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:36,600
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, not like yeah, yeah, yeah,

446
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:38,840
Speaker 3: like oh my gosh, you was yeah, like.

447
00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:40,840
Speaker 1: That's yeah, let's see and he has his own chair,

448
00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:42,600
Speaker 1: and he has his own plate, and he has his.

449
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,320
Speaker 2: Own like that whole. Yeah.

450
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:46,600
Speaker 1: I mean, if you could change something about it, like

451
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,679
Speaker 1: African parenting, what would be key? What would be like?

452
00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:51,920
Speaker 1: Oh what would you not change? Like what do you

453
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 1: asuly love?

454
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:57,280
Speaker 3: I think I would change. When I came here, I

455
00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 3: was fascinated seeing dads pushing prams alone. There's no mom

456
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:06,240
Speaker 3: in's side. It's one kid, maybe two sometimes three kids,

457
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:09,480
Speaker 3: and they're responsible for like and I'll be like, oh

458
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,520
Speaker 3: my goodness, like I have not seen this. I think

459
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 3: it's really beautiful to see like dad's hands on, even

460
00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:18,320
Speaker 3: if it's just taking the kid for a walk in

461
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,920
Speaker 3: the park or you know, playing a game with them.

462
00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:25,879
Speaker 3: I think that's really beautiful on a visual level. And

463
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 3: I think on a more personal level, it's engaging with

464
00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:34,440
Speaker 3: children and truly getting to know children as individuals and

465
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:37,960
Speaker 3: responding to them and you know, encouraging them. That's something

466
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,920
Speaker 3: I've change as opposed to the control or authoritative no

467
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,080
Speaker 3: you can't do this, do this because I said so

468
00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:49,200
Speaker 3: kind of you to understand why children encouraging you know, them,

469
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:52,879
Speaker 3: helping them work through fears, helping them go for the

470
00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:55,359
Speaker 3: things they want in life. I don't know, what do

471
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:55,879
Speaker 3: you think?

472
00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:57,400
Speaker 2: I completely agree.

473
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 1: I think what I would change is taking the time,

474
00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 1: you know, to really get to know your kids. You know,

475
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,000
Speaker 1: sometimes some kids will be like, oh or not what

476
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:08,440
Speaker 1: or my kid doesn't do that? And it's like, really

477
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 1: they don't yeh in these spirits we see them doing

478
00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:12,560
Speaker 1: it all the time, you know what I mean? Like

479
00:25:12,840 --> 00:25:16,280
Speaker 1: sometimes African parents are the last to know yes their

480
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:19,680
Speaker 1: child because they think they know they think you know it.

481
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:22,679
Speaker 1: Because after a while, as a teenager as well especially,

482
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 1: you start to give them this mask almost of who

483
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,439
Speaker 1: I am. You know, roomb will come, she'll set the table,

484
00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:31,480
Speaker 1: she'll make tea, she'll do Yes, I'll do those things.

485
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:33,760
Speaker 1: But do you know when we're talking about music, is

486
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 1: Rumby's room be more keen on.

487
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 2: That we're talking about?

488
00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:38,880
Speaker 1: You know, Like I feel like they need to take

489
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:40,760
Speaker 1: that extra step to really know.

490
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 2: Their child, do you know what I mean?

491
00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:42,639
Speaker 3: Like?

492
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 1: And I felt because we're not cookie kata, even though

493
00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:48,600
Speaker 1: the system makes it that way. So I wish they

494
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:51,920
Speaker 1: would change that because I want parents to really pick

495
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:53,959
Speaker 1: out up in a lineup. You know, we're not just

496
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,679
Speaker 1: the same. And what I would not change, which is

497
00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:00,959
Speaker 1: what we talked about before, is the boon to of it,

498
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:04,960
Speaker 1: because I feel like you shouldn't just get disciplined from

499
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: your parents, like your mom and your dad. I think

500
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,600
Speaker 1: it is important to learn and to get advice from

501
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:14,080
Speaker 1: different types of people because even as your kid grows up,

502
00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:17,880
Speaker 1: even in this global world, there's mentoring, there's gonna be bosses,

503
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:20,320
Speaker 1: there's gonna be managers, there's gonna be So if your

504
00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 1: kid is it so used to like only mom and dad,

505
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 1: it's almost like then they're just fighting everyone else.

506
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:27,119
Speaker 2: You know, like, don't tell me what to do. You know,

507
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:30,159
Speaker 2: I know what I'm doing. No, it's okay too. You

508
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 2: can get advice from someone else.

509
00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:34,800
Speaker 1: And I've noticed it at work with my younger and

510
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 1: the people that manage were younger, they find it really

511
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 1: hard to like get advice.

512
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:40,400
Speaker 2: They see it as an affront.

513
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:42,480
Speaker 1: They see it as what you're telling me, you know,

514
00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:45,320
Speaker 1: it's like even if you come you know, graceudy and

515
00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 1: come correct, but they're not used to it. They're not

516
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,879
Speaker 1: used to like people having an opinion on them who

517
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 1: are not their parents.

518
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know.

519
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 1: So it's like I feel like it's a skill in

520
00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:59,040
Speaker 1: a way that that is lost because it's not a

521
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 1: it's not a we're not like coming here to tell

522
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:03,400
Speaker 1: you what to do in a mean way. We're just

523
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:05,959
Speaker 1: telling you. You know, I noticed this about you. Why

524
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,480
Speaker 1: don't you do this? When you do that? And you

525
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:10,719
Speaker 1: not take it to a fence all the time. And

526
00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 1: I think that mainly comes from people sticking in their lanes.

527
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:16,520
Speaker 1: So now when someone else comes into that lane, it's like, oh,

528
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:17,240
Speaker 1: who you book?

529
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:19,199
Speaker 2: They don't have that.

530
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 3: You don't know.

531
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you don't know me.

532
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:25,359
Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, so I feel like that could open

533
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:27,400
Speaker 1: up our our minds a little.

534
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:31,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, for sure. How would you say? Though it's

535
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,000
Speaker 3: shaped you the pros and cons of African parents.

536
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 2: I definitely know how to come correct.

537
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: Like even when I remember if when Rumby had her

538
00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: wedding and prag remember when I got there, I was like,

539
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:46,399
Speaker 1: you got to greet everyone, you know, like as much

540
00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,320
Speaker 1: as i'mhugging Rumby and happy. I have to also like

541
00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 1: take a moment greet everyone. Marcadini, how have you traveled?

542
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,920
Speaker 2: You know, Like it's just one of those things.

543
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:56,720
Speaker 1: And even when Rumby and I were discussing for a

544
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 1: wedding or for or we're like, Okay, what do we

545
00:27:58,520 --> 00:27:59,439
Speaker 1: need to do for the parents?

546
00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 2: What do you need to do?

547
00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:02,439
Speaker 1: Like it's like a thing we need to discuss. What

548
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 1: are the expectations, what are the are we cooking? Are

549
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 1: we cleaning? Are a few hundred? Definitely shaped me in that,

550
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:13,280
Speaker 1: like you get almost an anxiety of how to be

551
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,399
Speaker 1: in front of them, But I know I can't fully

552
00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:17,880
Speaker 1: be me. I can't be getting there with my champagne

553
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 1: like common bottles in.

554
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:24,120
Speaker 2: This baby, you know. I know I have to come

555
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 2: like yeah, yeah, Like so I feel like it's definitely shaped.

556
00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 1: You're always thinking, You're always in your head, like reading

557
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:34,399
Speaker 1: the reading the room.

558
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:36,440
Speaker 2: You're reading the room all.

559
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 1: The time, which which is a pro and a huge

560
00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 1: corner at the same time, because then you're like showing

561
00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 1: them a piece of you.

562
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 2: You know.

563
00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 1: I feel like even with your mom, who's our biggest

564
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 1: fan listening to this podcast, she said to us a

565
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:52,240
Speaker 1: few times. Ah, you girls, like, because I think she's

566
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 1: now seeing a deeper part of our friendship, which when

567
00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 1: we're in front of it obviously trying to be like respectful,

568
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, I feel like.

569
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:06,080
Speaker 3: It Isn't it funny? Though? And to tie on to

570
00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 3: what you say, you have to come correct. But you

571
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 3: have to be careful not to offend someone. But you

572
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:15,640
Speaker 3: need to be willing to take on offenses because offenses come,

573
00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 3: and not just from your parents, it's like other family members,

574
00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:22,800
Speaker 3: all the people. It's this weird thing where you are

575
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,360
Speaker 3: not allowed to speak, but you're meant to just absorb

576
00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,520
Speaker 3: all the all. The next is a weird mind if.

577
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:29,240
Speaker 2: And then the.

578
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: Funniest thing is when they have different opinions. One is

579
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 1: saying you've gained weight, it's a good thing. One thing,

580
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:36,719
Speaker 1: you've gained weight, it's too much. You're like, so what

581
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:37,080
Speaker 1: do I do?

582
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:38,240
Speaker 3: What do I do?

583
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 1: Like?

584
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 3: Who am I right now? Absolutely? And I think it has.

585
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:48,400
Speaker 3: It has shaped me in valuing I think community for sure,

586
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:54,800
Speaker 3: and family and the importance thereof and showing respect. I

587
00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 3: see sometimes young people and I'm like, yo, like especially here,

588
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 3: and you're just like yo, you know, fighting the elder

589
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 3: to get through the door. I'm like, in what world?

590
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 3: Or you know, just those little you know, those polite

591
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:12,360
Speaker 3: I find politeness. You know, I've adapted a lot of that.

592
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,680
Speaker 3: And I think the cons is like triggered bra We've

593
00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 3: been triggered me outshit, triggered all the time. You know. Ready,

594
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, you know you have to cons are A

595
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,640
Speaker 3: lot of us have had to go through the therapy,

596
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,360
Speaker 3: I think, to work through a lot of the African

597
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 3: parenting that we experience as children and kind of work

598
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:39,520
Speaker 3: through that. Still working through that, you know, and then

599
00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:41,760
Speaker 3: it makes you question the kind of parent you'll be,

600
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 3: should I have children? Will I be a good pay

601
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 3: Like It's a lot to digest and work through.

602
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 1: So, yeah, you brought up a great point in therapy

603
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 1: because I actually really that is a huge thing because

604
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:58,920
Speaker 1: I think like self image, because the comparisons like if

605
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 1: you don't reach those level of doctor lawyer den, what

606
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 1: are you a nobody?

607
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:02,640
Speaker 4: Like?

608
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 2: Of course not.

609
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 1: You know, if you can't bear children, are you a nobody?

610
00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 2: Of course not.

611
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 1: If you don't make you know, all this money and

612
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 1: buy Mercedes Benz, are you a nobody?

613
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 2: Of course not?

614
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 1: Like it's like one of those things where it's like, yeah, man,

615
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:20,480
Speaker 1: like this, we have this template we're given, but what

616
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:24,040
Speaker 1: happens when we're outside of coloring, outside of those lines?

617
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think.

618
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:28,400
Speaker 1: That's why even this podcast it's been so good, because

619
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:32,080
Speaker 1: you've been questioning that template, you know, all along, And

620
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 1: it comes from now that I think about, it comes

621
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:36,840
Speaker 1: from African parenting, because we're like, we're not.

622
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:40,160
Speaker 2: This way, we're this way, so what now is it? Yeah?

623
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:43,720
Speaker 3: You know? And also it's also taught a lot of

624
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 3: that external validation and that needing approval and transactional love,

625
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 3: like if you do well, then I will give you

626
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 3: some form of praise, even though I may still hate

627
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,040
Speaker 3: on like this weird dance. And I think those are

628
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 3: some of the things we have to work through as

629
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 3: a result, and in therapy as we're talking about. But yeah,

630
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,720
Speaker 3: would your value systems be the same otherwise do you think.

631
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,720
Speaker 1: In a word, no, they would not be the same. Yeah,

632
00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:18,480
Speaker 1: because all the things we've talked about Burntu community, respecting

633
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: your elders, you know, being ageist with some things, it's

634
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:26,640
Speaker 1: all based on that. And that's the biggest thing I

635
00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:29,680
Speaker 1: think it is coming from African parenting. You've grown up

636
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: in that extreme and it feels like Western way is not.

637
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:34,760
Speaker 1: It's like, oh okay, I can do this, But I

638
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: wouldn't have had that in me without the extreme.

639
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 3: And what do you think, just like we spoke about

640
00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 3: in talking about colonialism, we would not I would not

641
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:47,520
Speaker 3: be me without it. And I think it's made for

642
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 3: a richer experience. I think, yeah, growing up African is

643
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 3: a very rich experience. Layer it multi faceted, tough, but

644
00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:01,960
Speaker 3: so valuable. It makes us or whatever, especially and I

645
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,640
Speaker 3: think to be fair and the parents in a way

646
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 3: were preparing us for a world where we would be

647
00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:12,959
Speaker 3: minority a minority, or experience racism in certain spaces and

648
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, like they it kind of

649
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:17,560
Speaker 3: has to prepare you to face all of that and

650
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 3: still try to come out on top at the end

651
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 3: of the day.

652
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,959
Speaker 1: So what do you think if someone else, like especially

653
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:27,280
Speaker 1: of a different culture, was to look at African parenting,

654
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,200
Speaker 1: what do you think they would learn from it or

655
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 1: glean from it? Do you think the would think we're

656
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: better or worse for it? Like just hearing even this episode,

657
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:34,680
Speaker 1: what do you reckon?

658
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 3: I think, as we mentioned the pros and cons, I

659
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:43,040
Speaker 3: think they would truly understand family a little more and

660
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:47,080
Speaker 3: the value of family beyond just your sort of immediate

661
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:52,120
Speaker 3: you know, brothers, sisters, or like mom and dad. I

662
00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:57,480
Speaker 3: think it would also symbolize hopefully a society where respect

663
00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:03,200
Speaker 3: is kind of paramount, and that there's value from hearing

664
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 3: from others. You don't have to all the advice. Like

665
00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:09,120
Speaker 3: imagine if only my mom was giving me advice on life,

666
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:10,959
Speaker 3: Like that's a lot of pressure.

667
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 2: On Yeah, you know what I mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

668
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,480
Speaker 3: Other people who can pour into you and you know,

669
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 3: give you certain perspectives. I think that's what they would see. Obviously,

670
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:21,839
Speaker 3: there are other things which are not so great, where

671
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:26,360
Speaker 3: you know, parents are a bit distant or as a separation,

672
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,840
Speaker 3: you know, or the control aspect of things. It's not

673
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,319
Speaker 3: always a great thing. But yeah, I think that's what

674
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 3: they would glean. I don't know what you would say there.

675
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:40,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I completely agree, because I do think it's

676
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:44,520
Speaker 1: important that we like our community based around our kids,

677
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 1: you know. So I do think that's the one thing

678
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 1: that's a huge takeaway that my kids can learn from

679
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:52,680
Speaker 1: different people because a lot of pressure and I'll say

680
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 1: this now as a new parent, there's a lot of pressure,

681
00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:57,359
Speaker 1: just put it on you me to teach them all

682
00:34:57,400 --> 00:34:59,759
Speaker 1: the languages, to teach them all the you know, like

683
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:03,200
Speaker 1: just everything in life. Like sometimes I look at Western

684
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:04,279
Speaker 1: life and I think.

685
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:09,040
Speaker 2: Aren't you tired? Like we as tired. We need a nap.

686
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,040
Speaker 1: That's why we need like that's why Westerners are heavily

687
00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:16,800
Speaker 1: into antidepressants and because I think we internalize so much.

688
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 1: So I think when it comes to parenting, it's nice

689
00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:22,400
Speaker 1: to bounce off ideas. It's nice to get a break,

690
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:25,680
Speaker 1: it's nice to travel as a big group and not

691
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 1: all of your take care of you know, the all

692
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:29,400
Speaker 1: if you're chipping in to take care.

693
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:29,920
Speaker 2: Of the kids.

694
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:33,879
Speaker 1: And I think all those things Westerners are definitely could

695
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,960
Speaker 1: learn from African parenting. With that it's okay to be,

696
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:40,080
Speaker 1: you know. At the same time, we need to work

697
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:44,960
Speaker 1: on our fiction because see African parenting, there's no affection.

698
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 1: Some people tell you they've never heard the words I

699
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:49,600
Speaker 1: love you from their parents, They've never had a hug

700
00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:53,359
Speaker 1: from their parents. So those things are sad because it's

701
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:57,800
Speaker 1: like those things shape us, and they shape our romantic relationships,

702
00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,879
Speaker 1: our platonic relationships where it's like, oh, you're a man,

703
00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:01,399
Speaker 1: I'm a woman.

704
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:02,399
Speaker 2: Oh what do we do now?

705
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,759
Speaker 1: Like you know, it's like if you learn that from

706
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:07,120
Speaker 1: an early age and it's okay.

707
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,120
Speaker 2: Whereas we're driven by fear, stay away from boys, you know,

708
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:14,680
Speaker 2: and you'll get pregnant. One look will make you pregnant,

709
00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:20,319
Speaker 2: you know. And it's like wow, yeah, I get you.

710
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 3: And I think there's definitely a lot to learn from

711
00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 3: both sides of you know, on each side of it,

712
00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:29,719
Speaker 3: and we could do better. Also communication, I think we

713
00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:30,880
Speaker 3: could do better as.

714
00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:34,400
Speaker 5: Africa is learning and not get so triggered, yes, not

715
00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:38,640
Speaker 5: get so triggered, and you know, not be so confrontational argumentative,

716
00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:40,839
Speaker 5: like just because I have a different opinion doesn't mean

717
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 5: I hate you, Like yeah, yeah, you know, learning how

718
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 5: to you know, there's a space communicate and this.

719
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,680
Speaker 3: Is space for your for all and if you could

720
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:54,360
Speaker 3: I'll maybe as we wrap up this episode, if you

721
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 3: could be a child again, would you want to be

722
00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:01,920
Speaker 3: raised the same way? If so or not? Tell us why.

723
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 2: Ish This is a tricky one for me.

724
00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:09,160
Speaker 1: Because it's pretty much calling out my parents up in here.

725
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,759
Speaker 2: I reckon yes, but.

726
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:18,160
Speaker 1: With some change, like I would want to be raised

727
00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:19,880
Speaker 1: the way I was raised. I think it has shaped

728
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:22,200
Speaker 1: me into the best person I could be in this

729
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:25,359
Speaker 1: global world. But I do see the problems. I do

730
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:27,600
Speaker 1: see the parts where I need therapy. As we talked

731
00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:31,360
Speaker 1: about where it's like, you know, communication, love, you know,

732
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 1: self confidence, all these things, and that I'm not I

733
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:36,520
Speaker 1: shouldn't have to be fit in a box.

734
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:38,600
Speaker 2: It's okay for me to be my quirky self.

735
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 1: And you know, you and me always talk about this

736
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,839
Speaker 1: where we want to be different and celebrate that. So

737
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:46,600
Speaker 1: I think I would love to be but there's some

738
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: definite points where it's like we could have done better.

739
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, one couldn't have said it better. I think there's

740
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:57,920
Speaker 3: so much you know, that I've gleaned and garnered from

741
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:00,879
Speaker 3: my parents that I'm so grateful for talked about it,

742
00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 3: like you know, and hunger to see the world, to learn, curiosity,

743
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 3: and you know, so much that has shaped me into

744
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:14,600
Speaker 3: who I am. But if somethings are tough with I

745
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:16,239
Speaker 3: don't think we need to be. I don't think we

746
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:20,640
Speaker 3: need that tough. I think I can go without it.

747
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:24,399
Speaker 3: And you know, it's really confronting for me. I'm not

748
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 3: a parent yet, but it really makes me wonder what

749
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:30,120
Speaker 3: kind of parents I will be and it's scary because

750
00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:33,480
Speaker 3: you see the way you were raised and the things

751
00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:35,080
Speaker 3: you want and don't want, and you're like, can I

752
00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:35,799
Speaker 3: even pull it off?

753
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:39,640
Speaker 2: Because it's like you have done.

754
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:43,239
Speaker 3: This better, parent, and then when you're actually in it,

755
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:45,480
Speaker 3: it's like can you do better? Yeah? You know?

756
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:47,320
Speaker 2: And are you being pushed?

757
00:38:47,680 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 3: Yes? So also recognizing they did the best they could

758
00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:55,040
Speaker 3: with what they had and hoping I can do the

759
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:56,879
Speaker 3: best or better with.

760
00:38:57,239 --> 00:39:00,080
Speaker 2: What you can learn from it. So can do it?

761
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:01,320
Speaker 3: Yes, exactly.

762
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:01,719
Speaker 2: Yeah.

763
00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:04,080
Speaker 1: But even as a teacher, I'm sure you see all

764
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:06,200
Speaker 1: types of parents, so yeah.

765
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:09,680
Speaker 3: And as a teacher also it's confronting because how I

766
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 3: engage with my students, it's like it's like WHOA, Like,

767
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 3: am I bringing the best out of them? Or what?

768
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:16,279
Speaker 1: You know?

769
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:19,399
Speaker 2: Yeah?

770
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:19,839
Speaker 3: Did?

771
00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: Little souls were given and then you're being not iffing

772
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: them up. So our ZIM shout out for this beautiful

773
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 1: episode is Stephen Chi. His Instagram handle is at Stephen

774
00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:38,440
Speaker 1: that's st V E n C H I KO SI

775
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:40,840
Speaker 1: roomby tell us more about Stephen.

776
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:46,280
Speaker 3: So I some of the cross upon Stephen like years ago,

777
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:50,520
Speaker 3: just like his Instagram and the photos I loved how

778
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:55,439
Speaker 3: he captured the African landscape, so Zimbabwe in its true form,

779
00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:59,960
Speaker 3: but you know, beautifully it wasn't like poverty photography or

780
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:02,800
Speaker 3: I don't know what the term is, but just really

781
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:06,400
Speaker 3: authentically and I loved seeing that. And I've just followed

782
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:10,200
Speaker 3: him ever since. And he's also a documentary he's a

783
00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 3: documentary photographer and filmmaker and yeah, really dope, so great

784
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:20,200
Speaker 3: to see Zimbabwean doing something so wonderful on such a

785
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:23,279
Speaker 3: beautiful scale. So give him a shout, follow him and

786
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:24,000
Speaker 3: see his work.

787
00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:27,480
Speaker 1: It's really absolutely beautiful, like you just keep scrolling on

788
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:28,279
Speaker 1: the Instagram.

789
00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:33,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, super, but thank you so much. And what a

790
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:34,560
Speaker 3: good topic.

791
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:38,160
Speaker 1: I know, I know we actually went through that without

792
00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:41,120
Speaker 1: being too triggered. We were quite We went and go

793
00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:43,560
Speaker 1: to emotional with it called breath work.

794
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:47,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've done the work. We've done the work. Our

795
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:49,800
Speaker 2: therapist to be proud.

796
00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:51,439
Speaker 3: Thank you so much.

797
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:53,879
Speaker 2: Obviously you can catch us on all the socials.

798
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 1: Yes, it's late and we're trying to really push the envelope,

799
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,799
Speaker 1: so please tell us you know all your thoughts and

800
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,800
Speaker 1: in the finale you're planning to have some of those thoughts.

801
00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 3: It absolutely thank you, am and yeah, hit us up.

802
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:14,399
Speaker 3: It's layered on Instagram, It's late pot on Twitter. Email US,

803
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:18,319
Speaker 3: it's Layered Pod at gmail dot com. Thank you. This

804
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:20,640
Speaker 3: has been wonderful, Am, and I look forward to speaking

805
00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 3: with you on our next episode.

806
00:41:22,160 --> 00:41:29,640
Speaker 2: As always, yay, hey bye bye yeah yeah yeah yeah.

807
00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 2: Oh no no no