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Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda

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Speaker 1: bunjelung Caalguttin woman from Gadigol Country. The Daily oz acknowledges

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Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the

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Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres

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Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the

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Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present.

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Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os It's Tuesday,

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Speaker 2: the thirteenth of June. I'm Sam, I'm Zara. Last week,

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Speaker 2: Apple announced that their virtual reality headset, the Apple Vision Pro,

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Speaker 2: would be available in early twenty twenty four. Now this

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Speaker 2: has the tech world talking, But for the rest of us,

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Speaker 2: what does this technology actually mean? How do we use it?

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Speaker 2: And is VR an inevitable part of our future or

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Speaker 2: is it just a whole lot of hype. We're going

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Speaker 2: to unpack all of this in the date dive be

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Speaker 2: before I tell you about it. What made headlines this

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Speaker 2: long weekend.

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Speaker 3: Z Area investigations at continuing into what caused the bus

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Speaker 3: crash in the New South Wales Hunter Valley that claim

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Speaker 3: ten lives. Around twenty five people remain in various hospitals

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Speaker 3: across the state. Yesterday, PM Anthony Alberizi offered support to

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Speaker 3: the victims and their families, while New South Wales Premier

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Speaker 3: Chris Mins attended the scene.

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Speaker 2: Four children have been rescued in the Amazon rainforest after

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Speaker 2: being missing for forty days. The siblings, who are all

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Speaker 2: members of the indigenous Huitoto people, had been traveling on

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Speaker 2: a light plane that crashed on May the first. According

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Speaker 2: to Columbian authorities, the children built makeshift shelters, foraged for

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Speaker 2: fruit and seeds, and fended off wild dogs.

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Speaker 3: Novak Djokovic has won his twenty third Grand Slam, officially

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Speaker 3: standing alone as the most successful individuals men's tennis player

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Speaker 3: in history. Djokovic is now tied with Serena Williams, with

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Speaker 3: only Australian Margaret Caught ahead of the pair on twenty

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Speaker 3: four individual titles.

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Speaker 2: And today's good news, a university professor nicknamed Doctor deep

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Speaker 2: Sea has set a new record for the number of

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Speaker 2: days living underwater surfacing. After one hundred days beneath the surface,

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Speaker 2: Doctor Joseph Deturi set a new record for the longest

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Speaker 2: time living underwater without depressurization during his stay at Jules's

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Speaker 2: Undersea Lodge, which is an underwater steel and glass hotel

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Speaker 2: built thirty feet under the water off the coast of Florida.

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Speaker 2: It was all part of an experiment to test the

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Speaker 2: physical and mental limits of humans when they're isolated in

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Speaker 2: a high pressure environment.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So, Sam, you have fought me very hard to

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Speaker 3: speak about this on the podcast today, and it's because

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Speaker 3: I know that you are very excited to talk about

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Speaker 3: virtual reality.

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Speaker 2: I am really excited, and I actually went to San

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Speaker 2: Jose in California last week and I got to actually

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Speaker 2: try on the Apple Vision pro headset. Now, before we

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Speaker 2: get into a discussion about the future of our reality,

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Speaker 2: I want to be really transparent up front and tell

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Speaker 2: everyone that I was invited as a guest of Apple

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Speaker 2: to try the product, and none of that will influence

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Speaker 2: the content of this podcast. It's editorially independent. But I

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Speaker 2: guess the reason why I was so keen to go

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Speaker 2: was it's impossible to deny the significance of virtual reality

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Speaker 2: in terms of how tech companies are imagining our future.

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Speaker 2: And we all know that if you look at how

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Speaker 2: laptops and phones have developed, it could only be a

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Speaker 2: matter of time until we all own a virtual reality

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Speaker 2: or mixed reality headset, whether they come from Apple, Google,

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Speaker 2: or Meta formerly known as Facebook. But I didn't want

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Speaker 2: to go into a product review. What I thought would

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Speaker 2: be more helpful is to explore in a little bit

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Speaker 2: more depth what virtual reality is and whether we actually

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Speaker 2: are heading for this future where it'll be as commonplace

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Speaker 2: in our lives as picking up a mobile phone.

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Speaker 3: I think when I hear you say that, it just

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Speaker 3: feels so unlikely to me, because you know, it's not

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Speaker 3: the first VR set to be released, and the people

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Speaker 3: that do have VR sets at the moment and are

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Speaker 3: just people that are obsessed by tech. You know, they're

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Speaker 3: really expensive, and normal people don't tend to really use it.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I want to understand why you think it's

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Speaker 3: going to take over the whole world, but I think

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Speaker 3: we should probably take a step back first and just

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Speaker 3: explain what it is that you're actually talking about when

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Speaker 3: you say things like virtual or augmented reality.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think part of the reason why it's

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Speaker 2: so hard for a lot of us to get our

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Speaker 2: heads around it is that we don't actually know what

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Speaker 2: these terms mean. So augmented reality is when virtual stuff

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Speaker 2: is overlaid onto our real world to enhance reality, and

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Speaker 2: it's already a pretty big part of a lot of

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Speaker 2: people's lives. Think about apps where you can point in

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Speaker 2: the corner of a room and it will show you

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Speaker 2: what a new couch or table will look like. Or

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Speaker 2: a game like Pokemon Go, where we remember people running

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Speaker 2: all over the streets chasing pokemon that they saw overlaid

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Speaker 2: into a vision of their real world.

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Speaker 3: So things like social media filters the things you know

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Speaker 3: when you see people becoming a.

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Speaker 2: Cat, right exactly, that's kind of the reality as we

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Speaker 2: know it, manipulated by a screen. But then you've got

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Speaker 2: virtual reality. So I just talked to you through augmented reality.

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Speaker 2: Virtual reality is a computer generated three D simulated environment

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Speaker 2: that you can actually explore and interact with. And this

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Speaker 2: is where you usually have to use a VR headset

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Speaker 2: or goggles. In the olden days, it was three D

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Speaker 2: glasses that IMAX was kind of getting you somewhat close

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Speaker 2: to that, and those tools create animated visuals and spatial

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Speaker 2: sounds to immerse you in that environment. And the idea

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Speaker 2: here is that it's realistic enough that you can suspend

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Speaker 2: your current reality and belief and experience that world as

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Speaker 2: real now. Naturally, VR has mostly featured in gaming, and

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Speaker 2: there are things also like flight simulating headsets that airlines

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Speaker 2: use to train pilots. And then finally there's the concept

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Speaker 2: of mixed reality, which is kind of a blend of

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Speaker 2: the virtual world with your real world. And you know

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Speaker 2: you're in a mixed reality environment when you see these

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Speaker 2: virtual objects in your living room or whatever real space

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Speaker 2: you're in, and these objects in front of you might

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Speaker 2: get bigger when you get closer, or they might react

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Speaker 2: to you sticking your hand out and moving it. It's

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Speaker 2: engaging with you in your world, but it's not obviously

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Speaker 2: really there. And the important thing to remind you is

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Speaker 2: that this is not totally new tech. Other companies like

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Speaker 2: Meta have had VR headsets out for a while.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, we in our last office, our beautiful office mates

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Speaker 3: would spend hours just playing games with it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I got my golf swing pretty good, and the

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Speaker 2: old version of only.

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Speaker 3: That's the only time I've ever seen it in real life.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so that was the quest and there's a third

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Speaker 2: iteration of that coming out soon. But in the early

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Speaker 2: days of virtual reality, as we experienced in that office, Zara,

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Speaker 2: it hasn't been that comfortable as an experience, it's either

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Speaker 2: totally unrealistic, or you're waving your hands around, or you're

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Speaker 2: bashing into a wall. And another problem that users have

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Speaker 2: reported is the fact that it's really bulky and it's

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Speaker 2: really ugly to wear this huge headset. We can all

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Speaker 2: agree most of them look pretty terrible. So with all

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Speaker 2: of those challenges in mind, Apple made their relatively late

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Speaker 2: entry into this mixed reality space last week. Now they

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Speaker 2: suggested that this was their biggest launch since the Apple

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Speaker 2: Watch back in twenty fifteen, and they're calling it a

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Speaker 2: new era of tech, with the headset featuring the world's

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Speaker 2: first spatial operating system. And how much jargon we've gotten

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Speaker 2: through this podcast, it's pretty easy to tell that we

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Speaker 2: can throw another one in there without too much trouble.

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Speaker 2: But in Apple's mind, everyone could own one one day.

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Speaker 2: But I'm not so convinced.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I know why I'm not convinced, but I

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Speaker 3: would like to hear why you're not convinced, given that

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Speaker 3: you've actually tried it. So what comes to mind immediately

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Speaker 3: when you try it?

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Speaker 2: It was a pretty interesting experience. So there's only been

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Speaker 2: a handful of people in Australia who have had an

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Speaker 2: opportunity to try one, and what happens is they took

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Speaker 2: my glasses measurements because I don't have the best eyes

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Speaker 2: and I wear glasses all the time, and they actually

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Speaker 2: insert prescription lenses into the goals before you put them on,

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Speaker 2: and what your eat it with when you try it

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Speaker 2: on is something that looks a little bit like ski goggles,

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Speaker 2: but from the outside it's really interesting because you can

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Speaker 2: see your eyes in the front, but it's not actually transparent. Instead,

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Speaker 2: there's little cameras inside the goggles that are transmitting a

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Speaker 2: live feed of your eyeballs to the outside of the goggles,

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Speaker 2: so that other people in the room know what you're

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Speaker 2: doing and where you're looking and what you're blinking at. Now,

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Speaker 2: the way that you control movement when things pop up

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Speaker 2: in front of you is just with your eyes. So

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Speaker 2: to click something in the top left, you look at

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Speaker 2: the top left and it's just a simple tap of

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Speaker 2: the index finger and the thumb. There's no big waving

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Speaker 2: of the arms, there's no golf swings like we saw

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Speaker 2: in the office, Sarah. It's very very minor movements, a

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Speaker 2: little bit like you're conducting an orchestra, and then there's

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Speaker 2: two little speakers near your ears that give you this

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Speaker 2: kind of spatial three D audio. And what that means

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Speaker 2: is if someone's talking to you from your left then

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Speaker 2: you'll hear it more in your left ear, and then

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Speaker 2: likewise with the right side. And then it's got that

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Speaker 2: kind of transparency where if someone walks into your physical

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Speaker 2: room and asks what you want for dinner, that will

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Speaker 2: cut through whatever world you're in. But the really interesting

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Speaker 2: bit was that there's this little dial that controls how

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Speaker 2: much of the virtual reality world you're in. So let's

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Speaker 2: say that you came into the room, you could dial

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Speaker 2: that back to see a little bit of Zara and

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Speaker 2: a little bit of my virtual reality rainforest and not

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Speaker 2: feel totally removed as a lot of the other v

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Speaker 2: I headsets have done. Now, how do you power it?

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Speaker 2: It's a battery pack, but it only lasts two hours,

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Speaker 2: and I'll come back to that later.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So once you had it on, what are you

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Speaker 3: actually using it for? Because I mean, we've heard it's

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Speaker 3: not just for gaming. What did you do with it? Aren't?

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Speaker 2: They ran through a heap of different scenarios with me.

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Speaker 2: I did a mindfulness meditation in a rainforest. I watched

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Speaker 2: some of Avatar where I was in the world that

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Speaker 2: Avatar was filmed in, and I had a FaceTime call

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Speaker 2: with someone in another room whose Avatar itself kind of

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Speaker 2: appeared physically in the room with me. One of the

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Speaker 2: really powerful ones was I relived the kid's birthday party

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Speaker 2: through a three D v so I was literally watching

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Speaker 2: a kid blow out birthday candles in the room with me.

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Speaker 2: And that was a moment for me where I kind

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Speaker 2: of saw the real appeal of this type of technology

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Speaker 2: and some of my doubts started to subside. This went

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Speaker 2: from novel to meaningful. Like I was thinking about what

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Speaker 2: this could mean for people who can capture memories with

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Speaker 2: family members who later pass away and then can kind

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Speaker 2: of relive this three D moment, which itself was quite

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Speaker 2: a confronting idea.

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Speaker 3: I mean, when you say that, it just sounds like

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Speaker 3: the kind of next frontier of holograms. You know, We've

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Speaker 3: seen two packet a music festival, We've seen Kim Kardashian

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Speaker 3: speak to her father, So I mean, it's holograms, but

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Speaker 3: then it's taking it to a whole nother level, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And there's so much about this technology we don't

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Speaker 2: know about. Let me kind of reflect on the good

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Speaker 2: bits and the bad bits, because I think there's a

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Speaker 2: lot of interesting lessons in it. I think the spatial

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Speaker 2: Furlo idea and being able to capture real life is

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Speaker 2: really exciting. And the thing that I kept think thinking

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Speaker 2: about was what it could do to news so we

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Speaker 2: could use this as a publication.

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Speaker 3: You texted me saying, we must come up with an

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Speaker 3: idea for how to use this for news.

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Speaker 2: It's incredible. I mean, we could, you know, get people

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Speaker 2: on board a rocket ship and show you new space

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Speaker 2: tech advances. But there's also a bit of an ethical

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Speaker 2: question for me there, because if we immersed you into

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Speaker 2: a war zone to show you the evolving situation, that

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Speaker 2: could have some serious mental health effects. So it's a

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Speaker 2: really interesting part of this tech to explore. But the

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Speaker 2: thing that really made the difference for me and the

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Speaker 2: good bit I think of this headset was the fact

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Speaker 2: that I could toggle in and out of virtual reality.

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Speaker 2: You and I have such a strong memory of our

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Speaker 2: office buddies playing golf in the virtual reality world and

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Speaker 2: just bashing into stuff, and I think this really does

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Speaker 2: counter that problem. And I'm excited to see how it's

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Speaker 2: used in some really meaningful ways. You know, yes, you

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Speaker 2: can watch concerts and go to sports games, but I

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Speaker 2: want to see how it's being used in medicine. I

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Speaker 2: want to see how it's being used in architecture. I

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Speaker 2: also think it's going to have a great impact for

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Speaker 2: people with a disability, and I'm really excited to see

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Speaker 2: how that tech is adapted.

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Speaker 3: And I think I'm going to use that as a

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Speaker 3: segue because there you're talking about accessibility. But I mean,

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Speaker 3: I think the biggest con about this is it's sheer

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Speaker 3: lack of accessibility, and that comes around its price point.

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Speaker 2: This is the big issue, and there was an audible

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Speaker 2: gasp at the launch when the price was released by Apple.

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Speaker 2: It's currently set at three thousand, five hundred US dollars,

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Speaker 2: which in today's value is over five two hundred Australian dollars.

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Speaker 2: We don't know the exact Australian market price for it

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Speaker 2: until next year, but that's simply not affordable to most people.

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Speaker 2: And it got me thinking that if you do see

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Speaker 2: this as an opportunity to replace the family TV, and

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Speaker 2: you're a family of four, you're going to be forking

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Speaker 2: out about twenty thousand dollars to make sure you can

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Speaker 2: all watch something together with the Vision Pro and to

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Speaker 2: give you a sense of the competitive landscape. Meta's Quest

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Speaker 2: device is around five hundred dollars. Now, of course, Apple

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Speaker 2: says that their's is far superior. Whether it's three thousand,

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Speaker 2: five hundred dollars superior is yet to be seen. There's

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Speaker 2: two other big negatives for me. The first is the

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Speaker 2: battery life, and I think it's pretty easily fixed, but

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Speaker 2: the battery life is only two hours, which is much

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Speaker 2: shorter than most films. And the second issue is how

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Speaker 2: it looks. So Apple have clearly done their best to

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Speaker 2: make it not ugly, but this is not a subtle device.

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Speaker 2: You look like you're wearing some hyper tech ski goggles.

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Speaker 2: And to get that beautiful vision of your kid blowing

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Speaker 2: out birthday candles at the birthday party that I spoke of,

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Speaker 2: you need to be the daggy person in the corner

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Speaker 2: wearing the Vision Pro goggles at the birthday party to

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Speaker 2: take the three D video so that we can experience

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Speaker 2: it later. And I just don't see a world where

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Speaker 2: people are confidently walking around with these goggles on.

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Speaker 3: Okay, so taking a step back from it all. Do

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Speaker 3: you think that this is actually something that could change

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Speaker 3: our future or I mean, is it something that only

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Speaker 3: a very few select you know, tech elites will ever use.

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Speaker 2: I think it's too early to tell, and I think

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Speaker 2: people would have had similar discussions when the first typewriter

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Speaker 2: was released, and then when the first desktop computer was released,

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Speaker 2: when the first iPhone was released. We're going to see

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Speaker 2: what happens in the kind of decade to come. But

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Speaker 2: something does need to happen on the cost side until

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Speaker 2: it can be adopted by the majority of the population.

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Speaker 2: We wouldn't have iPhones if they were five thousand dollars each.

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Speaker 2: And I'm also yet to be convinced that this is

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Speaker 2: a device that people would wear around other people. But

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Speaker 2: in saying all of that, this is the start of

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Speaker 2: a new wave of technology and it will take time.

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Speaker 2: But I do think Zara, that you are going to

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Speaker 2: have one in ten years.

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Speaker 3: Well, look forward to sitting on this podcast in ten

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Speaker 3: years time and no longer young people talking about if

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Speaker 3: we are using them.

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Speaker 2: Being beamed into lounge rooms all over the country.

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Speaker 3: What a vision. Thanks for joining us on the daily

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Speaker 3: as if you learned something from today's episode. Don't forget

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Speaker 3: to hit subscribe, so there's a two episode waiting for

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Speaker 3: you every weekday morning. We'll be back again tomorrow, but

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Speaker 3: until then, have a fabulous day,