WEBVTT - What leads to intimate partner violence? 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:04.360 Justa heads up. Today's episode contains distressing themes, including intimate 0:00:04.400 --> 0:00:08.920 partner violence and suicide. Listener discretion is advised. 0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:12.080 Already and this this is the Daily ARS. 0:00:12.160 --> 0:00:15.600 This is the Daily ohs oh, now it makes sense. 0:00:23.560 --> 0:00:26.599 Good morning, and welcome to the Daily ODS. It's Friday, 0:00:26.640 --> 0:00:30.120 the sixth of June. I'm Emma Gillespie, I'm Lucy Tassel. 0:00:30.480 --> 0:00:34.280 More than one in three men report using intimate partner violence, 0:00:34.400 --> 0:00:38.920 which is any behavior in an intimate relationship that causes physical, sexual, 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:42.720 or psychological harm, while an estimated one hundred and twenty 0:00:42.800 --> 0:00:46.279 thousand men nationally each year start to use it for 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:50.360 the first time. That's according to a government backed study 0:00:50.520 --> 0:00:53.920 known as ten to Men, a research initiative that measures 0:00:53.960 --> 0:00:59.000 mental health and wellbeing, paternal relationships, demographics, social support and 0:00:59.160 --> 0:00:59.960 life satisfaction. 0:01:00.720 --> 0:01:03.720 Launched in twenty thirteen, Ten to Men is the largest 0:01:03.720 --> 0:01:07.839 longitudinal study on male health globally, with a total cohort 0:01:08.040 --> 0:01:10.000 of twenty four thousand men involved. 0:01:10.000 --> 0:01:10.319 Today. 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:14.360 Its program lead doctor Sean Martin from the Australian Institute 0:01:14.400 --> 0:01:17.600 of Family Studies says these findings provide a set of 0:01:17.720 --> 0:01:21.480 risk factors to help support the development of effective policies 0:01:21.480 --> 0:01:22.760 and programs for young men. 0:01:26.760 --> 0:01:31.080 Sean is a clinical epidemiologist with over twenty years experience 0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:34.320 in men's health related research, and he joins us now 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:38.039 to talk about these findings. Doctor Sean Martin, Welcome to 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:38.720 the podcast. 0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:39.680 Thank you for having me. 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:42.520 We are talking, of course today about the data from 0:01:42.560 --> 0:01:46.000 the Ten to Men report this week, a really comprehensive 0:01:46.040 --> 0:01:50.720 study into the use of intimate partner violence among Australian men. 0:01:51.120 --> 0:01:53.440 But before we get into the findings, I'd be really 0:01:53.440 --> 0:01:57.200 interested to hear your involvement in the study, how the 0:01:57.280 --> 0:02:00.400 data was collected. What do we need to know about 0:02:00.400 --> 0:02:01.000 this report? 0:02:01.360 --> 0:02:04.520 Sure, well, I'm the program lead for the study, have 0:02:04.680 --> 0:02:07.480 been for the past three years or so, but I've 0:02:07.480 --> 0:02:10.640 been involved in men's health really for over twenty years now, 0:02:10.840 --> 0:02:14.760 so I have some familiarity with both the content and 0:02:14.800 --> 0:02:18.440 the field in general. But in terms of ten to Men, 0:02:18.800 --> 0:02:23.480 it's really the largest longitudinal study of male health in 0:02:23.520 --> 0:02:27.560 the world at this point. In terms of this specific report, 0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:31.720 what we did was when the guys were recruited back 0:02:31.760 --> 0:02:34.840 in twenty thirteen and fourteen, we asked them, as we 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:37.120 always do, a series of measures. One of them was 0:02:37.160 --> 0:02:41.639 around intimate partner violence, and at that point, around one 0:02:41.680 --> 0:02:46.000 in four men reported having ever used any form of 0:02:46.080 --> 0:02:50.959 intimate partner violence. And so this report demonstrates that when 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:53.800 we last assess these guys back in twenty twenty two, 0:02:54.200 --> 0:02:58.440 that estimate had increased to over one in three thirty 0:02:58.480 --> 0:03:03.320 five percent. Our study, by design is meant to represent 0:03:03.639 --> 0:03:07.840 the broader Australian population that they're drawn from. So when 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.680 we took the estimates from this report and applied it 0:03:10.720 --> 0:03:14.160 to the Australian population that it quates to around about 0:03:14.160 --> 0:03:17.840 one hundred and twenty thousand men per year using these 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:19.560 types of behavior for the first time. 0:03:19.760 --> 0:03:23.880 Yeah, I think it's a pretty startling number for a 0:03:23.880 --> 0:03:26.840 lot of people who might not be as familiar with 0:03:26.919 --> 0:03:30.720 this space and the prevalence of intimate partner violence. But 0:03:30.800 --> 0:03:35.080 of course that term represents a whole range of different 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:39.320 forms of violence. What are we talking about when we're 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:42.600 talking about intimate partner abuse? What can you tell us 0:03:42.640 --> 0:03:45.480 about these different forms and what the study found about 0:03:45.480 --> 0:03:46.119 their prevalence. 0:03:46.440 --> 0:03:49.720 Sure, so we used a measure called the Coosa measure, 0:03:49.720 --> 0:03:52.440 which is one of the only measures that was validated 0:03:52.680 --> 0:03:55.360 or tested for use in men at the time back 0:03:55.560 --> 0:04:00.000 in twenty thirteen fourteen. There's since mostly been a really 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:02.520 increase in the measures that covers a whole range of 0:04:03.120 --> 0:04:06.760 these types of behaviors that are covered under the umbrella 0:04:06.800 --> 0:04:10.279 of intimate partner violence. But for us, we're talking specifically 0:04:10.600 --> 0:04:16.080 about emotional type violence. So our guys sent a series 0:04:16.120 --> 0:04:19.560 of questions around those types of behaviors as well as 0:04:19.600 --> 0:04:23.960 physical type violence and sexual type violence. So they collectively 0:04:24.600 --> 0:04:29.120 focused around the use of intimate partner violence. 0:04:29.279 --> 0:04:30.040 In the case of this. 0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:34.039 Report, how did the study account for these boys and 0:04:34.120 --> 0:04:40.760 men self identifying those behaviors versus a potential kind of 0:04:41.240 --> 0:04:47.200 lack of keenness to disclose maybe some more concerning behaviors. 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:49.880 What was the kind of self awareness like in that process. 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:52.520 Yeah, it's a really important question. 0:04:53.040 --> 0:04:55.159 The first thing we always do is make sure that 0:04:55.200 --> 0:04:58.120 we do use these excuse me, validated measures that have 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:00.000 been tested for these sorts of issues. 0:05:00.440 --> 0:05:03.040 So some of those issues. 0:05:02.680 --> 0:05:05.720 Are like the test recall by so whether or not 0:05:05.760 --> 0:05:11.000 people consistently report that the same sorts of measures across time. 0:05:11.200 --> 0:05:13.800 Another thing we can do as a study is treat 0:05:13.839 --> 0:05:19.120 really seriously the privacy and confidentiality of our respondents. None 0:05:19.200 --> 0:05:23.440 of our respondents are able to be identified personally. The 0:05:23.440 --> 0:05:27.120 information that they provide us is safe, it's secure. They 0:05:27.160 --> 0:05:29.919 know that in providing that information they don't put themselves 0:05:30.080 --> 0:05:33.960 or their families at risk or at harm, and we 0:05:34.000 --> 0:05:36.800 make sure that they know of that and they're confident 0:05:36.960 --> 0:05:40.680 around that because we do ask a range of sensitive information, 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:45.120 including intimate partner violence, so we need to be really 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:49.839 consistent in making sure we dedicate some efforts to that area. 0:05:49.920 --> 0:05:52.200 And also too, I guess as we go along we 0:05:52.279 --> 0:05:55.520 build some trust with our participants, so we're able to 0:05:55.520 --> 0:05:59.920 have trust ourselves in the validity of the data. 0:06:00.440 --> 0:06:01.640 We've done a lot. 0:06:01.520 --> 0:06:04.080 Of work in making sure that the information that we 0:06:04.160 --> 0:06:07.080 do is extracted is as accurate as possible. 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:11.160 The study also looks at men's mental health, providing this 0:06:11.400 --> 0:06:17.000 longitudinal snapshot of mental health. What were the standout findings 0:06:17.040 --> 0:06:20.760 in that topic area. Is there a relationship between poor 0:06:20.800 --> 0:06:23.400 mental health and intimate partner violence? 0:06:23.720 --> 0:06:26.040 Yes, there is a very strong one. Actually, it's one 0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:30.640 of our strongest predictors. So when we looked again at 0:06:30.640 --> 0:06:35.320 our men, those that had clinically significant depressive symptoms were 0:06:35.480 --> 0:06:39.080 much more likely to report intimate partner violence later on. 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:42.359 Down the track and again when we looked at suicidality. 0:06:42.480 --> 0:06:46.040 So unfortunately, men who might have had suicidal thoughts or 0:06:46.080 --> 0:06:49.560 plans or even attempts, they were all sort of significant 0:06:49.640 --> 0:06:53.080 risk of later use of intimate partner violence. But we 0:06:53.080 --> 0:06:57.080 were also interested in identifying some protective factors, so we 0:06:57.120 --> 0:07:02.320 looked particularly at social connectedness. So that's a respondent's sense 0:07:02.320 --> 0:07:05.799 of connection to friends, to families, and also their community. 0:07:06.440 --> 0:07:09.840 And those men who reported higher levels of social connection 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:14.080 were actually much less likely to use intimate partner violence. 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:17.600 And also, and I think uniquely for our study, we're 0:07:17.600 --> 0:07:20.240 Arabi demonstrate that people who report at a very high 0:07:20.360 --> 0:07:22.840 level of paternal affection, so we use it again and 0:07:22.920 --> 0:07:26.520 other validated measures called the paternal affection score. Those men 0:07:26.560 --> 0:07:29.440 that had a high level of paternal affection were at 0:07:29.640 --> 0:07:32.840 a much reduced level of risk for using intimate partner 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:35.680 violence in their adult life. In fact, their risk was 0:07:35.720 --> 0:07:36.360 almost half. 0:07:36.640 --> 0:07:43.760 So we'll be back with today's deep dive right after this. Yeah, 0:07:43.760 --> 0:07:48.600 I was really interested in the findings around men and 0:07:48.640 --> 0:07:51.800 their relationships with their fathers and the role that plays 0:07:51.800 --> 0:07:56.320 in intimate partner violence. Also the data around well being 0:07:56.520 --> 0:08:01.560 and social connection that you've touched on men who were 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:04.800 in the two in three who had not reported intimate 0:08:04.920 --> 0:08:09.960 partner violence. What were the key points that differentiated their 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:14.000 outcomes as opposed to the one in three men who 0:08:14.040 --> 0:08:16.000 did report intimate partner violence. 0:08:16.280 --> 0:08:17.520 Yeah, look, it's a great question. 0:08:17.600 --> 0:08:19.120 So I mean, first of all, we did some sort 0:08:19.160 --> 0:08:22.760 of descriptive analyses, so we looked at some of the 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:25.280 age differences of a range of other what's called priority 0:08:25.320 --> 0:08:30.680 population groups, and essentially that there was no differences between 0:08:30.720 --> 0:08:31.320 those groups. 0:08:31.320 --> 0:08:34.520 The sort of tie brows equally amongst. 0:08:34.120 --> 0:08:37.199 All of those groups, if you like, So not too 0:08:37.200 --> 0:08:38.760 many differences there. 0:08:38.920 --> 0:08:41.920 The differences were really sort of concentrated on those. 0:08:41.800 --> 0:08:45.440 Risk factors that have just spoken about, so around mental health, 0:08:46.040 --> 0:08:50.719 around paternal affection, and around social connections. So yeah, as 0:08:50.720 --> 0:08:54.680 I say, these types of studies are relatively new in 0:08:54.720 --> 0:08:58.400 terms of using longitudinal analyses to I guess, predict what 0:08:58.520 --> 0:09:01.600 factors may prevent these sorts of behaviors. But they're certainly 0:09:01.679 --> 0:09:05.000 a couple of key ones we've been able to identify beforehand, 0:09:05.720 --> 0:09:08.560 and hopefully they will be able to be used to 0:09:08.760 --> 0:09:13.240 inform some targeted prevention strategies to try to, as I say, 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:17.200 minimize the rise of this type of behavior and in 0:09:17.240 --> 0:09:19.040 fact try to reduce it's. 0:09:18.880 --> 0:09:22.839 Importantly, were there any trends around inequality? You know, does 0:09:22.880 --> 0:09:27.959 a person's kind of demographic socioeconomic status does that play 0:09:28.000 --> 0:09:31.079 a role in intimate partner violence or do these findings 0:09:31.160 --> 0:09:34.160 suggest that this is an indiscriminate issue. 0:09:34.480 --> 0:09:35.560 Yeah, look, great question. 0:09:36.400 --> 0:09:39.840 In terms of I guess socio economic factors, we're really 0:09:39.920 --> 0:09:43.400 keen to take a deep dive look at those into 0:09:43.440 --> 0:09:47.480 the future. Decades of research that have identified the key 0:09:47.559 --> 0:09:51.240 roles that some of those factors might play, like also 0:09:51.760 --> 0:09:56.600 relationship issues like previous abuse people might have suffered, like 0:09:56.679 --> 0:10:01.440 alcohol and other drug usage. It's a whole range of issues. Mercifully, 0:10:02.040 --> 0:10:04.440 we have a lot of data around that, so we're 0:10:04.520 --> 0:10:08.960 very keen to sort of explore that further. And as 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:11.160 I mentioned before and in future ways, we'll be trying 0:10:11.200 --> 0:10:14.400 to expand our measures so we can have a comprehensive 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:17.040 view of how these behaviors arise. 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:21.400 What's the path forward now that we have this research. 0:10:21.800 --> 0:10:24.960 What will it mean in terms of supporting men to 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:30.080 develop healthier relationships in their families with their partners, as 0:10:30.080 --> 0:10:34.640 well as encouraging them to seek support to reduce rates 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:37.040 of intimate partner violence. What are the next steps? 0:10:37.320 --> 0:10:39.640 Yeah, Okay, first of all, I've got to acknowledge we 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:42.720 are but one study, and so others will also be 0:10:42.800 --> 0:10:45.880 looking at this area and we'll learn from their approaches 0:10:45.920 --> 0:10:46.400 as well. 0:10:46.640 --> 0:10:49.920 In terms of what we all do. As I mentioned before, we've. 0:10:49.720 --> 0:10:53.280 Just completed our most recent wave, that is, the data 0:10:53.280 --> 0:10:55.880 from that is coming to our fieldwork provider to us, 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:58.400 and so we'll be in a position to start to 0:10:58.440 --> 0:11:00.640 look at these sorts of issues by the end of 0:11:00.640 --> 0:11:04.640 the year, and we'll do so with our friends and 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:09.520 colleagues within government and outside of government. We'll also be 0:11:09.520 --> 0:11:13.400 looking to expand our measures for our next wave and 0:11:13.480 --> 0:11:17.520 hopefully future waves to start to really get to understand 0:11:17.840 --> 0:11:19.960 some of those issues. But I guess, in terms of 0:11:19.960 --> 0:11:22.400 a question around you know, what we do to address 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:25.120 some of these risk factors, like, for instance, mental health, 0:11:25.120 --> 0:11:28.280 where there's a lot of conversations at the moment occurring 0:11:28.280 --> 0:11:31.880 around mental health and specifically men's mental health. 0:11:31.920 --> 0:11:32.840 I think some of. 0:11:32.720 --> 0:11:36.680 Those some of those support services, those interventions are already 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:39.640 in place, and so I guess to some extent the 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:43.720 jury is still out on the effectiveness of those now 0:11:44.240 --> 0:11:47.120 the focus from a research perspective is really focusing on 0:11:47.440 --> 0:11:51.199 what works and making sure that people, when they do 0:11:51.280 --> 0:11:54.400 recognize these sorts of issues, are able to get support 0:11:54.440 --> 0:11:56.640 and able to get appropriate support, and able to get 0:11:56.640 --> 0:11:59.439 time and support to reduce intomate partner violence. 0:12:00.240 --> 0:12:01.360 Also to for. 0:12:01.640 --> 0:12:06.120 Social connection where there's a great range of online and 0:12:06.200 --> 0:12:10.760 other emerging initiatives that men and young men in particular 0:12:11.120 --> 0:12:14.960 can engage with, and likewise for parents. You know, as 0:12:15.000 --> 0:12:20.400 a society, obviously we've shifted to a space where men 0:12:20.800 --> 0:12:23.559 and young men in particular are often the primary caregivers. 0:12:23.760 --> 0:12:26.760 As a government and also other. 0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:29.520 Errors is often not those levels of support that people 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:32.520 and young men need in that critical period of their life, 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:36.280 and that's also sort of emerging as well, So hopefully 0:12:36.360 --> 0:12:39.360 we will start to see the effects of those shortly. 0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:43.480 You've obviously been very deep in the trenches of navigating 0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:47.800 this data, compiling these findings, sharing them with the world. 0:12:48.240 --> 0:12:51.000 Now the report's been out for a few days. What's 0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:54.720 the response been like. Has it surprised you? Have there 0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:57.760 been any sort of key findings that people have really 0:12:57.760 --> 0:12:59.880 paid attention to that you weren't expecting. 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:04.200 It's been a great response, really by and large, I 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:06.920 understand the point of view that this data will be 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:11.800 will be confronting to a lot of people. You know, again, 0:13:11.840 --> 0:13:14.320 there's not much data like this that's out there. These 0:13:14.320 --> 0:13:18.600 are lifetime estimates, so they are naturally higher than say 0:13:18.679 --> 0:13:22.280 annual incident data or data that occurs every sort of 0:13:22.280 --> 0:13:25.000 a couple of years. But nevertheless they're high in our 0:13:25.040 --> 0:13:28.360 reports suggests that they're increasing. So it's a challenge for 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:31.480 us as a sector. It's a challenge for us really 0:13:31.480 --> 0:13:34.559 as a community, is how we address those From a 0:13:34.640 --> 0:13:38.520 government perspective, They've invested very heavily in the National Plan 0:13:38.600 --> 0:13:42.240 to End Violence against Women and Children. My hope and 0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:44.160 the hope of others is this is sort of a 0:13:44.240 --> 0:13:47.520 high water mark and we will start to see those 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:51.160 rates begin to decline with our data and with others 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:54.160 that are sort of coming online shortly. It's obviously, as 0:13:54.280 --> 0:13:57.079 you know, the Prime Minister himself and others have common 0:13:57.120 --> 0:13:59.920 in a bit of what it is a national crist 0:14:00.200 --> 0:14:03.600 so it's spawned a lot of activity. We're very keen 0:14:03.679 --> 0:14:06.640 to continue to learn from others, work collaboratively with others, 0:14:06.920 --> 0:14:11.040 and hopefully ultimately our job is to provide evidence that 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:16.200 can provide targeted intervention to try to reduce the levels 0:14:16.200 --> 0:14:17.080 that we're seeing out there. 0:14:16.920 --> 0:14:17.560 In the community. 0:14:18.360 --> 0:14:21.120 That's all we've got time for today. Thanks to doctor 0:14:21.120 --> 0:14:23.840 Sean Martin for joining us to go through those findings. 0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:27.600 If this episode has raised any concerns for you, help 0:14:27.640 --> 0:14:31.960 is available via Lifeline on thirteen eleven fourteen. For domestic, 0:14:32.120 --> 0:14:37.080 family and sexual violence counseling information and support. Please contact 0:14:37.160 --> 0:14:40.240 one eight hundred Respect on one eight hundred seven three 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:43.040 seven seven three to two or head to one eight 0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:44.880 hundred respect dot org dot au. 0:14:45.120 --> 0:14:47.840 We will pop some resources in the show notes. There'll 0:14:47.840 --> 0:14:50.280 be some links there if you want to learn more 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:52.840 about these support services, and if you'd like to read 0:14:52.880 --> 0:14:55.080 the report that we talked through today, we will also 0:14:55.120 --> 0:14:56.960 pop that in the episode description. 0:14:57.320 --> 0:14:59.119 We'll be back this evening with the headlines. 0:15:03.280 --> 0:15:05.600 My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda 0:15:05.800 --> 0:15:10.600 Bunjelung Calkatin woman from Gadighl Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 0:15:10.680 --> 0:15:12.840 that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 0:15:12.880 --> 0:15:16.480 Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and torrest 0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:17.600 Rate island and nations. 0:15:17.920 --> 0:15:20.840 We pay our respects to the first peoples of these countries, 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:22.160 both past and present,