1
00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:07,160
Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families Podcast. It's the podcast for the.

2
00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:10,119
Speaker 2: Time poor parent who just wants answers.

3
00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:12,440
Speaker 1: Now, it's the Happy Families Podcast.

4
00:00:12,440 --> 00:00:14,840
Speaker 2: Hello, this is doctor Justin Colson, the host and pading

5
00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:19,079
Speaker 2: expert on Channel lines hit TV show Parental Guidance. Season

6
00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:23,120
Speaker 2: two is getting closer. Finally received word from Channel nine.

7
00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:24,880
Speaker 2: It's on the way. I'm not allowed to say more

8
00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:25,919
Speaker 2: than that, but it's on the way.

9
00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:26,720
Speaker 1: It's nearly here.

10
00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:29,240
Speaker 2: Keep your eye out for it. I'm joined today by

11
00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:31,200
Speaker 2: Christine Late and she's filling in for Kylie, who's looking

12
00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:34,080
Speaker 2: after the kids because the school holidays. The podcast continues,

13
00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,880
Speaker 2: but with a new co host. Christine is the ABC

14
00:00:38,080 --> 00:00:42,040
Speaker 2: Perth and Wa afternoon presenter on ABC Radio and a

15
00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:43,839
Speaker 2: mum of a four year old with a new baby

16
00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:45,640
Speaker 2: on the way. Hey Christine, when's the baby arrive?

17
00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:46,680
Speaker 1: Oh?

18
00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:48,760
Speaker 3: When does the baby arrive? So that is a very

19
00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:54,040
Speaker 3: good question, Justin. Look technically, and funnily enough, my son

20
00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:58,120
Speaker 3: is drew on my daughter's birthday. So my obstetrician thinks

21
00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:00,600
Speaker 3: that we bang once a year. That's not case. I

22
00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:03,640
Speaker 3: swear it was just a Christmas thing, so probably you know,

23
00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:06,320
Speaker 3: mid July. We'll see how we go, but he's pretty big.

24
00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:10,000
Speaker 2: Just really, really, are you expecting expecting to push out

25
00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:10,560
Speaker 2: a Heffer hero?

26
00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:12,119
Speaker 1: I am, yes.

27
00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:16,160
Speaker 3: My husband is a Scottish Adonis, very full, very hairy,

28
00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:19,000
Speaker 3: very loving and friendly, looks like Woody from Toy Story,

29
00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:20,559
Speaker 3: so I'm expecting one of the same.

30
00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:23,360
Speaker 2: I hope that when my wife describes me to other people,

31
00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:26,520
Speaker 2: she doesn't say very hairy.

32
00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:30,600
Speaker 3: I mean, I love his hair and when we started

33
00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:32,839
Speaker 3: dating was it was one of the things I love most.

34
00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:35,199
Speaker 3: His smell. You know, I just nuzzled into it. Anyway,

35
00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:40,680
Speaker 3: that's too much speaking of things that make you special

36
00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:45,000
Speaker 3: and discovering your identity. I wanted to ask you today

37
00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:50,040
Speaker 3: how to help my children discover their identity and what

38
00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:53,680
Speaker 3: makes them special because I remember being at school and

39
00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:56,120
Speaker 3: you know, when it was someone's birthday and they were

40
00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:58,640
Speaker 3: made a fuss of I was jealous. And you know,

41
00:01:58,760 --> 00:02:01,000
Speaker 3: if I saw that somebody was really good at sport

42
00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:06,160
Speaker 3: and could hurdle like Shirley, what's said, mate?

43
00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:07,920
Speaker 2: Oh no, I was going to say Temple and then

44
00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:09,320
Speaker 2: I was going to say McClain, but I don't think

45
00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:10,440
Speaker 2: it's either of them.

46
00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:12,880
Speaker 1: Thank you.

47
00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:16,760
Speaker 3: That's pregnant brain for you. I you know, I really

48
00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:19,360
Speaker 3: wanted to find what I was good at, so I

49
00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:22,680
Speaker 3: would like to help my daughter and son do the

50
00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:26,800
Speaker 3: same thing in a very gentle parenting kind of way.

51
00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:29,200
Speaker 3: So how do you start that process?

52
00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:33,839
Speaker 2: Justin all right, So before I answer that question, I

53
00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:38,040
Speaker 2: think that there's something really really important.

54
00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:39,160
Speaker 1: That we need to touch on.

55
00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:42,800
Speaker 2: And I picked this up from the wonderful James Anderson

56
00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:46,440
Speaker 2: in our recent Raising Resilient Kids summit. He talked about

57
00:02:46,480 --> 00:02:49,680
Speaker 2: this extensively. And there's a phrase that you used that

58
00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:52,359
Speaker 2: I've got to come back to. You said, I want

59
00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:54,360
Speaker 2: to find I want to help them to find what

60
00:02:54,440 --> 00:02:56,720
Speaker 2: they're good at. Want to help them find what they're

61
00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:59,079
Speaker 2: good at. And James Anderson said.

62
00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:02,760
Speaker 1: I can hear the neuroticism coming out in you. I

63
00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:06,280
Speaker 1: know what was it wrong? This is what he said.

64
00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,760
Speaker 2: He said, you don't discover your abilities, you create them. Now,

65
00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:11,399
Speaker 2: it's true that there are some people who are born

66
00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:13,480
Speaker 2: with more fast twitch muscle fibers and some with more

67
00:03:13,520 --> 00:03:15,320
Speaker 2: slow twitch muscle fibers. And it's true that there are

68
00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:18,000
Speaker 2: some people who, because of the environments that they're raised in,

69
00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,600
Speaker 2: are surrounded with music or art, or maybe they just

70
00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:25,079
Speaker 2: have something that other kids don't. But what the research

71
00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:28,880
Speaker 2: really clearly shows is that within a pretty short period

72
00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:31,720
Speaker 2: of time, if you don't do much with that innate

73
00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:35,720
Speaker 2: ability that you're born with, that special talent, gift or

74
00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:38,080
Speaker 2: whatever you might want to call it, strength, if you

75
00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:40,440
Speaker 2: don't do much with that other than I don't know,

76
00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:42,960
Speaker 2: do your thing and gloat in the fact that you're

77
00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:44,160
Speaker 2: really good at compared to all.

78
00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:44,960
Speaker 1: Of your classmates.

79
00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:49,480
Speaker 2: Anyone at school who is going to go and put

80
00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:53,840
Speaker 2: the time and effort into creating the ability, they'll probably

81
00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:57,600
Speaker 2: catch up to you and overtake you reasonably quickly if

82
00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:00,840
Speaker 2: you don't go and do the work yourself. And so

83
00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:04,720
Speaker 2: we don't find what we're good at, we create it.

84
00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:08,200
Speaker 2: And I really really like that idea.

85
00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:11,520
Speaker 3: I should have been teaching her piano from the age

86
00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:14,400
Speaker 3: of three, giving.

87
00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:16,520
Speaker 1: A right.

88
00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:23,520
Speaker 3: I see what she enjoys, you know, And obviously this

89
00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:26,479
Speaker 3: is very early days. I'm very much just trying to

90
00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:29,000
Speaker 3: think how I can support them like my dad supported me,

91
00:04:29,320 --> 00:04:32,159
Speaker 3: you know. I he could see that I loved playing

92
00:04:32,200 --> 00:04:34,240
Speaker 3: the recorder, and he was like, this is torturous. We'll

93
00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:36,800
Speaker 3: get her a clarinet. And so he got me a clarinet,

94
00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:40,080
Speaker 3: and then he would drive me to music rehearsals at

95
00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:43,000
Speaker 3: seven am every single day. I was in jazz band,

96
00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:47,360
Speaker 3: concert band, quiet clarinet ensemble, sax ensemble, and he obviously

97
00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:50,280
Speaker 3: saw that I really loved it, and so he facilitated

98
00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:53,520
Speaker 3: that that learning process for me. So I guess I

99
00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:55,280
Speaker 3: want to be able to do the same thing for

100
00:04:55,320 --> 00:05:00,120
Speaker 3: her without putting my loves and my own hobbies and

101
00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:01,000
Speaker 3: and loves on to her.

102
00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:03,279
Speaker 1: If that makes sense, Yeah, it does. So let's just

103
00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:05,120
Speaker 1: let's unpack that a little bit as well. Though.

104
00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:08,680
Speaker 2: There are three reasons that kids are going to be

105
00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:12,000
Speaker 2: drawn to and probably more than this, but my big three.

106
00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:14,880
Speaker 2: Even if they've got whether they have an innate natural

107
00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:17,040
Speaker 2: ability for something or not, kids are going to be

108
00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:21,760
Speaker 2: drawn to things that they do well. So just by

109
00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:24,000
Speaker 2: virtue of the fact that you can do something well,

110
00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:30,159
Speaker 2: whether it's playing Fortnite or playing the recorder or surfing, swimming, running, whatever, kids.

111
00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:37,320
Speaker 2: We call this our We call it a performance goal orientation.

112
00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:41,240
Speaker 2: And we can have one of two orientations to performance goals. Okay,

113
00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:45,400
Speaker 2: the first orientation to a performance goal is an approach orientation.

114
00:05:46,040 --> 00:05:51,359
Speaker 2: We approach performance goals when we know we can do

115
00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:54,400
Speaker 2: them well, and we avoid The second one is the

116
00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:57,200
Speaker 2: avoidant orientation, which is, if I know that I'm going

117
00:05:57,279 --> 00:05:59,680
Speaker 2: to look incompetent, I'm not going to do it. You

118
00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:01,640
Speaker 2: know that thing where who's going to stand up and

119
00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:04,520
Speaker 2: give the talk in school, who's going to do that

120
00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:07,800
Speaker 2: thing on assembly? Who's going to be the volunteer in

121
00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,960
Speaker 2: pe class to do that new skill that we're learning.

122
00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:13,840
Speaker 2: And the people who step forward, they're the ones who

123
00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:15,320
Speaker 2: already know how to do it and they can do

124
00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:17,720
Speaker 2: it competently. The rest of us we all used to

125
00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:19,280
Speaker 2: hide in the corner and get as far away from

126
00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:22,040
Speaker 2: the teacher as we could. We would avoid, like the plague,

127
00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:25,200
Speaker 2: anything that would make us look incompetent. So when we're

128
00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:27,839
Speaker 2: talking about your little Bonnie at four years old, she

129
00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:30,719
Speaker 2: will be Actually, there's something beautiful about four year olds.

130
00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:31,880
Speaker 1: They're pretty much more.

131
00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:34,160
Speaker 2: They're drawn to anything. They don't care if they're incompetent

132
00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:35,840
Speaker 2: or not. They just like, yes, let me add it.

133
00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:39,040
Speaker 2: I want to attack the world and figure it all out.

134
00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:41,600
Speaker 2: I want to assimilate every bit of knowledge that I

135
00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:43,640
Speaker 2: can about everything in my brain. But by the time

136
00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:45,719
Speaker 2: they start to get to about I don't know, let's

137
00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:49,520
Speaker 2: say six seven, definitely eight or nine, there's this thing,

138
00:06:49,880 --> 00:06:52,440
Speaker 2: this social comparison starts to come up. They become aware

139
00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:55,000
Speaker 2: that other people are looking at them, making judgments about them,

140
00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:58,880
Speaker 2: comparing themselves to others. When that comes in, we see

141
00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:05,599
Speaker 2: this ori, this goal orientation shift from approaching to avoiding,

142
00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:10,280
Speaker 2: and that that's devastating for our kids. So competence is

143
00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:13,239
Speaker 2: a big driver. Once our kids get to about seven

144
00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:15,320
Speaker 2: or eight, certainly nine or ten, the confidence is a

145
00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:18,200
Speaker 2: big driver of what they'll move towards, what they'll try

146
00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:22,120
Speaker 2: and do. The next big driver is relationships. So if

147
00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:24,360
Speaker 2: you want your kids to do well, it's something they've

148
00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:26,080
Speaker 2: got to be around people they loved, Like how much

149
00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:27,280
Speaker 2: did you love your band mates?

150
00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:30,240
Speaker 3: Oh? I loved them, Yeah, And we have so much

151
00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:32,640
Speaker 3: fun on the bus on the way to concerts. Oh,

152
00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:36,480
Speaker 3: you are absolutely right. That was at least fifty percent

153
00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:37,000
Speaker 3: of it for me.

154
00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:39,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and for a lot of kids it's even more.

155
00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:41,040
Speaker 2: For a lot of kids, they only do the thing

156
00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:45,200
Speaker 2: that they're doing because of their friends. And there's a

157
00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:46,520
Speaker 2: handful of things that I used to do when I

158
00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:48,720
Speaker 2: was a kid, and I only did it because my

159
00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:51,120
Speaker 2: friends were there. And there were some things that I

160
00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:53,840
Speaker 2: did as a kid where I was quite competent, but

161
00:07:53,920 --> 00:07:57,760
Speaker 2: I had no relationships, and because the relationships didn't exist,

162
00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:02,000
Speaker 2: I pulled out, I backed away, wouldn't be involved in it.

163
00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:05,720
Speaker 2: And so there's relationships, but there's also that last bit.

164
00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:08,560
Speaker 2: And this taps into what you were talking about before

165
00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:11,120
Speaker 2: with trying to push the kids into this thing or that.

166
00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:13,680
Speaker 2: And you made that comment where you said that you

167
00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:15,440
Speaker 2: really want to make sure that she's doing things that

168
00:08:15,480 --> 00:08:16,920
Speaker 2: she wants to do and not the things that you

169
00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,440
Speaker 2: want her to do. This where autonomy comes in. Now

170
00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:22,760
Speaker 2: I'm going to say something really provocative. I don't think

171
00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:24,640
Speaker 2: that it matters if you want her to do it

172
00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:26,760
Speaker 2: or not. Like, if you want her to do it

173
00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:29,720
Speaker 2: and she learns to be competent at it, and her

174
00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:33,320
Speaker 2: relationship with you builds and she's feeling like she enjoys

175
00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:35,360
Speaker 2: it so much that she doesn't want to stop doing it,

176
00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:40,160
Speaker 2: then to me, that's fine because she's internalized the same

177
00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:42,600
Speaker 2: love for that thing that you have. I'll give you

178
00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:45,400
Speaker 2: a case in point surfing. Surfing.

179
00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:49,120
Speaker 1: Yes, I just love surfing, and I have.

180
00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:52,680
Speaker 2: Some children who are just frankly not that enthusiastic about surfing,

181
00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:54,440
Speaker 2: and it pains me because I want to go surfing

182
00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:55,920
Speaker 2: with my daughters. I want to get them out of

183
00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:59,040
Speaker 2: the water. But something has happened. As I have forced

184
00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:01,920
Speaker 2: them into situations that they don't necessarily want to be in,

185
00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:05,200
Speaker 2: They've started to actually really love number one, being with me,

186
00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:08,040
Speaker 2: But number two, they've started to develop competence in the

187
00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:10,959
Speaker 2: water on that surfboard, and they've started to enjoy surfing

188
00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:13,120
Speaker 2: for its own sake, to the point now where a

189
00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:14,679
Speaker 2: couple of the kids will grab the boards and go

190
00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:17,720
Speaker 2: to the beach without me and oh, I mean, they're

191
00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:21,160
Speaker 2: still terribly incompetent, but they've found a love of the

192
00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:24,720
Speaker 2: water and a love of surfing independent of me. Now,

193
00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:27,600
Speaker 2: the central thing here is you've got to be careful

194
00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:29,360
Speaker 2: how long you pull out the whip and crack it

195
00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:31,240
Speaker 2: and drive the kids into the water, or drive the

196
00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:33,839
Speaker 2: kids to that musical instrument or that thing that you

197
00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:36,800
Speaker 2: care about so much. You've got to really listen to

198
00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:39,600
Speaker 2: the kids as well. Cycling was my other passion, and

199
00:09:39,640 --> 00:09:41,480
Speaker 2: one of my kids came along with the velodrome and

200
00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:43,320
Speaker 2: we bought her a bike and spent all the money

201
00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:44,920
Speaker 2: and after four weeks she was like, yeah, I actually

202
00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:45,319
Speaker 2: hate this.

203
00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:47,679
Speaker 1: That was an expensive.

204
00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:51,320
Speaker 2: It was a really costly exercise for us. But again

205
00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:53,600
Speaker 2: we didn't want to drive because she had no relationships there.

206
00:09:53,640 --> 00:09:56,440
Speaker 2: She felt completely incompetent, like she was. They were wiping

207
00:09:56,480 --> 00:10:00,079
Speaker 2: the floor with her. It was terrible and mostly I

208
00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:03,120
Speaker 2: was every Friday night for track night at the Veldroma

209
00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:04,600
Speaker 2: was like, you need to come down here. I've spent

210
00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:06,640
Speaker 2: all this money. I'm demanding that you do it. And

211
00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:09,079
Speaker 2: she had no autonomy, so those needs weren't being there.

212
00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:15,160
Speaker 3: You know, it's really interesting justin three interviews spring to

213
00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:19,000
Speaker 3: mind from recently. I interviewed the Doobie Brothers, I interviewed

214
00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:22,760
Speaker 3: Sting's son, Joe Sumner, and I interviewed James Morrison, the

215
00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:26,800
Speaker 3: famous jazz trumpeter. Wow, and this came up. This came

216
00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:28,680
Speaker 3: up with each of them, and I didn't actually bring

217
00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:32,000
Speaker 3: it up. Now. Obviously with Sting's son, he is a musician,

218
00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:35,320
Speaker 3: but he's doing it differently, right, He's taken the music,

219
00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:37,280
Speaker 3: he loves the music. He's got that from his dad.

220
00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:40,679
Speaker 3: But he's going to be a present father. James Morrison's sons,

221
00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:44,000
Speaker 3: two of them, William and Harry, are in his court

222
00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:47,800
Speaker 3: hit right. But he said to me that he very

223
00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:50,640
Speaker 3: much played good music around the house, but left them

224
00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:53,480
Speaker 3: to it. He'd hear them in the garage making mistakes,

225
00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:57,120
Speaker 3: you know, screwing up chords and it killed him. But

226
00:10:57,240 --> 00:10:59,640
Speaker 3: he didn't go in, and he waited for them to

227
00:10:59,640 --> 00:11:02,040
Speaker 3: come to him, and he said that worked. But when

228
00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:04,760
Speaker 3: it came to putting them in the quartet travel around

229
00:11:04,760 --> 00:11:07,360
Speaker 3: the country, he waited until they were more than ready.

230
00:11:07,559 --> 00:11:10,400
Speaker 3: So I found it really interesting just from a musical

231
00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:14,200
Speaker 3: point of view, the different stars I guess they are,

232
00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:17,320
Speaker 3: and how they broached this. And similarly with the Doobie brothers,

233
00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:21,400
Speaker 3: Pat Simmons, his son Pat Simmons Junior also went into

234
00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:24,400
Speaker 3: music is recording, but is very much more about the family.

235
00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:26,360
Speaker 3: So isn't that an interesting thing?

236
00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:30,679
Speaker 2: I love the alignment and there's such great, great examples.

237
00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:34,880
Speaker 2: I just really really love that, especially the masterful James

238
00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:38,720
Speaker 2: Morrison saying I didn't go and correct them. I waited

239
00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:43,200
Speaker 2: for them to come to me. Oh like just perfect, perfect,

240
00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:45,520
Speaker 2: perfect perfect. Now I've got one more question for you,

241
00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,760
Speaker 2: because this is this is ultimately what are my kids

242
00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:49,920
Speaker 2: going to be good at? How do I help them

243
00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:52,080
Speaker 2: to establish an identity? I think the first word that

244
00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:55,400
Speaker 2: you used when we started this conversation was identity, and

245
00:11:56,200 --> 00:11:58,560
Speaker 2: I just want to make one, I guess one last

246
00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:01,679
Speaker 2: point by asking you a question, how old were you

247
00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:05,640
Speaker 2: before you feel like you had your identity dialed in,

248
00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:07,280
Speaker 2: like you felt like you knew who you were?

249
00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:12,400
Speaker 3: Thirty? Yeah, Dean serious, thirty.

250
00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:15,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I would actually say forty for me, Yeah,

251
00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:18,920
Speaker 2: I mean we're growing. Our identity is becoming increasingly firm

252
00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:21,719
Speaker 2: and consolidated over time, and I'm even finding in my

253
00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:25,600
Speaker 2: last decade of life that I'm seeing my identity shift

254
00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:28,920
Speaker 2: further and grow more and develop in ways that for

255
00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:31,040
Speaker 2: the most part, I'm really thrilled about every now and

256
00:12:31,080 --> 00:12:33,000
Speaker 2: again in ways that I don't love as well. But

257
00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:38,160
Speaker 2: identity is not set and it takes a long time

258
00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:41,079
Speaker 2: to develop. So when you ask that first question, how

259
00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:43,640
Speaker 2: do I help my daughter to develop her identity? I

260
00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:47,280
Speaker 2: think it's super important that we emphasize the developmental nature

261
00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:50,880
Speaker 2: of identity and that children who are under about the

262
00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:55,160
Speaker 2: age of I'm going to say, eleven, twelve, thirteen, don't

263
00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:57,800
Speaker 2: tend to be thinking very much at all. Certainly under

264
00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:00,680
Speaker 2: the age of ten, they're not thinking wh am, I like,

265
00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,080
Speaker 2: they don't have an existential crisis as a ten year

266
00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:05,360
Speaker 2: old or an eight year old going oh, I'm not

267
00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:07,000
Speaker 2: sure that this is consistent with who I am and

268
00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:10,600
Speaker 2: my value is. They don't even think about it. We

269
00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:13,520
Speaker 2: know from good research that it's during the adolescent years

270
00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:17,560
Speaker 2: that identity development really really takes off. That's when it

271
00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:20,480
Speaker 2: all kind of kicks off and we start to get

272
00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:22,400
Speaker 2: a really strong sense of who we are. If we've

273
00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:24,920
Speaker 2: had healthy identity development by the time we're in our

274
00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:28,120
Speaker 2: late teens to early twenties, but by no means that

275
00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:30,600
Speaker 2: we have finished product. It's not until, as you said,

276
00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:33,920
Speaker 2: our late twenties, sometimes our thirties, sometimes even our forties

277
00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:36,960
Speaker 2: where we finally say, Okay, I know who I am,

278
00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:39,800
Speaker 2: I know my voice, I know what I'm about. Oh.

279
00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:42,120
Speaker 2: This interview just recently with Harrison Ford, he's in that

280
00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:47,080
Speaker 2: new Apple TV show Shrinking Yes, and he, with a

281
00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:51,079
Speaker 2: number of expletives thrown in, Harrison Ford basically said I'm

282
00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:54,200
Speaker 2: eighty years old, I know who I am.

283
00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:55,880
Speaker 1: And I just remember the.

284
00:13:55,840 --> 00:13:59,000
Speaker 2: Power of the statement as he said it, I know

285
00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:01,920
Speaker 2: who I am. You don't get too many teenagers looking

286
00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:04,040
Speaker 2: you in the eye and saying I know who I am.

287
00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:04,880
Speaker 3: Oh.

288
00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:07,040
Speaker 2: That's something that comes later in life.

289
00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:13,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, it does much later, hence my very long pause.

290
00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:17,439
Speaker 3: That is such a good point, and so I suppose

291
00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,200
Speaker 3: I will just support her as best I can and

292
00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:21,760
Speaker 3: have fun in the meantime.

293
00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:23,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, don't don't rush it.

294
00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:26,600
Speaker 2: And remember you don't discover your abilities or your identity,

295
00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:28,880
Speaker 2: you create them.

296
00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:30,360
Speaker 1: Boom. How's that?

297
00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:31,840
Speaker 3: Oh deep?

298
00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:32,760
Speaker 1: It's so deep.

299
00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:36,640
Speaker 2: Well, we tackle the big stuff on the Happy Families podcast.

300
00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:38,040
Speaker 1: Hey, Christine, thanks for joining me.

301
00:14:38,080 --> 00:14:41,360
Speaker 2: Let's do one more tomorrow if you're up for another chat,

302
00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:43,520
Speaker 2: because these have been there's been really delightful.

303
00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:44,600
Speaker 1: It's been so much fun to have you on.

304
00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,480
Speaker 3: I would love it. Justin see you tomorrow, Okay.

305
00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:49,680
Speaker 2: The Happy Family's podcast is produced by Justin Rawan for

306
00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:52,680
Speaker 2: Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer and yeah,

307
00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:53,680
Speaker 2: back tomorrow with more.

308
00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:54,280
Speaker 1: If you'd like more.

309
00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:56,360
Speaker 2: Information about making your family happy, please visit us at

310
00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:57,800
Speaker 2: happy families dot com dot a you.

311
00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:01,200
Speaker 1: He knows the