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Speaker 1: Joining me on the line right now is Dave Hayes,

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Speaker 1: the president of unions here in the Northern Territory. Good

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Speaker 1: morning to you, Strawbes.

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Speaker 2: Good morning Katie.

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Speaker 1: Now, mate, tell us where things are aunt at the

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Speaker 1: moment when it comes to the pay negotiations for public servants.

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Speaker 2: So look, Katy, it's all happening at the moment. Obviously,

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Speaker 2: on the fifth of October, the government announced the frosting

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Speaker 2: of the wage freeze, which we welcome, but unfortunately that

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Speaker 2: doesn't go far enough with the two percent that's been

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Speaker 2: often and he's on the table and our members are

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Speaker 2: pretty angry about that, and they're continuing in protect the

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Speaker 2: industrial action across many parts of the Northern Territory public

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Speaker 2: service at the moment, and so.

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Speaker 1: They are considering further industrial action, which I guess which

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Speaker 1: unions are we talking about, a which sectors are we

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Speaker 1: talking about? And when could that industrial action kick off?

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Speaker 2: So there's quite a number at the moment, Katie. So

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Speaker 2: there's there's ongoing action that's currently been taken across corrections,

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Speaker 2: fire is powerwater, t GEN and the teachers. But we're

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Speaker 2: also looking at a day of action next week on Thursday,

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Speaker 2: the seven eighth where we'll be out in our numbers

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Speaker 2: sending the government the message that two percent is and

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Speaker 2: just isn't going to cover it.

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Speaker 1: So Thursday next week looking at another day of action,

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Speaker 1: will that mean that for schools, for example, that the

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Speaker 1: teachers will be striking.

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Speaker 2: So with the teachers, Katie just they're waiting on some

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Speaker 2: correspondence from the OCP over the next couple of days, yep.

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Speaker 2: But they've definitely put in their notice of action. Whether

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Speaker 2: they take that or not as yet to be decided

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Speaker 2: for the teachers. But I can guarantee you that correction, power,

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Speaker 2: water and TGen they'll be adding great numbers to push

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Speaker 2: the government and let the government know that the two

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Speaker 2: percent isn't enough.

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Speaker 1: What's that going to mean to the wider community in

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Speaker 1: terms of disruption to there, you know, to the services

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Speaker 1: that they all provide.

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Speaker 2: Well, Katie, we always ensure that we have call out

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Speaker 2: through and those sort of people available. So in relation

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Speaker 2: to power, water and t Gen, power will still be supplied,

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Speaker 2: the power will still be on and any faults will

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Speaker 2: be attended to. But the general deception will go to developers, contractors,

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Speaker 2: all the works that get done day today, they'll all

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Speaker 2: be coming to a whole now, I mean.

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Speaker 1: Is what's the concern here from these public service workers?

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Speaker 1: Because I know a lot of people listening this morning

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Speaker 1: that maybe work in the private sector, They're going to

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Speaker 1: be thinking to themselves, Hey, two percent and a change

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Speaker 1: to some of those conditions. I'd take that. I can't

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Speaker 1: get that at this point in time from my own workplace.

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Speaker 1: So what exactly are they after?

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Speaker 2: Look, Katie, we want to package the addresses the cost

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Speaker 2: of living concerns that everyone's currently under facing. And governments

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Speaker 2: have to lead in this space. If the governments lead

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Speaker 2: and get wages and conditions up, the private sector follows.

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Speaker 2: And we need just people to understand that this has

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Speaker 2: to happen. The public sector is the biggest employer in

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Speaker 2: the Northern Territory and it leads leads the wages and

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Speaker 2: conditions that are paid around the place. So our members

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Speaker 2: are looking for a package that addresses those concerns, and

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Speaker 2: two percent at this point in time just doesn't even

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Speaker 2: go close. And you know, if you look at c

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Speaker 2: dou at the moment they're about to go to the

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Speaker 2: vote next week, they're offering a four percent increase in

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Speaker 2: the first year and then two two percent after that,

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Speaker 2: that'll be a no vote that occurs out there at

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Speaker 2: c DOU. All the members out there are going to vote. Know,

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Speaker 2: it just doesn't address the concerns of cost of living

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Speaker 2: over the coming years.

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Speaker 1: Where's the government going to find the money? Those straws,

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Speaker 1: I mean, they broke, Katie.

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Speaker 2: We've been here before and we've had these conversations before.

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Speaker 2: The government needs to look in at our agencies with

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Speaker 2: the use of consultants and contractors and the amount of

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Speaker 2: money that's being wasted. And I think you could speak

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Speaker 2: to anyone in the public service and they would know

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Speaker 2: there is many areas that can be tightened up. We've

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Speaker 2: got so much money going in a state. We've got

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Speaker 2: people working out of inner state offices and all that

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Speaker 2: money is not going into the territory. We've got contractors

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Speaker 2: coming in performing big bodies of work. All that money

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Speaker 2: goes out of the territory. If they have a good

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Speaker 2: hard look at this public service, there can be big

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Speaker 2: benefits for the Northern Territory and big benefits for the

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Speaker 2: population of the Northern Territory and get this place run

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Speaker 2: and properly.

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Speaker 1: That's actually a point that I reckon a lot of

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Speaker 1: people would probably be surprised by is that there is

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Speaker 1: consultancy work that happens interstate. There are different people that

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Speaker 1: are flywn in at different times. I mean, do we

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Speaker 1: have any idea you know, how much that is costing

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Speaker 1: the Northern Territory government or just how many consultants are

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Speaker 1: being employed across the board.

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Speaker 2: Look, Katie, we can't get we can't get absolute numbers

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Speaker 2: on that, but I always say the way I described

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Speaker 2: is they're run on two sets of books. They're running

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Speaker 2: a set of books that people can see with the

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Speaker 2: public service, and there's another set of books that really

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Speaker 2: that money just goes out of the territory. And if

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Speaker 2: that was really looked into and dived into, there was

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Speaker 2: offsets and benefs available in every sector where we can

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Speaker 2: I move that back into the public service itself and

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Speaker 2: that money will stay in the territory. I just can't

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Speaker 2: believe it's still going on and we're having these conversations

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Speaker 2: probably two years after they started in this bargaining process,

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Speaker 2: and no one's doing you know, no one's doing a

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Speaker 2: big body of work. And some of that work has

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Speaker 2: been done and no one's acting on it.

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Speaker 1: That's the problem now, Dave Hayes, I'm pretty sure tomorrow

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Speaker 1: for the week that was, I've got Paul Kirby on

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Speaker 1: the show. What is your message for him when it

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Speaker 1: comes to this public sector well wage kind of you know,

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Speaker 1: discussion or negotiation that continues on Katie.

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Speaker 2: Look, we've still got ten agreements that are outstanding. There

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Speaker 2: needs to be an urgency from government to get these

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Speaker 2: agreements solved. We're now we've had our first meetings last

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Speaker 2: week after the announcement of the new wages policy or

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Speaker 2: the bargaining policy. We are now you know, we're meeting

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Speaker 2: two weeks in two weeks time, we're meeting again with

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Speaker 2: the OC. Where's the urgency. Let's get together, let's get

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Speaker 2: in a room, let's bash it out, and let's get

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Speaker 2: a result for people with the Northern Territory and things

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Speaker 2: moving and emergency in the process.

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Speaker 1: It's the problem here is as well. You know, we're

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Speaker 1: only a few weeks away from school finishing for the year.

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Speaker 1: So for areas like education, you need to make sure

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Speaker 1: that this is locked in so that we can ensure

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Speaker 1: that teachers are coming back next year.

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Speaker 2: Right, Absolutely correct, Ky, So by mid next week, the

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Speaker 2: teachers or the AEU needs a decision so that they're

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Speaker 2: teachers given that the time it is in the term,

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Speaker 2: in the school year, so they can make a decision

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Speaker 2: about next year about what they're going to do. So

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Speaker 2: the government needs to really get down the business, especially

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Speaker 2: with the teachers, to get that deal done and get

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Speaker 2: a good offer on the table that will be accepted.

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Speaker 2: And it can't have twos in it, Katie, It's just

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Speaker 2: not going to be accepted by the members. We've been

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Speaker 2: up and down the track all the unions in the

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Speaker 2: last few weeks and as a long there's allowed and

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Speaker 2: clear message from our membership that nitthing with two percents

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Speaker 2: in it isn't even close and we need to get

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Speaker 2: packages together that they are going to keep people in

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Speaker 2: the territory and keep people working hard to whether it

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Speaker 2: be education, whether it be care, whether it be pound water,

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Speaker 2: central services, by these corrections, all those areas, we need

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Speaker 2: to get good deals to keep people in the Northern Territory, Katie.

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Speaker 2: Yesterday in the paper there was we're looking at the

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Speaker 2: three hundred thousand dollars three hundred thousand people population by

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Speaker 2: twenty thirty. How are we going to possibly do that

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Speaker 2: when we can't even pay the people who are here,

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Speaker 2: they're going to going out in droves.

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Speaker 1: Well, I can't understand. I can't understand how the government

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Speaker 1: thinks that they're going to grow the population at this

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Speaker 1: point in time, you know, when they've got the issues

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Speaker 1: that they're currently dealing with. So I think that that's

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Speaker 1: a fair point for you to make, particularly, you know,

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Speaker 1: when public servants in other states and territories there's no

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Speaker 1: doubt that they're getting better payoffers Storbes. I know though

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Speaker 1: that there's going to be people listening this morning who

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Speaker 1: are thinking public servants are being greedy?

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Speaker 2: Are they? They're not, Katie, As I said, governments leave everyone.

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Speaker 2: That doesn't matter. If you're a public service worker. In

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Speaker 2: the private sector, you are copping the cost of living increases,

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Speaker 2: you cop on the home lines going up. Everyone's in

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Speaker 2: a similar boat. Not all public servants are highly paid.

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Speaker 2: There's a vas vast majority that are a load of

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Speaker 2: middle income earners and so everyone's feeling it.

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Speaker 1: Caatie, is it time for us to relook at as

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Speaker 1: well the number of executive level contracts that there are

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Speaker 1: within the Northern Territory government.

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Speaker 2: Kay, We've been beating that drum for a couple for

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Speaker 2: years that needs a big shakeup. In our opinion, if

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Speaker 2: you look at somewhere like Pound Water, you've got sixty

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Speaker 2: percent in business support, you've got forty percent on the ground.

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Speaker 2: It should be the other way around. Your boots on

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Speaker 2: the ground should be up around the sixty percent and

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Speaker 2: your business support unit should be thirty to forty percent.

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Speaker 2: It's just all upside down in so many areas in

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Speaker 2: this in this public service, and it needs a good shakeup.

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Speaker 1: Well, Dave Hayes, Union z NT President, I appreciate your

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Speaker 1: time this morning. Thanks so much for chatting with us.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for very interest. Katie