Speaker 1: This podcast is brought to you by on Track Studio.
Speaker 2: Welcome to Yarning Up, the podcast that showcases First Nations
Speaker 2: stories and conversations to help us learn and unlearn Australia's
Speaker 2: history to work towards a better future. I'm your host,
Speaker 2: proud barber woman and founder of Black Waddel Coaching and Consulting,
Speaker 2: Caroline cow. We acknowledge the rundery people and elders where
Speaker 2: this podcast is taped, but we also acknowledge the lands
Speaker 2: that you are listening in from today. It always was
Speaker 2: and always will be unseated aboriginal and tourist Red islander Land.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Yarning Up, You Mob. Today, I have
Speaker 2: the honor of sitting down with an exceptionally multi faceted,
Speaker 2: multi talented creative artists, producer, someone who's making waves in community,
Speaker 2: bringing traditional cultural practices to our mainstream stages in many,
Speaker 2: many facets. So I'm so excited to introduce you to
Speaker 2: my next guest, Grace Lillian Lee. Welcome to Yarning Out.
Speaker 3: Hi, Caroline, thank you so much for having me and
Speaker 3: thank you for such a lovely introduction.
Speaker 2: Now it strikes me looking where you're dialing in from.
Speaker 2: You kind of look like you might actually be in
Speaker 2: a factory warehouse designed space lair. Where are you joining
Speaker 2: us from today?
Speaker 3: I'm calling you from Gimoy Country in far North Queensland,
Speaker 3: Cans and we're in our.
Speaker 4: Faith that we call the Hub at the moment.
Speaker 3: It's a bit of a shed space between First Nations
Speaker 3: fashion and design and also my own practice.
Speaker 2: How wonderful. My family is from Mathoden, Innisfaul for about
Speaker 2: forty minutes from Goomoy, So yeah, it's beautiful country up.
Speaker 3: There, beautiful and like it's a bit cold here at
Speaker 3: the moment, which is only like a couple of degrees
Speaker 3: less than usual, and we were all wearing jumpers, so
Speaker 3: we're happy about that. But I'm pretty sure it's like
Speaker 3: twenty four degrees but we're cold.
Speaker 2: It's certainly getting very very icy here in Melbourne, which
Speaker 2: is a good excuse to just nestle up and suit
Speaker 2: season and hibernation. Yeah, as we do on this show,
Speaker 2: we always like to start to get to know a
Speaker 2: bit about you and your personal story.
Speaker 3: So I'm a local cans girl, born and bred, but
Speaker 3: I in twenty ten I took my grandmother back to
Speaker 3: the Torres Straits where she hadn't been for forty seven years,
Speaker 3: and this for me was a big part of my
Speaker 3: learnings and my connecting.
Speaker 4: To who I am and where I come from.
Speaker 3: For me, at that time, I was studying fashion, and
Speaker 3: the best way I knew how to react and respond
Speaker 3: to this was through design and creation, and I was
Speaker 3: really fortunate that some of my elders taught me how
Speaker 3: to weave and really embrace me in knowing more about
Speaker 3: my culture and my identity, which was something that it
Speaker 3: wasn't a privilege I guess of my father's upbringing because
Speaker 3: of the time that my grandmother there was just a
Speaker 3: different time back in those days. It's something for me
Speaker 3: that I felt I really needed to take the reins
Speaker 3: and I wanted to be proud of that, and I
Speaker 3: really wanted to share that through what I knew best,
Speaker 3: and that was through fashion.
Speaker 4: I guess that's how this all started for me.
Speaker 3: It was questions that I wanted answered, and I definitely
Speaker 3: wanted to know more about where I come from and
Speaker 3: what that meant to me and my family and my ancestors.
Speaker 4: Basically, so this has been.
Speaker 3: A big journey because I guess it steered me into
Speaker 3: places I never had a I would go because I
Speaker 3: was able to be proud of who I am. I
Speaker 3: think I was embraced into other communities to support their
Speaker 3: narratives to be shown through fashion. That's how the fashion
Speaker 3: performances began, and I guess why I kind of called
Speaker 3: myself a curator of fashion performances, which started in twenty
Speaker 3: thirteens at the cans In Digenous out there just kind
Speaker 3: of grew from there.
Speaker 2: It's nice to get an insight into where we all are.
Speaker 2: You know, we all have different cultural journeys as well,
Speaker 2: and it's beautiful to hear that, you know, while you
Speaker 2: were studying and doing your doctorate in design and fashion,
Speaker 2: that you were able to go home and connect with
Speaker 2: your people. The Tori Strade Islanders. I understand you're from
Speaker 2: the Miriam Mayor people.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so where a part of the eastern islands of
Speaker 3: the Torres Strait. My father was born on Thursday Island,
Speaker 3: but my grandmother came from Murray Islands. I haven't, unfortunately
Speaker 3: been to Murray Island, have been to Arab which is
Speaker 3: very close, but it's definitely one of my dreams that
Speaker 3: I have to do and as a life goal to
Speaker 3: go back to Murray Island, but we just got back
Speaker 3: from TI. We were up at Horn and Thursday Island,
Speaker 3: just reconnecting with family, and I think it's something that
Speaker 3: I need to spend more time up there, you know,
Speaker 3: when you're home, and I think I definitely want to
Speaker 3: spend more time and be with my dad as well.
Speaker 3: To bring him up there as well. I think will
Speaker 3: be really a good journey to continue.
Speaker 2: We sort of have this sort of philosophy at our work,
Speaker 2: Black Waddel that you know, country and being with our
Speaker 2: elders is really our greatest teacher, our greatest guide, our
Speaker 2: greatest mentors, and so yeah, to be able to go
Speaker 2: back and to share that with your family, and I
Speaker 2: guess to draw strength and knowledge from your tourist right
Speaker 2: island a heritage into your creative pursuits and working with
Speaker 2: First Nations community for this explosion at First Nation Fashion
Speaker 2: and Design, which is really exciting. Is beautiful to see
Speaker 2: this amalgamation of your journey professionally and culturally. With that
Speaker 2: in mind, I'm wondering if maybe we start there in
Speaker 2: thinking about, yeah, what it is you've learned in going home,
Speaker 2: and I'd love to sort of unpack what the grasshopper
Speaker 2: weave technique is I'm wondering if you could share with
Speaker 2: our listeners. Yeah, some of the things and learnings that
Speaker 2: you have learnt in your cultural practices, and then how
Speaker 2: it is you've been able to transcend those traditional weaving
Speaker 2: and those traditional stories into First Nations design.
Speaker 3: So it was in two thousand and ten when I
Speaker 3: started weaving because I connected with an elder of mine,
Speaker 3: uncle Ken Thaday, who really took me under his wing.
Speaker 3: He saw something in me that I guess I don't
Speaker 3: know if I saw it in myself, but he was
Speaker 3: very encouraging of me to pursue knowing more about my
Speaker 3: culture but seeing it through fashion because at the time,
Speaker 3: I was in my final year of fashion design. And
Speaker 3: he has been this cultural beacon in my life and
Speaker 3: I'm very grateful that he's still here and he's still
Speaker 3: very supportive of everything that I'm doing, and he's definitely
Speaker 3: a guide for me. So he taught me this weaving
Speaker 3: technique and it's commonly done with coconut palm fronds as
Speaker 3: ornamental decoration for celebration.
Speaker 4: Generally that you make the fish.
Speaker 3: And grasshoppers, and they're just like the basic things you
Speaker 3: learn as children, and I wanted to see what that
Speaker 3: looked like through a different fabrication, and I started playing
Speaker 3: and using different materials and exploring all the different weaves
Speaker 3: with different fabrications, but realizing that there was something truly
Speaker 3: special about the grasshopper and that the repetition of this technique,
Speaker 3: this simple technique of the belly of the grasshopper, it
Speaker 3: was something I wanted to continue doing. And so I
Speaker 3: started making these lengths and realized that it was something
Speaker 3: quite malneable that I could put on the body, and
Speaker 3: it grew from there. It took a couple of years
Speaker 3: to get to the point where I was like I
Speaker 3: realized it could be an adornment, because before it was
Speaker 3: more a part of the whole body and at fashion
Speaker 3: where like exploring what that looks like. I didn't realize
Speaker 3: that this simple, humble technique would really catapult me into
Speaker 3: a place that, again, I could have never imagined for myself.
Speaker 3: Because for me, not only is it about that the
Speaker 3: beauty of the technique and how tactile and how it moves,
Speaker 3: but the reality of it is more that it was
Speaker 3: a healing process for me and my family because it
Speaker 3: enabled me to have conversations of reconnection and the continuation
Speaker 3: of my culture. For me, it was something to be
Speaker 3: proud of and something that I'm celebrating this part of
Speaker 3: me that was, I guess something that unfortunately it was
Speaker 3: suppressed in my father's upbringing. So you know, they weren't
Speaker 3: loud and proud, and they weren't It was just a
Speaker 3: different time for me. I felt like my dad could
Speaker 3: have really said who he is and not to be
Speaker 3: afraid of that, but back in those days he didn't.
Speaker 4: I didn't know.
Speaker 3: Where the fear came from, but I think it came
Speaker 3: from all different directions. Like I learned more recently that
Speaker 3: on our Chinese side that you know, they didn't really
Speaker 3: accept my grandparents' children because they were like black Asians,
Speaker 3: so it was like conflicting for them. Things like that
Speaker 3: that you just don't comprehend. I don't know what that
Speaker 3: must feel like for my father. So I feel like
Speaker 3: we're in a time we're freer in the point that
Speaker 3: we can have these conversations and we can shout to
Speaker 3: the rooftops who we are and connect with that. And
Speaker 3: I definitely think going home back to the Torres Shard
Speaker 3: Islands is integral family just so embracing, and we want
Speaker 3: to keep our culture strong. So the only way to
Speaker 3: do that is to stay connected and to keep living
Speaker 3: and breathing our culture.
Speaker 2: I think you're right for our parents' generations through like
Speaker 2: stolen generations, assimilation policies and just this sort of lack
Speaker 2: of proximity to cultural practices and healing. You know, we
Speaker 2: are living in such a different time where we have
Speaker 2: the privilege and the honor to go back home and
Speaker 2: to be reacquainted with dormant practices which have just been
Speaker 2: we sort of call them sleeping, you know, for a
Speaker 2: little while, and how lucky it is for us to
Speaker 2: in this contemporary world have access to that. But then
Speaker 2: there's also it's met with this sort of yeah, sense
Speaker 2: of sadness, in trepidation and duality that yes, sometimes our
Speaker 2: folks didn't get that. For so many of our folks,
Speaker 2: it was legal to practice culture. It was illegal to
Speaker 2: you know, speak language and dance and grasshopper weave or
Speaker 2: do your weaving practices. And so it's kind of beautiful
Speaker 2: that we get this opportunity to go back, but yeah,
Speaker 2: there's more to be done, of course, always, but that
Speaker 2: we're all on this journey, and I guess just hearing
Speaker 2: what you're saying, like it's sort of like a metas
Speaker 2: story within a story, that it is this weaving of ideas, right,
Speaker 2: Like it's a weaving of your healing, it's a weaving
Speaker 2: of your cultural connection, your families, your kin, and then
Speaker 2: kind of weaving it into this adornment and things that
Speaker 2: people can wear on their bodies. And how special that
Speaker 2: is to be able to create these beautiful grasshopper weaving
Speaker 2: body sculptures. I mean, it's just incredible. It's incredible, and
Speaker 2: I imagine that that would have been such a sacred
Speaker 2: journey for you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely, And I feel very grateful for the opportunities
Speaker 3: it has provided to me. I think it's created a
Speaker 3: gateway for people to really see and acknowledge tor Shrait
Speaker 3: Island fashion and design. I feel like we don't have
Speaker 3: as much representation, but we are there and there are
Speaker 3: a lot of us. There are incredible weavers from the
Speaker 3: Torres Straits and their works are stunning. So I do
Speaker 3: feel like my work hopefully informs to go explore more
Speaker 3: and have a look and check out who's out there,
Speaker 3: because there's beautiful beating and weaving and textiles and designers.
Speaker 3: So I'm definitely a big advocate for tor Shit Island
Speaker 3: fashion design, but obviously I've also been working in the
Speaker 3: mainland Australia Aboriginal art centers and First Nations designers across
Speaker 3: the country as well.
Speaker 2: It's almost this beautiful sort of cosmic spiritual whatever your persuasion,
Speaker 2: I guess in this notion that you went into formally
Speaker 2: do some study in design and fashion and then going
Speaker 2: home is what gifted you the knowledge your work in fashion.
Speaker 2: You have founded First Nations Fashion Design, which is a national,
Speaker 2: non for profit Indigenous corporation that aims to promote cultural expression,
Speaker 2: increase representation and celebrate First Nations designers and artists within
Speaker 2: the fashion and design sectors, and that you know has
Speaker 2: been instrumental in things like Melbourne Fashion Week and other
Speaker 2: fashion shows across so called Australia. It's got a lot
Speaker 2: of international listeners. Just help us understand a little bit
Speaker 2: around the First Nations and fashion scene generally in Australia.
Speaker 3: Fashion has been brewing for a very long time and
Speaker 3: I think stories have been told through whether it be
Speaker 3: collaborations or from individual designers that are creating their own labels,
Speaker 3: through textiles.
Speaker 4: And women's and men's wear and then adornments.
Speaker 3: But we're definitely seeing a shift in the space and
Speaker 3: the last I would say five years or four or
Speaker 3: five years where the sector, in terms of the Australian
Speaker 3: fashion sector are definitely taking more notice of what indigenous
Speaker 3: design is and not even just the designs, but also
Speaker 3: the indigenous fashion sector of makeup artists, hairstylists, models, photographers, videographers,
Speaker 3: you name it. There's definitely a big shift in having
Speaker 3: more representation and black narratives being shared and opinions and
Speaker 3: views of how that looks and how that might shape
Speaker 3: and has shaped the Australian fashion industry. They're finally a
Speaker 3: time where there is some space that's been created for us.
Speaker 3: But I do think that, as you know, there's always
Speaker 3: more to be done. That's something that First Nations Fashion
Speaker 3: and Design is very committed to and we're committed to
Speaker 3: further developing providing a space for innovation and upskilling and.
Speaker 4: Preservation of our culture.
Speaker 3: So at the moment where it looks like we're a
Speaker 3: bit in silo because we're doing smaller projects and not
Speaker 3: the big, flashy runways like everyone continues to do, which
Speaker 3: is beautiful, and we love celebrating and supporting all these platforms,
Speaker 3: but we're really trying to set up an Indigenous organization
Speaker 3: that is able to continue to support First Nations people
Speaker 3: in this space through education, through pathways and opportunities that
Speaker 3: we feel will create a long lasting ripple effect to
Speaker 3: the next generations to really create these successful people in
Speaker 3: the sector.
Speaker 4: So and there are there are already those people.
Speaker 3: But I know when I was studying a fashion design
Speaker 3: I was the only Indigenous student there at the time,
Speaker 3: and I was longing for a space that I could
Speaker 3: be me and have these conversations and preserve and innovate
Speaker 3: and discuss what is indigenous to design. So the question
Speaker 3: that you asked about what is the landscape, It's continuing
Speaker 3: to be evolved as time goes on, and I think
Speaker 3: that that's the exciting part of it.
Speaker 2: I guess it's kind of and I'm going to leave
Speaker 2: some brands behind. So I'll preface this point by saying
Speaker 2: that there are so many black brands, designers, artists, creative storytellers, entrepreneurs,
Speaker 2: you name it. You know, Black fathers are inherently creative people.
Speaker 2: And it's not just pouring in design onto a piece
Speaker 2: of clothing, it's either something that is from your traditional practice,
Speaker 2: it's a story. It could be a political narrative. There's
Speaker 2: so much more than just a fabric or a textile
Speaker 2: or what the eye can see. When I think about it,
Speaker 2: I'll use an example here in numb You know we've
Speaker 2: got you know, I could deck myself out from head
Speaker 2: to toe in all black brands and in the lat's
Speaker 2: probably with only within the last five years, everything from
Speaker 2: hat to earrings to you name it. You know, we
Speaker 2: could go to places like clothing the Gaps or gam
Speaker 2: and Threads or House of Dizzy and just be decked out.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 2: The other day I was at a market. I bought
Speaker 2: some beautiful Aboriginal designed Licra, beautiful buttery Licra activewear, and
Speaker 2: I have been stopped everywhere I go. Where'd you get
Speaker 2: those from? And that was from Amber day. So Karna,
Speaker 2: there is this beautiful explosion. It's nice to see that
Speaker 2: it's a changing and evolving landscape. I want to ask
Speaker 2: you about when you talked about First Nations fashion and
Speaker 2: designs role. I guess in some of those ways about
Speaker 2: education and pathways, you know, if someone wanted to get
Speaker 2: some support in maybe thinking about a career in this.
Speaker 2: You know, what sort of things do you envision that
Speaker 2: they could potentially engage with you on or in the
Speaker 2: future engage with you on.
Speaker 3: If I was doing my time again and I'd just
Speaker 3: reach out so as many people as possible, especially people
Speaker 3: that you admire or are interested in regards to how
Speaker 3: they run their business model or they're designs. In regards
Speaker 3: to the charity, First Nations Fashion and Design, we are
Speaker 3: working on a program where there'll be these opportunities. It
Speaker 3: is really hard to start up a charity. Yeah, it's
Speaker 3: really There's a lot of administration, managing the board. It's
Speaker 3: exciting though. I think it really is something that will
Speaker 3: have longevity and we'll be able to it will evolve
Speaker 3: as well with time, and I'm excited for what it
Speaker 3: will have to offer in the future. Now i'ma is
Speaker 3: definitely doing an incredible job of representing and showcasing black design.
Speaker 3: Whenever I come there, I feel very at home because
Speaker 3: Melbourne is actually where I studied fashion and design at
Speaker 3: r MIT, and when I was there, I don't recall
Speaker 3: there being anything really in terms of a place to
Speaker 3: go where I felt like you know family, and so
Speaker 3: now when I go there, it's like you said, you
Speaker 3: can pop into Christie at House a Dizzy, go to
Speaker 3: Clothing the Gaps, which is amazing, and then obviously going
Speaker 3: to Mabu Mabu and then there's cocktail places like it's
Speaker 3: just so good.
Speaker 2: It's incredible that we are seeing this beautiful explosion of
Speaker 2: creative and entrepreneurial expression. I mean even for Christmas last year,
Speaker 2: I got there. We've got a store in nam in Preston.
Speaker 2: If people are listening and want to go by, shout
Speaker 2: out to Emma and Kiniela Erk. They're based in Preston,
Speaker 2: and we were able to get all, like all of
Speaker 2: our gifts, every single present from a black owned shop.
Speaker 2: And I think the thing that's, you know, very interesting
Speaker 2: is about you know, when you're supporting a black business,
Speaker 2: you're not just supporting their bottom line, You're supporting the
Speaker 2: communities that they work with. They you know, are so
Speaker 2: social justice, they'll reinvest and you know when you support
Speaker 2: one black folly supporting hundreds of us. So go out
Speaker 2: and buy some black design. If there's anyone listening who
Speaker 2: hasn't got a pair of Houses Dizzies or any of
Speaker 2: the amazing brands. Please do that.
Speaker 1: Will be back you mob right after this short break, I.
Speaker 2: Guess circling back to you, Titter and all of the
Speaker 2: things you do. As I say, you have such an
Speaker 2: extensive and impressive bio and things that you have accomplished,
Speaker 2: and I just want to shout that out. Some of
Speaker 2: your work and you're moving away from fashion and into
Speaker 2: some of your more artworks and collaborative pieces. And the
Speaker 2: design that you have been doing has been acquired by
Speaker 2: you know, lots of leading and national international galleries. You know,
Speaker 2: you've worked with Cancer Gallery, the Jam Factory here in
Speaker 2: which is around the corner from me, University of Virginia.
Speaker 2: You've worked with the Australian Institute of Aboriginal Arts and Sciences.
Speaker 2: You know, you have a really impressive repertoire. But I
Speaker 2: want to ask you, Sis, you know what has been
Speaker 2: I guess asides from the beautiful work with the Grasshopper weaving,
Speaker 2: you know what has been I guess some of your
Speaker 2: major standout projects that have really sort of shaped who
Speaker 2: you are.
Speaker 4: I would say, Oh, there's been a few.
Speaker 3: One particular was a really special collection of three pieces
Speaker 3: where I showcased three different materialities. So one was the past,
Speaker 3: the present, and the future. So one was done all
Speaker 3: in palm fronds, and then the present was done in
Speaker 3: the current cotton that I use, and then the future
Speaker 3: was done in like this slastic perspexive fabrication.
Speaker 4: But what was really.
Speaker 3: Special about that is that it was the one and
Speaker 3: only shoot that I did with my grandmother. And so
Speaker 3: for me, that was like really special because this for
Speaker 3: me is all about this is a whole homage to
Speaker 3: my grandmother, really, and so I shot it on my
Speaker 3: cousin So, her granddaughter and her mother so, which was
Speaker 3: Grandma's daughter, and then Grandma, and it was I'm going
Speaker 3: to be most talking about it. Yeah, we did a
Speaker 3: photo shoot of the three of them, and it just
Speaker 3: was really beautiful to have that opportunity to shoot my
Speaker 3: grandmother in my work to celebrate her culture, which is
Speaker 3: my culture. But something that I I think as an
Speaker 3: older woman, I think she understood what I was doing.
Speaker 3: But at the same time, she didn't talk too much
Speaker 3: about it. All her sisters did to me and her
Speaker 3: children did, but not so much Grandma. And maybe that's
Speaker 3: because it's her lived experience and maybe there's too much
Speaker 3: pain there. But Unfortunately she's past. Now everything that I
Speaker 3: have done is to date as being for her. Sorry,
Speaker 3: So yeah, I think that, like it's really special to
Speaker 3: be able to have something like a practice, to be
Speaker 3: able to continue those memories and those celebrations of something
Speaker 3: that in the past.
Speaker 4: Wasn't so celebrated.
Speaker 3: So yeah, it's a very means a lot to me
Speaker 3: my practice, and it definitely is something that, like I said,
Speaker 3: I've kind of committed my whole life to this space
Speaker 3: and it's kind of gone hand in hand with obviously
Speaker 3: the charity because of how I got to do this
Speaker 3: for me, I feel like that has been like the
Speaker 3: flow on effect. Hopefully it's a place that others can
Speaker 3: also find peace in connecting with their cultures through fashion,
Speaker 3: which lots of people are continuing to do. But I
Speaker 3: just felt that there needed to be something that was
Speaker 3: quite independent and that was its own first nations run
Speaker 3: and led corporation.
Speaker 2: Well, we are so grateful that you've been able to, yeah,
Speaker 2: self determine some of your own future and then are
Speaker 2: helping others self determine theirs by giving back, you know,
Speaker 2: giving back to your family, being back to your community,
Speaker 2: and giving back to mobs. So that they can practice
Speaker 2: this beautiful, ancient and contemporary practice of a fashion design,
Speaker 2: art and storytelling. You know it's beautiful, So thank you
Speaker 2: for your labor and what a special special project.
Speaker 3: Well it's been it's been fourteen years since I learned
Speaker 3: how to weave, so one woven necklace has fifteen meters
Speaker 3: in it and we are about to launch our first
Speaker 3: commercial range. Because it's always it's been a hobby and
Speaker 3: it's been something that I would stock in Galerus when
Speaker 3: I was able and had the time. Whereas now, thankfully
Speaker 3: to Arts Queensland and their support, we've been able to
Speaker 3: recruit a small little team who I work with and
Speaker 3: we're developing our first range of the woven necklaces that
Speaker 3: will be dropped very soon. We don't have an exact
Speaker 3: date yet but in the coming month, and that will
Speaker 3: be a very limited edition of pieces. We would like
Speaker 3: them to be acquired the sense that it's a piece
Speaker 3: of artwork and it's a collectible in a sense because
Speaker 3: it's not mass produced. They're all handmade by me. At
Speaker 3: the moment, we've rebranded and finally have beautiful packaging with
Speaker 3: an authenticity card and each piece will be numbered so
Speaker 3: they will be very specific to knowing the provenance of
Speaker 3: where the pieces will be going, and they'll be collectibles.
Speaker 3: We're just dropping a range of small core colors and
Speaker 3: that'll be our first drop of limited edition pieces, and
Speaker 3: then we'll have another drop will come later in the
Speaker 3: year which will be a line to my exhibition.
Speaker 2: Wow, that's so special. I mean fifteen meters long. What's
Speaker 2: the time and labor that it would take to weave
Speaker 2: one of these beauties.
Speaker 3: It's good you asked that question, and the other day
Speaker 3: I was like, I need to stop answering it.
Speaker 4: Just because and then then we.
Speaker 3: Were laughing that I should answer that question with that
Speaker 3: I've been weaving for fourteen years.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's how long it takes exactly right, master a
Speaker 2: craft such as weaving.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, Yeah, I definitely have been able to master it.
Speaker 4: I guess I thought it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've never called myself a master weaver, but in
Speaker 3: this specific weaving, I've definitely I feel like I've mastered it,
Speaker 3: and so I am weaving everywhere at the moment because
Speaker 3: of this exhibition.
Speaker 4: I have so much weaving. It's all around me.
Speaker 2: There's a couple of questions that come up when we
Speaker 2: think about adorning something as meaningful as you know, a
Speaker 2: woven collectible piece that has taken fourteen years to develop
Speaker 2: some sense of mastery, and you know, and to hear
Speaker 2: that this is a practice that's been handed down through
Speaker 2: you know, your Arab Island ancestry. It's so so special.
Speaker 2: I mean, is this piece available for non aboriginal or allies?
Speaker 2: I think it's an important question to ask because people
Speaker 2: always do feel like is this for me? And you know,
Speaker 2: it'd be nice to sort of just hear from you
Speaker 2: what your thoughts are and then maybe where we can
Speaker 2: possibly acquire such a beautiful collectible piece once it's.
Speaker 3: Out for me, I guess, to be honest, I feel
Speaker 3: like this is a technique that is gifted to me,
Speaker 3: and then it's something that has evolved into this neck
Speaker 3: piece or color, and I find it's a really great
Speaker 3: piece to be able to share who we are and
Speaker 3: for that to be celebrated and for those conversations to
Speaker 3: live on. So I really feel strongly about these definitely
Speaker 3: for anyone and everyone, as long as they know where
Speaker 3: it comes from and those conversations are being had. So
Speaker 3: that's really important because I feel like, yeah, I want
Speaker 3: people to know about the Torrow Strait Islands and how
Speaker 3: beautiful and how rich we are in terms of our culture,
Speaker 3: our land. But we have so much to care for
Speaker 3: as well, So there just needs to be a lot
Speaker 3: of awareness that we exist. I think sometimes we get
Speaker 3: a little bit forgotten about really being so far north.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love and appreciate that. I think it's always
Speaker 2: the sentiment in which something is owned or worn, and
Speaker 2: that it's much more than just a fashion statement. It
Speaker 2: is access to ancient knowledge that needs to be understood
Speaker 2: and respected. And like you say, that providence where it
Speaker 2: comes from, needs to be understood. I know that whenever
Speaker 2: I'm got some handmade pieces that my family have gifted me,
Speaker 2: and even just got this jacket that I got custom
Speaker 2: designed by Regina Ginny Girl Gang, and every time I
Speaker 2: put it on, I feel like lucky. You I know, well, yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean, we work together to design it and I
Speaker 2: paid for it, and it was a beautiful sort of
Speaker 2: it was a beautiful exchange. But you know, every time
Speaker 2: I put it on, the feeling that it invokes within
Speaker 2: me and this like it feels like it's a shield,
Speaker 2: it feels like it's an artifact, it feels like, all right,
Speaker 2: I'm strong, I'm deadly, I'm you know, lookout world, you know.
Speaker 2: So I think it's it's so much more than just
Speaker 2: putting on these pieces. It's like you say, they're respect
Speaker 2: for where it comes from. Well, well, I can't wait
Speaker 2: to see, Yeah, where this collection emerges. Is there a
Speaker 2: launch period? Is there somewhere we can direct our listeners to,
Speaker 2: because I know there'll be people asking me questions.
Speaker 3: Oh, Carol, I I wish I had an exact date.
Speaker 3: It will be in the coming week, so I would
Speaker 3: say definitely within the next three weeks, so it'll be
Speaker 3: out in May, but definitely if you're following mostly on
Speaker 3: our Instagram or sign up as a subscriber on our website,
Speaker 3: because that's really we might drop a line before the announcement,
Speaker 3: so if you want to get some heads up before
Speaker 3: we actually go live, that's the place to go to.
Speaker 4: It's all about to happen, which is super exciting, but
Speaker 4: it's also.
Speaker 3: It's a bit of a strange world of art and
Speaker 3: fashion and trying to navigate what that looks like.
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, these things are so not binary for us. Hey,
Speaker 2: Like it's contemporary and ancient knowledge, it's operating just fashion
Speaker 2: in a business, there's a sales like I feel you,
Speaker 2: I feel you. You know, you're kind of always oscillating,
Speaker 2: always oscillating. So but I think it's really beautiful. We'll
Speaker 2: pop it in the show notes because it's where people
Speaker 2: can follow along with the education, all the work you're doing,
Speaker 2: where they can follow along with your beautiful woven collectible designs,
Speaker 2: and just some of the stuff you're doing in your
Speaker 2: personal launch, which I know is coming out soon as well.
Speaker 2: I wanted to ask a question around how do you
Speaker 2: balance it all? You know, one of the things we're
Speaker 2: really passionate about at Black Wattle is looking at you know,
Speaker 2: burnout and sometimes when we're doing things we love and
Speaker 2: our spirits in there and we're pouring from our stories
Speaker 2: and communities and families. Yeah, we have a propensity to
Speaker 2: give and give and give. So I want to just ask,
Speaker 2: you know, what sort of person, what sort of practice,
Speaker 2: what sort of lights you up and helps you sort
Speaker 2: of balance all of these creative pursuits.
Speaker 4: Oh goodness me.
Speaker 3: I think it's a very tough question because I think
Speaker 3: that we all well I can't speak on every behalf
Speaker 3: of everyone, but I know, for myself. I didn't have
Speaker 3: a lot of balance, and I definitely myself into the
Speaker 3: ground and definitely experience burnout, which is definitely detrimental to
Speaker 3: your health.
Speaker 4: I didn't realize that.
Speaker 3: I was really pushing myself like I did, but I didn't,
Speaker 3: if that makes sense. So I think that definitely taking
Speaker 3: the time to have family and friends and healthy food
Speaker 3: around you and exercise and meditation swims down at the
Speaker 3: creek is like so important and I think even more
Speaker 3: so that's the learning that I'm still going through, but
Speaker 3: it's definitely something that has been brought attention and come
Speaker 3: to the forefront of my life. Of having more balance
Speaker 3: is just integral. And unfortunately I don't have little babies yet,
Speaker 3: so you know, if you want to have all the things,
Speaker 3: you've got to find the place that you can.
Speaker 4: I guess just just stop.
Speaker 3: Get out on Country is a really good one.
Speaker 4: Go home.
Speaker 2: I really appreciate that. I really appreciate the honesty too,
Speaker 2: you know, even in my like doing this work, and
Speaker 2: you know, we get dubbed like a first nation burnout expert,
Speaker 2: which I have real strong it works about because I
Speaker 2: don't feel like I'm really I'm a student and learner
Speaker 2: of life. I'm not an expert really in anything, but
Speaker 2: even it's a lifelong practice for all of us, even myself.
Speaker 2: We get tested in new ways and we need new
Speaker 2: ways to look after ourselves. So I appreciate the honesty.
Speaker 2: I'm sure there'll be a lot of sisters who are walking,
Speaker 2: probably cooking for their kids or listening in their car
Speaker 2: going uh huh m hmm. Yeah. I'm still working it
Speaker 2: out too, so I appreciate.
Speaker 4: That we're going to learn to say no, hey.
Speaker 2: Yeah, unapologetically as well. You know, no no is a
Speaker 2: full sentence. Well, Grace, thank you so much for your
Speaker 2: time today. There's so much that we could have covered.
Speaker 2: Is there anything else that you want to share about,
Speaker 2: you know, anything that you can share I guess about
Speaker 2: what's coming up or anything else that you wanted to
Speaker 2: to mentor today.
Speaker 3: No, I think just that, like this year's been a
Speaker 3: great year. I'm excited for what's to come. I'm super
Speaker 3: excited for what our team has been creating. And definitely
Speaker 3: there's some very cool opportunities that have come in our
Speaker 3: little realm, which is super exciting. But yeah, we're still
Speaker 3: working obviously with the charity as well, and FNFD has
Speaker 3: still got some things that are coming out up, so
Speaker 3: both of the organizations are you know, we're heading in
Speaker 3: different directions, but I feel like we've become like teenagers
Speaker 3: maybe growing up a little bit before we were just
Speaker 3: having fun, whereas now we're still having fun, but it's
Speaker 3: a little bit more focused. We're excited, so keep following
Speaker 3: the journey if you are following or check us out.
Speaker 3: We love what we're doing and very excited that it's
Speaker 3: all about to come out, which is exciting too.
Speaker 2: The birthing, the new creation and the evolution of you
Speaker 2: as an individual as a sister, but then also as
Speaker 2: your businesses in FNND and also your own personal lines
Speaker 2: and launch it will pop Grace's website, all of her
Speaker 2: socials and handles in our show notes so you can
Speaker 2: follow along. We're in May now, so you know, get
Speaker 2: to sort of see some of these beautiful launchers and collections.
Speaker 2: So thank you so much for being here today and
Speaker 2: sharing your time and being so generous and sharing your
Speaker 2: personal stories too. I really really admire and appreciate it.
Speaker 2: You know, Black stories medicine for us, that's how we
Speaker 2: make sense of the world. It's how we make sense
Speaker 2: of each other and so yeah, to be able to
Speaker 2: connect with you in that way is really special. So
Speaker 2: thank you.
Speaker 3: So much, Thank you, Caroline, thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 1: You mob.
Speaker 2: If you are vibing this season of Yarning up, then
Speaker 2: please head over to Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get
Speaker 2: your podcasts from to show us some love, rate, and review. Alternatively,
Speaker 2: you can get in contact and give us some feedback
Speaker 2: by visiting www dot Caroline Coow dot com dou