1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: Despite Indonesia lifting it's suspension, I should say on live 2 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:08,039 Speaker 1: cattle exports from two NT cattle stations over concerns about 3 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 1: lumpy skin disease. It's now understood that they're not going 4 00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 1: to accept any livestock if they have skin lesions marks 5 00:00:15,240 --> 00:00:18,439 Speaker 1: or other pre existing scars. Now joining us on the 6 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: line to explain this a bit further as the CEO 7 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: of the NT Cattleman's Association, Will Evans. 8 00:00:24,400 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 2: Good morning, Will, Good morning Katie. Thanks for having me on, 9 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 2: will Mate. 10 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 1: It feels like we're on a bit of a roller 11 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:33,199 Speaker 1: coaster at the moment with this lumpy skin disease and 12 00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:36,360 Speaker 1: what the other countries you know, are happy with and 13 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 1: not going to allow. 14 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:42,680 Speaker 2: There's a lot of confusion in this space, and it's 15 00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:46,040 Speaker 2: certainly something that is continuation of a similar issue we 16 00:00:46,159 --> 00:00:49,640 Speaker 2: were dealing for a fair while. Yeah, it's a complex 17 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:52,120 Speaker 2: one that's causing us some real issues at the moment, 18 00:00:52,120 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 2: but we're optimistic about working through it. 19 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,959 Speaker 1: So what's the latest in terms of you know, then 20 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:02,480 Speaker 1: basically saying if there's skin lesions marks or other pre 21 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 1: existing scars that they're not going to take int cattle. 22 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:09,959 Speaker 2: So I think, first off, Cardie, If you don't mind, 23 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 2: I might just explain. When we talk about skin lesions, 24 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:17,000 Speaker 2: it sounds I think people might get the wrong impression 25 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:19,800 Speaker 2: that these are open wounds or these are issues that 26 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:23,400 Speaker 2: the cattle have that are quite negative. But the reality 27 00:01:23,520 --> 00:01:26,160 Speaker 2: is what we're talking about is you know, when I 28 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:27,760 Speaker 2: go out to the floodplanes and I get bitten by 29 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 2: a mosquito, I come up with a mark or a 30 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:32,119 Speaker 2: red mark on my skin. It's the exact same thing 31 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 2: with cattle when they come off the floodplanes, I come 32 00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:36,920 Speaker 2: off areas with insects, basically they get it like a swelling. 33 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:42,080 Speaker 2: So what we're talking about is relatively minor skin imperfections 34 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,000 Speaker 2: and the result of being bitten by bugs that we 35 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 2: have in here in the territory and it's very common. 36 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:49,360 Speaker 2: So the issue that we have at the moment is 37 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:53,040 Speaker 2: how do you know when too many bites or are 38 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:56,280 Speaker 2: too big a reaction to an insect or a mosquito 39 00:01:56,320 --> 00:02:00,160 Speaker 2: by may cause an export issue or you may I'll 40 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 2: be able to export that animal. And the subjectivity and 41 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 2: how we're measuring these things is really what's causing us 42 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 2: the biggest stress of the moment, And. 43 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:11,120 Speaker 1: Like point, at what point is it then determined what 44 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:13,840 Speaker 1: is too much or what's going to be acceptable and 45 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: what's not is you know, is it when they arrive 46 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:18,720 Speaker 1: over in Indonesia or is it before they leave the 47 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:19,800 Speaker 1: export yards here. 48 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 2: Well, that's so the final protocol is the Australian government 49 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:28,000 Speaker 2: in the Northern Territory, so we have federal government officers 50 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 2: who do sign up all export consignments and this is 51 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 2: really the chike point for us at the moment. So 52 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 2: producers were told about a month ago, a little bit 53 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:39,120 Speaker 2: over a month ago, there's going to be an increased 54 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 2: focus on these on skin marks on cattle. Please don't 55 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:46,440 Speaker 2: send anything to an export yard that doesn't fit that criteria. 56 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 2: So we've been processing cattle on station really harshly and 57 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 2: anything that we think, oh that's going to mark on it, 58 00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:55,960 Speaker 2: that that might not make it, we're taking those cattle 59 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 2: out and we're putting them back in the paddock and 60 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:01,239 Speaker 2: hoping we can send them next year, and we're basically 61 00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 2: not sending them to the export yard. By that time 62 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 2: an animal gets to an export yard, it has to 63 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,960 Speaker 2: go export or it doesn't just have no value, it's 64 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 2: actually got a negative value. It costs you a lot 65 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:15,040 Speaker 2: of money to transport cattle a thousand kilometers from a 66 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:18,080 Speaker 2: cattle station to an export yard. We then have two 67 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:22,639 Speaker 2: veterory officers inspect them, we have a government official who 68 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 2: inspects them, and that's the last quarter call. But if 69 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 2: those people say no, this animal can't go and you've 70 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:30,040 Speaker 2: got to pay the take it back to a cattle station, 71 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 2: that's a very expensive animal at that point in time. 72 00:03:32,880 --> 00:03:36,520 Speaker 1: Well, and it sounds like this is really quite difficult 73 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: in the sense that you know, as you pointed out 74 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 1: right from the get go this morning, you know you 75 00:03:40,640 --> 00:03:42,360 Speaker 1: could be talking about mossi bytes. 76 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 2: Well, and that's the issue, and how many bytes are 77 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:50,000 Speaker 2: too many bytes? Now, we don't export anything that's not healthy. 78 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,320 Speaker 2: That's a really important message for everybody. And the reason 79 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:56,480 Speaker 2: that we don't is there's no money in exporting cattle 80 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:59,839 Speaker 2: that aren't healthy. We sell top quality cattle to South 81 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:02,520 Speaker 2: Asia every year. And the reason that we do that 82 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:04,560 Speaker 2: is and the reason they want our catalysts because they 83 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:07,800 Speaker 2: are top quality. So we only export animals that are healthy. 84 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:11,120 Speaker 2: And so for producers, we've got thirty years of experience 85 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 2: and being able to determine this is an animal that's 86 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 2: ready for export. This animal, it's not so when we 87 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:18,039 Speaker 2: send those things, when export you are, we know that 88 00:04:18,040 --> 00:04:20,559 Speaker 2: they're healthy and they're happy. And when they come back 89 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:23,600 Speaker 2: healthy and happy because they've got skin marks on them, 90 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:25,719 Speaker 2: it's a pretty big blow to the business. 91 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. So mate, look we're too from here at this 92 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:32,800 Speaker 1: point and how are you know, like, how is the 93 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,560 Speaker 1: cattle industry feeling well? 94 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 2: I mean critical first step is we need certainty. We 95 00:04:39,040 --> 00:04:42,600 Speaker 2: need really clear this is how we're going to be 96 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,520 Speaker 2: measuring this because at the moment it's very subjective. It's 97 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:49,360 Speaker 2: it's very difficult if you've got three people looking at 98 00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 2: one animal, looking at lumps on it, and one says 99 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 2: no and two say yes. You know that's that's not 100 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 2: a good day. So what we need is we need 101 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 2: absolute certainty. This is how you can tell, this is 102 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:00,600 Speaker 2: how you come. And then we've to work through a 103 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:04,599 Speaker 2: process of trying to support the Australian government and talking 104 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:08,599 Speaker 2: with our Indonesian partners and explaining to them, you know, 105 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,520 Speaker 2: in the territory we produce catalog club planes, you know, 106 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:13,960 Speaker 2: and the reality is they get bitten by bugs. So 107 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:15,680 Speaker 2: we've just got to work work through that with them 108 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:18,880 Speaker 2: and say, look, guys, these are healthy animals and where 109 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:22,160 Speaker 2: we're sure of their health status, and that's just going 110 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 2: to take us some time. 111 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:28,240 Speaker 1: Well, is it getting quite difficult that the goalpost just 112 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 1: keep moving here? 113 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 2: Yeah? I mean, look, that's that's been It's difficult to 114 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:37,120 Speaker 2: know and it's difficult to know where they've been moved too. 115 00:05:38,680 --> 00:05:41,279 Speaker 2: So that's that's that's probably the big issue at the 116 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:45,520 Speaker 2: moment is there's a lot of uncertainty and we need certainty, 117 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:47,160 Speaker 2: especially at this time of year. You know, this is 118 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:48,520 Speaker 2: the time of year where we're going to be selling 119 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 2: a lot of cattle. Certainty is critical. 120 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: So where to from here? I mean, what's the Cattleman's 121 00:05:55,600 --> 00:05:58,160 Speaker 1: Association doing to sort of try and address these or 122 00:05:58,240 --> 00:05:59,799 Speaker 1: to try and move things forward. 123 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 2: Well, we're working really hard with our with our obviously 124 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:07,039 Speaker 2: our export partners. We're working really hard for camera to 125 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 2: try and come up with some guidance and some materials 126 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:11,240 Speaker 2: around This is how producers can know what they're meant 127 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 2: to be doing. But then when the next step is 128 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:17,040 Speaker 2: we need to be talking very closely with Indonesia and 129 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:20,240 Speaker 2: communicated with them. This is this is how good our 130 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:22,880 Speaker 2: cattle are, even though they've been bidden by bugs, they're 131 00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:23,920 Speaker 2: still really good cattle. 132 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 1: Do you know if the Indonesian authorities have any plans 133 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:31,760 Speaker 1: to visit the Northern territory and actually see what's happening 134 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 1: here in the end. 135 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,080 Speaker 2: So one of the commitments that came out of the 136 00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 2: meeting that the Indonesian officials in the Australian government had 137 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,359 Speaker 2: to be in Jakarta was to do that, And I 138 00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 2: think that's a really that's going to be a really 139 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 2: critical step. I mean, the reality of producing beef in 140 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:49,680 Speaker 2: the territory is pretty astonishing to see, and so we're 141 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 2: really excited about showcasing that and showcasing how good our 142 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:54,400 Speaker 2: cattle are and explaining some of the challenges we have 143 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:57,360 Speaker 2: we're producing them in the territory, which includes the fact 144 00:06:57,400 --> 00:06:59,679 Speaker 2: that we've got a lot of buggers in the territory 145 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:01,039 Speaker 2: that live biting things. 146 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:03,560 Speaker 1: Well, this is the thing, you know, like for so 147 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:06,839 Speaker 1: many of us, you know, we all have mossi bites 148 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:09,520 Speaker 1: on us at different times. It's just the reality of 149 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 1: living here in the territory, isn't it. 150 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:14,200 Speaker 2: And I think especially when you go out of the 151 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:16,320 Speaker 2: floodplaining this time of year, it's not only hot, but 152 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:18,760 Speaker 2: the bugs are starting to come in big waves, and 153 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 2: I think anyone who's been fishing or going fishing this 154 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:23,520 Speaker 2: weekend is take the red with you. 155 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly right. Well, the last time you and 156 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: I spoke, you know, it was really quite positive. We're 157 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:32,240 Speaker 1: feeling as though things are finally moving forward. You know, 158 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 1: this seems to have really put a spanner in the works. 159 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 1: Were there any like, were there any cattle that was 160 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,240 Speaker 1: sort of already on their way to Indonesia when this 161 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: change was announced? 162 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that this change came in this rail 163 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:52,360 Speaker 2: government adopted a precautionary approach right at the beginning of 164 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:56,320 Speaker 2: the suspensions being placed been put in place by Indonesia. 165 00:07:56,400 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 2: So we've been doing this for a while. But I 166 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 2: think again it's just that we're moving into a high 167 00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 2: volume period now. Everyone's been sitting and watching and waiting 168 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 2: for these suspensions to be lifted. They've been lifted. Everyone's 169 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:13,120 Speaker 2: send in cattle. But the understanding around what we're meant 170 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 2: to do with the cattle that have lumps on them? 171 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 2: Are we meant to send them that we're not. That's 172 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:19,559 Speaker 2: the thing that's really got us caught up at the moment. 173 00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 2: So the positive is we are still moving boats and 174 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 2: we are moving cattle. The negative is the cattle that 175 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:26,880 Speaker 2: we're not moving a costing has got a lot of money. 176 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:29,320 Speaker 1: When do you reckon you're going to have a clearer 177 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:32,520 Speaker 1: sort of a clearer outcome here or is it too 178 00:08:32,559 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: hard to tell because the reality of it is you 179 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: are relying on the Indonesian government and also you know 180 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 1: the Australian government working through this. 181 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 2: Well, I mean we've got to it's almost a double education, 182 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 2: you know, in some ways. We've also we've got to 183 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:48,680 Speaker 2: explain to the guys in camera how we produce cattle 184 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 2: in the territory. You know, it's pretty unique in terms 185 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,800 Speaker 2: of what we do up here. So we've got to 186 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:56,080 Speaker 2: work on a work with the Istralian government to say, look, 187 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:59,440 Speaker 2: this is just the reality of what we do. And 188 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:02,720 Speaker 2: then we've got with them and hopefully the Indonesian government 189 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,080 Speaker 2: and say look we're very confident, how good in our 190 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:08,120 Speaker 2: cattle are. Come have a look at him any time. Yeah. 191 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:11,760 Speaker 1: Well Will Evans, c CEO of the NT Cattleman's Association, 192 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:14,240 Speaker 1: always good to chat with you, no doubt, we'll talk 193 00:09:14,240 --> 00:09:14,920 Speaker 1: to you again soon. 194 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:17,439 Speaker 2: No, thanks, thank you. 195 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:17,840 Speaker 1: Thanks Mi