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Speaker 1: Get a. I'm Lala Berry, nutritionist, author, actor, TV presenter,

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Speaker 1: and professional oversharer. This podcast is all about celebrating failure

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Speaker 1: because I believe it's a chance for us to learn,

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Speaker 1: grow and face our blind spots. Each week, I'll interview

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Speaker 1: a different guest about their highs as well as their lows,

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Speaker 1: all in a bid to inspire us to fearlessly fail. Hello,

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Speaker 1: Holy Mac, I am so excited for you to listen

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Speaker 1: to today's pod with Noah Hunter Dorsey. He is a

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Speaker 1: digital marketer. He is a total creative. He's an entrepreneur

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Speaker 1: and when I interviewed him, I believe he was twenty seven.

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Speaker 1: I think he's twenty eight now. But he has created

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Speaker 1: three multimillion dollar businesses. He has worked with Kanye West

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Speaker 1: on the relaunch of Yeasy and I think he signed

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Speaker 1: onto that forty eight hours before the relaunch, and the

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Speaker 1: day that everything Noah did kicked off, they cleared something

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Speaker 1: like nineteen million USD in a day. Like this kid

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Speaker 1: is so smart. Sorry I know what to call you

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Speaker 1: a kid, but you feel, you feel, you just feel

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Speaker 1: like someone that is such a go getter, young, hungry,

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Speaker 1: smart and so insightful and one of my favorite qualities

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Speaker 1: about Noah is he doesn't gatekeep. So we talked about,

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Speaker 1: you know, success, loving speed, and the importance of momentum.

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Speaker 1: We talked about how we often can underestimate what we

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Speaker 1: can handle, but sometimes we'll overestimate what we can achieve.

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Speaker 1: In a really short period of time. I learned so much.

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Speaker 1: I took so many notes. I am a huge, huge

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Speaker 1: fan after sitting down and having this chat, And like

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Speaker 1: anytime Noah shares a vlog or behind the scenes of

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Speaker 1: all the incredible stuff is doing, I'm like, first in there,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, you're arazing. So, Noah, thank you so much

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Speaker 1: for jumping on this pod. I cannot wait to see

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Speaker 1: what comes for you next. I just know you are

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Speaker 1: totally unstoppable and it is a total honor to have

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Speaker 1: you on fearlessly failing. Thank you, my friend, You're unreal.

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Speaker 1: Noah Hunter Dorsy, great name, by.

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Speaker 2: The way, Thank you. I can think my parents that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna say, you don't get friendly take much.

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Speaker 1: I am so excited to be sitting opposite you. I like,

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Speaker 1: I started researching you and to be completely honest with you,

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Speaker 1: usually i'll like go for like actors, writers, directors, that

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Speaker 1: real like creativity space and you I go stting this

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Speaker 1: pitch for you and I was like, okay, hang on,

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Speaker 1: let me, let me do a detail, and I was like,

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Speaker 1: you're flipping amazing. So would you describe yourself as a

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Speaker 1: digital marketer and entrepreneur? Yeah, but with a very like

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Speaker 1: I cannot wait to talk about your creative like dreams

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Speaker 1: and aspirations as well. So I have to start with

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's so many places I want to start,

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Speaker 1: but like, let's talk e commerce. Covid, how it worked

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Speaker 1: like in a really good way for you, and it

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Speaker 1: was a hard time for a lot of people. But

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Speaker 1: is that where was it Tommy Skin? Is that where

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Speaker 1: Tommy Skin cats?

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Speaker 2: That's right? Yeah, that was the first business that got

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Speaker 2: traction and kind of opened up a new world for

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Speaker 2: me a career, I guess, yeah, And covid was it

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Speaker 2: was just that opportunity for us where you know, the

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Speaker 2: world when it's a panic and lockdown, but e commerce,

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Speaker 2: I guess we'd picked the right industry just started booming.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it changed my life overnight, and you know,

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Speaker 2: we just one thing led to the next and now

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Speaker 2: I'm here today with you. But that was really the

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Speaker 2: start of all of it, you know, pre covid, I

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Speaker 2: was very much so just figuring it out, sharehouses, couch surfing,

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Speaker 2: like yeah.

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Speaker 1: Right, but like then to now, is it true you've

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Speaker 1: built three multi million dollar businesses?

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Speaker 2: That's right. So the first one was Tommy Skin Sales,

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Speaker 2: a skincare e commerce company, and really we were working

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Speaker 2: with a lot of suppliers to keep that business running.

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Speaker 2: So I was just looking at the financials going, Wow,

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Speaker 2: we're spending so much money with other marketing agencies, and

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Speaker 2: we're spending so much money with other three pls. Why

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Speaker 2: don't we do these ourselves?

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Speaker 1: This might sound really dumb. Sure, this might sound really dumb.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know what a three PL was literally until

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Speaker 1: I started researching you, So can you say what that

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Speaker 1: is for the audience?

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Speaker 2: So? Three PL is third party logistics? Right, So for

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Speaker 2: e commerce brands, obviously they have stock. They need to

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Speaker 2: keep that stock somewhere rather than doing it themselves, which

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Speaker 2: takes a lot of time. Yeah, or get a warehouse

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Speaker 2: because that's just a huge outlet in terms of investment, buying,

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Speaker 2: forklifts and racking. You can work with a company that

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Speaker 2: will basically consolidate multiple brands into the one warehouse and

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Speaker 2: then store your products and then ship them.

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Speaker 1: Which is what you do, right, which is what we do.

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Speaker 2: That's right.

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Speaker 1: So that's future fulfillment.

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Speaker 2: That's future fulfillment.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so I have to ask about future fulfillment and

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Speaker 1: the fire in twenty twenty three, right, that's right. So

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Speaker 1: you throw like this was your baby in a sense,

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Speaker 1: and you get this call I'm getting the middle of

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Speaker 1: the night or something, wasn't it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so what happened in the middle of the night,

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Speaker 2: I'm like a very heavy sleeper. First, yes, Nick was

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Speaker 2: down on the scene that.

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Speaker 1: Your business partner, partner, yep.

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Speaker 2: And then you know, as soon as I woke up

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Speaker 2: in you know, the early morning, I saw the photo

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Speaker 2: and I was, yeah, straight down there. And by that time,

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Speaker 2: like you know, everyone had arrived, you know, detectives, police

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Speaker 2: or the new stations were down there.

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Speaker 1: I saw a fair story with your interviews.

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Speaker 2: It was a wild scene. It was something like a

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Speaker 2: TV show.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and then is it true? Like technically that was

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Speaker 1: like a huge, huge setback, Like a lot of people

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Speaker 1: be like if this I'm out like this is But

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Speaker 1: within twenty four hours you had found the place next

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Speaker 1: door and you were like organize Internet. You're ready, like

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Speaker 1: and you just started operation.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I vividly remember sitting at Optus like that day,

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Speaker 2: like just getting a like a modem and hooking it

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Speaker 2: up because as you know, like equoos doesn't SOP. It's

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Speaker 2: not like we could just say, hey, you know, it's

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Speaker 2: put everything on pause. It's like orders are still coming through.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, but that's like shout outs to the team

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Speaker 2: as well. That was the way that that was pulled

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Speaker 2: together was really good. And I think that that's you know,

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Speaker 2: that's our approach to it as well with everything.

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Speaker 1: This is what I am so excited to talk to

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Speaker 1: about your approach because it seems like you don't have

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Speaker 1: a fear of shit stuff happening or failing. It seems

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Speaker 1: like you're kind of like, well, Okay, this bad thing

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Speaker 1: has happen, bend, I'm still going to move forward.

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Speaker 2: That's right. Yeah. I think the if I think about

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Speaker 2: the experience that taught me the most about fear and

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Speaker 2: like getting over the fear of rejection, it would have

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Speaker 2: to be my first job when I moved to Melbourne.

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Speaker 2: So I studied university in Byron Bay and the day

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Speaker 2: I finished, I was ready to go to the city

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Speaker 2: and do something big, big dreams. And I came to Melbourne.

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Speaker 2: The first job that I got was door knocking for

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Speaker 2: Solar Oh wow. Yeah. So every morning we would meet

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Speaker 2: it at a warehouse that'd be maybe like fifteen of

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Speaker 2: us and they would put us onto a minibus and

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Speaker 2: give us a map with the suburbs we'll go into,

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Speaker 2: and then highlighted in my color were all the streets

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Speaker 2: that I got to walk that day. And then every

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Speaker 2: day we're just like in the sun like midsummer, just

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Speaker 2: walking door to door and like just getting rejected again

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Speaker 2: and again, like people slamming their doors on me, people

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Speaker 2: yelling and swearing at me, like you know, and that

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Speaker 2: was constant. But then someone would say yes, and we

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Speaker 2: got fifty dollars every Yes, it was a fifty dollars

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Speaker 2: note and it was like, Okay, more nose I get

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Speaker 2: the closer I get to well, yes, and it just

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Speaker 2: became a numbers game. So that was the thing that

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Speaker 2: really instilled it for me.

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Speaker 1: Oh mate, what did you study in Byron Bay University?

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Speaker 2: I did audio engineering, So I'm a musician.

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Speaker 1: I know this about you. Yeah, that's going to say

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Speaker 1: I love this. I live part in Byron Bay. Isn't

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Speaker 1: it the best? You love it the best because you're

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Speaker 1: a surfer as well.

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Speaker 2: Seventeen eighteen, nineteen years old in Biron, Like it was

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Speaker 2: just a coming of age. It was the best place

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Speaker 2: in the world that I could have been.

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Speaker 1: I literally think it would be the best place to

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Speaker 1: have a family. Yeah, I agree, the air, the water,

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Speaker 1: Growing up in the ocean, I'm always like this is

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Speaker 1: this is the best place.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely.

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Speaker 1: I call it Parrot to all my American friends and

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Speaker 1: like where are you from, I'm like, literally Paradise. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's the best.

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Speaker 2: That's right.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So you got so comfortable with this like consistent

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Speaker 1: rejection that you were like, Okay, this is a numbers game.

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Speaker 1: I've just got to like stick with it. And so

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Speaker 1: how like, oh my god, there is just so much

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Speaker 1: cool stuff I want to talk about, But like, how

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Speaker 1: do you go from that to like and this ability

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Speaker 1: to like not give a shit about failing? And then

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Speaker 1: I want to talk to you about You've said people

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Speaker 1: grossly underestimate what they can handle and like what they

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Speaker 1: can I think also what they can do yep. And

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Speaker 1: it's almost like you have that in built like to

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Speaker 1: be able to like that's that daughter at all? I

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Speaker 1: want to say, salesman, job, Can I say that? I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of people would throw the towel in

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Speaker 1: after a day. But you're like, hang on a stick,

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Speaker 1: if I can have like two or three wins, that

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Speaker 1: can be one hundred and fifty bucks. That's exactly right, right,

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Speaker 1: But like that tells me that you've got this in

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Speaker 1: built power of being like I know what I can

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Speaker 1: I know that I can handle more than I think.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well you made a comment there. So you said people,

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Speaker 2: you know, underestimate what they can achieve or what they

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Speaker 2: can do they can handle. There's also this other side

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Speaker 2: is like they overestimate what they can do in a

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Speaker 2: very short amount of time and underestimate what they can

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Speaker 2: do in maybe a year or so. And I feel

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Speaker 2: this constantly as well, because I wake up I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 2: I need it, I need to move faster. But then

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Speaker 2: I reflect and I go, oh, actually, where we were

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Speaker 2: this time last year compared to now, Like is what

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Speaker 2: I could never dreamt that, and like it'll happen again. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: So I think it's just like, you know, good things

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Speaker 2: take time, good things take people. Yeah, that's just part

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Speaker 2: of the process.

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Speaker 1: Do you know what you said something though, I tell

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Speaker 1: you what I wrote down, and my boyfriend was like,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, that's so good success love speed, oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: and like so as and this where I'm excited to

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Speaker 1: hear like your business brain but also your creative brain

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Speaker 1: around this because we know that, like, especially in the

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Speaker 1: creative industry, momentum like feeds, Like you know that if

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Speaker 1: you get a win, you've got to ride that kind

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Speaker 1: of way for sure and take all the like prezsies

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Speaker 1: that come with it, like and just go, Okay, that's

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Speaker 1: going to open that door, that's going to start that.

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Speaker 1: But like, sometimes we can have an idea, whether it's

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Speaker 1: creatible business idea and kind of like get paralyzed by

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Speaker 1: what if I fail or what if I suck it up?

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Speaker 1: Or what if I you know, like and I think

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Speaker 1: that like so many dreams and ideas are kind of

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Speaker 1: left Like I teach ogre and I used to say

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Speaker 1: it in my class, I don't need more because it

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Speaker 1: sounds a bit morbid, But I used to say, you

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Speaker 1: find like the best ideas and dreams in the graveyard

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Speaker 1: because a lot of people are too afraid to oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: to go after them. So I want you to teach

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Speaker 1: me about why success love speed number one, and then like,

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Speaker 1: as a creative that can sometimes get imposter syndrome or

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Speaker 1: oh that needs to be perfect before I put it

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Speaker 1: out into the world, Like how to let go of

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Speaker 1: that and that to like to like sit in that

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Speaker 1: like the pace of like success for sure.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I think there's one quote that a mentor

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Speaker 2: told me when I was growing up, and that was,

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Speaker 2: if you're not embarrassed by the first version of your product,

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Speaker 2: you've launched too late. Yeah maybe you've heard. Yeah, I

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Speaker 2: like that, and that really resonated with me. So when

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Speaker 2: it comes to creative work, it's like so important to

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Speaker 2: put work out there in real time to get feedback

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Speaker 2: from people. So sometimes it's like, and you know this,

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Speaker 2: this is a big part of marketing as well, especially

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Speaker 2: like creative In marketing, you know, we never test one ad.

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Speaker 2: We test hundreds thousands of ads, and we look at

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Speaker 2: the data to what's performing and then we can double

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Speaker 2: down on that. So the thing that I love so

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Speaker 2: much about marketing is the intersection between creativity and data

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Speaker 2: because creativity is very much so subjective a lot of

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Speaker 2: the time, the data is much more black and white,

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Speaker 2: and then when you find the middle ground, it's like

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Speaker 2: you there's like magic in that. So I think, for yeah,

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Speaker 2: anyone doing something creative and this isn't showing friends and family. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: this is actually like pushing things out there. You know,

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Speaker 2: there's so many Instagram just released a new feature now

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Speaker 2: where you can basically create dark posts that don't appear

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Speaker 2: on your feed or your story, your followers don't see it,

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Speaker 2: and you get real time feedback. It's like you should

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Speaker 2: be using that daily to test ideas, you know, so

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Speaker 2: just keep shipping and yeah, that's that's my approach to it,

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Speaker 2: and what about that?

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Speaker 1: Like so and again this will run between like creative

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Speaker 1: and business. But like that, if you get a knockback

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Speaker 1: obviously the Arson was like huge knockback for you. If

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Speaker 1: you get like a knockback from say someone's like I

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Speaker 1: don't like that, like product feedback or somebody doesn't like

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Speaker 1: something you put out there, how do you kind of

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Speaker 1: be like, Okay, like that's okay, that's one person's opinion.

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Speaker 1: I don't need to take that on. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: keep like, do you know what I mean? I know

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Speaker 1: this is more of a psychological question, but like how

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Speaker 1: do you keep going big picture focus and not let

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Speaker 1: the little stuff kind of like weigh you down or

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Speaker 1: get in the way.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think because I see some people really maybe

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Speaker 2: struggling with this, like in the comments and like seeking

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Speaker 2: validation through others, and I think that that's probably something

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Speaker 2: that I haven't had to deal with so much, mainly

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Speaker 2: because my circle in life is so small, Like I

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Speaker 2: really just stick to my people. Yeah, like it's it's

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Speaker 2: a it's just a tight knit career. So I like that, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: that kind of benefits me in the way that like

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Speaker 2: I'm not there's not a whole lot of external energy

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Speaker 2: getting put on me because I'm not surrounded by like

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Speaker 2: all these people. It's like it's family and friends, you

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Speaker 2: know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: And you need no external validation. And so if you

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Speaker 1: see like a yeah quote or whatever, you just like

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Speaker 1: like yeah comment, You're just like okay, cool.

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Speaker 2: I think you know, people are going to love or

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Speaker 2: hate it, And the scary part is if they've got

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Speaker 2: no opinion at all, you know. So that's what I'm noticing,

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Speaker 2: like now seeing you know, people that are basically pushing

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Speaker 2: culture forward. It's so split people either like strongly disagree

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Speaker 2: or strongly agree with the work that they're doing, so

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Speaker 2: at least you're getting some kind of feedback.

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Speaker 1: That's such a good way of looking at you mentioned

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Speaker 1: before mentors. How important to you is having a mentor?

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Speaker 1: Like especially, I think like business ideas and like going

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Speaker 1: out on a limb can be really scary. So I

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Speaker 1: know you had a mental in you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, multiple, I've been so so blessed to have them, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: throughout my life. And it's yeah, it's like so so important.

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Speaker 2: If you've got a dream, the quickest way to get

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Speaker 2: there is to find someone that's already doing it and

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Speaker 2: then to create like a beautiful two way street with

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Speaker 2: that person. So it's about figuring out what kind of

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Speaker 2: value can bring to these kind of people that are

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Speaker 2: ahead of you, and then often they'll see something in

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Speaker 2: you that they had when they were your age. That's

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Speaker 2: usually the dynamic. Yeah, And then yeah, it's just in

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Speaker 2: terms of like you know, learning and leveling up, mentors

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Speaker 2: are the best way to do it.

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, I love it. I also think as well,

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Speaker 1: like I don't know if it's an AUSSIU mentality, but

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Speaker 1: we don't ask for help that often. But like I

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Speaker 1: know living in America, that's where I see a bit

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Speaker 1: of a difference of like yes, ask for help or

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Speaker 1: oh you do all these different things. Oh amazing, Like

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Speaker 1: you'll feel you feel like you're being championed, even if

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Speaker 1: it's a weird idea or a bit.

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Speaker 2: Left of that's all right. Yeah. I was in the

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Speaker 2: US last year and I just love how big everyone's thinking.

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Speaker 2: It had been because most of my like my dad's

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Speaker 2: side of the family are in DC, so I used

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Speaker 2: to go a little bit when I was younger. It'd

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Speaker 2: been a few years. Yeah, and just how they're like

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Speaker 2: they're thinking so big, dreaming so big. It just felt

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Speaker 2: so uplifting. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like anything is celebrated there. It's so it's

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Speaker 1: so fascinating as a creative being an actor in Australia

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Speaker 1: getting zero wins, they're like no, no, you know, in Australia,

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Speaker 1: they're like, you're a nutritionist, Stainulane, you're a podcast so

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Speaker 1: stainu Lane. You go to America, they're like, oh, you're

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Speaker 1: a nutrition Its amazing that you're a podcaster. Oh even better,

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Speaker 1: Like they just love the more things that you do

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Speaker 1: and the more opportunities for them to sell you. So

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Speaker 1: it's like an add on bonus. Really yeah, so good.

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Speaker 1: He is fascinating, like looking at the two industries. I

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Speaker 1: can't sit opposite you without asking about the moment when

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Speaker 1: you I think you were living in your office you

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Speaker 1: get a call from Bianca. Yes, Kanye West wife, that's right,

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Speaker 1: and she's like, right, we need help. But it was

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Speaker 1: like a very like forty eight hour window that you

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Speaker 1: had to kind of like step up to the plate.

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Speaker 2: Is that right, that's correct?

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Speaker 1: Can you share this story?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Sure. So this was over a year ago now,

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Speaker 2: our February of twenty four and I was living on

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Speaker 2: my office floor. It was a beautiful office, but it

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Speaker 2: wasn't the best floor to be on.

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Speaker 1: I would have you put like curtains up, didn't you, because.

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Speaker 2: Staff would rock up every morning and like if I

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Speaker 2: wasn't ready, I was, oh so yeah. It was like

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Speaker 2: it had been a challenging year as well, you know,

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Speaker 2: like like everything, there's ups and downs. And one morning

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Speaker 2: I got the call from Bianca, like you said, and

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Speaker 2: it was I was actually it was just a bit

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Speaker 2: of a word like it's a blur now that I

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Speaker 2: think back, but they literally said that they had launched

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Speaker 2: a new website. The website wasn't working. They had a

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Speaker 2: Super Bowl ad that was going live in like the

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Speaker 2: following kind of forty eight hours, and then before you

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Speaker 2: know what, I was just thrown in. Yeah, a bunch

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Speaker 2: of texts with the team, spoke to the Chief of

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Speaker 2: staff CTO, and you know, got a custom with everyone,

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Speaker 2: and then we just got to work. And going back

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Speaker 2: to the point you made like success love speed, like

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Speaker 2: I thought I knew speed. I didn't know speed. You know,

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Speaker 2: that was a real eye opener to see, you know,

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Speaker 2: any problem, any task, anything that needed to happen. It

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Speaker 2: was just like right now, in this moment, who or

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Speaker 2: what do we need to do and then we do

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Speaker 2: it just like straight away.

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Speaker 1: Amrazy like So that was essentially a yeasy relaunch, right,

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Speaker 1: that's right? And is it true you didn't sleep for

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Speaker 1: forty eight hours? No, it was now you love sleep.

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Speaker 2: We know that this is bad. Like the rings around my.

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Speaker 1: Eyes were like, you know, so and I and obviously

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Speaker 1: there's a time difference America a stro oh yeah, and

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Speaker 1: so like you got up that morning and you're is

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Speaker 1: it true? Like the ad campaign had like all the

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Speaker 1: stuff you'd organized almost hadn't launched, like you'd read one

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Speaker 1: like website, Well talk me through, like because there's this

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Speaker 1: quote of you saying, like I got up in the morning,

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Speaker 1: everything wasn't was ready to roll out, but you knew

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Speaker 1: it was about to and it had already made five

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Speaker 1: million that morning.

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Speaker 2: Yeah what so Yeah, So the it was a mixture

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Speaker 2: of things. So this nineteen million dollar day, which is

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Speaker 2: what it was. Yeah, there was like a lot of

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Speaker 2: factors that contributed here. So the shop of five site

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Speaker 2: went live. The biggest contributor to that day was the

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Speaker 2: twenty dollars price point. So I got the message from

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Speaker 2: Yay and he was like, Okay, we're doing it. Now,

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Speaker 2: make everything twenty dollars on the site. Okay, here we go.

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Speaker 2: So the first thing that happened is that just went

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Speaker 2: viral and Reddit threads started appearing and it went crazy,

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Speaker 2: and then we launched social media ads. So you know,

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Speaker 2: I've sent the last kind of five years honing my

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Speaker 2: skills on out accounts, and you know, there was some

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Speaker 2: really awesome creative that Yay had given us. He was,

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Speaker 2: you know, sending songs from the Vultures album before they

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Speaker 2: had dropped it. Chopped this up, put it with this ad,

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Speaker 2: So that was really cool and the caption was just

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Speaker 2: everything twenty dollars. And he had an amazing podcast as

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Speaker 2: well where he was like, you know, I'm the robot

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Speaker 2: Robin Hood of fashion, you know, taking these high end

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Speaker 2: designs that are unattainable to the match line and bringing it,

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Speaker 2: you know, down at an affordable price. So that messaging

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Speaker 2: was so so cool. So we launched those ads that

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Speaker 2: ad account. We had an unlimited budget, so it was

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Speaker 2: kind of just like you know, cost cap just let

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Speaker 2: it go. And I went to bed and then this

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Speaker 2: was the end of the forty eight outputs, you know

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Speaker 2: what I mean.

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Speaker 1: It was like finally I can sleep now.

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Speaker 2: And then woke up again into the phone, you know,

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Speaker 2: going nuts. And that morning, yeah, the store had already

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Speaker 2: done five million USD by the time I had woken up,

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Speaker 2: and then the day just progressed and you know, the

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Speaker 2: super Bowl it went live, you know, that afternoon, and yeah,

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Speaker 2: just about cracked twenty million for the day.

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Speaker 1: And is it true you got a call from Yate

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Speaker 1: Like that was the first.

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Speaker 2: Time that he called me that morning, and he basically said,

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Speaker 2: now that this is working, I'd like to give you

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Speaker 2: the vision and He went on to talk about yeah,

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Speaker 2: what news he meant and where we were headed over

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Speaker 2: the next few months.

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Speaker 1: As someone that's both a creative and has an incredible

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Speaker 1: business brain, I'm talking about you, by the way, what

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Speaker 1: did you What did that call teach you? Like obviously,

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Speaker 1: like you're dealing with somebody that has like unlimited resources

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Speaker 1: already a huge profile, and like it must have like

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Speaker 1: given you a taste of like, oh, this is where

434
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:49,800
Speaker 1: you get to play, Like that's right.

435
00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:55,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that sometimes it's easy to you know,

436
00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:58,800
Speaker 2: stare at the numbers of a business or like think

437
00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,080
Speaker 2: too much with your brain and not enough with your

438
00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:04,719
Speaker 2: heart when it comes to making decisions. So you know,

439
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:06,840
Speaker 2: the reason that I get up and do what I

440
00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,920
Speaker 2: do every day is because I'm obsessed with creativity and innovation.

441
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:13,960
Speaker 2: Those things just like they're the things that really get

442
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:16,720
Speaker 2: me inspired. And if you focus on that and you

443
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:21,000
Speaker 2: focus on the right people, everything else is consequent, like impact, money,

444
00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:23,000
Speaker 2: like all of that's on the other side of that.

445
00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 2: So first, it's like how you bring you know, value

446
00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:29,800
Speaker 2: to the people that you're working with and working for,

447
00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:33,399
Speaker 2: and also like what are you doing in terms of

448
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:36,639
Speaker 2: just making impact and doing something so radical that no

449
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:39,600
Speaker 2: one's ever seen before. So it's like just getting back

450
00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 2: to that, you know. That was a reminder that we

451
00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:45,919
Speaker 2: just as creatives, like, that's what we need to focus on.

452
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:48,560
Speaker 2: That's how superpower. Everything else should be secondary.

453
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:51,000
Speaker 1: I love it. I love it. Oh my gosh. I

454
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:52,359
Speaker 1: could talk to you all day long, by the way,

455
00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:55,359
Speaker 1: just so you know you're amazing than you can. I

456
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:59,160
Speaker 1: also talk to you about the TikTok agency that you've

457
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 1: built as well, creative converters. I am an Alder millennial.

458
00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:07,360
Speaker 1: I'm thirty nine, so I'm.

459
00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:10,000
Speaker 2: Really I would have said like I was. I was

460
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:11,720
Speaker 2: thinking about it for like thirty one thirty.

461
00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:15,119
Speaker 1: Too, very kind, that's very very great, thank you. But

462
00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 1: I am of the generation of like Instagram was like

463
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,960
Speaker 1: the be all and end all and then like like

464
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:26,959
Speaker 1: danced in YouTuber with YouTube a little bit, but then

465
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:29,200
Speaker 1: TikTok was always like is it going to get canceled?

466
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 1: Is it going to go ahead? Like and being in

467
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:33,360
Speaker 1: America as well, we lost it for twenty four hours,

468
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:34,080
Speaker 1: do you know? Did you know?

469
00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, I mean I was like kind of out

470
00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:38,320
Speaker 2: of it by then. I sold the visits, so I

471
00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:40,200
Speaker 2: wasn't really so focused on TikTok.

472
00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:42,560
Speaker 1: But yes, it was so fascinating though, because everyone was

473
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,440
Speaker 1: like doing it as if it had never exist again

474
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:47,639
Speaker 1: did these like goodbye and like Gate like admitted all

475
00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 1: this crazy stuff. So it was really strange.

476
00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 2: Started trending in the US as well, which is like

477
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:56,960
Speaker 2: a Chinese app that's really similar really, and it was

478
00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:00,480
Speaker 2: like all these like Americans flooding onto this like which

479
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:04,080
Speaker 2: was just a Chinese application completely. Yeah, it was crazy.

480
00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:06,800
Speaker 2: Twenty four hours. I'm waiting for the next platform, Like

481
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:09,879
Speaker 2: I'm really exciting it, yeah, because I think it feels

482
00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,960
Speaker 2: like TikTok's been around foreveryone. Yeah, but it actually hasn't.

483
00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:16,240
Speaker 2: Like it wasn't that long ago that we didn't have it. No,

484
00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:20,399
Speaker 2: and I feel like we're due years here first for

485
00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 2: a new platform.

486
00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:25,000
Speaker 1: I'm there, I'm there. But yeah, so I guess like

487
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:28,119
Speaker 1: I'm someone that like dips their toe into TikTok and

488
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 1: then I'm like, oh, I'm not getting track, and I'll

489
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 1: just like abandon ship and just be like, well, instance

490
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 1: never it's my fail safe. But I imagine that's absolutely

491
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:37,120
Speaker 1: the wrong thing to do after what we've talked about

492
00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,359
Speaker 1: for the last like twenty minutes. Or so as like

493
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 1: it's how important is consistency?

494
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:45,880
Speaker 2: Well for everyone listening. I just want to say again

495
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,040
Speaker 2: because we spoke off Mike, but I've been following you

496
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:52,000
Speaker 2: for six seven years out and found you through Instagram,

497
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,240
Speaker 2: I think if you do that platform so well, so

498
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:59,200
Speaker 2: it's like rather than trying to do everything, like okay, yeah,

499
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 2: I still think folks on one platform or two platforms

500
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:05,000
Speaker 2: and just doing that extremely well is like the way

501
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:05,800
Speaker 2: to go amazing.

502
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:06,600
Speaker 1: Okay, that's good.

503
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 2: Favorite.

504
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:09,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, the pod Alive I love. I don't know if

505
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 1: you've noticed this because you've been on a couple of

506
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 1: pods now, but I think you'll see the people that

507
00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:17,040
Speaker 1: are obsessive with I am fucking obsessed with podcasting. I

508
00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:20,119
Speaker 1: love it so much. And everyone's like, oh yeah, but

509
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:22,280
Speaker 1: you've got to be like the biggest podcast in the

510
00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:24,919
Speaker 1: world to make money. I'm like, I don't care, Like

511
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:28,720
Speaker 1: I am obsessed with podcasting, like I would do it

512
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:30,919
Speaker 1: till the cows come home. And so I think, like,

513
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 1: if you find something, and this is where I'm excited

514
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:35,200
Speaker 1: now to like talk about your creativity and stuff, because

515
00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:38,680
Speaker 1: you started doing video content, like you were filming videos

516
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 1: for people, right content creators.

517
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 2: Like you're talking about day one, Day one, isn't that? Yeah?

518
00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 1: There was actually skate videos, yeah.

519
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 2: Day one, Like my very first job ever was making

520
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:55,919
Speaker 2: meditations like audios. Really yeah that was that was first video.

521
00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 1: With like doing all the sound yourself.

522
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:01,680
Speaker 2: That's right, yeah, environ so really Yeah. I was living

523
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:03,480
Speaker 2: in Buying Vas a seventeen year old, and there was

524
00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,000
Speaker 2: like there's a lot of yes, you know, coaches, their life,

525
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:08,560
Speaker 2: spiritual business, all of that.

526
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 1: I love that you change your intonation is yeah, a

527
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:14,720
Speaker 1: lot of like live coaches. It's so true though, it

528
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:15,639
Speaker 1: is so true.

529
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:19,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I basically tapped into that niche. I mean

530
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:20,639
Speaker 2: I had such a love for sound.

531
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 1: Yeah.

532
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:23,080
Speaker 2: So I was doing a lot of field recordings in

533
00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:25,679
Speaker 2: the National Park there and getting ocean and waves and

534
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 2: then synthesizers like pads and understanding bin oial beats.

535
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:31,800
Speaker 1: And oh my goodness in my.

536
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 2: Room mixing these and it was like crazy. I had

537
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 2: to take constant breaks because when you make binorial beats

538
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:38,840
Speaker 2: yourself and you're listening to it for hours on it

539
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,120
Speaker 2: because you're actually creating it, eventually get a little bit loopy.

540
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,399
Speaker 1: To the listener. Those beats therefore super calming like is

541
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,040
Speaker 1: it the delta brain wave that's doing yeah.

542
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 2: Meditation and correct, Yeah, it changes your brain waves. So

543
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 2: and then clients would come in and with a microphone

544
00:26:56,080 --> 00:27:02,639
Speaker 2: like this one. Yeah, they would okay yeah yeah and

545
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 2: basically do a voice over for like an hour and

546
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:05,760
Speaker 2: then I'd give it to them and they pay me.

547
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,359
Speaker 2: I love that. That was the first job.

548
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:11,400
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, I love it. And then so you're

549
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,160
Speaker 1: a surfer and a skater as well, right right, so

550
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: then yeah, I figured I was like.

551
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:16,920
Speaker 2: Something's never changed.

552
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:17,959
Speaker 1: Is this a skap injury?

553
00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 2: Yeah that's right. Yeah, so good.

554
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:25,440
Speaker 1: So then did were you self taught for like creating videos?

555
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 2: Yes? Yeah, yeah picked up like like mum had like

556
00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 2: a like a fifty dollars flip camera.

557
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:33,600
Speaker 1: How good are they?

558
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 2: So good? I still got it. Now I'm trying to

559
00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 2: find one.

560
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:39,760
Speaker 1: Yeah it's like vintage now no, yeah, it's.

561
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:41,880
Speaker 2: That's such a fun. And I was always like, you know, mom,

562
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 2: like I want the good one, and now I go back,

563
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,120
Speaker 2: thank you Mom, Actually the best one.

564
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:49,680
Speaker 1: Yeah that's what you want. The camcorder, that's right.

565
00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:52,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, so like making skate videos on that, and then

566
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 2: just went from went from there.

567
00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: And then to cut my brain's like a pink pool machine.

568
00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:00,919
Speaker 1: I probably should have like told you that. So to

569
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,560
Speaker 1: cut to now, and you're focused on like singing songwriting

570
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 1: or you're working, so you're are you back to producing music?

571
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:08,240
Speaker 2: Now?

572
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:08,679
Speaker 1: Talk to me?

573
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:11,639
Speaker 2: I have not produced music in a while.

574
00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 1: Why do I have that in my notes? Own creativity

575
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:17,640
Speaker 1: surve skating videographer, singer, songwriter?

576
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:19,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, sing a songwriter? Yeah?

577
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:21,000
Speaker 1: Okay, am I saying the wrong terms?

578
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:27,439
Speaker 2: Surely? So I I write a lot of music and

579
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 2: I work very closely with a producer Jamo.

580
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 1: Yeah.

581
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:33,040
Speaker 2: Shout out to Jammer. Yeah. Yeah, And a few years ago,

582
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 2: you know, we had an incredible run, did a lot

583
00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 2: of buzzy festivals. We did release the track maybe like

584
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,240
Speaker 2: six months ago together. So yeah, music's very much so

585
00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 2: a huge part of my life. And Jamo, you should

586
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 2: check him out because he's killing it. So what I

587
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 2: grew up with and yeah, he's just got his outlook

588
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 2: on life comes through his music really and it's high

589
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 2: energy and fun.

590
00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 1: Oh I love it. So if we could look because

591
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:03,280
Speaker 1: you're really amazing at like getting shit done, like big

592
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 1: stuff and then having no attachment to it, like the

593
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:08,760
Speaker 1: way you're comfortable like to sell when it's time to sell,

594
00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:10,960
Speaker 1: to move on and be like all right next. So

595
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 1: if we can look into a crystal ball, I know

596
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 1: you're like focused on values of like fam bam and

597
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 1: all of that. That kind of part of your life

598
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,760
Speaker 1: as well. Is if we look into a crystal ball, now,

599
00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:23,800
Speaker 1: is it you've set yourself up to a level where

600
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 1: you're like, I can focus on that or is it like, hey,

601
00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:30,360
Speaker 1: they're sing the creative stuff like I don't know, talk

602
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 1: to me.

603
00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I mean I'll explain kind of like the

604
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,040
Speaker 2: sale of Creative Converts, like how that's segued into what

605
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:40,240
Speaker 2: I'm doing now. So I was running Future and Creative

606
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:44,080
Speaker 2: Converters like simultaneous. Obviously both had, you know, really solid teams.

607
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 2: So when I started Creative Converters, is it was because

608
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,720
Speaker 2: of the love for making video content and audio. So

609
00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 2: I was making everything. I would find the talent, I'll

610
00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:56,280
Speaker 2: create briefs, I would film and I would edit it,

611
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 2: give it to the client, yourself, everything one man band.

612
00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:04,040
Speaker 2: I like, yeah, and then you know you fast forward

613
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,920
Speaker 2: for years and my job at Creative Converters was a

614
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:13,760
Speaker 2: mixture of legal finance, HR and putting putting out fires. Yeah, yeah,

615
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 2: and I hadn't touched a video camera for like, I

616
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 2: couldn't even remember. And you know, after selling that business

617
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 2: and going full time on Future, you know, I kind

618
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 2: of I'm CMO in that company, you know, founder and Cinema,

619
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:30,080
Speaker 2: and the first thing I did was started making videos

620
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:32,640
Speaker 2: again and that's what I'm still doing again. So you know,

621
00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 2: I get to do what I love and that's that's

622
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,400
Speaker 2: what I'm I'm focused on at the moment now. And

623
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 2: you know, opportunities to talk with people like yourself on

624
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:43,960
Speaker 2: camera and you know, vlogging and things like that. I'm

625
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,320
Speaker 2: just bringing video back into my life.

626
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:50,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, well you're nailing it, my friend. And then so

627
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 1: is that kind of your barometer for how you make choices?

628
00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 1: It's like find that passion in what you're doing and

629
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 1: then like absolutely checking back in and be like, hang on,

630
00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:59,760
Speaker 1: I haven't touched a camera for like a couple of years,

631
00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 1: and hr is like fun for someone else, you know,

632
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:06,880
Speaker 1: Like is that kind of like your process? Do you

633
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 1: just be like, Okay, do you check in with yourself

634
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:11,840
Speaker 1: if the passion is still there?

635
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 2: I check him with that like in a child, I'm

636
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,400
Speaker 2: just check in with him, and I'm like is this

637
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:19,560
Speaker 2: dope to you? Yeah, because if it is, then it's

638
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 2: dope to me as well. But if not, then maybe

639
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:23,280
Speaker 2: we've gone off course a little bit.

640
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 1: And what about like with selling, right, how do you

641
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 1: know when to let go on an emotional level? Because

642
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 1: I think like when I've sold a business before and

643
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 1: I've closed the business before, and it's there's little ego

644
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 1: death that goes on, and you're like, Okay, this thing

645
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: I thought i'd have forever or I thought it'd do

646
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 1: really well. The reality is it's not at certain times

647
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:52,480
Speaker 1: of the year. So yeah, I'm gonna sell this thing

648
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: right now. And I to be honest, I had a

649
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: smoothie bart and I to sell it, I had to

650
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 1: do a lot of therapy to understand like that it

651
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,120
Speaker 1: wasn't I was making a choice out of emotion. Like

652
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 1: I had to not make the choice out of emotion.

653
00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 1: I had to make it out of like just a

654
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 1: really clear lens and understanding that the business wasn't me.

655
00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, right, yes, So how do you do

656
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 2: that well with creative converters? Greta who purchased the business,

657
00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:21,320
Speaker 2: was I know gret Greta.

658
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, from back in the heyday.

659
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:24,880
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, so good. So Greta was the person that

660
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 2: told me to start it in the first place. She

661
00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:28,840
Speaker 2: was like, you know, I was making some videos for her.

662
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 2: She's like, you should make this an agency. So she

663
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:35,160
Speaker 2: knew like the whole founding team, like all the stuff.

664
00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 2: She'd been there. She was at every office, she was

665
00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:40,360
Speaker 2: at the parties. You know, she was so close to

666
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:42,400
Speaker 2: me and close to everyone. I think if it had

667
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: just been some like random you know, whether it be

668
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:47,760
Speaker 2: like venture capital or an agency, and there wasn't that

669
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 2: connection there, it would have been a lot harder. Yeah,

670
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 2: but I knew that, you know, this was like going

671
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 2: to the right person and she, you know, she was

672
00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:56,440
Speaker 2: going to take care of.

673
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 1: I went to a good place, go into good hand exactly.

674
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 2: It was in a way, it's still in the circle. Yeah.

675
00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:06,800
Speaker 1: No, I love that. Yeah, I think as well. Like

676
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 1: so you speak so beautifully though about this like non

677
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 1: attachment to outside things, even though you've got some awesome

678
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,880
Speaker 1: outside things, like your career is I would say careers.

679
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 1: So how do we like practice like not like not

680
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 1: having our worth attached to like how successful business that

681
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 1: we're really passionate about, Like, yeah, how do you separate that.

682
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:36,880
Speaker 2: That's a really good question. I think growing up, I

683
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 2: moved countries like seven eight times. I did eleven schools.

684
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:44,520
Speaker 2: You know, parents were you know, working and just living

685
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:46,480
Speaker 2: even you know, from before I was born, they'd already

686
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 2: spent ten twenty years you know, traveling.

687
00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:49,320
Speaker 1: The world legends.

688
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:54,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. Yeah, So that constant process of like you know,

689
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:57,560
Speaker 2: uprooting and then moving to a new city and new country,

690
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:00,880
Speaker 2: meeting new friends and doing that. It's like that I

691
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 2: got pretty good at being adaptable and not holding onto anything.

692
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 2: And I strive the older I get, the more I

693
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:09,839
Speaker 2: now strive for a minimalist life.

694
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 1: Like if you know, you're preaching to the choir, friend,

695
00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 1: that's it.

696
00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 2: If I you know, I moved to Indonesia a year

697
00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:18,239
Speaker 2: and a half ago and spent eighteen months living there

698
00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:21,200
Speaker 2: in airbnbs and also doing a lot of traveling, and

699
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:22,880
Speaker 2: then when I came back here and got an apartment,

700
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,440
Speaker 2: like it is just so bare, I don't have anything.

701
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 2: I plan to keep it that way.

702
00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:31,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so nice. And also this might sound really psychological,

703
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:33,840
Speaker 1: but your mind's clearer with less clutter.

704
00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 2: Mind is so much clearer with less clutter, just less

705
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 2: going on, less is better.

706
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 1: One hundred million percent. Okay, So sitting opposite you, you

707
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:47,080
Speaker 1: feel very like zen and you're giving Byron vive Bali,

708
00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:52,239
Speaker 1: Byron Surfar all that. But I've heard you say that

709
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,640
Speaker 1: you are able to stay calm in the really good

710
00:34:55,719 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 1: times but also in the bad times. And I'm quite

711
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:02,600
Speaker 1: a reactive person if I'm honest to you. So if

712
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:05,200
Speaker 1: I'm stressed, I can like turn into it. My boyfriend

713
00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:07,439
Speaker 1: will tell you I can turn into a tornado, like

714
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:12,600
Speaker 1: from zero to one hundred very quickly. Yeah, So it's

715
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: about like or if like something stressing out, whether it's

716
00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 1: an audition or something, or the timeline gets changed, I'm like,

717
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:24,440
Speaker 1: fuck control freak over here. So how do you find

718
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:27,560
Speaker 1: that like inner calmness in like good times, because I

719
00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 1: feel like it's easy to be like pretty chill and

720
00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 1: the good times because the stress is lower. But then

721
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:34,840
Speaker 1: in the bad times or when the steaks feel really high,

722
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 1: or how do you find that?

723
00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:41,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, I sometimes the good times the stakes can be

724
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:49,280
Speaker 2: even higher expectation expectations, but also you know, making moves

725
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:52,760
Speaker 2: that you know you've got like this like false confidence

726
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,840
Speaker 2: because like you nothing can go wrong and everything's so

727
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,719
Speaker 2: great and it's like remember that won't last. So it's

728
00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:01,839
Speaker 2: like so important yea to be cool and common both.

729
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,000
Speaker 2: But like first, I think it's just like breath Like

730
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:05,640
Speaker 2: you have to breathe through these things, you know what

731
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:07,600
Speaker 2: I mean, Like as soon as you go into your

732
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:11,680
Speaker 2: head and freak out about something, it triggers like that, yeah,

733
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:16,719
Speaker 2: reactive kind of response. So you know something that I

734
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 2: used to say to my team because they would get

735
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:24,720
Speaker 2: extremely worried in stressful situations, and I would just anchor

736
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 2: it with like, you know, we're not frontline health workers,

737
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 2: you know, and like shout out to frontline health workers

738
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:33,160
Speaker 2: because that's stressful, Like you know, you've got no choice,

739
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 2: you know, we're making videos like it's okay, like you know,

740
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 2: we're going to go home to our houses tonight, everyone's

741
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 2: going to eat, We're gonna wake up tomorrow morning and

742
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 2: keep going. So yeah, it's just like just perspective, I

743
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 2: think as well. And you know, traveling does that as

744
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,080
Speaker 2: well for people, Like people should travel and just like

745
00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 2: go see the world and just see like how other

746
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:57,279
Speaker 2: people are doing it. Because yeah, for the most part,

747
00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 2: like our problems are not perspective, but in the moment,

748
00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:04,920
Speaker 2: it's all relative. So in the moment. It's so okay

749
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 2: to get stressed like that. But we can make a

750
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:08,600
Speaker 2: lot clearer decisions if we just like anchor it back

751
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 2: to something to give the bigger.

752
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:13,000
Speaker 1: Picture and back to the way you were saying, like

753
00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: success love speed, like fail quick, learn quick, that's right,

754
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:19,640
Speaker 1: onto the next one quick, because you get like it's

755
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:21,719
Speaker 1: a bit like what you were saying that first door

756
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 1: to door salesman kind of job. Is like you were

757
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 1: so able to figure out that it was a numbers game,

758
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:30,560
Speaker 1: and I think if you can think that in business

759
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:33,720
Speaker 1: as well, objection is going to be part of the game,

760
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 1: like failing is going to be part of it. So

761
00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:38,960
Speaker 1: if you can figure that out real quick and be

762
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:42,480
Speaker 1: like all right, yeah, this feels a little bit uncomfy,

763
00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: but we're gonna like get up and try again now,

764
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:49,160
Speaker 1: as opposed to like that's right looking our wounds, you

765
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:49,719
Speaker 1: know what I mean.

766
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just an essential part of the process. It's

767
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:55,440
Speaker 2: an essential ingredient. That's so yeah. I just love the

768
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 2: name of your podcast.

769
00:37:56,560 --> 00:38:01,440
Speaker 1: So I have to ask, wow, and I've got this

770
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 1: like highlighted underlined, how do you sell yourself as a creative?

771
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:10,279
Speaker 1: And I know that's like a hard loaded but like

772
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:14,400
Speaker 1: even even like in Australia talk Bobby syndrome is a

773
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,400
Speaker 1: bit of a thing. And like if you're the creative,

774
00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 1: if you're the person, like so if we look at

775
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:25,759
Speaker 1: your like musical career or like and like you even

776
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:27,840
Speaker 1: said you're like, hey, I've started blogging kind of sharing

777
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:29,799
Speaker 1: my life and kind of like sharing a day in

778
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 1: the life and all of that, Like is that the

779
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:35,520
Speaker 1: way is it to just sell it to kind of

780
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 1: so is.

781
00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 2: This selling to an audience or to like clients as a.

782
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 1: Oh see, I love that your brain and my brain

783
00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:43,520
Speaker 1: doesn't even get that far.

784
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,600
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, because I feel like that so when it

785
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:51,160
Speaker 2: comes to selling to clients, because I like I was

786
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:53,160
Speaker 2: that creative person that didn't know how to sell myself,

787
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:54,799
Speaker 2: you know when I was young, and I was really

788
00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:57,480
Speaker 2: fortunate to you know, go through some sales trainings and

789
00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 2: be in the right rooms and learn and that just

790
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:05,640
Speaker 2: really starts with like communication, like learning how to communicate

791
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:08,839
Speaker 2: to people. And that's like if the creative people need

792
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:12,759
Speaker 2: to learn sales, you know, and they it's nearly like

793
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:15,680
Speaker 2: some some creatives look at them and they're like oh no,

794
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 2: like no, no, no, But like it's so important because

795
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:22,279
Speaker 2: sales is like its just communication with people, Like do

796
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:25,360
Speaker 2: you know, like how to really like understand someone and

797
00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:29,920
Speaker 2: see if like what you do will help them with something.

798
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:32,239
Speaker 2: That could be going to a concert, taken into a

799
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:35,560
Speaker 2: really special place through your music, or that could be

800
00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:38,360
Speaker 2: creating a video for them to tell the world about

801
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:40,239
Speaker 2: what they do or anything like that.

802
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,239
Speaker 1: So this comes back to where you've said people buy

803
00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 1: with emotion and then justify with logic. So then if

804
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:51,960
Speaker 1: sales is just really good communication, well, then as a consumer,

805
00:39:52,920 --> 00:39:57,000
Speaker 1: if I feel like what you're sharing is like honest communication,

806
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:00,720
Speaker 1: and I think that's really important. Feel it's like you've.

807
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:02,640
Speaker 2: Got to be real one hundred percent. You've got to

808
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 2: be real and authentic. So that's like clients with the audience,

809
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,040
Speaker 2: I think that's what the audiences are craving.

810
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:07,600
Speaker 1: Got it?

811
00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:10,239
Speaker 2: And I'm still working this out, like yeah, by no.

812
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:12,120
Speaker 1: Means share all your tricks, my friends.

813
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 2: I'm not a master of you know, like the whole

814
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:16,400
Speaker 2: like personal brand audience. I'm at the start of my

815
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:17,320
Speaker 2: journey now.

816
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:18,640
Speaker 1: Like oh you're doing great.

817
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:21,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, but thank you. But I think just people want

818
00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:24,520
Speaker 2: to see like, yeah, the real, raw version of what's

819
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 2: going on, and sometimes the most mundane things to you

820
00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:30,520
Speaker 2: or I that we do on a daily basis. Others

821
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:32,759
Speaker 2: are like, oh my gosh, So you know, I see

822
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,120
Speaker 2: a lot of musicians like just like show they've set

823
00:40:35,160 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 2: up a webcam in the studio.

824
00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 1: And like, oh I love it.

825
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:41,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, and screen records you're already doing it. It's just like,

826
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:46,600
Speaker 2: you know, it's when I think maybe the the trap

827
00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:48,760
Speaker 2: that some people fall into, and I've definitely done this myself,

828
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:50,800
Speaker 2: is thinking that if you're going to start pushing content

829
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:53,239
Speaker 2: out into the world, regardless of what it is you're doing,

830
00:40:53,320 --> 00:40:54,839
Speaker 2: you have to like wear this mask or.

831
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:56,960
Speaker 1: Like, oh I feel like that day's gone now.

832
00:40:57,040 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's just hard to keep up. It's like,

833
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:01,040
Speaker 2: you know, it's just so haring to like, you know,

834
00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:04,560
Speaker 2: if you just be yourself, like, that's a lot easier.

835
00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:06,920
Speaker 1: I even sometimes I will notice if I'm watching it

836
00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:09,560
Speaker 1: into a story, I'm like, why is this gorgeous person

837
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:10,879
Speaker 1: using a filter all the time?

838
00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:11,480
Speaker 2: Exactly?

839
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:14,279
Speaker 1: I feel like those days are gone, like just like

840
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:17,720
Speaker 1: and I also think when you talk about like marketing

841
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:23,920
Speaker 1: being communication, I'm going to respond better to get communication

842
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:28,400
Speaker 1: that feels like a connection, whether it's as an audience

843
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:31,400
Speaker 1: member even as a consumer, like I know I'm going

844
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:33,400
Speaker 1: to buy the skincare where I feel like I'm getting

845
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 1: to see in real time, like how it works, how

846
00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 1: I apply it, how.

847
00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:38,640
Speaker 2: I you know it's right?

848
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:41,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, And so I don't know, I feel like it

849
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:43,560
Speaker 1: all comes back to like this. I mean I might

850
00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 1: be hippie in saying this, but like very real and

851
00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:48,959
Speaker 1: just like no bs and no, I think those days

852
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:50,760
Speaker 1: are the fake gone.

853
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:53,759
Speaker 2: I think so to one hundred percent. And for businesses

854
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:55,920
Speaker 2: as well, I think that you know, people now want

855
00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:58,360
Speaker 2: to connect with other people, and a lot of the

856
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:01,480
Speaker 2: big companies are realizing that. How more and more you

857
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 2: see like creator Lad, like you know, there's a face

858
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,200
Speaker 2: to it. Yeah, and you get to live with that

859
00:42:07,239 --> 00:42:10,360
Speaker 2: person and they're who you're engaging with, not just the business.

860
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:13,759
Speaker 1: So totally yeah, final question, because like I said, I

861
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:17,560
Speaker 1: could talk to you all flipping day long advice. If

862
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:19,359
Speaker 1: someone's listening to this and they're like, I think I've

863
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:21,360
Speaker 1: got an idea, I think I want to do something,

864
00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 1: but obviously the next stage is paralyzing sometimes or we

865
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 1: get that decision paralysis. We're like, oh, I don't know,

866
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:31,520
Speaker 1: do I need to do this first, I need to,

867
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:36,600
Speaker 1: Like it can feel really overwhelming. What advice do you have?

868
00:42:37,239 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 2: So what you said information paralysis, decision paralysis, Like that's

869
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:45,400
Speaker 2: a killer. You don't need to know everything to get started.

870
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 2: You just need to know the next step. Like, don't

871
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:51,439
Speaker 2: try and learn absolutely everything, you'll learn on the way

872
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:56,680
Speaker 2: by failing chat GPT, Like there's more information in your

873
00:42:56,680 --> 00:42:59,040
Speaker 2: pocket than there ever has been. You just ask it,

874
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:02,279
Speaker 2: what is the critical path to getting this live? Like

875
00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:05,160
Speaker 2: what you know? Step by step? And it doesn't need

876
00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 2: to be fancy. There's so much technology out there now,

877
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 2: whether you're making music or you're a service provider or

878
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:15,719
Speaker 2: you've got a product anything like that. Like literally things

879
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 2: can be like set up in a day now, but

880
00:43:18,760 --> 00:43:21,279
Speaker 2: it won't be the best, yeah, you know, but it'll

881
00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:23,759
Speaker 2: be something, yeah, and it'll be a start for you.

882
00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:27,200
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think just figure out what is the

883
00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:31,319
Speaker 2: critical path to just getting the minimum viable product out

884
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:32,719
Speaker 2: there of what it is that you're trying to do

885
00:43:33,800 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 2: and take that step. Now.

886
00:43:36,800 --> 00:43:40,040
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, I just wish that that I like

887
00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:42,480
Speaker 1: had I'm going to listen to this whenever I'm having

888
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 1: a shitty day and just like you're like I feel

889
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 1: like a good luck charm to like everyone to just

890
00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:52,080
Speaker 1: keep in their pocket. How it feels no, weh. Thank

891
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,479
Speaker 1: you so much for jumping on this pod. I am

892
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:57,200
Speaker 1: so excited to see what comes next for you.

893
00:43:57,200 --> 00:44:00,839
Speaker 2: You are incredible, amazing. Thank you so much for having me, Lola,

894
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 2: You're incredible.

895
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 1: That's a wrap on another episode of Fearlessly Failing. As always,

896
00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 1: thank you to our guests and let's continue the conversation

897
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 1: on Instagram. I'm at Yamo Lollaberry. This potty my work

898
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:24,759
Speaker 1: for podcast is available on all streaming platforms. I'd love

899
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:27,840
Speaker 1: it if you could subscribe, rate and comment and of

900
00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:29,439
Speaker 1: course spread the love.