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Speaker 1: As we've just been discussing. We know Northern Territory Parliament

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Speaker 1: yesterday passing legislation which will mean we have the strongest

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Speaker 1: bail laws in Australia, the Chief Minister said on the

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Speaker 1: show yesterday corrections and police will be reviewing who's on bail.

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Speaker 1: We also know changes are not only going to impact

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Speaker 1: the decisions that judges make, but also our Northern Territory police. However,

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Speaker 1: in conjunction with that, we also have the police going

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Speaker 1: through a consent agreement when it comes to their pay.

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Speaker 2: And joining me in the studio.

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Speaker 1: Is the Northern Territory Police Association President Nathan Finn.

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Speaker 2: Good morning to you, Finny.

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Speaker 3: Good morning, Katy, Good morning to your listeners.

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Speaker 2: Phinny lots to cover off on.

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Speaker 1: Firstly, what was the reaction from the police to these

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Speaker 1: urgent changes that passed through yesterday?

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Speaker 3: With respect Katie, the government, can you reduce the new

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Speaker 3: bail laws. But without a properly funded police force and

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Speaker 3: a properly supported police force, they are meaningless to us.

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Speaker 1: So from your perspective, this will make no difference.

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Speaker 3: This police have an obligation to bail and have obligations

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Speaker 3: to comply with the legislation requires. We'll always do that, Katie,

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Speaker 3: and we always make sure that we're maintaining the safety

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Speaker 3: of the public, and the safety of the public is

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Speaker 3: our prime opportunity when we are considering bail.

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Speaker 1: But so I suppose from your perspective, as the president

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Speaker 1: of the Police Association, do you think it's going to

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Speaker 1: make any difference in terms of who's being bailed.

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Speaker 3: We haven't really had time to review what has come

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Speaker 3: out of yesterday, Katie. We've been tied up with the

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Speaker 3: negotiations with the consent agreement. But just like to say

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Speaker 3: that this government was elected on a law and order platform,

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Speaker 3: a platform that relies entirely on police to deliver, and

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Speaker 3: yet it comes to back in their own front line,

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Speaker 3: they vanish and our members are frustrated, Katie. Our members

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Speaker 3: are pissed off.

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Speaker 1: So from your perspective today, you're not even worried about

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Speaker 1: this legislation. You are concerned about the consent agreement.

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Speaker 3: I'm worried about the retention of our hard working police

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Speaker 3: officers that are out there keeping the community safe every day,

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Speaker 3: and if they haven't got the support of this government,

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Speaker 3: they will not have a safe community to live and

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Speaker 3: work in. For anyone in the Northern Territory.

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Speaker 2: So, Finny, what are you saying that we're going to

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Speaker 2: have in drives?

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Speaker 3: We've had hundreds of emails, Katie since the offer first

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Speaker 3: come out on on Monday. Well, I've got a twenty

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Speaker 3: page document of summary of all the comments that have

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Speaker 3: been provided back to us. They are angry, they are frustrated.

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Speaker 3: They see this as a slap in the face. They

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Speaker 3: see this government as saying something and doing something totally different.

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Speaker 1: Talk our listeners through, because, to be honest, like since

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Speaker 1: Thursday last week, so we've had a week of covering

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Speaker 1: the tragic death of Linford Fike and that has been

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Speaker 1: majorly what we've been talking about on the show. So

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Speaker 1: for a lot of people listening this morning, they may

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Speaker 1: have heard a little bit about these pay negotiations happening,

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Speaker 1: but they're going to be pretty surprised, I would suggest

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Speaker 1: by what you're hearing what they're hearing this morning, they're

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Speaker 1: going to sort of be going, oh, hang on a sec,

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Speaker 1: what are we talking about? So where exactly are these

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Speaker 1: negotiations at and what are the Police Association calling for?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely, Katie and our members are frustrated and what

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Speaker 3: we've seen in the last week. This is not unusual

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Speaker 3: and unfortunately, this is something our members have to face

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Speaker 3: day in, day out, and members are faced with the

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Speaker 3: adversity of every day of protecting the innocent people of

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Speaker 3: the Northern Territory community and upholding the laws of the

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Speaker 3: Northern Urchy community placing themselves at risks every single day

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Speaker 3: they go on shift. And this is a sad reality

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Speaker 3: that if you're not going to support our police, this

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Speaker 3: place is this place is going to go backwards very quickly.

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Speaker 3: And our members are really indicating that they are had enough.

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Speaker 3: They're at breaking point. They've been burnt out for years, Katie.

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Speaker 3: They've been smashed from pillar to post with controversies from management,

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Speaker 3: with controversy, pressures from the government, pressures that they join

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Speaker 3: to protect the community. They haven't had that opportunity to

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Speaker 3: protect the community. And now the government's decision to place

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Speaker 3: this offer on the table is placed in the community

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Speaker 3: at risk.

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Speaker 2: So what is the offer that they've placed on the table?

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Speaker 3: So potentially, Katie, is the offer that there is in

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Speaker 3: what we're being told is that it's demoralizing, disrespectful us

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Speaker 3: A three percent wage increase, so increase it is not adequate,

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Speaker 3: it's insulting. It's completely fast to reflect the relentless pressures

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Speaker 3: that the personal sacrifice that OURNT Police Office endure daily.

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Speaker 3: We are at rage that the government has framed this

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Speaker 3: to take it or leave it ultimatum, basically saying that

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Speaker 3: threatening to withhold back pay of our current expiration of

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Speaker 3: our agreement currently that's due in June. This is not

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Speaker 3: a negotiation, caddie. This is exploitation and a bargaining pad.

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Speaker 1: So do you feel as though you're being locked out

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Speaker 1: by the Chief Minister here? Because I know that you

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Speaker 1: had said you wanted to have those negotiations with the

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Speaker 1: Chief Minister. She'd said it's an issue for the public

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Speaker 1: employment minister, I believe.

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Speaker 2: So do you feel as though.

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Speaker 1: You're not able to get to the table with her

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Speaker 1: and go this is not good enough.

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Speaker 3: We haven't had the opportunity to get to that table

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Speaker 3: with the Chief Minister. She's provided support to us and

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Speaker 3: has provided support to us in the run up to

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Speaker 3: our election and then during election as Chief Minister, but

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Speaker 3: since that point this relationship is going downhill. Our members

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Speaker 3: are frustrated and members are sick of hearing the words

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Speaker 3: our police do a great job. How about you shut

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Speaker 3: up or put up and protect our police officer and

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Speaker 3: protect their conditions.

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Speaker 1: So talk me through then what the situation is with

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Speaker 1: this house agreement and what police are currently entitled to,

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Speaker 1: but what the change is going to be.

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Speaker 3: So the proposal to strip away police housing in Darwin

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Speaker 3: has completely blindsided us, Katie. This was never flagged during

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Speaker 3: our negotiations. Our members feel completely ambushed by this. The

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Speaker 3: chief members assured our members in writing and at our

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Speaker 3: conference NTPA conference last year that housing wouldn't be taking

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Speaker 3: considerations in these negotiations, and they are.

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Speaker 1: So what are police usually entitled to when it comes

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Speaker 1: to housing?

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Speaker 3: So housing, there's entitlement to departmental accommodation being provided by

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Speaker 3: the department, and there's also a housing allowance for those

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Speaker 3: that choose to purchase their own property, et cetera. Now,

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Speaker 3: what they're proposing is to take away the department of accommodation.

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Speaker 1: And only provide the housing housing allowance.

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Speaker 3: That's correct. The housing allowance is a tax allowance. Now

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Speaker 3: our members get whether the department or accommodation is free

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Speaker 3: of charges, not pat into their total income, and it's

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Speaker 3: affecting they keeps.

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Speaker 1: So sorry, So how much money is it in terms

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Speaker 1: of the allow it's per year.

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Speaker 3: The allounces are roughly just on thirty one thousand, and

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Speaker 3: the department in accommodation means it's not tax, it's not

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Speaker 3: salaried everything else. But the reckless decision to this effects

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Speaker 3: are currently one hundred and seventy seven police officers in

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Speaker 3: the Darwin region, so that a decision. And what I've

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Speaker 3: been told at the negotiation table is that that expense

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Speaker 3: of the potential saving for that amount is just over

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Speaker 3: a million dollars. To upset that many police officers for

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Speaker 3: that little amount of money, Katie, is a disgrace.

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Speaker 1: Do you feel like it's very short sighted?

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Speaker 3: It's very short sighted, and our members are frustrated, and

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Speaker 3: members are pissed off about it, and they because they've

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Speaker 3: been reassured that hey, we're not going to touch your

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Speaker 3: hasing conditions. But now it's on the table.

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Speaker 1: So Finny, where to from here from your perspective? Because

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Speaker 1: you sound angry, like you sound like you're really annoyed

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Speaker 1: by angry.

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Speaker 3: But I'm passionate about what our members deserve, what our

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Speaker 3: members need to do the job that they need to

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Speaker 3: do with the Northern Territory and for the Chief Minister

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Speaker 3: to damn play. That's only one hundred and seventy seven

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Speaker 3: officers in Dawn. The potential of every other member outside

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Speaker 3: of Dawen that hasn't been into Dawn, that's still an

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Speaker 3: option for them, and they're taking away that option.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I've had single parents, police officers' parents. If

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Speaker 3: this happens, I'm gone. I've had numerous I would say

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Speaker 3: in excess of one hundred people tell me that this

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Speaker 3: offer is a slap in the face for our members

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Speaker 3: and I'm looking at leaving.

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Speaker 1: So where like, when do you have until to decide

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Speaker 1: or for the negotiations to end?

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Speaker 3: So the negotiation period is defined by the current concent agreement,

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Speaker 3: which was to run from the first of February to

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Speaker 3: the thirtieth of April.

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Speaker 2: So it's ended.

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Speaker 3: So the negotiation period, we're still continuing the negotiations, Katie.

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Speaker 3: We had our meeting again yesterday. We've planned a meeting

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Speaker 3: for middle of next week.

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Speaker 2: Again, who'd you meet with yesterday?

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Speaker 3: So I met with the Commissioner of a publican pointment.

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Speaker 3: The Commissioner of Police was at the table and the

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Speaker 3: representives from both obviously Nicole Hurwood's office OCP and DCD.

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Speaker 1: Are you able to give us much detail from what

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Speaker 1: had happened yesterday in terms of being looks as though

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Speaker 1: there's some room for movement or what the goes.

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Speaker 3: We've told them blatantly that as long as housing is

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Speaker 3: on the table and they're in their offer, we will

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Speaker 3: not place that towards our members for a vote. This

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Speaker 3: is off the table and we will not place that

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Speaker 3: offer to our members ever, whyle housing.

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Speaker 1: Is on the table, so you're not even going to

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Speaker 1: take it to your members until the housing is on

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Speaker 1: the table.

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Speaker 3: They need to negotiate with that off the table and

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Speaker 3: to come back with us with an offer that actually

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Speaker 3: rewards our police force.

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Speaker 1: Finny, I know you said you've got like twenty pages

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Speaker 1: of comments from officers. I mean some of them might

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Speaker 1: be a bit a bit colorful, but are you able

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Speaker 1: to tell me what some of those are like what

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Speaker 1: people are saying.

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Speaker 3: They are totally frustrated, Katie, they are totally Again, we've

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Speaker 3: seen a cop government that relies upon and keeps going.

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Speaker 3: We're going to reduce the cost of living our CPI

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Speaker 3: and over the last three years and our agreement over

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Speaker 3: the last CPI has failed, has been fallen behind by

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Speaker 3: five percent the cost of living index within dhar And alone,

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Speaker 3: that's not including that's in darw And Katie, it's gone

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Speaker 3: up nearly twenty percent. Way our agreement went up nine percent.

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Speaker 3: The cost of living is what this platform and the

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Speaker 3: cop government are pushing both here and a federal level

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Speaker 3: to reduce the cost of living.

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Speaker 1: So how much do you reckon what would be acceptable

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Speaker 1: from the police perspective in terms of that pay increase?

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Speaker 1: Like three percent is not where it's at. Where should

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Speaker 1: it be.

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Speaker 3: Nationally on the average and through the government enterprise bargaining

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Speaker 3: is we've seen an average of more than five point

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Speaker 3: four percent nationally. So our members not happy with the

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Speaker 3: three percent. They see that as a kick in the face.

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Speaker 3: And we're referring us to all the other public sector staff.

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Speaker 3: We're at risk of getting sold every day. We're out

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Speaker 3: there every day. But unfortunately, Katie, our police force is

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Speaker 3: running on overtime and our members are burnout, and our

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Speaker 3: members are seeing this as the final point. Do you

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Speaker 3: know what? Why do I bother? Why are we even

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Speaker 3: doing what we're doing. We're not going to be supported

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Speaker 3: by this government.

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Speaker 1: Finny, do you reckon I mean, if you were able

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Speaker 1: to get you know, the increase more nationally it's five

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Speaker 1: point four percent. I mean, if you're able to get

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Speaker 1: that or more, do you think that we'd see a

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Speaker 1: situation and the housing where not only would people want

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Speaker 1: to stay being police officers, but potentially you'd be able

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Speaker 1: to actually get people here from other locations.

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Speaker 3: Definitely, Kadian. By removing some of these housing conditions the

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Speaker 3: attraction for the Northern Territory police. We work in the

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Speaker 3: harshest conditions within Australia. We work with the highest crime

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Speaker 3: rate per capita in Australia. We are the busiest police

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Speaker 3: force in Australia, unquestionable. Our members have burned out. They've

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Speaker 3: seen time and time again where we support you, we

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Speaker 3: support you. Well, it's time now to support us or

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Speaker 3: shut up and let the decisions being made by our

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Speaker 3: police officer to leave the Northern Territory because that's the

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Speaker 3: point where they're at and that's disappointing and it's disappointing

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Speaker 3: from this government, the church and great support for you.

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Speaker 1: You know from the community's perspective, like we absolutely want

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Speaker 1: our hard working police officers to stay living in the

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Speaker 1: Northern Territory. Goodness me, you've been like the glue holding

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Speaker 1: the place together in so many ways when we look

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Speaker 1: at all the issues with crime, I do not know

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Speaker 1: what will happen if we wind up in a situation

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Speaker 1: where police officers are leaving more than what we've already

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Speaker 1: seen in recent years. You know, we've already had an

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Speaker 1: issue with retention, you know, Finny. It's I know, whenever

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Speaker 1: I have these discussions right with whichever union it is,

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Speaker 1: even if it's the nurses union, no matter who it is,

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Speaker 1: people always say to me, or you know, Katie, are

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Speaker 1: they being a bit greedy with what they're asking for?

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Speaker 1: If anybody's out there listening this morning thinking that, what

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Speaker 1: would you say to them?

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Speaker 3: My thought is walk the day in the police's police's

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Speaker 3: shoes and see what we actually do, see the crime,

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Speaker 3: the violence and everything that's turned towards us, and downplay

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Speaker 3: that this removal of the police housing condition within Darwin

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Speaker 3: only affects one hundred and dann player one hundred and

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Speaker 3: seventy seven members. You have a think about this, Katie.

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Speaker 3: One hundred and seventy seven members is more than the

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Speaker 3: general Duty's members that respond to every job in the

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Speaker 3: Darwin on a daily basis. When you're talking about one

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Speaker 3: hundred and seventy seven, that's ten percent of our police

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Speaker 3: force that you've just told hey, cost of living's just

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Speaker 3: gone up for you by fifteen to twenty grand a

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Speaker 3: year because you're going to get an allowance down that's

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Speaker 3: going to be taxed. And if you think that's acceptable,

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Speaker 3: you will see and our members will march with their

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Speaker 3: feet if they don't come back with a suitable offer

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Speaker 3: for our Northern Territory.

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Speaker 1: Police officer, what is the situation for police like, can

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Speaker 1: you you know, can you strike or can you take

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Speaker 1: industrial action or what would be the next step?

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Speaker 3: The next step is us and to continue the negotiation. Cadie.

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Speaker 3: We've planned a media campaign that's coming out very shortly

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Speaker 3: to target our police and make sure that they're being supported,

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Speaker 3: make sure we can currently get the offer, the best

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Speaker 3: offer we possibly can. Again, there's a number of factors

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Speaker 3: we can do internally. Again, we can't take strike action.

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Speaker 3: We don't want to take strike action because at the

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Speaker 3: end of the day, the community is the prime people

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Speaker 3: out there that we have to support and they rely

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Speaker 3: on our police to support them in the time of

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Speaker 3: their need because at the end of the day, we

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Speaker 3: don't want to make them suffer because of what the

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Speaker 3: government's made this decision. At the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: they're going to suffer anyway because of this decision and

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Speaker 3: the offer that they're put forward to our members. But again,

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Speaker 3: we don't want to see them struggle in the community.

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Speaker 3: We live here. We want to make sure it's a

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Speaker 3: safe community as well, but we need that support.

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Speaker 1: Police Association Sident Nathan Finn always appreciate your time.

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Speaker 3: Thank you very much, and thank you Katie, and I'd

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Speaker 3: just like to say thank you to the men and

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Speaker 3: women out there that are feeling the pressure at the moment.

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Speaker 3: Please stay with us. Please, we have got your back,

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Speaker 3: and I'll make sure we've got your back and I'll

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Speaker 3: make sure this government ceased to have your back long

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Speaker 3: into the future.

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Speaker 1: Finny, thank you always good to catch up. Thanks for

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Speaker 1: your time.

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Speaker 3: Thanks Coddy