Speaker 1: It's in the news today, but it was actually on
Speaker 1: TV Reload the podcast plant to deep theirline. Welcome back
Speaker 1: to TV Reload. My name is Benjamin Norris and this
Speaker 1: is your podcast to get all the inside goss on
Speaker 1: the popular TV shows you may be watching from around
Speaker 1: the world. Undeniably, our TV sets are a major part
Speaker 1: of our home entertainment and very little is known about
Speaker 1: how our favorite shows get made. Each episode, I find
Speaker 1: guests that want to dive just that little bit deeper
Speaker 1: into the shows they're currently making, so that you can
Speaker 1: hear all their exclusive stories and gain access to the
Speaker 1: biggest names in Australian television. I want to thank you
Speaker 1: for downloading or subscribing to this podcast. I love hearing
Speaker 1: your feedback, so make sure you leave a comment on
Speaker 1: your chosen podcast platform. On today's episode, I have a
Speaker 1: full debrief with the most talked about player ever seen
Speaker 1: on Australian Survivor. It is King George from Heroes Versus Villains.
Speaker 1: We were first introduced to George on Brains Versus Braun
Speaker 1: only two years ago, but nothing could have prepared us
Speaker 1: for what we got this season. More confident, more strategy,
Speaker 1: more awkward, conversations this time on the beach, and one
Speaker 1: epic tribal council that really broke the internet. George really
Speaker 1: polarized his audience, but he also made this season what
Speaker 1: it was. And I know Liz has won, but I
Speaker 1: think George is the real winner from this season and
Speaker 1: I'm really excited to talk to him today. We will
Speaker 1: talk about George's ability to read people and how he
Speaker 1: managed to manipulate and control his fellow players. George will
Speaker 1: discuss his pregame preparation and if he and Haley did
Speaker 1: get together to plan out their season. I'll also ask
Speaker 1: about the impact George's game had on the other players
Speaker 1: and where his friendship with Simon, Shannie and Liz, amongst others,
Speaker 1: has landed. I will also unpack that epic tribal council
Speaker 1: and find out if George thinks he went too far
Speaker 1: and if he felt that he was antagonizing Simon. Plus,
Speaker 1: we'll get some exclusives on the whole series, including some
Speaker 1: behind the scenes secrets which I'm sure you're going to love. However,
Speaker 1: let's bring George into the podcast and celebrate his exciting
Speaker 1: time on Australian Survivor, which you can now catch up
Speaker 1: on on tenplay. Hey George, congratulations on the most epic
Speaker 1: season I have ever seen for any contestant in any
Speaker 1: reality TV show ever.
Speaker 2: Thank you, It's all true, and thank you for having
Speaker 2: me on your show.
Speaker 1: This season of Heroes Versus Villains. You really came to play,
Speaker 1: didn't you.
Speaker 2: Well. I walked in with the motto of glory or
Speaker 2: death and that was my strategy as well. I wanted
Speaker 2: this to be the best season of Austraian Survive and
Speaker 2: it was mission accomplished. It's been by far the best
Speaker 2: Australian season ever. It's been so widely acclaimed around the world.
Speaker 2: It broke the Internet in the USA, and we've shown
Speaker 2: that the Australian domestic TV industry is in a very
Speaker 2: strong state. And the fact that I've played a huge
Speaker 2: role in that. I feel a great deal of personal
Speaker 2: delight in that I have.
Speaker 1: Been looking forward to having this conversation with you for
Speaker 1: quite a few days now because I knew it was coming.
Speaker 1: And I think a lot of people who have been
Speaker 1: watching the show want to know is who we see
Speaker 1: on television? Is that your authentic self? Or is King
Speaker 1: George something that has been cooked up? For reality television.
Speaker 2: I'm exactly the same in every kind of situation and
Speaker 2: I think that's what worked for me. And a lot
Speaker 2: of people try and go on TV shows and they
Speaker 2: think it's going to earn them money in different aspects
Speaker 2: and whatnot, and that wasn't the case for me. When
Speaker 2: I played the first time, I was a Survivor fan
Speaker 2: that went through the audition process that's open right now
Speaker 2: for the next season of Survivor that'll be on Channel ten,
Speaker 2: and I told myself I'm going to play a phenomenal
Speaker 2: Survivor game and by doing that, it changed my life.
Speaker 2: And I think part of the reason why I have
Speaker 2: such a huge appeal in mainstream Australia, particularly where I'm
Speaker 2: from in Western Sydney, is because when people sitting down
Speaker 2: at home in their living rooms and they watch me,
Speaker 2: I'm a kind of like a normal person. I'm the
Speaker 2: kind of person they see at the pub, at the
Speaker 2: local soccer ground, at the local coffee shop. And that's
Speaker 2: what worked for me. That's my secret, and I think
Speaker 2: that's why this season of austraiand Survivor has been so
Speaker 2: good as well. We've had a very strong cast, very
Speaker 2: good decisions made in terms of going back to a
Speaker 2: more basic Survivor game, less twist, small organic gameplay, and
Speaker 2: it all results in the best season of Survivor ever.
Speaker 1: Have you passed on some of your knowledge that reality
Speaker 1: TV really works when people are just being themselves.
Speaker 2: I think there's a great production team. I'm not just
Speaker 2: saying that. In particular the new ep David Foster, who's
Speaker 2: a huge Survivor fan, really kind of like left his
Speaker 2: mark on this season and it went back to kind
Speaker 2: of classic Survivor challenges, still with a big kind of
Speaker 2: exciting physical aspect that we have on austrained Survivor but
Speaker 2: not on American Survivor for instance. The show's in great hands.
Speaker 2: It's been phenomenal in terms of like the way they
Speaker 2: were able to convey the story on the episodes themselves
Speaker 2: and just sitting back and watching it at home myself
Speaker 2: or when I was watching it with friends or family.
Speaker 2: Every episode was such a delight, and I'm just so
Speaker 2: proud to have played just a role as just a contestant. Yes,
Speaker 2: I generate the content, but all the production values and
Speaker 2: the storytelling have just been exemplary for heroes v villains,
Speaker 2: and I think Survivor's got a very bright future on
Speaker 2: Channel ten and in the Australian reality TV space.
Speaker 1: Do you think we'll get another season of it this year?
Speaker 2: Well, we are getting another season. They're looking for contestants now, Ben,
Speaker 2: So if you're interested, go on the ten play casting
Speaker 2: website and give it a go. Maybe you can be
Speaker 2: our first Big Brother contestant that wins Big Brother and
Speaker 2: wins Survivor.
Speaker 1: I don't think they want me, but I would definitely.
Speaker 1: And you know, it's really funny that you mentioned that
Speaker 1: show because people write to me all the time saying
Speaker 1: George reminds me of you in Big Brother, and I
Speaker 1: get these comparisons from people on the internet all the time.
Speaker 1: I mean, I would be honored, But how does that
Speaker 1: land with you?
Speaker 2: Well, we're both very good looking men, Ben, and can
Speaker 2: you blame them? And they're only human? But there's one
Speaker 2: big difference. You actually won quite a significant sum of
Speaker 2: money and I only won sixty thousand dollars.
Speaker 1: It's still cash in the bank, right.
Speaker 2: Yes, it's yours, and I'm very grateful.
Speaker 1: I want to know a little bit more about you.
Speaker 1: I'm sure that you've been talking about Survivor all day
Speaker 1: but when I was thinking about talking to you, I
Speaker 1: was thinking, I want to know a little bit more
Speaker 1: about the day to day George. What is your life
Speaker 1: really like?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 1: What is what are you doing? And what has your
Speaker 1: life been like between the last time here on Survivor
Speaker 1: and now.
Speaker 2: Well after the last time I was on Survivor when
Speaker 2: that finished airing in September twenty one, I went back
Speaker 2: to my day job as a public servant, but I
Speaker 2: was so bored I quit it in December twenty one,
Speaker 2: and I knew I was going to play in Samoa,
Speaker 2: so I put basically all of my time and energy
Speaker 2: into improving my body. More importantly than that, just kind
Speaker 2: of like living my best life. So what I'm grateful
Speaker 2: for is playing Survivor the first time changed my life
Speaker 2: in more ways than anyone could ever imagine. And now
Speaker 2: that I've finished this glorious season a second time, I've
Speaker 2: got the world at my feet and I can't wait
Speaker 2: to see what happens next.
Speaker 1: I just dream of these, you know, George in the
Speaker 1: real world moments, like you know, you're ordering Hungry Jags
Speaker 1: or KFC and just being you know, typically George really
Speaker 1: amuses me.
Speaker 2: Well, I think what is interesting is a lot of
Speaker 2: people like me in Southwest Sydney or Western Sydney, and
Speaker 2: it's a very kind of like normal experience. And you
Speaker 2: know why some other TV shows fail is because the
Speaker 2: only thing that you see people from NUSA and Bondai
Speaker 2: and they're all the same and Australia is a very
Speaker 2: different place. And what you saw on this season of
Speaker 2: Australian Survivor in terms of its impeccable casting, is you
Speaker 2: had all kinds of different people from all walks of
Speaker 2: life and all different kinds of ethnic backgrounds come together
Speaker 2: and play out the game of Survivor and it made
Speaker 2: a phenomenal TV product. That's what I want to see
Speaker 2: as a viewer myself, not just you know, not when
Speaker 2: I watch other TV shows. And I think that's why
Speaker 2: this season of Survivor was just so widely acclaimed. People
Speaker 2: can identify with me if they're from Southwestern Sydney and
Speaker 2: I'm one of us, and that's what you know, one
Speaker 2: of them, and it's kind of like what worked for
Speaker 2: me and what worked for Survivor in particular.
Speaker 1: I did hear that. I mean I haven't clarified this statistic,
Speaker 1: but someone said to me that the numbers for Survivor
Speaker 1: this year were up considerably in Sydney. They were saying
Speaker 1: that's all because of you.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, thank you. I would if I can
Speaker 2: take claim for that. That's fantastic. But I walk down
Speaker 2: the streets of banks down all the time and they're
Speaker 2: the kind of people that are watching Survivor that you
Speaker 2: wouldn't expect. They people that aren't, you know, the usual
Speaker 2: under forty demographic, and it's good to see. And I
Speaker 2: want these kind of people to be engaged with reality TV.
Speaker 2: And if they're watching Channel ten and they're watching Survivor,
Speaker 2: I hope they stay on board because there's there's lots
Speaker 2: of other good things to watch on Channel ten.
Speaker 1: Well, there's so many good stories to tell, and I
Speaker 1: think that Survivor has a very good platform to do that.
Speaker 1: So I actually think that the numbers are going to
Speaker 1: be quite considerably high for the people applying for this
Speaker 1: next season. And I think that does have a lot
Speaker 1: to do with you. But I want to move into
Speaker 1: asking you a little bit about the psychology of George.
Speaker 1: You know, I want to know more about how you're
Speaker 1: able to read people, because watching this season, yes, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of and maybe there's a little bit of
Speaker 1: magic on top of that, but your ability to be
Speaker 1: able to read what people are thinking and what they're
Speaker 1: going to do is uncanny. Where does that skill set
Speaker 1: come from?
Speaker 2: I think for me it's just life experience. So having
Speaker 2: worked as a political staffer, you have to be really
Speaker 2: engaged in terms of issues that matter. For instance, when
Speaker 2: I was advising on shadow portfolio matters, campaigning on local matters.
Speaker 2: I've been a campaign director for elections. I think it
Speaker 2: might have even been five and you have your finger
Speaker 2: on the pulse. But for me, I'm a poker player
Speaker 2: as well. Jackie wasn't the only poker play on the
Speaker 2: Villain Scribe, and when you cop a lot of bad
Speaker 2: beats you tend to learn how to predict human behavior
Speaker 2: and how to take the opportunities when you sense weakness.
Speaker 2: And when I combine all of you know, street smart
Speaker 2: from banks down campaign and political experience from my former
Speaker 2: professional life, and just judgment and instinctal moves that I've
Speaker 2: learned from playing pocers since I was eighteen, it all works.
Speaker 2: What I will tell future Survivor player is the ones
Speaker 2: that probably will apply in record numbers for season nine.
Speaker 2: Whenever it happens is don't waste an opportunity. Don't think
Speaker 2: this is Instagram. We can put a filter on and
Speaker 2: pretend you have a personality, go out there, be bold,
Speaker 2: be brash, do things, and then more likely than not,
Speaker 2: will work. And if it doesn't, at least it would
Speaker 2: have been fun to watch.
Speaker 1: It is like a superpower. You know your ability and
Speaker 1: you know what I want to ask here is what
Speaker 1: do you say about the speculation that you had a
Speaker 1: lot of help along the way from producers? And so
Speaker 1: when you hear that kind of stuff or read that online,
Speaker 1: is that offensive to hear?
Speaker 2: I do find that highly offensive because it's like with
Speaker 2: these people with Tim Foy or hats on. Every single
Speaker 2: twist that's happened over to two seasons has really screwed
Speaker 2: me over because I'm the kind of person that maps
Speaker 2: out the game and I need stability in terms of
Speaker 2: gay mechanics for that to happen. And for instance, I
Speaker 2: survived the skin of my teeth when two of the
Speaker 2: three people working against me found an idol. They found
Speaker 2: an idol because they were looking for one. When you're
Speaker 2: controlling the numbers, you can't spend twenty four to seven
Speaker 2: walking around the bush looking for an idol, and then
Speaker 2: I make a tactical decision to focus on politicking at
Speaker 2: the merch part of the game, to maintain my government
Speaker 2: that I built where I'm the king and the Premier
Speaker 2: and the governor all in one. But it's just like
Speaker 2: the producers and Survivor, they literally are not even there.
Speaker 2: They don't talk to you. The only time they talk
Speaker 2: to you is when they're interviewing you, when you're alone
Speaker 2: in front of them doing a confessional, and that doesn't
Speaker 2: even happen every day.
Speaker 1: How far away do they have to drag you to
Speaker 1: do those confessionals?
Speaker 2: Well, in both seasons there's a George IV spot. I
Speaker 2: am loud, I don't want the plays hearing what I say,
Speaker 2: and they have to walk me at least a kilometer
Speaker 2: away from camp.
Speaker 1: They'll take you back to Bankstown just to do some much.
Speaker 2: Yeah, to Bankstown. They should have given me my passport.
Speaker 1: Did you and Haley get together and tell each other
Speaker 1: that you were coming back? Because I even asked Flick this,
Speaker 1: They said, you know, do you reckon? Those two got
Speaker 1: together and started working out a few plans, and she said, probably,
Speaker 1: what's the story with that, did you and Haley get
Speaker 1: together and map out a plan together?
Speaker 2: No, to be honest with you, so obviously there was
Speaker 2: a lot of speculation about who was and wasn't playing beforehand,
Speaker 2: But Hailee's a very close friend of mine. I mean,
Speaker 2: I brought Carra to my family visit, but like I
Speaker 2: have Haley in the same category in terms of just
Speaker 2: a general life friendship. And I do recall having a
Speaker 2: phone call with Hailey several weeks before the game where
Speaker 2: we just decided it was best to stop communicating with
Speaker 2: each other just so we wouldn't get in each other's heads.
Speaker 2: But never in a million years would anyone have expected
Speaker 2: that Haley and myself would have both gotten to the
Speaker 2: merged part of the game, particularly having never played together.
Speaker 2: The proof is in the putting on what actually happened
Speaker 2: out there. Haley didn't want to work with me, She
Speaker 2: was trying to deceive me, and if she pulled that off,
Speaker 2: I reckon the Queen would have rained right to the
Speaker 2: very end of the game and deservingly would have had
Speaker 2: a back.
Speaker 1: To back win, which people want to see. You know,
Speaker 1: I've heard that a few times, even chatting to Liz
Speaker 1: this morning, Liz was saying, you know, she'd love to
Speaker 1: see a winner win twice.
Speaker 2: I'm sure Liz might be thinking about playing again herself,
Speaker 2: but good luck to them. And then it's like, I'm
Speaker 2: the kind of player when I go out there, I
Speaker 2: don't care what they've done in a previous game. I'm
Speaker 2: going to judge the cards that have been dealt to
Speaker 2: me and play the hand accordingly. You can't play a
Speaker 2: second time and think about what happened the first time
Speaker 2: unless you're trying to course correct.
Speaker 1: It's interesting that you came back because I think your
Speaker 1: game was better this time around, from a point of
Speaker 1: view of maybe your social game is a little bit better.
Speaker 1: I think that you managed to win people on side.
Speaker 1: You know, did you have to try and work out
Speaker 1: a strategy how to change some of that behavior from
Speaker 1: brains versus brawn to this season.
Speaker 2: My behavior was actually the same over both seasons, but
Speaker 2: this time I was just dealt with better hand. I
Speaker 2: was duds in the outback. I was dealt a cast
Speaker 2: of players, majority of whom had never seen Survivor before,
Speaker 2: and when they saw a hard game play, it was
Speaker 2: kind of being transported back to season one. In the
Speaker 2: year two, thousand, So most of them got voted off
Speaker 2: before the merge. This is in the outback I'm talking about,
Speaker 2: not in somea Some of the on the jury were
Speaker 2: incredibly better. And the key lesson that I took from
Speaker 2: the outback that I was very conscious of was I
Speaker 2: can't have somebody poison the jury. Every time someone went there,
Speaker 2: he just poisoned them, and it killed my chances of
Speaker 2: winning the game. Not because I had a poor aspect
Speaker 2: of my game, but because someone was actively campaigning against
Speaker 2: me at the Jury villa in Concurry. Here in Smut
Speaker 2: was a very different situation. You've got eleven of the
Speaker 2: twenty four players were returning players, all playing a second
Speaker 2: time or a third time in Sewanne's case, to try
Speaker 2: and play a better game, or to try and you know,
Speaker 2: live their dream a second time if they went earlier
Speaker 2: on people like Stevie and Jackie. So I was dealing
Speaker 2: with a very different set of players. But what I
Speaker 2: did a real kind of like conscious effort to do,
Speaker 2: and a lot of people wonder why Jerry and Matt
Speaker 2: and Liz all were very kind of like loyal to me,
Speaker 2: if you want to frame it like that, is because
Speaker 2: I made them the best possible versions of themselves that
Speaker 2: they could be out there's first time Survivor players, and
Speaker 2: they felt equals when they were working with me. They
Speaker 2: felt like partners. And perception is reality. And you know,
Speaker 2: if they perceived that they were equal contributors in decision making,
Speaker 2: great for me. But if other you know, jury members
Speaker 2: for instance, didn't value that and called them pawns, well
Speaker 2: that's not my problem. That's how I kind of looked
Speaker 2: at it.
Speaker 1: I felt like you were building these people up only
Speaker 1: for them for you to know that they were going
Speaker 1: to be on that jury at the end, and that
Speaker 1: they were going to vote for you because you'd been
Speaker 1: their friend.
Speaker 2: Well, I think everybody on the jury would have voted
Speaker 2: for me, to be honest with you, Ben, I played
Speaker 2: an incredible game. I played the best game Survivor ever.
Speaker 2: And what is important is not thinking about the end
Speaker 2: when you've got two or three weeks to go in
Speaker 2: the game. So when I'm building up capacity in Jerry,
Speaker 2: for instance, and turning him into a vicious player, that's
Speaker 2: empowering him. So I think with Jerry, and what's important
Speaker 2: to know is he felt empowered. I listened to Jerry,
Speaker 2: I took what Jerry said on board, and what I
Speaker 2: did is I identified people's intent, their motivation, their priorities, and
Speaker 2: I conducted my campaign on the ground around those and
Speaker 2: I found a solution every time that probably benefited the
Speaker 2: other person more than it benefited me, but it was
Speaker 2: a win win, and that's what basically kept everybody aligned
Speaker 2: behind my rule.
Speaker 1: Your rivalry with Simon was definitely the juiciest thing of
Speaker 1: the whole season. If you ask me, does Simon represent
Speaker 1: anyone on the outside that you had previously clashed with,
Speaker 1: because it just felt like that river run really deep
Speaker 1: with him.
Speaker 2: I was targeted by Simon, and Simon spoke the way
Speaker 2: he spoke to people in the early part of the
Speaker 2: Villains Tribe, and that's on him. That's something that he
Speaker 2: had to own. But I think Simon as a person
Speaker 2: is very genuine back at home, and I think Simon
Speaker 2: just made a few bad decisions at the start of
Speaker 2: the game and then came home like a wet sail.
Speaker 2: Part of the reason why I thought, particularly with six
Speaker 2: players left, to get rid of Simon as a priorities
Speaker 2: because I could see the jury benchers constantly smiling and
Speaker 2: cheering him on at every tribal council, and I was like, well,
Speaker 2: Simon's not someone that's going to be carried to the
Speaker 2: end with this plucky underdog story and be told you
Speaker 2: haven't done anything. He's going to get to the end
Speaker 2: and he might actually beat me. So I am just
Speaker 2: out of sheer respect for the huge game that he played,
Speaker 2: had to vote him off quick smart.
Speaker 1: Do you think though, that, stepping back a little bit
Speaker 1: and looking at that epic tribal council that went down,
Speaker 1: do you think that you went a little bit too
Speaker 1: far in the way in which you were definitely antagonizing him.
Speaker 2: Well, I actually think he was antagonizing me if you
Speaker 2: watch that back then. But Simon fell into a trap
Speaker 2: and he fell hook line and sinker for and I
Speaker 2: needed to get certain things over the line at that
Speaker 2: epic tribal council, and all of it was done on
Speaker 2: very very short notice, literally a five minute walk from
Speaker 2: a surprise challenge back to the tribal count and it
Speaker 2: all happened in real time. I needed Simon to specifically
Speaker 2: burn the bridge with Stevie, and he did that. He
Speaker 2: did that much better than I could have ever imagined.
Speaker 2: I needed Stevie to know that Jordie was about to
Speaker 2: vote him off, and Stevie was aligned doing what Stevie
Speaker 2: does and just attaches himself to a group of alpha males.
Speaker 2: He respected me and my game, as he told me
Speaker 2: a number of times, and then he realized I was
Speaker 2: the best person to work with him. And more excitingly
Speaker 2: for me was I burnt the relationship between Jordy and Simon.
Speaker 2: And it was spectacular because from that point on I
Speaker 2: took complete control of the game. I was in a
Speaker 2: block of three people in a six person tribe where
Speaker 2: the minority three literally refused to work with each other,
Speaker 2: and I did that on the turn of a dime,
Speaker 2: and it was the best thing ever.
Speaker 1: I think what was really interesting about that tribal council,
Speaker 1: and I've watched it a few times, by the way, George,
Speaker 1: so I definitely still stand by the fact that you
Speaker 1: both probably antagonized each other, and I still don't know
Speaker 1: whose behavior was worse than the other. But my question
Speaker 1: aside from that is there's a bit of a rule
Speaker 1: at the moment where they say that conflict on television
Speaker 1: doesn't really work and that people tune off. But after
Speaker 1: that particular piece of conflict, the ratings went up. Do
Speaker 1: you think that Australian viewers at home should be wrapped
Speaker 1: in cotton wall or do you think that we should
Speaker 1: still be allowed to see conflict like that on television.
Speaker 2: This isn't some cheapscape relationship show and another network ben
Speaker 2: Survivor is a very complicated political game and sometimes the
Speaker 2: drama that a game like this generates is the best thing.
Speaker 2: And tribal councils are very intense. Playing Survivor brings out
Speaker 2: a lot of emotions out of people. It's raw, it's real,
Speaker 2: it's unscripted, and that was the best ever tribal council
Speaker 2: in history. And like many people probably watched it multiple times.
Speaker 2: It broke the internet in the USA, and I say,
Speaker 2: if that's what's working, I'd love to see more of
Speaker 2: it myself. In terms of raw reality TV. That's not
Speaker 2: just fitting you know, stereotypes, and you know you have
Speaker 2: people that unrepresentative of normal people walking on the streets
Speaker 2: in places like I live in Western Sydney. It's like,
Speaker 2: I don't want to watch that.
Speaker 1: You know, it would have been obvious to everybody whilst
Speaker 1: you were in competition that you were the noisiest player,
Speaker 1: and you were probably gonna get the most amount of
Speaker 1: screen time. What I don't understand is why didn't more
Speaker 1: people try and take you down immediately.
Speaker 2: Look, when you're working with people, you can kind of
Speaker 2: like identify what is kind of like in their best interests,
Speaker 2: And it was in my best interest to survive from
Speaker 2: a crudely selfish perspective, but every time you strike a
Speaker 2: deal with someone, if it's a good deal, you take it.
Speaker 2: And for two Survivor seasons in a row, me and
Speaker 2: my allies got to the end and one of my
Speaker 2: allies won, And it's like, what's the point of just
Speaker 2: making a move for the sake of making a move
Speaker 2: and then having no control in the game. I look
Speaker 2: at what kind of like what Liz and Jerry and
Speaker 2: Matt achieved is they all made an active choice to
Speaker 2: work with me as I did with them, and we
Speaker 2: all got to the end together. People think, why didn't
Speaker 2: they try and vote George off. It's like, toward that
Speaker 2: end of the game, I was basically picking up no
Speaker 2: votes because I run a very aggressive campaign on the
Speaker 2: ground and sometimes through just you know, counter intelligence alone,
Speaker 2: I would turn people that even thought would be voting
Speaker 2: for me against each other. It's just like Nina and
Speaker 2: Simon kept voting for each other, and they never voted
Speaker 2: for me. That wasn't because they worried about other things,
Speaker 2: because they thought that was the best thing for them
Speaker 2: to do at.
Speaker 1: The time, putting Lizz aside and her tactics to take
Speaker 1: you down, which was successful prior to that, do you
Speaker 1: think that anyone got close, Like who do you think
Speaker 1: was the closest person to ever taking you down before
Speaker 1: Liz took you out of the competition?
Speaker 2: I was definitely Haley. I survived by a miracle when
Speaker 2: Nina and Sean mispaid their idols. And I always thought
Speaker 2: Sean had an eye dool I thought he found one
Speaker 2: at the Sandwich Rule Wards. So everything I was doing
Speaker 2: was factoring a suspicion that Sean had an idol. But
Speaker 2: I had no idea that Nina had an idol. And
Speaker 2: sometimes human behavior is a very interesting thing. Ben I
Speaker 2: always thought that Sean would only ever play an idol
Speaker 2: for himself and fortunately for me, mean another daughter of
Speaker 2: anyone but me. Creator of that strategy, Queen Sandra herself
Speaker 2: also was of the mindset that she was only going
Speaker 2: to play an idol for herself because that's how anyone
Speaker 2: but me works. And I survived by the skin of
Speaker 2: my teeth. And then I also, you know, maintained control
Speaker 2: of relationships and kept doors open with people there. But
Speaker 2: I came so close to going home in that episode.
Speaker 2: I knew it afterwards. You could probably see it in
Speaker 2: my face when that second idol got played, And that's
Speaker 2: probably the only time I got lucky. But that's also
Speaker 2: just kind of like, you know, that's just how those
Speaker 2: players were. They were you know, they were told the
Speaker 2: plan by Hailey, like the leaks information was correct, and
Speaker 2: they didn't listen to her and I survived.
Speaker 1: It was crazy? Was it crazy? The message in a
Speaker 1: bottle that got lost at sea? And I just was like,
Speaker 1: what is wrong with these people? Can I ask you
Speaker 1: the only questions? I'm probably going to be the only
Speaker 1: person's going to ask you this today, and you complete
Speaker 1: the fifth if you want to. But I hope you
Speaker 1: come with me on this random survivor question. Do you
Speaker 1: end up having feelings for other people on the show?
Speaker 1: I mean, you guys are living in such close proximity,
Speaker 1: and some of the people on the show are like
Speaker 1: ridiculously attractive and really lovely, and you're living in close proximity.
Speaker 1: I wonder whether or not you ever develop any romantic
Speaker 1: feelings for your opponents.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I definitely don't have feelings for Simon or
Speaker 2: Sewan for the record, maybe they're just not my type.
Speaker 1: Ben, what's your type?
Speaker 2: Still trying to work that out. Yeah, but if anyone interested,
Speaker 2: please feel free to sliding too my DMS.
Speaker 1: Well, anyway, I'm going to move aside of that because
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure there's going to be some people out
Speaker 1: there saying, mind your own business, Ben, But I'm going
Speaker 1: to move back into the survivor question for you. Let's
Speaker 1: talk about Jerry and Matt, you know, and the fact
Speaker 1: that to a lot of people watching this show they
Speaker 1: seem like the weakest players. Was it really okay for
Speaker 1: them to be there right at the very end when
Speaker 1: their resume was so was so poor? You know, like,
Speaker 1: could they ever have possibly won standing in there and
Speaker 1: pitching there, you know, doing their sales pitch? Could they
Speaker 1: ever have won considering they really both didn't do too much?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I didn't really agree with that. I mean, if
Speaker 2: if Jerry had won, or even Matt, you'd still have
Speaker 2: worse to strange survivor winners, and like sometimes there's many
Speaker 2: ways to skin the survivor can and playing an under
Speaker 2: the radar game is a legitimate strategy. But that's why
Speaker 2: I try to obliterate those players as quickly as possible
Speaker 2: in the early part of the game, because then you
Speaker 2: have a blood bee water situation where the entire endgame
Speaker 2: is filled by seven mats rather than one. And it's
Speaker 2: just a case of tactics. But I felt like I
Speaker 2: really enjoyed working with Jerry in particular. I loved his
Speaker 2: revenge mission suited me to a t and it was
Speaker 2: a good win win for us, and Matt made the
Speaker 2: choice to come on board with me. I gave Matt
Speaker 2: several days to make his mind up, and I knew
Speaker 2: Matt's word was good because Matt himself worked out that
Speaker 2: was the best thing for him to do. I knew
Speaker 2: Matt probably wanted to cut me at a Final three.
Speaker 2: I'm not an idiot, but the fact that I had
Speaker 2: multiple Final three deals and I knew what people's priorities
Speaker 2: were within these different deals is part of the reason
Speaker 2: why I got to the end myself.
Speaker 1: Well, truth often does hurt but your takedown of Matt
Speaker 1: was very accurate, and you asked him very specific questions,
Speaker 1: but that must have hurt his feelings and it kind
Speaker 1: of left him looking like, you know, a little toddler
Speaker 1: that was being told off. How has your relationship with
Speaker 1: Matt host that interaction been. Have you been able to
Speaker 1: maintain a friendship with him out of the show?
Speaker 2: Yes, of course. I visited him on the Gold Coast
Speaker 2: quite recently. I love Mattie. I've met his wife, haven't
Speaker 2: met Little Hugo the baby yet, but it's in that
Speaker 2: same kind of category of past players where we, you know,
Speaker 2: we're in constant communication with each other, and usually the friendships,
Speaker 2: particularly the ones you form in the game, get replicated
Speaker 2: outside as well.
Speaker 1: Did you think it was a little brutal watching it back?
Speaker 1: Like it might not have been brutal at the time,
Speaker 1: but watching it back on television, how do you think
Speaker 1: you came across.
Speaker 2: I just don't think it was brutal. I think it
Speaker 2: was just the reality of the situation. I was very
Speaker 2: willing to vote for Matt and Liz had a phenomenal
Speaker 2: game full stop, and she had an even better performance
Speaker 2: at the final tribal council.
Speaker 1: I love it. You went out of the competition last
Speaker 1: time and you went and got your tattoo of your idol,
Speaker 1: which we got to see throughout the How what is
Speaker 1: your souvenir this time? Have you gone back and got
Speaker 1: another tattoo?
Speaker 2: Well, I did get the tattoo. I got that quite early.
Speaker 2: You can see it on the Survivor Instagram page. You know,
Speaker 2: it would have been nice to tattoo the crown on me,
Speaker 2: but not this time.
Speaker 1: Would Would you get a full tattoo of a crown?
Speaker 1: Have you got it on it?
Speaker 2: I've already got a different mark there. Ben.
Speaker 1: How close were you to leaving the competition, you know
Speaker 1: at that point because of that injury.
Speaker 2: I was very close. It was very touch and go,
Speaker 2: and then I did play the next forty six days.
Speaker 2: Definitely nowhere near one hundred percent, but I'm very lucky.
Speaker 2: You had great care from the Survivor medical team, who
Speaker 2: are foremost experts in the world. I know that, you
Speaker 2: know talking to them. They've done like Everest expeditions. So
Speaker 2: I got patched up, I got the CLEI to go
Speaker 2: back in noting I wasn't at one hundred percent. But
Speaker 2: more importantly, I was given the choice. So when when
Speaker 2: I got you know, offered the chance to go back
Speaker 2: in and the state that I was, I'm the one
Speaker 2: that made that decision, and thank god that I did,
Speaker 2: because you know, imagine this season if I wasn't in it, Ben.
Speaker 1: I was hoping to see another friendship like what you
Speaker 1: had with Kara from your last season. You know, is
Speaker 1: having a bestiet like Kara an advantage or a weakness
Speaker 1: in a season? And did you try and recreate that
Speaker 1: friendship with her with any of the other contestants this
Speaker 1: time around?
Speaker 2: Well, I think what was good for me is I
Speaker 2: had more than one Karra this time. I had a Liz,
Speaker 2: I had a Jerry, I had a mate. I had Seannie.
Speaker 2: I was close obviously with Haley. I was close with Nina.
Speaker 2: I was close with Stevie up until I got rid
Speaker 2: of him. I was close with so many people, So
Speaker 2: what's better than one? Karra ten carras.
Speaker 1: The Spice Girls was the best thing ever. Like I
Speaker 1: when as soon as that formed, I was like, this
Speaker 1: is the best name for this group ever, and everyone
Speaker 1: loved it. It melted down. The Internet was so good. I
Speaker 1: did worry though, with Seannie. Shannie looked like she was
Speaker 1: pretty upset when I think you got rid of her twice.
Speaker 1: What did Shannie say, Because we haven't seen that meeting
Speaker 1: of you two together, what did Shaannie say to you
Speaker 1: when you finally got to see each other after the show.
Speaker 2: Shawnee's one of the greatest EPP of five players, and
Speaker 2: she's someone that has played a third time. She's played
Speaker 2: more days than anyone else, and I think she respects
Speaker 2: the game enough to know that a blindside isn't something personal.
Speaker 2: But my instinct was right. Seannie wanted to vote me
Speaker 2: off next and sometimes been the cream just rises to
Speaker 2: the top. I backed in the numbers to vote Seannie
Speaker 2: off and that's exactly what happened. If Shannie had more
Speaker 2: cut through in other players of the game, they would
Speaker 2: have stopped me from doing it, but they didn't.
Speaker 1: Well, the last question I have for you, though, is
Speaker 1: what's something for? Oh? I'm not allowed to ask what's
Speaker 1: something from behind the scenes because I get into trouble.
Speaker 1: So instead I'm going to ask you just what's your
Speaker 1: favorite moment from the season? So can you just tell
Speaker 1: me what is the what's your hero moment when you
Speaker 1: look back at this season? What are you going to
Speaker 1: be the most.
Speaker 2: I'm so proud I won that endurance challenge and I
Speaker 2: got what I was craving for after you know, eighty
Speaker 2: days of playing Survivor, lots of KFC.
Speaker 1: George. I am obsessed with you. I think that you
Speaker 1: are fantastic. I've absolutely loved watching you this season. I
Speaker 1: think that you've been fantastic. I can't wait to see
Speaker 1: what you do next. I can't imagine what other worlds
Speaker 1: George belongs in.
Speaker 2: After this waiting see, wait and see. Thanks so much,
Speaker 2: Ben reppreciate it.
Speaker 1: Thanks mate,